 It's 501. Oh my goodness. We're one minute one minute on time Hey, it's watch me work. It's 2024. Oh my god it's 2024 and We're here and I Was trying to think a few seconds ago. How long have we been doing watch me work and and then I thought Oh, yeah, it's older watch me work is older than my child And I think it started in like 2010 maybe that's a guess or maybe it's 2011 so someone's gonna have to Fact check that like I can make a phone call and then I'll know but anyway, we've been doing this watch me work thing for a long time and We've been doing it the same way every time which we we work together for 20 minutes and then we I Take your questions about your work in your creative process and while we don't have time for you to read your work or share work It can be any kind of work. We can talk certainly have a lot of time to talk about your process your creative process and If you think in line, why should I ask this question? Usually is a question. It's the perfect question that will help everybody on on the zoom We've been doing it on zoom since the pandemic and will continue because it's such a wonderful Wonderful way to get together and we are have been embraced in the past few months by the new work Development department at the public theater We were powered by the public theater and how around but Amritha and Zoe are there Amritha. You want to say some words? She's the chief for the new work development department Thank you. That's horrible. She's the what she's the head. Can we say that she's the Boss Yes I'm good with it. I'm good with it. Hi everyone. Happy new year. My name is Amritha remnant I'm the director of new work development here at the public theater And so happy to be with all of you and SLP for watch me work and I'm gonna hand it over to my colleague Zoe Hi, everyone. My name is indeed not new work development. It's Zoe Happy new year. I'm happy to be in space with everyone Awesome sauce. So we're gonna we're gonna do what we what we do really well We're gonna work for 20 minutes. You can work on anything and Then we're gonna gather back together after this 20 minutes and we're going to talk about process Here we go That's it that's 20 minutes and we're back Taking questions. This is time. We take questions Yes, if everyone with the question could use the raise your hand function We'll call in your name and ask you to meet yourself and then the please a meet yourself Hey Timothy. Hey, I saw P. How are you? Wow first question of the year, bro Hey, yeah, yeah, somebody had to do it Good to see you and good to see everybody again. Yeah, I actually this is a question that came up And sort of sitting on it for a little while, but it was after the last session. I Found myself in a silence. It's gonna make sense. I found myself in a situation where I had a plot outline And the plot needed to go this way but the characters We're dragging it this way. Hmm, and I was wondering Which one the false? All right, I Mean it was it really was a case of um You know, well if the story is gonna happen then this has to happen then this has to happen then this has to happen Then this has to happen Meanwhile as I'm writing out the characters and I you know, I take a lot of character notes and and You know and sometimes they tell you their secrets and you at least you hope so and The more I did that it's a two two character scene and it's kind of pivotal the more I did that for these two characters it was like You know, I couldn't force them into like a pre-idea plot They anyway So my question was if your characters go in East and your plots go in West Which trade do you get off? Yeah? Yeah, it sounds like it's going south. No Let's hope not these characters don't mind us. Um Hmm Well, how does it feel both way like feel it out? How does it feel to you to tell them? Hey, you're coming over here. You're doing this What I decided That was my initial impulse and it didn't feel great honestly You know, it really did You know There's that there's that little that little voice inside you that's going this ain't working so You know, it was kind of like that and yeah my first impulse was to push through and And that didn't quite happen. So I kind of I Kind of sat there being stuck for a little while You know, I I Think my inclination is to follow the characters though I'm not sure if I'm gonna have a story So Right. Well, at least you'll have a story about how you followed the characters You'll have some kind of story. I mean, I would say yeah, if you if you tried Have trying to sort of quote-unquote force them to follow you. Mm-hmm. That didn't feel good You feel like it was really what you what you should be doing and I Mean your other yeah, that's that's your alternative, right? Characters and then and then see what they have to What what story they have to tell you yeah, you know, I mean, it's it's not it's not it's not bad You've got strong characters who have who have a you can say, you know, they have a very rich story I just don't know it yet Right, right. I mean in since like I've just kind of let me just write character stuff in the helplot And like I said little by little I feel like their secrets are being revealed So in a weird way I'm kind of drifting morph drifting from that the plot Yeah, yeah, I mean, it's I had a I teach at NYU. I've taught there for a while and Couple years ago. I had a student who had come From another they taken a class a different class a semester before and they said wow I've got these great characters, you know, I really had fun You know figuring out who my characters are and now I gotta find a plot I mean, they really didn't like that and that really like You know and I was like that's really interesting Because what is plot but just whatever it is that your character is doing That's all it's so it's it's kind of It's it's like you're you're dating, but you don't want to do what they want you to do, you know It's kind of weird. It's like well, that's what they that's what a marriage is. That's what dating is That's what you know, what didn't you know that that's what it is character Characters are plot They're they're not different things. So if your characters are going that way then that's where your plot's going Fair enough, okay You know or you can find different characters that will go over there, you know, right? Yeah Not not for not for this particular project. They're kind of the pivotal characters. Yeah, yeah So so you you go you go the way you follow your characters, you know, and see how that feels see how it feels It's it's just writing You know, it's not worth not brain sir Exactly, you know, you know, so you can try it and see how it feels Okay No, this is true this this is this this is true I mean in a weird way almost by accident I've I've actually like They were I don't see they were mysteries, but they were kind of just like okay Well, you need to do this now and you need to do that now and now it just feels like, you know If they're not gonna do it, I suppose I I should find out why and that's kind of been That's kind of been what's been rolling Of you know of late since this was first encountered, but you know as always I just wanted to get other thoughts and you know Maybe the remote thought that I'm That I made the right choice or the wrong but whatever anyway Well, the right choice is to keep at it. That's I think that's always the right choice. It sounds like you're made Well done. Thanks. Thank you for thank you for the help Thanks, Lisa Lisa Hey, how are you? Happy new year. Hi. Happy new year All right, so I decided to branch out. I've been writing fiction short stories and My teacher Suggested that I try just another discipline just another way of writing just to see what How it could kind of cross cross pollinate some of the ideas I had so I tried creative and nonfiction okay, and What which I've never done before ever I'm not an essayist, but I thought it was a good way to stretch and One of the reasons I did it is because I've had an idea for a play And I thought hey, I'm gonna write this out as an essay first Mm-hmm, and just to see where it goes and to see if there's actually anything You know worth writing about here Which led to a really interesting Sort of situation in that the play is based on Hello, I'm sorry your voice cut out just right and the play is based on real people, okay Okay Most of the people in it are no longer alive But their relatives are oh Yes, and it's it's based on a true story that happened back in the early days of television with a friend of mine who was Active in things like Playhouse 90 and you are there and really really seminal work Female So most of her contributions were negated or minimized Mm-hmm, even though she had substantial credits, so what I'm What I'm wondering about is What responsibility do we have towards real people especially people whose Relatives may or may not ever encounter the work but Exist and on one hand sort of Fictionalizing everything seems kind of weird And not telling anybody's story really So and I've been debating this and going back and forth and going how do I handle this what do I do? I feel secure in telling the main character story woman who Substantially contributed but was not substantially recognized. Is that the main character for you? Yes, okay But how do I deal with all the other real people then it's some pretty substantial real people Well, what would I see what yeah, what do we owe the living and what do we owe the dead? I Think it really depends the store on the story you want to tell You know, so right now without mentioning any names, right? I mean you mentioned Playhouse the name of a program right But what if you had said a TV show, right? That would have been enough for me because I'm not familiar with that program Right now you've given me enough you haven't mentioned any names. No names You've given and only woman or a female you said and then I'm guessing the others, you know were others, you know You've given me it a very compelling story for a play Or a short story or whatever you want to write okay, so the question is what story do you want to tell? you know You've already given me a compelling story for a play without any proper without any names Right because in a way that story has happened So many times I mean this is I'm just make I'm just kind of figure this out while I'm talking to you Lisa right now So that story has happened so many times That it would be compelling even if you didn't mention their names But if you want to tell a specific story of this specific person, then you're gonna have to mention some names You see what I'm saying for example If someone wanted to talk about and Oh You know a group of folks who would get together on Saturdays in the 60s in Washington Square Park and play folk music And one of them would write songs and and she was never recognized, but she was amazing right you could tell a really compelling story without mentioning any names, right? But if you want to tell the specific story about some person specific person and Include her music for example, then you would need to start bringing out names. So it depends on what you want to tell Soon saying and that's that's your show. I I think I think you could write it without any without naming names. I mean call them something, you know, but not name any names I think you could if because I'm interested I guess in what's stopping you And I'm looking at what's stopping you and what's stopping you is should I name names? Should I not name names? Well, don't name names and write it for crying out loud because because you know You're not writing and I want you to write it Is are you was this Were you in a class where your teacher gave you some weird advice? Yes. Yes Okay That was me I'm me remembers. Yes. Okay. Okay girl girl. Look don't mention it names write it. I want you to write I want you to write you Think you know people are you know your your things are getting in the way of you just writing don't mention any names Look, she's a brilliant writer for television, right? And she's surrounded and she's a woman in a field dominated by guys and she's brilliant She comes up with all these great ideas. You know to mention specific to a show It can be a fiction live show, right? You can just just go with it let your imagination You're delicious imagination invent all these Details so that you don't get bogged down and oh no what these living people their relatives a lawsuit may be liability Oh, no, I'm saying something mean or wrong or liable or defamation of character or all this kind of stuff I do I do Okay, I I'm sort of wondering though what I was sort of juggling with was Okay, and this may sound ridiculous and this may sound very grad school. So apologize to anybody who was in grad school I was in grad school too if There's a layer of Authenticity that you know I was in grad school too if There's a layer of authenticity that gets lost When you don't write the real history really I don't know that's what I've been debating And why is that why is that a grad school question? There's a layer of authenticity when you don't There's a layer but it's that layer of authenticity Necessary Do you know that the majority of history Are stories of people will never know their names Do we have to sit around and and go I can't talk for example just you know I can't talk about enslaved people because I don't know all their names Oh, no, there's a layer of authenticity is going to be missing because I don't know all their names So I can't talk about it at all for me really Are we really you know I want to write about the shirt waste fire, you know, I don't know all those women's names I can't write about it all because I don't know their names So so I got to find out all their names I mean, you know, that's you could find out their names, but a lot of enslaved people you can't find out their names Okay, so we're going to we're going to let we're going to let a lack of the All I'm saying is Lisa I'm noticing that things are getting in your way and if I can remember A comment that you made I don't know how many months ago about a situation where you were with an educator Who was Getting in your head and making it difficult for you to write I can remember that and so I'm very lovingly and with total support going I just want you to write so authenticity. What does that even mean? Really Good point. Good point The last teacher by the way or authentic because I knew exact I know exactly where she comes from in western Africa Is it more authentic? I don't think so, you know, I'm saying and I'm not gonna write about her because I don't know exactly the village that she came from I mean, you know, we don't need to get twisted up into those I'm not saying the facts are not important and I'm not saying the truth should be just like brushed aside and generalized But I'm saying when we when we are up against these these these these situations And it's actually keeping you from writing something you want to write The story of a woman who did not get credit or did not get her due Write the story and if you have to go back six months from now and put in the the real names because you know You've gotten clearance on several estates or you've made contact with someone's air or whatever then great, but you will have written it Okay, well It's it's time to be free people It's time to be free No, really it's it's time to it's time to you know to do the things we got to do Okay, thank you. Thank you. Thank you and great question And grad school questions are great. I didn't go to grad school. So I have no idea what the grad school questions are, but yes Yes, Nick, please unmute yourself. All right. Hello. Hello. Hello. Hi hi hi Um, yeah, how are you doing today? Well, thank you. It's good to see you man. Good to see you. Yeah. Yeah, it's great So there is a play that I've been working on and I'm really excited about I finished the first act and I hit a bit of a just creative wall where I was like I'm just gonna take some time away from this kind of let it sit in the ether for a bit And I've started to return to it and what do you know the brick wall is just like still there So I'm just having a bit of a tough time getting going on just like writing through and I've been like writing every day the last few days just about characters and seen stuff but it's like there's some kind of a I want to say almost like a fear of getting through this act and so I'm just looking for a bit of advice on that. Like that's that's really brave of you Nick to say there's a fear. I mean, because fear is a real thing and and you're being so brave and just showing up, you know and And working on it and leaning into it and it's like Could you could you say you're writing about characters when you write you sit there and write about characters, right? Yeah, you do you have an idea going going to Timothy's thing. Do you do you have a plot that they won't follow. Do you have a story that they're not kind of they're like I'm not going to do that. So I do have like a general plot of where it's all going to go. It's it's mostly been it's like I know what's how the end gets to where it is. Okay, everything the meet between the end of the first act to the end of the second act is just this weird thing where like whenever I try to dip my toes in the pool of just like I'm not going in there there's sharks in there. Wow. Wow. No, no, no, no, that's that's that's a real thing. Yeah. Is it is it a personal story not to tell me the specifics of it but it's a personal. No, no. Are you in any physical danger by by writing it. I mean, No, I just don't want it. Okay, I want to be sure. Okay. Okay. Okay. That's okay that so it just feels like awful. Like Can you like write it. You see what a how much of a like shitty draft you could write who I think I think that's the answer. And it's just that I've been afraid of writing a shitty draft. Yeah, but you can can they go like can you have the characters like at least once a page go this is a really shitty draft. This is really shitty. All right. That'd be that'd be a lot of fun. Yeah. Right. And then go, uh-uh, I must. It's going to get a lot shittier on the next page. Watch. And then I'm going, Oh, this is even shittier. Yeah, this is stupid. Oh, that's a good idea. Yeah, yeah, but it's really shitty. Okay, well, we know we're going in the end. Yeah, yeah, I know, I know. I'm going to take a shit here. I'm going to actually pull on my pants and poop. Okay, now let's keep going. Okay, are you going to clean that up now because it's shitty. Ah, let's keep going. You know what I mean? Just kind of like stumble through because you've done all the things you've started, you have an idea where you're going. It's difficult. You're showing up, you're doing character work, and you just kind of inch forward and maybe every day. Do you write at the same time every day? Uh, not at the same time. I've been staying to the same general like block, like basically some time before I go to bed is usually when I would like plug in. Okay, okay. And that's your that's your magic time. Usually, yeah. Okay, great. Okay, great. So you're going to keep that up. And you write for a certain amount of time. Yeah, I either go between right now, like half an hour to an hour. Okay, great. Okay, so you're showing up. You're showing up at a similar time for a similar amount of time. And yeah, just go go like half an hour or 20 minutes. Yes, what I'm just going to do, you know, and then reward yourself, give yourself a prize, like, like, whatever, you know, if you like ice cream, or you're going to watch, you know, some TV show that you like online or your going to watch Kurosawa, you're going to go on a Kurosawa binge, you know, whatever I was watching or cure Kurosawa last night, you know, just like something that's going to make you go, yeah, wow, that's a really beautiful film like that. Give you because, you know, you're doing great, man. And then start, oh yeah, and hypnotize yourself. Yeah. Wow, Nick, you're doing really well. You're doing really well. Look at you. Look at you. Yeah, you're the man. You're him. Look, yeah, you showed up today. It was really hard. Yeah, you did. Look at you. You're doing great. Yeah. No, I mean, it sounds weird, right? No, I totally get it. Just because, you know, if you're walking around going, I don't know how to do this. Oh, no, no, it's fucked. It's horrible. It's horrible. Maybe your characters can say this is a really shitty draft. Let them say whatever they want. But when you're not at the workstation, when you're not typing it out or writing it, however you do it, just hypnotize yourself. Like, man, that was really good. Did you see, did you see how it showed up there? Did you see that? That was like, that was like, oh, yeah. Yeah, I'm going to do it tomorrow too. 15 minutes, man. That's all I'm doing, right? Because then you're showing the muse, you know, that you're discoverable. You're there. You're willing. You're willing to listen. Yeah, I think that's a really good angle to take it from. I think make a game, you know, make a game out of it. As much as possible, I do constantly. I constantly make little games out of everything. So what kind of a game, could you give an example, if that's okay to ask? Sure, like a game, like, well, like a game, like, hey, I'm going to do 15 minutes. That's not serious writing. Oh my God, Ernest Timmy Wayne, he stood up and then he went, you know, I'm going to do 15 minutes. Then I'm going to watch a movie, you know, or then I'm going to make popcorn. Then I'm going to go for a walk. Then I'm going to call my friend. I'm going to watch like, what is it, South Park for an hour after, because I did really good. You know, I mean, just make it, that's what I mean, a game. I mean, now you know, there's not, there's a lot of fun in my writing life, but that's the kind of fun I like. You know, or, you know, just something, a short amount of work and a treat, you know. Right. Just that. And then you just, and also I really, I really love short amounts of work time. I really believe in them. I have them constantly through my work day, very small increments of work time. All right. So, okay. I'm going to try that out. I'm back. Because guess what, you already won. You won. You can't lose. You just show up. You do. For 15 minutes, and then you give yourself a treat. And you do that seven days in a row from now until next week. Or not. Well, it's MLK day, but anyway, do it anyway. Boom. You win. You won. All right. Well, thank you so much. And now y'all know what I do. I sit around and go, whoa. Because it's, it's, it's difficult just to get through the day. You know, convince yourself that yeah, I can just keep going. That's, that's a, that's a trick. You know. Thank you. Hi, Grace. Please unmute yourself. Right. Hi. Good to see you. Hope you're well. I have a quick question about, you know, just about reading and writing and watching because I know you also write screenplays as well. But I'm just like really in a phase in my writing life where I just want to like read a lot of things and watch a lot of movies and read a lot of plays. And so I just wanted to know, like just some tips that you would recommend to someone that is reading like from the lens of becoming a better writer. Yeah. Sure, sure, sure. You mean like plays or I read screenplays, I read regular plays, and then also like books too. Like right now, like my 24 resolution is to read all the Toni Morrison books, but just wondering like some tips. You know that you would give to someone as like a lover of obviously like all of these mediums but also like as a lover of like writing like you know reading for writers. Right, right. Oh, oh gee. Toni Morrison is great. What a great idea. What a great and beautiful thing that you're going to be doing this year. Shakespeare. But Shakespeare on the list. Oh, any like Shakespeare in particular because I haven't read Shakespeare in a while and I didn't really like it in high school. So all of them, you can do them in alphabetical order, make a game out of it. You can do them in historical order. You can do them in the order in which they were apparently written. You can do all the comedies and all the tragedies or you can put all the names of all the plays and all the sonnets and hat and pull one out and read it. You know, read it aloud, read it with friends. I mean, yeah, because it's sure it's a kind of it requires a kind of athleticism like Toni Morrison. Some people say I read Toni Morrison in high school like it was so hard, you know what I mean? It requires some muscle, you know, some athleticism, but it's great writing and great writing. If you want to improve great writing is a good thing to consume. And also, you know, I mean, film, you can read film scripts, but you can also watch films and they don't have to be in English. Like I was watching, you know, some Kurosawa, Akira Kurosawa movies last night, you know, just great movies. And that's a wonderful break for your eyes just to see a director who just, you know, Jane Campion, you know, just a beautiful visual field. Oh, my God, it's so gorgeous. Just, yeah, and maybe if you think, oh, anything you read in high school that you thought was hard and you didn't like, but on the list. Okay, I will keep that in mind. Usually for movies, I mean, I watch a lot of movies and I think that that's like the easiest thing to do for me. Because honestly, like I haven't really been much of a reader, because I'm currently in university, so I have to read a lot for school. So usually like reading, like outside of that is like, oh, I'm so tired, let me just watch a movie. But what I started to do is if I really like a movie, like I'll watch it first. And then if I really like it, I'll read the script. Like what? What movie did you do that to recently? I really liked Charlie Kaufman's I'm Thinking of Ending Things. So I read the script for it, took a while. I love his films adaptation he did, right? Yeah. I haven't watched that one yet, but I like watched like all of them except for the film. Okay, okay. No, that's a, I love I love that one. Yeah, it's really good. My biggest inspirations like for sure. Oh, very cool. Well, so you could go on so you could have you read all his scripts. No, I haven't. Well, that would be fun to do, you know, just that would be really, really fun. Have a little film festival, you know, that'd be really cool. Just yeah, I mean, it seems like you're on the right track. Come now. Toni Morrison, Shakespeare, Charlie Kaufman, you know, some poet in there, some poet, like what poet do you like? I really like Natalie Diaz. Okay, then read Natalie Allowed. You know what I mean? And preferably standing up. Move, you know, because these things, these, you know, writing for the theater, writing for film, you're writing for bodies moving. You're not just writing for people sitting there, you know. You're kind of, you want to be moving around and feel the language in your body. That's always, that's a good thing to do. Yeah, I also think it can be a little bit hard for me to do that just because like I'm not like a actor. I mean, I used to want to be an actress when I was little, but then I figured it's not for me. So sometimes it's like a little bit like maybe like my question is like to what extent, like, should you really be considering and exploring like acting like as a writer? Because sometimes like I do get like really into it. But then I'm like, okay, is this like really necessary for me to think specifically about how people should say these lines or what movements they should do? Because I mean, I haven't like ever directed a play or a movie, but I know that when it comes to like casting and the actuality, it can be a bit hard because actors have their own methods and then writers have their own ideas. What day were you born? On what day were you born? Oh, January 11th. Oh, really? Yeah. Almost happy birthday. Yeah. Your mind is like... I was just like, re-support your loud girl. You know what I'm saying? You don't have to be an actor. I mean, you are an actor. All the world's a stage. We're all performing right now. I mean, it's cool. You know what I'm saying? You can just... All I want you to do is just feel the language in your body and that you don't have to be an actor, you know, or if you have to get permission to do that, I hereby give you permission. So you can read Natalie Diaz aloud just to feel the language in your body because you're going to be writing for the body. And I think the more we as writers can feel the language in our body, the better we are as writers, especially for writing for the theater or for film or video, you know, or TV. Definitely. Thank you. I just have one... Why'd you ask me when my birthday was? I'm just so curious. No, because your mind was just moving and I was like, where are you from? And see that, you know, it's like the answer, you answer back and such a like, I'm just like, yeah, when's your birthday? Thank you so much. You're welcome so much. Happy almost your birthday. Thank you. Right. Two minutes left. Two minutes. And we're going to take MLK Day off. We're going to be doing our day of service elsewhere. The new works department is in the public theater closed. Oh, oh, somebody has their hand up. Yes. Oh, where did they go? Hey, go ahead. We got two minutes. Okay. This is kind of like a question someone asked before, but there's this, I just started a new script and I originally began it last year. And I have, I only had a few ideas of it and decided to trust like the characters as I was writing. But I always find that whenever I return to the script, I end up dropping it and write to start something else. And so I'm trying to like tell myself to work on it now just to see what I can get out of it. And I guess my question is like, how do I commit to the script that's giving me trouble that I'm not sure where. Uh huh. Get yourself some index cards. Have we talked about this before? Maybe get yourself some index cards and like write out the story on little index cards. I don't have any index cards handy, you know, three by five index cards, small ones, you know, like this. And you write out the story, write it out in really small cards. Just the story. Don't try to do dialogue. Don't try to do big themes or anything. Just what are your characters doing? Jane walks into the grocery store. She buys a quart of milk. You know, Debbie's there. Her dog is dancing on the counter. They meet. It's a rom-com. Oh my God. I love a rom-com. You know what I mean? Just, just tell me what the characters are doing. Do you know what I mean? Card after card. And as you flip the cards, the scenes will develop. Okay. Yeah. That sounds good. That's a game. Just have fun. Have fun with that, you know. I will. Thank you. Um, you're welcome. It's funny. At the watch we worked for the week, I, it came to me and then I forgot it. So there you go. Um, when something comes to you, write it down. That's the first thing. That's the first thing. And I'll, I'll have to, uh, next time where I'll remember it miraculously and email everybody not, but, um, it's six o'clock. It's so, as we think about the new year, you know, we think about like what we want to do. And, um, we can all, what's great here, we're all resolving just by being here to show up for our work. You know, you know, we're going to do that thing we've always wanted to do, which is great, which is great. Cause the world does need us to do that. And I know we need it too for ourselves. So it's a great thing to be doing. And, uh, oh, that's what it is. See, there you go. So that's the thing about a job, a game. This, it's the quotation from Mary Poppins for every job that must be done. There is an element of fun. You find the job and snap. You find the game, the job and snap the jobs a game. Now I didn't get that right for every job that must be done. There is an element of fun. You find the fun and snap the jobs a game. That's what I was talking about. Mary Poppins got it in a spoonful of sugar. So that's the tip of the week. You find the fun and snap the jobs a game. And that's what, uh, can keep you going. Okay. We're going to be back. When are we back? So we went to be back after, after MLK. Okay. So which is the. Next Monday. Yeah. Not the 15th, but the one after that, right? Yep. Okay. We'll see you here. Happy new year. Happy 2024. Thanks for being here. See you next time. Bye bye.