 Everyone. Thank you for joining us tonight. I'd like to thank the public that are watching also thank them for joining us tonight. Before we start our meeting, we start off with the quotation of the week. Madam city clerk, please. Our quote for this week is real integrity is doing the right thing, knowing that nobody's going to know whether you did it or not. Thank you, city clerk. I'll call the 23rd regular council meeting to order. Madam city clerk, would you please call the roll. Bowman, D. Burke, E. Burke, Serta, Davis. Excuse. Graf. Here. Kittleson. Here. Manny. Here. Meyer. Here. Montemayor. Here. Radke. Here. Sagali. Here. Stefan. Here. Alderman Manny, would you please lead us in the Pledge of Allegiance? I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America and to the Republic for which it stands, one nation under God, indivisible with liberty and justice for all. Thank you, Alderman Manny. Next we have the approval of the minutes. Alderman of President Graf. Thank you, Your Honor. I would move that we dispense with the reading of the previous common council minutes and the special common council minutes. And the same stand approved as answered on the record. Second. So motion to second. Is there any discussion? There being none, all those in favor state aye. Aye. Any opposed? Minutes stand approved. Resignations, party to clean. Thank you, Your Honor. First is a letter from Michael Schrader advising that he's moving outside the corporate limits of the city on March 15th and therefore submitting his resignation from the Oregon Board of Water Utility Commissioner. I ask for motion to accept and file. I would still move your hand. Motion to second. Any discussion on that? Your Honor. Yes. Regarding the resignation of Mr. Schrader, what we normally do is that we send out a public notice or print in the paper a public notice of the vacancy and in this case we will do that. And what needs to be done is anyone interested in that position should send a letter to myself as council president and we'd be looking at electing someone to that vacancy at the April 5th council meeting. So they have the next 30 days approximately to get a letter of interest to myself. Very good. Thank you, Alderman Groth. Any other? All those in favor state aye. Aye. Any opposed? Motion carries. To the building use committee Alderman and Jean Kittleson. Term expiring 4-17-06. Joseph Clark, Carl Rigotti and Cameron Stewart. Terms expiring 4-30-06. Signed by the mayor. Those who will lie over. And Dr. Curtis Hancock to be considered for appointment to the commission on aging to fill the unexpired term of Jerry Hemsing whose term expires 4-30-09. Signed by the mayor. I ask for a motion to approve. Confirm. Second. Second. Any discussion on that? All those in favor state aye. Aye. Any opposed? Motion passes. And Mary and Keith are to be considered for appointment to the business improvement district to fill the unexpired term of Tammy Conard whose term expires 9-15-06. And Mike van der Sien to be considered for appointment to the business improvement district to fill the unexpired term of Craig Mazza whose term expires 9-15-06. Signed by the mayor. We'll ask for a motion to confirm. Any discussion on those? All those in favor state aye. Aye. Any opposed? Motion passes. Is that it? Is that it? Yes. Thank you. Public forum. Madam City Clerk. Excuse me. First on the list is Sandy Wimler. Sandy are you here? Sandy if you could give me your home address please. 2213 Erie Avenue. Erie Avenue? And you will have 5 minutes. Thank you. Good evening Mr. Mayor and Common Council members. Tonight I'm here because I'm told that this is the next step in grieving my property claim which occurred on December 4th 2005. In 2001 I purchased my small house and had it inspected from top to bottom. No water, not a drop. For five years I carefully filled in around the house with yards of dirt by myself to further protect it from any water problems. Neither to say and as it was the manhole clogged in front of my home and destroyed my entire family room in the basement. I immediately called DNM plumbing first because I didn't know what was happening. He proceeded to run a huge snake down the trap and came back with the comment that these pipes to the road were positively clear of any roots or clog. But the sewer was pouring in in waves from the trap. His next reaction and comment was to go to the manhole and as he suspected it was almost full to the top. I documented pictures were taken. He went into the house and called the city and finally reached somebody after 15 minutes. The city employees came only after two plus hours. I live within a half mile of the city buildings. They went from manhole to manhole in front of my home and then with some equipment found and unclogged a soft mass. This took a matter of about 15 minutes. As they unclog the mass I could hear my drain suck itself dry. We're sorry. This is after the fact and about six inches of hazardous black water filled my basement and family room. It's not leaves that were coming through the trap and drain but the whole neighborhood's toilets. My family was supposed to come home for Christmas but there wasn't any there. I am not a gold digger and I am not about to gain any extra money. I live from payday to payday and cannot afford to lose all my furniture much less the walls to my home. The insurance company I have refused to pay because of the hazardous waste which meant actual feces, toilet paper, urine, etc. in my family room. I had to hire a company to come out to the tune of $5,000 on my charge card paid ahead of time. How am I going to pay for this? I am told the next step is a lawsuit to be filed if I wish. In closing I have the city's rules and regulations for the lateral in front of me and I state in the homeowner and responsible to the main. I believe the center of the street is the city's responsibility and needs to be adequately taken care of as it was or had not been at that point. I am supposed to lift the manhole every month to see that it's drained. This is not my fault and I am putting the blame on the city. The materials found by DNM were neither leaps nor rubber duckies. They were black water. Lateral versus main in the sewage handbook that they gave me, my lateral was and is okay. Materials that were in the main created lateral problems. Three, the roots and leaves. There were no breaks in my lateral. The clog came from the city's main. Number four are frequent questions. City's responsibility regarding private laterals. I agree. City crews respond that the main is open. This one was not. If the blockage is in the city's main, we will fix it as quickly as possible and keep you informed about what is being done. I'm a taxpayer and I know the city has adequate insurance to pay for these things. Mine will not. I will continue to fight this. If the city can pay DNM, why can't they pay me? If I have to go as far as I have to rectify this, I will. I have a copy of DNM which they stated on the bottom that the manhole was filled. I'd like to thank you. Thank you, Sandy. Next on the list is Carter Paulus. Carter, can you give me your home address, please? Number four, Erie Avenue. And we will have five minutes, sir. Thank you. Thank you for the privilege and honor of presenting an announcement. It is time to let the taxpayers of our community know that the Sheboygan County Taxpayers Alliance has taken a leadership role in resolving the confusion displayed by the Coleman Council and the Mead Library Board of Trustees regarding the issues surrounding our library. In our responsibility to the taxpayers of the community, we have filed and had hand carried and received a legal notice of receipt of all of the legal concerns to our Wisconsin State Attorney General as of February 16, 2006. This filing embodies more legal questions per state statutes than just the issue of the library director's contract and includes the actions of the library board trustees and the actions or lack of actions of our city government. These legal concerns include a request for relief, determinations, and enforcement of law by the Attorney General's Office in the State of Wisconsin. The Finance Committee has been informed of some of the laws not being followed by the Mead Library Board of Trustees and the resultant majority vote to remove the entire trustee board has been recorded as of February 27, 2006. So no one misunderstands this action. A vote by the common council to keep the present trustee board is a vote to condone the breaking of law. The Sheboygan County Taxpayers' Alliance knows it is time to clear the air to the more than three months of continuing issues surrounding our library and provide some clarity of needed purpose back to the forefront. Thank you very much. Thank you. And last on the list would be Andrew Bubb. Andrew, could you come up to the front? Andrew, could you give me your home address please? 1616 North 21st Street. And you will have five minutes, sir. Thank you, Mr. Mayor, council members. I've come before you tonight to talk about charter communications and their lack of offerings in the Sheboygan area, specifically high definition television. On February 1st, I submitted a letter to the editor to the Sheboygan Press and it was published on February 26. I submitted this as a public document to the common council. According to Charter's website, not since the advent of color television, has there been a more dramatic change in the way television is experienced in your home? This has been on their website since 2004, so it's not something new. This has been around for a while. As of September 2004, about 90 million cable customers could get high definition television in the United States. And Charter has said that one of the reasons that they haven't added HDTV service is that it's slow to be adopted. Now, in comparison, it took a decade for color televisions to be in five million households in the United States. Already, there are 15.7 million high definition televisions at the end of 2005, and it was only introduced in 1998. Charter also claims that there's a lack of high definition programming as a reason they haven't introduced it. However, a preliminary tally of high definition programming by HDTV Magazine showed that about 650 hours of high definition content would be available on any given day. That's according to the Seattle Times. Most other areas serviced by Charter have 10 plus channels of high definition, including all the major networks. For example, Fond du Lac, West Bend, Stevens Point, Wausau, Eau Claire, and Onalaska, which are serviced by Charter, already have high definition, including two rivers with a population of 12,000 and roughly the same geographic area as us, have high definition as well. Charter plans upgrades in several communities throughout Wisconsin that already have high definition television, giving them capabilities beyond high definition, such as video on demand and internet telephony. Sturgeon Bay, Sister Bay, Egg Harbor, Pullover, Wausau, they're all getting video on demand in 2006. Campbell's Port, Mount Calvary, Sturgeon Bay, Marshfield, they're getting IP telephony, and the list goes on there. Charter so far does not have any plans to introduce high definition television into the Sheboygan market in 2006. Dozens of other communities smaller than Sheboygan have HDTV, and the Sheboygan area with a population of over 50,000 does not. Ableton, Green Bay, Milwaukee, all serviced by Tarm Warner have HDTV. Existing services like DVR, digital video recorders, that are provided by Charter are sporadically available, sometimes being sold out or not available for once at a time. Charter, they already have the critical infrastructure in place between Sheboygan and two rivers to provide service like HDTV. I'm asking, what's the delay? I'm also told that the city's infrastructure is less complicated than Fondalax infrastructure, so there shouldn't be a reason why we can't get it. Now, I realize federal rules regarding the contracts are weighted towards the incumbent provider, but I ask that you take into consideration Charter's lack of HDTV offering in the Sheboygan area when considering the renewal of their contract this coming year. I ask you to put pressure on Charter to upgrade or commit to a date in 2006 to upgrade to high definition television before we go ahead with the renewal of their contract. And if Charter won't commit to upgrades, I suggest looking at other providers that will give us a more modern cable system, which Charter has been wanting to do. Without Charter committing to the modernization of Sheboygan, I will be going into a new direction and satellite is looking better and better each day. I thank you for your time. Thank you. That's it. Thank you, Mr. Bubb. I would like to make a comment regarding Charter. Tonight, the council will be approving a Charter communication franchise advisory committee. And I put that committee in place for the exact same reason that Mr. Bubb has expressed, the concerns that he had expressed is that in the past the contract was negotiated out of the mayor's office and Charter and that was the extent of it and I believe with the assistance of a consultant. And this time around this year, if the council passes approves a committee, there will be an advisory committee formed with some citizen representation and Mr. Bubb may just have given me an idea to consider appointing because he seems to have a lot of knowledge on that. But it's important that the council approves that because that way we're going to have the right representation so that we get the right service or we do what we need to do. The next item on the agenda is a statement of commendation to recognize Miss Lindsay Walter. I would ask that Miss Walter please step up. This is one of the things I get to do that I really, really enjoy and this is recognizing in particular our youth for being exemplary citizens in our community. Lindsay Walter is being recognized tonight because she has been named one of the top youth volunteers in Wisconsin for 206 in the 11th Annual Prudential Spirit of Community Awards. This is an extraordinary honor. The program is America's largest youth recognition program based exclusively on volunteerism. Lindsay is a senior at South High School. For her volunteer project, she collected new and gently used backpacks for among refugee children and teens living in our community. With help from Catholic Charities officials, her mother and several friends, Lindsay solicited donations of funds and backpacks from local businesses, advertised her campaign in church bulletins and at the YMCA, distributed donation barrels and then collected, cleaned and handed out almost 100 backpacks to young refugees. At this time, I would like to present Lindsay with this statement of commendation. As mayor of Sheboygan and on behalf of our city, I commend Lindsay Walter for her outstanding volunteer contribution to others and to our community. I commend your efforts and issue this certificate and affix my seal and signature upon it. Thank you, Lindsay, for everything you've done. Thank you very much and I'm just glad I could help. Congratulations to the parents of Lindsay, Mr. and Mrs. Walter. Next item on the agenda is a mayor's comments. There will be three things I'll be talking briefly about. That's the rules of order that we are proposing to adopt tonight. The creation in the beginning of an online newsletter and then the Clean City initiative kickoff. With respect to the rules of order, every one of you will have received a copy of the rules of order. This thing has gone back several months and put it together. It's gone through a process of presenting it to the alderman so that we could have input, at least once, maybe twice, and then it went through the department heads at least a couple of times, too. And every time it went through that process, it brought back some good suggestions and good input and all that was incorporated into the final product here. It's not a lengthy manual, it's not a literary work piece at all. What it is is a very handy tool for alderman to be able to refer to with respect to our rules of order. And it addresses a lot of things that our municipal code does not. So in that respect, we want to make sure that people understand, the alderman understand, that this thing would be in effect so long as it doesn't contradict what our municipal code calls for. There's three things that this manual deals with and one is the rules of order for ourselves and that is the foundation for that is mutual respect for each other. We need to have mutual respect for each other. Whether we disagree with each other or not, the bottom line is we must have mutual respect for each other. The other area that it covers is the quorum conduct in order for committees, boards and commissions. And then there's a section there for the public also where it addresses the public responsibility when they address the council and either in a committee, commission or board meeting or in the common council. Again, this is it and you will have a resolution tonight to approve that tonight. The next is the online newsletter beginning today on online is the mayor's newsletter and it's just another way of me to reach out to the community and connect with the community and to inform the community as it's our responsibility to do so. One of the things that I want to do with this online newsletter is to work extensively with creating good, solid relationships with our small business and our big business. There's a lot of great things that are happening in Sheboygan here and we need to make sure that we brag about ourselves. For the longest time, I think sometimes we forget about the good things because some bad things happen. But whatever bad happens, we must always be mindful that there's an enormous amount of good happening in their community and that we're moving in a great direction. One of the things that I want to do with this newsletter is I said strengthen our relationships with local businesses and one in particular because there's a lot of rumor about this particular business that perhaps is not doing well. I have no indication. I have no evidence. I have nothing that tells me otherwise. I believe they're very successful and since then they've hired a new general manager and speaking of a general manager, he's here tonight. I'd like just to introduce you to, please. I just relocated from the Washington, D.C. area. I've been here just a little action a month today. And again, I want to thank you very much for the invitation to see me. Thank you very much. I'm going to have to thank you very much. I certainly hope over the next three months or so I get the opportunity to sit down and chat because I'm a little close to a very, very, very long attendee here in Sheboygan and the city of Sheboygan. I can't tell you how excited I am as well as my wife. I'm going to give you a follow-up. My wife is back in the age of 27, that first child. I certainly am very excited about that. But more importantly, I'm very excited about the opportunities at Sheboygan as long as the relationship between Austin and the city of Sheboygan. Again, I come from a very, very big city, but we're all in a very small town, very similar to the city of Sheboygan. So again, thank you very much for the opportunity to look forward to a very, very long and great opportunity to move on to the city of Sheboygan. Thank you. Thank you, Mr. Moses. Normally we would have asked him to step up so the public could hear him, he did such a good job or they didn't want to interrupt. Mr. Moses is doing a really fantastic job. All the feedback that we get from our community regarding him are extremely positive. Just as they were with Mr. Joseph Haas, the feedback we got was extremely positive and we're pleased that you're there and we hope that our relationship with the city of Blue Harbor will be strengthened in the days to come. The next item here would be the Clean City Initiative kickoff. You will be approving an ordinance change tonight that deals with this Clean City Initiative. What we want to make sure we tell the public and for the alderman to understand is when this thing kicks off, you're going to start getting some calls because why in the world did you charge me so much? All it was was one bag of garbage and it cost me $200. Well there's a process, a very, very fair and equitable process that has been put in place partly in the ordinance form and partly in policy form and it will be followed. The one thing I'd like to let the public know and let the alderman know in case you get calls is that there will be a 30 grace period although they're going to start enforcing the other policy now if somebody gets hit with a fine or a citation and they would like to avail themselves of the 30 day grace period all they need to do is call public works, I mean the inspectorate departments and ask for that 30 day extension and they will be granted that. That will be the grace period. After that, all goes, we're going to clean our city up and I hope that people understand that we need to clean our city up and I hope that we get their cooperation. And by the way, as a final note, on our website people can file a complaint if they so choose to do it online and I will add also that at the end of the year we've put together a process in place that will be able to track the progress and the success of this clean city initiative. If it didn't work, it didn't work, we'll put it aside. If it does, then we'll need to look at where it's strong where we need to make it stronger. I have every reason to believe it's going to be a great program. So again, you'll start getting calls because if people are going to start getting citations and start getting notices, okay? Thank you. Next we have a hearing to amend the zoning for property located at 2039-339 Pennsylvania Avenue from Class PPUD Pre-Plan Unit Development to Class Marina Vista PUD Plan Unit Development 206 Classification. Is there anyone here that would like to address the council regarding the public hearing? Is there anyone here that would like to address the council regarding that hearing? Sure, I would. Please do, sir. Can I get your name and address, please? Paul Weisey. W-E-I-S-E. And your address, sir? 9333 North Upper River Road, River Hills. Thanks. Thank you, Mayor, Council. I'm a Milwaukee real estate developer and the amendment would allow us to my company, Paul Weisey Real Estate Corp. to tear down the green buildings on Pennsylvania and build a condominium project called Marina Vista Condominiums. The building is obsolete, underperforming, and it's a great site. I do have, I believe everybody has seen that my general development plan, it's three separate buildings, 21 units in each building, 63 total. Parking on the ground level would be disguised to really appear that it isn't parking, but we can't really go down on the site, but we'll go below the 100 year floodplain and we plan to just go up four stories, first story being the parking. And the precise plan will be turned in the 14th of this month and that will have all the different products used and all the precise look of the property. The sketches that have been distributed are really preliminary sketches. They're not on AutoCAD as of yet. They're not electronic and they're not detailed, but they will be on the 14th. And I think it's an attractive site, attractive buildings that we're looking at putting there and I hope I'm looking for your support. Thank you, sir. Thank you. Is there anyone else that would like to address the council in a particular hearing? Is there anyone else? Alderman Groff. Thank you, Your Honor. I would move that the hearing be closed. I wish in a second to close here. Any discussion like motion? Alderman Serta. Thank you, Your Honor. I'd like to direct a question to Paula Enders and ask if this plan is conducive with the potential space port that's coming to us. Okay, Miss Enders, would you please come forward and Alderman Serta, would you please state your question again? Thank you, Your Honor. I was just wondering if you could elaborate if this is conducive with the potential project development plan with the space port coming to Sheboygan? Okay. Thank you, Mayor and Command Council. I sit as an ex-officio on the development corporation and I have mentioned this project and I've asked for input. I've received some from, I would say it was either members or their consultant and part of, we have a motion that's coming in that allows us the ability to still work with the developer on the site plan, which the GDP is at first step. It's the rezoning of the property and then we move into a precise implementation plan, which means that you, as a developer mentioned, you really get into some specifics and so what we're asking for is, part of the motion if you approve this is that it really makes very clear that staff would work with the developer to make sure that that site plan works for the site and for the community. All in one month of my order? Thank you, Your Honor. I wanted to make the motion. Are you ready for that to pull the agenda item forward? Well, we've got a close hearing for us. We're going to have to take a vote. Thank you. Any other questions for Ms. Paulette? Enders? Okay, thank you. Is there anyone else who would like to address the council? Is there anyone else? Okay, then there's a motion made in the second. Right? You want an aye vote from this? Mm-hmm. All those in favor, state aye. Aye. Any opposed? Motion carries. Okay, now, Paulette Montgomery. Thank you, Your Honor. I'd like to pull forward agenda item number 2242 relating to this hearing and this development. I make a motion to accept and file a request to the Board of Officers and pass the ordinance with the recommendation to approve subject to the following conditions. Modify site plan by working with staff direction to accomplish a desired orientation and configuration of development. Provide adequate views to the river and public river walk from Pennsylvania Avenue. Provide adequate green space and public access to the public river walk. There's a motion in the second with the amendments under discussion. There being none, please call the roll. D-Berg. Aye. E-Berg. Aye. Serta. Aye. Graf. Your Honor. All of you, Serta was pressing your vote. I'm sorry. All of you, Serta was pressing your vote. I'm sorry. All of you, Serta was pressing your vote. I'm sorry. All of you, Serta was pressing your vote. I couldn't ask a question. Okay. We'll hold on. Yeah, I raised it. I have it solved. You're ready. My question solved. Thank you. I see another bottom. Elmer and Ratke, did you want to say something, sir? Are we okay? All right. Please call the roll. D-Berg. Yes, I did. Okay. E-Berg. Aye. Serta. Aye. Graf. Aye. Kittleson. Aye. Manny. Aye. Meyer. Aye. Montemayor. Aye. And Bauman. Aye. 15 ayes. Motion carries. All of them are Ratke. Thank you, Your Honor. I'd like to pull ahead items 2355 and 2356. 2250, 2255. What is it? 2255. 2355. 2355. That's why 2355. Okay. That's why I was telling you. You don't have 22. I look at two sheets. Okay. Just that item? Just those two. Okay. 2355 and pull forward. Please continue, Your Honor. Thank you. Thank you. These have to do with the broad eating contest. I'd like to make a motion that the RC be accepted and adopted. I'm both 2355 and 2356. 2250's. 23. 2355 and 56. Motion to accept and adopt both. There's a second. Under discussion. Speaking, I can appreciate what Mr. Mertz is asking for here, but I don't believe governments should be getting involved in running referendums to stop not-for-profit organizations from having contests. Thank you. Alderman, want to my order? Thank you, Your Honor. Does he mean file or adopt? Accept and adopt would be to file it as you recommend to file both documents. Thank you. Thank you. Mayor Alderman Susha. Thank you, Your Honor. I just wanted to share a little bit of background about a story that Mr. Mertz shared with me. I shed some light on why this is coming to council. A number of years ago, he knew a teenage boy who worked in a restaurant, and at the end of his shift he was told he could eat whatever was left in the kitchen. And that boy, I believe, he devoured the rest of the prime rib, and by morning that boy was dead. And what happened is he died from aspiration asphyxia, which basically means he overate. And I think that's the concern here, and that's why this is being brought forward. At this point, I'm going to support what the committee decided to file the issue relating to the public referendum, because I don't believe that the general public has enough knowledge on aspiration asphyxia. But I would like to ask that the JCs be proactive the next time they come to council and ask for the permit to hold their broad days. And I'd ask that they be proactive to bring a physician in with them so the Public Protection and Safety Committee could talk with the JCs and perhaps some of the medical community about whether aspiration asphyxia should be something that we should be concerned about with the broad-eating contest. And I think it would be more appropriate for that committee to work with the JCs in the future to see what the future recommendation should be about the broad-eating contest. Thank you. Thank you, Alderman Susha. Alderman Sugali. Thank you, Mr. Mayor. I appreciate what Alderman Susha is saying, but under those circumstances of bringing in doctors, et cetera, concerning this, then we might as well bring in doctors. And police offers everything when it comes to drunkenness and people drinking beer or whatever else that takes place at broad days or anything else kind of picnics that are sponsoring. So I just feel that this is just something that's, I guess, a necessary evil that takes place when you have picnics and festivals. Thank you. Thank you, Alderman Sugali. Okay, please call the roll. Eberg. Aye. Serta. Aye. Graf. Aye. Kittleson. Aye. Manny. Aye. Meyer. Aye. Montemayor. Aye. Radke. Aye. Sugali. Aye. Stefan. Aye. 15 ayes. Motion carries. Alderman Susha, you get first. Thank you, Your Honor. I'd like to pull forward document 2339. Pulling forward 2339. Please continue. Okay. That's pulling forward the general rules of order, procedure, and conduct. And I move that this resolution be put upon its passage. Second. Motion to second under discussion. Alderman, okay, we've got Alderman Graf was blinking first. No, that was on, I wanted to. Okay. Alderman, Vice President Berg. Yes, thank you, Your Honor. I would request the chair's permission to use the podium. Permission granted. Thank you. Thank you. Fellow council members, tonight we will be establishing rules of the road that will govern our process and procedure. However, I would like to use this opportunity to address the situation that I become increasingly concerned about. That's why I ask Mayor Perez for the opportunity to address the issue that relates not to what we decide, but rather how we arrive at a decision-making process. Within a few weeks, we'll be concluding our legislative year. During that time, we will have dealt with a lot of content. If we look at our agenda tonight, we have over 70 items alone that represents the people's business. Along with dealing with these matters, we have invented a process which defines how we deal with the people's business and each other. That's why I'd like to talk about, because my sense is that's what the community is concerned about. Over the last several weeks, I've been disappointed, frustrated, and angry with the direction we've taken. I think that these are important words because they reflect the emotional tone that defines many of our deliberations. I cannot believe that as a group, we share these very common and understandable feelings which are expressed through our personalities and our political beliefs. Over the past year, I've enjoyed the opportunity to talk individual with many of you, many whom I may disagree with on issues, and while I may take issues with the words you use and the logic you employ, your feelings are readily understandable and valid. However, the words we use are reflective of our feelings and reality dictates that people remember the words that we use, especially when they are hurtful and directed at an individual or group. Hurtful words bring about a defensive response which quickly turns into polarized positions, leaving little room for meaningful discussion of the underlying issues. Unfortunately, we have often used the legislative process to serve these emotional ends. It's unique that as a nation, we enjoy and take for granted the governmental process which allows feelings to be expressed through our words. That's our freedom of speech. However, with freedom comes responsibility, and I would suggest that we need to exemplify a standard of conduct in our actions that makes us the object of pride rather than embarrassment. As a bystander, I've long been interested in city government. It's a place where we deliberate stop signs, taxes, garbage collection, marinas, dog runs, seagulls, a myriad of other issues that so directly concern those who we are sworn to represent. A place where serving the greater good is our challenge and where personalities and politics should be secondary. My disappointment is that we have evolved into a body where personalities, politics, and polarities have supplanted good sound public policy and decision making. My frustration is personal in that for the life of me, I don't see a clear and obvious way to resolve the gridlock and the contentious atmosphere that has defined this legislative session. Rather than look for solutions, we appear to be enamored with fixing blame on individuals, boards, and departments, and as a result of that, those of us who play the game, the blame game further become a lightning rod for further accusations, blame, and discontent. But with disappointment and frustration also comes hope, and in this regard, I offer the following suggestions. The power for change is and should be vested in the individual voter. Election time is fast approaching. The public remains as the true judge of the direction our city will take. While stormwater and south pier and taxes and economic growth comprises the stuff that our candidates will address, I would also ask that you look at each current and future candidate in terms of their abilities at consensus building and reason debate without personal attack. Mayor Perez, I also look to you to craft a committee structure that represents all viewpoints and appoint those chairman that can acknowledge the diversity that exists among us and produce outcomes that present sound policy and procedures above personalities and politics. And to you, my fellow Alderman, I ask that we remember our oath of office and our responsibility as public officials' employees. And until this point, the words that I've used have been mine and mine alone. The words that I read you now belong to all enough, all of us, as they can be found in section 2-267 of our ordinance book. And it relates to responsibilities of public officials and employees. And I read as follows. Public officials and employees are agents of public purpose and hold office for the benefit of the public. They are bound to uphold the Constitution of the United States and the Constitution of the state and carry out impartially the laws of the nation, state, and city, and thus to foster respect of all government. They are bound to observe in their officials' acts the highest standards of morality and to discharge faithfully the duties of their office, regardless of personal considerations, recognizing that the public interest must be their primary concern. Their conduct in both their official and private affairs should be above reproach so as to foster respect for all government. I thank you. Thank you, Vice President Byrd. Aldermas Agali. Thank you, Mr. Mayor. As I'm looking through your general rules of order and I have the draft that you did, there are just some different wordage in certain areas. The only one that I take issue to and it is not anything that means to disrespect to but as I was growing up, I vowed to only honor three entities in my life and as my God, my country, and my husband and I feel that since you do not meet any three of those requirements and according to Robert's rules of order I am not showing any disrespect to you by calling you Mr. Mayor instead of your honor as you so state here in this book. So I don't feel I'm doing anything disrespectful as I refer to you as Mr. Mayor. Thank you. Aldermas Agali, there's none taken. No disrespect taken but counsel will approve or not approve. You had every opportunity to look at these orders several months. We could have talked about that. I wanted just to point out something here. As I was working through these rules with the input of a lot of people what kept coming through my mind was this quotation that's up on top and I'd like to read that because it's very important to me and I think the community needs to understand that and it goes like this. When order is lost, everyone does what they please in the manner that they please and that is enough to initiate chaos and we lose civility, respect for each other and destroy the very integrity of the government we have the privilege of representing. That is a foundation for these rules. Again, mutual respect for each other. We all abide by orders. We all abide by rules. That's the way our society is structured. I will respect them. I hope you will too. Thank you. We have a motion. Second, please call the roll. I'm sorry. Thank you, Your Honor, to take you up on your word to find a middle ground seeing that Alderman Sagali has strong convictions and she gave her explanation and it also does go in lines with Robert's Rules of Order. I'd like to make an amendment to page 6 and just add where it says during council meetings and all other meetings the mayor is attending or is member of address the mayor as your honor or Mr. Mayor. Very good. There's a motion. Second. Second. Under discussion. We'll call an amendment. Please do. This would be for the amendment to add Alderman Serta's words. Alderman Serta. An aye vote would be to add them. Graf. Kittleson. Manny. Meyer. Montemayor. Radke. Segali. Stefan. Susha. Van Akron. Vanderweel. Bowman. D-Berg. And E-Berg. Fifteen ayes. Motion carries. We will take a vote. We'll call on the motion as amended. Please call the roll. Graf. Kittleson. Manny. Meyer. Montemayor. Radke. Segali. Stefan. Susha. Van Akron. Van Akron. Van Akron. Van Akron. Van Akron. Van Akron. Van Akron. Van Akron. Van Akron. Van Akron. Van Akron. Van Akron. Van Akron. Van Akron. Van Akron. Van Akron. Van Akron. Van Akron. Van Akron. Van Akron. Van Akron. Van Akron. Van Akron. Van Akron. Van Akron. Van Akron. Van Akron. Van Akron. Van Akron. Van Akron. bonds on behalf of Wisconsin Power and Light Company. And this has been to the finance committee several times. So that being said, and we have discussed this, I would move that this resolution be put upon its passage. There's a motion and a second with the resolution upon its passage, 2349. Any discussion on that? I believe representatives of Wisconsin Power and Light are here. I would move to open the floor to them. Okay, is there a second to that motion? All those in favor, state aye. Aye. Okay. We have some representatives. Please do, sir. Thank you. And could you give me your name, please? Yes, it's Rike Bacalao. Oh, I need you to spell that. Or a business card would be wonderful. Thank you very much. No, it's not. No, it's not. Thank you. Sorry about that. That's fine. Oh, please. Oh, I'm sorry. I'm Rike Bacalao. I'm the assistant treasurer of Wisconsin Power and Light. If you can get that mic a little closer, please. Oh, sorry. There you go. Is that better? That's better. Okay. And the reason I'm here is to request your support of this motion. These bonds will in fact be our obligation, Wisconsin Power and Lights. What we're proposing to do is to refinance or refund two series of bonds that were issued some years ago, totaling $24,500,000. They were used to finance some pollution control equipment that is in our property but in yours territory. And we were able to finance it with tax exempt funding, therefore cheaper for our ratepayers. What I am proposing to do now is to refund them such that we save some 20 or 30 basis points per year. And that will translate to some $175,000 to $200,000 savings per year for our ratepayers. Not for the company, but for the ratepayers. So we are requesting your approval of being able to refund these. And if you have any questions, feel free to ask me. Are there any questions? No. Thank you very much. Thank you. Is there anyone else that would like to speak to the council from that particular business company? Anybody else? No. Okay. Thank you, sir. Take your vote. Kittleson. Mani. Meyer. Montemayor. Radke. Segali. Stephan. Sushia. Van Akron. Vanderweel. Bauman. Dieberg. Eberg. Serta. Engraaf. 15 ayes. Motion carries. Engraaf. Thank you, Your Honor. I would like to pull on the next two documents I'd like to pull forward is 2352 and 2354. These are two documents regarding the Special Committee on Risk Management. And the first one, and I'd like to do these separately, the first one is the RC by the Special Committee on Risk Management for the claim of Sandra M. Wimler for alleged damages to her basement and property due to clogged city drain. The sub, or the recommendation of the committee is that we pay the plumber fee and deny the remainder of the claim. I would move that RC be accepted and adopted. Is there a second? Second. Motion is second. Under discussion. Under discussion I would move also at this time to open the Florida Ms. Wimler if anybody has any questions of her. But I would make that in form of a motion. There's a motion to open the Florida Ms. Wimler. Is there a second? Second. Any discussion on that? All those in favor say aye. Aye. Any opposed? Motion carries Ms. Wimler. Would you like to please come up? Ms. Wimler appeared at the Special Committee on Risk Management at our meeting last weekend. At that meeting we discussed the findings of the subcommittee and what they recommended and the committee recommended that we would do exactly the same thing as the subcommittee recommended and that would be to deny the claim and pay the plumber fee only. So with that if there's any questions that either I can answer or City Attorney McLean or Ms. Wimler I think that would be appropriate right now. Thank you. We have Alderman Steffen. Thank you Your Honor. I don't have a question for Ms. Wimler. I guess the question is typically I know we make people sue us to get their money sometimes but I mean it seems to me if we're admitting fault by paying the plumber fee why aren't we taking the next step and is it just that we don't feel what she's asking is fair or what's the logic and you know for paying the plumber fee we're kind of admitting it's our fault but we're not settling with the other part of it so I wonder what the logic was in that. Who do you want that respond to? Whoever made the decision to recommend this. I can tell you that the plumber fee is something that the subcommittee recommended to pay and I would believe that it's based on past practice that we normally pay the plumbing bill for a situation like this and I could refer to Steve if he wants to add any more to that or get everybody lined up here. City Attorney. Thank you. The policy's been that if homeowner hires a plumber and they come out and snake or jet their lateral and they find the blockage is not in the lateral that we will reimburse the plumbers bill if the clog is in the main but the rationale for not paying the claim in this case when the blockage was in the main is to do that you're saying that the city becomes a guarantor to every homeowner that they'll never have a sewer backup and anytime there's a clog in the main regardless of negligence on the city's part that we'll be paying claims. This one more indicates we've got plenty of insurance to cover that. That's not true. We're self-insured for the first $75,000 of a claim. So that money that's paid out comes from somewhere and it would come from the taxpayers in the long run. The principle we followed is if the city is negligent and that negligence causes the blockage in the main we will pay those claims and we've had those where there's been breaks in the mains where those old mains where bricks start collapsing in there and that causes the blockage but where there's just the blockage due to whatever coming downstream that occasionally happens it's not a perfect system occasionally things block up unless we have some knowledge that there's a major problem there or that we create the problem we've been denying those claims and that's obviously a policy decision that the council has to weigh in each case but that's the policy that's been followed in the past and I think from a legal standpoint if you look at it the issue would be in a court was the city negligent in its operation and maintenance of the sewer and we believe in this case that the city was not negligent in the maintenance of the sewer. Mr. Stephens, does that answer your question? Thank you. I have Alderman Cigali. Thank you Mr. Mayor if I could ask Mrs. Wimler what is your total cost I don't have it in front of me so what is your total cost between the plumbing and what you're suing the city? Lots of furnishings and the bills that it took to clean up it ran close to $14,000. Okay and to if I may have another question to attorney. Please do. Okay so what you're saying then is that any of these sewers are backed up now what do you classify as maintenance? Doesn't the public works or any of their their fellows go and clean these sewers so that there isn't backup? Okay so how can you say then that if this is being done and these sewers are being backed up that we are not held responsible on the people? I mean she'd lost $14,000 here. I mean that to me is an awful great amount for us not to be and say well the sewer backed up I'm sorry this is how it is. That to me doesn't seem right to these homeowners that are paying their tax dollars to the city and are expecting at least some type of service and I realize public works can't do all of it. I mean there's their strap the way it is for manpower and things like this but I would think that there is something there that we could help these people out when they lose just about everything they've had down there. Is there a question that you'd like to know? Well what I'm trying to say is this a policy that we the council set or is this something that's set in stone that we cannot do anything we cannot change a policy to say that what the city is responsible and not responsible? Okay I'll just turn my claim to address it. Mr. City Attorney. Thank you. Each claim that's submitted comes into the council goes to a committee that you've established to address them that committee deals with claims on a regular basis makes a recommendation to the council. It's strictly that it's a recommendation to the 16 of you you make the decision and if you want to choose to start paying these claims you've got the power to do that and you can do that at any time but you just need to bear in mind that there comes a price to doing that and you've got to weigh that and I think that's why you have the risk management committee is looks at these and tries to establish reasonable policies to follow again from a legal standpoint the city is responsible to use reasonable efforts to maintain its sewer system it builds the system and if it's using reasonable efforts to maintain the system that's all that the law asks of the city again if you're going to say that every time there's a blockage in the main for whatever cause that if that backs up in someone's home the city is going to pay for that you're going to be finding you're going to be paying a lot of money out and again you can do that the policy is up to the council to establish thank you attorney McLean, Elwin Many thank you very much your honor that's perfect lead-in is my question and that is for Mr. Holton if he would address for us the normal maintenance procedures in the city so we can consider what reasonable maintenance means in addition if you could comment upon the worst case scenario when we have difficulties with the large amounts of water etc the further aspect of that question is a little bit nuanced but in what degree are our sewers affected by inappropriate things going down toilets etc is that a part of the problem as well okay we've addressed about four or five questions there remember we need to ask you to please take the seat back Mr. Tom Holton, please sir did you understand all those questions or you want to repeat it one at a time I think I understand them thank you your honor and council the city has probably close to 200 miles of Sanctuary sewer main and we have a schedule where we will televised no we can't do it all in one year we can't do it all in five years but we're out there televising the mains to make sure they're in good shape we have a schedule where we go and jet the mains to clean them out we have a schedule where we will treat them for roots the roots will go on a ball up in the mains we treat the batteries of town we have a schedule for that we're out there I can't say daily but most of the time we got a crew of four or five that are out there they're televising or jetting the sewers we're making repairs all the time worst case scenario to which okay we need to put you on my aluminum mat the second question is what's the worst case scenario with pressure on the whole system how much impact is there it depends on the area where you're at that's a tough question to answer I'm assuming in Ms. Filmer's case there's probably some grease that came from somewhere it wasn't anything that was dull in the toilet or anything it was a grease a lot of grease it must have let go from somewhere that rolled down and got hung up in the main is my guess I don't let for fact that's what it sounds like it was okay any other questions for Mr. Holton thank you Mr. Holton thank you thank you your honor I believe the floor is still open to Ms. Wimler and I do have a couple of questions for her okay Ms. Wimler please sorry if she could please step up one more time thank you my first question is in regards to the type of weather on the day that this occurred was it during a major storm no it was cold whether it was the beginning of December because I remember that we had to go out in cold and check the manhole okay were there any other emergencies going on in the city that you were aware of no nothing as a matter of fact my house was the only house that was affected I said there's some pumps weren't running nothing I guess it was just me okay and my last question is from the time that the plumber identified that the problem was basically in the city's property you said that it took about two hours for the city workers to get there in that time frame after the plumber identified where the problem was would you say that the level of back up in your basement did it go lower did it remain the same or did it continue to rise it continued to rise it came in when the plumber went out to the manhole to look it had been flowing in through the trap in waves you could actually there were waves and the other part of the basement where my washing machine is where the drain is it just continued to rise and rise anything but sandbag everywhere it just kept coming and it stated on the plumber's bill also that it was six inches still rising much damage okay thank you with that information and the fact that it took over two hours for city workers to get there and there were no other emergencies going on I'd like to amend this document where it would read at the end recommends that we pay the plumber fee plus 75% of the remainder of the claim second there's a motion to amend did you get that you want to have the plumber fee paid plus 75% of the remainder of the claim paid we have all of them Vice President Burke your next yes thank you Your Honor I believe that this also addresses the amendment which is what we should speak on but I think that anytime we do this we are really I don't know that there's anyone out there whose heart doesn't go out to Mrs. Wimler we all would likely if we were in that situation look for some redress but I think this impacts on other areas of city government for example and I guess I would direct a question to city attorney McLean we do have a sidewalk inspection program that we do with due diligence to ensure that we have no lifts and sidewalks as a result of having that sidewalk inspection program we look at each claim with I believe the overriding legal principle being because we have a sidewalk inspection program that meets the standards that it needs to meet we can legitimately look at each claim with the normal procedure being denial of claim because of the fact that we do have an inspection that's the slippery spoke I speak of if we begin to address this area there are many other areas where we have inspection programs but for whatever reason claims still come up and come in in spite of that so I guess I would ask if attorney McLean could address that in some other areas where we may have exposure regarding this okay attorney McLean thank you I think there's a lot of areas public works all the streets you know you get cars you know hit potholes and tires blow or something happens there there's a myriad of infrastructure that the city has that is is not and is not going to be maintained in perfect shape all the time there's going to be problems with things cities again from a legal standpoint are not bound to be guarantors of everyone in the city never having a problem and I've had sewer backups in my home back in 98 and in the 80s that the first couple of the sewer water went up about the four feet in the basement and yes it bothered me and be nice if I knew that if I had sewer in my basement I could sewer water I could come to the city and the city would reimburse me for everything but again you open up the potential of opening up the checkbook of the taxpayers to pick up these costs you know this is another issue that you need to look at when you're scrutinizing budgets you face the budget crunches and the tax freezes and cuts in shared revenue and so forth you start chiseling away at this the number of crews or whatever that's out there maintaining the infrastructure the impact is you're going to get more claims there's going to be more imperfections so yes it's more than sewers it's water mains it's streets sidewalks you name it the city controls a lot of infrastructure and it's all prone to causing problems and needing regular maintenance and repair thank you turn Mr. Holton would you please step up it may be wiser at this point because we have some claims that are being made without giving our employees the benefit or the opportunity to respond and rebut many of the older men who were here may not have attended the risk management meeting also it would be wise to refer back to risk management and let them sort it out again make sure that we've got everything looked at if the city is making claims we need to make sure that those claims are accurate and confirm if somebody else is making claims we need to make sure that those claims are accurate confirmed we're at a point where and I don't mean to speak against anyone but we're at a point where you're going to open up a door in a legal sense called the floodgates we have I've been an alderman here since about four years ago and Mayor almost won now and we've had lots of people that have come to us and every one of their claims was denied because we opened up as Attorney McLean said, the floodgates and as Alderman Stephens said early agreeing to guilt and so forth so please if you're going to do that that's fine, just understand the consequences in my mind it would be best to refer back to risk management get the people back together again let everybody have their say confirm the right information to make this critical decision Mr. Holton this is a Sunday that's why it took two hours to get someone out there wasn't anyone to service by the one weekend watchman he has a call that goes through the call to get employees in to respond it would have been during the week it wouldn't have been two hours but because it was on a Sunday morning that's why it took time to get someone out to respond to it thank you okay we've still got some lights Alderman McLean answered my question I was concerned if it was on the weekend or not because we were concentrating on that two and a half hours but also I agree with Alderman Berg that and everybody who spoke in that if you pay any part of this claim you just open up the floodgates and it's just going to be a very bad decision thank you thank you President Gruff thank you Your Honor I do agree with what Alderman Berg said Alderman Bender as well as what City Attorney McLean said but just to give people a little bit additional information there is a subcommittee that reviews all these claims also and they normally come in with the information including pictures that they may have gathered and we discuss it before the risk management committee and I felt that no one wanted to deny this claim but it's something that has to be done because otherwise you are going to open up a Pandora's box too about all these claims coming in and right now we process probably between two and three hundred claims every year very similar to this and what we anticipate happening is that the subcommittee goes out and checks all these things and does their records and they report back to the risk management committee and make a recommendation to the risk management committee and after we we take all this information and look at it and determine what is correct or not we make the recommendation as to what needs to be done with the claim and in this case it was to pay the plumber fee and then deny the rest of the claim thank you Alderman Matty thank you Your Honor my question was somewhat answered already by Alderperson Graf just mentioned but my question related to average number of claims per year and the dollar cost that goes with them at least that's a good piece of education information for us is that too hard to come up with average dollars? Pretty hard off the top of my head but I could certainly gather that information and bring it to the next meeting I couldn't tell you what the average dollar claim would be and it really should be broken down by type of claim to be meaningful I think but we'd get all kinds of claims you see them every council meeting you're asked to act on them and I can guarantee there's a lot of people that don't file claims under the assumption that they're not going to get paid if you start paying those you're going to get a lot more claims being filed also but sure we could I think we have the information available on the matter of putting it together the numbers of claims we get spreadsheet I think from from the IS department on the types of claims and thank you thank you thank you your honor most of the people in my neighborhood pay property taxes between $7 and $12,000 a year and once you start paying about $1,000 a month for your property taxes and all you really see that you're getting in return is your trash picked up I think that the city needs to work a little harder on providing better customer service and even if it was a Sunday morning I think we have a problem with the system out there to fix this problem and this is a unique situation being that it wasn't in the middle of a rainstorm where we have city workers all over the place trying to fix a mirror out of problems all at once but I do think that this issue does warrant further investigation and I do support sending it back to committee so with that said I will withdraw my motion who seconded is there a withdrawal thank you, Alderman Susha, Alderman Sugali and we're back to the original motion unless somebody wants to make a motion to refer back Alderman Mani excuse me, yes, Alderman Mani I do then refer this back to committee and with that referral I would like information gathered about total number of claims, categories of claims, dollar amounts that go into that I think that's a good educational process there's a motion with the request second to that motion any discussion on that motion to refer back to committee being on, please call the roll we'll take a roll call Meyer Montemayor Radke Sugali Susha Van Akron Falmon Eberg Graf 15 ayes motion carries thank you, Your Honor the next one is also a claim from Special Committee on Risk Management 2354 and that is submitting a claim from Jane Jaworski for alleged damages to her basement when the sewer backed up due to men working outside recommends that the claim be denied and we are directed the city attorney to allow the notice of disallowance on that one so I would move that this RC be accepted and adopted second any more discussion at the same time, Your Honor Mrs. Jaworski is here so I would move to open up the floor to her motion second open up the floor all those in favor state aye aye any opposed motion carries thank you, President Graf Good evening, Mr. Jaworski, please Your Honor, Committee we've had a problem with the sewer people that lived in the house before where it keeps backing up and backs up into the basement and they've had problems with it for years and I don't know why they can't fix it do you want to refer that to well if I may ask what was your loss $384.20 and did you call you didn't call in a plumber or anything no, I cleaned it up myself I'm a widow so stinky mess I have the carpet outside if you'd like it she also brought the carpet to the Miss Management Committee nobody took it if the council would like we could refer this back also they both came in at the same time and I would make that in the form of a motion motion a second to refer back to the committee and you will have an opportunity again the risk management committee will have an opportunity to review your case again then I'm done thank you very much all those in favor state aye any opposed motion carries thank you, Your Honor I also would like at this time to pull forward 2259 which is a resolution requesting the common council to call together the ethics board at this time I would like to move to file that document there's a motion to second to file 2259 under discussion Alderman Cigali I know that there were some thank you Mr. Mayor I'm sorry I understand that there were some older persons that had stated that they would like to wait until the Department of Justice findings on this matter and it's to me this is not concerning what the Department of Justice finds concerning the statements that were made against our police chief what this is concerning is the statements themselves there's nothing to do with the Department of Justice I think that the statements that were said if nothing else an apology is necessary concerning our chief of police he was dishonored when those I guess all of his coincidence were stated concerning him and Mr. Muth and North 21st Street or other incidents that have taken place at PPS etc it has nothing to do with the chief was wise enough to ask the Department of Justice to come in investigate to prove that these allegations or whatever are false I think that we still need to continue on with the censorship of Alderman Shuchsia because it's necessary for us as older persons to know just how far we can go and say certain things and I think this is what this is all about also is it not so this is something that we need to continue on with and we need to discuss further and there has to be something done concerning this matter and I won't back down from this thank you Any further discussion? Alderman Serta Thank you Your Honor I look at this issue as a glass half empty or half full and as your fellow older person and you being my colleagues I think there comes a time where we need to hold accountable and that being this case as far as authoring this resolution it does fall under the guidelines under section 2-2-265 when an official or employee has doubt as to the applicability of a provision of this article to a particular situation or definition of terms using this article he should apply to the ethics board for an advisory opinion and will be guided by that opinion when given that's exactly what this does it allows to ask for this conduct appropriate in addition to the municipal code it does read as follows under the responsibility of public officials and employees and I believe Alderman Berg also stated they being the elected officials are bound to uphold the constitution of the United States and the constitution of the state and carry out impartially the laws of the nation state and city and thus to foster respect of government and that is the question that we have here before us that the opinions which were stated about our police department and to question their integrity was indeed one that was believed to be coincidence but not based on fact and lastly under section 2-269 obligation to citizens it says no city official or employee shall grant any special consideration treatment or advantage to any citizen beyond to which is available to every other citizen by the conduct displayed by alderman sushi saying that that would be appropriate for anybody any city department had any city employee or any citizen and that's what I'm taking issue with whether or not anything goes on beyond this I'm just taking a stand that I believe her behavior wasn't appropriate and it could have been easily rectified by giving an apology and choosing the relationship over the issue thank you alderman stefan thank you your honor I'm kind of concerned first of all that we're pulling this forward we just passed this general rules of order and then the council president I mean we must have pulled forward 10 documents tonight in the most cases I understand because we don't want to keep people from river hills here all night we don't want to keep camera crews here all night but I don't understand why we're pulling this one forward it blows my mind but that's just a different issue there's been a lot of misinformation in the community and I think maybe I'm wrong so I want to clarify all we're doing tonight if we support this is saying look into it we're not saying she deserves to be censured whatever else they can do to her we're just saying the committee should look into it it's worth looking into is that correct attorney mclean we're not assessing any guilt or anything tonight all we're doing is saying agreeing to send it to the ethics committee they should look into it attorney mclean would you like to respond to that please thank you the documents would direct the ethics board to investigate potential wrongdoing or improper behavior in office by all their persons who should so whatever we think we're not making any judgment on the the facts tonight I guess we're just saying doesn't meet some whatever level in our mind of we should at least look at it and I guess I would argue it does I don't know that it's worth censuring I don't know that it's worth removal but it certainly is worth looking at I think I think all of us as public figures people say things about us maybe people lie about us we kind of understand that we're in the public and maybe that comes with it we don't like it all the time we react we overreact but we can live with it when you use a police officer of lying that's a whole different thing if you can prove that he's no longer a police officer every time he walks in the court to testify a smart attorney is going to say what of course he's going to say that my client was speeding but he's a proven liar all the person should have stood up and said that so I think that alone means we have to at least go through the process and see I don't know it is it worthy of censure is it worthy of removal I don't know I'm not going to argue that point but I think you owe it to the police department to at least say it's got some merit we have to look at it because like I said if they're lying they don't have a job anymore if you can prove they're lying they're done particularly the chief so for that reason I really think we have to at least look at it thank you thank you ehran that is what we wanted from when we brought this in to have the ethics committee take a look at it I don't want to sit here tonight and say well file it and kick it aside that means say or do to anybody in this city it's okay to say it and do it but that's all we wanted was for the ethics committee to look at it thank you Elmer Berg next we have Alderman Meyer thank you your honor I don't know I think this has gotten a little out of hand I don't believe Alderman Shusha was accusing Chief Kirk of lying I think she was being honest and I think honesty is something we should you know cherish and I believe she was honest by saying she felt uncomfortable about some of the coincidences involved with closing this road and I also have questions about some of the information we were given in committee and some of the things turned out to be different from what we were told and I just think this doesn't fall under the definition of an ethics violation Attorney McLean could you answer that is this an ethics violation Attorney McLean well the the ethics code itself generally deals with looks at issues of personal interest and financial interest that's generally what the code of ethics is all about ethical behavior doesn't necessarily fall within the city's ethics code you know it may sound a little ironic but the code that you've adopted that's generally the code that's provided by the state for municipalities to adopt generally the focus is looking at our public officials and public employees engaged in conduct that benefits them personally or financially but that's not to say that you've got an ethics board which is the entire council and it's up to the council as to whether you want to send something to the ethics board to conduct some investigation it may not rise to whether or not there's an evaluation of specific provisions of the ethics code but as has been alluded to previously there are general statements in the code of ethics dealing with the standards of conduct of public employees and public officials to uphold the integrity of their office and act in the best interest of the public and so forth and if the council as a body wishes have something go to the ethics board to look at that's the council's prerogative I can't say that because it doesn't fit nicely into this box or this box that you can't send it to the ethics board again that's your prerogative Vice President Byrd thank you your honor I guess I'm going to support a motion to file based on one very narrow interpretation of the resolution the resolution calls for the ethics board to investigate we're not an investigatory body I don't know which of us is going to go out and investigate this subpoena witnesses swear people into testimony etc I will take a page from Alderman Schuch's book when she says we listen to the experts I think the experts in this matter are the department of justice Chief Kirk has indicated that he feels that their involvement will be valuable to his department in terms of providing if you would an arms length opinion on the matters that happened and that surround this particular issue and incident I also would note that in terms of the ethics board I assume that this takes the form of a quasi-judicial hearing where you have anybody who is in front of the ethics board we have Bernie's fees there is a quasi-legal approach to this and that in that sense this council will serve if you would will render a judgment and I can't help but feel that to some degree the jury has tainted I think we are so polarized that it would be extremely difficult to have a fair and unbiased viewpoint that comes up with this or any matter so I guess I would argue that we should continue to allow the department of justice to investigate once we receive their findings and Chief Kirk and Alderman Shusha have the ability to review them and see if they can come to some meaningful agreement regarding this matter then and only then should we revisit this thank you Alderman Montemayor thank you Your Honor I would simply like to restate what Attorney McLean said and our ethics training it was made very clear to us that ethics violation has to do with personal gain or money for yourself or for your family it was made very clear to us that ethics violations don't have to do with what you may think is intemperate speech it has to do with profit or gain and also I think we as a council the first step to any ethics board is law and licensing that's the entry way if we were to go ahead with this which I certainly don't think we should that's where it would go first thank you Alderman Kilsen thank you Your Honor I guess listening to everyone speak got me to thinking however we listen to Officer Williams speak here two weeks ago seeing that his integrity was personally attacked and so I tend to agree his personal integrity was attacked so I'm wondering if an apology is in order or what can be done we still need to think about those things and I am thinking about that seriously thank you thank you Alderman Kilsen Alderman Serta thank you Your Honor just for some clarification under the Wisconsin state statute it is very narrow in suggesting that the definition would have to fall under the criteria of financial interest or personal interest but it does further state that the statute also authorizes a county, city, village, or town to create its own code of ethics in addition to the state code which we have as follows our Sheboygan Municipal Code also outlines which Miss Elderperson Berg had reference again issues of respect which I think this would fall under another thing that we have to keep in mind it also mentions that their conduct in both their official and private affairs should be above reproach as to foster respect for all government going above and beyond the personal and financial interests it's all outlined here and secondly there is a provision under our municipal code that if we do have questions there is a way that we can bring this forward and look at it not just leaving it up to the Department of Wisconsin Justice so it's all outlined here this is the way that we should take it Thank you Thank you, Your Honor this whole discussion just kind of bothers me the way it's all come up it makes me nervous because if we start censuring people for what they speak on here maybe they made a mistake maybe they shouldn't have said it then we're all going to be worried that they're going to be censured Your Honor you might remember I made some accusations towards you in the beginning of the year probably had the votes to investigate me could have sent to law and licensing but it didn't happen and in the past when we sent things to law and licensing when as a group of peers who work together investigate ourselves it just gets real nasty I'm not sure I'm going to vote right now but I think it's a great behavior what she said is between her and her constituents and they have a way to take action a means to deal with that if as a group of constituents are that upset with it Thank you Thank you, Your Honor Just one I don't know if it's a point of order or clarification from the city attorney when this says directs to ethics board we had decided at some point that the first step was to go to law and licensing is that who this would go to or not as you understand it Thank you, Your Honor It could the law and licensing committee has been designated by the council as the subcommittee of the ethics board so I guess the way it's worded I would see it going to the ethics board which is the full council and then the ethics board and the licensing but you could clarify that in the document The other question I had Alderman Berg seem concerned about investigating there's nothing that says we have and we could send it to the ethics board and they could do nothing until they get the report back from the attorney general that would be fine with everybody there's nothing that says they have to act on it before that comes back and see what the attorney general does they can do the investigation then we wouldn't have to worry about conducting our own investigation we could just live with that and decide does it meet the merits of an ethics does it need to be pursued further or not correct we could just leave it sit down it directs the ethics board to investigate I don't read that as delaying the matter but again that would be up to all of you who are the ethics board okay we will thank you I think the discussion is the discussion to have I don't like the idea of having the discussion around the possibility of a censure so I'm going to vote against this but I would like the ethics committee to look at the issue in totality and we together can discuss the appropriateness of applying all that city ordinance to our lives I'm uncomfortable with any possible censure at this point for good reasons as Mr. Gandhi will offer alright one more time thank you I just have a question for attorney McLean I know that two weeks ago there was an issue of ethics violations against elder person Sugali and elder person Dan Berg I believe and they voted on their own ethics complaint to file it and I'm wondering if that's proper procedure if I'll be able to vote on this I should abstain attorney McLean good question I guess I would be inclined to suggest that you abstain since it it would involve investigating you and you have a personal interest in that that would be my advice since you asked you know I wasn't asked for last council meeting okay we have a motion thank you last time just in terms of the toddliness of this I assume that this is not a priority issue for the department of justice I understand that they made some preliminary contacts and I think it is reasonable to believe that this document will likely be bound over to the next council given we only had a couple more meetings so I guess the question would then come this would if I understand a procedure it would really sit as a referral to the ethics committee and at the end of our council year then we'd have to make a disposition of the document either to file it or to refer it to the new council is that your understanding that's correct based upon that I'd rather see it brought up with the new council and again that's where I'll vote to file thank you okay the motion on the floor is to file and I vote would be to file Meyer Montemayor Radke Segali Steffen Susha Van Akron Van Der Wiel Graf Kittlesen Manning I will vote I to file Graf would you please we have one more I mean it's been .370 is that what you're going to do I would like to now vote over 2370 which is the resolution authorizing the city of Sheboye in the office of the mayor to submit an application to congressman request a million dollar grant for advancement of the state's science and education and technology I would so move that we pass that resolution there's a motion to put the resolution upon its passage 2370 is there a second a second under discussion I'd ask for a motion to open the floor to what is your name Chrissy happy I would so move that the floor be open is there a second back on polls in favor state I any oppose motion carries please thank you could you give me your name please I'm sorry Christina happy PA PA I'm going to keep this relatively short in the interest of time tonight but I'm here to support the the passage of this proposal which would be submitted to congressman Petrie what it would do is it would bring funding for education in congressman Petrie's congressional district it would develop new educational programming that ties into the latest technology relating to space sports and it also provides professional development for teachers within the area at this point I'd open it up to any questions that anyone may have any questions from the element we're going to let you off easy thank you thank you very much and as happy as to return back to Green Bay that's what we open the floor for her thank you okay there's a motion in a second please call the roll Montemayor Radke Segali Steffen Susha Van Akron Vanderweel Bauman D-Berg E-Berg Graf Kittelsen Manny and Meyer 15 ayes motion carries thank you your honor at this time I'd like to make a motion on the consent agenda if I may um so that's for items 23-1 through 23-19 I would move that all our O's be accepted and placed on file all our C's be accepted and adopted we pass the resolutions and the general ordinance second any discussion there being on please call the roll Radke Segali Steffen Susha Van Akron Vanderweel Bauman D-Berg E-Berg Serda Graf Kittelsen Manny Meyer and Montemayor 15 ayes motion carries communications and petitions 23-20 through 23-23 to be referred for Port of Officers 2 23-24 by the city attorney submitting for the council's reference and outline in a portion of the legal document from the municipality magazine regarding procedures for removing local officials from office Alderman Graf thank you I would move that the O's be accepted and placed on file motion to second any discussion on that polls in favor of state aye any oppose motion carries 23-25 through 23-27 lies over 23-28 23-38 to be referred resolutions introduced 3 23-29 has been pulled forward 23-40 by Alderman Graf and Manny created in the Charter Communication Re-Franchising Advisory Committee Alderman Graf Thank you Your Honor I would move that the resolution be put upon its passage Motion to second resolution upon its passage any discussion Alderman Steffen Thank you Your Honor just as a follow up to what you said earlier I did think Mr. Bob did a wonderful job tonight and as he is a constituent of mine I would ask that you consider him strongly for the committee by all means I would really like to do that any other discussion being on please call the roll Segali, Steffen Susha, Van Akron Van Der Wiel, Baumann Dieberg one at a time Eberg, Serda Graf Kittlesen, Manny Meyer, Montemire and Ratke 15 ayes Motion carries 23-41 by Alderman Graf Susha Davis to remove the 10 members of the Mead Public Library Board of Directors effective the end of April 06, Alderman Graf Thank you Your Honor I would move that the resolution be put upon its passage Motion to second under discussion Alderman Steffen Thank you Your Honor kind of ironic that some of the people who wanted to forgive other people's mistakes continually want to go after the library board for their mistakes and we've made mistakes I serve on the finance committee I applaud the taxpayer group for bringing these issues forward I really do on the other hand their vigilaniism at the library board is something that there's no rhyme or reason to it there are mistakes there are definitely things that we have to improve upon I don't think starting over is the right step you know I've been on the committee for this will be four years when I get done never did anybody you know nobody from the finance the staff the chairman I think we had two or three different chairmen in that period of time nobody ever said well you know what we haven't been invited over to the library committee lately we didn't know it how do we expect the part-time people there to know it who serve on the library board committee I think there are definite issues that have to be addressed and this type of action just gets in the way it tells what we can really accomplish there so I'm not going to support this almost definitely just a correction I think that needs to be made or at least a different viewpoint the taxpayer alliance is not a vigilani group it's a group of very concerned a group of very concerned citizens who have at heart what's good for our community they may not do it in the manner in which some of us would like but what they do is extremely valuable to our community and it keeps us on our toes and that their efforts are appreciated Alderman Susha thank you your honor I do agree with what Alderperson Steffen said in regards to you know we have volunteers that step forward to go on these boards and I think it would be asking an awful lot for them to you know look up every state statute that might apply to them but what's different in this situation is that there was a document that was submitted from the Schwoing County taxpayers alliance and that document was referred to finance committee and it was also referred to the library board the library board took that issue up on their December 15th meeting I believe it was and they made a motion to file it and they did so without getting a legal opinion so they had an opportunity to find out if they were in violation of the municipal quarter state statute and they chose not to do so at that time well as it turns out the finance committee did get a legal opinion and they found that the library boards in violation of the municipal code in two sections and also state statute in one section and another issue that was brought up in this correspondence was there was a question about how we can have one citizen up for reappointment this year five up the next year and I believe three up the next year and we're not really sure why that happened but it was designed even though it's not against state statute but it's a process that we're trying to do every year and in an attempt to get us back on track the motion was made to remove all ten board members with the understanding that some of those people would be reappointed it's just that their term would end at a different period of time but I did notice in a document that we did just accept and file from city attorney McLean he said that once we remove members that does go a little bit different against what was originally intended here for getting a clean slate and now I also have a little bit better understanding that the common council serves as kind of the judge and jury if a taxpayer were to step forward and file charges against a library board member we would listen to the case and we would make the conclusion so if we're serving as the judge for us to say we put charges against someone and then we're going to sit as the judge and jury I think that's maybe why the statute was written where we as alderman cannot serve as a taxpayer because we are going to be the judge even though I do believe that some potentially could be removed I'll vote against this tonight but we'll have to see if a taxpayer steps forward in the future thank you thank you I'm going to vote against this document this evening first off ten library board members we just put two people up they're not that long ago again secondly we've got more people going to be changing out with the new council here shortly so I'm thinking we should hold back a little bit and just wait and see what happens let the finance committee work out their differences so two people are just appointed more people coming with the next council which is just a month away so it's senseless in my opinion to try and go after them at this point in time thank you Vice President Burke yes thank you your honor I don't know that the viewing or listening public has had the opportunity to review the information provided by attorney McLean and in as much as this would require what I understand to be ten individual trials with the taxpayers then being liable for the attorney bills on both sides I think I would I would ask that attorney McLean I guess hold forth with how the process would work and again I will vote against this because I don't know that the taxpayers wants to buy the bullets that we shoot at each other in matters like this thank you Vice President McLean thank you your honor the first thing I would say is the process for removal of library board members or any officers of the city or board members is not the adoption of a resolution by the council removing them that's not the process that's not what the state law provides for it provides a mechanism for removal for cause which is defined in the statute as inefficiency neglected duty, official misconduct or malfeasance in office the removal is done by charges being filed against board members and the board members being provided with copies of those charges so that they know what they are being charged with they are entitled to due process in this instance the statute provides that there be a public hearing held by the council and a three-quarter vote removal would require a three-quarter vote of the entire membership of the council based on a finding of cause as I've defined that under the statute those charged are entitled to legal representation they're city officials they're not elected as you are but they are city officials and have the right to be able to defend themselves against charges of malfeasance and neglected duty and so forth so that's the process my recommendation is that this resolution not be approved if for no other reason then this is not the appropriate process for removing library board members if the council wishes to do that thank you attorney mclean any other over manning thank you everybody for sharing a lot of things now I don't have to say I sit in library board and am not appreciative of this resolution I think it furthers an adversarial tone in the city I don't think that's necessarily helpful I think a few comments are appropriate to help us recognize where the library board sits at this point I forget exactly when it was but in the fall there have been about five allegations of impropriety in relationship to ordinance brought against the board we asked came back a couple of months later with the clear ruling that the board was in compliance with all of the ordinances except one and he was going to do more research about that before he would get back to the board so he would have comprehensive overview and clarity to offer the board so in December when the board filed that document I believe it was perhaps it wasn't fully correct it was filing those issues that had been dealt with by attorney McLean's commentary knowing that there was still one issue for the city attorney to bring to us to address they have not yet heard that commentary nor the recommendations from attorney McLean those appropriately are coming through finance perhaps there was an adequate commentary or communication process but the board is simply waiting for that information to come to them so that they can decide what to do would the city attorney recommend we change the ordinance that could happen would the city attorney with finance say the ordinance is solid this is what you need to do to get in compliance they would be happy to hear that whatever policy is in place now is established 21 years ago current board members are not responsible for that historic policy they're responsible for responding to information suggestions from key people in the city department heads with information guidance also through finance so it's perfectly in process this comes to their next meeting and any further commentary is helpful and we're going to meet jointly at the next finance team meeting I think at that point in time we'll move ahead wonderfully thank you all thank you Mr. Mayor I appreciate all of Manning's comments here the only thing that I'd like to know is that the library board hasn't listened to us in the past why would they listen to us now in the future if attorney McLean comes down with the ruling he's come down and suggested rulings before and you should not go with this contract etc they didn't listen before are we sure now they're going to listen now to us thank you no we're not sure and I think what all of them are saying that you can't hold them accountable for things they didn't do but you can't hold them accountable for things that they don't do from here on that's the point I believe we're trying to make anything else on that please call the roll and this is for passage of the resolution to remove the 10 members Stefan Susha Van Akron Van Derweel Bauman D-Berg Eberg Serda Graf Kittlesen Manny excuse me no was that a no it's to pass the resolution to remove the board members Meyer Montemayor Radke Sagali Motion fails I ask for a motion to recess for two minutes I need to switch the tape second all those in favor say aye we will recess for two minutes I ask for a motion to reconvene I would so move to reconvene second all those in favor say aye second all those in favor say aye we'll reconvene Alderman Sagali you had your light on before we recessed do you still wish to speak or not okay thank you very much 2342 by Alderman Berg Van Akron and Serda accepting the agreement with local 483IA FF for the 20506 contract and authorizing the collective bargaining committee and the chairman of the committee on salaries and grievance to maintain the agreement Vice President Berg yes thank you Your Honor a couple of things I'd also like to take 2342 with that parallel resolution for agreement between the city and the police union and also asking for suspension of the rules in as much as the mediator is scheduled to meet prior to the next council meeting needs to spin the rule is there any objection to the suspension there being on please proceed under discussion yes thank you Your Honor I will read pardon okay I would move that the resolutions be put upon its passage motion second to put resolution 2342 and 43 upon its passage under discussion yes thank you I'm glad to have the opportunity to bring something forward we're all likely to agree upon tonight usually when your chair of salary and grievance matter like this it's not popular on either end so you've got a bull's eye on either side but that being said this is a tentative agreement which we've reached with the unions which provides for effective one one zero five a two and a half percent wage increase and then effective one one zero six another two and a half percent wage increase the matters as you're probably all aware we are scheduled for arbitration with the majority of our unions and the arbitrator would either consider our proposal which would be a percent and a half per year or the union's proposal which would be three percent per year I guess I'm pleased to note that the even though we are scheduled for arbitration the unions and our HR staff as well as the bargaining teams have still been active and have come together with what I feel is a reasonable compromise given the contentious nature that always exists when you go through arbitration this would result in a were we to have settled the union at the union level in other words were the arbit where their position to prevail we would have experienced over two years a net unbudgeted amount of six hundred and eighty one thousand dollars at a two point five percent increase we will experience a unbudgeted amount of approximately four hundred and fifty two thousand dollars resulting in a difference in two hundred and twenty nine thousand dollars approximately the plan is to make this up out of department budgets which means either not filling positions or layoffs so with that in mind I would recommend passage thank you okay please call the roll Susha Van Akron Vanderweel Bauman D. Berg E. Berg Serda Graf Kielsen Manny Meyer Montemayor Radke Segali 12 eyes three nose Motion carries 2344 by Alderman Graf Stefan Davis Montemayor and Susha to terminate tax incremental financing district number nine and authorizing city finance director treasurer to distribute excess increment to overlying taxing district thank you your Honor I would move that the resolution be put upon its passage there's a motion to second please call the roll Van Akron Vanderweel Bauman D. Berg E. Berg Serda Graf Kielsen Manny Meyer Montemayor Radke Segali Stefan and Susha 15 eyes motion carries 2345 by Alderman Susha Vanderweel Meyer Montemayor Radke temporarily declaring certain streets as truck routes so as to best protect residential neighborhoods during the commerce avenue reconstruction and to prevent future problems with truckers using shortcuts and non-truck routes Alderman Susha thank you your Honor I would like to move to suspend the rules is there any objection to suspension of the rules second there's no objection she can proceed please proceed thank you being that we'd like to put the signs in effect April 1st I move that the resolution be put upon its passage motion second under discussion Alderman D. Berg thank you your Honor this one I will not support because what we're doing here you're taking a lot of trucking taking it off at a truck route which is 14th street the trucks that are going south could go just up to Indiana Avenue turn left down to Leaven Street they're right down at Rockline this way they're turning left off 14th street on Penn Avenue going one block and then making a big wide turn into 13th street which that whole street all the way down to Maryland Avenue is neighborhoods with children and everything and going right by Sheridan Park summertime there's going to be many many kids there the way I understand and you're putting those kids in harm's way with all this trucking my main concern are the neighbors and the kids in that neighborhood and not the trucking industry or Rockline so I'm not going to support this Alderman Segali thank you Mr. Mayor my question is I would like to know if any of the neighbors were concerned concerning this discussion with them before we brought this to the council if you remember correctly Gina and who was quite an advocate of her neighborhood they fought so hard to get that truck route changed and to make the one way streets and to make sure that the trucks weren't going down there I'm hoping that somebody had the courtesy of calling their neighborhood or going around and saying to the neighborhood this was going to take place before we brought this to the council and from what I understand nothing had been concerning these neighbors so I'd like to ask have somebody answer that question for me please yes Alderman Segali the decision is made by our engineer and officer Mr. Holton thank you your honor council we chose 13th street to Penn Avenue to Maryland Avenue that's what disturbed the least amount of people going that way Rockline has another business to have access from the west and the north also what you stated from the south loading dock they can get out to Indiana Avenue but from their north loading docks they don't have a way out of there and commerce is going to be closed down tight we need to do that in order to facilitate the reconstruction of that project answer your question Mr. Galli I asked if you my question was did you contact the neighbors who fought so hard to get that truck route changed to one way so they didn't have problems with the trucks did you talk to Gina and her neighbors no I did not I apologize I don't know if Ryan's asthma did I don't know the answer to that one we had talked discussed after this was all proved is sending out letters to the neighbors explaining what we're doing so they weren't caught off guard when trucks started going down 13th street okay Alderman Kiddelsen a question for Mr. Holton thank you Mr. Holton we're done with you nothing else Alderman Stephan I'm sorry hold on hold on Alderman Sush is next your lights blinking thank you your honor when this came into our committee Ryan's asthma is a representative from engineering that speaks to these issues and the way he explained it was that this would least likely disrupt the neighborhood what we did not want to happen are the trucks going down Maryland Avenue and getting back into that habit because it's been very difficult to break them of that habit so we took that into consideration and his recommendation was that we should keep them going the same direction that they're used to traveling because it's my understanding when they leave rock line that's one of the ways that they can get back out of there so we don't want them to get creative and find their own ways into the building or into those businesses by going right down Maryland Avenue because we have listened to the concerns from the people that live on Maryland Avenue and that's why we're routing the trucks down 13th street instead of down Maryland Avenue because we have heard from these neighbors time and time and time again and we're trying to help them I mean if you'd prefer not to go down 13th street and if you want us running the trucks right down Maryland I mean we could do that but then after the seven months is up at the end of October then when you try to break them of that habit that's going to be very difficult so this is just a temporary situation where trucks will be routed down 13th street while the Commerce Street construction is going on and then it'll go back to normal Homer, Stefan Thank you your Honor My question was just the October 30th date is that pretty firm or could you possibly get it done sooner? You could possibly get it done sooner depending on the weather if we have a lot of rain that shuts us down but we got Michigan Avenue done and we got a schedule last year so I hope that will happen this year with Commerce Alderman Vanderwill Thank you your Honor Engineer Ryan Sassman was involved in the two and a half years we were trying to get the trucks not to go down that one way and I know he tried his best to not disturb the neighborhood as much as we could but we do owe it to the citizens to at least have them voice their concerns about it going down so I'll make a motion to refer this back to public protection and safety There's a motion to refer back is there a second to that? Second Any discussion? We'll refer it back to the public protection and safety Alderman Rackage you wish to speak on the referral Thank you your Honor I can't support sending this back to public protection and safety this project is going to need to get going we need to get these signs and things in place before the construction begins and there was all the alternatives we looked at previously and I myself had talked to Sergeant Tysinski also and really this is a compromise over what he was even looking at we owe it to Rockline they're a huge business in this community they employ a lot of people people sometimes are inconvenienced when the construction project goes on whether it be a business, whether it be industry whether it be a neighborhood unfortunately sometimes we have to just adjust to those for just a few months but we owe it to that industry to also take care of them as well as the neighbors and I think we've already done that so I'm not going to vote in favor of sending this back to the committee Alderman Stefan Thank you your Honor we suspended the rules so I'm guessing that there's some urgency to this let's take us time to get the signs up and to get them installed we open up bids March 16th they could be underway in early April Alderman okay I think we're done thank you Mr. Holton please explain the vote this is a motion to refer to public protection and safety right everybody got that refer it back let's call the roll Vanderwheel Bauman D-Berg E-Berg Cerda Manny Meyer Montemayor Radke Steffan Susha Vanakren Eight eyes, seven nos Motion carries 2346 lies over 2347 to 2351 to be referred with the exception of 2349 which we pulled forward the Board of Committees 6 2352 has already been acted on 2353 by Public Works recommending filing document from the Board of Parks and Forestry Commissioners taking various recommendations with respect to all existing dog run parks in the city and directing staff to draft a document to move the dog run to the beach found on Wilson Avenue south of the wastewater treatment plant east of Lakeview Park and to drop the high avenue location Alderman Bauman Thank you Your Honor I move that we accept and adopt the report of committee There's a motion in a second to accept and adopt under discussion Alderman D-Berg Thank you Your Honor I would like to say thank you to the Department of Public Works Committee for letting me come there and express the concerns of the neighbors in the 4th District and the neighbors directly in the high avenue area so you can when people say the Alderman Art Listening this committee sat and listened to me and listened to the concerns and they unanimously said that they were going to take the concerns of the people to heart and they changed the location and I want to thank them for it I would like to thank Alderman Berg Alderman Ratke Thank you Your Honor I have just a quick question on this report of committee it says the draft resolution to move the dog run to the beach found on Wilson Avenue south of the wastewater treatment plant should that not see the north of the wastewater treatment plant this is south of the wastewater treatment plant that's the power plant let's not get into back and forth we need to recognize people please do sir thank you Your Honor I guess that is correct it is north of the wastewater treatment plant not south otherwise there wouldn't be a park there other than the state park Alderman Groth did you just make a motion Alderman Bowman and the motion was sir to change the 4th word and the 3rd last line then from the word south to the word north the motion is 2nd to amend accordingly any discussion on the amendment there being none all those in favor say aye aye any opposed one opposition motion carries now we'll vote on the motion as amended Alderman Groth you had your light on sir thank you Your Honor I'm still receiving calls about this and questions as to why this has to be on a beach why don't we leave our beaches for the people that are using them and become more user friendly with these beaches and so forth and there's other places that these dog runs could go and my constituents and I'm happy that Alderman Berg could attend the meeting and bring forth some of them but my concerns that I'm getting right now are is that why does it have to be on a beach and why does it have to be there with not yet you can do that we don't have a motion yet we don't have a motion to accept it out there we need a motion because I was amending to read a motion to put the resolution upon its passage as amended Alderman Baumann Your Honor it's a move there's a motion to second under discussion on that motion Thank you Mr. Mayor I just want to make a comment about this Lakeview Park and if anybody has gone down there my mother lives in the Lakeview apartments and I watch over the cliff that's what they call a little Lakeview park or whatever where that dog run would be and I just feel that that's really a very good location compared to the High Avenue where I think there's more traffic on High Avenue at the Lakeview Park so I'm in agreement with it thank you Alderman Meyer Thank you Your Honor I know when this location was first brought up there was mention of the natural bluffs in that area has anybody checked with the DNR about using this area if this was allowed Were you directing a question someone specifically Alderman Meyer I guess anybody that might know the answer Alderman Baumann you being chairman of that do you have any response for that Well I'll try Your Honor but I really don't know if we would need to check with the DNR or anyone else on that particular matter I think it's perfectly safe to use Thank you Alderman Baumann, Alderman Steffen I just want to be sure on what we're voting on here all this is pretty much doing is saying we're not building it at High Avenue and we're going to look at building it at the other place so I think those are some of the things that staff will probably have to look at We're not finalizing it at Lakeview Park tonight, correct? I believe that We're just saying we're not doing it at High Park we're going to look at doing it at Lakeview Park Well it says a resolution to move the dog run to the beach to have staff draft a resolution to move the so we don't have that resolution yet No So this is just putting a kibosh on the High Avenue site with the understanding staff is going to be looking into the Lakeview and bringing that forward if it works out Alderman Baumann, do you have a comment for that sir? As far as I knew Your Honor I thought we were bringing this up to actually be voted on to move it you know as of this So the document has been drafted already? Correct Okay, everybody understand that? Attorney McLean Thank you Your Honor I hadn't seen the text of the committee report but document 2359 is what I was requested to draw up designating the dog beach area as the beach area adjacent to Lakeview Park notice it's done by ordinance as opposed to resolution that's because our dog walk run areas are designated by ordinance but that's what I was advised was should be drafted up and with respect to the evaluating within a period of one year from passage the way it was drafted was it would be designated as a dog walk area and then in section 2 it talks about within 13 months after adoption the public works committee would review and evaluate the impact and report its findings to the council so it is drafted you could act on that you'd have to suspend the rules in my opinion to do that but I did draft the document and if everybody will note on the next page ordinance is introduced 10, 2359 speaks to that and that's being referred to public works and that'll take care of your concern Okay, so we're moving on 2353 please call the roll Bauman D-Berg E-Berg, Serda Graf Kittleson Manny Montemayor Radke Steffen Susha Van Akron and Vanderweel 13 ayes, 2 noes motion carries to the next finance committee meeting on March 13th, 06 to review an amended ordinance relating to section 58-38 of the municipal code and the committee further recommends removal of all 10 library board members at the end of April 06 Alderman Graf Thank you Your Honor I would move that the RC be accepted and adopted is there a second there's a motion in the second under discussion Alderman Steffen Thank you Your Honor I'd like to make an amendment to delete everything after finance committee meeting on March 13th, 06 delete everything after that just recommending the library board to our next meeting and the rest is deleted I'm sorry Everybody understand that? Okay Any discussion? Thank you Your Honor I would suggest that you include the words or keep the words to review an amended ordinance relating to section 58-38 of the municipal code also rather than stop it as of March 13th, 2006 Alderman Steffen I guess I'm going to just stop it there because I think we have numerous issues to talk with them about and I don't want to clarify it the one ordinance one thing I think there will be more than enough items to discuss Okay so your motion stands Yes Okay Alderman Susha Thank you Your Honor Are we trying to amend an RC? Is that what we're voting on? That's what it's been proposed Yes Okay according to our new book of order this is debatable but not amendable and requires a majority vote so can we amend this? I would agree with Alderman Susha I don't think you can this is a committee report you can you don't have to accept the committee report but it's really the report of the committee and the council can't really amend the report of the committee you don't have to agree with it but really shouldn't be amending any in the report Alderman Steffen would you like to withdraw your motion? Yes Okay the motion has been withdrawn whoever second it agrees On the original motion Alderman Kittleson Thank you Mr. Mayor can we make a motion then to divide the question on an RC? No it's a committee report Alderman Mr. President Burke Yes thank you Your Honor this is a committee report we don't have to accept and I believe we can re-refer it to the committee Is that a possibility? Yes Okay then I will make a motion to refer this back to finance committee The second to refer back to finance committee referral under discussion Alderman Steffen Alderman Ratke discussion on referral Thank you Mr. Mayor Your Honor Referring this back to the committee is only going to prolong what's already going on with the library board it's time that we just let this thing go through accept the report of the committee and get on with the business of trying to fix the problems we have between this council and the library board and the finance committee and everybody else involved so I'm going to vote no against sending this back to the committee thank you Thank you Alderman Ratke Alderman Serda Thank you Your Honor I think what we're asking is that once it goes back to the committee that they could amend that change because it was already identified which you supported that second the wordage in here is not feasible legally given city attorney Steve McLean's legal opinion Thank you Your Honor considering that this simply is a report of the committee and we're not taking any action they're telling us that we're going to meet with the library board and the part about removal of all ten library board members is moot we're not going to be doing that or that was so it's simply the report that we're accepting nothing else and there's no action being taken on anything Alderman Susha Your Honor just a procedural question if the motion is to accept and adopt and it failed what happens to the document then Good question then there should be another motion to place it on file Alderman Manderweal Thank you Your Honor Attorney McLean wouldn't the chair of this committee be able to just invite the library board put it on the agenda invite the library board to our 13th meeting and say this is what we need to discuss have it on the agenda we don't actually need this to go to council to have them come to the meeting do we Yes, attorney McLean I think there's a couple ways you could address it one would be to do that one would be to file the committee report and direct the finance committee to meet at their next meeting with the library board something to that effect or you could accept and adopt the report of the committee which you know the committee is recommending removal of all 10 library board members that was the committee's recommendation it's obvious by you pulled ahead that other document which was to take action to do that and you filed that you know you didn't adopt that so you could just accept and adopt the committee report for what it's worth and all you have left basically is the invitation to the March 13th meeting President Thank you, Your Honor the library board was invited to our next finance committee meeting which is going to be the 13th I've not received a reply yet whether they will be coming all of them or if they will only be sending a portion I believe that's something that the president of library board and the secretary of the library board are discussing as to who will be coming to the meeting or not but they have been invited so just to let people know that just so you know also I believe that the report of committees are non-operative resolutions are operative any instructions directors are done in the form of a resolution so if you accept and adopt the committee report, that's all you're doing you're not hanging anybody, not dragging anybody over here all you're doing is saying the committee met, they reported fine, move on, that's all you're doing so it's non-operative Vice President Yes, thank you, Your Honor I believe the question of consideration is referral that was my motion, I'd like to retract that motion and have this issue stand on its own with an upward out vote motion has been withdrawn and second withdrawn back to the original motion which is to accept and adopt non-operative, that's it please call the roll D. Berg, E. Berg Excuse me Serta Graf Kittleson, Manny Meyer, Montemay or Radke Segali Sushia Ben Akron Vanderweal and Bauman 13 ayes and 2 noes Motion carries, 2358 to be referred Ordinances introduced 10 2359 will be referred to public works 2360 to 2362 lies over 2360 All in the Sushia Thank you, Your Honor I'd like to make a motion to suspend the rules on 2360 through 62 2360 through 62 2360 to 62 Is there any objection to the suspension of the rules because if there is we have to take a vote there will be a non-proceed Thank you, I move that these Ordinances be put upon their passage Second 2361 62 upon their passage Under discussion Thank you, this is just an amendment to clarify which side of the street the parking rules will apply along South High School once they finish their construction of the parking lots We just need to change it from the south side of the street to the north side It was a clerical error made by the committee Any further discussion Please call the roll Deberg Ebert Graft Manny Montemayor Segali Sushia Vanakren and Bauman 15 ayes Motion carries 2363 to 2365 to be referred Matters laid over 2242 has been pulled forward 2259 has been pulled forward 2260 Resolution number 260506 by Alderman Graf Stefan Montemayor, Sushia and Davis authorizing a transfer of appropriations in the 06 budget Alderman, President Graf Thank you, Your Honor. I would move that the resolution be put upon its passage There's a motion in the second Under discussion There will be a none. Please call the roll Eberg Graft Manny Montemayor Segali Sushia Vanakren Bauman Deberg Motion carries Other matters authorized by law 2366 will be referred to salary and grievances 2367 will be referred to Marina and Harvard Committee 2368 an R.O. by the city clerks amending communication from Susan Hunley asking that the council vote no in regards to the resolution calling for the censure or removal of Alderman Sushia Alderman Graf Thank you, Your Honor. I move that the R.O. be accepted and filed Motion to accept and file Under discussion There will be a none. All those in favor state aye Any opposed Motion carries 2369 an R.O. by the city clerks amending communication from Eric Zecaff stating his upset that he has yet to receive his deposit of cleanup when his landlord changed to a new landlord Alderman Graf Thank you, Your Honor. I would move that the R.O. be accepted and filed Motion in the second to accept and file under discussion There will be a none. All those in favor state aye Any opposed Motion carries 2370 has been pulled forward 2371 a resolution by Alderman Sushia authorizing and directing the city to pay for reasonable legal fees associated with the removal of Meet Public Library board member in the 06 if they were appointed prior to January 1st 06 or if their term doesn't expire during 06 Alderman Sushia Thank you, Your Honor. If I can I would make a motion to put this upon its passage There is a motion in the second put the resolution upon its passage under discussion Alderman Steffen Thank you, Your Honor. I guess I won't rehash everything but for the litany of reasons I mentioned earlier tonight I think we should just not pass this and you know I don't think that's the right attitude to take we can also prove this down the road if we have to get to that point we're not there and I don't think it sends a good signal that we're looking to get past this problem and negotiate differences and we're already proving legal fees that doesn't seems disingenuous to me so I would urge people not to pass Thank you Alderman Sushia Thank you, Your Honor. I think that everybody will agree that we have some serious issues between the council and the library board and these issues were not really caused by private citizens and I know that there are some citizens that feel strongly in regards to the way we're currently handling issues and I think that it's not right to make them face potential legal fees because of a debacle by city officials such as ourselves and I mean you do have to come forward with reasonable charge and to expect the citizens to put forth a bond I don't think that's right so I would ask that you approve this tonight. Thank you Vice President Berg Yes, so thank you, Your Honor. Again, now we're getting down to the taxpayers buying the bullets and I would say that I think it's implicit in our ordinance and also the legislation that the city is responsible for legal fees I don't think we what is reasonable legal fees for me may not at all be reasonable for an attorney who is trained to serve as counsel for an individual so I think the reasonableness issue is questionable and also I think it's implied in as I read the ordinance that legal fees basically are on our dime or on the taxpayers dime thank you. Thank you Alderman Staffing Thank you and you know you brought up a good point when you read this the city is authorized and directed to pay for reasonable legal fees associated with the removal of any meet public library board member in 2006 well what a beautiful thing some citizen comes forward asks us to pay for the legal fees and the way this reads if I'm on the library board I'm going to say you know what I want a lawyer too and you're paying for my lawyer too so we'd be paying for both lawyers because that's how this is written Okay, please call the roll Serta Graf Kittleson Manny Meyer Montemayor Radke Ceagalli Stefan Susha Vanakren Bauman D-Berg Eberg Two eyes 13 nose Motion fails Before we go to a closed session I'd ask for a question Do you want to do another? I was going to wait till We'll do other matters first Attorney McLean 2372 is communication from Lee Montemayor Jr 1015 Logan Avenue regarding concerns he has with the proposed move of the dog run from South Beach to Lakeview Park That will be referred to public works 2373 is a communication from Missy Ginney of the John Michael Kohler Art Center requesting permission to relocate their food and wine tents on the beer trailer out into New York Avenue during the 36th annual outdoor arts festival on July 15th and 16th, 2006 And that will be referred to law and licensing and public protection and safety 2374 is an ordinance amending general ordinance number 90-0506 relating to no parking prohibitions to change quote add a no parking school days only 7 a.m. to 4 p.m. with the arrow pointing west 40 feet west close quote to read quote add a no parking school days only 7 a.m. to 4 p.m. with the arrow pointing west 40 feet east close quote of the east curb line of south 16th street along the north side of Wilson Avenue And that lies over that's for a motion to recess for 5 minutes All those in favor state aye hold on hold on Alderman Cigali you've been wanting to say something for 10 minutes we will could you take so we'll go to 5 to 10 thank you all those in favor we stand recess