 How did you use you send me the orders a new game here and it's real hard you chess Yeah, yeah, just gonna be difficult So apparently is the most part as your opponent a new version of ghosts of Tsushima where you can hang out with like Little cats and deer. That's that seems very soothing. I might get this first It's to be able to hang out with little tears and I feel like I'd be able to make sure you like my game Now at this point. I see to make it that there's a part with a nice animal that you hang out with Yeah, it's game is really fun, but it's also really hard. I mean that yeah, that's that's like That's a pathway. I feel like if my if my mechanics are kind of shitty as long as I have that part where the friendly frog is like Oh, they're free and then gives you some instructions And then he gets killed and you got to go on a revenge mission to get all of the things that It's a raw game it doesn't hold back on the realities of life You what he wants to suffer what are you the pain demons from that very funny? Oh, that's so so funny very funny comedy No Yeah, we're gonna address that today. Oh, I guess we could well By the way, do you want to do you go by full fat Matt or Matt is I'm assuming Matt is more efficient Yeah, Matt's fine people often like call me full fat videos and I don't really understand that like oh your full fat videos I'm like, oh, well, I probably would have said that if not for seeing the discord name. Oh, yeah Yeah, yeah, have you have you kept up with good old Rick and Morty by any chance? Um, I haven't I watched a couple of episodes of season four But I think when it drops on the UK, there's only a couple of episodes. I wasn't compelled enough to go and seek them out online Not because I didn't like the first three seasons But you know, you just sort of like drop off of something over time I kept sort of saying when the whole season goes on Netflix, I'll watch it and it has and I haven't yet But I probably will watch it before the new season drops This is dropping at the moment. Yeah, I was it. I'm sad the loopy Rick and Morty now. It's insane I'm still rewatching old episodes of community. Hey, I like You know, I'm gonna fork in the road now. I'm like, what do I ask you? You know, I'm gonna go to community first. What's your favorite episode of community out of curiosity Yeah, even though I don't I don't kind of like when all the cats start dropping out I do really like the meow meow beans episode in season four. Yeah, I'm like Troy in that Yeah, that's good shit. That's season season five, right? Yeah. Yeah, and I love coogler He comes back to me in season six He does. Yeah, I wish he was in it more. He should have become like a recurring character Yeah season five was full of like the floor is lava episode was Yeah, and I was kind of weird post season three like you haven't got like the full roster anymore Do you know what I mean? Yeah is obviously the crappier writing and then when you finally get Dan Harmon back We're just like dropping the cast like flies. It's a bit of a shame, but I don't know. I still enjoy like the later seasons, but it's just like it's I think our bed is weird without Troy Well, I've got the super controversial opinion that I enjoyed bits of season four, you know this season four is parts very like You know, it's fine. I think it's fine. Yeah A lot of people like hate season four uh Brie Larson was in season four Yeah, it's so like I You I ended up like rechecking and I was like, oh my god, that is Brie Larson. I had no idea. Holy shit It doesn't quite look the same Here's a little story for you when I was like Because I I hadn't I watched like the first three seasons community Then I dropped off And when I went to rewatch all of the seasons when I got to season four I legitimately like fell asleep the first time I watched it because it didn't seem the same Um, there was something wrong with it and I fell asleep Do you wait for the whole thing or I watched a first couple episodes and then I like fell asleep and when I woke up. I think I'd watch like More than half of it. That's an interesting use of the word watched. Mm-hmm Yeah, that's true. It played while I was in the room asleep Your eyes might have seen some of the bits of light through the the skin of your eyelids that kind of represented what was happening in some way That's gonna count for something Jay I did have um, I had like a a podcast on once like as I was falling asleep Um, and then I I went to re listen to it when I was awake And like all of the stuff that I was hearing I wasn't I couldn't tell you what like they were gonna say next but as soon as I heard it I was like, oh, yeah, I remember that it was weird Because I like it was a very bizarre experience of like Hey listening to it again Suddenly made me remember that I'd heard it before But like I couldn't I couldn't tell you what was going to be said next. It was very strange I think the worst is falling asleep in a horror film or when you're watching a horror film because you just get woken up By like a loud jump scare you go back to sleep loud jump scare like that's just the rest of your sleep So it's over. I get that. Yeah, you go back to sleep. That probably won't happen again I mean and then you're waking up to them getting slashed to death and like well I don't care because I didn't get that scene earlier showing me who this guy is eating cereal without, you know, getting A nice dude. Oh, no wait. I'm awake Oh horror films So anyway That was that was one of the forks in the road. The other one was gonna be uh, was it rick and morty? I guess Oh, yeah, so Literally the same e-fab that we checked out your video We covered a video saying that rick and morty episode the new one was bad and we were like, you know what? Not only is it not but rick and morty really hasn't had a bad episode. It's like they are They are on point with their format and they are effective and and even the web episodes We we don't like the most we still consider them to be pretty solid, but um man That following day we watched an episode. We were like, ooh, that was bad. Like and it's surprising the one after the one I saw or No, I know the one after the one you saw. Yeah Um, I Was it bad? So it's real bad The jokes are really like falling flat and obvious and also like super low brow And I know people will be like, oh, yeah low brow for working morty. That's unusual But it's like, I mean if you only have low brow, it feels a little bit different Um, and if you don't what's the premise? Oh The premise is that morty comes in a big cum harvesting machine and then all of his cum Sort of like goes crazy and tries to take over the world because rick does an experiment not knowing it's morty's cum It's okay. Come yeah reaches the train to go to the world. Yeah They're not kind of similar to when they get like the bad versions of themselves separated out It's different to that It's worse than that Yeah, so The episode that didn't just do that and look on the comedy end But we actually felt like uh feels like these characters not not themselves a lot of stuff feels weird stuff's going on We were like, you know what? Hiccup anomaly It's fine We'll be fine. And then we watched the next one and we which was was that a demon's one? That was even one one which good god That was the joke for the whole episode rags. You're uh, you know all of our center bites, right? The things from hellraiser. Yeah I know So I watched it this year. Yeah. What are you gushing about it? No I was impressed with hellraiser the the effects in it are like For how old that film is the it's fucking creepy and really yeah looking Uh, I uh recently went to the house like I drove past it because it's in enfield really close to where my girlfriend lives A lot of five minutes away. Um, so we just had to check it out But it's now like obviously like refurbished and just looks like any other house Do you finally flash or You want to do find any flash or Just like Yeah, I was really hoping the center bites would turn up to give me a choice between ultimate pain or ultimate pleasure, but Nothing. I was a pleasure. I was a pleasure. Let's go with that one Well, so So part of the center bite thing and I'm gonna piss off like hyper fans probably but part of it is like um causing Significant amounts of pain like can lead to forms of pleasure and therefore that's part of what the center bites do And that's why they all look like bdsm torture demons Um, they want to send you to like the brink of pain where they argue you'll reach this kind of nirvana Yeah, uh, so they show up in rick and morty and It's like, oh look look who it is and um, I mean I don't mind spoiling this because i'm trying to get a point a point across about the joke of the episode So that makes it okay rick uh rick's hanging out with jerry, which is very unusual And like right at the beginning of this sort of journey He jerry goes into a bar and then before the others do they're like, oh my god It's so cringy that you hang out with jerry and thus we get pleasure from it because the pain of hanging out with him gives us pleasure And then rick is like, yeah, I know we've been doing this for a while Now and yeah, and then like they walk in and That's like the first two minutes the episode and when we were watching it. We were like, man So I guess they did a really good job of explaining the foundation of the joke because that was The arc was um, you and fringy were like, man, that seemed a bit overt and I still had faith in it No, no, no, it's it's going to be fine because like this is just going to be like the premise of the joke Right and like the rest is going to be built and it's going to be expanding on this And it's going to be something that like requires this is just the foundation And then the whole episode was that every single thing they did they would explain this hurts But that is actually good for me because I like pain and thus I am having pleasure It was literally like the episode had been written to prove the thing that I thought wrong like The episode Like I decided to prove like it couldn't have been more just the joke is saying the thing again over and over again That's the entire joke And they won't even give you a I guess the comparison, you know in episode one or a commodity when they They are knocked over that thing and a little little guy falls out of it and starts running next to me He's like a baby becomes a teenager and then an old guy and then has a half stack and falls over All happens really quickly and then multi says like oh my god, whatever and then rick is like don't think about it and they keep moving Like um, I feel like if they were to do that these days They'd be like oh my god He was like super young and then he became really old died It's like he lived a whole life at an instant the rick would be like yeah, don't think about it And just be like oh that was much more of it They don't yeah, it's like they're not they're not given the Given the chance for the audience to just figure this stuff out with themselves But I don't think I've ever seen it this bad. We're Literally any instance of anyone taking any pain in any way who's a center bite. They would just fucking roll off The whole like actually this is pleasurable for me because pain is pleasure Yeah, yeah, I got it Hmm That's just to be clear. That's the whole joke. Yeah, that's the whole episode Oh no development really um It sounds kind of lame I guess the gun he makes at the end someone could call that a development, but I don't know I was very disappointed. Um And then we were like, well, there's one more episode available. Thanks to Uh, canada, I guess, um So we could check that out Remind me Canada, which what was the can what was episode? What was that? I forget Seven what happened? So, um, the ferrets one Yeah, they did a power rangers parody and then they moved into like mob boss film mafia film parody. Um It was bad Again characters had a character in the jokes and that was very flattened basic and they weren't developed So now we're very concerned. Yeah, we're scared for working more to know. We think it might be dying So people were like what your opinion changed dramatically and it's like not really My opinion is exactly the same with the amount of episodes I had seen Yeah, like all the opinions can change anyway. Well, yeah, yeah, yeah, that yeah, that's a good point Please don't don't fucking stigmatize people changing their opinion. It's good when people like Think and they change their minds about stuff. Like yeah, I see those first three episodes Of this episode like I love those episodes. I really like season were amazing. I was so happy with them Yeah, I smile on my face. I was so happy But yeah, I think we all stand by the take right that like rick and molly is At least is good to great every episode right up until season five Yes, something went wrong and that just happened. Yeah, I think it's new writers. I can't can't really see There's any new writers write it like not the same team sad face Because the good episodes were written by the people who write the vat of acid episode. So it's like, ah Okay, so there's something some sort of connection Yeah, um But you know because some people have started watching it on our recommendation I'm just like, well, you've got plenty of fun ahead. It'll take you a while to get to these episodes They're very watchable as well. Yeah I've really watched a lot of those episodes like if you started now It's like you you see that like it's solid like 45 something episodes 40 40 something episodes to watch that are really great Yeah, and there are episodes in there the like they're so good that I would Happily show people them if they refuse to watch any more than one episode of rick and molly. I'm like, all right Watch this one. I guess Watch citadel. Yeah Vat of acid citadel is so impressive like that that episode is Fantastic Agreed It's not one of my favorite tv show episodes like of anything um Which I can segue really nicely into man, isn't it great when we have good tv shows? And then I will say Yes in theory once upon a time. I don't know do they still do those? No, they don't nobody does anymore I I used to watch so I I started watching good old show in 2005 when it got like Restarted and then I fell out during Jay, what year was the first matt smith here? uh 2010 around 2010 I fell out What's that on series five? Yeah I'm I'm a half person I need to ask you a question about that. Well, it was this I remember specifically was the spoon heads episode I watched it with a friend season seven Oh, okay. Well, it was matt smith's era. Sorry. I don't remember when the spoon series seven. I would understand. Yeah, that's um Because I'd seen a lot of rory and amy so I must have seen At least one season or more That's season season seven is like often cited as the worst before chips takes over Or even by even with chips. It's still often cited as the worst All I remember is a spoon head people. Okay, and I was like it's too much. I can't handle anymore. I don't like the spoons What's what you got in spoons one bone? I I I figure people knew I just I'm not a fan of spoons I don't know anything about spoons Well, I know like what they are But I don't know I don't know much about them You don't know what in terms like the who the the universe You know about the culture Spoons are a significant part of uh of britain dammit. Where's my phone j What did you put my phone? Why do you need your phone? You're doing efab Well, see whenever I get like notifications or emails or whatever else I can check on my phone without fucking up this actually I can do it on my screen anyway, because nobody sees anything What is on the screen right now? Oh just the efab logo, which isn't Fucking up. Um, I hate to spoil it for people who didn't know but because my pc has been acting up A lot of the stuff that I've done with efab the little animation it's been like chugging like Pausing and flumping and stuff. It's like a glitchy sort of nightmare. It may still happen today, but Last time we were doing this. I was at 100 degrees on my cpu. We are currently at 70. So that's better That's 30 degrees better. That is 30 degrees better. That is better. That's quite a bit. Yeah, I think you had a hopefully you just had a weird strange anomaly. Oh, well Technically, yes, but in terms of the temporary solution is panel off and there's a fan blowing on it now So that's good in in the sense of temporary repairs, but Um, yeah, I need I need to replace the fan for the cpu. One of them is busted I had to look see and it's it's going one of them is like super fast and normal and the other one is like Oh you poor guy And yeah, I know what I just said was very complex cpu fan I know someone out there is probably like what is this technical jogging? It's like, yeah, welcome to efab tech tips Um Oh, yeah rags and free didn't even watch dr. Who at all because they suck Hector would do what actually I did show rags a couple dr. Who episodes Also shown fringy an episode Which one okay, wait, so with rags, right? I showed him I showed him I'm with the context like I gave him proper context for like who's involved in the timeline sort of thing But uh midnight and waters of mars. All right, I like those those were good. Yeah Fringy Jay tell tell him what what fringy saw So, um, when revolution of the daleks was coming out We were all um, I can't remember why we were gonna watch it together, but we just were Right. Yeah, pretty. I think fringy. You were just around as we were doing that So you decided to hop in and that was your first dr. Who episode I think I think the only other sort of watch like the one new earth the one with the cats and the people Oh, yeah But I rewatched that recently Is it good? Yeah, so I very So I think it's kind of fun. It's good for character. It's not great It's not got a great plot, but um, it functions to do what it needs to with with its ideas I do like the motivations behind the cat nuns Doing what they're doing, you know, I mean like it's it's ultimately For an altruistic goal, but they've just sort of like gone off the beaten track and You know, the way the doctor finds them by they've gone completely insane and what's about it tracks so many people It's it's it's about ethics and medical experimentation. Really. Yeah, correct me if i'm wrong But the way they cure people is by pouring their diseases into a different body or something like that Yeah, they're using them as like flesh sacks And they argue that they have no autonomy and no consciousness And that's why they can like pump them for all these diseases and they say to the doctor like you have no idea before you got here Like we were rammed overrun in the hospitals. Like this was the only solution to save anyone Um, but like they find out basically they have consciousness Oh my god, and then he gives them the little I just remember he puts the sprinkles on they all get saved I think yeah, yeah He he mixes lots of medicine together and cures them of all disease. Oh, yeah I remember being like, I don't think that's how that works when he just pulls That's the flimpy stuff. Um, the biggest flimp is that oh He just solved disease. Okay Yay But like everything else is like, yeah, the character's all right. Uh The problem with a lot of one part is is they sometimes just resolve it with like a magic button in the last five minutes I think that's the problem with series seven being like all one part is yeah That's there's a lot of that. Oh, well, that's okay because Steven Moffat's good at one part is like blink, right? I like blink. Do you know that blink? Well, I'm I'm commenting on how everyone thought Steven Moffat might be able to handle it But he couldn't handle it because blink was good and uh And and then his seasons I mean, you know, he looks good in retrospect right compared to chibbers Yeah, I think with series seven as well He was kind of exhausted from the 50th anniversary. I think that's why it took kind of a hit He was also working on what like sherlock and the tintin movie at the same time as that series, right? Yeah, like when it was sherlock and doc two sort of like back and back to back I just thought how's he not gonna get exhausted and of course series seven came along and it was trash Well, oh, that's that's how what uh, what did you did you guys? I'm pretty sure j you kept up a bit with sherlock, right? What's uh, what's your take um out on sherlock the bbc series with benedict cumber buns Um, I don't think it ever got better than when he jumps off that building I think that season two finale is Really awesome, and then they never knew quite how to handle it after that It's kind of funny They're like our finale is going to be moriarty shoots himself in the head at the sherlock commits suicide And we're not sure what the twist is yet Yeah Tips of writing yourself into a quarter twist was um Yeah, we see we want our payoffs, but we don't know Yeah, we want that we want our shocking moments, but we don't know um I don't know. I think I was just repeating the thing that he says We know that people jumping off the buildings is shocking And that that's that's all we know and they're looking at two corpses like now what? Yeah, well, oh those were our characters uh Yeah, uh, I say that he plans the resolution to that because I can't remember but it feels like he didn't have a plan at the end of season two going into season three um He never he so conspicuously didn't have a um a plan for like He clearly never knew how sherlock survived if you're gonna write something like that You want you want a solution this one. It's uh delivered to the audience that makes your audience go Oh Yeah, that makes sense in retrospect. I can see how that totally worked. Oh, yeah Like because because the only way to have someone jump off a building and then just show up later completely fine Work in your story is is essentially Is if the black widow is well to have the uh to essentially have the audience missing critical information or um Something that makes everything slot into place because Everything we know means that that can't happen Well, um, isn't the the so what happened is that it was really hard for them to write because uh john was watching it all Right, so yeah You have to account for that while also figuring out a way to save somebody who clearly fell off a building And got slapped into the concrete and died and they try to argue that he He fell in such a way that john couldn't see him Beyond a van and then they switched he landed on like a crash pad that they switched his body out And I was just like what the fuck is happening? I remember just because I wanted to know how they sorted that out, right? It was and I was just like I am not impressed I am in a form of very soft concrete It didn't ever um, they didn't ever commit to a solution though. They um, they essentially had like They presented loads of of potential ways that he might have done it that also had far-fetched and then said it wasn't any of those And that was it It just feels more like if austin power was in that same situation that would be the resolution Do you know what I mean? Yeah, all the smoke and mirrors and the crash mats and stuff. It's so ridiculous And landed on my mojo Do you see the um the h bomb a guy video? It's one of my favorites from him for sheer luck. It just annihilates the show I like that video I'm guessing not What what does he um, what's his premise? Oh, basically the the whole show sucks. So he might even change your mind on the first two seasons Oh, really? He hated all of it and um In fairness, he does his due diligence He goes um and checks out a lot of sheer luck content and then talks about what he thinks that like I think the main point Is that you get given the information you need to figure it out and then they put it together and you're like, oh, shit instead of a boomerang A step ladder. Yeah A huge amount of the argument is that um classic sure look stories will present you all the information you need um, whereas uh solve the mystery yourself whereas sheer luck the bbc show Will show you a tiny piece of the puzzle and then sheer luck will arrive Tell you that it was very hard and then Give you loads of information that the viewer never had that he used to solve it And then how they keep ratcheting everything up When they have no idea what they're actually going to be ending the story with clearly like there's lots of evidence for that Which I find super interesting weird. Oh, yeah, so much of it. It's just bait That's that's strange for an investigation show. Usually you start with the ended mind and then work your way back Like, you know the full mystery Also, here's the thing for you When they killed Moriarty at the end of season two they were like fuck that was Moriarty We need him back and they keep baiting him that he's coming back But he never actually comes back because it would be yeah, that was terrible You can't kill someone and then yeah bait the audience since oh, he's coming back and then actually go no He was dead all along. Sorry. It got so close to baiting him back that they had Oh, what so they got there was so many like little are you fucking kidding me moments? There's like a moment where he stepped where like they cut to him stepping off a helicopter The location that Sherlock and and Watson are at And then like after like a few seconds of the scene where Moriarty stepping off the helicopter and I'm going What the fuck is going on? It's why Moriarty is here. He's alive and then a title card appears for like Five years earlier and you're like Yeah, I was really disappointing um, and then They they also have an excuse that there were some video recordings of him made because someone before he died Got him to make loads of facial expressions into a camera So that he they could program his face like a puppet and that's how actually there were video recordings of him after he died He's not batman like you can't get rid of the Joker and then you've got this whole rogues gallery I want you to get rid of Moriarty. That's that's kind of like it for the big boys Um, didn't Moriarty only appear in like two of the original Sherlock Holmes stories I know but like when you're adapting it I just feel like the first two seasons set him up to be like the big bad and from there on I only kind of want to see what they're going to get to each other I didn't want to see like it's Mads Mikkelsen's Brother, isn't it in season three and I can't remember who the villain is in seasons four. Oh, it's uh, his sister, isn't it? Yeah, they're both so forgettable That's the thing they they clearly were like forgetting that character Wouldn't it be nuts if um if Moriarty shot himself in the head and that was a part of his plan And I think that's all they would they were lost after that. That was the idea and then they didn't do anything with it Yeah Sorry Someone just said at some point in the writer's room. Yeah, no one will expect that and that was the end of the conversation Yeah, you should totally watch Sherlock you'd love it All right, well, I think I might have you know what you just remember I think I watched like the first two episodes of that show I a long time ago. I remember because it's martin freeman is uh, yeah, you know, right? Yeah, so I I definitely I'm pretty sure like When did that show come out like how long ago 2011 season one? Yes, I'm right The release schedule this show has been bizarre too, right? They take like two year breaks every once in a while Whatever they're done now. Oh, yeah. Sorry. It was 2010 summer season one And then yeah, you're right. They took like over a year-long break It was like january 2012 and then it was two years two years. I think oh no, I think it was three years I think it was 2014 and 2017 they even didn't absolutely They're in like victorian times or whatever, right? Oh, yeah, that was oh, yeah a special British British TV you get like three episodes and then you got to wait two years for the next three Yeah, it's not like they are you don't have them just like churn Whether they do what you would think result in better shows. Well, I think that's the misconception, right British shows your episodes They're really good, right? I think that's a logical conclusion to jump to And of course really good. Well, yeah, you think about like faulty towers There's only 12 episodes and all of them are golden It's like that's worth a lot versus like I don't know like 24 episodes of big bang theory in one season What are you suggesting about big bang? You you like computers. I thought you loved that show big bang theory I used to really like big bang theory. That's my uh, that's that's my like And you know what? I feel like Well, the real the real awkward part is if you sat me down and got me to watch big bang theory I'd probably be laughing like it's one of those Yeah Super awkward because I know it's not good But like there's parts in it that I just laugh at honestly Um, I think um big bang theory is underrated not in the it's good But in the like people say it's like a two and it's like a four I think it's overhead. It's looked at as a two and it's a four. That's probably fair. Well It's just really weird because like far from home Yeah, I don't like Yeah, um, I guess it's just because when you look at that show it's like, oh, this isn't you're just like referencing things Like that's not but there are actually like legitimate jokes in that show that I feel like we're uh That are almost glossed over because a lot of it is your star jokes Like gi joe or transformers and stuff people like to take some of the unfunny scenes and Like remove the laugh track and be like, yeah, this is what the whole show is when No, there are there are scenes with like good jokes and then they're just I guess The problem is if you remove the laugh track from like Seinfeld That would probably really hurt the pacing as well um I don't know this fair to to totally change the pace of a show and then point out how awkward it is I know it's like any show with canned laughter is designed to use the canned laughter. You can just skip it out That's true Because if you go rid of it you just write it different Like community would be structured very differently if every time they told a joke there was like canned laughter And an awkward two second pause, you know, yeah dictates all the pacing Yeah, definitely I don't I don't think I've ever actually watched a whole episode of uh big bang theory, but Say I had a bad Um start with the joke I always reference. I think I've done this one before but Where the girl walks in and Sheldon's playing Mario She's like, what's she doing? He goes, I'm playing an emulator and then it's a laugh track And I was like, huh? Yeah. Yeah, and then she's like, what's that? And he goes it allows me to play a nintendo 64 or something like that and then there's a laugh track again I was like, what the fuck? There's no jokes. What's this not a joke? It's just saying what he's doing that That's the issue with big bang theory is that there is a good chunk of the humor Just look nerdy thing. Ha ha. Isn't that funny? They watch Babylon 5. Isn't that funny? Ha ha we think it's actually like 1989 and it's fun to laugh at nerds because no one's a nerd I think the joke in that in that scene is that you're not supposed to know what an emulator is Or a nintendo 64. So the nerd has just said two things that are not It's more of a joke than it was before No, it's more confusing Well, I guess what I get confused. Maybe it's more confusing to know because now you're trying to figure out I mean, I think I think that if we're being charitable, I think the joke in that scene is that he is supposed to have Um, miss the social queue in that he has no idea that she has no idea what the fuck he's talking about Well, yeah, I mean that's generally joke with him is that he's completely Oh my god, like social Still not a good joke, but no, I don't remember the fucking I can't remember what episode it is But it's like smith is I'm home. It's just laughter. He goes what already The laughter they go. Yes, the laughter because the fucking like shitty Was that the the film festival one? Was that something else? I can't do that his own cable network. It could be can't remember if it's out of the film festival. I'm kind of like conflating them Yeah, because the film festival almost is when he filmed his Steven Spielberg go fucking movie when it was non-union mexican equivalents Um, I guess Go ahead It's all a blur. Like I don't I don't remember it much anymore. Um, the simpsons Which is kind of Oh, I love the simpsons. I remember all of that I remember all the jokes in that one I'm sorry. So did you mean the big bang theory? Yeah, big bang theories a blow the simpsons. I like remember I remember jokes to like the words the exact words and timing I've got to admit like I've seen like probably like five seasons of the bank big bang through when it first came out I could probably tell you like the plot of maybe Two episodes All I remember is there was an episode where they go bowling with will weaton and like we'll wait and there's a psychopath in the show That's like the joke. Um, I remember the episode where penny penny gets like addicted to Penny gets addicted to like an mmo I remember that yeah, and then there's one where Sheldon plays in a card game tournament. I think against will weaton and will weaton Beat sim by lying about his grandma Right, that's right. Yeah because he's evil That's to be fair. I like that will we I kind of respect the chops on will weaton for agreeing to just play himself But as a piece of shit But as a piece of shit, yeah, so like they have will weaton in the show playing himself, but he's an asshole Remember, I like that. That's that's just a genuinely funny thing to do. I think Yeah, yeah, I like that when I do that I'm trying to do that Well, I mean, I might remember all her and bojack when jessica bill is just the whole thing is shitting on her career Like that was Oh, yeah Thanks god Yeah, yeah, um, because yeah her career just where did she go? So no no jessica bill is Daniel reikliffe is great in bojack as well like I I think what they did money was doing but yeah What they do with him is funny because it's actually him playing himself and he's playing an asshole like well You know what I think about like Yeah, I kind of agree I like it when he plays himself in extras. He does kind of the same deal. Have you guys seen that? I have only seen the patrick stewart episode of extras, but it was brilliant. Oh, I love the patrick stewart bit Oh, that's one of the best in the next generation Uh, yeah, I've seen like odd episodes. No, so I was I was quoting the episode but oh So just now we know something about you I uh, I think I've only watched a couple episodes of extras. I remember I started it, but I didn't keep going Which uh, weird. I feel I feel like I should finish that I think it ends on an oddly emotional note. I was like really Come around by the end of it. So there's a great doc to count me. Oh in the final episode right Like uh, because the ricky javae's like he gets a part in dr Who and it just like smash cuts to him next to david tenon He's like dressed like a slug and david tenon like throw sort over him after like, you know explaining a little techno battle and then it just cuts back to like his next job and like that's that's all he's in it And like david tenon plays it like as he would play the doctor like really seriously. I've never seen that Wow It's funny It's like an actual scene of dr. Who but imagine ricky javae's like the absorb a lot basically in worse makeup I I don't I feel like existing in the community like very deep for ages I would I mean I've seen shows you tits and I'll tell you but I've not seen that Oh, yeah, I highly recommend it. I mean I recommend the whole show just to get to that doctor who bit I'm probably gonna watch that scene at some point on youtube, but yeah, I do intend to watch the rest Jay is a hoover of doctor who content Even cameos Yeah, we're we're we're I'm gonna have to draw us back now I don't know where we were It's a doctor who I'd watched and I think I watched the one where she said that's what I call one in conflict Wait, that was the one you watched. No, that wasn't the one you watched. Oh, it wasn't it? No, you watched. Um, you watched the one where she said um, oh fucking Uh the one where she goes on about not knowing who she is Oh, yeah And she detonated a TARDIS, which is like a living being right? Yes A revolution of the Daleks, which you haven't seen right? Oh, no, I haven't seen it. Yeah, it's it's not very good It's like I'm I'm very happy to say it's wildly overrated by a lot of the community I wasn't impressed. Yeah I was waiting for like the reviews to come out or people I trusted Personally to say it was good before I committed back to it after the time of the children because I felt that burned by it And then when I saw everyone was saying at best it was okay And like even the people I could tell that were like saying they really loved it were joining like over egging it I just thought no, I can't be bothered. I'm I'm not buying You're wheeling out captain jack trying like appeal to the RTD era of me Oh, there are so many RTD era references like Gwen Cooper rose Tyler get name dropped Um, there's there's a lot It doesn't make it good I agree What the hell they try so hard to get the those references in there. Oh, well um, yeah, so I guess we're not alone on that front in terms of Damn, dr. Who what's that? Even though I've not watched it full apart. I just get updates from j Yeah, you watched um, you watched demons of the punjab Revolute resolution and then revolution of the Daleks Yeah Unlike you could fix them up. I guess. I don't know. Maybe revolution of the Daleks needs to be flushed, but uh Yes, there's there's some rich premises in there Yeah, I guess I'm just thinking about how She threw a bunch of Daleks into the Toddis and blew it up. That still bothers me. I'm thinking am I Oh And they're all really stupid. I've heard that captain jack Obviously appears in special, but that he doesn't die once and come back to life. Is that true? That is true. He doesn't That's bizarre Well, he says he's old is the ass in the trailer. Yeah, he does He says it but he doesn't there's no scene never comes up showing that Okay And um, he's done now, right? He's not able to get any more dr. Who? I doubt it. I doubt it. Yeah Am I right in saying he was supposed to do something with um, David Tennant in like big finish, but then yes Well, he did. Um, but that's not coming out anymore. Hang on Man, that sounds like the kind of thing fans would have been very very excited for but I mean, yeah, that's what happens When you get your dick out. I don't know That's what happens when you rub your dick on your co-stars I feel like you should expect consequences, you know Yeah, I just think it is a little bit funny that Chris Shibnall really banked on bringing Captain Jack back and then These stories came back into the public consciousness. It's like I bet he's thinking oh, fuck I can't like panda to the RTD era anymore now Chris, Chris, Chris. We can't we can't bring him back. He's like, what do you mean we can't bring he put his dick on people Like, oh The thing is Chris was Chris definitely knew he did that Chris worked with him 100% Well, so okay, so the scape the skill would be he put his dick on people that Chris doesn't react He's like, uh-huh Wow, people are asking for context. Isn't it straightforward? Oh, yeah, so um in like 2005 2007 when um, john barrowman was working on dr Who he would get his dick out and rub it on people That's it. That's that's the context Was it like um like his friends or um As sort of like I think he um, I think he underestimated um social boundaries He did it to his friends, but I don't think they were likely Um as on board with it as he thought they might have been It's always the dicker who thinks that and not the dicky Yeah Yeah, you should have asked you know should have asked not dicked then it wouldn't be funny That's true. I think it'd be funny to ask people um so Yeah, uh, we're all very sad about dr Who being in a bad state and we're hoping it can recover as it's done many times like a phoenix rising from the ashes You were saying they can't pander to the rtd era anymore. Um, I was the rtd era. That was the um, that's russell t davis is um the Showrunner when what a lot of people considered to be the peak of dr Who it was certainly like the peak of its popularity in like 2005 2010 That's golden age. They're all blank so People that's generally gets referred to as the rtd era You uh, the episodes you've seen rags are all from the rtd era. Oh my goodness gracious um Yeah, but like they still can we they've got like um, they've got a secret person that they're announcing at comic con this like Sunday, I think a person um, as well they've um, they've got they're doing a comic con panel with um, jody wittaker, like some of um, some of the other cast chris jibnall and A mystery guest who they've announced as a mystery guest Which clearly means they're announcing a cast member bite by that What makes me really sad how little I care Well, will you um, will you be checking out season series 13 and i'll show how it's called as a season series, but Yeah, series um, I I think it's a no at the moment. Um, the two people I do My podcast with We're kind of saying to me Oh, we know maybe like is that they don't really like watched up to who they both tapped out in the rtd era Um, and we were kind of tossing around like, you know, would it be interesting to do weekly reviews on that? um, but I just I don't know I just feel like there's a part of me that After the time there's children. I just feel like I should step away from it It's I'm not enjoying it. Do you know means like what what uses it in my life? Like if other people want to enjoy it, you know, go knock yourself out, but I don't care about it anymore It's it's terrible Yeah, I think with anything you don't enjoy and then well with anything you do enjoy and then it starts to crumble You do wonder if there's a time limit on how much longer you're gonna wait to uh Get the stuff that you wanted back sort of thing Yeah, and like I gave it two seasons of chibnall when he was announced back in 2016 I worried and then you know like when we first started seeing like the first couple of announcements first couple of trailers I thought okay, maybe it could be good He seemed confident and then it turned out to be exactly what I thought it was going to be I felt like a mug But then I saw the trailer for series 12 and I thought oh, maybe he's turned it around and that ended up being ultimately worse I just think you know now You know I'm a fool to go back right unless there's some sort of like critical Analytical reason and pretends my channel. I've got the the best reason that I've got to go back to it is um Matt, did you like haunting a velodai die? But it was fine, but again, I think I liked it, but I think you've moved. Oh, sorry Sorry, what did you say Rex? It sounded like he stuttered the joke was you said it's so fast it sounded like you stuttered, okay? You ruined a j Well, I'm sorry You may now continue Thank you That's just um, I thought was that episode was leaps and bounds ahead of all the other ones in the era And the writer of that episode is apparently coming back to write a lot of episodes for the next series. So that's good Oh, really? What if the reviews come out and they're all like this is the shot in the arm but too needed Then I will go back to I mean like there's no fun to me and In sitting there whilst everyone else is enjoying it going on I'm not going to watch our principal You know, I mean if if chibnall knocks out the park Then it's a different story, but do I think he's going to know? I don't think he's going to I think what's going to happen most likely scenario for it being What I would call a good season is that like all of the episodes he didn't write are great and then here's a fine like I see it be I don't see it being a um A well-structured season of television with uh a satisfying payoff at the end and good setups at the beginning But what I do see happening is like there being loads of good individual stories in there I'm assuming you're desperate at this point to those to where if a character is established as one way And then they do something that is kind of based on that trait. You'll be like yes Yeah Villadar Dati did that with like eight characters Real fast in like a space of 50 minutes, which is pretty impressive to do good characterization for that many characters in 50 minutes, I think Yeah, it is a good episode. Um, I just think it's kind of undercut by it's ashad Is it the side man? Yeah The way this gets like wiped off the map in the time the children was Yeah, so he gets introduced. He's a great character great villain in an episode Then in the next episode he's there and then in the next episode he dies But the master just like utterly bodies him like it's like he doesn't even break a sweat getting rid of him And you kind of sat there like Surely ashad's got something up his sleeve or this isn't the last we've seen of him But no like that's just it. He just he just goes off the map like honestly he could have been like If they kept him around he could have been like davros to the cyber man, but I really like the idea of having like a recurring side man character as well Yeah, he could have been that he could have been because he's not you know He's not like a ripoff of davros. He's not like it's not literally davros for the cyber man But as in uh, just the same thing as in a character who was often with them Then it was weird. Did he did he not want to I'm trying to remember it here He he wanted to like strip the submen of their like human components to make them like pure robots. Yeah, that was cringe Like what's the point the whole the whole thing that makes the submen interesting is the economy between the human side and their tech side That makes them robots children. So that's the count where she wants to make like robots then Yeah, he wants to just make robots really and he wants to do it by pulling the human pieces out of the current cyber man Well, he wants to he made a new design of cyber men that wouldn't have human pieces Oh, okay. So he's making robots. Yeah, just robots. I guess. All right. Well, that's just sounds like robots with extra steps I would say that's the dumbest side man idea and that's you part of it. Then of course we get the gallifrey and side man afterwards I mean their functional idea They were cool Visually, they probably put that out in promotional stuff like what could possibly have led to this. No, they didn't Oh They were really they were really I actually point of praise They were really restrained with the promotional stuff and like It's been like the most restrained era since the revival of like not giving Having a thing to show Cyber lords they could have showed there They didn't show Like most of the episodes they they wouldn't give away like what the alien looked like that was that was new Uh for like most of the next time trailer. Sorry, it would be I think if they had it would have been the pathing and all those kinds of things But like um, they didn't give away the dregs and often in the often 55 trailers. They showed like one of their hands The the next time trailers were very short didn't give plot details Didn't give like alien enemy details and stuff like that. They were just like we're in a place It's gonna be an adventure or something and that's it They were gonna be an adventure or something They gave they gave away a lot less in the uh in the trailers Yeah, it always just came across to me like it was because they were clutching at straws Like what substances in each episode? What can we show off? I don't know. I feel like you cut together a pretty good trailer from uh for most Shivers episodes really. Yeah that point That's an exercise. I would love to see like cut an epic series 11 12 trailer I do it. There's a lot of like there's a lot of spectacular shots in it Yeah, but like in terms of like, you know, like the next time tries to idea that they'd like pose interesting questions And you'd be like, oh my god, what's gonna happen to this character? Like I don't feel like there's any of that in the next times Well, and like there's some cool shots, but I don't know like how you're gonna sell like an epic series 12 trailer on like Oh, you know, you're the timeless child doctor Hey Everyone loved it. That's true. Everyone loved it So and and this is the thing by the way doctor who is that it's highest for budget right right now Um, it's certainly in terms of it's highest for like the production value I don't know if that's a higher budget or it's just being used more effectively But it certainly looks More I said, I guess realistic than it ever has before well Wouldn't have been neat if tom baker's era got to have all that money and technology Maybe it wouldn't maybe we'll make it worse somehow I probably wouldn't need You reckon they should re-release the older ones, but remastered with new CGI. Do you think that would look great? I hate that you I hate that. I know specifically what you're referencing I think everybody does don't they Not me Matt, have you seen the day of the Daleks remaster? Is that the is that the second doctor like animation? It's the third. It's the third doctor. It's the one They've done animations one animation. I'm good with the animations like recreating stuff that's that's got missing footage That's great. What I don't like is injecting loads of CGI and like Where in places where it clearly just was never intended for that to just be a special effect Oh, I see. Sorry. So it's like it's more like a restoration. Yeah. Yeah. Oh, yeah No, I don't like that I like the idea of like the missing episodes because that's the only way you can ultimately see it now Yeah for the old I like when they update effects that they clearly like I'm fine with them updating effects in old stuff that like Maybe the technology or the budget wasn't up to doing it then But now it's much easier to do what they were trying to do So you can just add it like clearly what they were going for I'm fine with that Just adding loads of extra stuff is where I'm like, why are you doing this? Stop it Yeah, you're like in the original trilogy that the orabesh from the prequels Yeah Yeah, yeah that kind of thing example of a good change. Do you know what I mean? Yeah, yeah, for more consistency it like it's good For and then when you go in the the original trilogy is just adding loads of CGI creatures that were never there in the begin with It's begin with that don't really fit the original visual style It's like the orabesh is a subtle change that's why it's all together Whereas like the the big uh, you know that when they let zoom pass in the in more size doing that big monster like jumps up It's like all could be obviously new footage and it cuts back to the old footage. It's really jarring. Yeah Well, like the world is it the new song they added in Return of the Jedi? Yeah, I know a lot of people prefer that song So wasn't I like how the song sounds I just don't like the scene I Kind of like the goofiness of it just because I think when they inject that kind of stuff in It makes it feel like a little bit like the prequels like as if it is all one universe It just just feel sort of like oh, it's a prequel scene and now back to the trilogy I hope they update the sequel trilogy one day with new ryan Just inject different. Yeah, just at the CGI in a new script Everybody's mouth moves but like all different words are coming out and so it has to just re-write. Yes computer generated I think the saddest thing about Rise of Skywalker is if it had just been like let's say pushed back a couple of months It would have strayed in to pandemic time and then it still wouldn't have come out And who knows they could have like rewritten it in that time like Mission Impossible Is getting like some added time and they're going through the scripts. I think that's only going to be better for it Well, you'd hope so right Honestly, you know what a good script is too, right at the point we were getting rise of Skywalker I think the best thing to hope for was a film that was just funny I think it was funny. I laughed. Yeah, no, isn't that's that's why I'm saying like would it been good if they rewrote it? Because ultimately what we could have got could have been not as funny I remember when she when she blew up chewy in the transporter. I laughed in the cinema I just hate how every single like point of tension just gets undone like a scene later Like sure Chewbacca dying is pretty lame, but let's commit to it. You've done it now. Oh, no wait the next scene Oh, we've got this prisoner on board. Guess who it is. I don't want Chewbacca die. I feel like he's a victim of He should be allowed to survive Like why was there no Kylo Ren Chewbacca scene? He's like his dog, isn't he? And he shot him But there's nothing to be like. Hey, buddy. You shot me. He's like, yeah, you killed Han Solo you bitch As you guys seen the little fan comic where it shows the scene where Chewie shoots Kylo after he kills Han. Yeah, I've seen it. Um, and it shows like Chewie um aiming as Bocaster at Kylo And then it like shows flashbacks with Chewie of like him playing with Kylo as a child And she like decides to like shoot him in the gut rather than the head And it's like, damn that's more character than was in the film. That's more than anything we've got in the sequel Yeah, because the the sequel trilogy thinks he's just a chauffeur for characters Not that he's like a war hero and a character and stuff Yeah, well, yeah, Chewie gets hard done by words. That doesn't make sense I wish all of the sequel characters didn't have words That's true. I also think when Kylo Ren's scene with Lando Like I think it would have been cool to say like oh Han Solo his dad failed But he's kind of like seraga uncool because like surely he would have known him growing up right? Like if Lando actually spoke to Kylo Ren and it was Lando That actually managed to sort of like just give him that that that little detail to maybe redeem him I think would have been cool or even Chewbacca. Do you know me like they're they're the two that Surely had like a big no he has to kiss Ray They should so much And now I actually I actually don't mind them sort of having a little coming of age awkward virgin love story across the sequel trilogy But that's not Well, you know what every uh Each to their own You like tea some people like coffee, you know that that's just that's the way of the world. It's beautiful really um I think the beautiful thing is no matter where you fall on the sequel trilogy Like I think most people are kind of united in hating on skywalker So they set out to do what they wanted to do they went to unite the fan base with the last movie and they Did well funnily enough um the first time I think you came up on our our podcast here was that uh We were covering someone who was defending riser skywalker as a very very good movie And they brought your channel up and they said that you by shitting on that movie of uh Well committed to a horror in a way I believe their argument was that the more misinformation And hatred you spread to that movie the less like exposure it will get and the more lies people will believe about It's uh inconsistent writing and they like they showed their comment section with you Back and forth thing and they were trying to sell it as though you were being very harsh and unfair And that they were being nothing but civil we read through them and we were like good god This guy's a psycho like he's obsessed with you. He's like you're wrong about everything Like I actually checked that out. Um because someone in my comments It was like a year ago, right? Someone was like, oh you're on the latest e-fap and obviously i'm thinking Oh, no, like someone's tearing apart my video. So I go to log on and it turns out it's someone else critiquing my video and you guys are actually critiquing his video And you're actually kind of defending me and I thought it was like just funny to watch like this guy and ravel I think he said things like Like wasn't he like arguing with me in the comments? Yeah, and I was kind of just like well, you know like It's up to you kind of thing He wasn't getting he wasn't getting the reaction out of me that he wanted Yeah, he kept pushing. I think that that was the guy, right? Yeah, yeah, and and the funny thing is with with us will be a lot more harsh But I think you were just like, yeah, I mean if you like the movie that's fine. Then you was like, no You you must correct the record. You've said things about the movie that are unacceptable, which by the way Out of the sequel trilogy, honestly rise scour is the one that kind of baffles me in terms of like Oh, wow, people love that one. Like I I can get Yeah, I don't get how people like it Such a crazy movie. That's like, all right. Well, it's so shamelessly corporate and made by committee at every turn And it's such a jumbled mess and like it's way more about this weird plot than it is about the characters Like this missing it look it's lando. Looky there. Look you saw him. You saw it was lando. Did you see it? God, it's alpatine. You remember him. He exploded twice. That's okay. He's cracked when I was your friend again Isn't that fun? We had fun the first time you give him the big suck And then he like attacked the entire fleet with his electric flumes. He's like, ah everything is cranking up so much He's got a hundred thousand star destroyers spaceships that can't figure out how to go up How's he coming back is so bad as well Like I just it annoys me to no end that it undercuts anakin's ending. Well, you have to understand the dead speak Anakin was just a setup for the real chosen one hero who was a skywalker It wasn't actually anakin. Yeah, didn't didn't they have Hayden christianson say something like Succeed where I failed or something like that It was like I I did or something like that. I was like, but you didn't because we're like He didn't do that You didn't do that. That's why we're here That's why it's annoying you because you're like which other jedi the emperor falls down that hole that he slips out through a little Compartment in his little dinky ship and escapes or he did die But there was another emperor on a different planet. So we still don't really know exactly what the answer to that one is That was a fun time. I love the idea of audiences in 1983 watching this villain Fall down like an impossible chasm and then literally explode and then the thing he's on explodes as well And jay jabrams thought yeah, he's coming back Did you know that scene after the death put star blows up? It wants the end question mark? Question mark Tune in next decade to find out who truly knows This is truly the end Interesting is adam's doubly reassemble Like i'm bringing back bringing back to life. It's just no put of mission. We don't care We don't yeah, we don't care Fuck it It does nothing matters You like palpatine right watch our movie They would bring him back again if they knew it would be the Biggest source of money like if they knew it was a guaranteed thing. Yeah, I don't give a fuck You're like well, you see None of the people you've seen so far the real palpatine Turns out the real that was just a clone of the real palpatine And He's well, what if there's just a multiverse that there you go Oh, that might be what they do palpatine is star wars is king Oh, oh, you know what there we go. We're we're slotting right in beautiful so then Relatively recently the mcu's been moving right along and it's like, you know what star wars that ain't our thing anymore Disney's like we're gonna focus on the mcu for a while even though star wars So I don't know if you I haven't seen all of your coverage on on everything But we here at e-fap really didn't like wander vision falcon the winter soldier or loki We kind of hated all of them. Um, we've got extensive like discussions on all of us Not just casual or any way like we went through all the episodes And there's stuff we like but oh boy, there was lots of stuff. We didn't like and of course When we finished loki, we were like, oh man We should cover someone who like likes loki and then someone was like, well You're uh, the full fat videos guy He he reckons that loki is not only uh good, but it's what dr Who should probably aspire to be at this point? It's like a fix in a way and I was like no way Um, and so we covered your video and that catches us up pretty much to now Um, I guess we should probably talk about loki a little bit like I'm curious the the the the thing I found super interesting about your video was um You didn't like the the doctor's uh history was retconned, right? Uh with the time of shiles. Yeah Yeah, no so, um Well, I don't I don't know how to really connect. They're not really the same thing But I would imagine it could cause the same frustration But we're gonna have a different sort of POV on this But like one of my biggest issues with the show is that it's it's we're not watching loki This is a completely different guy who doesn't even remotely match what I understand to be loki's characteristics Um, yeah, they put him on a super super super fast track to a complete Basically reversal in character in the first episode I think if if you've watched avengers 2012 at least relatively recently He's quite uh, obviously joss winden built him to be the threatening villain in that film because that is his role And that means he says and does a lot of things that are quite like oh, oh boy Um, horribly evil. Yeah. And so if you need to transpose him into a um plucky protagonist Who is kind of like heroic in a tv show and you need to do it fast I can see why they made the choices they did but at the same time. I think they're terrible and um As well as that'll be the first thing I would mind talking to you about. Um How do you feel I actually I actually don't subscribe to this theory because I think it's really weak but um There was like a slight retconning of the original avengers more recently. I think it was in like a companion book It sort of implied that the mind stone was actually influencing loki And uh, like once that was free of him. That's why like in the later movies. He's not as evil And like that's just like takes away all of his autonomy Talking about takeaway autonomy Had autonomy he never had autonomy That'll that'll be topic too. That's fine. So He gets that um Yeah, I hate that idea because uh, it's so thoroughly enforced by thaw one and avengers like his motivation Every action he takes is very thoroughly explained. There's no No, it was a mind stone really. Yeah, that's what it was. No, it's it's never implied at all And like I really like his arc from thaw to avengers to dark world. I do think like post that They join me like he's a fun character in kind of like a scene Like if there's you know, some hijinks going on like I liked when he meets stock strange and stuff Um, but I found more often than not we've sort of done the most interesting things we could do with that character Up until when he gets killed by thanos um Yeah, and of course people would cite that he was he was pretty evil before he even got in contact with the Mind Stone, right? Like uh, some of the stuff he did in asgard when he was at his low point, uh not only condemning thaw to Be banned from asgard, but also essentially like baiting the death of odin And then uh backstabbing the frost giants to come across as though he's a savior It's like these things are not They're not becoming of a of an honest or a good a good person And then avengers just doubles down like he does a shit ton more Like obviously they it seemed like that was the idea when he's he's dropped by thaw Or at least he lets go and falls into the void or whatever He feels like, you know, fuck asgard. They're not my people And then that's what makes infinity was a little payoff so good as well but um the Like he opens with zapping people with his like scepter thing throwing like knives into people's necks and um As as black widow made clear he killed 80 people in two days He like digs that device into a guy's eye And uh, he tears down black widow like furiously or smiling And all this stuff is really hard to brush away with well, you see it wasn't that he enjoys causing pain It's that he enjoys being seen as strong and he is kind of a good guy actually yeah I don't know. I don't know if he's like yet a good guy even by the end of the season um, but what I do actually really like about that first episode is Getting to see that slide show Um, I know obviously like there is an element to it that's like we're just watching the older movies. I get that um But I was trying to sort of like contextualize it from your own perspective and I do think If you were like as arrogant as lowkey And you really like you say to people openly like this is what i'm gonna do You know, no one's gonna stop me This is who I am and then you get played a video of Like your decisions lead to your mother's death like You know, you might reconcile with Thor but five minutes later, you know, this terrible decision you made like very recently Is going to come back to bite you like you think you're this god But here's a video and this is this is like canon, isn't it? Like they tell him that like this is the way it went So when he's watching that he's not watching that thinking oh, this could be like a you know, definitely made it This is like this is the end of the road and I just think like that would be Certainly for anyone no matter how narcissistic would surely be like a A moment of an impetus to change right like you'd be thinking wow if I don't If I don't do anything different. This is this is the canon path. I'm going on No, I'm not in any way trying to offend but I believe that is what they want you to think I believe that is the surface take for like the events as they're unfolding But then when you think about a lot more of the pieces of information it doesn't match so He is being told do you mean So he's being told about all of these events and you've shown that this is totally true under the concept that these people Control time and space under the three lizards that decide everything that happens So what you're being shown is like your intentions failing and you cause your mother to die Becomes almost irrelevant compared to wait people are forcing everything to happen the way they want it to. I'm just a pawn Um, that's the actual discussion Because like what what relevance would it be to talk about your failings and what things led From what you chose to do when you're not making any choices at all. It's the lizards that Choose one of your multi trillion options as the canon one because at one point almost it's like lol You fail so much in the elevator and look he's just like Fuck you, but I'm just like wait wouldn't the response just be like I never had a chance to succeed Like there was nothing that could have worked. I was always set to lose In fact the one time I did kind of succeed and get out of there with the the teleporter You guys pulled me in like no, you're supposed to fail So I find this whole conversation like bizarre in the show Like why isn't Loki just like fuck you guys like you control everything What am I supposed to do instead of him crying? Because he realizes that a lot of his like goals of hurting people lead to bad things Because the second tier to this Is I don't believe that you would believe any of this. I think that Loki would double down This must be a trick he he specifically says like this is clearly an illusion. This is some kind of a trick Like he doesn't believe it he thinks that first But like I think the way Hillston plays it that scene where he's watching his neck get snapped I think by that by that point he believes because they're using a good actor Yeah, so this is think I don't I don't think he should believe it Even if he does because Loki is his personality would just to be oh, well, that's not gonna happen I'm gonna change things. I'm gonna do things differently that Loki isn't me I'm me and I'm going to change because I'm gonna win. I've still got plans And this is discounting the entire fact that he shouldn't even be here anyway Yeah, we can probably talk about that ultimately I'd I'd much rather see that character in that in any way just Like I'd much rather see that Loki than the new Loki Well, the thing is that that's not the goal of the writers this because they want to get him working for the tv a by episode 2 now That again creates problems for me because Loki I don't think it takes a Loki to realize right if I told you J This is your whole future. I'm telling you this because I need you to work with me Person who controls time and space to do things that I need you to do Um instead of what you want to do because I'm showing you that if you do what you want to do It's gonna be bad. Trust me It to me is just like so you're showing me exactly what you think I need to see in order to work for you Like that. Yeah, that it's sus like super sus and Loki's super cunning But then I also think like Mobius I think there's an emotional honesty to him like even from the first episode like when he's going to him like, you know Look at this. You're enjoying this. Like don't don't be around the bush with me. Um, I think he's something Loki shouldn't care about at all but like I think he He's not really had a friend like Mobius before And he doesn't have a lot of friends. Anyway, I actually wanted to bring this up actually when you watched When you were pausing the efap You guys were like, why did he cut to His mum when you said family Um, but I would wage it like that's probably his only true friend is his mum He's very Norman Bates in that sense I see what you mean. Um, the the thing is with Loki though that like he to me He's always had offers, but he stays away from it because he's extremely like he just doesn't trust anybody Mobius is like literally the person I would trust the least. He is the guy He's like the good cop of the tv a that's how I would see him And I think that's how Loki would see him. He'd be like you're full of shit You're clearly like your goal is to get something out of me and they're successful the most part until uh the the supermarket scene It's interesting. I just I guess I guess I really like that That conversation I have an episode two um after they've come back from Pompeii And when Mobius kind of like lays out his beliefs and I just think like I can see why they gravitate towards each other because For him to be so confident in the fact that he is taken care of by this tv organization and he doesn't question You know, what else could I be outside of this life? But this is just my purpose and this is how the way this is the way things are and he's so like He's empowered by the fact that he believes right whereas like Loki the only thing he believes in is himself so I think like the the contrast there is interesting and I like that I think because he's never met anyone like him before he's never had anyone Are they like I mean I think they were like but like I think he he he breaks down Loki in a way that like I don't think anyone like Thor or Frigga ever have before Um, and like I I think it's really genuine like you buy episode five when they call each other friends I'm like, yeah, like I buy that after he tortured him. I don't know I definitely don't buy it at all. Well, I think I think the concern is that I think that the show thinks that it's reached that point that the problem is that I'm kind of still stuck at Episode one with the radical change in his character that I don't feel Is possible. I just don't think it's possible. I think yeah in the first episode we have to totally Reinvent Loki as a character. Yeah, even to give this semblance of working as a plot So I think I think that's the thing right is that if you accept episode one and that this is who Loki is Then yeah, I guess I can see all of the stuff that happens after that following but I don't buy it Especially because this is like 2012 Loki and a couple hours ago. He was like invading new york I would argue. Yeah 2012 Loki is the peak of his evil. Like that is When he's pretty much committed More so than in Thor he's Even in Thor 2 you can tell he's he's coming down. He's like And then Thor Ragnarok he switches almost like his but it still takes ages to get him to do it And it's all lived experiences. It's not him watching movies. Yeah That would be the big difference as well as there is a difference between Are you familiar with south park? Like have you seen a lot of south park? Not an awful lot. No, so there's an episode where the whole gist is that people from the Versions of the kids from the future come back in time and they're like addicted to drugs And the whole point is that it's like A big scheme that was cooked up by like the parents to try and scare their kids out of doing drugs and um That that hole gets unraveled By cartman and he's like, hmm, you know, I have this like I've been doing this business. I've been like I've been working on um Maybe I should like try and improve myself as a person You know exercise and eat better and then this guy says i'm coming from the future This is the day that you turned it all around and like his immediate thing is no, fuck you You're lying. I'm gonna do whatever I want now. Like I'm gonna do it to spite you I don't think it's that whole idea of like If I get told Oh, hey, I'm from the future. These are all the things that you're gonna do I think my immediate instinct would be nah, you're lying. Like I don't trust you I get that but then like I mean, I know you guys don't like this scene But obviously before he sees like so he's getting shown Parts of his life. He doesn't trust them granted Then he sees that they have all those infinity stones He then feels like they're the greatest power in the universe and then he then returns To the slideshow and I so I feel like Yeah, I mean like maybe he could die It's a lie before the infinity stone scene afterwards The question isn't he should trust them the question isn't whether or not he should Think that this is a possibility. It's more so to do with wait a minute I know that they control the future events. I know that they have the power to do whatever they want Why should I believe that this video is true? And then even if he does believe it's true, why would that make him Convert to a completely different character rather than simply doubling down or being angry that his plans don't work And that is possibly these guys fault because they never let him win Yeah, and if he believes that all of this is an illusion that's trying to trick him Why would seeing something convince him because that can be degrees of of how much he trusts this right like I think You know if someone put on a slideshow right now Of like the next two years of my life and it's all a complete shit show And you know like my mum dies. I get killed by big purple space alien at the end, you know like If someone said Yeah, you know, this is definitely gonna happen and then someone else in the room went well, I don't know Maybe it's 50 50. I still think Seeing those images Realized how they are in the show Would would give you cause to to think about who you are as a person though Like but would it with in the context of creatures that can just do whatever they want? How do you mean like So as far as Loki knows these guys they're more powerful than space and time So like laughing at something else So like if they showed me anything I'd be like I think you're showing me whatever you think you need to show me to get me to do something And then they're like we need you to work with us to capture a rogue Loki I'd be like, oh, well, there we go then that's the only reason you show me all of this You're trying to trick me into helping you get me Loki more than anybody else would think that I think that's the big big issue is that Loki's thing is specifically tricking people I feel like especially 2012 Loki his his mindset the whole time would be this is like you're tricking me You're you're trying to screw with me, especially when they're like, yeah, Loki you're destined to lose You're always it's like you literally have lost one of me and you need my help to get him So apparently this is the fucking king Loki But I don't think he necessarily like Trusts the TVA by the end of episode one or thinks maybe they're not gonna still trick him later This is the interesting thing um friend of mine was like no that you're getting the complete wrong read Loki is now committed to he's pissed the TVA and he's gonna destroy them Because he doesn't believe that all this is his future and that he's gonna change and stuff And I was like that sounds really interesting. I hope that's actually a direction. He's tricking them all But then we get um, I can totally see that though because like So he has I get he he wouldn't necessarily trust them maybe But he also like what other choice does he have within the walls of the TVA like he can't use his magic He can't take anyone on That's what I wanted to see I wanted to tell them what they want to hear and then to plan things now Um, unfortunately as we progress through the episodes There's so many pieces of evidence that they've they've committed to he's had the change of character episode one is the moment And that's how people talk about the episode episode one where he's tearing up in the room alone This is him changing. This isn't him seeing it becoming angry and making a plan to subvert it Um, I don't know what you think about this but like Loki Believes human beings and just just average people who aren't even as guardian and to a good degree not himself Are like worthy of subjugation. He is their lord He like they need him to tell them what to do and he'll kill people very casually doesn't care in uh on lamentus When they know she's told him the whole world is going to be destroyed And there's one ship that's trying to get out We might be able to use its power source to get the tempad working or just get onto it in general Uh, he says when they arrive he's like they're going to leave all these people to die It's like the fuck That's something he would Loki would never say that. Yeah, Loki doesn't give a shit And I think to say that well, do you mean like Loki's never capable of that or that he that that specific So I think you're gonna have him care about that You are going to have to work your ass off and it's going to take a lot of time I think they are in Ragnarok that he cares about these guardians But even even then he's doing it under the context of I am your savior You know, you will follow me. I will get you out of here. But that's also his home people his family His is the place that he actually likes. He's a random aliens And he like a very lucky way of being a hero and rag. Yeah, I love it because It's hero hero. He's a good guy. He's concerned about the welfare of other people to the exclusion of his own well-being Yeah, and sure that that's lucky that we know what I like about Ragnarok is the it proved that he is a leader for as God is ill-suited. It's what Thor told him in I think Avengers actually and I was proven to Loki and Ragnarok. He was a shit king But then by the end of Ragnarok, he finds an alternative and it's working And then he feels comfortable at Thor's side. Like I love that the arc is great between them I think it's really solid But uh, Loki the show is rushing it like crazy and I to the point where I've just I've had whiplash now I don't even know who I'm dealing with anymore I'm fair enough because I honestly thought like the progression Three episodes one to six was was fine with his arc. I shared a lot of the same concerns as you going into it. I did think like Back in 2018 when Loki was killed by Thanos thought that was the perfect ending for him. He needed to die Um, he needs to get us come up and I don't need to see that character again And I was I was worried that it was going to be Like a lot of retreading But I just I just really enjoy that idea of Taking that character we already knew and seeing that set path Um, so they've just kind of taken it The concept Because it's very poorly executed Shockingly bad in fact, it's one of the worst character pieces. I've I've ever seen. Well, yeah, we we consider it quite an assassination We're very frustrated. It's it's fucking horrifically bad Right like doesn't we don't it's it's Like it's it is one of the worst has probably ever been done as far as my memory serves me I don't know. I think Natasha's might even be worse. Oh, yeah It's in the time. I think maybe it's more. Yeah, I guess it's because it's so just black and white and blatant. Yeah um Watching him Like tear up and exasperate when Owen Wilson gets pruned like genuinely surprised me I feel like not only would he not have those feelings for him at that point Which obviously I feel like you're gonna be different on that but the Loki wouldn't express That way in front of people he considers to be like arch nemesis sort of thing He would be he would just get furious. He'd be like Loki knows to keep his emotions hidden if he can Because I'm gonna try and run through a couple, right? So there's that there's the the he's so busy professing his love for sylvie that he gets backstabbed Like damn Loki, you know like man. Well, and that's almost like a second Parallel issue is how insanely depowered and stupid he is in this show every fight scene outside of the tv He just doesn't use his powers effectively. Um, he never uses his illusions powers. Yeah, they've never been consistent with Loki Actually really bothers me. No, no, no. He is he is super super super nerfed in this show. He's not using them like he's crap in um Because even in for the dark will he uses his Illusions to fake his own death. It's like, oh, yeah Like retina he says to strange like oh, you think you're some kind of sorcerer and I'm always thinking well Like who are you compared to Dr. Strange? We've seen Dr. Strange do way more powerful things. Oh, you're right Um, he's just like the illusions and that's kind of it. That's why I believe strange outpowers. Loki. I'm fine with that Um, but I'm not fine with Loki being outpowered by random humans Yeah, a bunch of random guards with batons. They shouldn't stand a chance I think they should not have a hope in hell of beating Loki Because remember we don't know like what their actual durability and capabilities are Which I guess like, you know, maybe that's the failing of the show. Maybe they should say that Um, but I must admit like it wasn't something that bothered me too much. There's just people There's just people with sticks We know that they're just people so I think the show would need to give us something else To tell to indicate otherwise, especially when we know that Loki withstood being pummeled to death by Hulk Not too death because he survived it. But like a normal human would be jello after that. Oh, yeah But we know they have like Lots of different powers and capabilities that go well beyond Loki So like I don't think it's I don't think it's out of the room. Possibly to suggest like, you know, I mean like When uh What about the train guards then that's individual people they just seem to be people with batons and some gadgets Well, and you remember like Loki gets captured is because he lets that one chick just like Hit him with a stick Which is already like what the fuck are you doing? You're low. Yeah, like you you recommend right that had he done a simple illusion which he always does That wouldn't have happened and they wouldn't be able to get him. He'd be invisible Yeah, like I was like I've said during our coverage of it like if the tva showed up here in my room I would shoot them with my gun And that would be it and they'd die and they would die And that's done And apparently they've taken on titans vampires and scrolls and I'm like, I don't believe that I don't believe you Y'all are I imagine that they have like infinite different variations of time travel technology That they could use in those situations like and also I kind of like the I kind of like that there is kind of an element of incompetence to the tva You know, like it's kind of like the time lords as much as they are This incredibly powerful force and they have like an infinite amount of infinity stones They also, you know, Loki runs rings around them in the first episode like they're very regimented instruction Yeah, like he teleports around doesn't he and they're like trying to catch him Because he's just one of their gadgets And a situation you shouldn't have been in to begin with Yeah, he just snatches it when you think like shouldn't there be some maybe a biometric lock on it or something that Just automatically anyone who's wearing the neck brace can't operate the technology Like you just it's the tva the shows simultaneously It's it's like the black widows, right? They they have to be two things simultaneously an incredibly deadly powerful force But also insanely incompetent incompetent at everything that they do and are just eatable bio protagonist Like don't tell me you control space and time I can shoot you with a gun and you'll die And I can escape the tva forever Which is reflected again in their their current technology they they print paper They look through folders and files When they should have technology that's further advanced than anything stark has because they They regularly I kind of like that about it like from a design perspective because so I don't curious What you like about it? Is it strictly the aesthetic? No, no, no, no, not at all. No, I just like about like specifically the tva having like paper and these kind of like old kind of Kubrick Douglas Adams looking like rooms and stuff why So again, would that not be the aesthetic you like that? That's how it looks and that's what it is rather than like any functional reason So for example, I love the way rapture looks and if someone was like do you just love the aesthetic? And I'm like no, I think that's how it would look Or in a lot of ways To replace that is a built underwater in the 50s with you know insane amounts of money and manpower That probably wouldn't have existed back then for any single person makes a lot of sense But also has been run down There's so many elements to all of the different rooms that come across to me like oh my god This is not only lived in but it's been aged up and abandoned for x amount of time. I can totally believe it looks so good Meanwhile, I'm just regularly confused by the tva. I'm like why are they using technology that's so backward for like what they do Especially when it's like we need you to you know look into an assignment hear all the files to search through Like why isn't this on a computer and then later in the episodes when they actually need to find something quickly They have a digital filing system and I was like, oh so okay And yeah And yet they print out everything everyone says and store that on files as well And then they have everything to do with asgard is stored in like this one dinky folder compared to Just the dialogue from Loki which fills like 10 folders. It's so confusing I think the aesthetic of the tva kind of reflects that they seem unassuming They don't seem like they would be able to take out someone like Loki and then when they do and they sort of talk about like I guess I guess no no absolutely I'm assuming yeah, there's no real because unless they get the jump on him like they appear and go And he's just like whoa, okay, you got me instead they turn up and they seem to not even know where he is They're like, uh, there's a variant. Oh, it's this guy. Oh, there he is. Yeah It's like damn look you could have killed all of you by now And he could have taken you could have taken your temp ads and that's just that's that because it's not a shock to me Sylvie would have escaped them, but then he was a little yeah, if he was little girl, Loki He would have been able to do that, but you know god of you know Asgardian god Loki He's not he can't do it So would you prefer that they Like the aesthetic was like hyper technological and like super interesting Certainly more of what would impress me is if they got a designer to combine the A sort of feel or atmosphere of this 60s tech, but everything is super advanced and useful So you maintain as much as you can of this goal of making it look that way But everything functionally that has to change to match these hyper advanced aliens that control space and tech Yeah, you just that's what you've got to do Otherwise it's all incongruent as far as i'm concerned The paper could literally be Like a screen and that you're looking at paper and the stuff that's displayed on the paper changes That could be cool. Yeah If they had Records of Loki through time and they're scrolling through and it goes from paper like a stone to paper to bubble And they're just like yeah, this is all of we contain all records of recording things in our records Which is an umbrella record and it has access to everything because that's how high tech Yeah, once we get to the tba levels of masters of the universe and space and time You just indistinguishable from magic is the level of technology that they should essentially have Not They are in like a magical reality. So like I kind of I don't mind The argument would be that um that the technology that they have at the moment is stuff that Would not would it hinder them to use? Yeah, um, well, we see it hinder them to use it an extreme degree We see that that's not like a possibility that happens. They are hindered by it But again, I do kind of like that There is kind of a bit of an incompetence to them as much as they are so powerful Why do you like that there is an incompetence to them because I think like it the way it's kind of riffing on Like organized brutality and like police brutality and that kind of stuff with the tba and like the way they're deliberately meant to look that way um, and it's very authoritarian kind of stylings. I just think it's It's it's kind of like talking it's it's kind of riffing on though You know, like those regimes that actually were incredibly unorganized or were incredibly incompetent like, you know, like anything with like an organized kind of Does that make sense? I think I think I've word So that's all Well, that's all It's metaphorical, but Like these stories are like But these stories are like a conduit for Talking about what the writer and the directors want to talk about Um, I don't care what they want to talk about. It's what they present and what they show. Wouldn't you want to that's that's the rub right though like is I think Like I see where you guys are coming from but if you want to talk about something it has to make sense in your world So I guess you want to know that thematically well, I don't care thematically when you see them When you see them using something Essentially what you've got is that at some point they've made the decision Or maybe not even an active decision, but some point a process has occurred that has led to them using that thing And the natural question that a lot of viewers will ask is You know, what was that process? So at some point did they decide I would like to go to the 1960s and use You know grab some filing cabinets. Yeah, I guess like specifically 1960s america aesthetic to style the tv Yeah, it's kind of like question When they have access to everything Why is that the decision they make and like ideally you should be able to go for the aesthetic You should be able to go for the aesthetic and the theme that you want to strive for While also having the decision that they made be one that you can understand as a viewer When you think about that kind of thing like that's I think we can achieve all three of those things I think that's the that's the big thing is like I really like the aesthetic from a very personal level I think it looks really cool And I get it But we need to we need to do the work to in universe Explain why it is this way And when there's stuff in the universe that makes it seem like If I was running it that I wouldn't be making these decisions Um at that point we start to wonder like hmm Like it feels incongruous with this world that we have like the story that It's like a mismatch between the story that they want to tell versus the story that the universe and the The sequence of events up until this point have actually boxed them into telling And they just didn't care to reconcile that issue And you know if you want to compare it to like take like real life dictatorships or totalitarian regimes or whatever Um, that's really fine. I think I like I understand what I understand what they're going for there, but I don't think they've gone the right way around Striving for that with their tech and their technological limitations because that's essentially going That's essential like seeing a totalitarian regime in real life that has full access to like heavy artillery and and machine guns and All they could all the all the artillery they could possibly want all the ammunition all the weapons and for some reason they've They've armed themselves with bows and arrows and it's never clear why and if it's like well There's incompetence in these sorts of things. We should be like I don't believe that level of incompetence Yeah, it's not quite the same as like a mismanagement of maybe fuel getting to tanks and it leads to Fuckups in that regard versus because it's funny. You mentioned the weapons. Like yeah, they all use batons Like we all expected they would have rifles. Like why are they not rifles? And if you want to if you want to do incompetence like that's there's still got to be um essentially a consistency to the incompetence with the way it's executed within What is the way in which these characters are incompetent and and how have they reached that incompetence? How is that? demonstrate within them how It needs to be essentially congruent with because you know when um when we look at a lot of um I guess writing teams is the perfect example to go for right now. You will see kinds of incompetence in writing teams um And you can generally figure out what things what things do they get right what things do they get wrong and why? at least to an extent Uh, whereas with the tba from what I understand about it going to admit not watch this fucking show I'm just ripping off what you guys are saying. Um, but um From what I understand it seems like they're um, they have a incompetence but one that is not Understood easily by the viewer, which yeah, it does change. I would want to make It's not just like a bureaucratic sort of like logistic top-down kind of you know in incompetence to them It's like at every level of the organization. They're just doing everything stupidly Like I assume if it was understood that this was like an incompetent thing This was a problem within the organization that you might have um, you might have a higher up who's made a decision that they think and that makes sense to them, but then uh, the Uh, the staff who have to deal with that decision who have to like arm themselves with batons or whatever the decision is might get frustrated with that decision and and you would see the different like arms of the industry working Uh out of sync with each other Well, I suppose so but like I just I don't think any of those changes being made would make me enjoy the show any more or less personally I mean, I know you guys feel different but um I don't know. I guess I kind of see where you're coming from in sort of sense of you want these things to have an internal logical consistency and Yeah, if if it doesn't pass that bar then You're kind of not interested You can't sacrifice the logic of the world for an aesthetic or for a thing Is always like I could get into it if it doesn't have logical consistency Maybe I can maybe I can't it really depends on what it is and just how I'm feeling about it And what else the show has to offer, you know, all of those kinds of stuff but I said my my My when it comes to the end of it at the end of the day, there's no harm in having it there I would always rather watch something Um, I would always rather have something be logically internally consistent rather than otherwise because it is There's there's no there's no reason not to have it, you know, oh, I guess Unless you're doing like a parody or a desired effect in the same way I always want the camera to be in focus and if it's not in focus I might be able to enjoy the show But like unless they're deliberately doing something with the camera being out of focus What's going on here? Well, I guess I guess to to put it another way you wouldn't I it's unlikely that you would be upset if it made more sense than it does Like even if it managed to retain the aesthetic like It's unlikely that your enjoyment would be harmed if it was Made more sense It just made too much sense None of us are gonna sit here and tell you that you have to like you have to enjoy it last because it's not Oh, yeah, and I would be I'd be curious To in every episode when he returns to the tv a it's a different era Like it could be the 20s 30s 40s, but he keeps changing around 90s And um and everything reflects that technologically and stuff But no characters acknowledge it and I'd be like I wonder if that'll make you enjoy the show more I I wouldn't it would make less sense to be honest with you But I wonder if that would just make you enjoy it more because it's just like oh, look Ah, they're doing the 40s now. I can totally tell. Oh, that's a it's the noughties I totally recognize this they got flipped phones, you know stuff like that um, what what films and tv shows do you guys like that you feel like Connects to you emotionally, but the internal logic isn't bulletproof But you kind of let it pass because you like the story or the characters that much the nevers Okay, is that the recent thing the HBO? Yeah, that's that's probably a good point from right actually because yeah Because I like the nevers, but there's plenty of us to be able we can pull it apart in lots of different ways A lot of pot issues, but great character work awesome dialogue good aesthetic Yeah, so so that's kind of like the benchmark Like the nevers you feel like it does those things well enough the even though you recognize I like the show, but it's like it's holding inconsistencies. Yeah, like if I mean if Loki were If Loki were exclusively in character and the dialogue was top-notch in Loki I think I'd be able to forgive a lot of the stuff with the tv I'd be like well, that's complete fucking nonsense But uh, I I enjoy watching Loki deal with it Yeah, because like in a sense Sorry, go on. I was gonna say so in a sense Like watching the character be consistent and deal with this insane plot line is still like that like like so That's still a through line of storytelling. Yeah, even if the world is nonsense And you could kind of like it's it's a rock in a stream You know in that I think that's what the MCU kind of needs is that everything is just becoming everything else There's no through line. It's all waving around Yeah, because if they switched from the 20s to the 30s to the 40s the 50s and every time he came back he was like, what the The does any is anyone noticing this and like all the workers are just like, huh? And and he's just like flip phones Jesus those are just comments like and if I watch him stay cunning stay intelligent But at the same time he's commenting on how nonsense everything is I'd probably be able to deal with that much better So Do you guys kind of at least see even if you don't this even if you don't agree with my enjoyment of the show that All those kind of like logical They don't bother me because I enjoy the show that much. So I'm saying like in the same way you do the nevres I'm not a we understand your perspective. We just want to talk about like yeah, I'm not asking you to to change your enjoyment I'm asking if you can see that um, so for example, you're like I really like the aesthetic and I'm like But do you do you agree that it's completely non foundational like it's just there to make you say that that is it I suppose it could be tied closer to as you guys saying like like the The backstory and the creation of the tva and why it looks like that But ultimately like as I said, it doesn't bother me and there's no tie. I don't enjoy the series um Well fair enough if you think that but it doesn't it doesn't change my enjoyment So no, yeah, cool Because I was gonna say like if it if it did and even if there was room to say that it kind of could It could be to do with when it was in it's like well, it was created by kang in was it the 31st century or something? Yeah, so that can't make any sense unless kang just has this fascination with the sixth And it's like why wouldn't you have implemented that at all? Like I guess I don't know how jaffa is about this, but I guess it's kind of a holdover from doctor Who have doctor who does that all the time? There's like something that looks really old and like they've used a different aesthetic Trying like cover the budget of doing like an alien world or an alien spaceship Well, I guess I'm just kind of desensitized that um, I mean there are sometimes where I I can't think of like What do you mean? Do you mean like the the example that's popping into my mind is the is the sick wreck ship, which It's like this big rocky thing with and they all use swords and I would say we never And and I would like I'm fine with that but I think that um, it's integrated into the story pretty well And the technology is just indistinguishable from magic the the sick wreck stuff. We just don't know how any of it works the trap street is We I mean it's that's all like been cobbled together from stuff. They found on earth, right? But it still looks like an old kind of like victorian street, whatever, doesn't it? It is it's a street in the middle of london Right, but is it supposed to be the like do you think it's weird they haven't updated it at all? Is that I don't see whether we'll be in the same in the same way I think I mean I think there's a conversation to be had about whether or not it's internally consistent, but I think that um There is a lot of there's a lot of potential therefore there to be a good reason for it um I'm sure that there are examples in dr. Who have they're just being no reason for the aesthetic and like um Not in the spring to mind right now, but like yeah, there's there's loads of stuff where the aesthetic doesn't match What you know, it really doesn't match the aesthetic in dr. Who is um Whenever a character regenerates and they've got full makeup and full hairstyles in I'm like what the fuck is that about? Yeah, David Tennant comes in with his hair gelled and honestly And I don't I don't like that as well. I would prefer it if they essentially like You know, they don't regenerate with makeup on or their hairstyles um It seems strange to me I would I guess that's uh That's a kind of a good example right of like the the thing in universe It's like why would that be the case and the answer is like oh wouldn't be the case and then you look at that It's like oh, that's like a that's a problem, right? But but then you'd be thinking. Yeah, it's not like it's not really consequential And like dr. Who it doesn't really impact the story at all. It's never impacted the story in dr. Who That's kind of what i'm getting at Also, it's not really like an aesthetic that I like, you know, I don't I don't enjoy I don't like I don't get more enjoyment out of it if it was something that I thought looked really cool Then I guess I would understand I would understand it as a a trade-off. I suppose Yeah, that's kind of uh, I would wish there was a justification That's kind of what i'm Getting at there is it's the whole thing of like you can identify that that's a problem It's not really a big one But because it's not it doesn't really affect the plot But like in universe it's kind of Fluent be a bit but like You know if that if that's like a preference and that's cool And I don't think that there's an issue with like not being able to or sort of recognizing that there's like potentially an issue there But still enjoying it. That's that's not really like yeah And and so on a more grand scale. It's like so with the tva's aesthetic It's like it is a really cool aesthetic and I get if if somebody likes the aesthetic Um, and there's there's really nothing that can like be said to make somebody not like it If it's something that they enjoyed it would just be trying to sort of separate That enjoyment of it from Thinking about how much sense it makes in this universe Yeah If we're all on the same page that there is actually nothing to support why they are in this aesthetic Like that's totally first the end of the conversation then for me. I'm just like, oh, yeah, okay If you agree, but like well, I still like it. I'd be like, yeah, that's fine. I kind of like it too I yeah, I mean, I guess there could be a stronger reason but Again, I think like a diet of dr. Who for years where like a lot of the logical consistency is bullshit Like 90% of it. I just think, you know, like I'm in something like low g You're gonna trigger j There's plenty of problems, but there's a lot of stuff that's that's justified as well Like as in a lot of it is the doctor just sort of like explaining things away like, you know when there's like, um When cooper eve miles, she's in dr. Who before right? Oh, yeah, like using actors. Yeah. Yeah, and like, you know, there's no there's no logical reason for that Except for the doctor saying, oh, it's genetic multiplicity, right? And then like you're just expected Like you get no textures that you just like go, okay The doctor said some bullshit whatever like they just want to move along Because it's not ultimately that interesting why they recast eve miles. They recast eve miles because she's an actor It doesn't affect the the story. You know, it's just like Here's a thing that I don't know if the if the tv a using 60s technology affects the story at all It does I again, I haven't seen this show So, um Just a quick rundown, right? So the way that they file everything is incredibly and like like Inefficient and it's gonna cause them just general like i'm surprised that they even have a limit on their warehouse or whatever for That too, then there's their technology is incredible and simultaneously like cavemanish Like they have the ability to hit you as something that slows you down in time But nothing else they have the ability to zap you into future like to erase you and they're attached to sticks What are you doing? This causes them problems like like a little girl defeats them because of this so like stuff like in um In dr. Who where you've got the sick rex for example, which is like a A space faring alien race and each of their soldiers carries a sword Like we never see what they actually do in battle. We don't know if that is like You know, if that is the weapon that if they would charge like Um, if like that's fine But the point where you that if you then saw an army of them land and then charge like a human military force With their swords and they all get like shot down you'd be thinking Okay, why why is that them? Why are they using swords? You mean like so swords the swords could be ceremonial. They could be a part of culture Like we don't know as in we see every yeah, and as in uh, even in the episode as one of the swords gets a ceremonial use Like they they talk about like ritual combat with a sword So you're like, maybe, you know, the soldiers have There's there's plenty of room for you to think maybe the soldiers each carry one for that reason or maybe their fucking Swords with like some technology in them that means they have like they do blasts or something I don't know, you know There's your mind is free to run wild with just what you see on screen because ultimately it's a background detail That doesn't actively contradict anything And and and if you're wondering like like what is what is going on here? Like what's the obsession with figuring this stuff out? It's like we we look to try and celebrate the people who do work to justify all of this stuff from the ground up in In ways that are not even overt. They just have it casual dialogue or uh, you know environmental storytelling for why these things are the way they are versus people who go 60s Aesthetic would be really cool and I just want it and so there it is and it's like I just think that is That's why they have it I appreciate that you that you think about these things and that like you want to discuss these kind of like finer points And I do think it's interesting and like, you know, I think there's a level of it to you know To it that you're right like why don't they just have rifles? I totally get that But it doesn't impact the plot Like it should it yeah, but it but You know as I say, I mean, I sound like a broken record here, but like it really doesn't change how I feel about like Don't ever feel like you have to concede your feelings are now different at any point I'm literally just asking you if you see the same thing I do when I say something like, um I I can't Well, I think so, yeah Because I'm gonna say the next thing I wouldn't mind talking to you about and I do actually want to get your More so your feelings on this But how do you feel about the MCU up to now has been the result of one man choosing? Which one of infinite trillions of choices everyone could make and he puts it into one timeline How do you how do you feel about that? What does it what does that mean to you? Um When you say field you mean like in terms of like Everything I've watched up to this point Well, my argument wouldn't be that that doesn't make sense. Um That's like I don't think I could say that I think the with what they've told me I'd have to just concede. All right. That's apparently how it works now, but How does that make you feel about? Well the events of the MCU so far I think it takes away from like any of the emotionality that I remember across the last 10 years um, I think it's just kind of like The way I see it is he's not He's not he's not like taking a magic wand on every single scene We've seen previously and forcing people to do certain things. He's Just clipped the other branches so that this timeline we're watching That's right. He's still going great. Oh, no me What did you miss? He's the magic wand is when he cut out for me Okay, so yes, I like I don't see it as He's physically going in and directing these events. I see it as like, you know how there's all these different timelines that we later see I just saw it as like he's clipped all the branches so that this specific timeline He's chosen is the one we're going on. We don't need to worry about necessarily like what people are doing We just need to make sure that it doesn't branch out It's about clipping that same thing. Well, yeah, so if I could just reframe that right so if I'm Choosing one sacred timeline and that means that Fringy has to walk into his house grab his coat walk out and go to the store That means Fringy cannot go or do anything else And if ever he decided to do any of those other things I clip him And from what we understand with the multiverse being accessed and there's trillions and trillions and trillions of options That means everybody's doing everything conceivably possible and he decides which thing he wants to happen Yeah, if you stray from that you get murdered literally being like being late for work and get you murdered Yeah, I don't see it as like he's Actively trying to cultivate events. I see it more as like like this the spring example, you know He could go get a pint of milk today. He could go get some coffee And the timeline we're on is the coffee one and he ends up going get get the milk He doesn't have free will Where all of the versions of him that shows milk they get murdered And their universe gets murdered. Yeah, like I I get what you you're saying like he just lets springy do whatever he wants until He goes off a plot line, but the thing is there's a billion options to go off the plot line at any point and Every time he does it gets snipped And so it's like it's like a what did we end up calling it? It was like it was post determined like Yeah, like it was because it's a matter of every single thing they could do happens and then just snip away all of them except one Well, is it is it clear that it's like every how many how many? Versions of the timeline is it Suggested well if I can get you Yeah, I'll get you a little image Yeah, infinite. Oh, that's a lot of clipping actually wait. Can you get the image for me? I don't have episode six, unfortunately All right, all right, hold on. I need to Hold on this might take me a little bit It's like there is this big old light Line that represents the sacred timeline and the second the kang stops controlling it It splits and splits and splits and splits and splits and splits was just splitting infinitely Right, um, I mean the point is he prevented that The number of people in like what i'm thinking of is like number of people in the fucking universe as a whole Yeah, um, you know seeing a lot of splits. That's like, you know, maybe One decision per like that that's just a matter of the inability to present it because there's a thing if you had a line And then from a split second forward, there's no more pruning the timeline. It would just explode into a giant bit of light Yeah, so they show it as the line splitting splitting splits And I actually complimented them they put a they put lots of little lines in there They they really did I think if ring can get the image at one point you'll see it, but um Uh, it's the best they could do without it being inconceivable. Like rags said Uh Do you feel like it kind of that decision undercuts like the previous moves that you enjoy please This is what this is why I was appealing to emotion. I um, I hate it I hate that they did this it fucks with my perception of the mcu completely when I watch iron man make the decisions He makes it's not because kang stopped him from making any other decision Oh, it's funny you say this or he would have been murdered You know the writers of endgame they actually were quizzed about like Oh, what do you think about like alternate realities and all these kind of things like secret wars and they actually said like We don't like it because like it kind of takes away the autonomy that you know If Tony's Tony's start can do one thing and there's like a million different other versions of him that have done Like the opposite decision then like why are we following this one? How do you get that? Microsoft paint blocks disney plus you can't take screenshots. Oh just google it probably, right? Yeah No obs I think doesn't work either for that Really disney plus and netflix they have this thing built in where they go black if you turn on any recording software Um, not for me Oh Interesting There's a I think I remember having to change my obs settings to get it to record netflix But I do I can record netflix. That's how I've done Several of my reviews. All right jay There you go see all the little all those things supposed to represent like lines moving all over the place and everywhere And I do think in fairness to them. That's the best way you could probably show it without it being just bullshit Yeah Yeah, yeah It's just kind of the show it just fucking ruins everything So in terms of the whole I guess the free will thing the the interpretation that I think Follows the most based on what the show tells us is basically that Like if let's imagine I'm just I woke up I brushed my teeth Um, and then I go get some cereal and I got two choices And I pick one and nothing happens and it's like, oh cool. And then I go watch tv I get the remote and I press one button. I press the button I'm like, hmm. Oh, it's just sort of want to keep checking and then I check and then suddenly I get melted it's like I had choices But like if I made the wrong choice, I would have died So I don't really have I based on what Kang said. So it's like it's not If that's not like free will to me at least in terms of a a sort of um Almost like a a practical way of looking at it in the sense that I had a choice And I exercised my ability to choose but only in so far as allowed It's perfectly represented by the way the show starts. Loki has the space stone thrown in front of him He picks it up and teleports out to rescue himself. It's perfectly in character. And then they have to Yeah, they have to delete him because he's done the wrong thing Yeah, what else was he what else would he have done exactly? Well, yeah, that's the problem But and of course what gets super awkward is that the Avengers were meant to do what everything that they did But their plan only works like going back to the 1970s to get the tesseract if they screwed up and Loki got it and got away Yeah, uh, correct. So to to streamline that out Loki doing the thing he wasn't supposed to do makes it so that Tony and Steve had to go back to the 70s Therefore that should be out of timeline as well because if you put Loki back that means they don't go back to the 70s Honestly, I think that's a really good point. I hadn't thought of that. Like you're right. Like Yeah, that does follow the chain of events like that needs to happen Um the time travel in this show is it's among the most nonsensical I've ever seen and I've seen anything you've seen this morning tomorrow war One of the worst. I mean they clearly didn't I I would I would be more charitable to say that they didn't give a shit That is that they actually really tried and this is what they ended up doing But would you say your favorite time travel movie is also the same one with the most logical consistency? Um No, that would be favorite not best, but I would I don't I don't know what my favorite time travel movie is. Well, if I can answer that my favorite is probably I'm not sure My favorite is probably back to the future, but best is probably primer if I had to like gun to my head answering those questions but like I think that's interesting the The kind of distinction between the two Um, because I would also say back to the future. I think it's the best time travel movie personally Um, but I think it's like bulletproof in its no, I don't think so either Um, yeah, where's primer is and I actually think prime is a good film But ultimately you don't mean like what one do I watch right now back to the future every time? Oh, absolutely. Um Because it's about thinking about what it what are the other elements of the film that are really good Like what in terms of like the future the character is really great. So There's that balancing against the more flimpy time travel stuff Yeah, what we end up talking about um when it comes to consistency Is that like if you nail it but you have like no variables And so it's a man in a room sitting down. That's the whole film So it's gonna be hard for you to fuck that up. Um, but at the same time with no multipliers no variables And I'm including stuff literally like there are multiple rooms. There are more people all the way up to it's a complete news fantasy sci-fi world with all kinds of powers Multiverse travel time travel these are major variables And what I mean is the variable makes it a lot more interesting to watch for the average viewer But now it makes it hell of a lot harder to keep consistent Like that's the trade-off and of course there's lots of things that sit in a perfect sort of balance And I'm assuming you feel like they've nailed it in Loki where yeah It doesn't make a lot of sense in a lot of ways, but it's I'm really engaged by the sort of stuff that they're showing Um, well, I was just gonna say like I think it's really interesting what you say about like There's less variables like kind of in a in a more stripped-down idea But the more you add like these things to it it gets harder and harder to keep it consistent I think that's kind of why You know sadly a lot of these franchises that we love like they're just destined to die aren't they because They're they're only gonna add They're only gonna add more and more and more like law or like new cannons or like different ideas Well, um, no, they could stop they could stop but they won't and it's like keep on going and going and going Like what does a hundred years of Star Wars look like? No, of course Like the Star Wars or my Star Wars or one of kid in 1977 one of if not my favorite episode of Doctor Who is midnight and that's uh number what like Fucking 500 and something like episodes or I I mean like in the grand scheme of all Doctor Who episodes with that's really far down the line And um, you could be like well in fairness. They're just on a train It's like well, they are on a train in an alien planet where if you open the windows you burn to death Like there is still the sci-fi element and it's still all the history the doctor matters to that scene I We tend to say I don't know if we've come across something where we're like If you make another story on top of what you have it's impossible for it to be any good We usually try and say that there's a chance to repair There's always a chance to repair to keep something going and Doctor Who I think is a living example of an attempt to keep trying to bring it back to keep Repairing when older stuff has managed to sort of crash me been a little bit um Like like the only way it could come back like for example of 2005 the Robago RTD He just completely forgot about the doctor saying he was half human in the last like live live action project He was in and I think that was absolutely the right decision because if you don't ignore like some of the crappier parts And you try and keep like consistently adding to this law like the third room we go with all franchises They're just gonna like cannibalize themselves If um if someone in let's say Mandalorian season one establishes that stormtroopers can't shoot Like they just kind of like they can shoot but they can't aim they're terrible Lol and that explains why they've been missing before and then I come in as the new writer and I'm like Fuck that they can shoot and you know what they can aim really well Actually, it's just that the past stormtroopers have been really incompetent That's that's my canon as far as I'm concerned. I'm not saying that all stormtroopers can't aim We're ruining their threatening factor like we cannot have this happen in the same way that if I came in to do episode nine They're like, why can't we use the hyperspace kamikaze? I'm like that was bullshit That's not something we can do because it makes it so we gotta have space pals ever again And of course JJ had the same problem It's like do you commit to that being an actual viable thing or do you say? Oh, it's one in a million as one of the ways like if you have to choose between two continuities Like is it this or is it that so in doctor who for example Yeah, well, so this is the thing if I was to have to make the next mcu story following kang I would probably try and repair it so that he was never doing the sacred timeline thing and that's all bullshit And he was lying all of it was a lie Yeah, that's the best thing you could do with Loki. Loki woke up. It was all a horrible dream Because I this thing we need to erase how much damage this has done to everything else in a sense And that's kind of how I see a lot of Properties when you've gone so far and you've had so many writers in and some that just didn't care And they were like, no, this is how it works now. You know timeless child For example, it's just like a new writer might be like, yeah, actually no That was a completely different person and the doctor only has Through an accident got the memories of being that person when they're not them And maybe need to be addressed or would you be happy with like the rtd method of we're just not going to mention it Um, I would probably address it. I think I think it I think it takes more balls to address it and be like, you know what? This is a mistake of our past and and yeah, the fans I think will really appreciate it if you acknowledge it as well And you're like, this is something that happened and this is how what it actually meant And then do you not think there's kind of like a whiff of desperation in something like rise of skywalker When that character's like, you know that hold on move, you know, I could see why it's it's all really bullshit It doesn't really make sense does it? Um, what do you mean like a whiff of desperation? I'm not I don't quite understand I mean with uh, sorry, uh, let me explain There's a there's a whiff of desperation Coming off the film screen from the people that made it to me when they say things like that because it's almost like Yeah, they're really desperately they know that people didn't like that scene from the previous movie and now they're like Oh, please like this explanation. We've given like please like I know what you mean, right? I don't think it comes across as desperation more like we we have to account for this thing that this asshole did last movie So like desperation, it's like you don't want to be the writers don't want to be in the situation where they have to write this dialogue And it's very conspicuous that that's the case and I would argue that they didn't do either of the options of ignoring it or fixing it They went with a weird third option where they acknowledge it and just say nah, it's too hard lol Yeah, you didn't yeah. Yeah, we didn't have that's not fixing it because what we saw with holdo If you tell me that she knew that was a one in a million that was an insanely stupid choice There's no way she would have done it That's good No, yeah an explanation like the one that they gave in the rise of skywalker It doesn't just try and offer an explanation as to why we can't do that all the time it also whether you like it or not It's irrelevant, but it it retroactively affects her character because it gives us information on the decision that she made So the kind of fixes that were the kind of fixes that bad writers have to come up with To fix the problems made by other bad writers can make things worse Like it could just yeah, it just it just keeps gathering like a snowball sometimes and it makes things worse and worse What you're saying I want to take back to uh matt what you were saying with like As the friend of the franchise is just doomed because of this but ultimately You can still tell the story of just a chair sitting in a room in the star wars universe Yeah, the stuff that's you know There's not going to be you don't always have um not every scene is going to be impacted by every piece of law, you know um There's some stuff that can You know, like if one right establishes chairs exist in this universe, but you know, whatever the hold them over destroyed space battles It didn't destroy Han Solo and gredo having a standoff or anything I think like the longer these sorry No, go ahead I was just gonna say I think the longer these franchises go on it's like if you think of it as like a graph It's just going up and up and up like the longer we spend with these and the more years go on the more little like You know, for example, you could do a really good story about a chair in star wars universe Sure, but the more time goes on surely the chances that some writer added some little caveat to that chair goes up Yeah, until you know totally true. Um And there's the thing i'm i'm a big advocate for ending stories Hot take I think stories should have endings stories can end I I I definitely agree with the observation of like the longer something goes on Effectively the more chance you have to screw something up. I think I think that any sequel to a story runs the risk causing issues for Either what came before or what came after and of course it's all it's all contextual Right. So like for instance with our Falcon and Wester soldier, which I don't really like at all A lot of the issues with that story are relegated to like a specific part of the mcu Mainly obtained more. Yeah Mainly one part of earth not the mystical part. Yeah, it's um hyper condensed But like low key because it's about time and space. It's hard not to separate the issues from everything Yeah, and it's retroactive To the beginning of all space and time like it ruins it can't it ruins everything that happened before this show But at the same time you like you could look at it and say it ruins it but also I think there's something interesting in looking at all these Godly characters who you thought had so much conviction across all these movies and sort of give them I think there's kind of like something existential in that. No, like Tony Stark Didn't know what the fuck he was doing like there are powers Well beyond any of these characters So that sounds awful. Go ahead, but I guess there is a I was I was gonna say that I was gonna say that that is like an idea that could be interesting for sure. I think um I think there's a point we need to do a balancing act in terms of like What what you value more in terms of our in terms of the story It's like is it worth exploring this concept if it means potentially undermining everything that we've seen before Yeah, you are not talented enough at that price about maybe like weighing up our goals Like what are we going to achieve by doing that versus? What can we continue to achieve with what we already have if you get what I mean? and and I would say um go ahead a power leveling like that so like Being like low key the gods and everyone they're nothing compared to the tva um I don't I don't know if we should reach caps like that because like the tva have kind of just made it now So that nothing could possibly beat them like who's going to be coming above there They control time and space and the progress of reality meanwhile When you have something like the boss of 2012 avengers that our team had to work hard to defeat someone who's been a thorn in the side of our characters for a Long time the opening of the next boss Shows him literally executing that villain like to me. That's an amazing power creep. That's just like holy shit He just tossed away the guy has caused so much trouble for everybody. This guy means business compared to we control reality So we kind of outclass you it's like yeah I guess you do it feels like this all this new stuff Is an interloper in an established universe And they don't care about things like power creep. They don't care about things like stakes They're just they're just a leech on something else Well, I I completely agree It feels like someone came in and did whatever the fuck they wanted because they were like you got me here mcu And now I can do my idea. It's like look how much damage you're doing though It's like it's like kids playing like imagination or something. Oh, yeah Well, I've got invincibility and then the next writer. I mean main kid comes along and said, oh, yeah I've got mega invincibility like no, uh, well my space faction. They control all space and time Oh, yeah Well, my guy is a magical wizard in a castle and he controls that organization that controls a castle He has a castle Yeah, so it's just like like what the fuck's going on like what are the stakes anymore? What it's all nonsense power creep anything is all right So take take the scene right in the first episode where he sees all the infinity stones on the uh inside the desk, right? so Infinity the infinity war saga I guess spent an incredible amount of time Building up how important and powerful these stones were and a lot of people died and sacrificed themselves and there was a lot of Struggle and emotional work and character payoffs and build ups and all that sort of thing to get these stones And they just sort of made a joke of it And so it makes me wonder now my mindset is it doesn't matter what they show me anymore It'll just be used as a joke for something else later All right, it's like a joke. I think it's kind of like all of this is an accessory Well, they do make a joke about it. I think I think it's all just an accessory for something else I think I think because i'm inclined to agree more with rags is take that it was played off a bit as Like a joke, but the best faith interpretation for them that I could give is that Again, would be leaning into like on a grand scale. Do you see how meaningless a lot of it is? But again, gotta be really careful with that when it comes to storytelling because people do get invested in these stories and it's Yeah, man, you're like Meaningless When I hear about that, I think of like this it feels like this sort of existential like almost Lovecraftian revelation to me of Like I could see it as a really really well done moment of You people were tiny you were fighting over five of these or six or whatever the number was While I think you could write that well, I would I would never Probably I think it's a horrible fit I think we're scratching the tip of the iceberg with like that kind of scene I think you're gonna get so much more of that in the next 10 years Like, you know, I mean like they keep diving into the cosmic side of it Where there's like already Every shitty writer thinks that they're fucking amazing and everyone I think that's the concern is that infinity war and endgame the stakes were the whole of the cosmos and so And then we follow that it feels like the universe follow up such a significant Yeah, the whole of existence it feels very weird to me To follow that up by going the catalyst for that event like we have them as paper weights It feels like a really I don't know why you would do that Like now the next time you try and build something up and spend a decade working towards a payoff The next show can just say Lol, fuck that We're just gonna use this as an accessory to power up my faction that I just created And you know what it doesn't even make sense you wouldn't take the stones back to be put in a desk You would just nuke them with the whole timeline It doesn't even make sense to take back variants to ask if they're guilty or not. You just nuke them That's the thing as well What we later learn is that there are actually duplicates of things just in the same timeline because like everything gets sense Like the things that get deleted don't get deleted. They get sent to the end of time So they're not really deleted that like be murdered by a Cloud master that's actually not a big deal Can I bring up my um, I've got a favorable comparison in mind and I want to because again not seen this I don't know how any of this is executed. Um to me, um The idea of going somewhere like Where this is the faction that controls time and reality um, and they've got you know countless of these things that um That the that our entire universe has revolved around but the cosmos and reality as a whole is so much larger than just the scope of what we can see and what we Um, we know within our sphere Uh, even if we think our sphere is huge Um, it reminds me of the scene from lost ark where they put the ark in a box and then put it in a warehouse full of These countless boxes and it's unclear what's in any of them. Yeah That's I think I mean, I would do we all like that scene here? Yes. Yeah. Yeah, that's I think that is um The desired uh, essentially impact of a scene where you see this faction that's just got loads of infinity stones lying around That's what I would want to get out of a scene like this. Um This is kind of goes back to the scale and power creep issue. Um Where like that was if you take the ark of the covenant thing that was Indiana Jones and some nazis and some people and it was it was relatively small scale and you understood kind of everything Which it makes it a lot easier to like, oh, okay So, you know, where is this place and what are these things and it is like these are god forbid mystery boxes um And you don't really learn what they are and well, they said later on but um Like we're getting into cosmic and space and time levels and just the sheer change in scale is is difficult to Escape and it really kind of colors everything about it I I will go on record of saying I like That being lots of infinity stones in the tva I do not For this for the reasons I feel I just outlined maybe I didn't but I think I think the thing with the warehouse though, it doesn't make the ark of the covenant any less powerful By being among many powerful items But it's no longer like unique So in the same way, they're worthless in the in the desk in the tva. They don't do anything I think Because they are Well, but the ark of the covenant is not useless the people who organize that warehouse I mean, I'm not I'm not trying to draw It's there direct. I'm not trying to say there Well, yeah, no, we're trying to figure out why one works and why one doesn't right? I understand the value there It's not quote-unquote insulting to the ark of the covenant for it to be there Like it's being locked up and put away because it is the ark of the covenant Yeah, I think it needs to be put away. It would be like if indiana jones five He breaks into like this super secret government facility and he sees his box With the ark of the covenant he recognized it and then it zooms out and there's 17 of them all the same It's like, yeah, we've got loads of arcs of covenants. I use it as my couch Yeah That to me would be like humiliating the first movie I think there's lots of That depends on I that depends on how they take it like they're being 17 of them They're being Sure that you could do that well and you could do that badly. I am going to assume just for just for ease of this conversation that they did The infinity stones shit badly because I still do think that you can have Yeah, there are loads of them that they're common to us Because we get them from lots of different timelines I think I I I definitely like understand where you're coming from. I think The issue is when I see like three soul stones in a in a drawer and they're like, yeah, you know We use these as paper weights. It's like I'm thinking man like blackboard or died for one of these And like yeah, you use these as paper weights man, like I would you be happier if we sort of got that scene and then obviously earlier you guys were saying like How do they be all these super powerful characters and you kind of like find out But because from so many different variant timelines, they've got all these infinity stones Like they're basically Powering their whole ground operation with them. Would that sort of sit better with you? That could help I think I would still have concerns about how it all makes sense like how it all fits in I mean, I've never even understood a limit on Kang's power I have no idea how he works or what he's got at his fingertips And when you have access to infinite universes that you can control at your fingertips Like what exactly is your resource limit? Yeah, because like when you are essentially when you are essentially introducing god, like, you know A god into the universe that you've created I feel like You almost want infinite power creep. You want something existential that That if your you know struggles that you've been if you've been showing essentially the struggles of the mortal people previously You want if you're going to demonstrate this is a god You're going to want all of those struggles to be so far beneath them that they don't care about them, you know or or that um You know, what is incredibly valuable to the to the mortal people would be You know, just some another thing to a god who has access to not just all of time in reality But infinite versions of time in reality there is going to be It makes I guess from a well-building perspective that is something that makes sense that it is there because um To a faction like the tva They're not going to find value in something that when they can get literally infinite copies of any resource Which is why they shouldn't even be there Yeah, i'm happy to say that To be handled much more carefully I was yeah, I mean handled in a way that you have to handle it so carefully I'm just like don't even try don't do this like you need to understand that you are going into that You need to understand that you are writing A faction with what is in essence infinite to power I feel like writers who want to do that are almost like just in love with the idea of what it wants to be and they just have no There's no idea of just how careful they have to be with that sort of writing and what could do today I think that's what you do with like um existential and like Lovecraftian plots, right, which I don't think Uh fits neatly into the MCU. I don't think you can do. Yeah Something like that in the MCU without it's astonishing work to justify thematically within the rest of the universe It's not even just that that's what they are It's also that they just do not operate as that in the episodes we see them Like I don't believe for a second that this this selection of people with batons are also Literally in control of reality. It's like no Yeah, because like surely if they have in like if they have access to infinite infinity zones That would be their go-to weapon, right? Absolutely. Yeah, and they work like holes. They work where they go Um, they can they can literally use them if they want to that's something that Loki doesn't take advantage of as well Well, yeah, I was gonna say there's so many examples of Loki and you know, um, I don't I don't want to spend um too much longer on the infinity zones things because like I don't want to take up too. I don't know how much longer will have you uh, Matt Obviously, I'm gonna try and get through them at least a couple more topics around for a bit longer. Yeah, uh So what would what I would hope that we're we're getting to with with Loki is that like We could obviously talk about it a bit longer for any of these subjects If you felt we haven't really covered them But like if I'm at the point where I think that the main character has been assassinated But the organization that's involved is completely nonsensical Though all the people in it keep making really stupid decisions to get things to happen And the same for Loki that the world building is damaged like the MCU significantly Um, I'm starting to run out of things that I like I can talk about alligator Loki and rigiddy grant Loki um for a while probably I really really like both of them. Um, but Most so like 95 percent of the show is then like not only I think broken but a lot of it pisses me off and so, um I would be curious at that point like what am I supposed to draw out of it? Um And if say for example, you said well, don't you enjoy the aesthetic for example? I might say yes, but I would again just be like but it is nonsensical And I'd be curious like what do you think was well built rather than something you simply Appreciate like for the look like what do you think when you're watching was like, oh man, that was really well Crafted the way that they did that When you say built crafted like do you mean like could be like a story moment a character moment something Something that you would possibly draw the difference between someone going. I want this thing here There it is versus I want this thing here. How do I build everything to make this event happen? In a way that it follows cause and effects rather than simply me plopping it there I'm trying to understand your question So for for for example, like you might have wondered wait, you know that a lyre thing like how did yeah Where did a lyreth come from and how does uh can control him can just says I control him? Oh, okay Are you asking me like does that bother me? No, I'm asking is there something in Loki's a show that makes you go like man I thought it was so good. So to give you an example I think that uh, Tony's decisions throughout all the mcu except like for a few moments Like uh, all are informed by watching the prior films Like you can understand him perfectly in civil war if you watch all of the films he's been in prior Yeah, um, if you only watch iron man, and then you watch civil war. I think you'd think he's been assassinated So like uh the progression changes how things will have to go if someone came in to write iron man for civil war And was like no he hates the government. He's just going to blast away and steve, you know steve's a soldier boy He'll listen to the government So that's that's how this story should go We'd be like you guys i've been paying attention to any of the writing you've been doing Um, and I feel that that's how they've done a lot in loki especially with loki's character So if I was to compliment for example like a sense of cause and effect I would try and pick something that uh followed along from something we've seen before And so to give you an example I think that's kind of the series type to the mcu like a previous mcu Well, uh, it could be that but it also could be safe example You'd like something in episode four because of the way they set it up in episode one and two or something Oh, okay. Um, what? I guess earlier we were speaking about like Whether loki has the potential to be good whether he had that potential I really like that line from mobius where he says that he's the scared little boy out in the cold And he kind of feels sorry for him And the way he reacts to that because I think that That is a is a perfect trick shot to why episode five They become friends because like I think loki like, you know Like when he's fighting the avengers and he's fighting something like Tony Stark He feels belittled by him as much as he is confronting him Whereas I feel like mobius kind of takes the ego out of the situation, you know, he's not trying to like He's not ultimately trying to belittle loki Do you know what I mean? Like he he sees him as someone that he pities and someone that he could see going down A different path So I think that kind of It all it takes for me is like one well-placed line. Do you know what I mean? I don't think it's always necessarily the quantity of the time you have of the characters That line there. I feel like, you know, after they're reunited and when Uh, mobius finally believes him and believes like, you know, the the real truth of the tba Like when they hug each other and say they're friends. I feel like that was A good payoff for what we saw earlier Obviously a good answer Um, well, I don't worry about like whether or not your answers are any good Because like obviously my take on that is I get frustrated with How easy it was for loki to just connect to mobius when He's got no reason to trust that he's even Like a rational agent of his own rather like at this point We haven't even confirmed whether or not he's just a puppet And then he's of course the guy who forces him to be in a ball kicking simulator for extended periods And after that, they're like, we are good friends and then he gets really sad when he dies I'm barely being able to follow this like I'm almost frustrated that loki isn't More angry or he's not taking different actions. So like it is really hard for me to engage with stuff like that Meanwhile watching, um, you know thaw and avengers say like, um, loki, we have to shut it down We have to stop it and he's like, it's too late. It's too late Like he puts his head down a little bit and he goes, no, it's not and we can work together We can stop this Then loki like considers then he pulls the knife out and stabs him to me It's like, oh, I could talk for a while about why exactly that that's exactly what I thought would happen um, but do you not think that kind of That summation of loki that he is ultimately a scared little boy. He's not this god that he thinks he is Do you not feel like that's Summised in that avengers moment I think that to say that loki is more of a scared little boy who has trouble like figuring out what exactly he wants from the world is A dramatic oversimplification and that this is a man who's lived for more than a thousand years And he's incredibly intelligent the only thing about him. Do you see what I'm saying? I don't think that's I that's like final point of I don't know if um, I think he's certainly a factor Look, you'd probably consider that him being talked down to and that's yeah, that's that's kind of where I was going with that like, I mean, are we are we accepting the distinction between uh, 2012 loki and loki loki at this point where if we if we accept the change then this follows I don't know if we accept that loki was transformed into a totally different person That's yeah, that's what my answer was gonna be It's consistent with it's consistent with the show that is loki, but not with The place they took it. Yeah, which might be the the key to all of this is that like every decision I watched Him yeah every decision I watch him making everything I see him say I feel so all the way to episode five when she says, you know loki You can you can get out of here and he goes if you go I go I was like so loki wouldn't say that but I guess this new loki might say that But like redemptive arcs in this kind of big or practical fiction They're always kind of messy like, you know, you were saying earlier. He kills 80 people in two days So, um, I don't know if this answers your question quickly, but like yeah, I wouldn't It's not the action. I have a problem in that scene. It's literally the dialogue I don't believe loki would ever say something like that I think that if he was gonna do the good thing like in ragnarok It's always going to be with like a sly attitude like yeah, okay I'm helping you but really I'm having some fun kicking ass here too, and I'm ordering people to do stuff Yeah, yeah Selfless or altruistic. There's always an element of like I don't know that loki can ever not be more than an antihero Unless we spend a lot of time Yeah, he has to go on like an iron man level arc where it's he's a protagonist for like three movies And we get to really chip away instead of sitting in a room watching a couple of clips Like that to me insults a character writing as a whole I also think like We've not just this but like any form of media where it's typically like a villain character That's now getting their own spin-off or like now they're the protagonist They always get retconned a little bit like I wouldn't argue that eddie brock in venom Is eddie brock really do you know? I mean, it's like that's on the character. That's a different That's a different continuity So yeah, but like but like even something like say Uh, like fast and furious right sure jason stay from shore He fucking killed Han and then in the next one, you know We get all this added detail about him that you know, he like Saved his boys like in the army or whatever like like you but you get more texture to him to sort of go Oh, he's not such a bad guy and then the next movie down there that you killed Han Well, that's this one of those is explaining why a character did something after the fact and the other is completely changing the character in a you know in a sequence of events Yeah, like um, like it's a soft retcon of shore like he like you look at I mean I don't know if you guys enjoy those movies for the ironic fun They are but like you look at something like furious seven And he's the winter soldier the kept the short character and then in eight He's helping dom save his baby and then in nine. Well, he's not in nine, but then in hobson shore He's he's an all out hero and like none of it makes any sense Well, I was gonna say I don't know that people consider them Like great stories or anything. I think people mostly just like watch them. Yeah. Yeah They are they are like I think there's an element of so bad. They're good Like the whole continuity is a complete mess. It's so elastic, but elastic is a word for you Yeah, but if you Before you pass go if you're like, I'm okay with that then you're gonna have a lot of fun You know, I mean, absolutely. Well, that's the thing. I think people had fun with Loki I know people had fun with Loki I'm just talking about if you determine ahead of time that you're gonna like it. Yeah, you're gonna like it It's um, I didn't determine ahead of time. I would like it So with what happened with oki would be the same for me as if they did a hulk movie And this is after 2012 avengers and he can't stop being furious now It's like unlocked a monster in him We're just like, oh my god And then it opens with Tony saying you need to go to a spa And then we cut to him. He's at the spa and then he talks to some like old Wise guy and the wise guy is like anger is really just an expression of your own frustrations about yourself You need to introspect. What is it about you that you are unhappy with and then the rest of the film? He's totally chill. He's like, yeah, that was it. That's what I needed I'd be like Jesus Christ really is like one scene and it's completely changed and if someone went well, you know It could happen, right people and Have you never had a moment in your own life where like someone's just said something to you or you've Got in that tiny little detail. It's just made you think about something differently Um, so the counterbalance would be that he's been a rage monster for years and Despite being a scientist surrounded by intelligent people He can't possibly figure out what it is and some old guy giving him one piece of advice Like to me, that's just like that just insults everything that's happened before in terms of how effective it all is In the same way that Loki finding out one of his plans didn't work from people He can't necessarily trust who are trying to manipulate him turns him from what is essentially one of the greatest villains of the mcu into a good guy That's bizarre. Like I feel like It's not it's not it's not a stretch to me that like It could take one conversation with the right person to say the right things to you To make you see life differently. I don't know if you from x to y I can agree. I think that like It's kind of like I'm pretty sure I've heard this before it's the saying that you know You can read like one book or like one sentence that kind of reframes a lot of stuff but as true as that can be It would still be a gradual Transition into a different person that could be the catalyst for change But it won't it won't be like in him because people are just People are stuck in their ways. You know people are creatures of habit It's it's really tough to get somebody to change radically in a very short amount of time to frame that more positively People have their ways for reasons They got there for a reason and so to bring it down in moments should take at least more so than just a line And sometimes it'll be that line. They disagree with it and then the following day they think about it and they're like, hmm That is kind of This line of justification Creates a horrifically low standard for character writing which essentially equates to well, it's logically possible that it could happen Yeah, so it's all fine It's not it's not for me about whether it's possible or not. It's more that that's what I feel like there's been No, but I'm saying like I feel like there's been times in my own life where I just needed that little thing to read just how I saw something I don't think it's like unheard of to fictionalize that I think Hitler maybe the Jews are just people like you and I and we should be nice and that completely changes his outlook on life I think that would be fucking absurd Yeah, so do I I mean in the case of that one like I again, I definitely agree I think it's just a a matter of How radically would I expect somebody to change if they hear the right thing in the right way? It's like I can I can totally accept that Even like one conversation could change a person But not instantly like there would still be a progression that I need to see Well, and I think I think in the case of Loki we need to think about so that conversation may well reframe his perspective on like What are my goals? Like what are my goals? um as like the god of mischief like what am I If if all of this crazy time variance authority is like ultimately in charge of stuff like, hmm I can I can see that changing him But I don't see it turning him into effectively a good guy overnight I think we need a much longer story to get him there agreed and here's a comparison Here's a comparison If you were to watch a season of doctor who where the doctor has to deal with a part of human history in the future rather But his you know, whatever timeline Um where humanities move from earth and they've colonized colonized Let's just say the solar system even the sun we're living on the sun is so neat Um, but it's a kind of a dark time for human history and for some reason like I don't need to justify any of this The point is that it happened Ironic if you're living on the sun slavery's back cannibalism is totally legal and often happening and uh Torture is like a fun thing that everyone's doing This works the most depraved and horrifying event like era of humanity or something the doctor witnesses all of this And then I tell you The doctor has decided that it's time to wipe out life because if humans can't even make it like it's just We're fucked and it's the doctor's going to wipe out all of uh human life so that they can't be suffering anymore They can only be like a neutral Uh sort of element and going forward if the doctor spots any dark time in a species history Similar to that of what he's just witnessed then uh, he's going to destroy That species and that is like that that's ishow run for season 14 And that's what I make it about he's hunting down civilizations and destroying them Well, like I guess you'd need to see it in context I wouldn't love to see that story because that's not what I want to see from dr Who right, but like I don't think it necessarily Old zero weight, you know, like the way you describe it is obviously an abridged version But maybe if you wrote that scene, maybe you could give it the necessary texture to go Oh, wow, I actually I kind of see where he's coming from. Maybe it's not overnight as you say Oh, well, so if I there's definitely something in there, that's kind of where I'm Looking to push you so if I made it literally like an overnight thing I'm wondering what I would have to do to make you finally go. No, it has to be longer than that I think I think something like that way you're dealing with like grand Stakes. Yeah, maybe overnight is a little strange. I think what I was more thinking of was just like Maybe small interpersonal conversations You've had with people close to you or like, do you mean like maybe even people you didn't get on with and it's like I think I think There's so many rooms for so many So many conversations you have in your life that could just completely alter how you had an opinion of something And I do think like, you know, it takes like One sentence to do that in certain scenarios I am I think you're right And I think part of that is informed by what happens with Tony in civil war Is the right things are said to him are the right people the right times with ideas He's already having and but the thing is like I can reference you all the events of the MCU for why you made this decision with Loki I'm like, uh, I can reference you all the times. He's a piece of shit And then all the times he was a good person are all in the future. So he hasn't done them yet And then I'm faced with what made him make this decision. It's like seeing his plans fail And it's like if anything that would probably make him double down So I'm this is really I've got so little to justify this change I think that's what I because I imagine a better Loki in terms of what we're talking strictly about his character I think I want season one of him to be like a hyper villain. He's like doubling down seriously really Fighting against like the team. Well, I don't like the tba. I think they're bad guys But like fighting against whatever and then slowly he starts to accept that there is a lot that is beyond this control and we starts to narrow down his like You know goals in terms of what what he's trying to go for and then we start taking him on the journey Where it's like, hmm, maybe the things I was pursuing like why why did I do those things? Like why did I actually do those things in relation to that? Who would have made a great season one villain the worst Loki like there's a timeline Loki That's just the worst and it makes our Loki look at him be like Jesus Christ. This guy's fucking insane And yeah, I don't want to end up like him It's like and that's the season one finale and then season two opens with him being like, you know Really introspecting and thinking about why does he do anything that he does? Especially now that he's in a position where he's got way more power and control and that the timeline is is malleable and this is the thing we want to change way more than this but If we're strictly focusing how to turn him from x to y I don't think you can do it in one episode let alone one scene Do you really feel like he's good from episode two? Do you feel like he's redeemed from episode two? So to make the terms clear it's not that I consider him a good person It's that I think the show wants me to think he is with how he talks and how he acts Like so his his concern for the dying civilization his bravado in protecting sylvia She battles the smoke monster is like his approach with mobius like, you know, oh no mobius I wouldn't want you to be hurt like I I'm just like who the fuck is this person? He's like a good guy He's still he still lies and manipulates Later points in the series like when he reunites with mobius He tries to like play off that he doesn't care about still v and like he doesn't care about mobius even and he like You know, that's not a bad thing to do. Yeah, especially in interrogation He's still he's still got that duplicitous manipulative side to him. I don't think he's like completely stamped out White lie is nothing compared to that. It holds basically I would also Like I wish I could agree But like I almost hate that he's so ineffective at lying in that scene and mobius is just looking at him and laughing Then like I know you're lying and it's like literally it's I think that's the progression he's taken like as he's discovered more himself He's become a worse liar is the way I see that He's been doing it for like a thousand years How does that follow? Well, I mean, I guess he's Literally a thousand years old but in the context of us watching it as viewers It's you know, we've only been following our context is he's a thousand years old that doesn't change Does what I mean? This is this is part of what makes it hard for me to believe he's so incompetent Because like he's been doing this for so long but like Do you think the a thousand year thing works for any as guardian character in the whole mcu because like honestly I think it's kind of flimsy like they don't mention it a lot and then they mention a little bit in dark world Like, you know a human life's a heartbeat and then they don't really mention it again and then like, you know, like in infinity war They need to adhere to it I think it helps them in many in many times So for example, I believe Thor when he's always invested in trying to save Loki because they grew up together for possibly hundreds of years I can believe Thor when every other Avenger is like fuck Loki and Thor's like no, no, no Like we can only but the only time I believe like I agree with you on those things But like they could be the age that they're playing right? They could be like in their 30s based on that information whereas like uh, the Theoretically true. Yeah, but of course like they're from a I think it helps the believability of the world building as well That they're not the same age as like Iron Man. It's like damn that was cum incidental and that they're like the only You know and it helps the so what the way they want us to believe it in the mcu Is that Norse mythology is actually built from these real aliens from a different planet that I guess visited humanity at some point That they are ancient and powerful and they've been around for a long time to help justify that Like it would be I think a little harder to be like they've not been around for very long But they also have all of this history Um, it's not impossible All I'm saying is these Giving them this long history is helpful in many ways and so breaking it you don't need to break it Why would you break it? Why not adhere to the fact that Loki is talented? The Loki is a good liar and that Mobius wouldn't be able to outfox him I'd say that the I just would say I I think the only time I really do believe That Thor is a thousand years old is in that one scene in infinity war where he talks to rocket We're actually like feel it emotionally rather than just something that is stated. Do you know what I mean? Like when he talks about the amount of people he's killed and The weight at which you know Thanos has bested him and killed his brother like I believe that guy's carrying a thousand years of war Um, but like I think generally in the MCU. I don't think they really strike that tone with Thor very much I think I vaguely felt it from how he speaks I think I kind of get what you mean though in the sense that it can sometimes be hard to move past Just how old they are and so consequently just how little time relative To how old they are they've spent doing avengers stuff and being part of this world I get I think I get what you mean, but at the same time. I also Do get the sense that they have been around for a really long time in universe that makes more sense to me um, like they literally have It's part of how I accept Thor as uh, certainly in avengers and an age of ultron He's like the very big difference between him and a lot of them is that he's a god That's ancient that has power while they're human beings that have Variables And like I've always felt that he did speak that way the dialogue they create for him Yeah, and I definitely like in the way he speaks but I mean like They go through changes the Asgardian characters at the same pace and period of time as the human characters No, yeah, I agree and I think the ones that Thor goes through are much more informed than Loki's like, you know between minutes Would you argue this is a very like vitriolic time For these characters so they could have Like a lot of stuff is going on. No, no, not vitriolic. Sorry. Volatile. It's a very volatile era for these characters I got those words confused because they both begin with V. Um, no, it was a it's an era where like Lots of people are dying lots of stuff is lots of like events are happening in their world And it's the kind of period that would change a person Yeah, it's like it's it's really contrived when you think about it that they've had these Thousand-year lives and in the space of a couple of years like Asgard gets destroyed Mummy and daddy get killed like they find out they have a like a secret sister Loki gets killed like Thor's hammer gets destroyed like, you know, like I'm okay with that But like if I really think about it, it's weird That like this is all happening to them now like they were they were Thor and Loki as we know them to be for the first a thousand years of their life No, no, no, no as not in the exact same way, but it's in um I mean they probably did have stuff going on before that But I don't think it's it's totally contrived because a lot of stuff that stuff happened because of other I was gonna say a lot of those events circle around the infinity wall Like um, the infinity wall covers a lot of that stuff like the aether stone and everything but uh, similarly I would argue that there's probably lots of dramatic events that have taken place across Asgard's history that we're not aware of Yeah, yeah, like when you think about how dramatic I don't know that file Family they lose Things to give you an example I think that it could be an interesting film to watch odin and his daughter rampage through all of the realms and control them For him to then banish her when she gets to the point where she's too powerful. That'll be a really interesting film Yeah, that'd be cool. I'd be I'd be interested in watching that and this And that's the thing uh, it remember hella hella says the odin is like whitewashed history And so there's so much that's probably happened that's like bloodshed drama and insanity that we just don't aware of Of course if you read Norse mythology, you would you might have some idea of what it could be Um, did like look you fuck a horse. Yeah, wouldn't you? Oh look, he is the horse. Oh, right. Yeah in there odin fucked a horse Yeah, okay gets impregnated as a horse Oh, um, I think his birth as you do That's one does we've all had those days Uh, but yeah, like did you not find a distracting when he says different lines like this? Or do you just see it as uh, Loki is a good person He believes in the sanctity of life sort of thing He will do what he can to help people where he can and now he's doing a sort of a fight for good to a degree Like you just believe that sort of wholeheartedly But I don't see is like He's good as you were saying earlier. Do you know what I mean? Like I think he's like He flipped flops between the two even before this, you know Like he's saved Jane Foster in dark world and um, you know, he's consistently been part of Excuse me and part of like Thor's efforts to sort of like save the galaxy, you know, that's all thing and like as much as he is still There's there's this part to him that's still evil right up to infinity war. I still think The whole point of this character is that he flipped flops Again to get away from good or evil calling him a good person or an evil person that his value That's why I said sanctity of life Like he clearly now thinks that lives are important. You don't just throw them away That is clearly incongruent with 2012 Loki who will literally just execute people casually. So Do you believe the change? I don't know if he Always like had no respect for life um Like I think, you know, again, let's get a little boy thing in Avengers he's This teenager Kicking his is, you know, chucking his toys out the pram He's gone into different ages now, but you get my point like he's He's saying things to get a rise out of Thor and he's trying to be provocative And he's trying to prove himself and he's picked earth To be the vessel to do that. Um, but I don't think that necessarily means that he always means the things he says You know, like no matter what Rumi's in he is trying to get something out of the other person He will say I agree with you. Um, and I think that would be totally in line with Loki But um, we see him alone crying at the screen. We see him It's his reaction to seeing people run around and screaming. There's like these people are going to die There's nothing. There's no manipulation happening there. He just that's his that's his feeling on the situation Yeah, but like but like he's always he's always cared about his mother I know obviously that's his mother, but like he's cared about Thor. I really like that Well, remember so he has a huge leap. He killed 80 humans to care for your mother as yeah He was like just remember just like five minutes ago. He was invading Earth with an army of people and he killed a bunch of folks And like listening to people scream makes him smile But I don't just to say well, he cares about his mom. Well, so did Al Capone Yeah, but I'm not saying those are two completely different things like people aren't one thing and he of course Of course, so that's why I asked you Do you believe that those two things are incongruent or do you just believe that they effectively explained that change? I think in terms of the The character a to b I do think they explained that change like what's the whole six episodes maybe not from episode 2 the change I'm referring to happens at the end of episode 3, right? um Wait, so to go from I will execute 80 people casually because I am taking over this world anyway And then I will slaughter new york city with my army of jitari versus Oh, no These people they're not going to make it. They're going to die. They're being left behind But like I think when you think about The journey he's gone on he hasn't No, I would argue that not much so just a refresher for anybody who's wondering in chat, right? So he goes the the he sees the tapes then he agrees to help mobius. He does some research on apocalypses um Then Well, that's that's they go to the supermarket place They're probably Yeah, yeah. Yeah, so well, they would have to show us what it would mean for him to have changed They wouldn't just leave that out, right? Or are you saying like there are deleted scenes where he goes through like a significant character developments? To me the way I see it is he He is humbled by the avengers He's humbled by the Hulk He sees An opportunity to escape. He's immediately again captured He's then shown like, you know, like obviously we could we could debate does he trust what he's being shown? Is it real just like for the sake of where I'm going with this? He believes this right? He believes this he's given he's given a canon future Where the way the person that he is as of today only leads him to ruin And then from there, I think he finds a genuine friend in Mobius I think he finds a genuine friend in sylvie and I think he is given more reason After seeing how this is how my life is going to go. I think I'm this arrogant guy that knows what he's talking about and like, you know, like My will will be done because I am that competent and I know what I'm doing Versus oh, I've been shown that actually everything I believe about myself was wrong and I'm bullshit Do you know what I mean? Like I think that would at least give you the impetus to sort of view the world differently or maybe like consider Feelings and thoughts you'd maybe shut off before or hadn't even experienced before like for example Loki giving a shit about all these random people that you know in another movie. He would have been like they don't matter They're beneath me Um, I think it's kind of nice that he well that was like cares about them going. Um, yeah I I think that's that's all assuming facts not an evidence and it's just claiming that things presented are just true Feels a little bit arbitrary how they happen. Yeah, but like but like Anakin turns into dar fader in a couple of days I mean like that's not a bad thing. It's not a good argument for you I think they rush out of kid as well. Um, yeah, so Uh, where i'm going with that, right? So like when he lost in Thor He he lost his position as custodian of asgard until odin was going to be back He lost like uh, any sense that the people there that believed that he defended odin and that he defeated the frost giants It was all a ruse Thor gets the position that he wanted and he's tossed into like the abyss If you then said you see this humbled him and now he's gonna really rethink his position in life Or it's gonna actually make him really furious Because um, he's lost everything He was subverted by the very guy that he thinks has always lorded over him in his life And then he's given an opportunity by Thanos with more power to take over earth or whatever I'd be like, oh, there's an obvious one out of those two that he's gonna do and then at the end of avengers He loses again And you're like now it's gonna be an introspection stuff I was like, well, I don't see why you wouldn't be even more furious again And then he's like mess meets the tva. It's like this is the chance to never lose to the avengers Like I will control space and time if we're accepting all the bullshit with the tva and that he believes everything about them I think it's way more in character for Loki to be like i'm going to take over this place Oh, yeah, it's like we've seen that movie like several times That's a meta argument No, but like no, but like you need to When you when you're when you're sitting down with this character like you need to think like what have we not seen from them before What would be interesting? There's more than one way to be cunning and uh subversive especially when you're dealing with a whole new faction, right? Like if I said to you, why the fuck did they make Loki a villain in 2012 Avengers when he was a villain in Thor that we've done this before Well I know I see that but like I just for me personally I feel like villain Loki I've seen as much as I want to see out of that and I feel like infinity war took it to that logical conclusion but Hero time traveling Loki Yeah, I could do a little bit of that and so I enjoyed the series. I like do you mean like it's I get a novelty for sure, but it's it's the issue of you've chosen 2012 Loki. He's our guy Who we're going to be following That kind of locks you in Even more so than usual because he's canon bad guy The best way to achieve that and I still think this would be cheap, but then just like oh, there's a thousand year time skip Um after Loki gets captured by the tva and he's been working for the perages and you you say all of that development happened off screen We promise all mad or I still wouldn't like that, but I think it would be better. I think that's better. That is better But it's that's actually better. Yeah Because essentially at that point we're getting introduced We're getting introduced to what is in effect a new character at that point. We have to relearn who he is I don't I don't hate the idea of doing tight of doing massive time skips to either Well, I would say a thousand years of events have happened not yesterday He was evil and now he's pretty because essentially at that point you are being introduced to a different character I'm appealing to like a preference here But I would way rather go with the the free one of like the first season is us breaking him down Like that is the focus. Yeah, I would love to see I would love to see villain Loki being broken down I want to see I want to see scheming Loki who like has his own like Like has his own goals that don't even become clear Um until like he either achieves them or fails to achieve them And it's doing all kinds of deception to to achieve them. I want to see that I want to see deceptive Uh in it for himself Yeah And I know it sounds contrived But the point of this is that I would spend a lot longer to make it not contrived But I want situations like he's gonna destroy some building and there's clearly a kid in there And he sees that and he's like he can let the kid out It's like a locked door and then he just sort of looks the console whatever and he does flick it the door opens They get out and he doesn't really think too much about it But it's just enough that us we're like he's clearly doing more than he needs to So there's clearly something going on He's clearly having thoughts about stuff and you just do sprinkle that throughout You could even do it. Um and a sort of um, you know, he's like his big big ego way, you know, he's like Yeah, um, kind of like look at me. I'm doing this or whatever like or or kind of show off to the child or whatever, you know, something Some some something it's like it's not just that he's saving a child. He's also getting something out of it Yeah, he's getting Becomes that kind of notification of like self selfishness that is used towards a good goal Yeah, so it's like he's getting something out of it. It's congruent with what we already know his character. It's so it's like He's going look at me. Look at me and part of look at cool and good. I am, you know Part of what I think set him on is big a lock in ragnarok was that he achieved the throne of asgard for a significant time And it wasn't everything that he wanted and so I probably have that happen in the tv a to some degree He does have some form of victory, but he's like a he's like a now what character because him being king Yeah, it was only ever a goal. It was never actually what he wanted Maybe that's the point where we start delving into loki being. Hmm. I did like hanging out with thor Hmm, maybe I need to develop relationships with people. Huh morbius. He's Yeah, it's like I'm learning to like help me out on this little adventure. You know, I've learned about being good And like it's okay, but I just feel like we could do better than this. Yeah To just piggyback on that mobius thing Imagine he like goes on a two episode like thing with him and then by the end like he under this thing Is like I need you because of blah blah blah and then by the end of the episode It's pretty clear that that thing wasn't actually needed. You didn't need him for that thing Mobius to come along. Yeah, and it's never admitted to he's just like no Mobius picks up on it. He's like, hmm. You know Yeah, it's like you could have done this yourself and he's like no, I couldn't Oh now I'm getting sad Well, let's think a million different things that were better that they could have done and didn't I would want to sprinkle all these character moments in instead of slap bang He watches the movie and now I'm supposed to believe this is not I can't expect him to act as though he does in avenger 2012 I have to now expect a completely different skill value set not to mention skill set. He's very incompetent of fighting I feel like all we've done right now is I want him to be cleverer than that Yeah, do you want me to comment on this? Just to finish that off the compensation I'm assuming you would like when he was tossed out the train by two random guards when he's still capable of doing all kinds of Magics just like that shit frustrates me Anyway, yeah comment on whatever you want I suppose so but like It's no different to like in avengers for me It always bothers me that like Tony Stark just flies up And Loki's like you can see him. He's right in front of him and Iron Man just blasts him away And it's like what what like you're Loki like you had your fucking stick right here He goes to shoot him copy Yeah, but like He doesn't like it's not like a surprise attack. Is he just like comes up He says he says they're in front of him. He makes a quip about like his name is phil and then he shoots him And like I just think that's the it's a similar kind of thing. Do you know what I mean? Like I can understand So punks there I would um I would then we like I probably want to get into the nitty gritty of like how it's filming the way it's done So he thinks Tony's dead. He flies back up after he was hit by his own Machine shooting past him. I I would make the argument that Loki's actually partially impressed that Tony's still alive And then he says there's one more person you pissed off Probably expecting him to say me and then phil that could potentially throw him off He's still aiming the staff to shoot him. But then I am man's quicker like to me that all It's right within the realm of possibility all of that like I wouldn't complain at all and you know, Loki's barely hurt by Iron Man's blasts I still feel like That was an elegant way to put it but like you look at You know, I just described now. I don't like either way is invalid. Do you mean like I think you could easily go Oh, you know, he was probably more valid than the other what I'm suggesting is It's within the realm of reason all of that meanwhile him walking up to people who've just come out of a portal with glowsticks talking about There's a variant I'd be like so go invisible immediately like there's you have no idea what's happening These people have power you've never seen before Meanwhile, he knows Tony Stark really well at this point part of the point in 2012 Avengers was to tear the Avengers apart He's not intimidated by them at all. He thinks he's gonna beat them Like I think that informs it as well In the moment of the scene that he could react you could argue Do you know, I mean like just as easily as you could argue that he could have reacted better on the train Well, so yeah, the train were just dudes. Those were just dudes To clarify, right? So they're aliens aren't they what I feel like I think they're just dudes with sticks like there's no there's nothing special about them What do they have to be humanoid like I don't what I'm saying is I don't believe they have any Special strength things and even that would actually be relevant if you can just give me one sec So with with Avengers 2012 what you're arguing is he wasn't at 100% effectiveness and I would be like you're correct But I don't know that any character should be operating at 100 effectiveness. Meanwhile on the train I'm practically arguing. He's operating at like one or zero percent. He didn't even use a clone He's also Drunk and like he's not very phased by them. Is he like there's one moment where like they attack him He's like, I'll stop it. Do you know what I mean? So like I don't think he's It's not like he's giving it is all in this fight. Is it so that I would accept as a variable Then the other problem comes in of I still think that even when drunk he would use His magic to his advantage, especially in fighting I think it would be actually a great opportunity to have his holograms sort of falling over or being like Like hiccups Yeah, yeah, exactly. Um, but also I think they forgot who Loki is like So he's a he's a nice guardian Creature meaning that like so he can take punches from Thor. He can he can lock weaponry with Thor He can grab humans by the neck and lift them all the way up and toss them Like this is a man who's pretty damn strong. Yeah But he can be picked up and tossed by these like random guards and to the point where he's like And it's just like I totally see where coming from with like the earlier examples In episode two like the the humans that sylvie possesses I was like, I don't really understand why they're able to beat Loki up But the aliens in In episode three, even though they're humanoid. I kind of assumed a bit like in Guardians of the galaxy There's lots of different races that kind of have like different levels of strength You know, like spot I would admit the only way out you have is if they have super strength But I don't think they do when they fight them later Um on lamentus and the uh when everything's falling apart they fight them again And they're just they're very casual like there's no There's no uh efforts for super strength. I think what they they did when they were filming They were like wouldn't it be really funny if he was surprised grabbed and tossed out the window and then that crushed the uh The tempad meaning they have to do this other thing on the plot line now and sylvie can be like god You keep ruining everything. It's like a fun back and forth, but i'm just sitting there like Man, this is the god of mischief Yeah, he is insanely depowered so that a plot that they want to happen can happen and that's really depressing to watch It's a huge erosion of stakes in what we understand about power levels for these characters If we were to shift it to the drunk and singing stuff, I think that's out of character too I don't believe for a second that loki on a distant planet with little help to be able to get back with the tempad With someone he doesn't trust whatsoever who's tried to kill him would get drunk Escape destruction. Yeah, and I secondly don't believe that he would entertain a crowd That's just not something loki does He would see all these people as being far beneath him that he shouldn't even pay attention to Well fair enough to think that way. I mean, I would personally say I think he likes attention and You know, he's also a hyper arrogance. So I could believe That he could get drunk and still think arrogance isn't he's gonna take anyone on an excuse for anything Really? Well, like he's arrogant character Then an arrogant character can do anything at any time and you can use arrogance as an excuse No, just in situations where like I feel like it would be relevant Like this one? In no way, in no way would an arrogant character who has that as one of their core traits do what he's doing here I'm trying to like genuinely trying to spot the through line where he is like Man sylvie's asleep I'm just gonna have some I'm gonna have some alcohol On this apocalypse planet with a person I don't trust in a place where I could die Like that's just you know, I'm that confident about the situation. I just like that doesn't seem like low key to me at all Yeah, maybe drax Yeah, drax is much more Epicurian, I guess we could say in like a certain aspects another character I wouldn't expect would be like dr. Strange. I would never expect him to just start drinking because he's so confident I'd be like that seems weird. No, but I don't think like I'm not I think that's an oversimplification. Like I'm not just saying like any arrogant character would do exactly that thing I just feel like low key would do that in that moment But like, you know, again, you guys don't agree. Like that's just how I see it We don't seem to see any evidence for that claim that's being made based on his prior behavior But like, you know, like We're just gonna go back and forth thing here. Aren't we like you know, I mean like That's just how I see it. Um This I guess that comes back to the same thing the doctor who comparison like I would probably say that I I feel like I'd be able to argue that forever And I don't know if you you just think that is the way it goes like Um, if for example, we start up a movie with peter parker in no way home And he just starts machine gunning down people And you're just like, whoa, this is complete character assassination and I'm like, well, I mean, um, he could be like I don't know really angry like he's just fucking done with people He knows that his identity his identity having been revealed Means that these people could very likely use that against him. So he's just gonna he's he's obviously young. He's angry Um And yeah, he you know people make mistakes Yeah, I want to see the movie where peter parker shoots up school like If disney were to make that I wasn't expecting you to say that I wasn't expecting to say I was being sarcastic You think that would be that would be a strange film But do you get what I mean though? Like we're trying to find more of a Baseline than simply saying Well emotionally they figured this was the thing to do Because I you just said like you're coming from I just know you're coming from but I just I think for me like all movies and tv Have you like I think it's fun to pick apart like holes in things and talk about like the logical fallacies and logical consistencies I think all that stuff's fun. But like All me what comes down to at the end of the day is like how it connected to me You know how I was able to empathize with what I was seeing on screen and and if it made me feel anything Um, it's not that I don't think those other things are important or that I don't enjoy talking about them um But I guess it's just like when it comes to something like this. It's like You know, I'm just gonna be a broken record because these things are compatible like you can you can Like it's it's The idea that Yeah, yeah, yeah, so like you can You can separate enjoyment from what you think is is consistent or inconsistent. I guess I Record on that as well Well, I think I think um to to clarify because a lot of what I find value in talking about this stuff Is that it can help me identify and explain why I like the things that I really like So for instance when I think about like, uh, hot fuzz or something um I can I can identify stuff within the material that is supported by other stuff in the material to explain why I think that it so effectively does what it does And so that's like the value that I can get from it because of course how I felt like that's Sometimes that can be completely independent from like the well or largely independent from the you know The media itself and what's in it based on like Something that you personally appeals to you or maybe like a relationship you had with somebody that reminds you of Or like something in the story reminds you of that or like a topic that you find interesting and that fool you It could trick you and it could play you Well, I mean in In the case of this it's more like the idea of It can just be that there is a story that has ideas and stuff in it that just appeals to you personally And so it becomes a lot easier to um to sort of buy into that story Um But but it's sort of you know, they both kind of feed into each other and they sometimes kind of don't Because like what's in the story and how much sense it makes can't explain how much you enjoy it or don't enjoy it And then you can still have your own feelings that sort of develop almost differently from from that stuff if you get what I mean. Yeah I don't think any of you are like necessarily wrong per se it's just like The stuff that you want probably different priorities, maybe like different In terms of what you were going into to sort of get out of it Also, like these, you know, oh, these things are We watch these things because we want to get enjoyment out of them And yeah, this is how I derive enjoyment out of it And like that's how you guys get your enjoyment out of it and like, you know, I think that's fair enough Yeah, yeah, that's that's cool Like it's not because of course like the the goal has never been to uh to get you to not like the show anymore Because that's like because of obviously whether or not people enjoy something that's that's like totally subjective Well, yeah, it almost seems like a um Just just a thing you want to be put out there if ever because for example Do you ever think you'd find yourself saying this action from the character was out of character? But I enjoyed it and if the answer is uh No, it probably shouldn't be right It should be the it makes sense that there's going to be times where There's plenty of things that we think don't quite match and the the reason we like it So for example, I think it could have been easy for someone to have said I think the 60s aesthetic matches perfectly because it's a representative time of like a more an intrusion of bureaucracy As well as like an inefficiency with technology that matches the way that they operate And I could see you saying like hey, yeah, I kind of yeah I kind of see that and then um that might fill the slot for you of why you like it so much as well As the way it looks but I think and this is not some kind of like character criticism I think you like it because of the way that it looks not for much of anything else And again, that's fine I like lots of things for the way that it looks for the way that it is Perceived but the thing is we can sometimes again not saying you're doing it But uh, we can attach a reason and then we will not let go of that reason because that is the foundation for why we believe we like it Rather than maybe it was really just a simple and surface level as you thought it was fun And that's I have no problem with I'd be happy. I'd be happy to say that I just liked the tv aesthetically Um, yeah, I think yeah, I'm gonna ultimately like in terms of that part of all the other things we've discussed It's ultimately like it's quite a small part of the series, isn't it? um um but No, but in terms of the aesthetic like do you mean there's this there's a lot of things going on I would say yes and no, uh Yes broadly, but like in the sense that um, it can impede their ability to do x y and z Because they aesthetically have to have the technology of the 60s like to me. I'm just like Like I would have preferred if everything was like I said to to bring it home We have it with uh, do you know like you can buy microwaves that are like the 50s microwaves, but the technology of today They look like they're from the 50s. There's a lot of like stylists Retro futuristic stylization That's just housing and they could have done that and you could literally have Kang be like Yeah, I I mean I like the 50s. I think they really fucking need or 60s I feel like there is an element that's like though because like they still open up like portals and they travel across some space And they can like put you in prisons where you're just repeating the same scene over and over again Like Jimmy like they clearly like display power Do you mean like I think I think the aesthetic is kind of like papering over like the incongruence for me is drawn from that If it would literally what it is and that was it and I'd be like, I guess that kind of that's just the way they are But then it's like also they can travel through time Like wait So they have access to a future where Because like Tony Stark's already got tech above this and they can go way further than that and they have infinite resources So now I'm very curious why what's stopping you from having the technology you need rather than technology that looks neat Especially considering the foundation of the organization and what yeah, they try to stop reality from tearing apart, you know, yeah So like are they stupid or um And so the reason I should have the best of the best based on because they go to pretty Theoretically they go to everywhere in the universe Doing this stuff for all time and space anything they want infinitely because these universes Break off and you can take anything from them and then prove them. So Yeah, so there's no there's no excuse it makes them look incredibly incompetent Which means that I can't believe the things that the show says that they can just do and asserts that they do because like I said if I if I put tea in my mug instead of Rockstar and that breaks the sacred timeline and the tv shows up wanting to melt me I'll just shoot them with my gun and so the tv is all of a sudden. They're not so deadly anymore Well, then you get the tempad rags and then You're unstoppable because you're like, how do they stop with doctor strange? How do they stop iron man? What I mean all of the versions of you know, I don't know Did they get eaten by the cloud monster? And that's like I'm happy like even though we don't see those answers I'm happy when they say like, oh, you know, we've taken down like vampires and that kind of thing Like I've seen enough of their power to believe that I don't because I've seen their power. Yeah. No Well, so the problem I guess would be that we're shown They went after Loki would be one of the people I'd be like, how would they take out Loki? And if you go, well, you know, I can believe they have the technology They might be able to find a way and then in your head you envision them Portal behind him when he's busy with something and then they immediately zap him or they hit him with a rifle shot from a distance Yeah, they invent something special because they know that Loki is special Well, they use the reality stones that they have Or they just show up in front of him and hit him with a stick And that's where I was going with that is that the the point I was trying to make was that with uh, how we see them take out Loki I no longer believe that they actually do anything special for anybody They just appear and hope and for some reason that has worked 99.9999% of the time except with silvi Like what they want to do is like if you have a faction that's powerful Essentially what you want their interventions with reality to be Is just the thing they don't need they'd barely even need to send anything anyone or anything It's just they snap the fingers and the thing they wanted to happen happened in the universe because some operative somewhere was using all of the infinity stones combined into you know The all powerful objects and can do anything Because that's that's the level of power that they have like a big onion Yeah, yeah, yeah, so they make a big onion appear because that's what happens in the sacred timeline And they do they can just do that they can just manipulate reality because that's the level of power that they've gotten They have no reason not to make that choice rather they're expending resources and risking Things going wrong by sending like stuff, which you know to them. I assume is a resource I mean like they shouldn't even be able to fail Like because if they did for whatever reason if they somehow failed then they'll just go back in time Yeah, try it again But if anyone's gonna fuck with them if anyone's gonna be able to fuck them with them It's going to be someone using deception and trickery which was Loki exactly He's not a They are on they are essentially. Um, I'm forgetting which word is which omnipotent not omniscient Um, they should be both though Would you would you argue they're close to omnipotent though? They're not quite omnipotent right because they still have limitations. Yeah, they should they should be like maximally powerful They can do basically anything they need to in the physical realm of the universe They can make anything they want to happen pretty much Well, can they can definitely can equal to what the stones can do pretty much um But they can't um They don't they don't know literally everything Um, they don't they have yeah, it's like they they don't know everything But they have the pathway to know everything that they need to know pretty much So if anyone's going to take them down it's going to be Loki who can deceive them Yeah, which would be cool by the way if when he first met them he outsmarted them and they had to do something else Yeah, and because of their power They just eventually or like the time that they finally get him It's like the 412th attempt like finally after learning Like he's so they're all like they're tired and they've just had so much of this shit And they're just so finally happy and they seem grizzled and beat up and bruised and how about um They erase his timeline down to like it's all the parts of it are flowing away except for the island he's standing on Then they have a little uh portal open So that's his only escape. He jumps through right into a trap that they've got set in the tva It's like the they force him they have reduced him to an impossibility It's no way he can do this without getting captured um like I What I want what I want the first attempt of them to catch him to be like um Is he like he just gets scooped out of time But then like the version of him that we get see gets scooped out of time just sort of goes Congratulations, you've got my decoy. I don't know who you are, but I know you're trying to get me now That kind of thing, you know that That's a bit over but you know, that's not all you mean um the dialogue to deliver And that's the thing throughout the show. He keeps getting some like the one that um Matt referenced is in the supermarket. There is a human who is possessed by silvi and he tossed his Loki around like several times And it's very confusing because Loki is again in a universe. He has his god powers and his magic powers It's just a guy literally just a guy What are they doing Toss them around picking him up by his back and throwing him through like a pile of cans or whatever and he's like Is it a decoy or something? No, that's that's Loki No idea it was really frustrating to watch Because the people who wrote this are shit at their job and they just want things to happen What do you think um because i'm trying to I don't want to block you out of conversation matt What do you think about the fact that silvi used detonation grenades the prune timelines to create timelines That was at the end of episode two right because you crushed me on what That was when they were all set up when they're in the supermarket. Yeah, her grand plan was to Send back through time with the tempads all different Detonate like grenades the prune timelines to different places to then generate so many timelines that the tv is so busy Dealing with that that she can get to the time lizards Oh, I see. I mean, I don't think that's like a terrible plan. Like I think the one Weakness they have more than anything else is like They're manpower and they're in competency between each other. So I think like if you were to divide and conquer I don't think that's a terrible plan. Uh, so first first of all what what I meant to highlight there was that she used Timeline pruning grenades to create timelines That doesn't work that like in the sense that She's I don't necessarily disagree with you, but like is it the The grenade is dropping into this place where it shouldn't have been and it destroying like an area of that timeline Is what is corrupting that timeline making it different So from what I understood all the grenades do All the grenades do is reset whatever they've been dropped into back to the sacred timeline So if you were to drop 17 billion of them everywhere, it wouldn't change a thing in terms of maintaining the sacred timeline But you you drop them on things that are Splinters. Yeah, is that correct? If you were to drop it theoretically on something that was meant to happen with that fuck it up Um, well, that's the thing we I assumed as the audience We would all be like, well, no, but then the show is just like, well, yes, you know I could fight I could kind of No, I see where you come from. I don't think it's clear. I don't think it's very clear But I could kind of believe that The way the grenades work is that if you're if you're doing it on a branch, you're destroying that branch If you do it on the main timeline, it makes a branch By fucking it up. Do you see what I'm saying? Because it's like They physically take things away from the world, don't they? They actually like destroy it So if you if we treated the sacred timeline like a piece of string and you drop a grenade on That instead of the branch that just cuts the branch and goes back to sacred It wouldn't it just cut a chunk out of the main stream and it's string itself Yeah, and then I guess with the with the strands that you've cut apart start to unravel Oh, no, I was almost saying wouldn't logically we expect something more catastrophic Like it starts to wipe out the sacred timeline if anything Maybe maybe I don't think you're necessarily wrong. Like I think it's it's a confusing plot beat Yeah I don't think we've necessarily got like Enough information either way But yeah, I definitely agree like it could be explained better You know like how the grenades work For example Yeah, well, I think lots of things could have been given more time. They rush a lot in this. Um and Yeah, uh The obviously what I was trying to bring up with with the the aesthetic and the tools and stuff is like eventually you might Conclude for yourself Like it wasn't how any of it worked at all It was just I really liked the look of it and in the same way with that scene with Loki like drinking and cheering up everybody and stuff I wonder if um As far as you're concerned It is the fact that you believe Loki would do this and you enjoy it Or is it that it's an event that you just enjoy in general and thus you will defend it as something Loki would do Like I think I believe that this Loki variant would do those things Um across this season I suppose I can give you that like that's the thing I I'm constantly comparing him to who I believe Loki is Not who I believe they try to switch him to in episode one Um, you think you'd enjoy the show more if like let's say like roughly the bones of this idea of the show Was an original series without if it were a previous Loki if we did the season one idea We were talking about earlier and then season two Is he's finally revealed by Mobius after they get to be actual like close friends He's like what was my what was my future and Mobius keeps it away from him Because he doesn't want him to know how he dies and then he shows him And then he's like and he's already started to change because he's seen the super evil Loki And he sees You know all the worst results of all of his worst actions And at this point you fully believe so that he knows how the tv a works He knows that this footage is real and he knows that Mobius isn't doing this to lie to him because he asked for the footage And Mobius was like I don't really want to show you and he's like please If it was all in that context and then Mobius is like I'm I'm gonna I'm gonna go I'll leave you alone with this like I'll come back to you and we just know that Loki washed everything that happened And then you get a really important scene between him and Mobius for example talking about what does that mean All the actions you would have taken and where it led you and what does that make you You know and just and then the season two I probably would try and change to be The significant season from changing him from x to y And if we had that ending for season ones uh season one finale being He sees the worst version of himself Season two. He sees what he would have become. I feel like we're in a really good position to start changing him do you Do you like want to do your own writing like is that because I see like you know I mean obviously like you've got like these ideas of how you would want it to go like is that I am That's an interesting mind. I don't know more load probably I'm For now I'm way more interested in breaking stories down to figure out what I think Works and doesn't work before I make my own, but I am absolutely not averse to making my own story someday And that's the thing I wouldn't I wouldn't want to make a Loki fanfic. I'd want to make my own thing Yeah, yeah, yeah But I think that's the that's the thing like you don't really want to make Fanfic of anything even if it's like sanctioned by disney do I mean like I don't know maybe I mean it's a bit if someone if disney came to me and said wow rags. You are so smart and handsome And we're gonna give you Fucking free reign to make whatever star wars story you want. Here's a check just write any number you want on it Go and make a show. It's great. These people will fucking clap at anything I would if I would just be like over the moon I would be over the moon I I'd be like man think of all the stuff that I could do I could make a meme for myself I could actually make some good star wars content I could tell the stories that a lot of people might want to tell that I want to tell and I think I could do them well But disney's probably not gonna do that Probably I mean by me more in the sense of like it's the trust between that and Just making Original storytelling with your own cool sci-fi premises that don't like exist on these like 50 year 70 year franchises I think it would be all the better for it because I don't think we'd be sat here going Oh, this isn't consistent with this or this isn't consistent with that like we'd just be talking about like This thing in its own right I might want to use other people's shit as practice for my own stuff But you can just make your own stuff from the start like building from the ground up means that you have full control Over these parameters rather than having to make your story fit into the parameters of the story How the process works and how the technology and the legalities and the the actual film production stuff is Because I would want to get experience and practice before I say all right now It's time to make my thing now that I know how to craft I'm the other way around a practice story. Um, you know, I'm kind of the other way around The first story doesn't have to be the thing that you're most invested in making you could You could even go you could even get someone else to fit one of their ideas and make that uh, that's what I'm saying But isn't it doesn't have to be tied to establish to an established franchise for it to be a practice Yeah, it doesn't have to be so wait, can I clarify? What was the question? I have no idea It was do you say would you you say we've seen like why aren't you is the question like Why wouldn't you be focusing on writing your own stuff instead of talking about how other stories could be better? Was that some of the question? No, no, no, no, I'm just I'm just interested in the way that you're like Oh, this could it could go from here to here to here to here like you're obviously like thinking about it in terms of Like a structured story in its own right and I'm just wondering I guess if like Is that something you're interested in like it was it was more of a question, I guess Yeah, no, no, no problem. I just wanted to make sure I was answering it, right? Yeah, yeah, uh Yeah, no, I I I have a lot because this is the thing we do it here and there in small ways on eFat We like the makeup stories tell stories jokes will often involve stories The scripts we make for criticism videos will often have narrative elements in terms of you set things up and then pay them off joke-wise or you have The way you're delivering the script you get progressively angrier Because you built the blocks in a head to justify why you might feel that way There's lots of elements that have crossover is kind of what I'm getting at. Um, I would be interested in Telling stories at some point, but I still feel like I'm really interested in figuring out For example, Loki comes out loads. People love it. I hate it why This is like let's figure out if it's more than just I don't like the look of his hair Or I don't I don't appreciate it backs you that people that a lot of people like it. You see you see that way So I think this is so there's two passes on one hand if they're just afraid like it's so free He's like, yeah, I love Loki. I'm like, that's fine, man Everyone can like whatever they want. However, on the other hand Him liking it along with millions of other people means we're going to keep getting more of it Um, and that is not a good thing as far as I'm concerned. I feel like the mcu is Basically like we keep talking about exactly where it's died Think phase four has killed it now um, if you combine Loki and because obviously we don't want to Take thousands of hours away from you, but if we combine the damage wand of vision falcon the winter soldier black widow and uh Endgame and Loki have done Um, I this a nightmare for a writer to make a strong story in the mcu right now To deal with or everyone's done as variables And then we you would need we're at like the beginning probably and still in terms of the overall scope of the mcu They're going to introduce like a thousand new characters and they're all going to be really powerful flying around all over the place And they'll just drop bad guys It's inevitable Um, well to clarify I'm a big fan of civil war and I think civil war is juggling more than most mcu movies If not, I'm not gonna say all of them endgame juggles the most but still civil war is juggling a lot And it's surprising how well written. I think that film manages to be yeah, and I think that there's still Chances that so for example if if they're like, hey fringy, we're gonna bring you in to make the dead devil movie in the mcu And it's gonna be he's gonna be starting up right now I still feel like well fringy could just he's in hell's kitchen And he's minding his own business doing hero stuff on a low end and it could be a great film That would be that would be my like if somebody said fringy you have to make an mcu movie I'd be like man. I need to separate it as much from the rest of the universe as possible because I kind of can't I don't know. I'm not sure it's almost like the less of an event just five you movie. Yeah Well, if it was event just five, oh Well, I just want to I just want to say by the way, I've got going like roughly 15 minutes. Is that okay? Yeah, yeah, that's totally fine man. Um, you must remain Um, is there anything else you want to kind of like there was like burning questions you went to ask me or anything But I figure it's probably more fair to say is that for that for you? Is there because you saw some of our coverage. Was there anything you wanted to clarify or talk about? Yeah, oh, yeah, actually like At the start, you know, and I was sort of like covering the state of doc two in my kind of opinion of it I think I'm obviously I'm paraphrasing here But I think you guys are sort of saying like it doesn't seem like you're committing to one side of the other Whatever you're gonna say that you hate it or not and like it seems like you're sort of like walking on egg shelves Around like the people that like it. Is it was that it's like a fair kind of summation of what you guys are saying? Yeah, from what I remember you said something along the lines of um, yeah You don't want to necessarily talk too much about what you think is like Florida's not for you and that for the people who do like it It's time for them to sort of talk about what they liked specifically the remember the quote I remember annoying me and this is like I don't I don't get Like this is the one thing in the video that annoyed me like the rest of it was just like, yeah I don't agree with that I got a note when you said that you wanted to give you didn't speak about it because you wanted to give people space to Like it. I'm like it will have all the space you they have to because that's the kind of shit that um That I like I get from people saying that essentially my video about it shouldn't exist because I'm trying to tear it down for other people when they have all the space they want you to like it It's literally the entire world that isn't when places my video is playing Oh, I know I like that's that's what bothered me is essentially I felt that you're contributing to that attitude That that I find to be difficult No, I I could see that I guess I guess the the the thing for me is right like I've been doing this I'm not sure how long exactly each of you guys have been doing this But like this youtube game It's fucking It's fucking exhausting and sometimes the comments you get Are exhausting and it doesn't matter whether you said you liked a thing or you hated a thing There will always be someone that has a problem with the fact that you liked till I hate it Like strongly to the point where it's vitriolic and to the point and like I just think I've been doing this for a few years now You know, like it's not the only thing I want to do with like my career It's not anything I want to do with like my life and like I just think I'm just so fucking fed up guys of this like Positivity and this kind of like I can't believe Yeah, I totally think that's the thing like it's it's Like like like particularly with dr. Who I feel like there's this kind of There's this need to like the your the your shitting on it and that like you have this like You know, I mean like this goal that you want to see like burn and it's like no like like I fucking love dr Who like I don't want it to be shit. I want to be fucking good You're talking to like the most suitable selection of people on the internet right now for this topic I see I I see I guess I see what you were aiming for with that. I feel that um I feel that I would have said something different in the I feel that essentially what you're saying is that um, you're giving By saying that you want to give people space to like it You're essentially telling the toxic positivity people that they're right and that if you'd created a negative review You would be wronging them in some way and that's the uh, I don't know I I feel I get the sense that's what you meant to say, but that's what I um, that's what it that's what it meant I guess that's not what you meant to say then by the sound of it. So in that case it sounds like we actually like very much agree Sounds like it Yeah, I just I agree with you the toxic positivity Yeah, exactly By the way, I thought it was because like something we know It was like in the initial part there you you're much more So if someone who loved jody whittaker's era was listening they probably be like that's chill That's chill. But like later on the video I think toward the end you at one point described like the writing and the jody would get your absolute fucking trash or something like that And I was like, oh boy the people if they're still listening they're gonna be upset at this point But like I started by time the shod video by saying it's the single worst twist in the whole show's history You know like so I don't feel like I've ever No, of course shied away from saying I don't like those things. It's just like I think you just get to the point where Like these people like, you know, if you want to fucking comment and say I'm being so terrible in just critiquing the cinematography Acting and writing of a show Then that's your problem. But also at the same time like I don't want to give these people any room to give me those comments So I'm saying like it's it's exhausting to me. Yeah, do you know what I mean? Like I would rather just like give me those caveats and like, okay I've thrown you the bone here now. I'm gonna tell you why I think now And like if you're not on board like germy like why are you watching the video germy? I've already told I've already given you the caveats. Do you see what I'm saying? Yeah, I totally appreciate what you're trying to do. I totally appreciate what you're trying to do that I I guess I just have notes on how you phrased it. But you know, I think we're pretty much on the same page I like I like to do the same thing like I don't know. I guess I attribute a lot of Um a lot of my audience to the fact that I'm willing to essentially extend bones to people but also Keep within my own principles at the same time. I think that's a very important thing to forever youtuber to do Is to absolutely not leave it's to make sure they're not leaving room for the the misinterpretations and the And the people who just want to get mad don't leave room for the people to for those people to To get mad in the way that you know, they probably want to But don't then also make the video entirely just if you're going to comment this then this and if you don't want to You know, you know I'll tell you guys finding your own experience but like sometimes like I find myself I'm writing things in a script for a video that I'm almost like I'm almost responding to the comments before I've even seen one And I'm like, I need to stop doing that because like yeah, we've done that Yeah, I think the the the trick there is to not Say something and then say the thing that is responding to the comments You know, you're gonna get because you said the previous thing I always try to personally Freeze the first thing in a way that Doesn't allow the interpretation that those comments are going to be responding to like I'm always I always try to I always try to um Respond to the comments in the thing that I'm saying rather than saying something else afterwards And yet you made a response to the response to a video Also, then make a half hour video responding specifically to comments, but Yeah, I Yeah, it's just like I want to just like It I want to be constantly motivated to keep making the next video Do you know what I mean? Like I'm just working for myself now do this full time Like I used to do this with a job and when I did with a job, do I mean it like it wouldn't matter as much But like now it's like I need to feel completely passionate about doing this thing so I can keep it going, right? And I just feel like it takes away my enthusiasm And it just it just exhausts me to see comments like that and like maybe Maybe there's an element where I've rolled over too far the other way by going you have space to like it if you want to Maybe that's fair enough, but Yeah, I hope you can just see where I'm coming from in the sense It's like I just want to talk about the show and what's good or bad. Like I don't care about Yeah, I don't want to tell people that I have space to like it. I think the the issue I took was that Um, you implying that your video existing would not give would take away from people's space to like it That was yeah, no, I see I see what you're saying. I see what you're saying um, but yeah, I just I just wish like particularly with like this new era like it just seems like The viewing figures are going down the hype for show is going down. Like we're not the only people Yeah, have have criticized it, you know in a way that actually like targets The you know the way it's made and I just think like Why do some people get online about this stuff? It's like I've not offended you personally I said anything I said anything to offend you about the show like I've just criticized like the writing You know like yep People get very personally invested in whether or not other people think that the writing of something is well made I think horrible things levied at me for saying like I just don't like something It's insane and that right there should be enough to unlock the more interesting Discussion tier of why does it make you feel that and what does media do to you on like a personal level and Because a lot of people connect to it really personally without ever acknowledging that they'll be like What no I'm just talking about how good it is and you're shitting on it. So that's wrong I gotta stop you Not to say not to say that I don't do that at all by the way. I'm just the same as anyone else But also like, you know, I mean if if someone wants to walk in on this on the stream right now And say here's like, you know, I've laid it out. Here's why I think this jelly wicket era is good I want to try and prove you wrong. I wouldn't be like Oh, no, like god, this is just angering me so much that you disagree with me like, you know, like You know say it like let's see what you got. You know, like that's that's interesting I'm like the thing that would make me angry in that discussion is and I would try to keep my cool Like, you know, I don't like getting angry at people on streams and I I don't think I ever have Really, I don't know maybe a couple but Um, the thing that would fix me isn't the fact that they disagree with me If they were being like incredibly obtuse or difficult that would get to me You know more so than just the fact that they have a different perspective on something Oh, yeah, I'll take honesty over Like honesty and stupidity over dishonesty and intelligence Oh, yeah And it's just like it's a it's a work to try and just get an honest earnest answer out of them And it's the most frustrating and shitty thing The the scenario that I'm like envisioning at the moment is I try and explain the same point to someone Like several times and then they come out with a So you're saying and then you know Something that's an unfavorable. Yeah an unfavorable straw man Uh, that's that's the shit that you're saying you like hate everyone Yeah Damn, it's also like sometimes people take things to such like extremes like because you said you didn't like this thing Oh, you must hate like all of this and also you think Yeah, it's like But it's like it's Yeah, calm down, you know Just talking about stories Yeah, like it's It's yeah, it's pretty straight. You're quiet here. I I think um I totally think that when you like toxic positivity, that's certainly a thing I think that there should be no harm that comes from just trying to talk About media and why you like it and why and what you think works in it and what doesn't work Especially when most of the time when we're dealing like I mean, it's definitely the case where you were dr Who you obviously really like the show and it's kind of why you're so motivated to talk about why you find it so frustrating It's the same with me for like stuff and more and raise and j. It's just it shouldn't I don't want to see an environment where Open conversation about what we think about media is discouraged because negative opinions aren't allowed But positive opinions are totally fine all the time And it's just like ultimately at the end of the day like it's media it's entertainment Like you shouldn't be getting like this to each other over like, you know discrepancy of opinion like Like, you know, I mean like if there's something retraumatic in your life that someone is trying to talk to you about You have every right to just be like no, I don't want to talk about this and get vitriolic to them You know, but like if we're just talking about low key Like that's a bit different. Do you know, I mean, it's like you don't have to like Make out like very emotionally invested Yeah, like and take it so personally that you don't like a show or like a certain era of a show like You know, I'm sorry. I'm sorry to everyone that likes the jolly wicked era. Like I wish I could like it Like do you think do you think I enjoy like Bigger thing to watch series 13 or like not getting to watch revolution of the daleks Like the christmas special of dr Who was a staple every year in my life since since it came back and like I would rather that continue Like do you remember? I'm also not going to like sit here and just like Take the puffy with the shit that I don't enjoy This is why uh, some of the worst fans I'm like, I'm not saying that all of the people who do this are the worst fans as in a lot of the worst fans come from this group A lot of the worst fans are shippers because they get really like that's inherently Very strong emotional investment is to is to want to ship. That's like you're fucking That's like the the fucking love chemical in your brain going, right? You're in there You're gonna like that generates such fucking vitriol. I remember um, like some of the Like the worst shit I've got is why I just make you make making it like if might I made a joke about reylo's? Oh Like that was a day on twitter You fall no And like yeah, a lot of the a lot of the shit I get from on got on twitter recently after my dr Who video was um like was specifically coming from like Lesbian 13th dr. Yass twitter who are like people who you know twitter dedicated to finding the characters attractive and shipping them uh, because there's so much emotional investment involved there Where you can't just yeah It goes like liking a tv show But also like let's say like you're one of those people you sit down you watch the whole five hours like Guess what like your blu-rays, you know, haven't evaporated like you can still go on bpsi player and watch it Like you can still do all the same things you did before like you could choose not to even watch it Like I just don't understand why it's genuinely It's the um the always sunny in philadelphia meme where they look at jade's video or one of yours or whoever else and like That the aura it it fucking pisses me off that it exists. Just like go away You're the fact that there's a video that's stating it's bad than that it's sitting there looking at me like I can't have that Like if there was a video a five hour video going over why it was good I would be interested in what arguments it makes but the fact that it exists would not be Potentially some of those arguments would vex me but not the fact that it exists It could be that that person just has entirely different standards to any of the ones that we use Yeah and it's like equally like Like the right skywalker right as I've said a couple times on this. I think it's a piece of shit but like if you want to if you want to If you want to put it put it on watch all the special features watch jj try and You know discuss how he came to all those shitty ideas in the commentary track like you can go and do that Do you know I mean like no one's stopping you I don't understand why like Do you know I just say it is as if I guess maybe that I see why you say like that I gave people space thing It's kind of weird because it's like It is infinite you can You can like all these things and also like the internet is is a wonderful thing in the sense like Whatever whatever thing that's kind of fringe that you like like I still fucking love thunderbirds I think it's fucking terrific Like I think a dream of mine would be to make a thunderbirds movie for example Like no one's talking about thunderbirds really but like you can go find like a facebook group or a reddit thread Where like there's people like me that still like have an affection for it that you can talk to about it So like there's no there's no way like You could be stifled by like a negative criticism unless unless of course it's like vitriolic to you personally and who you are as a person Do you mean that that's when it crosses a line. Yeah, like stuff. It's like if you like this then you know those kinds of Like one of the first videos on my channel was someone saying that if you like the mc You what you you are like like a malformed child or something. I remember that that was fun. That was a fun video to respond to The comment I I love the most is when someone points something out or suggests something to you that you've covered in the video Like maybe even like a minute later and it's like How did you like you commented that but like you didn't like like the the answer is right there. You know what I mean? Like it's Just just watch a little bit more of the video You know, I mean well people don't realize is that comment sections are just the same three comments over and over again Like 90% of it Me something funny. Nobody something dot dot dot profit. Yeah, there you go. That's like three of the most common ones in one Oh, actually that reminds me as well. That was the other thing I went to bring up From the video is like you you guys deduct points from me for saying like Don't forget to subscribe or like comment when you think of this thing I'm like I just want to say like I I see I see I see why I took the piss out of that but like I genuinely try to respond to a lot of comments So when I say stuff like that like I know it can come across a bit like this and generous But I genuinely do try to sit there You know, I should have I should have referenced the fact that we know you do because we covered you doing it before So, you know what? It's good that you broke the mold and that's a correction because yeah The the the common thing is that it feeds the algorithm They don't actually read in their comics and as I think Fringy said it's like it's always is it three Well three example questions Like it Like question question question segment done and it always feels really Captain Midnight video Was oh might have been it might have been Captain Midnight video or saying that I think why it was the Captain Midnight video Yeah, the point is I have no problem with people doing that if they actually read and respond to the community's ads This is like yeah go for it And I try to respond to a mixture of positive people negative people Do I mean I don't just want it to be like Oh, if you scroll down any one of my videos, he's just responding to people that agree with him Yeah, that's that's cool. That's uh, that's because you see that on certain channels where they're always Harding the comments telling them how great they are and how awesome they are while ignoring the people who have criticisms against them Names channels Fringy single out these people Yeah Do it now It happens I like It happened. I think it happens more on smaller channels Then yeah, I mean, well you say that but there are channels that have like 300 000 subscribers Around they're about to do that Yeah, I'm sure there are but I think it's more common amongst probably smaller channels I think you just need to be careful with that because it can feed your ego And you always want to keep it in check as much as possible I would also like to say I mean I don't know what you guys think but I also think there's A lot of good comments in the comment section Do you I mean like there's a lot of things that maybe go that's an interesting way to look at it Or like I'm glad that you just felt encouraged by what I've made like that's really nice Like do I mean like and and also like I wouldn't have continued doing youtube if there's good comments one there Yeah, yeah, that's fair. Yeah, naturally. There's always people being friendly. That was a good video. Yeah. Yeah, thanks That's the it really depends on what the video is as well Yeah Like I feel as um as It depends on how like personal the video seems like if people get a sense that you are a person on the other end You'll generally get a lot of nicer comments rather than you like, you know, it doesn't matter if like that When they're looking at a thing you made rather A thing that could have been made by a team right that kind of thing that feels less personal will get less Nice comments and and and some things clearly high effort will get a lot of nice comments as well Like my most recent video the comment section is lovely Oh, no the video before all right, the five hour one Oh, yeah, I enjoyed that by the way Oh, thanks rush That was shit I'm gonna I'm gonna have to ask you if you get an ask by chat Just just go with your gut. All right, which is better christmas or halloween Christmas Yeah It's chosen a tribe Um, can I give you a bit back story to that? Yeah, go for it. I'm weirdly like It's just me when I'm growing up my mom hates halloween. So that was kind of inflicted upon me. Wow. So I didn't I didn't trick or treat Um, whatever like that. Um, yeah, so Yeah, I don't really have like the nostalgic context to ever really care about it truly Although I like going out now for halloween. Do you know what I mean? But it's not like I don't think of it fondly. It's like a childhood memory. Yeah, no, that's fair. Um Halloween's a fun time or you know what both christmas and halloween are as fun as you make them It looks like a fun time. Oh, I'm cursing my mom Should let me go out to retreat. We're uh, we're getting close and close to know the halloween season I'm getting all excited for it. It's my favorite time of year I almost brain legit just all over completed by the halloween season two like what halloween season two I'm a sequel. Yeah What's the second most wonderful time of the year after? Christmas. Oh, I mean, I'm a fan of christmas too. So I'm a fan of late april slot where we get a marvel movie and it's usually one of the good marvel movies like late april Yeah, not this year not this year not in the last two years, but back in the day Uh, yeah late april. It's a good time for a decent marvel movie. Probably a russo movie Well, well definitely for civil war and infinity war. I kind of agree. Yeah What do you think? Oh, you know like when soldier? Well, that's our hot take that's our super. Don't worry. We won't we won't do all that to you We have got people on the internet. I think we're just all just bad Really? Yeah, I really like it. But yeah over time and then recently The our our mega hot take for reference is that Spider-man far from home is better than the soldier That's the hot take nobody in the world has that take except And we we spent seven hours justifying it on an e-fap. So yep, and nobody can argue otherwise That is a firmly established to just be correct Well, it's written in stone. The gods have approved of it dubbed it holy. So yeah And if you say anything else, I'll punch you. Yeah. Yeah, there you go Even if you say they're equivalent Convict me. I don't think it's possible to convert anybody out of winter soldier love really. It's real hard to do that winter soldier Yeah No, I do I do have a tremendous soft spot winter soldier. I actually I don't love end game. Um, maybe some of the time Join the club That's totally fair. I love end game, but I don't think it's like well crafted. I don't I don't love it anymore I think I used to say I really liked it, but I can't say that anymore after thinking about it so much End game frustrates me now thinking about it After three months of coming out. I stopped thinking about it. So I uh, I like infinity war a lot more than end game Like I actually oh, yeah. Yeah I think it's better like top to bottom Like yeah pretty much every way. Yeah. Yeah. Yep. I mean clients were great I miss I miss infinity war thanos. He was cool I see you've got the footage up there. There's thanos right now. Well funnily enough I've been playing infinity war with this far. We've the whole movie is played Oh boy, has it? Who's looking that long? Yeah Well, I mean we've been talking for nearly four hours. So Oh boy, really? Yeah, I was I was putting up like doctor who or uh sherlock or whatever we were talking about and eventually just sort of Selled here It's been fun Yeah, I've been I hope you've enjoyed having me you will Yeah, I've I've I think it went a lot better than I may have expected You know, we've had a lot of guests on and it doesn't always go as as smoothly as you want Especially if they come on in the context of confrontation Um, yeah, it can often go way worse But I've had I've had lots of fun picking your brain as well. It's just talking through lots of stuff It's a good one. I've been a great sport. Yeah and if You know, I I never know with creators, but if you're interested in covering videos I could invite you back someday to hang out with us and react to someone's breakdown of something. Um, if you're interested, of course Yeah, sure. Um Yeah, I don't know if it's my style, but um Yeah, I'll be off giving it a go And uh, Certainly before Before you leave you should uh, you should tell the crazy old people in efap chat What you get up to and why they should follow the link in the description to your channel and maybe hit the subscribe button Um You should follow me because I really enjoy editing more so than any other part of um Doing full-frame videos at the moment and I'm trying to get better and better at it I'm trying to do more match cuts. I'm trying to do my action editing and Like if you're someone that seems in any way interested by that, um Please follow me because I want to keep getting better at it I want to like I want to I want to call myself like a proper editor. Do you know what I mean? Like I want to be able to not just edit video essays. I want to be able to like edit movies and and and learn How to do that. Um, so yeah, so if you want to come with me on that Please go over there and subscribe and also I guess if you like dot-two marvel star wars Uh films video games and you want to hear me talk about it. Um Um Then yeah go over there. Was that was that was that exciting? I feel like I did a terrible job Well, no, I thought no one's gonna go over now I feel like our audience is actually big into star wars and the mcu's so they're probably like, hmm Well edited videos about them. Maybe he even changes your mind or some stuff chat Maybe even makes you think the winter soldier isn't shit. You know, it could be could be We we like the idea of Discussion, you know, it's all good. We we hear any fat value high effort editing Oh, yes We will point we will we will point at people who are just like They've got a trailer loop as their video and we'll be like, hmm Yeah Like I think the the shots are just as important as what you're saying. You need to match up and oh, yeah It can be layered. It can be subtextual. This is the thing. I get frustrated. I don't know how you feel about this But um when people it's like I'm sorry chris. I'm putting you under under the bus here chris stuck them treats it as though Being a critic and movie reviewer is lesser than being like a film Creator and filmmaker in a significant and like every way when there's so many elements that are shared And um, I don't know if you remember, but he basically said like pretty fucked up that a filmmaker will spend years Making something and then we will watch it and in 30 minutes poop out something and try to pretend like we're on the same level And you sit there as someone I think it's strange to make a hierarchy between them like absolutely. Yeah Different different tasks I know the j has but like I have worked on a video for six months Twice now. I can't remember if I've done it three times or not, but yeah When you commit to someone like that and then someone's like You know, you're you're kind of the vulture. You're picking up the scraps of someone else's content. It's just like Fuck you I worked really hard actually Yes, that's that's bizarre. I didn't know he said that Yeah, it's something that really annoyed me Restokman has a few choice quotes that are um, well, he's he's transitioning out into filmmaker now So he needs to start making friends instead of shitting on bridges. Yes Yes, he can burn his youtube bridges. He needs to make filmmaking bridges now But then once he burns those youtube bridges, it'll just be like mr. Burns when Come crawling back, okay Yeah, well unless you know he goes on to become the new jj abrams. Who knows? I'll pay you worse than death. I'm sure yeah My girlfriend is consistently what's happening me to get off this. So I really need to go Thank you so much for coming thank you for spending the four hours. Like I said, yeah, you you're great to talk to you I hope we've given you a decent impression compared to just people who angrily ran on the internet or something. Um, no, yeah It's been a pleasure and I'll happily come on again. Yeah, we'll gladly have you back. Yeah, and um, Obviously, like I said, so people have listened to you and you've given a pitch Link is in the description to find his channel. You've done all kinds of stuff for longer than I think a lot of us have a reviewing, um media Which uh brings us to the end. Thank you so much Thank you. Cheers. Um, I'm gonna click the red button and I think that's gonna end. Yes. Yes I'll see you later guys. All right. Yeah, catch you tomorrow He's gone. He was a very good sport Yeah, yeah, absolutely. I think he'd be a top scorer for guests. Well, I don't know the category is antagonist Kind well, I mean probably up in the the jay. So we're true, right Yeah, jay. How do you feel someone's competing with you for best guests? Wow, I'm gonna kill him. Oh, no Nothing nothing like that. It's good. Gosh jay um Yeah, that that pushes us into, um I guess we're gonna do super chats if I can find the fucking controller. Where did I put it? Mom To play your game you should play during super chats is fall guys. It fits the tone perfectly. Fuck. No, I would be concentrating on it I know Yeah, you should be happy jay. I'm playing legos and you said you you're like interested in information on legos right now I'm doing critique of that game of legos. Yeah I know we were busy sort of talking about loki, but you might have seen apparently a sequel to army of the dead with zack snider Returning to direct that's just confirmed Fail upwards I don't get it. I just I just oh and also his company has a first look deal with netflix now. So yeah fail up What the fuck I don't get it that movie would I must have made money? I I may I may not have to go at a random interval of time from now I just I may just top out and go just just to be clear That just yeah, you you know, well as long as you get in your little. Okay. Bye. Bye. Bye. And then That's that's all you need. It's all we want from you jay. Is that what I have to leave? I will make Yeah, I think I understood most of that. Yeah, as long as you're not going Is my is my we're cutting out Yeah, well, I have to leave on like a random sound It's argument right now idea Just check the setting. Can you hear me okay now? Yes, we can I was just I was further away from my microphone a second ago I was I'm not a microphone expert. So I don't I don't yeah, I didn't make a microphone j I don't know why you're saying I wasn't the inventor of microphones. That was Thomas Edison or something. Yeah, I wasn't Thomas microphones Thomas Edison's a controversial figure now, isn't he? Like people say that he stole a lot of what? No No, like I'm pretty sure it's it's said that like Thomas Edison It's kind of like in the same way that there was Steve Wozniak and Steve Jobs almost like Wozniak created the things and jobs was like the company guy who sort of synthesized the All right. Okay. Well, there you go There it is. Sorry Uh, I think I think the thing that people say is that like he Wasn't really an inventor but more of like a really good businessman and that it was other people who were the inventors um, so like people like tesla were more inventors than um, then Thomas Edison, that's what I've heard Yeah, I feel like Thomas Edison strikes me as an interesting character So I I'm still super interested in some of him. Yeah, I want to be careful because I've seen Passionate pushback being like uh, actually that's a misconception that Edison didn't blah blah. I'm just like, okay fine fine fine Yeah, maybe I But I mean, I thought I was cavi adding the hell out of that Even still we've we've done that before and people will be pissed at us Like you gotta you gotta be definitive. You gotta get the Wikipedia out. Okay Yeah, I suppose Um, but yeah, all righty, so We'll do we'll do today's ones and I'll mix in some new ones if uh, if we can um Immuptually don't know if you forgot But full fat was the guy that was being hated on by that guy to the rise of skywalker guy in his comments Yeah, I um, I remembered it between episodes, uh, and I was like, oh man I'm looking forward to bringing this up because it's actually like a little bit of history Yeah Interesting interaction another e-fap. I just finished catching up with 144. Well, that's the thing Uh, we were actually two behind. We are now back on schedule. I think so This worked out actually as well because these would have happened anyway. We had These had to be slotted in because of the timeline and stuff Um, I think it worked out. It's been fun Mola, you're lesboneous. Hi wags. Hello Any plans to discuss Venom's new Lord of the Rings re-review? Um, well, so I actually uh, I emailed him um to come on now chat about it if you wanted to I've not heard back yet, and I think he deleted his twitter So I'm not sure if we're in a stage of you might be done with social media type thing. I don't know Um, but I don't think we'll be like that decision, but yeah I don't think we'll be yeah. I don't think we'll be reviewing his review again I would rather just have a chat with him about Lord of the Rings and um, I don't know video making and stuff And wish him the best of luck Um, oh, this is gonna be an interesting discussion. Also, hi ragas Hello, I think it was Yep Kick rags Also hi, jay. Yeah, I mean we did the opposite. Sorry commenter. Sorry about that You keep in keeping rags and kicking jay Yeah Surprise efap time to touch myself. Oh Up to you, you know, I'm not gonna say that's the wrong thing to do with an efap stream Statistically people have done all kinds of things while efap has been on, you know, and that's fine Hello fringy jay more and rags. Hope you're all having a great day Yeah, so far. I'm thinking things are going a okay. Yeah Well, the day started so it could all go downhill from here and it probably will So that's true. That's true. This could be the highlight of someone's day Yeah, I'm hoping it doesn't go to shit, you know Yeah, it's not that bad. Yeah, it probably will And thanks for coming on full fat videos. Yeah. Yeah, he's a really good sport. He's he's nothing but friendly and all the DMs have had with him as well And also it's just super willing to engage in the discussion in good faith is is that's a goes a long way me Yeah Compared to the the I wish we get his name That's your plan death of the author. Yeah, like I don't know what I'm meant to do with that for instance Uh Respect to full fat for being a chat and coming on absolutely Hi chat. We've been found no long no long kidnapped Okay, all right I'm confused, but all right Um gunpowder milkshake is the dumbest movie I've ever seen since the tomorrow war. Why can't I have nice things? Hello raggann old Hello, haven't even heard of that one That's like john wick but caron gillum. I think that's that's what I've said. Yeah um The thing is man like people love john wick two and three so imagine how bad this movie is Hmm I mean, I don't know. Um, I'm guessing their action is just not up to snuff. I don't I don't know sure Um scrungus bumbless I want to agree with that That's something Yeah, that's fair enough choke me. I agree. Actually choke me mummy j. I uh, uh, woo All right Again, you know, they are free to say whatever they want these super chats. Sometimes you just like yeah, you know, that's fine Uh, the joke of rick and morty episode is that you are experiencing pain from how bad the writing is and thus experiencing plan See, I wouldn't be surprised if they actually tried something like that if it was written by someone competent Like a meta sort of joke was that it was painful in a meta sense But but the problem is that I felt no pleasure. It was just pain So if it were well written and you're watching people go through all kinds of pain and cringy circumstances And then they're like you have some kind of line that implies something about the people watching this we would be like Oh nice Yeah, but no More stop. I can't keep up with all these e-faps You'll be okay. They will be we had a hiccup with 144 and copyright But this one should be able to go right on to moolah as well because people used to say the opposite is the other I swear as yesterday. It was like, where's the fucking e-fap? Well Four and two weeks is not bad Yeah, god damn you get any money's worse um and Obviously like the the thing that stopped me and delayed me with 144 was the the computer stuff, but Not gone above 75 degrees even with dolphin on so clearly the panel being taken off was more than enough to rescue the the fan being a fuck That does uh, it does wonders to take that side panel off. It's a big part of what cooler you're gonna choose is it's uh Or not cooler, but what uh, like uh, what chassis you're gonna have Is gonna be the cooling. It's gonna be a huge factor A lot of people make really Yeah, they like they go for aesthetics on the chassis. They don't like they don't seem to Like understand that cooling's a big deal I cannot cool your computer I remember I had a uh r290 which was a very hot card and I just paid no attention to that and um that caused a lot of issues Um, and then with my new build I bought a massive tower. It's huge. It's a chungus Um, I've never had any overheating issues. It's just big lots of air flowing through Yeah, um, and so things should be all right for now with uh everything Yay, yeah, it's good stuff Mutually euphlysm I haven't had the time to catch up on 144 yet and you start streaming 145 Well flumple my dangus guess 144 can wait right no mill Oh, well Paul 144 poor old us and current us Out out matching them apparently Um, have you seen the lightsabers in the last episode of the flash? It's hilariously bad. I've seen screenshots Yeah, can you fetch that screenshot for rags for any of that possible? um It's clearly something I remember if I should do in a group chat or in one on one, but oh my gosh Yeah, we need to I think you showed it's land. Oh, no. I think you might have shed it. Oh Here it is. Yeah, there it is Fuck How do you even have that? That's a great question How is this the thing that occurs? There you go. I got on screen as well. Yeah, um, so red flash is fighting white flash white god speed god speed against and there's another guy Oh, I think that's reverse flash. So it's flash versus god speed versus reverse They all got little lightsabers for reasons Yeah, so people tell me that this show was good in season one. I don't believe you and I don't believe the arrow is good either I don't believe any of you Bring your refuses to be tricked I'm not no. I just I don't buy it. I don't I've been small but it was better than all these shows Yeah, probably Um, also hi frogo j longman ragu and full fat. Hello. Hey Mola, you and the boys need to check out all tomorrows on youtube It is the greatest story ever told and it has the best memes plus. It's free. It's a win-win Uh, I have no idea what that is. Um, maybe yeah me neither Oh free just letting you know but cdpr didn't enter actual Pre-production until after blood and wine. It was at preconceptual production. Sure. Sure. I don't buy that I don't believe you It ends with just wanted to tell you the fact Okay, all right, so I am gonna wonder It seems weird to me to release a trailer for a video game that you haven't even entered into pre-production for The problem is that we it either spins around to incredible marketing incompetence or production incompetence There is a level of incompetence here on that is baffling Why would you do a reveal trailer for a game that you haven't even started developing yet? Not even started developing you haven't even entered into Yeah, did they have an arrogance warranted yet? Feel like it's not even warranted yet, which it's like cool You need more than that before you can be that cocky about like, I don't know this There was some failure there and i'm not convinced I'm just not convinced that that there was no development active development prior to that point You announce again that you don't go into active development for until five years later Like anthem at least was in development when they told people that they were making it At least they were working on this thing they said that they yeah, there was a folder called anthem it was involved Well, I remember that the name was uh called beyond it apparently some of the developers when they found out it was called anthem That was like news to them Yeah, yeah Imagine working on a game and then it's like wait is anthem What does that even mean? Wow, I think they had to create a reason right there's something in the game Why would they say why would they? Why why that word anthem well anthem is a weird name right because beyond it's like beyond the walls of this fort It's like yeah, okay. That's I get it. Yeah Destiny great beyond like the far beyond the wild beyond the But again beyond it's you can't because there are there are plenty of things called beyond Like there was like david cage game is called beyond um Yeah, I don't know Anthem is just a fascinating case. I'm just like Yeah, all these mistakes that you made and a lot of it was uh was was uh Bioware's fault I can totally understand being the CEO of like Yeah, it's like you've been working on this for five years. Do you haven't even started development yet? Like what's going on? We gave you so much money Yeah, like what did you beat the a exactly now? Of course, there was a part of fault on ea for making them use frostbite Which is not an engine for rpgs, but still you knew that you're working with that engine. Hey, there's plenty of rpgs in battlefield Ah Hey Like the rockets so anyway I Just somebody saying the name was because there was something in the law called the anthem of creation It's like oh man. That's some proper noun salad right there. It sounds fucking cool I'm tired of you a little like oh, I don't like it. It's cool A civil war two war How cool was yeah, free grace to me with like a summary of I guess it's not even a summary. It's just the story Yeah Civil war two specifically All right, I gave him a summary of civil war the the comic as well because I have it so I read parts of it out Wasn't very impressed. Yeah But civil war two is way fucking worse. I think anyway. Oh, yeah, of course Yeah It's worse because there isn't even a legitimate argument to have like captain marvel is wrong. It's just fucking nuts. The whole thing is nuts Yeah And then like toady flies in to try and kill her or like beat her up. It's like dude Why are you making all these stupid decisions? um Fringy in crow so crow swan confirmed Is crow swan like a new thing Maybe it's a game that has like a plague doctor in it. Well, unless he's a green plague doctor I wouldn't I wouldn't make comparison. That's pretty offensive It is I was about to say I'm sworn to crows Like jake of cane I I think so. Which is why we should probably get excited actually No, we don't have much of him left. Yeah, you're going to enjoy every last scene we have of him Yeah, we gotta we gotta just every moment Um Poor poor jake of cane is so mistreated by the show. Absolutely. Yeah, he's one of the strongest characters of the dceu He should be in the justice league With his deagle. Yeah, I'm down Uh molla, how ready are you for iron maiden 17th album sin jitsu? Uh I mean, I wouldn't mind giving it a listen. I guess but I don't know I'm not following them actively so I don't know what to expect Uh Fun fact one of the truss defenses you guys covered was made in response to full fat videos truss videos So you guys have indirectly crossed paths before yeah How about that? Uh, hi molla. Hi rags. Hello Hi there time for twos campaign was incredible. Thanks for the recommendation regret not playing it sooner since I got it for free on ps plus Glad you liked Yeah, that seems to be a consistent recommendation Really is great. Oh, yes um Molla is racism against spoons. We shall spoon him during the day. We shall spoon him during the night We shall spoon him at all times until he loves us. Come on computer fight off task manager It's the computer's trying. Okay, and as for spoons. I don't know. I just don't trust him. That's all Yeah, maybe I'll change my mind someday. I don't know so Hi, as I said before I've got full blown aides It's not a reference to um Liam Neeson in Have you guys seen that skit? No, so I don't think I don't think I have basically like Liam Neeson walks to a room I think it's part of some show. I'm not sure but um Life's too short. I think it was but rigid base has like a meeting with Liam Neeson when he comes in He's like I want to do sketch comedy And they're like, okay he's like so Well, we'll set up like a improv session All right, and he's like, I'm a store owner. I'm like, okay. I'm coming in and they like they do the rigid base It's just like hello. He just goes I have aids And he's like, oh And I and that is the the thing to get you to watch the video Okay, there's a shit ton more jokes But the idea that Liam Neeson wants to be an improv comic and his first pitch is to say he has aids Full blown aids. Oh full blown. He's gonna be the family guy right a song reference true. Oh, yeah You have aids you got the it's not hiv but really full blown aids He has full blown aids The fact that they just keep emphasizing is not this normal hiv like it's aids Man Uh more because I care about your mental health I'm telling you not to see the new space jam warning. They race they recast your favorite arnie character. Hi rags Hi, so are we talking turbo man or mr. Freeze? Or tea too Yeah, I like mr. Freeze over turbo man gotta say I will I think I agree with that mr. Freeze the fucking legend and this thing I could see the t800 showing up in uh Space jam too. I don't know uh, isn't that Isn't that paramount? I don't know. I uh, I'm pretty sure it's I'm a net as paramount I was curious if they would just using their own ip's throughout all that or if they were doing Probably is just their own ip's because that's all they have access to well. They could pay for licenses, right? Thank god, but it seems like they want to just do Warner Brothers stuff Yeah, um There is nothing on the plans for watching space jam too But I mean if you guys were up for em all I'm happy to do the double feature at some point I will if you guys know Yeah, I'm not gonna rush you Because it would be interesting to see the comparison Like back to back Of what they've done with the old manu and and to be honest with you Space jam is a film I saw a whole bunch when I was younger, so it'll be interesting to revisit Yeah, I I like my loony too, but I definitely prefer just loony since the space jam. Yeah, but I do like space jam Rags lend mutually a snow it'll help his pc Yeah, that will help. Yeah, you you heard of a liquid cooled pc, but Let me pitch you this Right, what about a pure snow cooled pc? Wait, everyone's saying my microphone's fucking up Did anything sound weird to you? Um, it was for a little bit for just a moment, but it's normal now. What did it sound like? It was just like a little scratchy and just a little robot like we understood everything you said, but it just had a little Little bit of a robotic scratchiness to it for a moment, but it seems to be a okay That's probably just more foreshadowing for the destruction of this pc or something sad face Let's hope it all hope it all works out. I don't know Uh But yeah, as for putting snow in the pc. I just need to do it very carefully You know wouldn't want it to leak into the whole thing with water and then frizzle for idle and stuff I'm assuming your snow is Able to be used very specifically for stuff like that Oh, this snow it is It stays cold Let me tell you this you might say is this like some kind of a like a solid liquid nitrogen And I would say you know what that is an interesting yet apt Comparison because this stuff is this is the pure shit. This is This is like if there was a god of snow This would be it. This is like this this never melting snow. It's like magic It's like girgy. He got a wallet of never-ending food Gimli he got some hair me pure never melting snow incredible absolutely incredible I've never hit a better pitch. I'm definitely gonna look into this. Yeah Do you do like multiple packages or is it just like the one package deal? That depends on what you need depends on what you need You're not gonna need a lot not gonna need a lot just a little pinch You put you got to work it into Certain cpu coolers that can use it. It's really it's really really something else Do you have a Delivering bulk to like industries that are trying to sort of use it for big projects and stuff Well, I don't want to you see it's like um, I don't want to draw too much attention to it Don't know how much I'm really going to have overall Uh, want to keep it sort of a small kind of small small deal. I don't want the whole world to know Not yet. Yeah, I don't think they're ready for it. I don't think they're ready for it Um My first experience with dr. Who not knowing what it was was the family of blood the first episode I watched knowing the doctor who was was blink. That sure was a hell of an introduction Yeah, those are two of the highest rated episodes that exist. So Might skew your expectations a little bit How does it feel to know that c137 rick and morty were assassinated? What did we do? Why can't we have good things anymore kick j. Hi froggie Hi froggie. Um Yeah, like I can I can isolate it to the one episode or so But if they keep this up for the whole season like it'll kill the show so obviously Really hoping we don't end up with that, but uh, the past three episodes we saw we were very disappointed Just after standing so hard Outrageous, that's what I think um A suspicious amount of e-faps. Yeah, you could say that What's going on here? Play more a muggus a muggus a muggus. Um I don't know that we're ever going to be playing that again compared to just wanting to do uh Like what is it called garlic phone? Which by the way, we are we are behind on we should have another time soon As long as everyone's on board. Yeah, we gotta we need to play that again. I love garlic phone It's been a while since we've played it. I think um, I think there's a plan to make a e-fap versus friday night tights for garlic phone I'll I'll get them It won't make any sense because it's a whole team effort, but we will make it make sense Uh Moffat is great with standalone episodes in two parts as he can't do series long arcs He can build up to the mystery, but the payoff tends to be weak Sounds like JJ Abrams, don't I? Um, though, I think the link is probably better than anything JJ Abrams has made so I don't know What do you guys think of the rdj Sherlock Holmes movies? Have you uh, I remember liking them. I I don't know how like I I I liked them. I just can't I still I don't know. I I saw him a long time ago I remember like in the first one more than the second one, but I remember being happy with both of them Maybe a rewatch would uh Illuminate my thoughts. Yeah, I'd be down. Yeah, I'd be down rewatching Well, they're making a third one, I think right or at least they've announced a third one I don't know if they've made it or making it Interesting to see where it goes Um, I don't think bring these back. Yeah, we'll hang on to that one by the way Oh, sorry Black widow should have been the Budapest where Hawkeye finds and refuses to kill black widow because she refuses to kill her target near civilians Yeah, we all We all thought it would be like You know We all no one saw this coming No, and they this person said the target would be Loki He refuses to kill Loki near civilian I don't know why Loki would be involved if you're going back to Budapest. Maybe misunderstand the super chat But I agree the the thing that could make Hawkeye question killing her is maybe a decision she makes on her own You know mission that could be cool, but yeah, the film was not about what we wanted it to be about Hi rags Hi Hi long man Hello And then it says hi rags again Oh, hello again, and then hi fringy, which I'm sure you would say hello to but he's just currently a little bit busy This is hi rags again Hello again, this is hi j kick him dunzo sorted. Oh he gown. He's out of here. Then another hi rags Oh my goodness. Hello, and then hi fat. Which you know, yeah makes sense and then hi rags again Hi there a lot of hi rags. Uh, how are you all doing doing pretty good? I'm doing all right. Have a nice. Are you okay? A nice little conversation Absolutely Um Hey fringy, what would happen if you put your goo into me asking for a friend? um I think I mentioned on my stream yesterday, but I haven't started doing human experiments yet, so Are they soon? Well, I'm busy, you know, I've been working on a video And I've been working on my comic so it's tough to squeeze in the time Yeah, I guess that's fair. I'm not gonna I'm not gonna push further. I don't want to you know ruin your schedule as it already is you know a little complicated Yeah, it's already it's already jam-packed like I got at these appearances while trying to do the comics and my other stuff, man You there's not a day off when you're a plague doctor, especially green one Also, do you prefer laissez-faire or central planning economics? I mean if I had to pick the two, I guess I'd prefer laissez-faire, but I don't really yeah, I feel like between those two options laissez-faire If I had to choose between the two but not ideal Definitely not ideal. That's kind of my thing. I want something somewhere in the middle not not laissez-faire But definitely not central planning Yeah, I feel like laissez-faire would work better Quotes everywhere. I have more of a means of Affecting change on the laissez-faire system than I do in the other one. Yeah, I feel at least it was I at least I could just There'd be more. Yeah, I feel like there would be more opportunity for me to do shit Oh, I mean to just try and fix the system to make it more what I want But in central planning, how do I make amendments to it? Yeah, if I'm not the if I'm not the big man at the top Yeah, if I'm not one of the oligarchs in charge or whatever you'd call them Uh, you might be screwed. Totally. You just wouldn't be able to do anything. Yeah But preferably neither somewhere something in the middle. Yeah um The music in blackwood was really good by the same guy who did mission possible fallout assassin's creed 3 and the tomorrow war and terminated Genesis What was it lawn ball for something? I am I don't like the soundtrack in black widow. Yeah, I don't remember it. Well, so I've I've I'm relatively aware of it one of the consistent like much use they have is regarding um task master And it's this like it goes Then I go over and over again and let's go on off. Okay Yeah, no, he's done some good stuff for sure I like uh, I like the soundtrack and assassin's assassin's creed 3 soundtrack is pretty fantastic. Um, he did modern warfare 2 Most part Didn't just briquette do a lot of the assassin's just briquette did a lot of the earlier assassin's creed. He did one and two Two soundtracks kind of fucking bangers twos is twos is amazing. It was I really do like freeze though And this is uh, this is the interesting thing is lawn buff. He's done more than people give him credit for because um A lot of people think modern warfare 2 was Han Zimmer. Han Zimmer did the main theme. I'm pretty sure and lawn buff did most of it and Similarly crisis 2 everybody loves crisis 2 soundtrack main theme is awesome But that was Han Zimmer. Everything else was lawn buff as well So I don't know if it's ball for bath. I might be mispronouncing it um Yeah, he and he did assassin's creed revelations with jesper kid. Is it just an infinite source of money? Oh, maybe That's that's a little bit lame, isn't it? I don't know Maybe doesn't it from infinite It's anyone lego. No, is this just here forever in which case I guess you just wait and then you can unlock everything once you get 99 golden Yeah, apparently it is okay. Well I'm just gonna drink. I'll be right back Mm-hmm Um, but yeah, I I wouldn't call the music in black widow really good though had literally none of it. Um stood out to me All I remember is And that's not anything at all It's very normal to me for the most part. Uh, well, it's just narrow sort of it fits into the You know, it's just what yeah, there's no unique tone Which is interesting because I don't feel that way about all the marvel movies civil war Or what? I love the sound so has a really good soundtrack. So there's infinity war all the stuff that alan subvestary I probably mispronounced his name too. He's done some good stuff Guardians has a cool original soundtrack as well. Yeah Don't get enough credit for that Um Big bang theory is the only show that consistently makes me laugh. Please stop. Please don't destroy it Oh I figure you're all you must be aware of its reputation Like it's not new for you on big black big blank theory. Yeah, I'll go with that well Um, because for a time it was number one in terms of popularity well good for it The Loki TV show is that's a nonsense, but at least the soundtrack was awesome. Keep up the good work more and everyone Uh, yeah, the soundtrack is Yeah, I love the soundtrack for Loki's good shit Love she gets more work. Yeah um Keep up the good work more and everyone your dedication and hard work is appreciated kickjay and also high rackles I indeed Yeah, thank you. We will On the topic of animated comedies that deal with high concepts. Has anyone seen Xavier renegade angel? It looks like a shitpost, but it's quite clever I haven't seen it. I have not seen it. Yeah Um, if you ifab movies the pirate movies phil mento has videos praising the second for perfect plot Perfect plot, right? And the third for a perfect action scene finale Hmm Man Uh, I don't know about that. Yeah, we I'd have to Obviously give it a give it a little watch through and uh, maybe He's an interesting guy that phil mento Yeah, I don't know why people tell on us. Nah, he's good Well, I've seen much less of that after the three times we covered it Which tends to happen Yeah, it was just weird. That's all I mean You'd expect that with everybody, right? Because everyone we cover has fans I guess everybody. Yeah to a certain extent, but it seemed like a lot of people And and you know, I'm pretty sure like the the first time you covered Lindsay Ellis It probably wasn't as much favorability there Yeah, um, that would be interesting to see actually, but we haven't actually covered her I don't think like an explicit video yet I think we've mentioned her But we'll be interested if we pulled up a video of her as I get curious if chat were like, you know what? Let her finish her point. Why are you pausing all the time? I love it when those come up talking that high top, but it was spider-man homecoming. That was really great Whatever it's almost like you must be new or you must be really protective over this particular creator It's like stop pausing them Oh, yes thoughts on the clip of nude rottick's bad take on southport and his take on batman the animated series If you haven't seen it, then maybe you can pull it up Uh southport actually sent me it. I like I'm very confused by lots of what gary said um One of the more confusing things was when he said who's gonna watch a five-hour video essay I was like, huh? I'm pretty sure he has watched my stuff. That's more than five hours and then um It was in reference to dr. Who and I'm pretty sure he's seen jay's dr. Who video. So that was just confused. Um Then the defenses for like batman the animated series. Yeah, I don't think they hold up very well like it's So the problem when you say with um, this thing was made in this time And so to critique it from this like modern lens. It's just not fair What does that mean for stuff that comes through despite being old? Do we just go? Well, that's irrelevant because it Shouldn't have or something to talk about the only what was good about it at the time But if yeah, that's it's uh, you know, and I guess it would just be in that case It's just separate the distinction between like you really like the show Versus like what you think about this quality and it may be that gary hasn't watched it in a while And that's the thing I think batman the animated series is one of many things where people will be like What are you doing criticizing that you don't criticize that? You should be like, huh? Especially if you're completely out of the loop you'd be like, I don't understand. Why can't I and then I think people jump to a lot of defenses that they're not Thinking through a lot of the time like one of the ones most comments Like it's not even intended for you it's intended for like younger audiences or do you know how much it changed? Do you know what it did? Do you know influential it was? Well, and I guess that's part where it's we need to be a distinction. It's like influential. No doubt good That's a that's a whole different and even the and again because like I like batman the animated series from What little I remember of it like I like it. I like I like what it is But I don't I don't know how good it is. I haven't watched it I would have caught a couple of episodes here and there probably I'm not attached to it at all And so south will be like actually it's terrible or whatever he said to me. I'm just like, okay, maybe I don't know I haven't seen it Um, obviously he's shown me clips that are hilarious, but I mean Who knows what the overall quality of the whole show is apparently there's good episodes if not great episodes, so Um, perhaps we shall have to wait for his covering of it if if he decides to do that or not. Yeah, I don't know Fringy for a meme. Could you please say hey hey in your best babu frik voice? What does babu frik sound like again? He's like hey, but like really high-pitched Oh, let me let me just look up babu frik. Let me I'll try and get into character Um babu frik. Hey, hey Okay, let's see give me a minute. Mm-hmm. He's up. Hey Wait, hold on. I need to find the give me the timestamp. I don't have one. I'm so sorry. Oh there it is It's really funny. I mean, he's one of my favorite parts of Ryza Skywalker Yep, there you go. You got it. You can slip that out. Hey, hey, there you go. All right, you got it Slip it out. Put it in your meme. Put it in your meme. Do it. Do it He just popped out of nowhere Hi to the lot of you Thanks, Jay for keeping up to date with the last couple of seasons of who without needing to watch them alone Hello, and yeah videos like jays make it so that I never feel the need to ever see seasons 11 12 of doctor who Like I've seen that video. It's fine You need more estrogen for that one. Well, yeah, I mean I don't my voice is a certain pitch really hard to get a high pitch Anyone isn't like high pitch. This is a weird little uh, it's like high but not in pitch Anyone else as hard as rock. Let's get started God Hmm, I don't I wasn't as hot. No, I was just looking to have a conversation. Jeez Is is Christmas better than Christmas? Feel like it levels out. I for Christmas the war on Christmas My god 20 million. Oh, I can put it times eight. All right. Just gotta get one more now Man, this really Hello, I made coffee because I'm I I I used to last of the tea that I had so I'm like I better do it now so that it's ready and But what's weird is that I because with efap time I can have I can start making it and it could be like basically it could be done by the time the stream's halfway over So Yeah, gotta start now. Let's all have more later Uh Star Wars episode 10 somehow clone palpatine return possible Don't put it past them What are you doing? What are you doing spoon heads? You mean cardassians? I mean, I don't even know what they were in doctor who they were just like creatures I think they made people into spoon heads. I don't remember. I just remember being like this episode's fucking weird Lord long bone of miobschlington abbey. Have you given any more thought to a kong fap movie fap of peter jackson's kong? um This definitely is one of those things we're like so for example I think I would have said even in like the first efap episode if efap movies was going at that time We'll do a mask of sorrow efap movies one day And like that would have been true and technically now it exists But you guys are still not going to see that until as much as a year and a half from now Man the backlog if we died there'd be so much content by that. Yeah by the way Is we're ratcheting up now with with resin evil Hoping there's no guarantees. Okay because of how everything went but Hoping to get the six movies done and a trailer for the efap movie arc of resin evil before october 1st Wow release them I think let me have a look see Because I think it worked out really luckily this year and well if if if it works out luckily To go october 1st 8 15th 22nd 29th and 31st that is six days that covers the full month You know what feels like an equal way and there's six movies So um, and you know, it'll have consistent memeage lots of fun to be had A lot of fun. Yeah, and we recorded them fucking ages ago and I'm looking forward to seeing them. It's gonna be great Me too, it'll be like I've forgotten so much of what we said and did yeah And then yeah, we got the the war movies are still being creative and lots stuff like that will happen in future So basically Peter Jackson's King Kong will arrive at some point at some point Don't know exactly when I'll see I have unlocked the super mega stud multiplier now we got A full total of times three thousand eight hundred and forty Holy fuck. Yeah Um P.S. Hello wagsies squishes for the good boy Long Long Kong you could say based on the runtime. Yeah, maybe that is the long kong My god, look how fast I make money now I'm saying We're the multiplier in the three thousands. I hope so. Yeah Loki's changing character Loki's changing character throughout the show hiccups a bit like major skips in character development than entire episodes of being the writer slash directors soapbox I'm closer to being sympathetic to the idea that if you accept the change in episode one the rest of it kind of um Flows better, but like I just never accepted it. Yeah, but yeah, they don't Maybe that's why they tried to do so. I don't want to say work. No, no, but put so much stock and Tried to sell it to people How do you say try to sell it asserted that he was a different character in the first episode because you kind of need that Yeah Yes, the feelings theft begins take them all I think I think we may have moved his mind on a couple things here and there about Loki. I don't know I hope so Um, do you guys coom with the door open rags? Normally, I don't think there's normally never anyone else in the house as far as I'm aware So you don't have to really worry about it and I mean like hey I mean Yeah, something you want to show off a bit, right? Someone walks in you're like, oh my god. I need to get me a piece of that Yeah, it's like presenting now. It's a part now. That's what I call a pod racing. Yeah Uh Boop see poop see we made multi-dimensional war Well, that's think uh, that's not it for the Loki talk Saturday We're gonna be gonna going over the the season. I have to rewatch it for that by the way I still haven't started that rewatch Gonna be fun The junior and Loki is pointless They could have just shown him another montage of his life and gotten him up to power and brought him directly to the end So again, we will talk about this on Saturday, but I don't understand what Kang was doing Why didn't he just teleport him straight away? Oh, yeah, right? Saturday is the lucky breakdown Yeah, I forgot what we're doing on Saturday. It felt like that. It felt like that was today sort of sort of yeah Kind of yeah, we'll go chronologically and we'll be much more definitive on the floors on saturday probably and we'll have Gary as and drinker. So Who knows what they will say Yeah, this is just yeah, that's right. This is the We've not yet begun to criticize Rick kind of forgot about his core character traits also high rags. Yeah Hi there Um What's up guys working on my cola cthulhu campaign when I caught this stream my first stream live I send you my regard from the francophone land of quebec Um long live the long man. Ozzy bonjour rags Uh wee wee Merci Yeah, um, well, hope it's going well a little campaign. Thank you very much Um, and Jay, what kind of keyboard do you have nice vid? Um, if you're looking for the type or like model and make and stuff I won't be able to get that but his video does his his video shows his keyboard here and there, right? And uh I think he's got like the it lights up and stuff That kind. Oh boy. Yeah But yeah, I'm not sure this show can be saved by saying it's Kang's plan He doesn't care if the multiverse exists. So why doesn't he let Loki kill him from the start? It's because the whole show is his entertainment the tva's incompetence Loki spreading chaos the multiverse war is all a game This is a story about a depressed immortal who wants to see chaos. It would work better if he was just in the earlier episodes Um, I'm still not a fan of that. I still really cop out to you to the point where Everything happens because some guy's just playing with his puppets. They're cool Again like Loki making any decision at any point even if they frustrate me becomes meaningless because it was just Kang doing it Which by the way is still kind of what we're dealing with so So shit like they just just in the last episode actually it's this guy. Oh Okay All right, I just got more than 1.2 billion studs Oh my god The richest lego piece in the world Uh, if the temperature doesn't go down i'll be melted Yeah I mean, yeah, that's that's true. I would suck It is it is concerning all the melts that's happening right now. Ever heard of the melt all melting Well, there was a lot of melting going on Ice caps freeze Germany's melting. Well, Jimmy's flooding, but well, yeah, that was melt some way some something melted and made them flood Yeah um I like mohler rags j Stefan molyneux, aron, magruder, michael, malice and stoned toss for political reasons Who should I vote for in 2024? Wait, you like Stefan molyneux. All right Well, I'd stoned toss it. I don't sure who the other people are Right. I don't know. Yeah, I don't know who the other people are molyneux was uh, he got he got He got eat it. Yeah He's an odd one Yeah, yeah He's an odd fellow Yeah, these compilations are like some of the craziest stuff that he said and it's like oof. Yeah Yeah, you are a mega move What a what a what a weird What a weird man I don't know if it's worth that. It's just the eggs stuff. The eggs thing is really funny. Oh, yeah Covered the eggs of yeah Man, this is just you know, it's like we all have our hobbies, but We all have our hobbies, but you know but uh I don't think you're gonna find efap telling you who you should vote for based on who you like content creators wise That's pretty bad metric If you like fringy vote for the green party, there you go Uh, no vote the orange party Vote rags. It's funny. There there is a green party in australia that the greens Yeah, they were one of the minor parties Do they touch grass? No, was that why they're green? That's their goal. They love the grass. That's why they're the green party kind of Think I think I don't know shit about the green party to all best album from your favorite three bands Best album. Yeah, which is the best album from your favorite three bands Or I feel like to make this easier. I will pick three of what I think are the best albums from three of my favorite bands rather than like the top three, so I love um hypnotize and mesmerize from System of a town and if I had to choose one it would probably be hypnotize Then Whichever let me check Which song Is this from It might be emerald sword This whichever album emerald sword is from rhapsody of fire like basically the whole album the most Then Oh, I'm not even sure with avantasia That's a tough one. There you go. You had two off me. You guys do the rest I generally don't go by albums when I get music. It's generally in individual songs from all kinds of different places But there are some But I think one of the reasons that electric light orchestra is my favorite band is that they just seem to consistently put out All kinds of really great stuff More so than any artist that I've found So I'd probably say time is the best album that they've done I There are some contenders. I really like el dorado and discovery A bunch, but there's done a lot of they've done a lot of good ones, but I'd say time's my favorite Uh As for I don't really that's the thing I don't really listen to like albums or like cds You know, it's individuals that I pick and choose time here um What other ones kind of come to mind I guess that have good ones There's new world symphony counters like it's probably too small to be a a whole Well, I mean it's an hour long, but Do we include symphonies in this because that's a that's a good pick I feel like new world symphony would be one of the ones I put in that list if I had to pick an album Was that just wait the I mixed up Wasn't it? Yeah, that's right It's one of my favorites one of my favorites really like new world symphony If I had to pick a soundtrack The problem is when you say because if someone says albums, it's like oh, so soundtracks. No, I mean albums. It's like oh, it's the soundtracks. Um That's that's all I got is reference soundtracks Um, I was default to halo 3 soundtrack. Love that score I've bought everything in the game life is meaningless 100 boyos. Yeah, there it is 100 nailed it best lego player ever That is incredible that you're able to achieve this accolade here on this stream only took 37 hours It it really just speaks to the to the passion of efap that one of the host is is He he collects that many studs mm-hmm One of the best time travel stories with no time plot holes is a show called steins gate and steins gate zero I don't believe you would love to see you guys cover that show. Is that I think that's eos favorite anime Or is it's one of us? Yeah, he either loves it or hates it. I can't remember. No, he loves it count angular things at shit We're boring or something at least. Yeah. Oh, well, you know, maybe it holds up. I always know maybe Wouldn't want to claim anything otherwise Super eaf walk catapults bounty hunter rockets super zappers Regenerating hearts fast building self destruction Invincibility and self destruction. Wow tractor beam And super blasters toe deaths. How can you have self destruction and also invulnerability? Well, that's that's just the power of this video game right? Are you not impressed? That is That that sounds pretty crazy Sounds wild. Yeah, and I have regenerating health So like even if the invincibility doesn't take for even a moment, I can regenerate Even if you self-destruct you can just reform Uh drinking bleach is better than this idiot's thought. Oh, that's not very nice Can we call the phenomenon of bad writing bad writers trying to fix another bad writer's mistakes a johnson abrams cascade Um What do you think is like that that's not a terrible name for it actually. Yeah Could you call what johnson? Because like I feel like what abrams did with the the uh hyperdrive definitely was an attempted effect But what johnson did to like all of abram's setups. It's not like he was fixing anything. He was just like, this is my story now, bitch I guess that's what i'm saying. It's cascade in the sense that it's like it's my story. No, it's not. It's my story That's almost like a bounce like a cascade kind of implies that it keeps going and going and going You know it does kind of keep going in a certain sense, you know So I feel this is like a bounce back and forth Like it starts here then it goes here then it goes back and then it goes back and then it goes back Like it's going to two things. It's like it's bouncing between a couple places So I almost feel like it deserves that that's like a different thing. It doesn't I don't get a cascade kind of vibe to it Okay, it's like a juggle maybe Like at all it's it just goes back into the hands and back into the hands and gets passed back Like one hand gets them and they just keep rotating it back and forth and back and forth It's like an angry juggle or uh, I don't know irasable the irasable juggler. I'm not sure Well either way it was the most expensive bitch fight that's ever happened in history Yeah lapping back and forth Uh Here we go. He wanted to fight the paperweight Well a lot of people do defend the paperweight thing It's not a huge surprise. I hate it. I fucking hate it. Yeah Uh, so much Natasha died for something they have nine of in a draw. Yeah, that's That's just how it be Um, they think the reand johnson of the mcu. They were correct I mean They've dealt some significant damage and yeah Do you guys kind of look back on the sequels as ryan johnson was the one that dealt the most damage even though Skywalker was probably the worst Yeah I think it's because it it had the dare I say the the privilege of coming last in a way where it was almost shielded Like people were already the car crash happened and then he pooped on it Yeah, yeah, yeah, like if a horrible car crash happens and it's almost like um It's like a reverse bioshock in a way Where the second game is a better game, but it was the second one that came out and it wasn't like new You know, so it almost gets kind of overshadowed by the novelty of the first one. Uh, Um So yeah, I think because ryan's came first and it sort of really shook things up And got It would also be in reference to what kind of thing i'm talking about with damage. So like The brand or our perception of it. Oh jay's back. Oh, no Jay, did you did you finish your tea or whatever you did? Yes. Was it good? All right. That's good. It was good. Yeah Look, I capped out the studs a hundred percent of the game I I can't see that right now You have two monitors How do you how do you do it with that little dance? I don't have the stream up on uh, either of them at the moment I just I just turned on my pc Why are you back? What did you miss about us? Yeah, what the um, well, you're the one who you're the one who knows what I missed I I missed it No, I said, what did you miss about us? to come back, um Which which body parts in particular? Oh, I have a I have been told I have a very pleasant musk. That is true It is tantalizing yet not overpower. Does it prevent people from killing you if they're close? Yeah, it does. It's a pheromone lock. Nice. Um, this locks them right up I don't understand what this is a reference to that's because you fell asleep when you were watching it Oh jay you you and I guess jay hasn't seen black widow No, I've seen the first 40 minutes. I fell asleep. Um, I fell asleep after the last scene I remember is uh red guardian Getting off the plane with everyone or the helicopter Yeah, and then like walking and talking about like I think captain america and stuff. Mm-hmm It's really good movie It's great. You should you should definitely You should definitely finish all of it. It's great. It only gets better I would say so. I heard that. It definitely doesn't get dumber Everyone always says man did that film get better? People who say it gets worse and worse. They just hate women. Don't pay them any attention People say it gets better with time as well Like I've heard that it's like it's now much better than it was when it was released That's true because it came out. It came when it came out. It was a different time But it was really visionary, you know, I didn't think that black widow could really just predict the new the neo vogue Of you know artistic creativity and that that kind of zeitgeist I mean I mean that the I mean literally the contents of the film has changed since it came out. Oh my god That's a wow like when they removed the cut from that game of thrones episode Oh, no But no one knows who's doing it. It's like it just seems to be happening on its own It'll be so interesting if they did that one day they release a Maybe it would have to be animated I suppose and the people behind it Are like you can vote on how the story went and then we will update it Or something just an experiment But I guess it would be too just like susceptible to trolling But I imagine they just try and craft a story through public voting over years until it's like and then it's like Hey, have you ever watched it? It's like it's pretty cool right now I honestly think the best thing to do this one will be like a film about gas lighting or something and then they um They like update it on streaming services without telling on everyone. Occasionally you get different Versions randomly different versions on dvds or blu rays or uh And you know, it's slightly different every time you watch it essentially you should pull the stream now. Some plane is the best character Oh, is it the gunk's road better? Charge Oh my god Let me have a look Oh Oh my god, that's incredible, I would have never guessed I'm having a look How many uh How many um Uh, oh my god, I can play as the little wabrat Hmm You give them a moustache. I do Do you have a moustache as copyright hon? No, that's sad. Wait, is that a wait? Is that a rat? Yeah, it's a lump rat Let him go. What's a dude with glasses? You're gonna write I got the emperors I don't wear glasses and you're a dog. Oh look at that See I'm I'm gonna still be interested in the new lego game when it comes out It's pretty fun. The lego game is going to be like I'm gay Hopefully Because coming out because sjw woke agenda. That's why jay They want the lego to be gay stop them. I'm glad that they have they have carbonite representation in this game. Yeah Oh my god, you're the fucking rosin and carbonite who might want some you still do the flippy emperor move the remove You can yeah, I think that was in the other one too. I'm glad they kept that You know, we'll jump over me Whoa I am the brick I am all that Even he thought that was cringy when he said it, you know it He's like we met like four of them I am all four I am all four Together I thought I would look better I I am quite ugly. I understand Need dark magics to make me beautiful I'm going to I'm going to steal your youth So I can be beautiful and go to the club again And see everybody would watch that emperor palpatine just trying to you know trying to mingle some stuff Oh, yeah Do you think he marked his territory by like peeing in the throne room of the death star? Yeah, and like veda would she be like oh, hi He's like, why do you is like? I don't know why you do this like no one really comes in here This is sort of like your space He just looks to him and says this is my area It's like somebody else There's a door. There's a sign on the door. It says emperor palpy. I know it's yours and then veda comes there and he goes Send private jinkins up here. We need to have the emperor's little glitter box. Well When the emperor realizes that nobody thinks it's cool. That's really embarrassing He's like, yes, someone else did this. It wasn't me. I will make it to cool Kylo is just in the corner intently watching him. Yeah Asking whether it hurt That was the obvious joke. Um, no the obvious joke would be just doing the quote Yeah, I got yeah It wasn't obvious to me Oh, yeah, custom little character. Let me see your custom little character. Well I haven't actually made any you know, let's go do that. That sounds like more fun Yeah, you have to make the ultimate you have to make all this air Completely unrelated question. Do you think kylo Ren story is a crappy retread of anakin's Masters attacking them losing faithful and Jedi etc um I mean weird. I never saw it as a retread of anakin. Um, that's just yeah, um I can see how you could possibly draw some connections, especially when you just broadly look at the character, but I can't even say in this I'm almost like well, but anakin's was like a whole story Kylo's is like a fucking casual memory that we're told about briefly like Yeah, we got like five minutes on that with kylo Imagine if the sequels were as good as the prequels That would be interesting Man, I don't have a choice of that many hats Dude, imagine if the sequels came first and then the prequels came out Oh, and I guess we'd be pretty thankful of the prequels, right? I'm playing this big brain We'd be like, oh, there are actual like characters in here like yeah It's sort of like the comic relief could use some work, but like, you know, this the world building is great They've done world building again. They're a world Yeah, this looks pretty fun I like it Like the state of the galaxy is pretty clear. There's a separate this separatist movement that building up and that seems important Yeah, that sounds like it could cause a lot of issues and potential. Yeah. Wow How about that? Wow, you don't get that many options. I'm a little disappointed here like I feel like these movies are shitting on the thing. I love that's kind of nice Like it's Emperor Palpatine. It's just casual clothes But he's got a little revolver Oh my goodness gracious. What's he want? Everything He wants this in it. Oh my god. This is the random option. Check this out Oh, look at him. He's gonna be a Gamorian god. Who's the protagonist in episode 10? He's gonna take on the set We're gonna play as both of those legend. I can't choose both of them. Can I because it's lame You can if you like start player two and then select it with player two and then Jay, nobody's gonna do that Nobody Um I don't like subnautica beyond zero below zero because no seamoth The cringe Jay, you can't simply command cringe you have to explain the cringe um It's the Gamorian god is simply called jedi in this election He's got a little silhouette. I love it Hey, a jedi can come from anywhere. No, it's just it's just like I believe it and I want it. Give me all this story And they just want to guard things with the force. Yeah You may not can use the strange space magic to help guard things That sounds great Look at Ryan. Look at him with his little cape. He's got a purple. Oh, this guy's kicking ass. It's we've got to see his story That's what I'm after and go Gamorian god jedi a star wars story I build so fast. He's just that's just who he is good offense Whoa, look at him go. Why is he so speedy because I've unlocked all the things You see something to guard over there. He's got to get to it quick This is the character we needed in the sequel trilogy You would have solved all the problems Um, so yeah, what is what is the math thing jay and why are they right or wrong? Oh, it's just like I don't think they I don't think it's a serious opinion if it is a serious opinion. It's kind of cringe, but Um, isn't it's just it's a it's a vehicle. It's in the original game and it's not in the sequel But the sequel has like an entirely different selection of vehicles. So um, it's like The the the sequel has like different vehicles that you can use and they do different stuff All right Like it's the strange reason to not like the entire game Uh, Sherlock is written by a bunch of idiots who think intelligence is a form of magic It's both garbage under garbage adaptation That's very true. Actually, I think so too. Uh, it's a very pertinent criticism Nice it's like Using intelligence as an excuse to just like he's smart and that's like the excuse to just have him know things He has no reason to know Yeah, it's really annoying. Um Hey jay, I watched your doctor who review while on a treadmill helped me burn over a thousand calories. Please clap Yay Congramvulin That's not the word, but I'll accept it I feel like it was just on the edge of being far enough away that you didn't know what the fuck I was trying to say I could understand. I I invented the form language. So I can if I moved it any further away. Could I think it would have been indecipherable Man, I had to swap to Boba Fett before killing the Gamorian guard because my Gamorian Jedi just doesn't have the heart, you know To execute other Gamora wait, maybe he's okay with it if he strangles them. That is the only way he'll do it That seems like a strange standard. Why why is that? Why is that his um his motivation? Okay, fine. He just he's okay. We cut him in half with a lightsaber, but that is the only way No strangling Yes, very dark times on the sun I think this is a reference to that solar thing question. Um Thanos wouldn't know about earth if Loki didn't bring it to Thanos's attention. All the big effects are from dominoes. Loki pushed down kick j high rags Hey there. He must have known about earth outside of Loki, right? That's where lots of the infinity stones were I mean, that's one of the things about the mcu that doesn't really kind of this kind of stupid like Across the entire universe three of them are on earth. It's like that's weird Yep I mean, it would almost be like one of them being on earth is a little bit like, huh, okay, but I'd accept that but I'm if you're gonna say like well, what if they were brought to earth for reasons like fair enough But like I don't think we get that We don't get that but it's not like inconceivable Like someone collected three of them and came to earth or whatever and that's why three were there um So the sorcerer supreme with the time stone all we know Yeah, they've just always had it then Must have been a time before then Are you saying like as long as we don't know for sure how it originated there? Then it could always just have been brought to that planet some I don't know. I'm not like I'm not I'm not married to this I'm not making it as an argument I'm making it as sort of like this is what my brain is doing at the moment I'm trying to figure out if I like it or not jay when you have all the multipliers and then you go to a double score Zone I've got times seven thousand six hundred and eighty You've got a lot of money. Oh if you press b as any droid you self destruct nice See that's a useful feature. Yeah Why is that in the game? Well, you can blow up on an enemy and you can damage them Man they are doing some pro moves Um I'm watching buffy really loving it. Thanks for the suggestion currently through half halfway through season six. Oh, no Good luck with that Your episodes away. No, that's the best one that if you're halfway through that means you're very close to certain things happening that uh Oh, yeah, maybe if you watch it with a friend, it won't be so sad I felt like a spoiler Um, I'm more than willing for you to know that which seasons are good which ones are bad and We're in season certain things happen because buffy's just gonna surprise you regardless Ain't no way you're gonna see all the stuff happens in that show coming hmm Loki's disguised as a horse got fucked by a stallion and birthed a an eight-legged horse Loki also slept with a giantess and she birthed the wolf fenrir Ah, that's where it's from. Yeah, he gets around. Yeah, he does the man. I mean if if I could change my shape I you know, I just I mean, so like giantess. I'm thinking like how how big would a woman have to be before? It will be impractical to sleep with them Hmm Well, couldn't he just turn himself into a giant giant Can he do that? I I mean in the original you change yourself into a horse. I guess you could change I feel like some degree. Yeah, like in mythology. He's probably got very few limits Um, I don't know I'd sleep with a as long as she wasn't like morbidly obese just big I'd sleep with a pretty big woman. Yeah, I'd be down for that. Yeah Like I mean like I just want to go with that 16 feet tall Give her a bit of the sausage now Yeah, I'll just see what we can do. We'll see what we can do. Put it in there. See what happens. It doesn't work out Well, you know no harm no foul Hello and chat person who this is your fetish. I'm sure you're there Yeah A genuine friend in Mobius the guy who enslaved him so that I've seen a lot of people say that I never believed that when watching the show that those two are somehow great friends now. It's like I had Yeah, I Came out of nowhere being being as good faith as possible here. I just don't see it It's he barely knows him. He doesn't even understand the place that he's from or who is controlling his strings And then also he kind of fucks with Loki quite a bit And to be honest with you not gonna have favorable views of the person who put me in the torture chamber for a while Yeah, fuck that. It's gonna be a little bit annoyed at him. That guy's a dick And then it's like Could you call me a friend or some shit like that? I'm just like go away No, you're dead in the air nut Um get a nice hole Norse mythology funny now play ddlc dumbo's How dare you? Uh fio doctor strange multiverse of madness will be doctor strange channel surfing through disney plus I expect setup for another simpsons movie in doctor strange Um I feel like we'd be lucky if that were the case I feel the whole movie with him watching tv because I feel like that is the only way to make it consistent But we'll see who knows what they come out with Uh fringy. Have you listened to any of the liquid liquid richard albums yet? If not hop off the call for two minutes and listen to pistol grip. It's a modern modular banger I have not listened to that All right Also mohler you're gay. Sorry. It's okay. Well, I'll be gay for a bit. That's right Uh, oh by the way efap 85 from 736 36 to 737 you guys say something that I don't think you'd agree with anymore Uh thoughts now high rags Hi, he's going brackets south portisms capper I think we made a rule race like the few efaps ago right like we're not doing any hunting down the timestamp stuff Anymore because we we just put the quote. Yeah, something maybe tell us what it was It's a whole bunch easier Oh, man. Look at this The gamorean gods Uh ground pound move j. It's so powerful. It creates the same effect as the lightsaber Damn, I bet he's a chonky boy. That's why it just like Look at that makes the light make and shatter just to sheer weight. Yeah This is a lightsaber axe All right The more you know Uh, is there any hope for dune also high frog daddy g Hey I don't know Dune could be cool Uh, yeah, I I've got no expectations for it. Like denny What's his name? Who's a mixed bag? It'll probably look great. That's something that you can almost Be certain of that it will look amazing. Probably have a great soundtrack Great actors that we'll have to see A team reign supreme which is an adam and sitch meme. I know that rags when you're coming on stitch and adam Me I I mean whenever they want to invite me I'll come on to stitch and adam phrasing I think rags won't sit phrased that way Yeah, I mean what's the what's the issue? Oh, there is no issue. I just said come on stitch and adam whenever they invite me Mm-hmm Rags doesn't understand sarcasm. Oh What do you mean? I said phrasing you don't seem to understand No, I don't know what there is to misunderstand. I mean, I I don't know what's wrong about coming on Adam and sit when they invite me to I think phrasing's Great there. I love it. I think it's great Yeah, I mean what we discovered is rags is pro phrasing fringies anti phrasing Yeah, uh, it's kind of bothersome. Uh, but you know, I'm not anti phrasing. I'm pro phrasing. That's why I said phrasing Well, it seems like you agree with rags then Yeah, it's caught up on a web of his own lies Oh, yeah the web spider web the spider web uh Um, there's super chats about it every sunday Oh and mohler stitch said that you're wrong about soma being good star wars is better than the father and lowkey makes total sense totally not lying I reckon you're lying I reckon that's a sneaky little Star wars. I mean It is it is it is better than the father. Well, I mean you have pretty sure explosions Darth Vader could be Anthony Hawkins in a fight. I think oh, yeah, I think so too. Yeah I think I think bobu frick could beat it. He's in a fight Wakes up one day opens one of his doors and there he is and just like oh my god I'll just scare him enough somehow Anthony Hopkins returned Uh, you know what that sorry, I'm just seeing people like oh, you're wrong. It's like, oh, yeah wrong In what way I said phrasing if you don't get it. That's your problem Shame Crimes have been committed Today I learned of a character called spiders man He's a mass of hive mind controlled spiders taking the form of a human who's been brainwashed into believing he's peter parker It's like million ants from rick and mohler's man Million spiders I would not want to touch him. No, no, I don't want to touch million ants I hope you're more happy to touch million ants than millions Are you sure about that? Yeah, unless they were the kinds of ants that bite I mean, yeah, because the answer this question for me is just whichever one is less threatening. It's like I've Yeah, like assuming that non assuming that they're both non harmful or equal levels of harm I'd rather touch the ants than the spiders Yeah, because I guess million ants are smaller Maybe that's true, but but like I prefer touching like if I'm gonna find a creature crawling my body I would rather it be an ant than a spider. I just don't like spiders. That's true. I don't like spiders either I guess I'm just saying like a million ants Some ants can be scary like bullet ants are one of the like only like really high up on the pain scale or whatever Yeah Million bullet ants I'd probably would prefer and like versus million house spiders I would probably go for the house. Oh, yeah, you should definitely go for the house spiders at that point But I assume I think one of you said like if it were equal levels of uh Like threat, I guess. Yeah, if they were equal levels of danger like in pain, I would go for the ants over the spiders Yeah, because spiders can be venomous I don't like Yeah Like irritate you maybe it'll hurt like Yeah, it won't inject venom into you like a um, yeah, I think Well, that's that's a question is the most threatening spider Like it is worse than the most threatening ant presumably Yes, because it can kill you Well, I don't know if any ants like I genuinely don't know if there's an ant that can kill you I don't know is there or is there a chance to kill you as a group Like ants as a group can kill people But there are spiders that on their own like if it was a million funnel web spiders I would not want to go anywhere near that thing But like what is so the most threatening ant in the world It's only a form of it can like it can cut it can bite you and it doesn't do any venom stuff And it will hurt a lot. It will be very deadliest ant So, oh Well, maybe we're wrong. Maybe there are Mermisia piriformis So the jackjumper ant and its relatives in the genus mermisia Are among the most dangerous ant genera and have a fearsome reputation for their extreme aggression Uh What ant can kill you it says well, this says that the most dangerous ant Oh, it's in the same genera though the bulldog ant Uh found in australia Of course in attack it uses its sting and jaws simultaneously and there's been at least three human fatalities since 1936 The latest was a victorian farmer in 1988 Does it say I'm assuming it is that like so the sting does That probably is a group right? I assume But I don't think that ants venom is going to be enough to I don't think an ant will be able to Yeah, I I I guess it says here that they're venom unless you're like allergic to it. The venom isn't Get you but I feel like the venom of a spider is The deadliest spider is probably going to be modern medicine But I think the deadliest spider in terms of their venom and just necrotic effects of A lot of spider bites is going to be really bad You don't you do not want to be if we're saying like random spider versus random ant fucking let this let the ant bite me I'm taking my chances with a spider. I hear that spider bites are horrifically painful. Yeah, they're also just They freak me out because I always expect them something horrible can happen like oh it fucking implants eggs or some shit That's that's the really spooky result In fact, my dad was bit my dad was bitten by spider um a year or so ago maybe two years ago and he had to Go to a clinic and he had to have like bandages on it that he would change constantly Um, and he had they had to get antibiotics and shit for it like it was just it was fucking awful for him It he was constant changing of gauze and stuff on this wound It was never gonna like take off a limb or kill him or anything It was just a a constant upkeep on this wound to get it to heal and it did heal But it was like it must have been months that he had this thing. Um this wound on in fact, let me ask if you ever found out what um what uh Well, let me see. You know what one million ants versus one million platypus That's uh Sorry, I think that would crush me. Did we answer the whole um What about a thousand spiders versus a thousand ants is are the ants better than spiders in greater numbers? I think well ants are cooperative. Yeah, because like I was good That's basically where my point I I'm curious because the ants will be working as a unit while the spiders very well may not We'll be working independently. Yeah Yeah, so like I would be more afraid of a coordinated group of a thousand ants than I would an uncoordinated group of 10 000 spiders Let's go this way. I think insects fear ants more than they fear spiders Ants are just like I guess they do fear ants ants are there are there are specifically spiders That mimic being an ant so that birds and stuff won't fuck with them Yeah, because when you watch those like nature shows and stuff like ants like literally have like war plans and stuff and the well, I mean there was that video from uh from uh Good old good old kozges asked on the ant war talking about how coordinated these ants are going to war with each other. Yeah and um Probably not. There's a super chat coming up that asks about it but that game I did voiceover work for it's like They'll introduce some kind of bigger creature But your ants will always just swarm the fuck out of them and there's just yeah Yeah, it gets to the point where you just bite, bite, bite, bite, bite, bite that health buzz going down Well, that's that's the thing with ants especially because they are such a unit and it's not really about the preservation of any one ant rather than the preservation of the whole group which makes them a lot scarier than human beings because humans don't tend to work that way you know what's really fucking funny is the next question is ask the tiger or bear question we already did the tiger and bear question well no i'm assuming they want us to ask uh full fat or in this case j gut response all right who wins Siberian tiger or grizzly bear in a fight i don't know this i don't know what a the specifics of a Siberian tiger they're the biggest one very close to how you imagine a tiger looks um yeah let's just get images google them go right Siberian tiger grizzly bear i think they've both got a very strong chance yes correct answer well there you go it really depends just i mean you know whichever animal gets the first bite yep yep all accurate statement oh look at chat bear wins team grizzly i'll take the bear bear we had this conversation we already had it you can go review that previous one we're not going to reach red it again it is not bear easily that is just an incorrect statement it rags is do you do you feel it's the bear still he's run off he can't he can't hack it he can't handle pressure he knows the truth i was curious i think i read some of the article you would uh you would brought up and um the one thing they were they were mentioning was how like that uh it could create a lot of problems from the for the tiger is how tough the bear's body is definitely that's true but yeah these are these are tests we're not really looking to conduct because it would be pretty cruel it would be pretty cruel to the animal yeah why well making them fight to the death for our amusement like that's a little what's wrong with that yeah i actually think that's great because if we're doing that then it probably means that there's just so many of these animals now we just don't know what to do with them the fuck we just have to call the groups and so we just like man i'm just there's just so many of them now they're not in danger they're they're the opposite of in danger there's too many let's force them to fight to the death for our amusement yeah let's force them to fight there have been cultures in which this is entertainment or like even humans fighting these animals is just considered just entertainment that you go to see yeah yeah that happened in history yep you go down dude there's probably parts of the world that's still happening oh i mean bullfighting what is bullfighting except i'm in a little bit more gruesome than that oh but yeah yeah probably you want to go down the fucking oh what's the name of the building i can't remember it now the big round building the big coliseum that's the one so you want to go down the big round building yeah you see here's the thing i could jay says big round building i know exactly what it means everyone knows that's the coliseum it's just there was just a time where you could have lived in a you could have just lived and you could have gone i want to go down the road round building down the road and see the you want to go down the road to the round building and watch a gladiator fight to bear to the death oh my god ronnie's doing it this week can you like really ronnie's like yeah he stole it ronnie man gutsy nice it doesn't make it was it a um shout out titus for spasian what a what a bro it was a criminal justice like penalty right yeah um i mean it depends on what culture we're talking about but i think the coliseum it was sometimes gladiators and some of them were voluntary what are all gladiators but some of them were voluntary like for the glory to a degree i imagine yeah exactly i wouldn't want to do that well yeah you'd make a video about the fall of the coliseum and about how it's not it's it's encouraging negative what i wouldn't want to be skyscrapers that these russian kids always are climbing but like i still love those videos just well i always get worried right because like by watching them it almost encourages them and that's true there is a film about this not that specifically it's called untraceable do you know what i'm talking about no so the premise is there is a guy who sets up saw like traps so for example someone will be in a tank of water and slowly it will introduce acid like very very slowly based on the amount of people watching and and so it'll be uploaded to a site and the whole point of untraceable is like you know for the contrivance of the thing it can't be shut down by anyone um and so people keep watching it out of fascination then it just kills all of these people basically and uh i remember the premise was more interesting than the execution but yeah uh that's like the most straightforward way of putting it it's like the more people who keep eyes on this the faster they will die yeah is that some profound comment on some aspects of society absolutely yeah it's commentary on you jay me yep you keep watching doctor who and that keeps making more of it i guess other people say we don't talk about them that's making more marvel movies so all right i feel like we're not helping marvel or or disney in general weren't talking about the films so negatively but well yeah i mean let's be honest winter soldiers reputation alone would be better if we didn't talk about it at all because there's people in this chat right now who will probably say yeah we're soldier poopy when they might not all right i've still capped out my studs horrifying i've done a lot for the bbc's reputation recently yeah uh ask the c versus h and bathwater question utism i don't think we've retired the bathwater one but what the you know but that one right for me um if you drink someone's bathwater do you deserve to get herpes are are we talking about this now have you answered that no we're just remembering what the question was i have answered that question well go ahead answer it i don't know i don't know that you deserve it it's more just that you shouldn't be surprised if that happens yeah i don't know i feel like you could still be surprised i feel like ah man i don't know and and i guess the big thing as well as like don't do that and you know play stupid games win stupid prizes right like yeah don't do but i don't think you deserve to get something to happen to you because you made a stupid decision i had to step away when you were talking about gladiators real quick um lindy beige has a great gladiator video and you all should watch it it's really what i will what are you gonna do if i don't nothing oh what are you gonna do if i do i'm gonna appreciate you taking my advice i'm gonna be glad you enjoyed yourself with his video another pick for the christmas chads christmas all the way you halloweenies i mean christmas has its time i'll allow it to exist christmas had its chance i could see him saying it that that superman i could see him doing it he's that crazy he says that on boxing day dude there is something so satisfying about seeing a super battle droid with the fucking disguise mask on disguise mask yeah look at him like nobody can tell i'm a human hello fellow human covering up the screen at the moment will you be will you be mowing your lawn today fellow human i will watch as i walk like a normal human look at this walk dude dude i am off to the store i will also maintain vegetation altitude levels within acceptable parameters human oh no they have discovered me oh that's a great walk the run is good too i can't even climb stairs in this game can you be like multiple wamp rats inside of like a coat no but you should be able to then get into movie theaters god if no one had context for this game they just saw this i feel like they'd be like what the fuck is happening what is that i'm just a wamp rat doing my thing especially especially if they don't know what lego is they've never seen lego before oh it'd be really star wars is this a ghost game oh they gave the disguise to the gong droid that's good nobody could tell they added a new version of hexagon good where the tiles dissolve slowly over time like you can step on it once it cracks you can step on it again and it cracks again you step on it third time and it crack it goes away oh yeah you've been playing full guys there's also snowballs that run over the map um and try to crush you you know they're adding the new season tomorrow hmm the new season tomorrow is it yeah my goodness i thought the new season just came out you know i think the new season's coming out tomorrow and that's going to add new stuff i guess they ramped it up that would be yeah six i think holy shit yeah they're talking about timing well season five just came out like i swear me reacting to the fact season five was out is why i started playing it again and that was two days ago let me hang on maybe let me see i'm gonna check oh the fall guys season five release date set for july right huh maybe i miss red maybe it is this is the news um yeah season five you're right i uh wow you pissed j off pretty nice i wanted more fall guys content who you just got more fall guys content too greedy bastard even though i i raised your hopes and dashed them profusely yeah well done fuck you hey you're tearing us up apart hi good it deserves no yeah ain't it great really big one best guest you should grow moustache hashtag christmas chad this room for halloween and christmas chad celebrate them all i love how happy your full guy gets at the end of a round he's so cute done um he's like please no more i think god it's over if if i've won some decent tv shows line of duty god give me strength for the wait for season seven i've heard that i've heard that the last season was bad i've never heard like be careful with your tv show recommendations you don't want to recommend a show that you think is awesome and then we watch it and it's like what terrible you don't want that to happen i feel like he's referencing something specific but i just can't think of what it is devs look i i don't know no i'm not i'm not referencing devs devs i'm not referencing devs they devs again no i don't want to say it again mock the week i like mock the week how do you know it's internally inconsistent you're eternally inconsistent you screwed up huh didn't get rid of that red one you put it down with shouldn't have i'm not doing red yet i'm doing green you should respect the fact that i'm doing green ringy yeah uh what does the panel think of warhammer 40k all right yeah i got i got nothing to say on it unfortunately i don't really know much about it looks fine so you don't want to recommend a show what kind of advice is this for any i see you don't understand that is the advice you don't understand sarcasm oh no damn pretty slaughtering these people ultimately if you recommend a show via a super chat it will at best go to the very long list like yeah what will it worst happen it won't even make it to a list oh because like i feel like people people recommend shows i mean i appreciate the spirit but like if we were going out and watching all these shows we get recommended i don't think we'd have time to do if not probably not um the list is still long i still i'm totally fine with recommendations it's just that yeah i hope they do it knowing that very little chance that anything will actually because i don't even fucking follow my own recommendations list as in yeah i know what i want to see and then i don't even see that yeah like i'm gonna go i'm gonna get my own list first and then uh yeah unless there is something very like unless there's something very specific about it like it falls into a category of film that i want to see more of or something like if you recommend being a space archaeology film there's a good chance to watch it um all right i was a rough idea i was in like a as a as in a sci-fi a sci-fi film that's like about uncovering old like old stuff that is science fiction old space um old space stuff like a like an ancient crashed spaceship i that's my crack i love that um that's how the movie sphere which i thought was pretty cool beer as um i think i i specifically said someone's name you'll jackson in it yeah it has he's good in it oh yeah um i remember i think i said yeah i like those kinds of movies and someone recommended me one in chat and uh i went and watched it and i liked it a lot so yeah that's that's that's the only way way i'm likely like to watch the recommendation i think because if it's something i'm specifically looking for more all right jay yes reading out the sycophantic messages flat cold dead voice this is my favorite part oh yeah i have to go this is my favorite part i keep forgetting about the sycophantic but like yeah that's really amazing what what is this oh you're not familiar with that story no no boy oh we were doing we did about four super chat catch ups in a row and oh yes no i am particularly with that chop yeah they oh yeah you would we were they when we read these out i thought you might have been there yeah i was there i just i just i forgot the word sycophantic and i i'm i'll be honest i'm not entirely sure what it means it's like oh basically just you're you're a fanboy kind of like you're just mindlessly yeah yeah you someone in chat asks jay it's not in space but have you seen the dig i have not seen the dig here's the thing there's an old macintosh game that i used to play that was called the dig and it takes place in space all right 2021 film that's new oh my goodness does it look good oh i've seen a clip from this i think it looked interesting yeah all right then yeah that's that we can watch it yeah that sounds like fun almost forgot all super chat money's bribery so you don't look at my 40k channel lol also did you do a voiceover for a certain indie game yeah uh empires of the undergrowth you can get it on steam if you really want to listen to me guide you through an ant game kind of neat that's such a kind of new ass shit talk current project um well i've played it and i like it i'm probably gonna play it when it gets released again because i think we had played a game but you're narrating well i've said it before but there's this clip it's like a twitch cut out from when i played it back in 2014 or 15 but i'm obviously it's very much like narrative driven even though there's challenges and so like i think and they use all of the like genus names for the well all the insects and so when you encounter a beetle for the first time it's like delivered very dramatically and it's like in a in a place it's like a very boss like and then i i'm like this is the you know blah blah blah blah beetle it's it it comes it weighs it whatever blah blah it's like one of the kings of the it's just stuff like that you know i mean um and like i was doing really well in the game and i'd already stacked up like a whole army and i killed him before i delivered finished delivering the introduction nice so it's just a corpse that i was describing as super threatening oh no it's gonna get me um you'll sweat at this game you'll sweat when you play as an ant trying to survive in a rough don't sweat they totally do it's a myth that they don't i don't know why do i feel like you're lying to me it's what the deep state told you fucking wake up sheeple what about shallow state what what are they up to they're like the post office no one cares that is what they are really i guess if anything's gonna be the shallow state post office yeah they spin some lies here and there there's nothing big no yeah we lost your package we didn't open it and fucking piss on it and take all of your shleems woof i wouldn't joke about that for you there's a lot of people in the audience who are very sensitive about that fuck them damn it hey it was cancelled well you had a good run jay you're the best rock on you massive thank you very nice i was gonna say imagine if uh the person in charge of cancellation was a dude with a baseball bat he smashes your computer like you've been cancelled and then once you try and buy more computers he freezes your bank account and then he starts throwing bombs at you as you just walk down the street so that you have to run off oh that's my doorbell give me a second oh god he's coming for jay ah okay that's elation mad oh well as we said jay had a good run um hi what do you think will happen in mcu phase five i don't know i get the tone of that delivery was who the fuck like it could be anything and nothing in terms of ideas will tempt me to walk that's like the saddest part if someone says man are you looking at forward to dr strange four we're star lord and dr strange we've got to take down a rogue wander vision don't wonder whatever i should be like i mean they're gonna fuck it up so so is james gone doing it no all right well it was yeah all right mad i wonder what guardians is gonna look like without him i wonder i wonder if he can pull it off with the suicide squad i really want him to well i hope so been rewatching old episodes dunkeys what happens when a child is born in the chenobal exclusion zone and deprived oxygen at birth hi rags again how did it was someone linked it on the discord there was like a discussion of a thread about how someone was looking for a breakdown of dr who that wasn't i think five hours and someone was like um they linked a different one there was an hour and they were like jesus fucking christ can i have one that's 15 minutes or less um and someone was like okay but it's not going to be in very much depth and then they were like are you kidding me if you're someone like dunkey you can definitely get your points across very quickly and you can still like make them all i'm just like dunkey really okay this person is looking for someone who says like yeah the plot wasn't very good uh the characters yeah flat and um also like that's what they don't want like yeah anyway that's i'll give it a score of like two out of ten uh no four out of ten well anyway do you think that criticizing something means saying which things a bit that you thought were good and things that you thought were bad and that's it not elaborating um i'm gonna go and do something um be careful um i will thoughts on kibble smith the author that wrote santa's husband and character snowflake in safe space he is now writing blade for marvel fail upwards man i like the way that you phrase that thoughts on the guy who wrote this he's writing blade that's just snowflake in safe space that was like the laughing stock of the internet like why would yeah that was uh embarrassing why why would you call them safe space in snowflake because they're reclaiming them but yeah that was what they apparently want to do with everyone just was like please don't yeah everybody was saying that nobody was happy everyone just like done um yeah that should probably cover that um i feel bad for blade blade is like fucking cool factors through the roof and could get butchered uh don't know if it's the same thing but out of wilds two was announced and they said that they haven't even started development yet they still released a trailer man i don't know just seems like a bad idea i analyzed all of loki because of you long man worse than i thought it was doing invincible now it's a five or six so far which is quite refreshing oh is it wait do you you think is it a refreshing or is it five out of six of five or six invincible right yeah yeah uh yeah i am asking is it really refreshing maybe but is it just received a message that the domain name killwithme.com from the movie untraceable that we mentioned in stream is available for four thousand nine hundred dollars wow that's pricey um okay that seems strange i don't know what any other means but i would have thought with whatever things that movie's about you wouldn't want to just i don't know you would want to stay away from any sense of uh like hey wouldn't it be deep to buy because i could picture people like i want to fake it i want to buy the thingy and then have videos of people dying that are prerecorded but show the view count going up just to be like the movie or something to be like oh god if that domain existed and i didn't know what it was i wouldn't visit it kill with me yeah it doesn't seem but if i knew of the movie but i didn't know what was on the actual website and existed i wouldn't visit um can gemorian gods be lifeguards does that count in their society i need to know where this fits into the law i think they could be lifeguards coastguards all sorts of yeah i think they would call themselves gemorian gods when doing it but um guarding is the important part yeah as long as they're guarding something that's really all the matters that's what it means to be a gemorian god that would be the arc of the story it's not what you god it's that you god yeah that is enough to be a gemorian god is enough that's honestly pretty beautiful i will say yeah it could be it could you could tell a story out with that um okay so i'm just gonna read this one out all right okay this is just gonna be read out you know i bet the way i bet the way atla ended how it assassinated aang by having him more about his morals and millions of people's lives inspired a lot of writers working now oh that's the spicy meatball you say that one more time they are they are looking to piss chat off i'm thinking it's it's about the finale for atla the the big decision is whether or not he'll kill someone um to save sure it makes just as much incredible writing sense as the rest of the oh well captain midnight said that the beach episode is like incredible that was really fucking weird yeah that there was comments on the video saying like this is one of the greatest episodes i know well so so this is the thing that's something that we have trouble broaching with other people like some people think that dialogue is just on point yeah people just think it works oh my god it's like it was written by a 10 year old jesus christ i love having not seen this show right now jay you're complicit jay you're not saying i i i do not endorse you're not disagreeing so yeah you're you're part of this now you're part of this i've not seen the fucking show see jay isn't making it clear that these do not reflect the opinions of jxc foundations and productions so if you had you know people would understand but now you're just as responsible for all of the negativity that comes next fucking atlas fucking garbage oh i've not seen it oh no it's it's just really terrible well if i could choose between atla existing and um and another just genocide occurring like tomorrow i'd pick the genocide hey jay are you guys happy is that what you want hey jay you know if you have a character who's like conflicted about the progression and in terms of in like an arc they're like oh man you know i'm having different feelings about things do you do you think to represent that in a way that sort of tells the audience that's what they're experiencing i could have them shout why am i so bad at being good um um the emo an emo wow i think that's an important part of the um part of the are they a part of the emo subculture from like the early noughties to the late like 2010 obviously yes okay then it's fine yeah that's what i thought thank you why am i so bad at being what did you show me that the first time that's the thing i had no bias in favor or gay so i was just like what am i watching uh you returned from being kid who says that hmm yeah he says that yeah he's like the character who's widely cited as like one of the best yeah as long as it's all time yep yeah you hear that a lot oh god shush it's gonna be reddit threads why i'm just i can't get like why did good girls like bad guys out of my head after hearing that that's like the same vibe to me why are good girls like bad guys that's in my brain now thank you no problem it's a gift um would you rather a million tarantulas i rags i wags hello it just says would you rather a million tarantulas that's it i'd rather not i'd rather not yeah tarantulas they yeah i think they have physically larger fangs so that would probably like that could probably cause some actual damage if it was that many tarantulas are they more peaceful bros or yes they are they're typically pretty docile but um um i i held one as a child did it eat you no well if only here's thing if only if only five percent of tarantulas would be aggressive to you and you have a million of them that's still a big yeah i don't feel like yeah it's either like i don't feel like it's percentage wise i feel like it's situational like if i was in a room with a like a sheet there there have been situations where like sheep have attacked people but if i was in a room with a million i wouldn't be worried i feel yeah um well maybe because the aggressive ones it would take them so long to get to you they have to get through so many other sheep well maybe well i think it depends on how long we're stuck with these sheep do we have to form a society like while i'm here with them how much i feel like we're just passing through a room with that you're like you're just in a room oh oh yeah that that's cool i guess i'd just be worried if like we had to start rationing food and they start getting that look in their eye of like should we eat this food yeah but but they also eat food oh wait but they're not let's assume that they are carnivorous even though they're not i would not want to have to be the person there because one sheep just needs to say eat eat that guy and all the other sheep will say yeah that's a good idea guy oh because they're sheep that's right what about um a million dogs oh a million it depends what type of you mean a million friends well yeah exactly like well it depends on what type of dog we're talking about statistically like probably there's a percentage of dogs that would attack you well like i said i feel like what the fuck calm down but it depends on what dog they are there's some dogs aren't so nice they're to me yeah like the shark dog or the panda dog they're like very that's true the tyrannosaurus dog i know those have been pretty the tyrannosaurus dog it's just a giant furry tyrannosaurus little flimpy arms but like something nailed it my brain is starting to fry which is weird because it's really early so we're off to a great start today is this the start yeah um rags how do you manage to be so aggravating and attractive at the same time give the fellas some tips hashtag bass boy oh my goodness gracious um i don't know if it i can't just tell you that's the thing i can't not because it's like a secret i'm hiding right i don't think it's something that i can just tell you how to do it's a it is an emergent property of a journey of self-discovery that could take many years to complete and if the way was made clear it would not be the way so i'm not sure that i can just tell you how to get to that result and i'm not sure that i really would want to i think that you should be a first rate version of yourself not a second rate version of somebody else good point i just i could i agree completely so so true uh would you oh wait what's more dangerous the hopkins flesh and or the ledger scar spider the hopkins flesh ant i think so yeah hopkins flesh and does that reference because hopkins flesh and ledger scar yeah i think it's a reference to joker and Hannibal yeah and i think i would rather do with joker than Hannibal yeah i think joker is unstable enough and i feel like Hannibal's too clever and crafty and smart and he bides his time i feel like there's the volatility of joker is his downfall i think you get comfortable with Hannibal you know like he'd make you feel like your friends i never feel like i've won with Hannibal i'd be like oh god what are you gonna do next what are you what are you playing out here what are you gonna do to me and he would never say something like oh wait no i'm mixing up leto i was mixing up leto jokers like could you imagine having to hang out with leto joker forever oh geez that's the thing i'd like to talk to Hannibal i would never like to talk about jokers like no no no no no you imagine oh the horror i thought nobody should have to be forced to do that i fear no man but that thing scares me yeah um huge fan e-faps kept me company in the worst period of my life so thank you so much for providing us so much amazing content for free no pro belay mode dude hope you're doing all right thanks dude yeah hope things are getting better for you bringy which ratchet and clank games have you played and which are your favorites um i have played a good number of them my i think i haven't played the new one because ps5 um my favorites are basically the playstation 2 1 so 1 2 3 and deadlocked uh in order will probably be 2 3 1 deadlocked or 3 2 1 deadlocked i'm not sure um highly recommend the playstation 2 1 uh the playstation 3 ones i like as well crack and time is is really cool um but yeah some cool puzzles in that game like legitimately sort of clever um i would i would have played a whole game of uh those clank puzzles actually no really good so yeah pretend from being kicked impossible no one can have this level of power kick them again do it now look do it now just half kicked muted that's that's like being kicked i should suffice for now i'm unmuted i finished my joint jesus oh my goodness gracious jubilee christmas um i'm really annoyed because i wanted to have my joint like just before my my delivery arrived my food um but the the order tracker wasn't working so it was like 20 like it was like your order has been confirmed well like you know when the driver's on the way and then my doorbell rings and i'm like well normally this would be great but i wanted to schedule something around this like can we help can you tell us what it was and you're like no actually we're too fast do not fail me again uh but you did an amazing job on that game by the way more the first time i played it because i was listening to the soma video for the millionth time and i was i'm sorry wait i need to read this again you did an amazing job on that game by the way more that's a full sentence i'm assuming i don't know if they're referring to lego um first time i played it because i was listening to the soma video for the one millionth time and the the ants must protect the nest and i was like what the fuck lol oh that's something i say a lot in that game the ants must protect the nest because i think if you lose the nest you're fucked you must you must build additional pylons i had to record a whole bunch of lines because i think i'm sorry i'm not enough of a nerd for you i'm not a nerd i just have a good memory what's that more i had to do like uh reading the line more intensely every time because it all leads to like i think i think the last one i recorded was like you have lost the nest this is like no man that's terrifying oh yeah the game is very intense at points because uh i want to play this well as far as i know they're still working on it so um give it give it time it'll get a full release and then you'll have a big ant game with me being all dramatic about you not taking care of your ants it was it's it's still being developed it was and like it's not been fully released yet yeah it's early access and working on it for ages they got like a whole 2014 i believe so that's how long they've been working on it like the big major project right there yeah yeah and they um obviously it's they're an indie studio so they're just trying to get like they release as they create and they're just like fund us and we will make more i'm surprised that you've never been required to taking that long for development they must have like really planned that well because i'm you if you if you never had to record like additional voice lines for it i've done two major sections i believe a third might be on the way oh cool i didn't know that that was ongoing when was the last one that was a while ago i think i want to say like i think it was 20 late 2018 maybe 2019 boy yeah hopefully i my voice doesn't sound too much different like i i just i look like 50 years later and i can you do it i'm like i guess so i must protect the nest so i'm sleepy now um oh that's probably what they meant by you did an amazing job in the game they probably meant my voice over so thank you uh movie bulb crashes through your room via portal he reaches his hand and says please come to the real world with me do you do it fuck no so say that one more time so movie bob crashes into your room via portal and he reaches out his hand to you and says please come to the real world with me i mean my first thing would be to ask follow-up questions to make my decision well if i'm only allowed to decide yes or no i'm going with no i don't know what this creature is trying to trap me into doing yeah i i feel like here's so my no is the default but you have like why would you if you can make portals and your movie bob why would you do does he find me worthy of coming to his beautiful new world or his what his version of what that would be or why why from if he's saying come to the real world with me i'm assuming he's like someone from like beyond this reality in some way like you know it's a matrix situation or something like there's another layer of reality that my reality exists in so i assume that it's not movie bob from this reality because he's from this reality yeah it could be a worse one unless he has avatars in like unless that's his like avatar in this reality i guess um and like he regularly hops between the two um maybe that maybe that's the possibility but i would assume that he is not actually the movie bob i'm aware of or at least if he is that some that he may have many reasons to be to be doing the things he does as movie bob and not all of the meat you know maybe he has some goal with his actions that would explain a lot see i think that if it was pertinent or super important that i come with him then he wouldn't require like my compliance you just open a portal underneath me or something so the fact that he's my permission makes me think there's some kind of weird juju going on where i he needs my permission in order to to do something and you know maybe with no further elaboration i i fail to trust this maybe it's like morpheus he just he just wants to know if you're up for it you know yeah well you know what you can make that clear in fact more morpheus gives a whole explanation before that but all we have is a giant movie bob in our in our room and i just i'm not gonna trust it please play shadow the edge hog or sink the hedgehog um i'm gonna admit i'm probably not gonna do that so sorry fans of sanik what are you doing to the sanik the hedgehog sanik you can really move can he can he though do we money do we father i know what that references uh bowels track of doctor who videos are great no they're not you are incorrect well i've not seen i don't think i have seen that like this you're probably you're probably incorrect about a lot of things to arrive at that perspective damn and that's from doctor who fucking aficionado five-hour video so you know you how can you disagree how can you disagree i would be interested in watching a bowels track video with you guys that would be fun this is the same person that said please please shout out the hedgehog by the way feel bad no shadow the hedgehog hearing fringy was i don't feel bad fuck bowels track he's a piece of shit oh my goodness who is that um some con all i know about bowels track is that uh he's another sort of doctor who commentator maker of videos who's uh friends with like a lot of the fandom menace people and um has done streams with drinker that's all i know i don't yeah i don't know anything jay's not a fan of bowels tracks videos from what i understand no it's like your opinion bro i'm just gonna walk around on this banther until i find studs hearing fringy was writing a book gave me the courage to commit to my passion and go into cyber security just got 100 on midterm and close to degree oh sweet that's awesome dude yeah keep it up um pop quiz what color is a polar bear's skin underneath it's fair a white b black c transparent it's black why would i know this oh it's black well jay that doesn't answer jay's question so yes so you know it's a real transparent image if it's darker what are you using dark mode for google what the fuck are you talking what black we're living with polar bears oh i'm sorry what was the question poll what color skin the polar bears have is it white black or transparent or translucent well their noses are black so i assume the rest of the skin is probably black if you were listening yeah you have the answer ready it's black how would you i knew that i knew that already i really did that's that's i know i actually really did yeah it's one of those just little fun facts that i know because you know polar bears they have white fur but underneath yeah i know that i think that's how i remember it because it's like you wouldn't expect that but yeah you really wouldn't i thought they were pink skinned uh it's funny you look i think you look at polar bears you're like oh cute and it's like but you really don't want to be next to one like that you really don't want to be anywhere near it um polar bears despite their pleasant demeanor you are you should be scared if you can see one what if it's a friendly polar bear wow the problem is that like friend what does it mean to be a friendly polar bear in terms of relative to like anti-social polar bear like what does an anti-social polar bear look like i don't know it just feels a little bit racist i'm gonna say that like you're like oh see a polar bit better stay away statistically they hurt people it's like damn okay you know i think there's some friendly ones out there and you shouldn't be so prejudiced there probably are some friendly ones out there yeah can anyone there's anyone in life who's fucked up or about probably not i feel like that's gonna be unlikely like even though with everything we know about how long humans have been around stuff and that there's a potential i feel like that one's not happened you get i feel like one yeah you get one person who's determined enough to fuck a polar bear man they will get literal the ends of the earth only get torn to shreds before they can do that oh yeah hold up hold up it doesn't have to be alive oh oh no i feel like even then that's never happened like you would be the first person in existence to have ever done it if you did it so chat if you're listening you can be the first i don't want to encourage people to do that so um i i think that in all of human history with all the polar bears that have been shot on expeditions potentially one of those guys was crazy enough to just go and fuck it just to say that he did just to say that he did i don't know i feel like a little question i don't know i haven't heard of it yet i can though because why would somebody boast about that well why do who knows why mad men do is i feel like if you're a point where you're doing it you may be at a point where you're boasting about it like you know right because what we're like if you're strange enough to do it in the first place your priorities are far enough removed from what i understand momentary reason to be momentary lapse in judgment you know we've all done it we've all just sat there you're looking at it just and you do it as soon as you finish you just like vomit you know because you're so upset like why not fuck it that's what the brain does for some reason yeah you just why not the nearest the nearest other like the nearest woman is is 500 miles away and like an ocean and several like sheet like and lots of ice i'm fucking this polar bear do you guys ever imagine you'd see this image in in star wars no it's uh yeah flash pour it yes he just wants to play oh just wants to play reminds me of that video with the deer that goes over the slide this is george lucas it's original fishing oh yeah it's better than sequel trilogy wow if the sequel trilogy was this on loop for the duration of all three films it would be improved yes the lego windmills mola the lego windmills what do i do with them i don't remember i've i've thrown all kinds of things to help hit them at them and i i don't know i don't know what else is there let me know let me know chat uh is something i'm not doing because i've completely forgotten mola jumbo in your critiques right um and i've got a question if you find a like a visual effect that is so bad that it's conspicuously a visual effect in some way that changes that if you acknowledge what it actually looks like it changes the meaning of the scene would you count that as um the same as poor writing so essentially let's say something is supposed to be levitating but it's clearly on a string would you count it as in it's canonically being on a string or not that's an interesting question shows you it's on a string but it's all the characters are acting as if it's not um i think that's gonna have to just be case by case i suppose like i'm thinking of like if the context were like there's literally like a mutant who can you know use telekinesis in some marvel movie but you can clearly see the strings and then you're supposed to try and think about like wait so why were the strings there was he faking it was he setting it all up to trick them and someone's like no i think that's just that's just how they were lifting it special effects wise and so um then you just have to i suppose make the decision of what would be considered um special effects versus not and if someone else is to make the argument that um no we cannot accept that as a special effect you know because this comes into the the coffee cup in um in Game of Thrones i've talked about this before but some people will be like you know it's just a little little mistake who cares about that and it's like well i mean if someone was being as bad faith as possible couldn't they say like this is evidence that starbucks exists and the capacity and technology to create these cups as well as storing you know caffeine in this way or some shit like that and it's like does that not present many issues and what about does it mean that there's a this whole civilization it's actually post the future where um everything fell apart and that they've just found this coffee cup or some shit like that you know the only the only thing that makes it work in the story is our metatextual understanding that it's not supposed to be there um i suppose someone could make the argument as well to a degree that it could be a trick of the camera slash light and then if someone was like we can't assume that ever i'd be like what about if someone said like you know like the lines that can appear in like older stuff or film grain this extreme the starbucks cup um well it's funny enough they airbrushed that out so now it's just a matter of which one you're judging the original or the airbrushed that changes that up but also just if there's enough grain you're like there's this creature in in this shot what does he want who is he from his name is steve um but yeah interesting to think about and i suppose it'll be up to the reviewer decide if they want to consider that a canon explanation for the thing happening itself or if it's a special effects mistake or just shitty special effect yeah uh yeah i'm happy that we've worked that off because nothing more to do with the windmills guys if i don't know what to do what do i do with i don't want to know don't want no what to do new you've been on that for 44 minutes well i mean it's really chill because i'm just running around and answering questions you know i don't really mind but yes i've been in this lego playground for 44 minutes adj some people like to enjoy the journey we're not rushing to get to the end tell you oh god rags run i can run pretty fast with weaponry i can also run passive weaponry i because i am the weapon is there a reason why you guys seem to only play lego games on streams that's how long i've been playing them now the rest of them have been forgotten it's your current phase yeah and when you're gonna do every three streams beats luigi's mansion well everyone's indiana jones next indiana jones is not on gamecube so we will see indiana jones desktop adventures not that one but uh oh okay yeah this is the last stream you'll see the complete the original trilogy star wars lego game someone else next time but you know can't really be indiana jones that's not on gamecube guys there's just no possible way i could stream that so sorry sorry are we ever gonna get another soma-like series of videos i understand why they take an insane amount of time and effort um so if i was to do a full breakdown on for example captain america civil war or the haunting of blyor hillhouse um i would see it being that sort of way but if you're talking about specifically a game as well as looking into like all the interviews around it and then lots of like concept stuff and just sort of deriving a bit of a detailed breakdown analysis a lot like the soma one um i i would never want to promise anything uh i really liked making that one and i wouldn't be against making another but no guarantees of what will come in the future except obviously i'm definitely still making more uh movie breakdowns and stuff a lot talking about movies um help i lost my place in buffy i was just at the part where thing is said uh i didn't understand and i can't remember what episode that was so that episode you find that out uh like very early on if you're talking about when we find out as an audience then that's like episode i'll say like four or something it's when oh fuck i should know the name of the episode i'm disappointed but i don't um but if you're talking about when everyone finds out i believe that episode is called blood ties so hopefully that helps but um if you just look at the episode synopsis on like i'm db from episode one forward you you know you should be able to tell which one you were on you can't type eric kaya sciara mella i guess on youtube correctly replace the k with a c and remove the h from the last name you know that that message being translated into just like vocals for the rest of us we're just not gonna get that i'm not sure i get it and now i'm suspicious that it might be some kind of naughty word or something if youtube doesn't even let you do it like penis yeah like big schlonger i mean like the p word mm-hmm all right i should i shouldn't have said penis i'm gonna do it again oh fuck i said fuck oh no oh it's a cast it's a rags cascade it's it isn't cascades you're right wow fringy just because polar bears have black skin hey look you connected those dots i did no such thing yeah you need to think about what you're saying um rags has some strange fetishes about polar bears and jay's racist against polar bears no this time on eflat 145 no i don't want to fuck a polar bear i'm saying that i think that in humanity's collective history right someone has fucked a polar bear the only takes one i think it's happened humanity never ceases to you know surprise me amaze yeah i would be amazed if someone fucked a polar bear i would be i think i would be more amazed if they had sex with it while it was alive what a pretty chad move not not gonna lie but uh definitely definitely amazing i will say that incredible um maybe it's uncredible like i can't i don't even know if i could believe it maul you described the entire premise pretty much a 40k with your comment on starbucks cup saying the society collapsed etc oh and it was like the current one was built on a destroyed past one or something i could believe it um all righty also um fringy how long do we have you for because you said all right all right you got me a little bit longer in which case we will go for a half hour more and uh we've caught up with today's super chats so that's a fucking excellent we did it um awesome i will now read uh the streamlabs to keep up with them so what about an efap on karen woke horror movie i could see us covering that at some point that movie looks hilarious erin yeah woke horror have you seen the trailer rags i'm assuming you haven't no i haven't um a little black family move into a neighborhood and there's this karen who's like excuse me about like all the normal stuff like putting the bins in the right place or maybe parking your car correctly or don't make any noise after a certain amount of time um but then turns out she's part of a cult and she's gonna try and sacrifice them to a god or some shit oh my goodness that's totally credible so yeah i mean i i think it would be hilarious i think she calls them snowflakes at some point so there you go with the price of admission already uh you know mutually i still can't get used to how you pronounce the letter h it's almost like you're saying hate somewhat lol probably a british thing yeah you're supposed to say the actual sound yeah well i can do what i want i'm in freedom land no you're not you're in wales freedom land you're in the honorary freedom land kingdom of the united yeah and that's it's freedom land is that the freedom land yeah it's nice and big and i've got honorary freedoms from nice and big with pranks that's that's amusing nice and big the united kingdom is that are you upset i'm not upset i just find that interesting that's all big i don't think i've ever heard the united kingdom described as a large country i mean i'll be honest with you i know it's can be a surprise but i am not as big as the united kingdom and so it does come across as large to me when i walk around in it the united kingdom is not as big as australia so i mean compared to a person the united kingdom is very big i think so too yeah i think so too i think that's the only scale we use is the comparative size to a person so like i i feel like we got a better one which is comparative scale of countries but i think i think that's unfair yeah i think that's unfair and united kingdom is not a country of anything oh the size of anything sure yeah no to describe the size of anything at any time you have to just say very big big small this many people small if you like this medium um is there a medium yeah is there a medium like very big big medium small oh yeah i guess they'll be about the same yeah yeah we have to have it about the same so and that's like even for like scientific like stuff scientific stuff like engineering projects it's like how long does this uh like there's this piece of metal need to be oh um about the same this is the future we liberals want yeah uh i had a super chat for 117 or 118 i'm pretty sure that compared the tropes used in one woman 84 to those in not another team movie and asked if you had seen that movies before such what you thought of it i think we covered that one actually we did catch up with it and i just i've seen not another team movie i don't know how it connects to one woman 84 i definitely don't remember enough to say that but i remember being amusing i don't know if it's any good though hello rags hi there given your opinion on anime in general you mostly like stuff like ghost in a shell but would say that 99 of popular stuff's kind of garbage i can understand this and in accordance with that view i would strongly recommend monster from 2004 all righty that's our charles there on right oh that paddy jenkins directed that movie i don't think they're talking about that for me oh oh that's oddly convenient timing then i mean it would feel really weird if they said i know you don't like most of anime but you might like this live action movie starting to throw him like that i guess the weird things in evap chat is that wait have i got that totally wrong was that the name of the film it was definitely the name of the film i just was it out in 2004 it was out in 2003 and there is also a film called monsters in 2004 short there are a lot of movies called monster like there's a really big list here a lot of them wow so on a reason there's a lot of things that could refer to a lot of different kind of things you know yeah but like monster there's like 20 here because of course you've got the monster then the monster then the monster then monster then the monster then monsters ink which is the most unique one here monster monsters what about the monsters you're the monsters yeah i i i think you're not your average family let me keep going down the list so we're up to monsters monsters the monster again monster monster monsters so there is no movie called the monsters there is only the monster and monsters and monster well i heard you earlier say monster energy then the monsters and is that a movie or is that just another label because i'd like to see the film called then monsters oh god look at this list and apparently there's like 20 songs that are called monster monster monster monster monster yeah there's like 20 of them i love that you read out examples from the list yeah just to make it clear there's a lot there's a lot there's a lot of them called i would like to read from you the list of the word monster here i go and here you go monster south korean tv series monster anime a 2004 japanese anime television series monsters an american television series monsters a japanese television series and the monster the tv series and also there are several episodes of tv shows called monster or monsters including the flash aquatin hunger force and star wars the clone wars and the walking dead all right and also several books called monster and monsters and the monster all right moving on what about stage please i don't see any stage plays called monster disappointing there are a lot of albums called monster too but again we we're getting stuck in the weeds here let's let's move on iraq's jay what would win with a Siberian tiger grizzly bit we actually asked this yeah jay said inconclusive right yeah um can you please qualify your statement regarding lost give five specific things wrong with the show all i hear from you is nothing but smoke monster bad okay so smoke monster bad that's one of the main ones actually fucking hideously wrong and stupid but um well this is the kind of thing where say for example i said someone traveled across the universe via the power of love and you said oh you just said that that's bad you haven't explained it it's the kind of thing where i'm like hmm i don't think you're ready to have these conversations um yeah i mean i'd have to rewatch last i haven't seen it since uh i want to say last time i watched season one and two was like three or four years ago or something and it was only those two because when i watched three i was like oh no the writing's dying i'm out how many seasons is it six maybe seven because i remember that finale coming out like that was the first yeah i thought that i think i remember all the tv shows finale was that before after sopranos sopranos was it was lost was off to sopranos which means sopranos probably the first time people got pissed off with the finale right well it's the first one i remember oh okay i remember one that i remember um people were really upset or some people were yeah enough that i remember people being upset about it is it actually bad or is it just um i don't know i never watched the show that's the love that cuts a black mid-sentence that's what i understand yeah we well it's not even mid-sentence it's a bunch of characters may or may not have died that's the ending you don't know whether they've died or not yeah which is interesting because one of the best endings of something kind of not sure what you're referring to there but if um if it's going to be depending on execution i'd imagine because it could be related to the you know whatever storylines that match whoever's involved with whatever feels like an isolation i could never judge if that's any good which you could say the same for lost in that it was purgatory it's like hmm yeah spoilers which i'm sure someone's gonna get pissed off in chat it wasn't that actually you didn't understand it it was blah blah i'm just like it's fine don't worry about it it's totally fine i'm out i'm i'm leaving the lost train okay i left it a long time ago chances for ono's finale was good well i know for a fact that that one's in contention much more than say dexter or game of thrones or something like that where everyone fucking hates them um the soprano's one is discussed at length which i think is a better sign of it being probably a much stronger ending than the others um but you know lost actually at one season they introduced time travel did you guys know that i didn't watch lost i never watched lost characters i can't remember what it is that does it but they they find a way to travel through time and um oh my man careful wow that's something to drop on a show and one of my favorite characters had to go back to britain i think to look after his mum or something and so they had to write him out and he just was fucking casually killed by the black smoke monster at the end of an episode it's one of the most disappointing that's how i remember the black smoke monster so fuck you piece of shit it's representative of like the island has like a person who dresses in white and represents like the goodness of the island and then someone dresses in black and is like the badness and he turns into the black smoke monster and eats people i like the idea that the black smoke monster haunts your dreams you know you go to sleep and you see the black smoke monster well now i'm gonna ruin your shows that's me black smoke monster that could be done well so it's like time travel bad it's like yeah fucking 90 of the time yeah they fuck it up all the time very very different it seems to be an extremely difficult thing to write because it's a very tough thing and it has major consequences every time yeah it's not like you're organizing a fucking birthday party yeah it's complicated i would have to i played lost the video game i'm pretty sure it was on like ps2 or something but uh yeah lost is a crazy one you know what maybe in 2036 we'll do a lost doc we'll watch through it on you fat mini and uh give give our perspective on it there you go guys just wait a little bit you'll get it um hi hi rags hi there UK citizens are just proto-americans and Aussies have failed Britons oh shit oh that's kind of true yeah for free free free agree otherwise you would have free left he would have agreed he does agree otherwise he would have spoken i've agreed what or what um i think it's just sad that you agree with also australia is kata chan 40k reference trust me it's fun i don't i don't like that i don't what i like what was i like the idea that in 40k or like australia is just a reference to something in 40k not the other way around i think you agree with our free your kata chan in australia i don't know what that is so i'm not gonna it's like a 50-50 kata chan is that a character in an anime sounds like it doesn't it kata chan hey don't train that's chan is that's a nothing to do with it that's a moonspeak word right oh god they're throwing they're throwing shade free how isn't the moon god um oh yay free you have a large country all right a country where humans live on the edges making up like what 20 percent of the continent the rest dry arid deserts and land lel still love you cheers isn't a pretty significant that comment with a roller coaster in the united states like giant desert though what country are you from come on we'll we'll we'll give you a go oh the you mean the soup chata i don't know yeah like the called doth gene cream veda so i don't know if that tells you anything about where they're from oh definitely what are you saying about deserts why are you so prejudiced again because there's nothing there there's nothing there without the sahara desert the amazon rainforest wouldn't exist why because the sand from the sahara getting uh blown across the atlantic ocean is like really important for stabilizing the amazon ecosystem yeah how didn't you know know that jake jeez what the little like the little things flapping on your craft there yeah just floats on it so it looks like uh something's wrong looks like there must be a thruster underneath it that we can't see that's keeping it all i guess the um i swear when i played this game the little like the gray sticks poking out of it they they they flapped like little wings well you know what maybe mine's broken okay they like they're i said it mine's broken i guess am i right about that is that what's supposed to be happening here chat of mixed opinions changing the subject i'm what was it before um so you know this is another adventure of a super chat i think i'm gonna unsub i'm tired of these bs analysis and these stupid super chat catch up this isn't interesting why do you keep reading this do you like me do you want to me to push you up against a wall and kiss you yeah that was a roller coaster that wow that was yeah i just that took turns that i wasn't expecting it to and isn't that the most important thing i think so it's about family i'm too tired i'll watch this video later but if you're reacting to full fat his best videos that i've seen in my opinion a humble opinion or iron man and Thanos i've not seen all of his videos i mean we didn't react to him we were reacting with him in a way where he reacted at him i mean as he reacted at us yeah i suppose um and he seemed pretty chill uh check out his channel i guess i'm mollo we know you would run from the duck sized horse but which one of your panel do you think could take it not rags he'd do weird things uh-huh they apparently excluded you from this rags you do weird things to the horse-sized duck it's it's already conclusive i guess what do i make a saddle for it so they're asking me out of jane fringy who do i think would best battle the horse-sized duck huh who would best battle the horse i don't think you have a choice in this little scenario i want to hurt the duck i like ducks a lot what if what if it attacks you or your family i would leave what if it a location what if you what if a trolley is heading toward a duck and you could save it by pushing the duck is a really big fan of the current doctor who run like serious yeah what about that big fan oh man i know it's a duck i don't want to hurt this duck is coming at you with a knife i like i like ducks what do you think what if it comes at you with a knife yeah yeah this duck is coming at you with a knife go like oh man this changes everything yeah i'm not so friendly now i honestly regardless if they if they something was coming to me with a knife my first instinct wouldn't be fight and that's not like a baby no but that was the requirement that was the that was the requirement anyway you can't get by him you have to kill the whole premise is you're not running you're fighting i would leave you can't you can't leave you're an open doors what's it you're in an arena you have to find you're in a coliseum around building jay you're in a round building yeah i'm in a round building yeah now what he's coming oh he's coming you gotta make a decision he's coming at you he's going quack quack um i will decide quack quack quack quack quack quack quack quack quack quack quack quack quack quack quack quack quack quack quack quack quack quack quack quack quack quack quack quack quack quack quack quack quack quack quack quack quack quack quack quack quack quack quack quack quack quack quack quack quack quack quack quack quack quack quack quack quack quack quack quack quack quack quack quack quack quack quack quack quack quack quack quack quack quack quack quack quack quack quack quack quack quack quack quack quack quack quack quack quack quack quack quack quack quack quack quack quack quack quack quack quack quack quack quack quack quack quack qu Take it around and you in such sort of rip out your organs. What are you gonna do Jay? For you, he's going to be a hot gory and less hurry Jay the heart hurry. I made it more glory on purpose You have to stab the heart to make it horrifying. He's cut. He's he's getting there. He's reaching for the heart I just bought you. I win So you burst that's how you kill it you allow it to consume you and then you burst out of its body Yeah, but that's not what's happened. It's just ripped your heart out. I was gonna say it's inside you, so I Don't want to hide all right. Well you die and I guess This isn't a plausible scenario Oh, is it not don't have to test this is a cracker be cracked world. This is a Quite This scenario does not have to fit within my principles because it I like the idea of a giant duck assassin Who kills people and says you've just been quacked? Yeah That that feels like a that feels like a ten season series right there He doesn't want you know the the life found him and he didn't find it and he's Killed so many people by quacking at them and he wonders it was so far gone That's also my answer at this point Jay would die freeing you would stand a chance. I'm not sure what his plans would be though I'm not sure what my plans would be because I feel like I need to keep it on land for the home field advantage But if I'm in water, I'm a little bit more nervous. Could it finally be the time for you to utilize your goo? I No, I can say time for you use it. I can handle this one. Yeah, I'll save it for rainy day All right, I Think I heard once that Gilmore del Toro wanted to adapt the monsters anime the monster anime into a live-action TV show Cannot confirm this however. I Could believe it Mulla, I believe you have to float along with the floating house and the studs should be at the top. Hi. How are you frags Jay? You know what I'm doing. All right Well, okay Catachan is a planet in 40k where all the insects plants and animals are trying to murder you and are as big or as big as a car Or bigger damn That's how it's like Australia Hmm. Oh, yeah, I guess it would be a bit fuck a bit like Australia in that way I'm from Canada. So I have an adverse reaction to deserts or deserts Um, and no, I don't live in northern Canada lol. It should have said CAD Mulla What should have said CAD I am like living in northern Canada. It's like that's it. Oh, yeah, it should CAD would be. Oh, yeah That we would have given it away. Well, see I was too distracted by the gene cream Veda thing. I'm sorry Aren't we all yeah I think the characters on lost is some of the best in television history, especially Sawyer What's your favorite and least favorite characters? Oh, that's a tough one because I Really like a lot of the characters in Lost. They're pretty good Little kidneys they go through. Yeah. Yeah, the first two seasons. That's the whole reason you're watching the show you with every character basically they present themselves as X and You find out from before they got on to the plane and why they were on the plane is very significant to Know where they're going forward and a lot of them are trying to start like almost new lives or lives Or they're keeping something from everybody that is seriously important to know in order to protect yourself in some way Lots of mysteries and craziness It's like a box it well There's a guy who was paralyzed before he came and he has the use of his legs on the island What does that mean? Hmm. Oh my goodness gracious. That sounds like a mystery box. Oh Lost has seven trillion of those What's JJ is finest, right? There's the show for that. Yeah, it's like every episode tries to end with some kind of like What was that and you go? I don't know next time. Bye questions are exciting, but the answers, you know that part You can figure that out later It's another like the finale was criticized like not answering most of the mystery boxes in the show Either that or just being a really just dissatisfying answer But probably the probably both actually Jay ducks are assholes. You don't have to feel bad about beating them up. I Want you want to beat them up or you want to feel bad about beating them up? Yeah Thanks for helping me make this Wednesday fun. Hope everything everyone has a good Thursday to hello Jay dr. Fring rags and didn't hear Hello, man, it's already Thursday, so we'll see just this day for a little Britain as well Let's hope it goes good. I disagree liar It's an adaptation So monsters an adaptation based off a crime thriller and it's set in the 1980s 90s Germany surrounded by the fall of the Berlin war and the wall in the collapse of communism and the stories about a serial killer similar to how you described GITS it's good despite being anime. Oh, yeah, there you go Spells gets shouldn't say that a man chooses a space lizard melts. It's true For more a guide to American politics the right wing to his principal Snyder the left wing is spike and libertarians Just want everyone to enjoy the fucking prom I Know what I could see someone breaking Buffy down a bit of bazillion times that way Do reviewers like this gen genuinely enjoy these stories almost so do they enjoy the idea that they're in the correct group because they Like it do they spend hours talking about these stories like we did pre-woke or about the people who disagree So I was actually talking to As in Gary about this I don't believe so like, you know how there's lots of content We still reference and come back to a lot of the time I feel like Loki Wanda vision and falcon women soldier are just not gonna be that those shows ever Nobody in ten years from now will be like, oh man. I love this premise. It's the kind of the It does have a fast food kind of quality to it Yeah, well cuz by the time it's done the next things out, you know, it's like Loki's done All right, what if and then after that? Oh, it's like Shang-Chi and then after that all like Hawkeye Then after that, it's always about the next thing hot potato's ending is hey watch Hawkeye Shang-Chi's ending will be all what's like, I don't know if she hawk or something Eternals will be like, oh watch Eternals to Doctor Strange age of Ultron again Yeah, you have a constant in every fucking thing now, but all the time. Yeah Like yeah, it just seems that they've cracked the phone or in for this I'm like Marvel for this Marvel started this Yeah Cuz the Mandalorians are symptoms still right? It's not like the cause Man, yes, Mando is I will say the Luke Skywalker one cost us big time Yes That was like I do this. Hey, you're fine. All right. We at EFAP Emporium including Jay as well But this one blame all of you for that. Okay, you listen Who loved that scene who I guarantee by the way most people who are in EFAP chat who loved that scene and then they exist They're in there they right now probably like yeah, I don't really care about that scene now like that It's over. I don't really at the time you did. Oh for sure. I'm sure they did What I'm suggesting is that it wore off that yes Yeah, they probably watched a couple times on YouTube and then they were like man, this was kind of thin Huh, you just sort of turns up and then that's it. Yeah Anyway, what's next? Yeah, oh Obi-Wan show yeah, oh Cassian Andal show yeah Nobody cares about Cassian Andal what no, I don't care. It's got Star Wars on it That's the thing. I worry for Cassian Andal who the fuck is gonna watch that like normal people If you said like oh, you know Han Solo, they're just like yeah Cassian Andal. They're like was that was that That is the guy from He's done as far as I know Yeah, it's ready to go it's good to go. It's gonna be great. They they they took something from their good movie Wow good movie I wouldn't be comfortable calling Rowan good. I don't know I I'm not sure I Really can't remember how nonsense the plot is and but I do remember the characters are pretty damn thin But I don't know I don't know that they're, you know broken or anything though And honestly that might be just enough to just make it better than most stuff Like the characters don't assassinate themselves. I'm fairly confident is probably the strongest Um Because it's the emptiest certainly if you ignore all the prequels is the strongest Maybe if you ignore the prequels, it's maybe if you include the prequels is the strongest. Oh There you are Save the dream No, I haven't one time that's the thing so now I've only seen it once I thought once in the theater And I was like well the last 15 minutes was cool Yeah, I like the ending and that was the end of that Now I I must depart very soon. So Well, I don't I don't wanna I Mean it's okay. We're at nearly seven hours and this is the the bonus e-fap as well So right be right and we've caught up to the ones on this one Okay Well, this is like four more and we'll be good. So do do One is What is your favorite trope to see in stories or which one do you think is never done correctly? credits, um, let me see My favorite trope Hmm, there's probably Hmm You know what? I'm almost certain. I definitely have an answer to this. I just can't remember it Maybe From the death of a character to involve them like doing something Heroic instead of just dying roic death. Yeah, I suppose it can be I suppose that's a trope It's more of a loose trope. It's not that because I always like I'll always prefer it when they're doing something That's brave or whatever before they go out sort of thing If you give me a moment, I can maybe Right get my thing on it thing and I can take a look I might have to just let you finish these last few cuz like, yeah Yeah, all right. I Apologize I must depart very well shenanigans to do Yeah, all right. Uh, see everybody in chat for next episode when I'm there on Saturday Yeah, well, bye Bye-bye That's a good one. The they always do wrong make bad guy intimidating really done correctly at this point Just have them kill their own people no reason at all a Yeah, just like an actual fearful villain a villain that I can be concerned about yeah I gotta use the fluid. I'll be right back I don't know why a lot of people seem to have seen like he fudges Joker and take him from that that what they need to make a Villain threatening is to make them do quirky random things for no reason. I Don't know. I think Vader's more to blame and it's literally just copying him badly instead of seeing why yeah, cuz I can't think of a quintessential more like foundational old example of the villain being scary because he's not only Gonna hit the heroes. He's also willing to just wipe out his own men if they you know, oh, that's true, actually but I was watching um, I Was watching the fan that there was a there's a power in his fan film I was just watching it cuz I needed like To reference a like a costume design in it And there's a moment in it where there's like this guy's got a lot of henchmen, right? And they're on the knives and they're attacking the black power ranger And the black power ranger like get racism gets all of them all of them out except Like one henchmen and the boss, right the boss walks up to the henchmen, right? It grabs the henchmen's knife from him because he wants to take on the power ranger is On his but you know himself And then can't stress this enough no reason at all. He uses the knife and slits his henchmen's throat It's just like as he's taking the knife. He kills his henchmen. It's like But why? Why did that happen? Did we ever find out why? It's such an accepted trope It's just such an accepted trope that like people don't question it now when Villain kills henchmen. Yeah, like it's just you know, it's not or why did he do that? It's yeah, you know, that's a villain thing to do like um having an evil plan or A deep voice that goes Yeah It that it's embarrassing and it makes me think that they're not intimidating at all. Actually, they're really stupid But I mean Could you convince you that volatile? Well, yeah, I'd be worried they'd kill me I guess but at the same time It's like you're not cunning you're not culling part of your team in order to make it more effective You're just an idiot But you're a dangerous idiot It can be written well, of course. Well, Veda's written well Yeah The house on the top right next to where you got the speeder is still damaged. One of the walls is missing Hey If you're talking about this house, I can't do anything to it for some reason. I've tried everything. I swear except baby something Can't have you've got six thousands more studs to go Um wait rags you there No damn JJ left after season one and never touched it afterwards calling lost JJ's is like saying Nolan made man of steel Why smoke monster bad? I mean Um, I'm pretty sure he stayed on as producer for a long time to say like his influence isn't in there would be Uh ridiculous, but also all of season one, dude, that would be the mystery boxes. They've been planted That's the foundation for like any show is he's now. How can you not call it his and people do tend to say that Nolan had a a finger in the pie of man of steel Oh Yeah um As for why smoke monster bad I'm back I just again, it's like the the love thing where I'm just like, uh Anyway, I'm doing a breakdown of that for you as if I rewatched lost and I ain't doing that But smoke monster is indeed horrifically bad Why I finished my lectures and you're still going wow. I know right Uh rags, what are your resources for firearms? My resources um youtubers that I like and trust, um, I'll read articles here and there, but um, it's primarily youtubers if I can find a gun review from someone that I trust um Sooch or nothing fancy or something like someone like that. I will be much more keen to get it Uh, but uh, generally pretty much Kind of that you know, it's like a lot of things if I want a good informed opinion about something I go to a youtuber That's kind of kind of where we are now. That's who I trust games are kind of the same way a lot I'll ask a friend or uh, you know Let's check out some gameplay and But generally it's just youtubers alive Yeah You didn't say why it's bad. I also said I wouldn't say why it's bad Um Ifringey, australia is still a flusamy country. I mean if you had a choice to live in canada, australia G to h gun to head. I guess uh, which would you choose? I would go canada I've got a question Go for it. I guess we're talking about endings. We're talking about the soprano soprano I alternate between saying the two. It's not a word. I say much um lost You know all these have has there ever been a Show that ended very cathartically just like it basically it was a happy ending with no conflict like the hero And you know, he did fine He went on to live a happy life and things worked out and it was all good and people didn't like it And people hated it and there was backlash against it Oh, so you mean like a return of the jedi type ending but people hated it Kind of like an ending where it all works out in the end and it's all good Um, and so the meme with people didn't like it Dexter was that he went and went off and became a lumberjack I don't know if that counts as living happily ever after or not chat would have to Mention that oh mad men is apparently possibly one that ends that way and people didn't like it So wait chat. It's not did they have a great ending? It's did they have a happy ending? That people hated I guess lost is probably one of them actually I will um I was thinking about tropes a bit too I like tropes That get into it's hardly a trope anymore these days But where or I guess it is but it's unintentionally a trope. We're like the antagonist has a point They have a they're not just evil bad and the good guy's not just good mc wonderful There is actually like you have a villain who is a villain sure But he's not evil He's a vil like like the vulture types, you know The zemo types where you clearly have like a a conflicted or a Well-structured character who is in the villain role or who is the antagonist? Um Though nowadays it's often a bad a good person is turned into the bad person or the protagonist hero is actually the terrible Um Oh and um, what would you prefer ranks australia or canada to live in? Um canada Yeah, I felt like that's that's what I would guess you'd said to promise not to mention In fact, it's close to where you actually live right at least compared to australia Yeah, I I feel like if I if I didn't like living in canada. I could just come right back down I feel it's um Like when it comes to shipping and stuff like that, it's it's very close to america in that sense Um, oh wait, would you prefer move to if you had to move to britain or australia? Oh, I don't know That's tough Probably I feel like living in britain would have less impact. Well I don't know. I I legit do not know all right Yeah, that's someone said person followed up with that question same, please answer it uh with scritches, but there you go You would have chosen canada over australia Uh, what did you guys like about the lighthouse so much? I thought the acting was fine, but it was strange and I just couldn't get into it I could totally see why someone would have that reaction Say, um, it's super unconventional lighthouse Yeah, that's that's one of that. I really liked it though. I really liked the lighthouse Well, so they're asking us why do we like it so much? I think we gave a Stronger explanation when we first watched it on an e-fab. I don't know which one it was though I was super into the acting and the dialogue and the interactions between the characters I was super super invested in just Getting more of these guys. It was extremely atmospheric and interesting and I kind of Like I the artsy sort of metaphorical stuff like i'm okay with that, you know It was all right to me But I just I I had an incredible appreciation for the work That the the actors did And it was very interesting to watch you weren't bored watching this movie. It's very Huge amount of effort that you can appreciate in that film Yeah, because the main draw is going to be the dialogue and uh I think it was excellently written a lot of the speeches or the the bigger portions of it And then yeah, I was um, I was also intrigued like by by it visually, uh, they took advantage of the uh format quite a bit And um, and I was still I was I was gripped to find out what it was all gonna Amount to what it was all gonna mean What kind of point was being made in totality? It was also Very creepy twists and turns Bye Jay Hello Rags is so hyperbolic. There's nothing but the worst thing or the best thing. There's no scaling with him That's really not true though. I don't know why they think that about you, but not about me We have the same yeah, so here's the thing a lot of things are terrible And I'm actually the one who says that we shouldn't like I'm the one who often says To like remind people that we don't want to come across as hyperbolic a lot of stuff really is just really bad But there there's plenty of things that are middling Um, I mean we I we talked about one of the stream we talked about the nebbers which has Good stuff a lot of bad stuff extraction. Well, yeah, that's got a lot of great stuff Um, there you know, there's a lot of things fallen to that middle-ish category Um But I think it just happens nowadays with so little care and attention that is paid to writing narratives Things just tend to sink way lower and we don't get some really fun Uh character stuff and witty dialogue So you don't have that, you know uplift to balance out a bad narrative or a bad plot also bi-j No Rags is so hyperbolic, but he isn't joking. I mean I mean A lot of stuff's really bad. I don't know what else to say a lot of stuff really is bad I do try to be accurate We say even here we were talking about earlier Mahler was Mahler was talking about resident evil And what is it? What those movies are terrible. They really are. Yeah, but we love them There's so much just joy to be taken from those movies, but they are terrible movies So Um, yeah, we think there's plenty of things that score along our scale All over the place I'm just have to look at our efap movies lineup and there's plenty in there that Uh Like mask of zoro we don't consider to be a masterpiece. It's pretty good. Oh, yeah, there are problems with mask of zoro They really are but they hear the thing is they are problems that are very fixable There you can you can tweak that movie and it becomes stellar. Yeah What is your favorite monster character? How would right beast characters like grendel? I thought about what that would look like in star wars or marvel Beast characters, um Like werewolves or well, so they said like grendel which is a little bit confusing to me because isn't grendel like a golem in terms of So he's he's the offspring. He's the offspring of um the previous king and Uh the the the woman right that's what grendel is like that. Um, but we're talking about characters Like characters that are like monstrous, I guess Little frankenstein Yeah, it's just about to say him from van helsing. It's kind of neat. Yeah Uh Monster characters a grave mind from halo. He's he's he's cool Uh, who else do we have? Hmm, this is a tough question like favorite monster characters. I'm like, hmm I don't think it's a very extensive list Not from memory now Yeah, I'm uh, I don't know. That's a good question. I'm sure some will come to mind Maybe we have oh someone mentioned underwater is another movie that we didn't say was great or terrible Oh, yeah underwater you guys should see underwater Why don't I say underwater underwater? Yeah, you guys should see underwater But like it's surely all these references like does that now prove the rags doesn't just say things are great or terrible We don't we just don't yeah, it's just the stuff. That's really terrible. It's big stuff. That's been coming out. It's mcu shows It's mcu movies Um, it's been blockbusters and disney stuff Those are all terrible and so they often take up a lot of our discussion because they're very big prominent films films like underwater and um Extraction those are totally all right And I would recommend both of them particularly underwater Um, but those just don't get really talked about by a lot of people and not as many people have seen them So they just don't often get as much attention Top left house has a piece missing Can you say top left house? I'm assuming you don't mean this house It's fine Um, also in regards to that one we read about do they actually enjoy this stuff or are they just when they discuss it? Are they just talking about who who hates it? um I think they do enjoy it and I think when they discuss it they tell each other things that aren't I know this sounds a little bit lame to say but you know like with Loki They'll be like I fucking love how well they developed mobius and Loki's relationship and then someone else goes Yeah, I thought it was fantastic like Gradually over the episodes you can see it building up And they go through so much together that you can really see how that blossomed and they tell each other that And I'm just sitting there like so none of that's true but Yes, it is if you say it is Next house over the idea that I can destroy this house Oh That's good timing Um, oh balls. I used the twitch link to stream labs last time to donate. I think did I eat that money? The twitch link to stream labs shouldn't that I imagine that sends it to stream labs regardless Um, if I've read out your thing before then it would have worked. I'm not sure if I did though But it should it should be fine. I'm not sure if you're aware of this But apparently youtube doesn't count downvotes for comments if you downvote a comment It's only saved logically in your browser cache might be relevant because of the recent discussions Is that true? I have So like only I never see comments with downvotes. That's the thing. You never see comments that are that have downvote numbers to them Um, I know they don't do negatives, but I figured that say for example if a comment has 10 upvotes and 20 down It'll just be zero zero. That's potentially true. I it probably um, but I just I don't know but they won't show negatives. Hmm And you know it's within the realm of possibility that they just fucking eat the dislike button eventually I think they've already said they're doing that, right? Um, oh, I don't know. I think so I remember reading an article someone shit on twitter It's the the fact that I'm aware of it being discussed means it's probably a year's time before that happens Uh, I'm not allowed to just like fucking videos like fuck off youtube. Hey, right. It could hit someone's feelings, dude No, we wouldn't want that on the fucking internet. Gosh. No I kind of handle it Uh Hey, my lord small donation for maintaining your computer since efeb has become an almost daily part of my life It's worth donating to you and to be honest. It should be more but now not possible Well, no problem. Thank you very much and um Yes, uh, I will be getting a new rig possibly within the month I'm already talking to smiler about what we're going to be going for. All right. Oh boy. Yeah, um, and of course I won't be abandoning this rig. I just I'll repair it. It's just that um Yes, there's a good reason for that and I will probably tell you as soon as the stream is over right speaking of which We're pretty much there Does garfields the cat hate mondays because president garfield was assassinated on a monday You know, it could be I have to speak to the creator. I guess maybe that could maybe I don't know that could like legit be the reason that might be interesting Or he's just like a lot of people who just hate mondays. Yeah, good me that um So, yes, do you think anyone names their kids garfield anymore? No, or is that a name that's just well fallen out of Quinton would name his kid garfield Quinton's not gonna have a kid. He could adopt Pull him garfield. Yes, his own name already. He's like you will be garfield now Um, you shall be garfield fucking naming you kid garfield is someone's done it It's a child of these yeah So this was a bonus e-fap two of two Um, it's not gonna become a regular thing that we do e-faps on wednesday as well That was just um because we had Extra topics extra coverage and we were behind on the numbers But now we've just completed 145 which means we got 146 on saturday and then it's just a really like that Right, we're getting real close to 150. That's like a oh my goodness gracious. That sounds exciting though Well, so I suppose it's worth saying um for those who want to submit things that could eventually be in You know, whatever coverage I have for 150 be it art or um Videos whatever else because I'm gonna obviously have a point where I'm just gonna sort through that make Something of an intro. It's not gonna be like 100. Okay guys 100 was very special I'm hyper busy as it is. I'm probably gonna make something that's pretty sweet as an intro But not you know nothing complex and we will probably go for 24 hours Hopefully Fringy will be there for the whole lot as well and I'm sure it'll be very fun um But going forward, I think we'll try and maybe start making wednesday our um bonus stream day to catch up on super chance I think we're just gonna have to come to Tim's the fact that We may never Not never we may never catch. We may not catch up to super chats in a for a long time Um, but that's okay because I was gonna say with with So the the 24 hour stream on the way if that's all coverage, we're gonna be That's gonna take a chunk out in terms of putting us far behind but one day we will catch up um And yeah until then things being worked on there are some surprises on the way I really hope you guys will like and um I think that's about it until we see you again on wednesday, which won't be very long from now We're gonna break down low key Episodes one through six with a couple guests I'm sure it'll be fun. Uh What do you think of quintons eye carly video? Uh, I haven't seen it. I don't well. I never watched eye carly. So I got uh, it feels like a weird one for me to check out Um Saturday, I don't know anything about it. Yeah So yeah, um, I don't know. Thanks for hanging out everybody. Uh, is there anything else ranks? Absolutely before we go Man, I think that's it. I think that's it. Well, you think you're right Uh Very well then everybody. Have a good night or whatever time of day it is And we shall see you on saturday Yeah, see y'all later. Bye. Bye