 Good evening, everyone. Welcome to the, they were almost said March, but it's May 2nd, select court meeting. First order of business is we need to approve the agenda. Are there any addendums to the existing agenda? Roger? Yeah, I'd like to move to the end of one item at the end of the agenda to discuss some matter concerning the employee. Item F. Any other changes? There being none, do I have a motion to approve the agenda? You have a second. What? You need a second. I don't think he has. I don't think he has. I don't think he, anyone has a motion yet. All right. We've got to have a motion. I'll give it to my first. Move to approve the agenda as amended. I'll second. Thank you both. Any further discussions? If not, all in favor, say aye. Aye. Any opposed? There being none, the agenda is passed. Next item is the consented agenda item minutes of the April 18th meeting. We have a motion. Motion to approve the consented agenda item. Thank you. Motion will second. Any discussion? If not, all in favor, say aye. Aye. Aye. Any opposed? No. Motion passes. We're up to the public. This is a section of the agenda where we take any input from the public that's not included under the existing agenda items. Is there anyone who would like to speak to something on the town matter? One's got his hand raised. Hey, how's it going? Hey. Can you hear me okay? Yeah. Okay, great. So I guess I just, this is going to Anderson calling or calling in, but I did want to talk about the recreational issues up here and zoning on Sweet Road across from the Hunger Mountain hiking trail. So I'd reach out to y'all by email and we don't necessarily have to get into it tonight, but I know I saw on the agenda the gravel grinders up for discussion. I don't know if it's routed to come up through Water Works and Sweet Road, but I did see the graders out today and they did a fantastic job. So as that's happening, I just want to check in and see if in light of all that I shared with you about the construction that we've got going on, if there's a way that we can get a temporary, at least for the season, a no parking along Sweet Road, maybe from say the bridge crossing over by Debbie's house, the hunger ravines to say the Water Works, if that's something that could happen because we are going to have a whole bunch of machinery and trucks coming through for the construction. But at the same point, given the need for back country rescue and all the reasons that I've articulated previously, it may be something that we want to discuss as far as a future issue to make it more permanent, as well as try to find more off-street parking. So I'm bringing that up just to see if maybe tonight, there's a way to get a temporary seasonal on-street parking ban, even if it's just a temporary nature so that we can continue with as neighbors what we need to do for the farm, but also just so we can start to prepare for what it's going to look like going forward. I appreciate, thanks. Hey, thanks, Glen. As a matter of fact, I think most of us have all seen and read your email. There are some valid points. Most of the issues have to deal with zoning issues, which are more longer term. I understand you're concerned about parking. That's something we could take under advisement. I tried giving you a call today, but I guess on your phone it kind of calls and then it shuts off. So I want to speak to you. Thank you for being brief. It was really helpful. But does any of the other board members have any questions about Glen's request? Yeah, Glen, are you being specific about a certain issue pertaining to construction or is this just an in general comment? Well, I think that there's maybe two layers to that, right? So the first part, let me just step back and say, I apologize for missing that call. It was a busy day with the cannabis control board earlier and just a bunch of issues trying to keep people moving forward. But as far as Chris, your issues, and I will reach out, Mike, if there's a better time for you to chat, just let me know by email. But Chris, to your point, I think for the short-term season, you know, I don't know how fluid it be to just create temporary measures so that we can get, you know, we are doing an 1800s barn restoration. And so we're going to have trucks bringing really long 30 foot, 40 foot beams and potentially for restoration efforts. There's a whole lot of different components to it, but, you know, I want to be proactive as far as work. With the neighbors with the state to make sure that, you know, we can sort of get through, you know, parking on both sides, which we see often. And I think that's something that, you know, the folks at the rescue and first responders are all acknowledging, you know, Waterbury Ambulance. I just want to make sure that the zoning issues that we're talking about, you know, as far as making sure that the agricultural zoning is reestablished for our farm, you know, that's something that, you know, I can sit back a little bit on, but because of the nature of our, you know, development cycle, we do need to kind of have an ability to know that we can forecast for, you know, egress and access better than we can now. So. Thank you. Yeah, the only thing I think that we could do is, you know, because people are really not supposed to be parking on the road and we could talk to the state police to kind of swing by there, you know, occasionally. The biggest issue is, I know this has been something that's gone on for a few years, you know, talking to the Department of Forests and Parks about expanding parking up at the Hunger Mountain. You know, we have discussed that issue infinite. And yes, this probably needs to be more parking up there, but I don't think people have, you know, people parking on the road, that's just not an applicable thing. So we could just use enforcement and that may have the effect that you're looking for. Yeah, and I do also want to say that the Vermont State Troopers have been, you know, through here routinely and are doing a fantastic job with patrol. You know, there are some issues that come with trailheads that, you know, as you probably know, you know, I'm not necessarily one to say that I have issues with the occasional burnout and, you know, a bunch of donuts in the parking lot on an off hour. You know, I think it's more of the bigger picture of things that I have issues with when I see patterns of particular, you know, vehicles and timings with locals coming up here to get away from maybe high visibility spots to make transactions, things like that. I think the State Troopers are good with looking for that. I think they're doing a really solid job. So I just want to, you know, I know you have to consider all the contracts going forward. So I just want to put a shout out there. But also, you know, as far as finding that off street parking, you know, I think there is a case in the environmental courts now that I'm hoping we could find some reciprocity too and, you know, some ways to, you know, as a trailer doctor for 30 years, I don't want to necessarily be part of the problem for my neighbors as well. So, you know, I'm hopeful that we can be part of that solution if it means creating some off street parking, you know, in our meadow just for a few cars, et cetera, on peak volume, that's fine. But, you know, to be able to get to that point where you're talking about as far as, you know, enforcing something, that would be greatly appreciated. All right. And I don't think it's unique to Sweet Road. I think in terms of by the reservoir, I have a couple of several of the parking areas that's also a problem. And I know Bill has talked with the Department of Forest Parks and Recreation and they're open to it, but we haven't heard anything concrete about expanding both on Blush Hill and by the dam and as well as the Hunger Mountain Trailhead, you know, any kind of expansion. But, you know, that's where it kind of really needs to be lied. We'll keep this on the radar. And again, you know, when we speak to the state police folks, you know, we'll let them know to, you know, maybe ramp up, you know, visitation. So it's always when you see those green cruisers, that kind of stops people from doing bad things. Thank you for your question. Yeah, I'll let you guys get on with the evening. I know it's a long one, but I appreciate the consideration. Again, the state troopers have just been fantastic as far as the patrol up here. So, you know, keeping that up is greatly appreciated. So have a great night. Great, you too. Thanks, son. Any further questions or comments on that or any other questions from the public? Finally, comment on the board members. I would just say in general, I would defer to staff and if there needs to be more understanding in the community about what the process is for requesting parking or other changes. I know we have some time there for races later tonight and just as someone coming off the planning commission and you've got the great town planner, analysis and planning and zoning director as well. So in terms of permitting needs and the like, I would direct folks to those town staff and certainly if there was a reason they weren't getting more sponsored to go here, but in general, my preference as a select member would be that we have policies for those town staff to implement in those regards. Thanks, Alyssa. You've dealt with the both issue up there. On understanding correctly, the state police's duties, one of them is not parking enforcement, so they could patrol up there till they're cool in the face, but they're not gonna, I don't believe they're gonna take the time to tell people to keep parking on the down road. I mean, there is a safety issue there. I mean, that's, I think, say that you have a village force is if it creates a safety issue. The same thing's happening on Delta road, so got built, sweet roads, getting calls, texts all the time when things get jammed up there. Parking issues and our parking lot. Anything better? I don't know, we just got, I know Danny was on that email from Gary Dillon, the parking over by the elementary school, that's still creating a problem. It's gonna be a problem, but we need to find some solutions, but tonight's not the night. Okay. There's no further questions, we'll move on. Next item is we're having planning commission interview for Dana Allen. Dana, you wanna come on forward? Yeah, what are you doing? Come on. Ron, sorry. Well, thanks, yeah. Thanks for having me. Thanks for coming. Could you tell us a little bit about yourself and why you wanna be on the planning commission? Sure, Dana Allen have lived in the village in the utility district now since 2013, right across from the Brookside Primary School. Moved back to Vermont 2011, originally from Maine with School of Middlebury, ski bum for a few years came back for masters in stormwater management, essentially, so environmental consulting is what I do. Worked in Burlington for five, six years and then in 2019, struck out on my own as a independent environmental consultant, do a lot of geographic information systems for work, mapping, focusing in water quality issues, but I wear a lot of hats. I like being self-employed because you get to hustle and do what you wanna do and you get to choose your work. So that's my professional life in a relatively small nutshell. Over the course of that professional work, I've done a lot of planning adjacent and planning related work. So stormwater master plans and things like that, something I've always had an interest in. I majored in geography at Middlebury, so that was something that, looking at how people interact with their space and their place has always been an academic and professional interest. And ever since I moved to Waterbury and I moved here very intentionally, I hated living in Burlington and I liked it here because it had the small village feeling. It was relatively close to a lot of different things. I like to ski, I like to mountain bike. I used to roam the Waterbury Area Trails Alliance with a co-founder of that group. So I did a lot of stuff with mountain biking over the past few years. Did a lot of stuff with FPR, playing parking lots on occasion and sometimes creating parking lots a little ad hoc as with the Perry Hill Trailhead. Why am I interested in being on planning commission? I think that right now, Waterbury is in a liminal phase. We're kind of between two phases of our development. There's a lot of growing pains right now. As a younger member of the community, I'm 41. So I consider myself young, maybe optimistic. All the search. Yeah, that's great if you want, but I'm going with it. But anyway, as a younger member, and someone who moved here at a relatively young age, sort of early 30s, we were lucky to be able to move in and buy a house. We bought our place across from the Brookside Primary School for sale by owner, negotiated over a beer at the old cork space and kind of like, felt like we sort of sneaked in the community a little bit at a good time. So we feel lucky that we were able to like own a home and community. That's not necessarily the case for a lot of people in sort of my position, my age, people younger than me, people older than me, that sort of thing. So I think that's something that I'm interested in as part of planning commission is like, how can I contribute to that process? How can we promote more affordable housing in Waterbury? I personally like living in a relatively dense village center. How do we potentially promote more affordable housing for everyone? Sort of the, I don't know if anyone saw the Seven Days article recently, but about the missing middle. I think that's critical right now. I think we have a lot of programs for people who are at the very low end of the economic spectrum. But again, there's this sort of middle ground that we don't really know how to hint. And I think that that's critical for us. So promoting that level of affordability and also encouraging, this is a really old term. I don't even know if it even uses anymore, but smart growth, so until development. Yeah, it was a big buzzword early 2000s. 20 years ago. Yeah, a big thing. But anyway, trying to like densify our village center to the degree that we can and the degree that we want to as a community. I think that's important. And preserving the character of the center and the village as much as we possibly can. You know, I wear my heart on my sleeve as far as environmental issues go. So I do believe in environmental protection. I'm also a relist and recognize that people need places to live, we need businesses to be located around various parts of town. There are appropriate places for that. And there are actually less appropriate places. So compromise is king or queen. Any questions from the board? We have two positions open, so I understand. Yes. Can you clarify what the terms are? One is a remainder of the two-year term ending in April 30th, 2024, and one is to pull through your term ending April 30th, 2025. Do you have a preference on any of those two positions? No, I'm strong. I think it's probably arm wrestle. I'm a preference. Should I go left? You know, I don't know the opponent and I don't want to handicap them. So we'll figure it out. But no, honestly, I don't have a strong one. So you have to decide when. I do. We do, you don't have to. Yeah, yeah, okay, I'm a preference. Katie doesn't either. Okay. Other questions? Yeah, so you and I could sit and have a beer and talk for a long time. I've been in the construction industry for more than 40 years. And being born here and raised here, I've seen genuine swing stars change. And the older I get, the more I recognize maybe it's a personal thing. I'm more concerned about open landscape and preserving that. And I could talk about wildlife and fishing the brooks. Like you've never seen in your life. Back when I was a kid, those are gone now in most part. Water quality today is huge. I didn't put a really missing boat. We should be doing this in a little bit earlier. You're just a whole host of things that you and I could talk about. The things that I've seen and experienced being on the front line and how's the market, the ability thing. My concern, and I've expressed it to this board for a long time, because I've been on the board set, we're very regret not having those open landscapes. You know, is there a line in the sand that you draw in the community that you say, we're happy where we're at. And you know, just maintain what we've got and keep the quality of life here. And obviously you need to give a burlton because it was too congested. I didn't feel to my sense of community in Burlington was all that strong. That's right. And I mean, also think about 2013, Waterbury was two years out of 2011. And we had a real strong sense of community. And I think we still have that. I think there is still a strong sense of community here. I think the key for us, especially right now with everything that's happening in terms of this influx of people due to the pandemic but also frankly, this is not a trend that I see decreasing because I believe pretty strongly that we will be a series refuge for climate migration. I think that's going to be something that we deal with. We're going to see it. We're not, we have our risks. We have floods, we have issues with rivers and flood plains and things like that. We know living in Waterbury the issues with floods. But we're not a coastal community. We have a little bit less susceptibility. So I think we're going to see a lot more of that in years to come. And it's the sort of thing where like each community is going to have to come to grips with the fact that I think more and more people are going to live here. And many of those people, now that we've seen this like remote work trend, which you know, fully for the people who can do it. I have a lot of friends who've lived here in the past year that I really like who work on the New York economy, the Boston economy, wherever they may work. It's something that's a reality that we're just going to have to figure out. And I think one of those big things is like, let's figure out how to protect the people who don't necessarily work on that economy who still live here. The people who've been working at the res for 10 years who can't buy a house. How do we protect them? Because we need those people. And that was a big part of Waterbury's revitalization is like people coming to the Alchemist, like that spurred on a lot of energy in the community and led to some level of downtown revitalization. What if those people had no options for living here? So we need to figure this out. So I agree with you that the protection of working landscapes, the protection of open landscapes is key. And I think we're actually pretty lucky in Waterbury that we're surrounded by a lot of like open state lands. That's really a key thing here in this community and being on the water board and sort of seeing that process with FPR for so long taught me a lot of things that I didn't know. They have a lot of concerns when they're dealing with that way, that's for sure. So we're lucky in that sense, but you're not wrong in that like, we need to make sure that our zoning decisions to some degree promote that over landscape that promote cluster development. We can do that, you know, the planned unit developments that are maybe tighter than they are now or more dense than they are now. There's a lot of different ways. Again, I'm not a planner. I need to learn a lot of this stuff. Like I'll be the first to admit that like my biggest asset in life is not necessarily intelligence. It's resourcefulness. So I spend a lot of time looking for answers because I figured like, I'm probably not the first person to have this problem. You know, and so Waterbury is not the first community to have this problem. There are good examples elsewhere. You know, I was actually reading about Woodstock and their adoption of the rent local program from Big Sky, Montana, where they're incentivizing people with accessory dwelling units to put them into long-term versus short-term rental. And they're sort of in some way financially covering the gap. And as far as I know, they're the only community in Vermont that's looking at that. And that's in short-term rentals, they're a big issue because they're cutting out some of the long-term rentals in the town, but they're also an important source of income for people. Let's balance it. And if we can't... I don't think you're ever going to solve the housing shortage or the affordability issue. I've told people what happens over time if you watch carefully. The government's always changed the rules to satisfy themselves. At some point, I suspect there are zoning subdivision rules will change at some point from like 10 acres only, drop it to two acres or five acres only to two acres only. They'll chop it up more as pressure from, like you said, that influx. You know, what I just told somebody the other day, one of the bigger benefits to Waterbury right now is that there's a demographic of people who have been here probably for a fairly lengthy time. Well, in fact, some people that have come in here have the ability to buy larger tracks of land and they're preserving it through time being. But I know there's certain people who have those pieces of land once they pass away, their kids will have them and they're just going to chop it up. So we've kind of got that on our side right now preserving some of that open landscape, but I suspect as time goes on, you'll see that starting to increase into your point, building in tighter areas and more density. We need a key, but at some point, you got to run out of that, you know, it's just. Yeah. No, I mean, it's a pattern that's repeated itself so many times and, you know, it's when we learn. We never reach the end, but it's always about the process. And I think that's the important thing. It's like, let's put a good process and try to follow it as much as we can, you know, because I'm not going to come up with an answer. No question, but will it be part of the solution or the process to solve some of the issues? Give me what everyone else has questions. Shameless plug for state of Vermont planning goals and our local town plan, both of which love sparkrobes. So, you know, there's some deduction and anyone else who wants to do a deep dive, always happy to chat. In this course, you've answered my questions. I thank you for that. We see you had a question. I just wanted to ask you, you mentioned a number of you were involved in being here. What and why are very creative as a community here? What was the case in the first place? That's a hard question to answer, because it's sort of an amorphous thing. Okay, so here's this, I'll offer this. This sounds like a jokey answer, but it's honestly not. I have always spent most of my time playing outdoors. I love being outside, skiing, biking, and running, hiking, that sort of thing. And so I would say that I'm an outdoorsy person. Whereas in Burlington, I felt like the community was very outside Z, which means that like, if they're outside lined up for brunch or doing yoga on the waterfront, that was sufficient outdoor activity. And for me, that wasn't sufficient. And so when I started, honestly, like skiing and mountain biking, we'd always come to Waterbury to go ride at Perry Hill or we'd pass through Waterbury on the way to like Sugarbushes South and go skiing. We're like, any of the backcountry spots around here, we kind of like pass through. And over time, kind of found a community of people, relatively like-minded people who were more outdoorsy. And for whatever reason, it just felt like the right fit in terms of the sort of like cultural profile of the town. And then also too, I mean, like, we lived for 40 years in this small town in Colorado called Crested Youth and walked and biked pretty much everywhere. And that's super important to be able to walk or bike to most things that I want to do on a daily basis. So like from our house in the village, I biked here, maybe we get a bike rack by the door. I know, but it's too far. I ride my bike so I don't have to walk. I'm very exercise. I know, I realize that very things. Yeah, ride my bike to the gym, like ride to the grocery store to get whatever, it's important. And I think that this is a community that really fosters that. And so it's just one example of why I felt more at home here than I did in Burlington. And I think the work-life balance here, people are again more outdoorsy. And so like, yeah, they work hard, but at the end of the day, Perry Hill is a two minute pedal from the house or what? And that was more important to me than sitting in traffic for 25 minutes to get out of Burlington to go through something. So. The reason I asked the question is because I think there's a lot of people that move from bigger cities into smaller towns for the reasons that you just stated, which is we appreciate and value a lot those same things. And then unfortunately, once we get into the community, they bring with them those big city ideas. It takes them good ideas. It's a totally different ministry than it works so well. So I only ask that because I think it's important for everybody to recognize and not forget what those differences are to make sure that the commitment and decision, you keep that in mind when you make decisions. Mm-hmm. Well, of course. We appreciate that. Thanks. Thank you. That's all right. I don't know if I just want to pass this through. I don't want to call the question, but I do want to be a little sensitive just to our time. Can I? Yes. Can you be special and brief, Moroni? As brief as I can be. You talked about moving people, not going to, I'm just curious in what a very nice position to sell in the past few years to be one of the town that's recognizing how we need to move more easily. And I'm just wondering, what is your understanding of visibility and what is your take on there that we have put there and how would you carry your duty with that sense of impossibility? Good question. I firmly support that banner. And I think that it does promote a message of welcoming visibility. And I appreciate that. As someone who's from a way, from Maine, seeing a lot of people coming in out of Maine, there's a lot of localism there. So I appreciate what it means to be not from a place and to adopt it. And I honestly think that anyone deserves that chance. And in any way that we can foster that, whether it's through more affordable housing, more inclusive housing, specific housing options or specific business zoning policies to the extent that we legally and effectively can view those, then I am 100% for it. And I'll learn more about how that actually happens in a nuts and bolts way. But it's something that, you know, I've been included in this community. I appreciate that. But I don't want to deny anyone else that. Thanks, Dana. And I know you're gonna call the question. Well, I guess we need as a board, if I was, I think we need to have a discussion about what the terms are. And I will say as the person just step off the plan and question, I'm gonna not make the motion or second, but I'll certainly vote. Okay. Would someone like to make that motion? Sure. I think it's possible that a little unfair because we just heard a lot more from Dana tonight than we heard from Katie previously. But I'm gonna move that we nominate Dana for the full term and Katie to fill out when the other term for both positions on the planning commission. Thank you. Here's your second. Second. There's a motion and a second. Any further discussion? Now let's vote. All in favor say aye. Aye. Any opposed? Big none. Motion passes. Welcome to the planning commission. Thanks. We'll have plenty of work for you. Thank you. Best of luck. Now it's homework time. Thank you very much. Thank you. Thank you. I appreciate your time. I appreciate you watching. Should be in the next steps. And I'll put you on an email list and if anyone wants another thing to do Mondays from 7 to 9 p.m., public input is also always welcome at the planning commission. Thanks for that plug. We're discussing inspire growth and density in the downtown area. Thank you for that plug for the planning commission. Always and forever. Okay. Move on to the next topic. The Harwood Union. Harwood Union. Unified school district. I could never. Unified school district director interview. She is not present at the meeting. She had indicated she was going to call in, but. Actually I was going to ask, is she playing on the call again? She said she was. Well, I guess we'll have to pass over that interview. Can you contact the applicant and see if we could reschedule? Well. I can. I know the school board was hoping to make. Right. On May 11th. They still probably could do that without your. Can I make an appointment? Can we make an appointment without the applicant? You don't make the appointment. We make a recommendation to the school board. But they can still appoint. They can still. They can do whatever they want. But it would be nice if we would ever meet with the applicant here to make a recommendation for or against. Yeah, it's an elected position, so. I will get in touch with her and a couple of members of the school board said she was going to be able to make it go on the reason. Is there any possibility where. She could present some more information about the background, you know, for that that we could review and then. Let me see me. You know, then we could warn. Can we warn an email vote? No, no, OK. That's not it doesn't go. Even if we did it via like a little a little zoom kind of thing. You want to do anything. Yeah, that's your project. But what's your guys' pleasure on this? Just let me get some information. A letter from her, right? Yeah, yeah, yeah. I mean, I there was nothing that stood out to me. That was like a huge red flag. So I think I'm I'm keen to let the school board make a decision because that's there's regardless. So I'm OK passing on the recommendation, but that's only my opinion. So we'll have everybody else. I agree with that. Anybody opposed to that? Oh, it's your proposal. We don't just that. We don't have to make a recommendation. We don't have to warn a new meeting and interview her. And then, you know, I'm OK. Letting the school board make a decision. I will show you. Where we're at, so I would say if we have something that I have in some really adverse information that would, you know, that we would have to decline her, you know, recommendation. I don't say we will just leave it as let the school board make a decision. No, we'll move on to the next topic. These people's race, October 2nd, 2022. Is anyone here for? And now he was invited to attend as well. I sent you the safety plan on the race. It's pretty much the same race that was pre-COVID. Pre-COVID. So it's very complex. It goes out through Duxbury, loops around out there, and then it's back. Same 5K. It's a 5K and a half-marathon. Oh, OK. That was the 5K. OK. Half-marathon goes out of Duxbury over to Georgetown for over that. Right. 5K goes around somewhere. Two to seven. Two to seven. Two to seven. Two to seven. Two to seven. They have our fire department help and safety, I think they have a couple of sheriffs. It's pretty straightforward. The same as well has been for years from pre-COVID. I can't remember. Did they pay for this show? Yeah. Chairman, is that OK? But there hasn't been in past years any negatives. And she doesn't have issues. There's no feedback. There were some concerns expressed by our residents in Duxbury. About the traffic. Yeah, just that it's not traffic. Yeah, it's traffic. The runners, not the, OK. Yeah, not the runners, but the residents feeling. Yeah. So it's an inconvenience, but I don't know how big a deal that is. And it's not one of our issues. I don't say it's a passive gas decision at all. Yeah, I would expect so. And probably ask theirself for this issue as well. Yeah. Do they need a decision tonight? They'd like one, if you certainly don't have to. It's not until October, but I know they're planning. I think it's a great thing. Once you're all on the run, I'll move the radio. Accept that plan. I'll second. Motion to second. Any further discussion? I would just note that we did get, I don't know, that includes, quote, general public race awareness measures prior to the event. And I won't regurgitate the whole thing, but it does talk about notifications on front porch forums, event informational signage on town roads one week prior, postcards delivered to all houses on Main Street and River Road in Decksbury that are directly affected. And then later on, runners will be notified on race day, including race information that spectators are not to on the race force, or private drives and fields slash yards will be prohibited. And just ending that, I appreciate Carlos notes that happen to things. So I appreciate that they address that and their application. Can you put anything about in the vertebrae around about slash reader, if I'm not mistaken? I know they said front porch forum, but that committee doesn't reach. Lisa is nodding her head. As much as I believe in what you guys do, but I think they should be there because that reaches, to me, much more far reaching than the front porch forum. Suggest that. I think it's not a reason to not approve it, but I certainly think we should provide that. Right, I think that would be, at least, I'd make that recommendation to the motion. Yeah, we'll accept that amendment to the motion. What was the amendment to the motion? That they include a notice in whatever reader around about. We want to define notice. I mean, if Lisa writes a story that we consider that, or we make them put the public informational thing in, like, it's a DRV meeting. Well, I think they could, I don't have a problem with them providing with notice because they're going to be the experts on what's going to be happening there. Right, I just want to word our motion to get at our intent. So I'm thinking, I'm sure there is notification. What was the original motion, Carla? There is motion which is to approve the leaf papers, right, so I'm going to go for a second. I'm going to make it do that one and then do a second one. It's probably. That'd probably be cleaner. Yeah. OK, then all in favor, say aye. Aye. Any opposed? Motion passes. So then I basically made an amendment to that they include in there that the leaf papers organizing committee include in there advertising and promotion that it'd be included in the Waterbird and Readers slash where I'm about to be notified the public of any issues. So. Thank you. I'll second it. Motion is second. Any further discussion? They haven't. They're seeking additional notification as possible, newspaper, radio, etc. In general, public awareness. OK, sorry, it took me a minute. I didn't see that either, I'm sorry. That probably then covers that. We could probably just mention that. Reflected a minute. It was noted to encourage staff, to encourage organizers to ensure there was notification in the Waterbird reader as a newspaper tracker. Perfect. Thank you. I think that we could probably draw that. You know, just have it as a recommendation. Sure. OK. I'm not opposed to that much. And if we feel strongly about them, I was just. It looks like it got their bases really well. I'll cover with this right up. Yeah, they sound like they've done the right thing. OK, move on to the next one. What a gravel grinder event on May 15, 2022. So I send you information on that. And I know Keith is here. He's involved in the organization of that event. Keith, if you could give us the highlights. You have the notice I sent you. Yeah, it's just I have just the email, right? That you forwarded. Yeah. Sunday, May 15, Friday, 30 AM from Kilogram Park, approximately 500 participants with approximately 30 volunteers to support. We're going through Waterbury Center Stoke in Stohalo back to the village. Sunriders continue over to Moortown, an aid station as in past years of the Triangle Park as Evo and Waterbury Center, which she submitted a request for. That was as of April 21. So that might be reserved, I'm not sure. And then we have an emergency action plan available. That seems to be the gist. OK, I don't know. Keith, Keith says back at is Keith, do you have anything to add to what Danny had presented? That's also just to make you aware that that's happening. OK, the bikers get like straight now. It's not a traffic problem. There's been no complaints in past years when I've run it. No, no, no, nothing that I know. I'll move to a move. Thank you for your second second motion or second. Any further discussion? There being none, all in favor, say aye. All right. Any opposed? There being none, motion passes. OK. As of general note, topically, I don't know. Like, could we have an S.A.Q. guys for like hosting an event in Waterbury? No. I'm just thinking, this is, you know, an email and like, hey, what? What's going on? It's not a town event. It's not a certain kind of hosting event. I guess I'm seeing that. So an approval for like a park, we do have a process. Yes. But this is more. We're using news for property. So this is just a notification. Yes. Thank you. Anyone who uses public property has to ask for. In case you see it, you're wondering what's going on. Right. You don't care about it. Right. OK, we'll move on to discussion on the recruitment plan questions from Vermont League of Seas and Towns. Just to keep everyone kind of up to date. We had a first meeting with the folks from Vermont League of Seas and Towns. They had a bunch of questions which they outline to the recruitment committee on what information that they need to go forward. Basically, as the committee exists, it's two representatives from the select board, two representatives from the EFA district, and one representative from the library. And that's what it is as of now. To be able to move forward in developing recruitment information, they have asked us a series of questions. And I know I have passed out the questionnaire to all the select board members in advance. Excuse me. I just got to say, sorry, can I continue? Yeah, this would be the questions that we'll give you. As you see, EFUD skipped basically kind of answer. EFUD is going to actually have a meeting tomorrow night. And they're going to go over these same questions. Maybe just so the public's aware. These are the following questions. They have more detail, but I'll read the general ones. When do you want the new person to start working? Is the pay range competitive given the current job market and housing crisis? Will the new manager be required to live in the community? Does an accurate description of the job exist? Is there some form of organizational chart in existence? Should a profile of the town and position be developed to help inform applicants and a search committee, if any? Step two would be under the advertisement. Where do you envision candidates coming from? Where do you advertise it? And they gave us a draft plan. Screening committee, who does the select board want involved in the screening process? Does the board want to involve others? Just put it on the select board. If so, who? How many members is the board going on the screening committee? Does the board want the committee to screen all applicants or doesn't want the consultant to screen out those who do not meet the minimum qualifications? Has the board approved the charge for the screening committee? And then step four is first round interviews. How does the board want the first round to be conducted remotely in person or a hybrid? How would the board like to receive the screening committee's thoughts? As a committee recommendation, verbal reports from consultant and participating select board members. Step five, final interview process. Assuming final interviews are conducted in person, what travel expenses for the candidate traveling at distance is the town willing to cover? Secondly, is what elements of the final interview does the town wish to include as part of the process and who decides? And three, how would the board like to debrief those participating in the final interview process should the manager be involved in debriefing? Step six, reference check, background check, negotiations on employment agreement. Is there an existing employment agreement with the incumbent manager? Is assistance in negotiating the initial key elements of an agreement desired? What is the name of the town legal counsel that plans to use for a review of the agreement? Some of these things, we probably don't have a lot of control, but I think we can answer these questions to the best of our ability. And myself and Danny and actually Maroney who's a representative from the library, we could bring those forward to when we have the next meeting with the consultant. Who is it? There is not. After this meeting where we'll decide to answer some of these questions for the consultant and then we'll, if I was gonna have a meeting tomorrow night, I'll relay what the results are from our meeting. There was a question of, is that a conflict? Is that really a selection committee meeting? Do we have to have it warned? I'm not meeting tomorrow with the E5 as a, so I'm meeting as a select board member just to bring them. So I don't think that we're in violation of the town meeting, Maroney. Can I just make a suggestion? Because I looked at those questions and I'm a lawyer, but I work with lawyers in some of those questions. You may want to check with your lawyer how to avoid answering your console. Because one of the questions there is whether you want that person to live in town. And I don't think legally you can do that. So there's some questions that are in there Right. There are, I know, other, like, you know, when you have like a fire chief or something, they want to require the fire chief to live in the community that's there. A lot of communities don't have that requirement. To be quite honest, I don't see why we have to have that requirement. It would be nice if they lived in Waterbury, but. I would just say that is government also. Right. I would say in general, my understanding, right, is BLCT is helping to provide this. I mean, we heard and agree is providing support and ensuring that we have a process. Do we have a strategy for talking through? Are we talking through the S.K.I.P.S. responses? Yeah, this is the first thing to make sure we're not in need of writing it to us. S.K.I.P.S. responses came within an hour or two of this meeting. Right, no, I am. But I'm just saying, so what's our strategy from the good thing is it's eight o'clock now. We have some time to work through this. Is there a proposed structure? And I think it's going through the questions and seeing if we're unified on some of the answers, going down kind of as what, you know, similar to what S.K.I.P.S. you know, did in his responses. So maybe we should just start moving right down the questions. When do you want the new person to start working? I know in S.K.I.P.S. email, I think as we all talk that we wanted the person to start by November the 1st. What's Bill's proposed final date? December 31st. End of the year. And I know where I had on the, you know, their proposed list of days. They have December 5th start work. I think we want to move that up because we all have discussed in past select board meetings to have some time with the new select board manager, work with Bill, you know, get some background information. And I think we can do that because I think some of the, some of the in between items can be consolidated. As long as they know that, I think, does anyone have, should we start earlier or do we want to go with the consultant's recommendation of the 5th? I think we should move as early as possible. November 1st is great. I think the best we could probably do is consolidate step two, if that's a huge chunk. And I know one of S.K.I.P.S. very vocal concerns was getting things done. But I think this, I'm sorry, I meant step one. I'm sorry about that. The defining the job call to patients. But I think now that we're moving forward, I don't, I think, you know, two and a half months. I think we can do it in less than a month. Right, so, yeah, as early as possible. We want as much overlap as possible. So. Well, that's why I think we want right from this meeting move into really, you know, getting to the meat of the stuff, have them developing so the steering committee can have, you know. So November 1. Should still have any input on this? No, he doesn't want to. He, I knew he did want some of it, but I don't know if he was concerned about time frame. He budgeted for a certain time frame for overlap, but I can't remember. But I'm thinking it was too close to two months. Yeah, right. And that would put us at that November 1st date. We should have two major holidays in there. Yes. That is a good one. Realize that if we could do it sooner, I think it would be great. You know, if we could hire someone, but I would say at the latest, we want to see this process done by November 1st to give them some some time. So I'm seeing on step one, when do we want we concur with the recommendation November 1 and possible and hearing that we concur with the recommendation November 1 possible and that that would be a planned overlap of yes, November to December, but I'm also noting that this is not matching this draft schedule we received. So we're discussing changes in what's labeled as step one, assuming we're coming contract start with step zero, which currently defines April 25th to August 15th for this first step in defining job qualifications. And I heard August 1st as a potential end date for that project. I think it might need to work backwards, Alyssa, from right from 12, five at the bottom. To 11-1. And then work backwards to the one before in order to. Yeah. And I don't know to be frank, whether we do this or if we give Rick that, and they do that. Understood. And I think that Rick will be able to- Adjust accordingly pulling out of it. Right. Yeah. No, I think that's fine. I think Rick would do it when you say we want to hire by this. And I think there's some slush in some of these interim dates that he could, you know, like especially the first one, define job qualifications and requirements for the position. I think that can be- Yeah, so I think the ask would be to give- Hope that we'd be able to do that before August 15th. Me too. I don't see why we would delay that to the amount of time. And because we're advancing the higher date, we're going to have to advance the message steps. So, yeah. So, Mike, when you do return these, for really these answers just the request would be to use that start date to then re-adjust the dates in this. Okay. And I would say I think specifically by compressing the defined job qualifications timeline because I think we do want to ensure that there's a long window for recruitment. I think it's like it's going to take folks a lot, you know, a theory like this to have. I had a good time for advertising a four-time supply. So I would hate to have that be the portion I guess, Pat. That's not a for sure thing, but I'm mostly just saying that as background for you that I think we all think that's a pretty long, you know, three, that's what may June, July, half of August. Yeah. If we could do, I think we think we can do that in less than three and a half months or the committee can. The only thing I know that, I know Bill doesn't want to really be intimately involved with the process, but I think we do need him to be intimately involved with some parts of the process, such as what are the functions that he does? We need him to put that. You know, I don't think any of us are going to be able to do that. I think we need his assistance. Yeah. So I'll just switch. There's a question out, Leon. Are you taking any public comment right now? It'd be helpful if we kind of wait till the end. Let's get through these questions and then we could take public comment. I'm glad to come. Okay. It doesn't search for any questions. Right. This is, we're really acting not as a search committee. We're acting as the select board where we're addressing some issues to the consultant. And then I think in this, when the search committee is fully defined, that's at that point. Let's just have a very brief practical comment. Okay. Briefly. Yeah. Just, sometimes everybody disappears. Everybody gets engaged. When the candidates will be disappearing, this group will collectively be disappearing. And you're talking about adding some higher than six months. So time is that of the estimate. Well, that's one of the reasons why each of the groups has appointed an alternate who we expect to be fully engaged. So if someone's, as you point, checking out, we want to keep on marching along. Like we can, yeah. Thank you. So very well valid point. Okay. So B, who's responsible for approving the recruitment schedule? Is it both boards? I would think it's the selection committee. The whole selection committee. Would it not be both full boards or it's only the selection? Well, because remember the library, at this point it is the library. There's still, I know, has been some sentiment that we want public involvement, you know, on the thing. We're not, but I'm specifically, who's approving the recruitment schedule? Is this, this is the schedule that it's referring to? I don't think it's, I think this is for discussion. I need help. So the question B is referring to this document. Is that correct? Right, which is probably gonna be revised. Understood. So the question is, who is responsible for approving it? And Skip's recommendation is the full select board and EFAT. So I'm asking if we as a board agree on that or does it only wanna be the small committee? My opinion is that the whole board should look at and approve the schedule, not just the small committee, but I'm open to other ideas and not. And if everyone trusts just the committee to approve it, that's okay. Yeah, well, I think that's a reasonable idea. I didn't catch your name, but his comment is well taken. Tom? I was trying to figure it out. Oh, okay. So I hope. I do think that we're asking for this process to be accelerated, given that we're shortening time frame and that we should probably try to set some dates by which both boards would want to come together and include the schedule. That ain't your question. No. No. I got more confused. I've tried this before and I'll say it again. Ultimately it's the select board that's responsible. They should at least be able to review them. I agree with Chris. Also because Candidate there's been some communication challenges between the smaller committee and the sport. So my only concern would be scheduling and not I do know if that's I'm trying to pull up calendars here because they're saying their contracts are to people 25, which is like our next meeting. No, that was awesome. No, it was started with our first. We've already had the contract done. First meeting. Right. Okay, sir. Okay. Thank you. We also in. Right. So both boards, are we? I think, yeah. And does it need to be, I don't know this policy wise, like could this schedule just be sent to everyone individually? And if anyone has questions or concerns, it could be written individually. Like we don't have to vote on it. We just have to not have a problem with it. Can this not be done at a consent and have a selection committee meeting. And if there's any issues, the select board and EFUD boards can comment. Yeah, what? I'm just saying is to expedite matters. I know what I'm hearing from Chris and the Roger is that select board ultimately should have decision making. And if the selection committee basically, because I think this schedule is going to be revised right after we speak to the consultant. Yes. And we'll get that, the selection committee will have that, bring it back to the board. And, you know, I really want to get to be quite honest, get going. You know, I hate to take a wait till next select board meeting. You know, times the wasting. Right. So I'm asking if it has to be done in a meeting because I don't think we have to vote on it. Can it just be sent to all the select board members and the EFUD members? Obviously we won't even see it because I'll be a part of that really. So can it just be shown to folks if there's big concerns, they can raise them with you. If there's no problems with it, we'll all concur. Right. I just think everyone needs to see it. I want to talk a little bit about that, questions that were submitted. Just the schedule, like the recruitment. This is they submitted a schedule of, which is already kind of off and still looking at a selection of December 5th, which is beyond where we want to be. So we just need to tweak that schedule a little bit that will work. And I think the boards can, I don't think we just need to adjust those things and they'll be able to make something that will work for everyone. Yeah. Okay, thank you. Thanks. Okay. It's the pay range given the competitive current job market and housing for what is the pay range competitive given the current job market and housing prices. I don't think we have kind of set out a pay for the incoming town, town manager. Right. So that's going to be happening in probably that step one. What's your final? I think that as I agree would happen within step one. I think we have to come up with, Bill has been on the job for 34 years and we have to look at what environment we are. And now, can we offer more or less or something? Or we'll probably have a range, a starting pay range. You know, it depends upon who we get as applicants. I think it's going to determine what kind of a pay range. So the response is pay ranges to be determined in discussions with BLCT and Bill. I'm comfortable with that. Yep. Agreed. Will it be advertising the job? Yeah, we don't wait until we get candidates. We'll advertise. There will be a range, I assume. Right. That's how most jobs are really saying, you know, from, you know, 60,000 to 90,000 or something of that nature, you know, I'm just using that as numbers. And what major fringe benefits that I think would just be the standard, you know, fringe package that all employees get. Yeah, I mean, I think that will happen in the same. Agreed. I don't know if we just say, is this part of the discussion of job qualifications and requirements and compensation. I don't think compensation will be added to that first step. Right. Which can include fringe for all the things. Combinations from, okay. Okay. Agreed. Needs for the... Will the new town manager be required to live in the community? What seems like we wouldn't necessarily, if we're not planning to require that, then it doesn't, then maybe we don't need to do much legal research, right? I don't see that being an issue. Yeah, I don't see what we would require. Unless she's planning on living in New York City or Boston. Of course. We can use that, and then it wouldn't matter. Great, so no. Next, doesn't, this is the tough one. There is no good job description. And that's something I think this group is going to have to develop. But I think we need definitely assistance from Bill. I think he'll assist with that. I think he'll assist with that. Yeah. I think you have offered that last meeting, not just because he said when he came in, there wasn't a move. Right. Thanks, but I need to... Yeah, I think he's willing to do, he's not willing to get into interviewing and stuff like that. But I think, to develop a job description, which I think is essential if we have who are offering a position. So people know, this is what my responsibility is going to be. Do we want to have any minimum? Do we want to have any degrees requirements? Do we, are there any kind of things that we want to have required of the applicant? One. I was thinking certain amount of experience in municipal management would be helpful. Any amount that you were thinking. Anyone have other opinions on that? I think that... All the times I understand management policy doesn't look like that. They're all different. This is a set guideline that the state of Vermont has for towns that have town manager government that the certain... But those are really based is like, they prepare the budgets and stuff like that. They don't get down into the nitty gritty. Each individual town, because they're all different. You know, water barrier is different than Newport. Newport's different from Burlington. So they all kind of have different requirements. So I think, you know, I think the time requirement someone's experienced, but is there any other things that people feel are essential to burn applicant? Well, we see the job description before it gets well. I recommend that you do. I would say yes. Yeah, absolutely. Well, we have to develop that, the committee. Committee, Bill, Rick, and then, yeah, I don't imagine anything gets put out with the full board, well, full board. So there's a basic boilerplate, like you were just mentioning, but then there's things that this town differs from the others. I was going to ask you, let's do it separately. See, there's not even a boilerplate in this board, and it did. That's a problem. Right, forget it. That's what we have. That's what we have. Pretty much on the step one. I would assume that's what BLCT was all about. Oh, I was going to say, it says no to be developed. So I think, again, there's a session of minimum qualifications. I appreciate you asking. I would say again, probably consideration with defining job qualifications and standards, which was a step one. And B is it's determined by a vote of the select board all the more. Well, no, so this is the position established. I think this gets to Moroni's question, which is, and we wish we had Ghostbill chef like in the room with us. Waterbury does have the town manager form of government, which I believe took a vote of the town to implement that. So some towns have a town administrator who does administrative functions for a select board, but we have an opt to have the town manager form of government, which in search after Vermont state statute, which currently is Bill's job description is the things that are enabled and authorized via the town manager form of government. So I think that's what we're talking about. Yes. Yes. Okay. Is there some form of organizational chart in existence? I don't know. That's something I have to ask. So in this bigger conversation, not to be asked here, but huge the org chart and the lack of job description and personal policy part of our large issues at hand. Currently, there is we have five hour meetings. So to set up this person for success, this is essential and also to take things off our plate like happened last meeting and it's still continuing. This personnel stuff needs to be done and it needs to be stayed on top of because this town is not just two people running the show anymore and to be a professional, we've got to have this. One of the real complications of this is the fact that we have two municipalities, E-Fund and the town, like our public works, director works for E-Fund for the town. So yeah. And E-Fund can eventually go their own way and say, no, we choose a town manager. They can say, no, we're looking at someone else. That can't happen. Right, maybe we should sort that out in step one. I was just gonna say, that's my actual question. So in terms of like scope for this, I think the answer to this question is no, it's not. And I think, you know, is it a parallel track? We have task one to find job qualifications or requirements. Pay range is their box too, that also just says approve requisite town or chart and whatever else that needs to be done. Yeah, I think it's like one B, it just goes in there because... I know it's a separate process, so it's not for this contract to be clear, it's part of the town. But I would imagine coming into that position is something, I mean, I ask for it in interviews, like it's something you're gonna wanna see as a potential candidate. So I think to be able to have it by interview time would be pretty essential. I agree. Pretty easy to develop. Okay, next, should a profile of the town and position be developed to help inform applicants and search committee if any? And yes, Skip said yes to be developed with, you know, with VLCT and consultant's help. R.W. Oh, that's R.W. Okay. Any disagreements to that? I think that's common sense. How should the community be described to the applicants? So these, so are these A through D, like subsets of this profile? Yes. All right. Okay. I think it's what's in or on our website that's kind of described our town. Well, our website, Stover, Waterbury and R.W. Right. I think, but I think your point is a lot of this could be compiled from existing resources. Exactly. Anyone disagree with that? Who does that, though? Whose responsibility is that to create that profile? Is it the search committee? I think you could remind me 9% of the way there, right away. Right. But someone needs to be responsible for copying and pasting and putting in a document. Just whose job is what? It's like- To me, ultimately- It's not this morning as well. To me, the consultant ultimately does that, could ask for information from various sources, but it could do the final. So we would want to find out and confirm that they would be willing to do that. Yeah. What are the major upcoming issues facing this community? Just the like- That could be a day's discussion. I think these are all things that are going to be put in. Merger charter, we've discussed infinitum housing issues. You know, continued economic vitality of the town. I think- Portability? Yeah, I think those are the big broad brush things. Is there anything that we're really missing that's- If you're starting improvement in maintenance, there's always a key six months on now, new practices keep going up there early. I think that's a good general description. We also have two recreation studies there. We're going- Yeah, that's probably- And probably the re-write of the zoning re-write. It's not that much. How well does the board responsible for hiring the manager work together? Skip route? Okay. We haven't- We haven't done it yet. Can I just- Sorry, one on major issues. I just want to say like, access and responsiveness and engaging with the- I mean, I think it's kind of to Chris's point about infrastructure, but like, it's not a major issue, but the day-to-day of doing local government and interacting with the public and interacting with the public very consistently, professionally, all those things. Of course, I think that would be a significant benefit, but I just want to say I think like, ease of access and not for the thing of certain reasons. Yep. I think so. Okay. Sorry. How does that work? How old is that guy? I still don't know. Don't really know how to respond to that. That's just- So I think Skip says it well. Yeah. Very brief. Next is how many employees is the manager responsible for supervising and what is the annual budget? We could provide the annual budget really easy and I'm sure when Bill's here, I know it is around 100 if I'm not mistaken. Employees? Yeah. No. Well, I think- 50-ish, less than 50-ish. I think he's saying this like- Well, it's not really- He counts the whole time. He counts the entire department people. Yeah, and part-time summer recreation. Right, part-timers and stuff. They're more than you think. You mentioned that number before. I've heard 100 being- I guess that's just like as direct supervisor. But I agree with your comment. It's more like 50 with the price, another 50 of being part-timers. And I bet we could get a part-time full-time equivalence. Right. That's something that would be easy to provide the consultant. And are there any enterprise funds the manager is responsible for managing such as a water, sewer, stormwater, or other related funds? If so, what is the budget for each? And we could all get that from, you know, the CIP stuff in the town budget. Sure. That would be the same. We definitely do. Yeah, that stuff's just a matter of compiling. Okay, advertisement. Where do you envision candidates coming from? Where to advertise? See draft plan. They put A, any local over Montague for seven days, Burlington Free Press, local. Right up there, our Burlington reader roundabout. You never know who's right in our community wants the job. Local, no question. Yeah. Any other things that- I mean, there- Wouldn't we- I would think that Times-Argus would probably be one that we'd want to prioritize and be- It's a local. I think that's a local paper. Regional sources. I thought they had a good list. Any comments on the regional ones? Anything that people think should be added to that? Maron, do you have a question? Yeah, I was just curious. Are we advertising outside Vermont or just within Vermont? That's a pull-up point. Well, yeah. We just said there would be a whole bunch of things. I think it will be outside of Vermont as well as inside. I think we're being- It could be very restrictive by being just within our state. Right. Plus, it's, I think, good for diversity and stuff that we have put, potentially have a diverse pool of applicants. I wasn't in that one. We're on the same page. Yeah, we've got regional sources, national sources, and then online. And I'm sure he has national, international, city, county, manager, association, and there are kind of other things which are going to reach people from all over. And social media sites such as LinkedIn, does anyone have any other social media sites that they think would be good places for us to advertise? Well, LinkedIn doesn't have a dash in it, just for social media. Cool, Olga. No, I mean, I have terrible voice. Everyone I know who's either hired or looked for work with indeed has had really bad experiences. So I wouldn't recommend it, but yeah. No, it's not. So I don't recommend it. I mean, it- But I don't know enough about, you know, when I did a lot of hiring on a long-term basis, a lot of these big-time, you know, online recruiting services and advertising that weren't in existence. So, you know, I see the advertisements on television. I just don't, you know, I can't sort through what's good or bad. I would hope your employer would have something to say about that. You're laughing. You're laughing. No, I just think there are Denny and Ease. That's the last one. Yeah, LinkedIn is pretty big. I'll put a no with Ease. And just to read from folks who aren't looking at the memo, because I guess the point I would say, too, like we have seven days off, or seven days have an excellent online job for, if that's what I'm talking about. Seven days. I don't know if they want to write about that. And then regional services, like New Hampshire, League of Media, municipality, TLCT, Mass Media School Association, I do believe several of those have online built-in boards as well. I know, like, that plan our positions to, like, a lot of associations of people who do these things. I do not know if folks who are interested would likely go. So. Exactly. But, yeah, I guess the distinction of social media sites as opposed to online sites of other organizations get along with each other. I think there were two different things. Okay, let's move on to the next three, screening committees. Who does Select Board want involved in this screening process? Does the board want to involve others beyond just the Select Board? I think we have already answered that question. It would be the committee. Well, yeah, just stating, you're stating that we're saying the search committee is serving us, the screening committee. This is the question of the hour. How many members does the board want on the screening committee? I know Skip has on his five, which is already what's on there. Do we want any other members? I think at the least we want input from both the employees, not as a full member, but have input from them as to qualities that they would like to see. I think that is really important. To me, I'm up a little bit up in the air on a quote, public member. What's all your thoughts? Is this relate to this draft? You might include staff member or public member later in the process. I would agree with that. I guess, well, if we have this draft charge for town manager screening time, so I'm just wondering if that's relevant. It's saying it's charged with assisting the search. It gives an outline of the work. I don't know if we have any thoughts on it. It's reviewing all applications, recommending candidates, first round interviews. But then, yeah, I don't know what the process is beyond that and screening committee versus the committee. I would think that the screening committee could do what you were just suggesting, Mike, is ask for input, both from the public and from the staff, but that we wouldn't necessarily want to inflate the number on the screening committee because we want to keep this process relatively tight and expeditious. Yes. I agree. It's difficult for me to think that somebody from the public can have a justifiable point of view on this because 99% of them are so uninformed or misinformed or, you know, as to what really goes on. And I speak to that as a citizen of Waterbury who has become a SWCC board member and has gone from seeing what I thought I was seeing to now what I really see. Even I'm not a social media addicted person. I hear enough about social media to hear the pendulum on both sides and it's difficult to think that somebody's gonna have a real insight as to what's actually going on. Yeah, I think overall we're hearing that. Oh, sorry. I mean, there could be a way of getting around it. First of all, I respect the second 99% of Waterbury who is in our own home. But I think there's a way, I do know some members of the public who have not been part of this process. So maybe there's a way of maybe putting out something out there to get input. So what kind of question do you want this to be important as? And just get that in the public and then rather than having others never being part of it, at least get some input as a pregnant question based on what you're asking. Yeah, and that's specifically what we asked, Rick, because I said, you know, it's really, I think it's really important to have particular staff input. And then we've talked about public. So keeping the committee at five seems to be what most are most comfortable with. And then going back to Rick and he said, he does have ideas and experience with getting input. And I think that's a really good way because I know that happened in response to Chris's question. I too just don't want any, you know, everyone has an opinion on something. And if they have a gripe, you know, they'll say, I want to be there because I want direct use to new town manager. So we'll have this and that done. I think maybe let's, I don't, I'm sorry to interrupt you, I'm sorry. I just want to maybe reframe the way we're talking about the members of our community and understand that they want to help. And yes, some people have an agenda, but it's because they care about things. And I know we hear about it and it's exhausting. I know. But I want to make sure that we remember we're representing them. We maybe talk about them in a more positive light. Thank them for wanting to be involved and also know that we have our hesitant to call expertise. Cause I'm only my second year, but we have, you know, it's our job that we're here to do. So we'll take that responsibility, do what we can to incorporate input, but also know that it might not be a good fit for a public member to be on the committee. Perfectly said. And the where I was going is that I've heard from people who've had, they've either been past select board members, past people who know about, you know, government, our government process, who I think can add to the process. But I think that ultimately having the staff as well as public, give that input to the committee, I think would be the best way because as if the committee gets too big, it just couldn't fog itself down. So I think what I'm hearing is the consensus that the five person committee works for us. Let me just bring it. Okay. And I think we just need to be clear about figuring out where are those opportunities for input are and communicating them. I'm seeing some even looking down to the final interview process. So we can discuss there, but I do think it's really important. Again, we've been kind of working internally as a board to figure out how to put the screenings together and how they communicate with us. You know, I think this charge for the screening committee is a useful tool in that regard. It's noting that the final decision rest with the select board. But I also think today is what we as a select board have a responsibility to communicate out. This is what the process is and this is where those opportunities for input are. So as we move forward figuring out what those are and then clearly sharing them. Totally agree. If not, in pursuit of that, perhaps when we reset the schedule here, we did set a date for public input for all the occasions that we're looking for and then the other input that people have on this process. We need to, because we don't want them to have input the day before we're going to go to and relish that. Right. And there could be a series of steps where we'll present the answers to all these questions, finalized and then set dates for the different stages. I assume we're all on agreement on that. Okay. As the board approved the charge for the screening committee, I think we have by selecting. What's that, Alyssa? Number three. Oh, yeah. Okay. Writing too much on the thing. It's getting a little messy. Does the board want the committee to screen all applicants or does it want the consultant to screen out those who do not meet the minimal qualifications? I think it's, we're going to have some sort of minimum qualifications. So if they don't have, I don't want to be bothered a lot of time. I think that's what we'll pay the consultant to do. Just my opinion, any disagreement? So as a board, has the board approved the charge for the script, a charge for the screening committee? I assume they mean what they're going to do. And I think we have. Has everyone read it? We've developed an open, I think it's still going to be developed to somewhat, especially now that we're looking at, yes, we're going with a five member board with input. So I think that's what, and we just have to define what the committee is going to do and when and when that will fall back to the board. Any other comments on that? Okay. Step four, first round interviews. How does the board want the first round to be conducted? So remotely in person or a hybrid? I think first round seems appropriate to get options. If someone's really far away, let them zoom in that they're a candidate, you know how in person. Yeah. Is there a number that we're thinking about having as a number of first round candidates or let the process determine that? You just did by meeting certain qualifications. Right. We very said it will toss out, but if we have 25 people that meet the qualifications. I think that's part of this charge. At least part of this graph that screening charge shows that recommending eight to 10 candidates for first round interviews, conducting those first interviews and then considering what two to three candidates should be available for second round interview process. Or maybe we finalize that as part of finalizing this charge when we do that. Any other comments on that? Okay. How would the board like to receive the screening committee's thoughts as a committee recommendation verbal report from the consultant and participating select board members? Skip didn't have an opinion on that. I like the idea of having the consultant also give reports, so it's not just the committee. I don't know. I mean, it's more for your benefit in theory that would be there, but. They're saying consultant and committee. You guys, I mean, I think ultimately you wouldn't create recommendations. We should then hear seven recommendations. But input from both versus just the committee or do you think that's over? Like input from Rick as well as the committee recommendation. Right, I'm hearing and sorry, this is like a really worded sentence. So as a committee recommendation, I think there should be a committee recommendation. I think a verbal report from the consultant from Mike and Danny, participating select board members may also make sense if there was something to elaborate on or if there's, I don't know. Yeah, I'm not sure. Sorry, let's just try to park to what we're getting at. Some of these questions are a little disjointed. Yeah. Firstly, I'd like to get to your recommendations on the top five candidates and the reasons why we position them and so the top five candidates and key strengths and no questions that you're going to go after. No, I think that's a reason for a very reason. Oh, it's fine. Any other comments on that? Next final interview process. Assuming final interviews are conducted in person, which I assume they would be what travel expenses for candidates traveling a distance is a town willing to cover. I'm sure Rick could probably give us some sort of guidance on that. But, you know, someone's coming from Hong Kong, you know, or some, you know, we should probably have some sort of a budget for someone traveling. You're also going to advertise in the budget. Right. I would think that we need an overall budget for this process. And then their initial proposal, I think they had like a range of, so I think once we know exactly where we're going to go, we'll have a more firm, you know, advertising budget. But I would just say it's kind of a TBD. I think we want to have a certain allowance to allow people traveling a distance to come, you know. Maybe given our overall budget, if you can recommend. Yeah, I would say he's probably had enough experience with this. Fun travel, if it's needed to a reasonable extent. So folks can visit the relative to, well, I wanted to be close to the overall cost of the search for the future of the community. If there's an outstanding candidate that needs to travel, we should support that. It looks like there was a range. So that way, let's say that was $750 and it was divided by three candidates and only two of them needed it and they can have a higher stipend or a higher reimbursement. But... And some may say you're having a candidate coming from Connecticut. They may be able to drive versus why. You would hope so. You would hope so, but you never know. Maybe they don't drive. But we'll start with the budget. Yeah, I was going to mention that. Also consideration. Yeah. Driving may be a key qualification. Yep, okay. What elements of the final interview does the town wish to conduct as part of the process and who decides? We've basically eliminated Bill already because he says he doesn't want to. Well... Okay, that's the final interview. Yeah, he doesn't want to. This has opportunity for Q&A. So if I was taking a job in a town and someone had that job for 34 years and I had the opportunity to ask him questions, personally I would like to do, but it feels not well and too clear that we're not going to have questions. Do you want to think that's a challenge? Yeah, maybe we need to follow up with him to clarify if he would do that. No, it says no Bill preference. So that just as soon as he's been asked. Never mind. Yeah, let's not assume almost... But that is a good comment because if an applicant does have wants to speak to Bill about the job, I think that's a reasonable request. And if he doesn't want to, he doesn't want to, but I'd rather confirm with him than assume he was still checked with because I don't know how the communication's been. And just as a note, the tour of the town facilities and stuff was also a time when Rick said it was a good time for staff to also interact with those final candidates and he had, you know, organizationally ideas of how that worked well and how he's done it in the past. Would the committee be the ones conducting the tour with the applicants, I assume, or representatives, right? Yeah, probably not all five. Right. I'm assuming it's going to be a few that can attend. Maybe you want a staff member. Yeah, I was just going to say. No, definitely. I think the staff member would be, that would be very appropriate because the staff member's going to know the infrastructure better than any of us. Written assignment. Do we want to specify that the town employee is part of the tour of the town and facilities or is it only one? Do we think that some, some of it's an opportunity to engage with staff needs to be explicitly included in that? Yeah, I think we could include it and be, but we would want to sell it out explicitly. Yeah, I don't know if they're talking about a written assignment. Do we want them to submit a copy of something of a document that they have produced, you know, work to see how cognizant their ideas are what we're written for? Yeah, can we get clarification? Maybe we can ask Rick about that. Because I think that's, you know, really here and seeing someone's writing style, if someone can't put together a good business letter, I'd have a lot of concerns. You know, same, I would have a lot of concerns with someone who can't communicate well. I think that's, to me, is more important than his writing, but I think writing is important too. I don't know if it's also a past work sample as opposed to a written assignment. I'm not like, do we want candidates, is this going to be writing a sentence assignment? Because I don't know if it's going to be asked to be a candidate to say something about it or is it saying, you have qualifications that likely will include municipal experience and share. I would say, can you provide a document? I don't know. Right. Can you provide a document that you've shown how you dealt with a problem in a past job or something like that? But I think Rick's going to be best to guide us on that. panel interview, who do you want to participate? Not on the search committee. I'll be edgy and say, is it more effective to do final interviews with the full board if the full board is making the higher decision rather than recur to TD? Yeah. The search committee heard the final interview of two to four. I know Skip, but the search committee, I kind of agree with you, Alyssa. I said, to me, I don't think to have three other people on that interview was that, you know, I always hate to have, like, when you have interviews, you have 10, 12 people on an interviewing board, which is, you know, very intimidating to a candidate. You could see about, like, could you report them or something? Because I guess I'm cognizant to both. I really was just thinking practically, like, if it's a search committee, it's kind of the order of recursion, I think. Should we want to say that? That should be helpful. I mean, it's like, work and interview, like that. Yeah, well, it was, yeah, go and check the site double and check the site name, stuff. So that was my question, is the order of these events for a panel, are we having a first interview and then a panel interview and then a select board interview? These are the final interviews, right? Scratch the middle one. I think the final interview is the interview. The select board interview. Right, once you get down to eliminating the candidates to reasonable, you call people in, that's your interview. Then you may want to decide sometimes if you really feel you need a second interview for some reason. I'm hoping we could do it with one interview. Well, two, a preliminary interview. Right. One more. I guess, so I was misunderstanding this clearly and I apologize because I hadn't looked at the second one. So we have a select board interview and TPD. So that's already on here. This is saying a panel interview, I guess. I mean, not to use the example when I interviewed to the Economic Development Director for Violet and Waterbury, I interviewed with Bill and Karen at RW and Wayne Leverton and someone from the community and John Grenier. So I guess that, now that I'm rereading his panel interview, is it the search committee that's to propose? Is it something more public and random? Yeah, anyway, I just think we should before we immediately say no. That's a separate thing and it's watching you engage with diverse constituencies. That isn't just us as a board. So let that be TPD. Well, do people have any of that? And who that would be effective for? Or would be all of that? Roger, Christ, your opinions? Well, I think that the full select board and the full board of P5 are going to be going on us. So we've got to be involved in this final interview. I guess I'm not clear on what the difference would be because the panel in the research committee versus that final interview with the two boards. And what I was also speaking to is that it probably wouldn't be the search committee. More the panel would be more patchwork of perhaps a leader in the community, maybe a staff member, maybe a public member, maybe some of them are W. So people with diverse interests and investments in the town asking different questions on their own behalf. How does that all trip it down to the select board? That's what all they're to hear. No idea. So the thing that knows a little bit different than what happened with the police department, the lawful discussion commission was charged with bringing several different options that they will basically brought one. So I guess through a long process, now how does that benefit the very end result? Unless we're all there at that. Right, sitting in as the audience members. And then my concern is if we're bringing someone here, if this is final and it's like two days, is the panel interview one day then select board and it reads the next day. And that to Chris's point, if you're not in the audience, then do those people have to write up their opinions and get them to you before the next and that just scales unreasonable. So the option would be then. Unreasonable and perhaps not 100% transparent or clear. Yeah, I think this is an important decision. Yeah. I think we can probably agree to clear our calendars for two days and can sit in the audience while other people in the community do that panel and hear the answers and form our own opinions and then come together as the two boards together with our final review. And then we're gonna have to deliberate to make our final choices. If that sounds like a reason to cross us, it's well worth the time that we invested it. Yeah, there may be questions out there. And then I asked you how to, you know, overlook towards the board's pleasure on that. I hate to drag somebody who is such a long process but to you, it's like through the minerals too. I guess, and I guess my own screaming is is that a public interview? And I don't know, like I'm trying to think of what the school board is to respond to it. But like that type of thing, right? Well, you know, staff is, you know. Right, so staff is gonna know. So right, I guess I stand with what Robert just said about in a few days and it could be a lot. It is another, it's another thing we have to think about. I'm talking about, so I get to know where that's an added competition, but. Seems worth it. And it's only gonna be the final two or three candidates. And this is important to me, just to muck things up a little bit, is this us looking at this decision and you're dealing with personal information. Is this something that needs to be done in an executive session? It's kind of like, you know, that's why I look at any kind of like hiring and firing kind of things. They're kind of. I think Rick would know. I'm sure he's done this before. So he could probably guide us and then we can say what we're gonna say. That's really, yeah. Because those are your personal information. Yeah. So as for guidance from Rick. Whether it's public or part of it's public and what we can and can't. I can see what part of it would be public, but I also, there's a lot that might not want to, you know, just in defense of people's personal information, you know, may not want to be out there on Fourth Street, you know. So we'll ask Rick. Hey, how would the board like to debrief those participating in the final interview process? Should the manager be involved in the debriefing? I think the second part is pretty, I don't think Bill's gonna want to be part of that. I think he's made that very clear. Well, I'm not really, I don't know if he's talking about the board or the committee. Debrief, I'm a little confused on that question. So it seems like he's referring to debrief just from the process or when we're letting folks know that our selection, because if it's referring to just the debriefing process, I'm not privy that I haven't done anything like that. So I don't know how that would go, but it's referring to like letting folks know, no, we haven't chosen you and what that process looks like. Then I think we could. Let's ask Rick on that question. I read this kind of analyzing this. So we're saying that we're hypothetically two to three candidates are gonna come for a tour. They're gonna give us some writing. There's gonna be some sort of panel or a few TPD. Obviously we would directly be involved in that final interview. But how do we go from that to a top and final candidate? I don't know. Is that a deliberation? I guess debrief. If the panel interview is distinct, that would need to be debriefed. I think we're discussing, some of that will be determined in conjunction with the structure of this panel interview. Then, yeah, I guess I'm just wondering what else fits in this process because then we're at reference tracks. Is it final deliberations? So, right. It means, yeah. I didn't know the consultant does that. So it's not debrief with those. It's deliberate about participants, right? Is that more accurate for you? Yeah. Or I guess, or we can just ask that question. You can just ask the LCT. Yeah. What would the process be for final deliberations? Yeah, I just wrote down what you said. So I appreciate that. And lastly, step six, reference check, background check, negotiations, unemployment. Is there an existing employment agreement with the incumbent manager? That I know is no. And is assistance in negotiating the initial key elements of the agreement desired? Yes. I would say, yeah, the consultant's gonna know that. And what is the name of the town's legal counsel to use and review of the agreement? It should be Joe McLean. Yes, it's all paid in budget. Anything else that we need to bring up before? Can we just talk about what the next steps are? I hate to be right here. I hear you loud and clear. This was really clarifying for me in seeing, and again, thank you to both of you and to the Boothbottom Library folks participating. We talked about updating this timeline and how that's gonna get back to us. Do you have this charge? Are we discussing that at our next meeting? We also got a list of advertising, which seems fine. But like, what are next steps in terms of what committees mean again, when things are coming back to us? This note that we do need to have a really clear outline to the public about what the process looks like when it's finalized and then that might be. I think as soon as EFUD meets and kind of has a decision, then I think very shortly thereafter, we'll probably warn a steering committee meeting of this. And I wanna go forward and enlighten and speak. So I think this is going to be, we're doing our part, EFUD is doing their part tomorrow. I'll communicate what we have said. Hopefully we'll have kind of, I think we'll have joint agreement on going forward, skips the contact to the consultants. So I think we're okay on, we'll be okay on moving forward pretty quick. Well, I hope that answers your question, Louisa. Yeah, I would say maybe can we just put an update on the next agenda at a minimum for our board, just to check in on where things are and then go from there. Yep, excellent suggestion. And that would include answers to these questions plus a revised schedule. Yeah, the revised schedule one should go around to the full board when it comes to us. And we're still okay. I know the consensus was probably to have the committee meet because I know our first meeting was during the day time. And I know some people kind of, and I think we'll have a lot of meetings via Zoom. Some people will be here, like Rick will meet via Zoom because that's going to save a lot of our travel costs and time costs from them community. And I think that's where our next meeting is where the rubber is going to meet the rubber. We're going to get a good outline on where we're going. And this will be no more and we should hopefully have a firm set of deliverables that VLCP will be able to produce. Okay, thank you all for being so patient. And the last item on the agenda, employee issue. Any issue. Yeah, this does concern some personal information about the particular employee. And so I'm going to go to the executive session to discuss it. Second back. Before that, could I make a general comment? I think it's really important. One, I had a fairly lengthy conversation this morning with Lisa from the roundabout reader. And I just want to clarify because I wound up, I de-plugged myself this weekend from internet and then all of a sudden on Sunday I see the reader in her article about changes in water very government. And I was concerned. You know, I said, I always try to respect people's Sundays as being family day and stuff like that. So I called her this morning and we had a very frank conversation. And I just made a very clear point that if you notice when we met at the last select board meeting that the title for the new director's position was going to be assistant municipal manager for community services. And I read her article and the way the article read to me is as if we were appointing a assistant municipal manager. And I just want to put this clearly on the record that is not true. Because if you look at it, it's assistant municipal manager for community services. What that was going to do was Bill has always been, Bill Sheppl of our town manager has always been overwhelmed in terms of stuff. He's taken on everything, more power to him. He's been really good about doing that. But, you know, I've talked to Bill many times I said, sometimes Bill, you really need to download things. You know, he's taken on the roles of health officer, you know, animal control officer have done this and that. And I said, Bill, these things are all just not sustainable. And that's one of the reasons why when in his proposal to make some adjustments to people, hey, to justify Nick is still gonna be in charge of all the recreation programs, but he was going to be helping the town manager if we have this whole Harper thing. And that was gonna be a big thing that, you know, he was gonna assist in that process. And there was some other assignments that were being given to him related to community services. To me, that's not a full assistant municipal manager. And I had a conversation today with Nick about it and we reached a real daytime about it. You know, I think he was very comfortable and he saw my side. His side was, you know, long-term for his career path. You know, he has to look out for what he's gonna do. If I said, I encourage you, I wanna have you stay in our municipal government. We cannot make any promises to you and we will not make any promises to you, you know, to that there is any kind of pending future advancement. It's like what we've talked about, it's gonna be total open competition. So if Nick applies, he will be treated like any applicant. And the only thing I really need one to be clarified that he is not an assistant municipal manager. That job title would have totally different responsibilities. Bill Woodruff has a lot of things that might go into that responsibility as to others. Well, I just wanna make that clear. I know I've spoken to Lisa. I know that's why before we go into executive session, I just wanted to be very forthright and very transparent to all the people in the town of Waterbury that we're not making any kind of decisions that are outside, you know, trying to second guess or pre-select anyone for position. So I've said my piece. Well, to your point, going back to what I said earlier about 99% of the public, not necessarily being informed about the facts of what really happens here. There can be some, let's say this, misprintings or misunderstandings for social media, personal opinions, things get blown out of proportion. One person takes somebody's comment differently than somebody else does and next thing you know, it's gone into orbit and, you know, it's just, it's different. I don't mean that the public doesn't have a, you know, doesn't care about their community, but the truth of the matter is even us as select board members are ignorant of a lot of what goes on in the internal workings of the municipality and so you have to be careful with these types of things because they can fall right off the rails. I hear 100%. The only thing is the newspaper article right in front street, the first two paragraphs are basically saying we have a new, you know, kind of assistant municipal manager and I know later it says assistant municipal manager for community services, but people sometimes agree, all we have, we have a new assistant municipal manager and that's all they've probably read that whole article. Not that the rest of the article is totally fair, but. It also led the discussion of municipal manager search. So just to say, as I pointed out earlier, us as a board communicate clearly and transparently what our process is, because then it's really easy to accurately report on it and have it at four. To echo Alyssa, I think we also can learn from this because I don't know that we as a board do a great job in terms of getting, and I think it's because we're essentially volunteers and we were a lot of hours, so we're doing stuff that you don't have time to do, but we signed up for it. That said, it's something that is a priority for me how do we communicate better to the public? The decisions are making what we're doing. Yes, it is there. There's a recording. Is it, are we expecting someone to watch a three hour meeting? No, we're not. So it's something I do care a lot about and I would love to work with us all about is how do we, if we want an image presented and we want communication done, you know, we're gonna work with Alyssa and she's doing her job and she's writing a newspaper, but if there's something we want out, let's call Alyssa and let's tell her what we want, what we decided. Let's put updates in from porch family Theresa and Tom do. So that's not obviously not going to be solved tonight, but there is some personal responsibility to be had on our part. Not that it's easy. Great point. Should I agree with both of you? Okay. Speaking of the public, we have Moroni, if you have a comment. Yeah, so I'm assuming this is the manager, because actually it's one of the hardest person to be, right? Well, yeah. Yeah, yeah. That's a great one. So just a couple, a couple of things. I'm sorry, I'm sitting here, my heart is beating. You know, I just, I really think it's problematic for an elected official who serves the public to continue twice and not to say the 99% of the possible orders are uneducated. I didn't say this. I thought of the 1% of these educated with uneducated, but I just think that's their problem out of consulting to the right of the residents and supporters. Second point that I want to make, and I think it's 90% of those orders that you mentioned were that out of the problem. The second point I wanted to make I hope I said the wrong one too. Okay. Just because that it's too, too many, out of the problem, but again, that's their problem out of the problem. Anyone who is in need to consider there's 90%, 99% of the constitution to continue to educate us, they're very sorry, the problem out of the problem. You have a lot of other questions. Well, if I just say this, I think that we had a lot of criticism in both contracts, and if they can educate us and there's a big difference. This member of the community has been attending a number of these meetings now. I'm just gonna say that. And I'm an educated member of the community. I've been on the one because I haven't been attending a lot of these meetings. And I spoke to a lot of members of the public and most are un-informed, but it's not because we necessarily choose to be un-informed. Many are just trying to work every day hard for their families so they can provide it with them. So I don't believe that Chris's comments have meant something to that place. We work from a realistic point of view. I can understand why you might see that. That could be taken in an offensive way, but it's not in the, I don't think it's meant in that way. And I think we do have to be realistic and recognize that people in America who are very Vermont are, like I said, a lot of them are working really hard and they're so busy that they don't necessarily have this in life. I would hope that we can figure out a way to help them make the time to become more important, right? And we can, and to do more. So I'm gonna just, and I know really quickly, I'm gonna wait and finish. I just, I want to remind us that when the public is speaking, you're actually addressing it fast as a board and on each other. So I'm interrupting you, but I want you to finish. I just want to remind you that you might not know, we don't discuss it a lot, but when the public is speaking, it goes towards the select board and not to other members of the public. So thank you. And Danny, can you have them speak up? I can't hear on Zoom. So, or on the, over to the internet. So if you can have them speak to the mic here. Thank you, sir. Well, I didn't want to finish. Yeah, thank you. Okay, so we have, sorry, go on. Oh, can I also just, I just wanted to add, I want to also as somebody who's been here 30 years, you know, I think Chris's point was really well received. And I don't think it's a political thing. I just want to be frank. I've been to like how many of these meetings. And first of all, you're all riveting. So you're like rockstar, right? Like we appreciate the work. The volunteer work is real. So, you know, it's respected that, you know, as a community that we should, you know, accept that you can say things without feeling attacked. And I think realistically 99% of the issues are not going to be understood by every single member of this community. And that's why we all work together in teams and come together. So, you know, I appreciate the work that's being done there, the inclusivity, all of that. So I may have executive session, but I did also just want to raise one other question from a public perspective. Is it not questioned so much as just a comment regarding the two municipalities of EFUD and the town, just as you go forward, you know, the whole issue with cannabis licensing, I was at the board meeting this morning. And so I just, I think, you know, the opt-in meeting that we had before the select board previously encompasses the entirety of this municipality. But if you see any kind of, I don't want to say conflict, but potential overlap because, I mean, what is EFUD essentially is, is it its own unique, atomically, you know, identically separated entity, or is it a subservient municipality similar to the old village? Those are questions that we need to know before licensing happens. So if you guys can help clarify, if you anticipate- So EFUD has their annual informational meeting at seven p.m. tomorrow, that I'm pretty sure includes the Zoom. So if you need a public forum to ask any questions that anyone has about EFUD, I strongly encourage you to pop back on Zoom tomorrow. So I'll come in there just to see what's up. And then they have their annual meeting next week on the 11th. So sorry, just chew something at the time. No, no, no, I'll definitely be there. And I'll raise that. I just want to make sure that like you as a select board see that issue because on the Heady Vermont website, which cascades through to the control board, there's literally a notification of the historic village as the licensed municipality that opted in. So it's a small point of order, but just want to put on your radar. Again, thank you. And if you are having members of the public speak to you from that location, if you can have them addressed through the mic, it's just super hard to hear here. All right, thanks again. Thank you. Thank you, Glenn. If you can, if you have any comments, if you can put very concisely to the select board members, what your concerns are, I will try to help you. Thanks. Thank you. Thank you. Can I make one last comment? I thought about that. This is not going to be a conversation, but I've been going through a lot of select board meeting and observing this setup. And this one is very unique and interesting. So all the select board meeting that actually face the public, I think this is more of a setup for this next session where you're talking among yourself. And those who are talking about inclusion, you can look at your setup divided. Thank you. We have talked about it. We have talked about the infinitum. Thank you. Thank you. Okay, so we've had those comments. I think we now need, we had a motion to go into executive session. All in favor, say aye. Aye. Aye. All those that are in the Zoom meeting, I'll be putting back out into the waiting room. Hi, Orca Media. I hope you can hear us. We're back, this computer says 1026, but our phone says 1018. So we are coming out of executive session. Any action? I think we've agreed not to take any action tonight in respect to the fact that our town manager is still on vacation. And we'll take a yes until our next meeting. Okay. Thank you. With that. Any further questions? If not, I'll make a motion to adjourn. So moved. Second. Holy in favor. Aye. Aye. Aye. Aye. Aye. I guess I'm getting tired. I thought you did your best work after telling mine. No. Thank you. I blame it on COVID. Yeah.