 Hello, everyone. I think we should might as well get started. I want to introduce myself. I am Becky Bartavix and I, I use she her pro pronouns. I live on the occupied Penobscot territory of now known as North Haven Island. And I am a longtime Sierra Club volunteer. And I wanted to just start by recognizing or acknowledging that we all live on Wabnaki occupied territory. And in fact, Sears Island was certainly occupied by Penobscot natives. The Zoom rules, because we're expecting a large crowd. We decided to accept question answers after both Rolf and and Steve Miller speak. And David von Segren will be helping me manage the question and answers are the questions and we'll pose them to both David and and I mean to Rolf and Steve. Rolf has been involved with working to protect Sears Island and the resources that it provides ecological resources to the Bay. This is a wonderful picture that Rolf has up and he will talk more about that, but we've been doing this for more than 35 years. This is among the largest islands on the coast along the coast, east coast of the United States, and certainly want to close to the largest island that's on developed on in Maine. So, without further ado, I would like to introduce Rolf Olson, who is the works, who is a volunteer for friends of Sears Island and Rolf do you want to go ahead. Right. Thanks very much Becky really appreciate this opportunity to help people understand what's going on and try to take some action as well. I think to start, I'd like to set the stage as most of you probably know the state of Maine would like to build a create a floating wind farm about 30 miles offshore in the Gulf of Maine. To start with what happened a port or actually a system of ports is required. First to manufacture and launch the floating wind turbines and then to service and maintain them after they go into the production of energy. The largest of the ports that is needed to be built is called a marshaling port and this is where they'll bring together all the materials the towers the blades they will put all the pieces together. This requires at least 100 acres, probably more of flat land that is adjacent to deep water. And there can be no aerial obstructions at all between the marshaling port and the deployment site in the Gulf of Maine. This is an illustration of it's not pretending to be Sears Island or anything but it's showing you what we're talking about and that's really a, you know, a facility that might rival a bath iron works and size and scope with a massive crane that can reach high enough to assemble the bases and the towers that will rise several hundred feet in the air. These are large, large pieces. For you a sense of scale, 20 megawatts or more of the turbine sizes that are being planned for the project in the Gulf of Maine. So those would be higher than the 12 megawatt towers you see that's just to the left of one World Trade Center and shorter than the 50 megawatt towers depicted at the far right. The lower line you see on the screen is just about 200 feet above the sea level and that represents the highest point on Sears Island. In the current plan there are two towns on the main coast that meet the criteria for the marshaling port Sears Port and East Port. And Maine DOT has presented four possible scenarios, three of them are located in Sears Port and one in East Port. Sears Port is the focus of our discussion this evening since it appears that Maine DOT has exhibited a very strong preference for building the marshaling port on Sears Island, which of course is owned by the state of Maine. And as Becky said it's one of the largest undeveloped islands on the eastern seaboard of the US. The other feasible option in Sears Port is on Mack Point, and that as many people will know is currently an operating port operated by Sprig owned by Sprig. And it's been an industrial site for more than a century. And to us, Mack Point makes the most sense and that's the proposition we're going to be exploring today. Many of you are familiar with the map of Sears Island. So I'll offer first an overview of Sears Island, its natural recreational historical cultural and other value. And then Steve will present the caves for building on that point. And he'll have other other points as well I'm sure. And then after that we'll have time for questions and discussion. We see on the map how the island is divided into the conservation area, which is the left hand side of the map, the top and the left hand side is about two thirds of the island. And the transportation parcel is that darker shaded place on the right which as part of the agreement back in 2007 2008 has been reserved by the state of Maine. In the name of the Department of Transportation for possible future transportation uses. As Becky said we're all living on Wabanaki land and indigenous peoples of the Wabanaki nations called the island was some keg, meaning bright sand beach, and it served as a visual navigation beacon as they migrated seasonally over land and water for 3400 years or even more before Europeans arrived and claimed land for themselves. Around 1730 so early in this nation's history the island became known as Brigadiers Island, names for Samuel Waldo, who was a Brigadier General and the namesake for Waldo County. He passed through multiple owners in 1794 Henry Knox hired people to turn much of the island into grazing farm for oxen cattle sheep and hogs. He also built a farmhouse the remains of which are still visible, just off the homestead trail. By 1806 several men owned shares in Brigadiers Island, and in 1813 David Sears bought out his partners and the island became known as Sears Island. Farming continued on Sears Island for more than a century. While the Sears family never lived year round on the island they did build a summer home there at the southern near the southern end in 1853 that burned 40 years later but the foundation stones for the for the homestead and also an outbuilding remain. In 1905 Bangor Investment Company part of Bangor and Rustic Railroad bought the island to develop a resort which was never built and farming the land ultimately proved not to be successful so in 1934 the vacant buildings were demolished and the island as the island returned to a more rural state local people really viewed it as a public recreation area and they even use it as a drop off point for smuggling liquor during prohibition. So over more than 50 years since the 1970s, there have been several plans to industrialize Sears Island. A nuclear power plant and oil refinery and aluminum smelting plant and LNG terminal and a cargo port. All were tried and ultimately rejected for environmental and other reasons, but only after first stirring up considerable local discord. Sears Island continues to be a thriving terrestrial and marine habitat. It's a very popular birding site burgers have reported more than 225 species spotted on Sears Island and you can see that's 47% of all the bird species recorded in the state of Maine. It's a hotspot on ebird.org and a gem of Maine coastal birding and the region and that's a quote from a book called bird watching in Maine. It's surrounded by eelgrass beds, especially on the western side of the island where the development would occur. Eelgrass serves as a nursery for fish, lobsters, urchins, clams, mussels, marine snails and other mollusks. And once eelgrass beds are destroyed, they have a very difficult time coming back and they take with them, all the species that they nurtured. And illustrates that purple block and the green area show where the proposed wind port might be located on Sears Island and it's overlaid on a map that shows a variety of wildlife habitat areas. And it's an area of pretty dense forest and it includes wetlands and streams as well. On Sears Island, there are many large legacy trees among the maritime spruce fir and mature hardwood forests and they provide habitat to birds, mammals, invertebrates and understory plants. The vernal pools, they are a never ending source of amazement to the kids in our science squad program and I'm always quite amazed by the sound volume when the peepers start up each spring. Sears Island has really become an important learning lab for people of all ages, but maybe especially for children. And the programs that are offered by friends of Sears Island have become extremely popular over the last several years, providing a really rich dimension to what kids learn in the classroom, or in homeschool situations and they're all offered by their free or by donation. Sears Island has become an engine for tourism and the economy in more recent years as it's become better known in the region and beyond. More people have visited each year we have a traffic counter on the island for three years courtesy of Maine DOT, so we can see that during the summer, you know we see 34,000 plus people in the summer. I'm on the island and I see people standing at the map kiosk. I asked them where they're from. And I've met people from many different states several foreign countries, England, France, Germany, Australia, Japan just to name a few. And people come to Sears Island and they leave with great memories of visiting Maine. I didn't visit. I met a couple from Washington DC at the very south end of the island on the, what we call the scenic lookout trail. And he's a diplomat didn't say what sort of diplomat but clearly distinguished people and I asked them how they came to visit Sears Island and they said they did a Google search to find a place where they would stay for three or four days and not have to travel far to enjoy great food, culture, some outdoor activities. So they stayed at Captain Nichols Inn in Searsport, which is a wonderful place. They ate at some of the best restaurants in Belfast and Searsport. They went to Hay Sailor, which was noted in Down East Magazine as one of the best new restaurants in the state. Marshall Wharf Brewery in Belfast. They really enjoyed themselves and they said they'd think about retiring in a place like this. So how will the experience of visiting Sears Island change with an industrial port there. There will certainly be much more traffic over the causeway with heavy trucks and maybe several hundred workers coming and going every day. It's possible a new rail line over the causeway could be needed. Will there be new utility infrastructure, wires to bring power for the manufacturing process. Will visitors experience the same tranquility they've come to expect on the beaches and trails. Well, as many people visit the island and none of this can be known yet, but it feels pretty safe to me to say that the experience of visiting Sears Island will be significantly diminished if the wind port is built there. So, here's the question, you know, can a conservation area successfully coexist with a busy, noisy manufacturing port. There's no simple path forward. There's no doubt that a very challenging process to decide lies ahead, although, you know, we'll know more in the coming weeks, difficult decisions will be made that are undoubtedly going to leave some people disappointed or even angry. I believe what we need to do is find the pathway forward that offers the greatest benefit in terms of finding a pathway to renewable energy resources, while presenting the fewest possible obstacles and I believe that site is on Mac Point for the wind port. And so now, Steve will share his screen and I'll stop mine and Steve will take over. Steve Miller is a longtime supporter of Sears Island, and he is also with Islesboro Island Trust, and I would like to hand it over to Steve and can you turn on your video. Oh, I'm right here but I'm trying to get my slides up for you. Okay, great. Just one more minute and I'm going to hit share screen. Does that work? Yes, there it is. Okay well first of all I just want to thank Becky and Ralph and Sierra Club main for organizing this event this evening. I apologize to you all because I really haven't had the opportunity to present anywhere near as elegant a discussion as Ralph just did. It's going to seem a little bit jumbled because I really had to just call together a whole bunch of different desperate pieces of information but I think it's information that you might find useful. I also hope that during the this evening, if you aren't already that you become convinced of three things. Sears Island's current undeveloped natural condition provides important ecological services to the region and the state, especially for fisheries. Secondly, once begun, we believe and I hope that you become convinced of the proposed development at Sears Island opens the door for expansive industrialization of Penobscot Bay. We're currently altering up to, and probably more than 300 acres of the islands 940 acres and changing the entire Penobscot watershed forever. And thirdly, the build out an industrialized map point consolidates industry in one location, economizes on existing infrastructure and replaces and remediate some of math points past updated coal oil and gas history. This trust supports the development of an offshore wind facility at Mac Point and opposes development of that facility on Sears Island if any such facility is to be built in Penobscot Bay. I'm going to first provide a little background to some main Department of Transportation promises about Sears Island. I'll then share some information that I think pretty clearly indicates that main Department of Transportation has been pursuing development of Sears Island instead of Mac Point all along, and why that seems so nonsensical. I'm really looking forward to questions and answers and discussions after this to perhaps help clarify what is going to seem like a jumbled presentation I'm afraid. So for a little bit of background, you know, we all understand the climate change is the most serious challenge facing us all. I think we all understand that. Isbro Islands Trust certainly understands that and supports and is engaged in efforts to address climate change, including renewable energy, but citing renewable energy facilities can and should be undertaken with great care. So something called the Sears Island planning initiative acronyms SIP I put together or came to a consensus agreement including promises made by all parties, and those parties included the main Department of Transportation. Governor Baldashi convene the Sears Island planning initiative in 2006. There were about 50 stakeholders participated and of those 38 signed the consensus agreement, which was dated April 12 2007 and that included signature by then Department of Transportation Commissioner David Cole. There are three things from that consensus agreement I want to draw attention to the first, and I'm quoting that point shall be given preference as an alternative to port development on Sears Island. And secondly, the agreement included a fairly extensive list of things that would not occur that everybody agreed should not occur on Sears Island. Things like LNG terminals and so forth, but one of those on that list was no soil harvesting. And the third finding in the agreement is that I want to draw attention to it is understood that none of the parties are endorsing in advance any proposal for marine transportation facility. All stakeholders reserve the right to object to certain kinds of facilities. The date them often a nickel report and which I'll talk about a little bit more in a second here, and the main Department of Transportation public and internal communications all show preference for Sears Island as a location for offshore wind facility and not the current plan for Sears Island would entail harvesting a million two hundred and 15,000 cubic yards of earth from Sears Island. Failure to give present preference to my point and proposing to harvest more than one million cubic yards of soil from Sears Island clearly violates promises made by the main Department of Transportation through the Sears Island planning initiatives and raises huge questions about although there are public statements to the contrary, those notwithstanding main Department of Transportation clearly show that they have promoted development of the proposed offshore wind facility on Sears Island for months and really perhaps three years before the November 2021 release and offered a nickel report. Further evidence from our Freedom of Access Act request related to this show that Sears Island has always been the main Department of Transportation's preferred alternative for this particular facility. One example is that in March of 2021, way months before them offered a nickel report was even made public, a memo an internal memo from the Department of Transportation called for and I quote, Request for information to explore potential for partnerships that would focus on primary site Sears Island. So internally, Department of Transportation has understood and been working towards the primary site for this development on Sears Island. Just yesterday we discovered yet another example of this commitment to develop Sears Island. It's in a stakeholder management plan which was written and undertaken by Kay ran on behalf of the main Department of Transportation. That document cites the goal as, and I quote, a commitment to pursue development of Sears Island as the renewable energy port of the Northeast and announce a statewide port strategy spanning the entire coast to provide auxiliary roles to position as a national leader in the offshore wind industry. That goal is here in what you see in that slide or portions of the email and the management plan. So the nickel report was issued in November of 2021. And in that they found that and I quote both the Mac point and Sears Island sites can achieve or surpass the minimum required offshore wind port criteria. And then that report went on to recommend that a marine terminal on Sears Island should be the centralized hub for assembly and launching of floating foundations as well as erection of the wind turbine generated components onto the foundation that Moffat and nickel explicitly and formally recommended construction of the needed manufacturing, assembling and launching facility on Sears Island, especially when they acknowledge that such a facility could be built at that point was in our view, just simply outrageous. But given some of the internal communications we've read since then it was not that surprising. So where are we now at this point in time. There is no formal application being made for development of the offshore wind facility to manufacture assemble and launch offshore wind turbines however Department of Transportation and the main governor's Office of Energy have both made it very clear that they are working on applications for that facility, and that we should expect those to be forthcoming. The Moffat and nickel report actually had a section outlining what the permitting process would look like. It is extensive. We have significant evidence that federal agencies will require mitigation for Sears Island destruction. One of the things that we're quite happy about is that pilot Bennett who was formerly with the Environmental Protection Agency during cargo port proposal back in the 1990s. And that is now where the public employees for environmental responsibility has joined our strategic discussions about how to proceed, and will be in a position to help lobby federal agencies to in fact take a hard look at any application that sites Sears Island as a preferred alternative for development. So it permits, it's going to be time consuming and it's going to be costly. But even if successful, it will require extensive and enormous amounts of mitigation, which will further add to costs. Back in 1996 US Fish and Wildlife Service set of Sears Island and I quote, rocky intertidal mud flat and salt marsh habitat provide feeding areas for an assortment of shore and waiting birds, and the rest of different species that includes eel grass beds, provide highly productive feeding areas for waterfowl that eat fish and shellfish surveys of the intertidal and subtitle habitats in the project area show very high levels of biological productivity, such as soft shell clam, rock clear ab, American lobster, sand shrimp, Pollock, Manhattan, winter flounder, sea urchin and starfish, all of which are critical components of the food web at Sears Island. There is simply no way to overestimate the importance of Sears Island to the Panopska Bay watershed and the ecology. This has been borne out by review of Sears Island in the past. We can expect that level of review going forward. I trust Hired Dawson and Associates Consulting Company prize actually largely a former Army Corps of Engineers personnel to take a look at them off at a nickel report. And they report that US Fish and Wildlife Service is main coastal islands national wildlife refuge favors keeping Sears Island in its current natural condition. While the US remains supportive of the continued protection of Sears Island, the refuge stands ready to assist in review of any proposal presented to the public. After that, after Dawson had contacted folks earlier this year, Friends of Main Coastal Islands issued a letter in support. In August, the letter says in part, we the trustees of the Friends of Main Coastal Islands National Wildlife Refuge hereby support the Osborne is trust, and their rejection of development on Sears Island Sears Port Main. They concluded that maintaining Sears Island in its current condition is essential. One of the things that concerns us the most is the industrialization of Penobscot Bay that could, and I think we should expect would occur if the door is open to developing any kind of port on Sears Island. Even back in 19 being excuse me back in 2017, the main port authority said and I quote Sears Port represents one of the most flexible and adaptable port facilities in the northeast. Sears Island could be used for project cargo specialized production or assembly of offshore wind components or neobalk. Cargos that was in 2017. We believe that this latest industrialization threat is actually is disguised as a green project. In fact, the Moffat and Nickel report lists possibilities for expansion, as I'm showing here as the top criteria for the recommendation to build the offshore facility on Sears Island rather than that point. In fact, Matt Burns, who is the main port authority executive director and a primary spokesperson for the offshore wind manufacturing assembling and logic facility on more than one occasion, while promoting them off at a nickel report and its findings referenced the likelihood of additional industrial and commercial development that Sears Island, following construction of the offshore wind facility there remember we're talking about over 300 acres. On the other hand, Matt point is already industrialized building here consolidates heavy industry in a single location offshore wind that Matt point would repurpose a portion of an outdated industrial facility with energy development for the future. The area outlined in black was determined by Moffat and Nickel to be available for the offshore wind facility and Sprig Energy is is agreeable. The preferred location at Matt point is over here which actually historically supported to commercial peers developing offshore wind and Matt point will entail a safer mediation and Sprig Energy confirms cooperation and accommodation for this. If we could convince the Mills administration of the points that often I have been trying to make this evening, we would save everyone time and money. We're about to admit that I'm not terribly optimistic. However, we really must try. But meanwhile, we also need to prepare for the far more likely scenario that Sears Island will continue to be the state's preferred alternative when they enter the permitting process. I hope you are convinced that Matt point should be the location, if any offshore wind facility is built in pronounced Scott Bay and that Sears Island should be protected in its present natural state. What can you do. The Islesboro Select Board adopted a resolution saying among other things that the best offshore wind manufacturing launching location must be a careful process, weighing a wide range of social cultural environmental factors. And they concluded that Matt point can and should be the preferred location. Now there's no about your position, including US Fish and Wildlife Service National Marine Fisheries Service and your federal state and local governmental representatives. I draw your attention down here to a friends of Sears Island offshore wind resources page which I think you would find quite helpful. I think that we have left sufficient time for questions and discussions and that you can thereby help make sense of what I've been trying to jumble through here. Thank you. Thanks Steve, and thanks everybody for listening. I, if you look in the chat there are two other two opportunities for signing a petition. There's the one from Protect Sears Island, which is the Friends of Sears Island petition. We have an add up campaign, which will allow us to communicate with you when we have a press conference to deliver the petitions to the governor. And then that will probably be in the in the new year. But you can also reach out to either Friends of Sears Island or Sears or Sierra Club or Islesboro Island Trust to let us know if you'd like us to keep you in, you know, included in any information going forward. I think there, there was a question that came through from Peter Shapiro, and I think it was had to do with, you know, what from an industrial perspective, you know why, what in what ways is Sears Island a better site than Mack Point. And I think that he, you know, he said that the next slide kind of gave that answer but I think we might just take a couple seconds to respond to that question. And I've got a couple of thoughts on that. Great, wonderful. Good. One of them is, you know, there are, there are, as Steve mentioned, you know, criteria, and I think I touched on it as well. What makes a good place for it and, you know, a big thing is large amounts of flat land adjacent to deep water and, you know, Mack Point fits that. Some of it's occupied now by tanks and other buildings that would have to be either taken down or, or moved. Sears Island represents 335 acres of land that could be flattened and in order to flatten it they will be needing, again, as Steve mentioned to carve out a big portion of that western edge and then compact it to, you know, severely change the landscape, but it makes it better in that it's there's nothing there now except for trees and dirt. So it's, and the state owns it so there's no issue of, you know, figuring out who do we need to contact either by the land or lease the land or it could available to us. Steve has some thoughts too I see. So I just thought it might make sense to go the other way and to mention that during the permitting process, especially NEPA National Environmental Policy Act review. There will need to be a determination as to which of several options. Well first of all the application has to identify several options for developing a offshore wind facility. And then we'll have to determine which is the least environmentally damaging. And I think it's pretty clear to all of us that there is just hands down no real question about that that indeed that point is the least environmentally damaging option. I wanted to just let's see there are a couple of questions that have come in. So the question about dredging. When people when this person Jennifer Craig, you know speaks to people they talk about the need to dredge Mac Point, and not Sears Island and I just wanted to say I do participate in the state, or the, actually the army that is dredging calls and Sears port has to be dredged frequently so this is not something that doesn't happen. And because partly because of the, you know the river bringing sludge down the river, and it depositing there rather than circulating around Sears Island and going out, since we now have a causeway that stops it. And there is always dredging there so the question is how much dredging would be needed for Mac Point. And I don't know if either of you want to mention that or I can go on, but I'm not part of the offshore wind port advisory group so one of the you to bring that to answer that question. Thanks Becky. Not because I'm part of the offshore wind public advisory group because that really hasn't been discussed there, particularly but, but the Moffat and Nickel reports suggested a substantial amount of dredging would need to be done over at Mac Point, in order for the key to be built over as they have envisioned it, which was sort of parallel to the shore. But, but the thing is that it's our understanding that those sediments could be brought ashore and deposited in an upland location. It's suitable to be repurposed, they can mix it with one component or another concrete and so forth, and actually use that sediment safely. I think so. It isn't in our view so much a question of whether there should be any dredging or not, in order to utilize Mac Point. But whether or not that's a significant enough factor to make it say the least environmentally damaging. But there's every reason to believe that the sediment is not highly contaminated right now there's a proposal to do maintenance dredging in the entryway, and the sediments there have been found suitable for disposal in an upland location. And in other words they aren't terribly contaminated so I think there's reason to be hopeful that that would be the case with these other sediments. And that they could be reused so it's costly there's no question about that. That's a factor that needs to be considered and approach carefully, but I was rather stressed when we were looking at the possibility of a huge huge widening and lengthening of the entry where area format point because of an interest in larger ships coming in. And the work with Dawson Associates and found that dredging at the peers which would satisfy those interests. And so we were in a position of actually encouraging dredging at the peers and order to keep this small sort of niche market kind of port open so I think that there's not. There's reason to be cautious about dredging but not a reason to be fearful about dredging. So then the next thing was question from Edward hotter. Connor is that is it accurate to say that the only reason the state prefers years Island are related to cost. And yeah, why don't you take that one, Ralph you're muted. You're muted, Ralph. Yeah. Thank you sorry. The fact is there are no solid costs that we can understand at this point in the first Moffitt while the only published and publicly available Moffitt and nickel study. There were cost figures included, but they were admittedly very preliminary, and without any strong authority. So, yes, in that round at that iteration, it was more costly to do it on Mac point or they claimed, but it was not a reliable figure and they're not standing behind those figures and we have yet to see new which I just want to interject that there was no statement of or any analysis of what the cost of mitigation would be. For Sears Island, and of course there wouldn't be mitigation costs for Mac point because it's already developed. So there's a whole while they report indicates it's less expensive on Sears Island they left out, you know infrastructure and mitigation costs from their costs. So it's unlikely to be significantly different, I don't believe. And it doesn't, it doesn't say so in the Moffitt and Nichols and Steve you have something to say. Well on both of those are excellent points. Another reason that was as I mentioned in that slide or showed in that slide. Another reason to prefer Sears Island by the Department of Transportation is that it offers more room for expansion. The point has sufficient space for this offshore wind facility and some expansion to in fact Jim Terrio from Sprague Energy has made that point during the offshore wind public advisory group meetings. On the other hand, it doesn't have over 300 acres of land available for expansion. And while that was mentioned as a criteria or as a benefit for developing Sears Island Moffitt and Nichols, Matt Burns has also made that point more than once. So, then in our review of internal communications, the magnitude or the grandiose magnitude of proposals for this development would would really benefit from more space at Sears Island. And one of the reasons that we're quite concerned about it being on Sears Island. The next question that we had was about mercury but I think you may have answered that Steve that the analysis was that the, that the soils in the dredged area could be used on land so I think I'm going to skip to the next question. I think we addressed the pros and cons of using Eastport versus Sears port. And I think, Ralph, you probably should answer that one since you were there, you went. Sure. You know, and I, I think an advantage of Eastport is that at the exist, there is the land there, and it's available. The Sears Port Authority has expressed a very strong interest in having this port there. They have not had any cargo traffic through Eastport for a few years, it was envisioned to bring wood chips through and they were spent a few million dollars on warehousing and a big conveyor system that has really almost never been used. The big advantage of Sears Port is there's 65 feet of water that would require absolutely no dredging and there would probably be, you know, less probably environmental damage. There there was a reference to the possibility that one of the salmon pens that's in the area might need to be relocated. But really that the major a major barrier. And I guess the only other thing I would say is that Eastport is farther away by some 75 to 100 miles I don't know the exact distance. So, towing these behemoth, floating wind turbines becomes more costly. And I suppose there's some risk involved in that to towing that much farther. I think there's also the issue of the fact that leaving the port of Eastport you have to cross into Canadian waters. Yeah, but that was pretty much minimized because any shipping that had been done through there. There are treaties in place that make it very easy to do. Again, I'm not I'm certainly not a marine engineer so I don't know the ins and outs. You know it does look like it would be a difficult place to get through but they say it can be done so I'll take the experts at their word. I think the next question unless I'm missing one is that the pilot association is suggesting I think you mean Sears Island is less is safer than Mac Point. Now which is a statement that I've heard from them. And I don't know if either of you want to address that. I think that was storm surge or something. Well, no, it was for this this concept and you can probably describe it better Steve but it was like the prevailing wins. So the pilots association as represented by David Jelinas, who is a tug captain and I think he's, he's on the offshore wind port advisory group with Steve and me and and 16 other people. And I made the point that the way ships have to be brought into Mac Point that the, I can't even remember the name what is the term Steve that fetch the fetch, you know the fetch of the wind and the waves pushing boats in a certain direction, introduces a dimension of again I'm not in a position to comment on, although Jim Terrio from from Sprig and some others have minimized this issue saying number one. That's a factor in a very short periods of time during the summer with this southern prevailing winds coming from the south and the southwest. It really shouldn't be an issue. And in fact there were strategies considered of resituating the peers at Mac Point for this purpose in a way that would be, you know, resolve some of that issue. Well, I think that's a little anecdote here I was almost amused when I heard Dave Jelinas mentioned that as a mess in his view anyway, particularly important factor, and, you know, it's one factor among any number of different issues that ought to be looked at fetch was attempted to be used as an issue in the cargo port development applications and the attorneys working on that at the time absolutely shredded the claim that it would be a problem. Because they're just simply are very few days out of any given year when the wind out of the south is going to be a problem. And that's the only when there really is a problem. So I'd like to point out that fairies and including the Islesboro fairy draw run broadside to fetch every single day, and many times a day and, and it's rare for the boats to not be able to run because of fetch on on the West Bay. So, yeah, you got to look at it and you know I don't want to claim to be a major marine expert but but it's a red herring in my view. Not only that though but as Ralph mentioned, there may be a possibility of reorienting a case so that it's perpendicular. I mean, excuse me so that it's parallel north south to the to the fetch rather than perpendicular east west so it's just I think something that you know legitimately needs to be looked at but is is not likely to be particularly major factor at all. And as most people do know and pronounce that Bay are really the real damaging winds are out of the, the Northwest, and now lately often out of the southeast. Yes. Southeast is seems to be coming around a bit more these days at least from this perspective I live on North Haven Island. So, are there further questions have I missed any questions. I did want to just mention a couple of things. I was hoping that Matt Canon our staffer who is also serving on the offshore wind port advisory group would be able to speak, but he is unfortunately on another call. I do think that it's very interesting to note that there have been the main Department of Transportation has offered a an advisory group opportunity and I could put it in the chat but it's it So Steve and we're all serve on that along with with Matt Canon from Sierra Club. And they have been looking at or supposedly evaluating Sears Island and Mac point and other alternatives. They have only looked at Sears Island they have not done any of the due diligence that needs to be done on Mac point yet. In terms of soil analysis and other things and there is not going to be any report before the final meeting, which I believe is December 12. I'm not going to go into that though because I mean it is generally expected to be the last meeting but it is not been stated. There is a possibility that there could be another meeting after the first of the year. It seems unlikely but it's possible. I do see there are a couple of other questions here one is from Beverly about beyond the site itself what else might be needed for MDOT to develop the acres and on. The plan itself you're right the the footprint of the port itself would be that 100 acres give or take and probably give or take. And to get there there they would need to build a new road along that Western shore from the cause way to the site. So that would be new the plan that was initially stated, indicated that the existing road which many of you might be familiar with we call it the jetty road that kind of goes up the spine of the island and curves to the west. That road would be a secondary access to the site and the primary one would be going through the woods. So I've been told, Eastport no longer has rail. You know, I think, again, Steve might have other information but what I'm understanding is that for the for the marshaling port. There wouldn't be much. If anything coming in by land either by truck or by rail, that the steel the concrete, the generators the blades and so forth, those would all be arriving by ship. So rail is not necessarily an advantage in terms of this marshaling port for Searsport, it definitely is an advantage for other types of cargo in through through Mac point and the spring terminal there. But it's not for the marshaling port. Well, I wonder if there are any further questions. I'm sorry, I missed Beverly. That's all right before but are there any other questions that I have missed. Aha. Yeah, and I guess I'd like to dive into that one is someone who makes at least a yearly trip to Sears Island, my wife. This is the first time we've heard much of anything regarding the issue. Now, December is not a deadline, you know, it is when the next meeting of this wind port advisory group will meet, and it's a two hour zoom meeting, which both, you know, Steve and I and others have discussed that's a really brief period of time to get whatever information we're going to get, because it's a very complex decision. But as I think Steve also mentioned, the wind port advisory group is not being asked to vote, or to make a decision on what the group itself believes is the best place for this. We are as individuals representing our stakeholder groups, and I have been frustrated they stated at the outset that they would conduct. I believe they were saying a robust and transparent stakeholder engagement process, and that has not happened. The Department of Energy Department main DOT has really taken very few steps at all to publicize and make public the information that you know that, and I've been frustrated by it I actually wanted to. I proposed to the Searsport Town Manager, the Stockton Town Manager, both of whom are part of the wind port advisory group, and there's also a Searsport resident that is on the group. I proposed that we hold a public meeting in Searsport and invite people to come and see and I got no response from them. And, you know, as a resident of Searsport and a taxpayer, I'm kind of bothered by that, and I think, I think that people in Searsport and Stockton Springs who have passed in the neighboring communities need to understand what's happening here and I want to go back and reemphasize that I personally and on behalf of friends of Sears Island, we support all efforts to achieve energy, you know, renewable energy. You know, we think it can be done, you know, in Searsport, but people need to know it's going to happen and that's what we're trying to do. Yeah, I'd like to just sort of follow up a little bit on that, and on answering or addressing the question here. I, as I tried to point out in the presentation and I can't emphasize enough the importance of applications, formal applications and that's when things get really that's when decisions, formal decisions can be made and will be made. And we have every reason to believe that a formal application for National Environmental Policy Act permit and Clean Water Act permits are forthcoming. One of the reasons that we think that it's very likely that it was going to occur soon in 2023 was that during, we were actually interviewed to see whether we were safe to be on the offshore wind public advisory stakeholder group. I found amusing, but anyway, so during this interview process which was conducted by Department of Transportation representative woman named Kay Ran, as well as by two representatives from a consulting company. We were being asked some some questions about our views on Sears Island and the offshore wind proposal, Moffat and Nickel report. And so I had a few questions for them, which I think was rather startling for their standpoint but one of my questions was whether they had initiated any scoping discussions with the Army Corps engineers or other federal agencies, and the representative from the consulting company that was part of the zoom conversation began to say oh yeah we've we've we've begun those discussions and was immediately interrupted and essentially thought to be quiet by the Department of Transportation representative. So we did learn in that that in fact that scoping process is a very initial phase of applying for federal permits to do this kind of activity so with that in mind. And so far only a minimal amount of evidence in the in the transmissions that we've been receiving email copies and so forth from traversal transportation but we do have every reason to believe that this permitting process is relatively imminent and will require a great deal of support from you all. And that's when, you know, especially then is when your voice is important, and we need to hear from you and we hope that you will be talking about about the matter frequently and with as many people as you could. A couple more questions there. I want to comment of course about lawsuit sounds like MDOT and the governor have their mindset which is kind of our position that that although we are told repeatedly that no decision has been made. Clearly with the background documentation that Steve brought forward tonight. The intent, really from the beginning, before any of us were brought into the process. So the other question is what sprigs position I'm using Mac point and all the changes. And, you know, I was told David Italian or who is on the board of friends of Sears Island did the tour last Friday of Mac point and he reported that he understood that spring. He was very interested in the idea of the port be the wind port marshaling port being cited there, and that at every point in the discussion and you know and things that MDOT said might be problems. He had solutions for, you know that it's no worry to move the tanks it's no worry to move the dry storage warehousing. You know, our understanding is that spray is certainly strongly willing to engage on this and to be the site, if it can happen. So, let's see. How, how will you be informed with permitting updates and when your efforts may be needed. Well, one of the things we will plan to do is anyone who is who signs up expressing interest through our ad up campaign we will be contacting you when the permitting process begins and will also be on our website. I think friends of Sears Island will have it on their website and so will Osboro Island Trust. I'm going to put in the chat again. The, the ad up campaign that Sierra Club has organized. And that allows us to capture a way of communicating with you. So going forward, I expect that we will be delivering petition signatures to the governor, and also talking about, you know, going forward what our activities will be sometime in the new year. And, you know, they're the permitting process, we hope will be a robust permitting process. I think we need to hold the Army Corps of Engineers accountable for, you know, actually doing the NEPA evaluation they have expressed. Frequently that they do not like to do EISs but they, we shall as citizens ask them to follow through on an EIS which is an environmental impact statement, because it's going to be needed and we will have the help of, as Steve mentioned, Tyler Bennett, who is part of the public employees and for environmental responsibility organization she has been a whistleblower herself and is a lawyer and they will be doing their best to hold the state accountable for all of the analyses that need to be done. I would like to add, that was great Becky but I just want to add that I thoroughly encourage all of you to badger us. Go ahead and make sure that you know what you need to know when you need to know it. We will be trying to do that and I think that, you know, we will be aware through press releases and internal communications for all of our organizations but just in case, get in touch. I'm putting my email address in the chat if anybody wants to email me directly. You know, I'd be very happy. I also put the info at Friends of Sears Island email address. This is another thing. Friends of Sears Island does have a resource page. There's a link right from the homepage of our actually quite beautiful new website. It also has a link to a, you know, a video kind of a virtual tour of Sears Island and it'll show you actually there is a one part of it where it shows you where the wind port would be located and it's a densely forested area so you'll get a sense of the perspective if you've if you've not been there or haven't been there recently. I want to just note that it is after seven o'clock, and it's 7 o'clock, and so I, you know, we don't want to hold people longer than they are interested in staying but if there are further questions please throw them in the chat. Matt Cannon is our chapter staffer who also would be happy to follow through on any kind of questioning, or also give you any kind of new information that we would have. And we have, I also put a regular email address for the chapter main dot chapter at Sierra Club org in the chat as well. And my inbox is so bad that I'm hoping that the chapter will send me questions directly. So, I'm not giving you mine. If you want, if folks want to stay on a little bit longer great. Otherwise, I just want to thank all of you for joining us with some kick is a beautiful spot in the bay, living down here a little bit south of and south and west of Sears port. I would say that I can see Sears Island from the West shore of North Haven, and what happens on Sears Island and in the upper part of Penobscot Bay affects everyone who benefits from the resources we have in this bay. There's a lot of effort that has has occurred to try to preserve the bay but there's also a lot of effort that is going on right now to industrialize and add more influence into the bay that we are trying to, you know, to highlight the resources that we benefit from right now. I hope all of you will enjoy Penobscot Bay and please feel free to contact all of this. The recording will be available. Yes, on the Sierra Club website. It'll probably take a couple of days for us to get it up. But please be patient. And if you're having trouble get in touch with me please. And I'll make sure that it gets out soon. Thank you, everybody. I appreciate your kind attention, wonderful questions and interest. So, thanks for, thanks everyone for joining and I'm glad that we introduced it to new people and feel free to ask, ask away. Thank you.