 Is that laptop yours? Was that your laptop for you and your father ever discuss you for him? So today we're covering Hunter Biden. And just like R. Kelly, you have an image in your head of who this is. Even more importantly, his father happens to be president. And you'll take all the baggage associated with the fact that he's the child of the president and assign all of that to him and what we're talking about. We're talking about what we see in terms of body language. We all have some very pointed opinions. Does not have anything to do with the president. Doesn't have anything to do with anything other than what we see. Period. That's it. All right, you guys ready? Yeah. Here we go. I'm Scott Rouse from a Body Language Expert and Analyst and I train law enforcement in the military and interrogation in body language. And I created the number one online body language course, BodyLanguageTactics.com with Greg Hartley. Mark? I'm Mark Boden. I'm an expert in human behavior and body language. I help people all over the world to stand out, win trust, gain credibility every time they communicate, including some of the leaders of the G7. Chase? I'm Chase Hughes. I did 20 years of the U.S. military. A lot of research into behavior and psychology. Nowadays, I train intelligence agencies and the general public in extreme persuasion, influence and behavioral profiling. Greg? Greg Hartley. I'm a former Army interrogator, interrogation instructor, resistance to interrogation instructor. I've written 10 books on body language and behavior and put together this course BodyLanguageTactics.com with Scott Rouse. I spend most of my time on Wall Street in corporate America today. All right, well today we're gonna talk about Hunter Biden and we're gonna take a look at a few interviews, sections of those that he's done over the past couple of years. Some of them are from 2019, isn't that right Greg? Yep, 2019, 2000 and then most recent one. Yeah, it was the most recent interview as well. So as we go through this remember, politically, we don't care. We're Switzerland, we go right down the middle. We're not for one side, not for the other side. Believe it or not, we do not care. There's no way we could care any less about who's innocent, who's guilty, who's being honest and who's being deceptive. We don't care. We're just telling you what we see in these specific videos, that's it. All right, we good? Just subscribe before you move on. Oh yeah. Make sure you subscribe. Yeah, hit that button. Okay, forgot. Yeah, help us. We're almost 2250. You could be the person who brings us over in our first year. Yeah. Yeah, wish we could give you something where we know who you were. All right, here we go. You make just one reference to it in the book. Yeah. Is that laptop yours? You don't need a laptop. You got a book. You got the book, it's all in the book. And I don't know. I truly, that- You don't know. The serious answer is that I truly do not know the answer to that. Did you leave a laptop with a repairman in Wilmington? Not that I remember. Not that you remember. No, no. But whether or not somebody has my laptop, whether or not my was hacked, whether or not there exists a laptop at all, I truly don't know. Are you missing a laptop? Not that I know of, but you know, read the book and you'll realize that I wasn't keeping tabs on possessions very well for about a four-year period of time. All right, Greg, what do you got? Yeah, so I'm gonna go, Mark, I'm gonna send a little like you this time. I'm looking at character. And as we walk down the path for the sky, I'm gonna tell you that if you're not old enough to know this character, you're gonna have to go and look him up. There's a guy named Eddie Haskell on Leave It to Beaver. And Eddie Haskell was notorious for any time someone could give him something like a parent, he would suck up big time. Oh, let me see if you can. Baby, won't you please come home? Your love and daddy is all alone. You see? Just practice him to the Glee Club at school and this is the Glee Club. I'm sure you are. And when they couldn't, he would talk down to them. There's a whole lot of Eddie Haskell going on in this video as we get into these next pieces. I'll point him out and his demeanor changes depending upon whether he needs something or he's telling. And we're gonna look at all of that. Now I'm not saying he's lying here. I'm gonna tell you, he might not even know whether this is his laptop or not and he hedges it every turn. So we'll talk about Eddie Haskell throughout this video. I'm gonna say he's now Haskell-ing, will be the term I use. Here, he starts off by chaff and redirect. He just throws a lot of crap out there for you to bite at and see which direction you'll go. By that I mean like a plane dropping a bunch of chaff and missiles taking off after it. He's dropping something and hoping you'll get there. He's very vague in his response. Always an indicator that somebody is getting the opportunity to avoid the question. He disclaims, his blink rate goes through the roof when he's talking about that and he starts to trade guilt saying, hey, he was a bad guy and get off my back in other words. And then he does sacred space, a thing I call closing your body and then milling. So it's burrowing, keeping space between you and then adapting, he's milling his hands. And then he does a whole lot of burrowing in general. He's locked up pretty tight. If he's not lying, he's sure sending a lot of indicators that something's up. And if I were interrogating this guy, the heat would go really up. I would say, no, no, no, no. You don't get to answer that way. You don't get to be free with this. You gotta answer my question. And then you get to the point where you see this guy's head poke and prod and push. And what you're gonna see is you see that brow go up request for approval, any time he needs something. And if you go back and find, leave it to Beaver and find Eddie Haskell when he's talking. Hey, Ms. Cleaver, you see that forehead up. You see all that nodding when he's talking to them. It's just classic. And we'll see him change his demeanor when he's talking in a different way. But for now, remember Eddie Haskell. Chase, what do you got? Great. I agree with all that. Where there is an edit in there. Then you can see it in the reporter, but I'd like you to check it out. Let us know in the comments if you identified where the edit was. And when he said, you don't need the laptop, you got a book, there's a book. There's some subtext here. You know what the subtext is? Go buy the book. I mean, he might as well have a screen behind him with his book on it. I mean, it's ridiculous. So, the serious answer is that I truly do not know the answer to that. So, this is double removal, a non-contracted denial, which means they say do not instead of don't. And did you leave it with a repairman? The reporter is shaking his head to help him with the answers. No idea who this person is doing the interview, but I would bet money that you're gonna see this again. And I would also bet money if I had no idea who either one of these people are, that the reporter was either paid or trained to assist this person in the interview. And not that I remember, said that twice with digital flexion on his hand. You can see his hand squeezing his other hand to try to hold himself still. He's very still here. And this is when he's being deceptive, according to me. And I want you to see what he looks like when he's not here in a couple videos, which we're gonna look at. And he's saying, read the book and you'll realize that X, Y and Z. So you need to go buy my book, go buy my book. And that's the overall theme of this. Mark, what you got? Yeah, absolutely all the same stuff. There's a book out there, go and buy the book. He's locked down. There's lots of self soothing going on there. I baseline this about against him being on Jimmy Kimmel because I thought a primetime show, still a lot of stress, different kind of interviewer. It's a bit more fun. And so yeah, we see him on the Jimmy Kimmel show. He starts to use descriptors more. He's more open. He's still a little bit locked down, but he's not locked down like he's locked down in this. So yeah, he's really tight and secure in this one. You know, the only thing he doesn't suggest is the potential non-existence of laptops altogether. I'm surprised he didn't go down that route because he gets very, very close. I mean, you know, it could be my laptop, maybe it's not my laptop. Hey, maybe laptops just are not a thing in the first place. I was expecting he might push it that far, but he doesn't. There's this interesting strong gaze that he has as well. Now he does show this in the Jimmy Kimmel show as well, but in the Jimmy Kimmel show, his blink rate is a lot more. He kind of locks his eyes very wide and tries to hold that gaze without any blink at all. Greg picked up on some specific moments where he can't hold that open eye, that kind of locked gaze that I think is there to kind of almost seduce the eye contact and get the attention and get the buy-in on it. And then at the end, absolutely, Greg, lots of chaff and redirect, but especially at the end here where he says, look, everything was a little bit shaky at that time. And he introduces the hook of a much bigger personal drama going on. The drama for the interview, or certainly the audience here, is the drama of the laptop. He manages to move it across to a much bigger personal drama where everything was a little bit shaky. So interesting start for him there, which doesn't bode well for us really believing in what he's talking about here. Scott, what do you got? All right, you guys covered a lot of stuff. Chase, I was going to talk about what you were talking about in the editing. I was opening with that because the editing on these things, all of them really bugged me to death. This guy, he isn't a TV guy. He's not good at this, but he's been trained. And we'll go, as we go through, that's going to be the little thread this time that I go through, pointing out the things where he's been trained. And now he is the champion of chaff and redirect. The champion up to this point was Anthony Weiner. Boy, that guy's good at that. I mean, you'll come in and say, what about this? And it goes off in this whole other thing. But the thing that's similar with those two, with Anthony Weiner and Hunter, is when it gets to the important part about that laptop, he does the very same thing Anthony Weiner does. He starts talking about how it could be mine. It can be mine. I don't know. We're listening to a victim. Everything he talks about goes back to him being an addict about how he blames everything on being addicted to crack at some point during this. So he goes, I don't remember. You'll find out in the book, those types of things. I agree with Chase. Again, he's selling the book, but that's the reason he did the interview. And that's fine. No big deal. He's selling something. Again, his squeezing that hand is going to be, is part of his baseline now, because when he does that, I believe he's been trained to do that because before I'm sure he was chewing on his mouth, doing all kinds of things and moving around a lot because you can see him controlling those little movements that someone will do when they get nervous or they start getting into things like I do. They train him to, or he's been trained to sit still. And that's how he's doing it because he's not comfortable in the way he's sitting. He's all got his arm cocked over this way and he's leaning this way somehow and it just looks odd and it looks like it feels odd to me from where I'm sitting. He talks too fast when he's thinking about something. That's how you can tell when he's creating something because he starts throwing out chaff and sort of puts his mouth over here while his brain is thinking and he knows what he's going to say. We're looking at a professional liar here because he was a crack addict. And drug addicts, they're pro liars and they'll look you right in the face and just swear up and down to everything you find valuable and they think you find valuable in your life. They'll swear to that from your religion to your kids to whatever it is, they'll swear to it. So as we go through this, I can't get my mind off that because I know that look we all do. We've all talked to people that are in that space. So to me so far, this looks like we're coming out of the gate. We're dealing with somebody who's who is really good at being deceptive. I shouldn't call him a liar like that. That's bad to come out of the gate saying that. But that's what I'm seeing right out of the gate here. And again, he's not a TV guy as we go through. And that's why he's looking uncomfortable most of the time. Scott, two things, I agree. And the Eddie Haskell character, anybody who's an addict will be the Eddie Haskell character because they have to have two faces, one for authority and one for the rest of the guys. So I think that's a part of it. And then the other one is Eddie Haskell, if you go watch the show, any of these guys, when they get into a point where they have nowhere to go, it immediately becomes somebody else's fault, something else happened. It's just, it's why every time I watched it, all I could see was this character. Yeah. You make just one reference to it of the book. Yeah. Is that laptop yours? You don't need a laptop. You got a book. You got the book, it's all in the book. And I don't know. I truly that- You don't know. The serious answer is that I truly do not know the answer to that. Did you leave a laptop with a repairman in Wilmington? Not that you remember. No, no. But whether or not somebody has my laptop, whether or not it was, I was hacked, whether or not there exists a laptop at all, I truly don't know. Are you missing a laptop? Not that I know of, but you know, read the book and you'll realize that I wasn't keeping tabs on possessions very well for about a four-year period of time. All right, you good? Yeah, good. Here we go. Was that your laptop? For real, I don't know. I know, but you know that this is- I really don't know if the answer is. You don't know, yes or no, if the laptop was yours. I don't have any idea. I have no idea. So could have been yours. Of course, certainly. There could be a laptop out there that was stolen from me. There could be that I was hacked. It could be that it was Russian intelligence. It could be that it was stolen from me. And you didn't drop off a laptop to be repaired in Delaware? Not that I remember at all, at all. So we'll see. All right, Chase, what do you got? So he's shaking his head while questioning again. I'm sorry, she is shaking her head during the questioning. Is there any way, is this your laptop? Let me tell you exactly how you need to answer this, Hunter. And we're seeing that. And in the truth questions, we'll see them nod their head. We'll see them give that look like this is that truth question, Hunter. You need to get ready for this question. And these are called plausibility statements. It might have been this. It might have been that Elon Musk might have actually broken into my apartment and stolen it. It could be on Mars. I don't, you know, there's a lot of things that could happen. Those are plausibility statements. They are a marker for deception. It's, as Scott would say, suggests or denotes that a person is being deceptive. And then again, in the same video that we just watched, when you're about to watch, there's even more head shaking during the second part of this. It's not yours. You're absolutely certain about that. And so this is a distancing language over and over throughout the whole thing. I'm not gonna go too long on this one, Greg. Yeah, so same thing. I have written down here, there may be dogs on the moon, you know, who knows. We can just come up with any kind of conjecture and make that go forever and ever. For real, I don't know. The only time that he does a gravity-defying act is his finger rises when he does, for real, I don't know. And then he says, but my point is, and if it were one of us, we would sit quietly and listen for a story to start to come apart. But she steps on that and then goes to ask more questions. He does the Eddie Haskell request for approval with his brow up. I don't know the answer. I was just messed up. All the whole time is what he's saying, but then you see distaste and amusement as he chaff and redirects and does more of this whole Eddie thing and does a broad disclaimer. Not that I know. I mean, he's using all the language we expect from people if they're trying to avoid answering a question. Does he know that he had a laptop? Certainly. Does he know where that laptop is? Now, no. So yeah, he's doing this broad thing, saying it could be this, somebody could have stolen it, could have been here. What he didn't say is I could have been so drugged out of my mind I gave it to somebody for crack. He didn't say that. So he just leaves it open ended, chaff and redirect, and she takes the chaff and steps on him when he says, but my point is should have, I agree with you Chase, don't shake your head no, don't shake your head yes, stop, ask a question and go from there. Scott, what do you got? All right. When he says for real, I don't know. He's almost reverts back to a childlike thing. When he's coming into that head goes down and he juts his head out at the same time. That's, and we'll see that as we're gonna see him do that a couple of times as we go through this. His legs, like we saw in Prince Andrew, his legs were crossed in that, not in the masculine form, but the more of a feminine form of cross legs, which suggests you would be relaxed and everything's gonna be fine and all that, but his demeanor doesn't match the way he's sitting, the way he's acting. He's trying to have his arms apart and be open and have his hands here, but you can see he's stressed. You can tell that he's really tight as he moves because you can see his whole body begin to jiggle as he starts talking and starts to defend himself. The blank expression, the wide eyes again, I agree with Mark, he's trying to get him to lock in on him, which is, as we know, that's a great tactic to do. And he's had so much time to rehearse defending his position on things, when he might be not telling the truth, when he's being deceptive, that he's just reverting right back to that because it's that, please, you gotta believe in, the eyebrows go up, the whole, it's just, it's classics. I mean, this should be on the Ted Turner classic thing if it was a movie, they say, oh, let's watch some of the old stuff. This guy re-does it and he does it so well. That's what we'd be looking at. And again, Anthony Wiener does the same style of Chaffnery Direct, but I think this is the new champion of Chaffnery Direct over Anthony Wiener at this point. Mark, what do you got? Yeah, so there are some similarities to the Prince Andrew situation and we'll see those later on as well. And I think the big similarity I'm seeing is his resistance techniques, which are similar to some of Prince Andrews in there's a lot of just hang on there for dear life, just hang on, keep your grip and don't try and move because when we see him in the Jimmy Kimmel interview that I baselined him on, he comes away from the chair side and he does really start to gesture, there's way more description. I think as everybody else has been saying, he's been told, hang on to that chair and just keep your hands still. So we do see that gravity defying as Greg was saying, two finger lift that happens there on, I really don't know. That signals to me, there's a strong possibility he does know that there's some actual positivity there rather than negativity. If he hadn't been told, hang on to your chair, I think we'd be getting a big gesture out of him, right then, because he really wants to convince us of, I just don't know about this. We get these incredible stories now about all the possibilities for computers. I mean, again, it should be like the computer could have been everybody's. Maybe it was a computer that belonged to all of us at the time rather than before. It was like, I don't think computers maybe exist in the first place. So he's gone to the opposite end of the spectrum now. Again, this strong eye contact that we get, I think that is his way of controlling and convincing. And I think to Scott's point, I think that is a learned behavior from back in his, he's recovering now, but back in his days when he was a user, I imagine that is the behavior he used to convince people. Yeah, I don't know where those things have gone. No, I didn't sell them. I hadn't met those people. Where were you last night? Here's where I was and those eyes are wide and he's trying to lock them to control and convince. I think it's some of his user behavior that we're probably seeing there. I don't know for sure, but it's a good bet. That's what I got for you. Excellent. Was that your laptop? For real? I don't know. I know, but you know that's- I really don't know if the answer is. You don't know, yes or no, if the laptop was yours. I don't have any idea. I have no idea. So could have been yours? Of course, certainly. There could be a laptop out there that was stolen from me. There could be that I was hacked. It could be that it was Russian intelligence. It could be that it was stolen from me. And you didn't drop off a laptop to be repaired in Delaware? Not that I remember at all, at all. So we'll see. All right, let's move. Looking back, did you make a mistake taking a spot on that board? No, I don't think I made a mistake in taking the spot on the board. I think I made a mistake in terms of underestimating the way in which it would be used against me. But you must have seen the optics. Even back then, you must have- I mean, how could you not have foreseen that this was gonna look that? Because I really didn't. I'm being as honest with you as I possibly can. All I know is that not one investigative body, not one serious journalist, has ever come to the conclusion that I did anything wrong or that my father did anything wrong. All right, I'm gonna go first on this one. Right out of the gate, we see him squeezing that hand again as an adapter. And he really gets on it too. He's really up in that thing. But again, that's part of his training and it is part of his baseline. We're gonna see it throughout most of these videos. His knees point at the interviewer as he's doing that as well. We've got two barriers going on there. His hand is being used as one. It's doing that. And his knee is pointing right at her. And he's slunk back in that chair so hard he cannot get any further away from her. As you're doing that. We don't see any illustrators. His knee pops up a little bit here and there, but we don't see any illustrators with this. It's just odd looking. And when he says, I'm being as honest as I possibly can, he is. He's being as honest as he possibly can without getting in trouble because he tells her the whole truth. He's out. It starts a whole other thing. And that's a famous little phrase with somebody who's hiding stuff. When they say, I'm telling you, everything I can possibly tell you and being as honest as I can be. Yeah, because you don't wanna go to prison or yeah, you don't want this to happen or that to happen. So that's a huge, those, that's a guy flagging you on in like at the airport. Those little flags bringing the plane in. That's a big one. Again, he uses his addiction as a get out of jail free card in this, which is another thing that runs, another thread that runs through this whole thing. He doesn't, he can blame anything that happened on that. It's probably the best thing that ever happened to him because no matter what happens is I don't remember. I don't remember what happened. We'll find out, I guess, you know, if it, oh yeah, I guess it did. I guess I was, I still remember doing it. So I wasn't lying. As they get to my last nerve. So that there's a whole, there's a whole bunch more I'll eat them all up. Mark, what do you got? Yeah, so a lockdown there. Again, that's training. Yeah, as you say, Scott, he's right in, oh, he's right in there. And I think he's probably using a technique of self-stimulating on that, which is to cause some kind of strong feeling here, which is a sense of, well, I'm in control of this feeling, though I'm not in control of the drama that's going on or the question that's going on, something I might train somebody to do in order to go, well, you're not gonna be in control of the questions, but here's what you are gonna be in control of. You're gonna be in control of the pain that you're gonna cause yourself during this. You're gonna be in control of that element of it. So he's doing that for sure, digging his fingers right in. Yeah, I'm being as honest as I possibly can be. Oh, well, so you could be more honest. So my question would be, under what circumstances could you be more honest? And how would that look? What would that sound like if you were being more honest with me right now? Because he's basically saying, under the current circumstances, this is good as it gets. Well, I wanna know, what are the current circumstances for you and what would actually more honesty therefore sound like? Chase, I'm super interested in what you think of the blink right here, because I'm not even, I mean, I counted one, I may have miscounted, you know, but maybe you've got a little bit more than I did, but I only got one noticeable one to me. So, Chase, what do you got? The blink rate goes up for stress and down, some people say comfort, but down means focus. So last time you watched like a really cool movie that had all your attention, your blink rate was somewhere around like a three or a four per minute, per minute. And when we go up to those spikes that are 80, 75, 80, up in high stress, none of us notice that our blink rate's going up because it's such an unconscious behavior. And that's one of the reasons that it's so dramatically reliable for everything. But yeah, so we had a tremendous amount of focus there. The blink rate was almost non-existent. So we had a lot of focus. And I think I'll skip over what you guys covered. And this is a common narrative now that we see in everybody, left, right, I don't really care, all politicians lie. No matter what, all of them, a hundred percent. This is almost like, it almost reminds me of, if I'm guilty of anything, it's being too honorable. This is what this reminds me of. I'm a victim. I never make mistakes. Or a big part. And you're misunderstanding everything. That's how this works. And it's just summed up perfectly in the end of this clip. It's summed up perfectly. And I'm paraphrasing like crazy here, but it's no one has ever done anything wrong that's involved with me. Anything that's happened to me was a result of something else. And my locus of control is outside of me. I don't control my life. Greg, what do you got? Yeah, you guys have hit most of it. But again, we can't miss the coaching. Guys, if we were coaching, we would probably do something different. I'd say roll your toes and your shoes or do something else. Don't do it so visibly. I would take it away. But the guy is releasing his nervous energy some way. Again, Scott double barrier. Barrier means I need space. Cross your legs and do this. Can't miss that. He goes to this negotiating why it's not his fault to your point chase. He does a double edge sword approach. The first one is, hey, well, I didn't make a mistake, but I didn't realize how it would be perceived. Okay, well, that is fundamentally a mistake. That is fundamentally a mistake. You did something that. And then he does something I call innocence by association. And he lawyers his way through that even. He goes to anybody who is credible has never accused. Oh wait, not accused. Concluded that I or anyone else did anything wrong. This guy's lawyering his way through the whole thing. He's negotiating any fault away. He's Eddie Haskell again. And he is romancing to use a term that Scott and I use the romancer. And that is, tell me what you want to know. Paying really close attention. And the reason people lock their eyes in, I love what you said, Chase. Blink rate goes to zero. The reason it goes away is because they're paying really close attention to, you believe me, don't you? You believe me, don't you? And their forehead's up and they are locked onto every move you make. This guy's negotiating his way through what he's lying about. He, there's lots of ways to lie. Omission, commission, embellishment or transference. Who knows which one, but it's always nice to have the I can't remember. And in today's world especially, and when people are addicts, they're recovering from whatever medical condition they had. Yeah, we feel for them at the same time. It can't be holy ground that you can't go after and say, okay, and, and I think you're dead onto that Mark. I would have been, I would have crawled him pretty hard about this because it's clear that he's being deceptive and he's distancing and taking every opportunity for it not to be his fault. That's all I got. Looking back, did you make a mistake taking a spot on that board? No, I don't think I made a mistake in taking a spot on the board. I think I made a mistake in terms of underestimating the way in which it would be used against me. But you must have seen the optics. Even back then, you must have, I mean, how could you not have foreseen that this was gonna look that? Because I really didn't. I'm being as honest with you as I possibly can. All I know is that not one investigative body, not one serious journalist has ever accused, has ever come to the conclusion that I did anything wrong or that my father did anything wrong. Excellent. Good. You have a deal. In the list that you gave me of the reasons why you're on that board, you did not list the fact that you were the son of the vice president. Of course, yeah. What role do you think that played? I think that it is impossible for me to be on any of the boards that I just mentioned without saying that I'm the son of the vice president of the United States. You were paid $50,000 a month for your position. Look, I'm a private citizen. One thing that I don't have to do is sit here and open my kimono as it relates to how much money I make or make or did or didn't. But it's all been reported. If your last name wasn't Biden, do you think you would have been asked to be on the board of Burisma? I don't know. I don't know, probably not. I don't think that there's a lot of things that would have happened in my life that if my last name wasn't Biden. All right, Greg, what do you got? Yeah, I'm not going to take a whole lot, guys, because this is a pretty clean one. This is a great baseline. This is the way he talks to other people. This is Eddie Haskell talking to other children. This is not Eddie Haskell talking to the parents. Watch, low-forehead involvement. He has a little bit of forehead request for approval once when he says I'm a private citizen. But lack of that, he looks at her, he's telling, he's less likely to be asking for approval and fishing and uncomfortable. He knows where he's at. He knows that he has control of this situation. He's just simply saying, I don't have to tell you that. Very different demeanor, very different mindset. Not a lot of fidgeting. Still has his hands closed, but that's his demeanor, that's his baseline. My guess is if you talk to Hunter Biden and you were talking about something contentious, but not where he felt like he was in trouble, this would be the Hunter Biden you found. Mark, what do you got? Yeah, so if we take this idea that Chase bought up, which I think is a really good one, that the blink rate goes low when there's focus. He seems very focused around the idea of, I'm a private citizen, that area around there. And I don't need to open that kimono. So it gets very focused around that. So that's very protective. It's a protective idea. He's basically saying, I'm protected by telling you any information and I'm focused on that. So that's where I'd start to question, like what are you being so protective over? What are you most worried? Who are you most worried for? Who do you most need to protect right now? Because my feeling is that's the focus of this protection. If my last name wasn't Biden, he knits his eyebrows there. It kind of looks a little bit like the idea of confusion. I'm going to pretend to be kind of confused. It's a bit of a Prince Andrew. Well, you see in the Navy, there's this idea of going, I just don't think you get this. I'm a little confused. And so I'm just going to take away your whole premise. What he tries to do with this confusion around if my last name wasn't Biden, is to discount the whole premise, the whole idea, because his name is always Biden, always. It doesn't make any difference to things. It's just something that he has. It affects everything. So therefore, it shouldn't affect this particular issue. Well, of course, it affects this particular issue. Of course it does, but he mocks the confusion there. So kind of interesting on that one. Scott, what have you got for us? All right. Again, we've seen his clasped hands, and we've seen his baseline. We've seen what we're used to seeing so far. Except these are a little tight and they're in front of them. We can see that as a barrier where he's doing this. He's got those. And he can see them squeezing together and move around a little bit. Anybody's going to be nervous when they're being interviewed, especially as it's on TV, that type of thing. But again, let's start listening. When these versions of the interviews come up, and listen to the edits on here, because if you listen to the stuff in headphones, there's a lot going on with the editing. A lot going on. Mark, I know you can see that stuff, but I'm telling you, I can hear that stuff in there when the reverb from the room cuts. Just look, they're doing the crossfade. So the reverb ends in the other one is starting, as it does that, but they're not that good at it. They're great at it, but it's not perfect. So watching it on TV, you're probably not going to catch it. But in headphones, you can't miss it. And that was really odd wording where he said, make or make, did or didn't, did or didn't. That's he's thinking as he's going through that. He didn't make 50,000 a month on that. It was 83,000. So he sort of stopped. That's my understanding of it. I could be wrong, but I went and looked it up and it said it was 83,000. So that's why he stopped that. That's why he was going. That's why I didn't say, no, I didn't make 50 grand, which would have not been true, because he did make 50, but he made 83. If my information is correct on that, which there were a couple of things, and that's the one that finally led out to show that was true from the little better research that I did. So that was really, that was really odd. I think his mouth, again, is moving faster than his brain's moving. And he knows these questions ahead of time. A lot of the stuff he's just reciting the answers that he's rehearsed. He hadn't gone into deep rehearsal on these, but he knows what he's going to say. He just hasn't said these out loud yet. It's just going along. Because she even says that she's on the list of questions, on the list of whatever you gave me, I didn't say you were the vice president's son. So I think we're seeing some heavy editing in this group of interviews. And I think he's being deceptive in there as well. Chase, what do you got? Yeah, so this is heavily cut. If you want to see the spots, or one of the biggest spots that Scott and Mark are both talking about, watch Hunter's hands. Just keep an eye on his hands and then just take a look when it cuts away and it cuts back and you'll see it. There's a whole lot of political language here, which he's been exposed to his whole life. His dad, I think just about since he was born, has been in politics. And he uses the word look just like his father. If I'm an interrogator or if I'm a salesperson or if I'm a parent trying to convince my child to do something and they use visual language like look, I'm going to use words like I see what you mean instead of I understand or that sounds good to me. So I'm going to change all of my language to match the person I'm speaking to in the interrogation room or wherever you are. If I'm a psychotherapist, I'm going to be using the same language as the person I'm speaking to to help them. When he says, I want you to watch this. We talk about micro facial expressions and other things. I want you to spot three micro behaviors and they all occur simultaneously when he says it's all been reported. There is a neck fear muscle movement, the myoclastoid muscle right here. You can see it move under his shirt down here. It even lifts his shirt up a little bit when he says it. Then there's a single shrug that happens right along with it and a tiny little no head shake. It's all been reported and you see it all right there within a quarter of a second. So you look for that in this clip. That's all I got. Right, great. You're talking about the three modes or three forms of communication there Chase and I'm not telling you this but the person watching is going to be, what are you talking about? There are three of them. You've got the audio part where like as Chase was talking about, I hear what you're saying that sounds good to me. You've got the visual where they say, I see what you're saying. You know, it looks to me like and then you have the kinesthetic where it feels, they talk about feeling, feels good or that's a little bit rough around the edges as they start going forward. So those are the three in a nutshell and you can go deep on those and really connect with someone fairly quickly when you start mirroring not only what they're doing with their body but what they're doing with their words except to sort of look at them. And by exactly what Chase said that's the way they organize their information so you're helping them pull the information back out by using the right modality. Yeah. In the list that you gave me of the reasons why you're on that board, you did not list the fact that you were the son of the vice president. Of course, yeah. What role do you think that played? I think that it is impossible for me to be on any of the boards that I just mentioned without saying that I'm the son of the vice president of the United States. You were paid $50,000 a month for your position. Look, I'm a private citizen. One thing that I don't have to do is sit here and open my kimono as it relates to how much money I make or make or didn't. But it's all been reported. If your last name wasn't Biden, do you think you would have been asked to be on the board of Orisma? I don't know. I don't know, probably not. I don't think that there's a lot of things that would have happened in my life that if my last name wasn't Biden. All right. Have you ever given your father money from any of your business ventures? No. Nothing. Nothing. Ever. Not a nickel. Not a nickel. Directly or indirectly? Directly or indirectly. Not a nickel ever. 100%. No. Never. All right, Mark, what do you got? Yeah, so what you're gonna see out of there is really good, strong denial, aren't you? Like he's straight down there like no, nothing. Not a nickel. And the illustrators in his head, they're pretty good. They're pretty congruent, as we might say. And we're not seeing any replacement of the idea. Well, when you say paid, I mean not paid per se, or there's no rearrangement of that. So I think anybody watching this and listening to it is gonna see something there. They go, well, that was pretty strong. And they're gonna go, well, I don't think we saw anything there. But let's see if anybody else picked anything up. Chase, what do you got? So the reporter starts again. This journalist, no idea who he is. Looks like he's been specially coached to make sure this interview is in favor of Hunter. So this is bad. Whoever this guy is, is really bad. There's more no head shaking during the initial question there. Continues to shake head, only offering pieces of the questions he should be asking. These small fragments of that allow the person to just say yes or no, nothing ever. Indirectly or indirectly. And it's a recipe for disaster there. And in Hunter, we see fidgeting and digital flexion. And the difference between these two is the repetitiveness of the behavior. If it occurs once or twice, we wouldn't classify, most of us wouldn't classify that as fidgeting. We typically classify repetitive behaviors that way. And there's repetitions of the questions and phrases, direct repetition. Direct repetition is a red flag for deception. He's saying the exact words that the person doing the interview is saying. This is not a good sign. I don't know who this guy is, but it looks like he was trained to make Hunter look innocent. Greg? Yeah, so I'm going to do exactly what he did. Mark, play along. Mark, I'm going to use leading questions too. Mark, you never ran naked through a football stadium, did you? Never, never run naked. Absolutely naked. Absolutely, absolutely not. You get it, guys. If I ask the question a certain way and I say, hey, you didn't do this, did you? That's called a leading question. The reason you can't do it in court is because you're telling the person the answer. Well, you don't have to tell the person the answer. If you say you didn't do this, did you? What are they going to answer? No, you say, Mark, tell me about the time you ran naked through the football stadium. Different story. No, you tell me all about it. We have evidence, so we know. But so what this guy is doing, and Chase, I agree with you, by the way, there's a disclaimer in the video that says this is a CBS Viacom company and his publisher is tied to the company. So they go out of their way to say that in the video. We don't have that captured here, but they do go out of their way to say it. They didn't know it. He's locked down, and it's not common knowledge. It's just one thing I heard them say. But he's locked down his burying and adapting and milling his fingers. And I agree with you, it looks like a strong denial, except for he's repeating exactly the same words. He's being spoon-fed the answer. Now, whether the guy's doing it intentionally and as a conspiracy, they'll know. We're not going to assume that. But I will assume bad questioning and giving him the benefit of a doubt where you shouldn't. Then, he responds to every one of those leading questions and he does Rome answer again. He is eye-focused. No forehead involvement because he knows what he's denying. The other thing is he never answers the spirit of the question. He answers the question, very lawyer-like of him. Did you ever give your father any money? I believe he didn't, directly or indirectly, directly or indirectly. Did you cause him to have any money? Never answers that question. He never says, look, there's nothing behind the scenes that cause my father to get money. None of that's ever addressed. He answers the question asked, just like when I asked Mark, did you ever run, you never ran naked? If I lead the question, the guy's going to tell me what I want to hear and he's going to pay attention to me very closely because he's going to be specific. A trained lawyer who has worked as a lawyer is going to be very specific in what he answers and not answer the spirit but the letter of the question. Interrogation 101, when you're trying to get away from answering, answer the question they ask. Don't provide information that you shouldn't. We're seeing it over and over and over here and there's no reason for him to go and become Eddie Haskell because he knows what's coming. Scott, what do you got? You guys got all that stuff. So I'll say this. This one's hot, yeah. Yeah, so I'll say this. If you'd like to see Mark Bowden run through a stadium naked, it was a Nike commercial and you can Google that or don't Google it, and YouTube and search Nike Streaker. That's Nike Streaker. And you'll see Mark Bowden naked or nude. Furlong Denik, oh, we have contact. Looks like he has more souvenirs for the crowd. I think he's got the shoes to thank. A minute ago they were all chanting who had all the pies. And that goes your answer. And he's off like a bull with gas. Have you ever given your father money from any of your business ventures? No, nothing. Nothing, ever. Not a nickel. Not a nickel. Directly or indirectly? Directly or indirectly. Not a nickel, ever. 100%, no, never. When he said I hope you know what you're doing, what did he think you were doing? Well, he read the press reports that I joined the board of Burisma, which was a Ukrainian natural gas company. There's been a lot of misinformation about me, not about my dad. Nobody buys that, but it buys this idea that I was unqualified to be on the board. What were your qualifications to be on the board of Burisma? Well, I was vice chairman of the board of Amtrak for five years. I was the chairman of the board of the UN World Food Program. I was a lawyer for Boy Schiller Flexner, one of the most prestigious law firms in the world. Bottom line is that I know that I was completely qualified to be on the board to head up the corporate governance and transparency committee on the board. And that's all that I focused on. Basically turning a Eastern European independent natural gas company into a Western standards of corporate governance. All right, Greg, what do you got? Yeah, so here, once he starts down the path and he starts telling you all the things that made him, yeah, he's got all the right qualifications for whatever role it was and he rattles those off. See that forehead drop? When he first starts off and he's on the ropes, the look, he's doing that thing again. That's a, yeah, yeah, yeah. Like he's talking to a parent. Then once he gets to a point, you let him chat from redirect and you let him blast out all his qualifications, he's comfortable, he's got it. He's got exactly what he needs. His hands even come open away from that barrier pose and he starts to almost pound on the desk, almost illustrate what he's thinking. This one's not as messy as the other things he's doing where he's being fed the information, where he's being, now, is she challenging him and saying, yeah, but, yeah, but, okay. Every one of those things you got into because of this or that, if she challenged him there, if she were interrogating him, he might come loose a little bit more, but you see that lack of forward involvement as he's reciting his answer for why he was qualified. That's what I got. Mark, what do you got? Yeah, so I'm gonna discount the whole of the first part of this particular clip, because it is so edited. It is so shockingly edited that I can't really, there's nothing for me to grab hold of. That's okay. There's some stuff at the end of this for me, which is, I do like the way he illustrates at the end, the transition of the company from Eastern standards to Western standards. His illustrator there is strong and concrete and congruent. I totally believe that he believed that that's what his job was. That's what he was there for, to transition an Eastern company into one with Western standards of governance, because he's very strong around that. However, we do see this one eye flutter on qualified. I suspect he questions himself whether he was truly qualified for that. There seems to be some asymmetrical stress around the idea of qualification, but no stress on this is the job I was there to do. Now, whether he had that job or not, or was convinced that was his function and why he was bought in as a qualified individual, I don't know, but I think he believes that what he was told about his function there, he believes that to be true. Chase, what have you got on this one? Did Scott go already? We burned you up last time. Oh, okay, good idea. Scott, go for it. I don't even know what you're going to say. I was like, when you first pointed out, I was like, yeah, man, because Chase, you're gonna get this one. I'm gonna, sorry, Chase, gotta take this one, because then, okay, there were 11 cuts in 23 seconds, and there were seven of them in the first 10 seconds. This is the, but the time this thing was over, it had been chopped up so much, I was a nervous wreck, because I couldn't follow what he's saying makes sense, but it doesn't make complete sense, which makes him look even worse. So this really bothers me. And so, Mark, I'm with you. That first part doesn't even count. You can't tell what's really going on. As you know, when you're looking at a body language, you always talk about how you have to look at the complete picture. You have to take everything going on, and you have to put that into context with what the person is saying. And we can't tell what's going on because it's so chopped up. There's time missing in all those things. So most of this was rehearsed, and he was ready for that long answer he was given when she asked him why he was qualified. He just lies, that head goes down, he comes forward a little bit and he starts talking, those eyes are hypnotizing almost. So he's ready for that, and he grabs his wrist, almost grabs it as an adapter. It goes over there fairly quickly, I'm gonna say grabs, but he does hold onto his wrist. That's an adapter. And yeah, the editing on this is just so bad. It's hard to keep up with, it really is. But you're right, Mark, I caught that thing with the eyes as well. When he talks about being qualified, go back and take a look at it, or when it comes through this time, because his eyes, they don't even close all the way. One goes down almost all the way, and the other one comes right behind it, but they don't close all the way. It's really weird. He's thinking hard about that. And his brain is saying, no, man, hang on, we gotta be really careful right in here. So I don't think he believes he was qualified for that. That's why I think that shows the lack of competence to the maximum right there, to the max. All right, Chase, what do you got? I didn't see all the editing. I saw some, I saw some editing. I thought you're gonna eat me alive on that, not have nothing. No way. So I think in the beginning, the very beginning of this, we're seeing some truthful baseline at the very beginning. He's moving around, he's illustrating, he looks like a comfortable human. If you were to ask a third grader, what is it, which person is comfortable, the person moving around, I mean, they're all gonna say that. We know this just humans. And he moves his eyes when speaking. He doesn't lock eyes while he's speaking when he's being truthful. And you can see him illustrating and all this. And when he says, I know that I was completely qualified, he doesn't say that I was qualified. He says, I know that I was completely qualified. And when he says the words qualified around that whole subject, it's almost to me like he's resisting an eye block with eye flutter. He's trying to prevent that from happening. What's funny, his dad does the same thing when he's being deceptive. And remember what I said about politicians, Trump does a head tilt distance language and then steps back from the podium when he's lying. This is just a thing that politicians do. So there's no one-sidedness here, but he does take a lot of behaviors from his dad. Jason, when I'm teaching, I call people professional lawyers. I say interrogators, lawyers, politicians. That's awesome. And Don Jr. just has a lot of behaviors of Don Sr. Who's the guy in the Godfather? Mark, the main guy. Who's the Godfather in the movie? Brando. Brando, Brando. That's what, Chase looks like Brando, I'll lean backwards, it looks like a Godfather. Just say it's just, tell me what he thinks about whatever it is. When he said, I hope you know what you're doing, what did he think you were doing? Well, he read the press reports that I joined the board of Burisma, which was a Ukrainian natural gas company. There's been a lot of misinformation about me, not about my dad. Nobody buys that, but it buys this idea that I was unqualified to be on the board. What were your qualifications to be on the board of Burisma? Well, I was vice chairman of the board of Amtrak for five years. I was the chairman of the board of the UN World Food Program. I was a lawyer for Boy Schiller Flexner, one of the most prestigious law firms in the world. Bottom line is that I know that I was completely qualified to be on the board to head up the corporate governance and transparency committee on the board. And that's all that I focused on, basically turning a Eastern European independent natural gas company into Western standards of corporate governance. Halley, your brother's widow threw the gun away. She was trying to protect you? Oh, I think she, yes, yeah. I think she was just concerned about me. Why did you have a gun? Well, I did, again, the period of my life that was difficult, but I don't know. Halley's intent was to make certain that I didn't do anything to hurt myself. According to the reporting at one point, the Secret Service went looking for the record of sale. Do you know anything about that? Nothing, no, no, no idea. Did somebody report the loss of the gun? Oh yeah, they had, in the moment, we knew that the gun was lost, that Halley had thrown it into a trash can. And I told her that you can't do that when I realized that it was gone. And so she went back and the police came to help retrieve the gun, which was retrieved. Someone had gone through the trash and picked it up and they found it within hours, I believe. And so that was the end of the story. But do you know about the Secret Service being involved in that? No, I had no idea. I don't know whether the Secret Service were or why they would be, or I don't think that that's true to my knowledge. It would be very concerned that you had a gun. Wow. All right, I'm gonna go first on this one. This is victim talk. This is I'm a victim, right from beginning to end. And he says, why do you have a gun? He goes into this chapter and redirect it. Boy, that's just, we should put that in the book or something because that is just, it's wonderful what he's doing right in there. That's really great. And he goes right to that, that get out of jail crack card every time. Because when he asked me about the gun, he goes, well, I was the part of my life with it, because he's getting ready to say, I don't know what was going on. He's trying to work up a way to use that to add it to that. Well, I don't know what happened. I don't know what was going on. You know, shoot, I was on crack. Again, we see that the same thread of that hand squeezing going through there as an adapter. He looks uncomfortable. And at the end there, I'm not gonna say anything because I know Greg's gonna eat it alive that when he's bobbin' and weavin' there at the end when it gave us the giggle so bad. So Greg, why don't you go next? Yeah, so he starts off with this whole adapter barrier, the same thing we've been seeing. And then he goes into, again, Eddie Haskell. Hey, his forehead comes up. He starts trying to placate this guy, chaff him redirected every term. My favorite chaff him redirected is he starts to puke up. Hey, why'd you have a gun? Well, I was in, and suddenly thinks, involve with drugs and carrying firearms looks a lot worse than involve with drugs or carrying firearms. So he edits in the middle of it and his blink rate just goes, do do do do do do. He flashes so much, I think he's doin' all fly away. You know, he could have Allison sing the song in the background. And then he starts to bounce and he gets that little, his foot bouncing and as his pulse increases, he loses himself and he starts to stammer and just trail off. And Chase, you talk about him sounding like his dad. When his dad loses place in the conversation, in a speech, he does the same exact thing. He trails off and drags out. And then he's doin' all that popping and weaving. It's just avoiding the incoming body blows that he's expecting. Cause he knows he's lost. He knows he's in the middle of everything. He knows is that he has no idea, he knows, not noses. He knows he has no idea where he's at in the story and he's lost himself. Not probably sure that he hasn't done some little bit of incrimination right in there when he says, hey, in the middle of me being a drug addicted drug dealer, I also had a gun. Yeah, I think he's probably thought for a second. Uh-oh. And so he gets kinda off track there. Chase, what do you got? Yep, I agree with you guys. I want you to notice the head nod in the beginning. When he's asking him to say yes to this question, there's a head nod, the open hand gesture from the reporter. In fact, every single question in this clip when he's supposed to say no, the reporter tells him you're supposed to say no to this. And when he's supposed to say yes or he's supposed to know something, the reporter asks him the question in truthful fashion, feeds it to him with a leading question. You didn't know about the Secret Service, right? And this is bad. I'm not saying there's some conspiracy here, but this is really bad as far as reporting goes. We could have done better. How about that? There's some immediate fidgeting, some digital flexion, his whole body becomes rigid. And when he's asked, why did you have a gun? I'll read you what he says. Cause I spent some time today, typed it out. He says, well, I again, the period in my life that was difficult, it was, but you know, I, I don't know. That's code for I was a criminal carrying a gun while I was buying drugs. Yeah. Then he asked about the Secret Service, reporter shakes his head to let Biden know. Second question about the Secret Service, reporter shaking his head to help him answer the question and not knowing the case, this looks bad. But you didn't know about the Secret Service being involved. And then with the answer to the Secret Service, I don't know whether it was the Secret Service were or why they would be, or I don't think that's true to my knowledge. That's the answer. Pretty interesting. It's all I got. Mark, what do you got? Yeah. So here's what I want you to look out for because I think he does lose his way slightly because he does enter a real emotion through this. And he enters it on, that was, that time of life was, was difficult around there. What you're gonna see if you look around there is his face muscles will relax here. He'll lose the musculature there. The sides of the mouth will come down slightly. His eyes will trance out. They go a little bit red very, very quickly. And you'll see him fix in what I would call an emotional trance state. He enters into that emotion for a moment and then he's back out of it. But I think there is some true sadness there either around that he's carrying a gun because he's involved in drugs and you're gonna have to do that. Or I think there's an element here that isn't mentioned but it's kind of hinted at which is somebody doing harm to themselves. The word of suicide isn't mentioned in this but there could be some sadness around that idea. Either way, I think there is some true sadness here but it is surrounded with a word salad of trying to obfuscate and move around this very embarrassing situation which I think is why the word salad is there. It's just totally embarrassing what's gone on here and just bad, bad optics for his dad at the time. Beth, that's what I got for you. Thanks a lot. I lost a spelling bee because of the word obfuscate. Obfuscate, yeah, I can say it. I don't necessarily know what it is and I certainly can't spell it. Spell it, Chase. I can't, I still can't. No, that's why we have editors. That's not gonna go out. That's exactly right. Allie, your brother's widow threw the gun away. She was trying to protect you? I think she, yes, yeah. I think she was just concerned about me. Why did you have a gun? Well, I did, again, the period of my life that was difficult, it was, but I don't know. Halley's intent was to make certain that I didn't do anything to hurt myself. According to the reporting at one point, the Secret Service went looking for the record of sale. Do you know anything about that? Nothing, no, no, no idea. Did somebody report the loss of the gun? Oh yeah, they had, in the moment, we knew that the gun was lost, that Halley had thrown it into a trash can and I told her that you can't do that when I realized that it was gone. And so she went back and the police came to help retrieve the gun, which was retrieved. Someone had gone through the trash and picked it up and they found it within hours, I believe. And so that was the end of the story. But you know about the Secret Service being involved? No, I had no idea. I don't know whether the Secret Service were or why they would be or I don't think that that's true to my knowledge. Did you and your father ever discuss Ukraine? No, as I said, the only time it was after a news account, it wasn't a discussion in any way. There's no but to this. No, we never did. All right, Mark, you wanna go first? Yeah, so net net of that, you did. I mean, that's net net. You had a chat about it. Now, only so yes, you did. So long as you frame the interaction as not being a discussion, the question was, did you have a discussion? Well, yeah, I did. Well, no, I didn't. Well, if you there's no but. So what he's doing is going a interaction happened. I would suggest an interaction happened where the Ukraine came up was part of that interaction. But he's reframing it as not a discussion. So maybe he was told about it. Maybe it was mentioned and he was there. Maybe he mentioned it and somebody else was there. But what he's saying is because we can't frame this as a discussion, it didn't happen. Net net it it it did out of that particular salad that we got there. But listen, you know, tell me if I'm if I'm wrong, Greg, what do you what do you think? What are you good on this? Yeah, so here's my initial response. What the hell? I mean, if a child told me that when I asked, did you take cookies from the cookie jar? I would just paddle their little rear end when I was young. You know, I mean, when I was a kid, you get paddle for that. I would have gotten paddle. That's the way life works because they would know your line. Come on. This is a very simple, direct question. Direct questions that are answered honestly have direct answers. Did you know we didn't and a leading question on top of that. This is the equivalent of the kids saying, well, I went to get cookies. Well, no, there weren't cookies. It was candy bar. Well, no candy bars. There's nothing, nothing. Just this is insane that anybody would sit with a straight face and believe this guy's telling the truth. That's all I got. I'm incredulous to use the word I don't use. Chase, what do you got? This is by far the best interviewer out of out of the group. This this shirt man here don't know who she is. From maybe I should, but I don't I don't even own a TV. So I mean, it's going behind you. So in the Ukraine. It's not really a TV. Well, just to counteract all the people we're going to, you know, I'm going to write it. Oh, yeah. No, he's got a TV. But I mean, I may not own it, Greg. I mean, there you go. That's true. No, but no, but there is a but on the TV. Have you ever talked about the Ukraine? She's asking him whether they discussed an entire country in general. So to answer no, would obviously be a lie. Just to discuss a country and a blink rate goes up to 60 blinks per minute. And the only time was after a news account and then he self edits. It wasn't a discussion in any way. And I want you to Greg talks about the eyes a lot. I talk about the eyes a lot. I want you to watch the natural movement to his normal recall position, which is nine o'clock. You can watch any of his baseline videos and nine o'clock recall hour, nine o'clock as you're looking at him, your clock. So his right. And then they immediately and rapidly move across to about four thirty five o'clock as as we're looking at him. And that is an immediate retreat. And I need to change the subject and figure something out immediately when the eyes move from one hemisphere to the other. Some things going on. That's almost ninety nine percent of the time. That would be a big red flag for me in any interview, especially if I'm interviewing an employee. Scott, what do you got? All right, this was three answers, three different answers in seven seconds. Unbelievable. There's a guy named Julian Moore. He was a police sergeant here in Nashville. He's retired now. And he could do the funniest imitation of somebody lying to him. Oh, it would put me in the floor. But everybody was around him in the floor laughing so hard when he started doing it. And it looked just like that when he would do it. And it was so funny that it was that's why we're all laughing so hard as we're watching this because it just looks it just it's ridiculous. It's ridiculous. And this guy reminds me of Julie, what he does. Every time I saw that's the first thing that's the first thing that I could think of. But we're seeing a pro at work here. This guy is he knows how to do that. He knows how to how to once he starts getting into something and he sees it sticky and he he stepped in it. He knows how to get out and jump around and and try to get out of it like a frog in some tar or something. So he's he's a pro. I don't know else to say about that, but it's hilarious. That's so bad. It's it's hilarious. So we do are real of the best examples of everything we've seen for our anniversary. This is one. This one has to be it because no kidding. It's just no foundation of truth. That's the best part. We're going to get alive on this thing. Did you and your father ever discuss Ukraine? No, as I said, the only time was after a news account. It wasn't a discussion in any way. There's no but to this. No, we never did. He came to my apartment one time and this is when he was still in office as vice president, and so he kind of ditched his secret service, figured out a way to get over to the house. And I said, what are you doing here? I said, honey, what are you doing? I said, dad, I'm fine. He said, you're not fine. Greg, what do you got? Yeah, so this is one of those where I'm going to take part of the story and take, you know, take exception to part of the story. I do believe his father probably came up and said to him at some point, wherever it was, honey, you're not fine. And I don't think anybody, regardless of your politics, we don't discuss politics here, regardless of politics. I think most people would say Biden is probably a good honest father and looked out for his kids. I mean, if you know his his history, he said, you can find another senator, my kids can't find another child. I mean, another father. So I don't think anybody would ever discount that. However, how did the whole he just he ditched the Secret Service piece? That just feels like fantasy to me. It doesn't feel like it really is even important to the story. So it doesn't impact anything I feel about Joe Biden in the case. But it feels awkward in too much detail. Anytime there's too much detail, usually it means something. So probably what happened was maybe the Secret Service was there. Maybe his father was around whatever. Who cares about that part? I still believe a second part of the story. That too much detail is just too much for me. And so I don't believe that. Scott, what do you get? Yeah, I think the second part happened. It might have been a phone call or something. He was already at the house or something. There's no way you're going to be able to ditch the Secret Service. That's what they do for a living. They make sure nobody's sneaking around, coming in or going out. That that's kind of to me, that's kind of like a smack in their face. I know you guys. I know we train all kinds of lettered agencies. And there's no way. There's no way, especially women. They're going to the women Secret Service. They're going to have it out and everything. Somebody sneaking in. That's what they're looking for. Somebody sneaking out. That's what you're not going to get past that you're not going to. He made that part up somehow. He ditched the Secret Service. You don't think they know where the vice president is. They know everything about about where the president is and the vice president is all the time, all the time. That didn't happen. The second part, I think it happened. I believe that. And like Chase was saying when we got into this just before we got in, he, you know, sounds like something Joe would say, honey, you know, because this kid loves him, but he didn't he didn't ditch. He didn't ditch the Secret Service. That's I'm not I'm not good with that. Chase, what do you got? Yeah, I think this is mostly honest, except for that part. Or, you know, this was maybe he didn't see the Secret Service inside the apartment with them or something like that. The vice president, if you didn't know, his address is number one observatory circle in Washington, D.C. He lives at the US Naval Observatory on a base. Kind of hard to slip out, but I think it's mostly honest. We also see his truthful recall movement with his eyes to our nine o'clock when you see it. Mark, what do you got? Yes, I think the spirit of the story here is actually quite a sweet one where he positions his dad in a position in which every dad would like to be in seen as a bit of a hero and protective and emotionally there for him. So lovely spirit of the of the story there, I think. And his and his hands become buoyant. They break away from the chair. They're gravity defying because it is a bit of a superhero moment, a bold story. He even uses a very quiet expletive before talking about that he slipped away from the Secret Service and that and he hasn't used that in certainly any of the videos that I've seen so far. So it really launches into a different place for him. I think he places his dad in quite a heroic role here where he can escape the Secret Service, escape the bonds that he's that he's in and be there, you know, one to one with his son when he most needs him and he uses that word, honey, which is it's literally a sweet word. So, yeah, I like everybody here, you know, I've been around protection of of of top politicians, of world leaders. And yeah, you can't get anything past them as you shouldn't. So no, didn't slip away. But what a great story. Beautiful story to to have maybe a slight fantasy idea there. There, that's what I got for you. He came to my apartment one time and this is when he was still in office as vice president. And so he kind of ditched his Secret Service, figured out a way to get over to the house. And I said, what are you doing here? He said, honey, what are you doing? I said, dad, I'm fine. He said, you're not fine. All right, here we go. How did you react to learning that President Trump called the Ukrainian president in a phone call asking him to investigate you and your father? I was like every other American. I was shocked. Did you call your dad and say, oh, my gosh, can you believe this? No, yeah, but look, my dad and I talk on the phone. We don't live in this like political bubble. I picked up the phone. And the first thing he said to me is, you know, Maisie's love in her classes. And, you know, I said, yeah, dad, I know she's a pen now. We had that discussion before before you talked about for real. And that's not a joke. It's not like anybody has to have any discussion beyond that. And I'll let Congress handle that. And I'll let you guys in the media handle that. And I'll let my dad's campaign handle that. And the only thing that I'm looking to handle is to make certain that I get up every day and do the next right thing. OK, well, I'm going to I'm going to go first on this one because I'm going to tell you, I there's too much editing in this thing. It's ridiculous. So for me, I can't I could tell you the things I'm seeing and stuff. But it's it's not in. I don't know if we're hearing the answers to the same questions he's asking. It's so horrifically. So I don't feel good about going and saying, here's what he thinks. And here's what's going to happen next and all that. So I'm going to move on from that. Mark, what do you got? Yeah, so here's what I see within. And you're right that this one's all over the place. But I do see he hides his hands. He then barriers with the water. He sinks, hides both hands, hides a hand and then holds the other elbow joint. So even though it's a mashup, what what there is is a mashup of lots of protective elements of nonverbal communication there and minimizing, minimizing behavior, which is when you sink down, you make your body smaller, protection of of joints, which are vulnerable. So I can certainly see see that for a start. What comes across in this one for me is it seems hard for him to be involved with issues of potential national importance to the US. And and for his only important concern to be can he get up and do the next right thing? So he's kind of saying, I can't I don't want to handle these big important issues about us because I want to handle my thing of getting up the next day and doing the right thing, which for somebody in recovery is a super important thing. Absolutely. Anybody out there, anybody, if you're in recovery right now, it's super important that you get up and you do the best that you can on a day to day basis. But then it's maybe if that's what you're handling right now, maybe the political area is not for you, because in politics, you have to handle stuff which is of importance to many, many people other than yourself. And so it's hard to be a really great politician and be only self-centered. I'm not saying you can't be self-centered as a great politician. You absolutely can, but you've got to keep your eye on everything else going on and get the best balance possible around that. The world of politics is not necessarily good for this particular recovering addict, I would say, though there would be others in recovery who who are at the stage where they can handle, you know, big overarching concepts. At the same time as handling, I got to get up and be the best person I can be to myself today. So that's what I take from this one, Greg, what have you got on this? Yeah, so when he says, like all Americans, I was shocked. I expect indignant chin rise on shocked. I don't think he was shocked. I think he kind of expected this. He does some chaff and redirect where he starts talking about everything. But and then he says, for real. And again, they're edited, but you see his body close up, his blink rate increase. And then he goes to this holy ground thing again. I'm going to do the best I can. And I understand when you're in recovery, that's the most important part of your life. But his brow comes up, he does the Eddie Haskell thing all over again. He is not doing it when he's talking about the rest of the story. And suddenly his brow comes up at that. Now, is he just asking for approval because he's saying, look, I've had a fractured life and I'm trying to recover, maybe. But it is a pattern for him in people where he needs approval and needs he does that whole Eddie Haskell thing. And I'll just keep using that word because I'm going to revive Ken Osmond's role of Eddie Haskell at least for a day. Show from the fifties and sixties, it still has some kind of pertinence today. There's a guy named Rizio, a doctor who is involved in a psychologist who's involved in organizational dynamics, who talks about something called the Haskell effect in a business. When you have people who are too faced and going behind and if you don't do a good job of controlling that, it'll erode your your entire organization. So bring back that one last time he does this, he goes and asks for that approval, that's all I see. I don't see a whole lot other than that. And again, there's so many edits, it makes it tough. Chase, what do you got? This was masterful. He opens it up by saying, like every other American, I was shocked. So he socializes the issue and saying, everybody thinks this, if this wasn't shocking to you, then you're obviously not an American. And he's more use of visual language. So what the reporter should have done the moment he says, look, starting to explain this is not start discussing phone calls and say, you know, what did it look like to you? What did that conversation look like? Or what what happened next instead of going on to the auditory part? And why not ask after he says, well, yeah, no, we didn't talk about that. But the first thing he said on the phone, maybe a follow up question would be, what about the second thing he said on the phone? What happened after that? Because that's that's where the thing is that we need. And this wasn't deception, but this was masterful avoidance. And it's definitely dishonest, but not deceptive, per se. And when he's recalling a conversation about his daughter, I don't want to mention kids names on YouTube. He goes to nine o'clock, his normal recall, where he accesses information. So it's a truthful event. And when he's saying, I'm going to do the next right thing, this is great for his recovery, but it also makes us assume in the statement presupposes that I've been doing right things all along. And anything bad I've done is not my fault, including my addiction. How did you react to learning that President Trump called the Ukrainian president in a phone call asking him to investigate you and your father? I was like every other American, I was shocked. Did you call your dad and say, oh, my gosh, can you believe this? No, yeah, but look, my dad and I talk on the thought we don't live in this like political bubble. I picked up the phone and the first thing he said to me is, you know, Maisie's love in her classes at, you know, I said, yeah, dad, I know. She's a pen now. We had that discussion before before you talked about for real. And that's not a joke. It's not like anybody has to have any discussion beyond that. And I'll let Congress handle that and I'll let you guys in the media handle that. And I'll let my dad's campaign handle that. And the only thing that I'm looking to handle is to make certain that I get up every day and do the next right thing. All right, let's start around the room and see what we got. As far as we're talking about him being for a percentage, being deceptive or being truthful. Greg, you want to go first? Yeah, I'm not going to give you a percentage. I'm going to say he avoids truth at many, many, many opportunities. He always goes to the high ground. He had a Haskell's back kickback to Ken Osman. He had a Haskell's every opportunity when there's somebody in authority. And then when there isn't all that goes away. So I don't trust that he's being truthful. I also, guys, I'm going to say this and we're going to put disclaimers in here, but this has nothing to do with Joe Biden. This is Hunter Biden. We're talking about Hunter Biden and what he does in this interview. So don't take it as politics. Take it as what we're looking at. I don't believe he is trustworthy because of the there's so much deviation between what's normal and what he's doing. That's me. Chase, what do you get? Yeah, again, this isn't politics. This is a human. And what we're looking at is a human, not a Republican or a Democrat. We do that with everything. And if we are biased, we'll be the first to tell you if we have some kind of vested interest in something. This was mostly dishonest, slightly deceptive and hardly truthful. Mark. Yeah, so so I know, you know, some of you watching out there, you'll feel like you've got a horse in this race because of the relationship with his father, very important man. Absolutely. So, you know, in order to not offend, I will say I feel at some points that he is obfuscating somewhat. There you go. Can you spell that? I don't care if I offend, but I really don't. But I'll tell you, I am politically, you guys know me. I don't care. But I think we're seeing more being untruthful than we are seeing being truthful in these things. When the questions get hard, that's every time, not every time, most of the time he's being deceptive, it looks to me like. So I would chase. I think if you wait it out, it's going to be deceptive, it's pretty heavy. And he goes a bit light on the being truthful. Now, if you like what we're doing, please subscribe. I just broke that little thing down there. It says YouTube on it or subscribe, whatever it says. It's red and become a panelist with us. So I'll take it a step further. If you don't like what we're doing, please subscribe. Yeah, yeah, yeah. If you have any evidence about it, you're going to want to subscribe. Just to know what we're doing. Yeah. Yeah. All right. Well, thanks so much. And we'll see you everybody next time. Thanks, fellas. This was a good I'll see you next time. See you. Bye now.