 Well, hello everybody. Welcome to another episode of Dr. Jill live. If you have missed previous episodes, you can find them all on YouTube on my channel on Stitcher on iTunes or anywhere you listen to podcast. If you like this episode or any previous ones, would you just stop by and subscribe to YouTube or leave a review on iTunes that really helps us to reach more people. And thank you as always for all your wonderful feedback and comments during the show. We're live to Facebook and we will post this on all other channels right after the show. Today I'm super excited to talk to my guest Steve Stavs from South Africa. I want to introduce him in a moment but today we're talking about the future of health. We're going to dive deep into the things that make us more resilient, the things that we're seeing as changes in our health care system and how we can really approach that in a new way with a new lens. And as for me, one of, as you well know, one of my most favorite things is the idea that we can really transform the way medicine is practiced and the way patients are treated. So we'll dive into that today as well. Let me introduce my guest about Steve. Steve is considered one of Africa's leading professional coaches and internationally trained biohackers. Over the past 20 years he's been interviewed on radio and television, and has been invited to speak at a host of international forums and conventions. He's lectured to over 10,000 professionals in the medical health and wellness industries and continues to connect with this audience empowering them with knowledge skills and practical tools to become courageously and live a life of thriving. We so share this. With an undergraduate degree in science together with certifications in functional medicine and Chinese medicine, Steve combines many disciplines of medicine to offer clients a master plan. He has led to thousands of testifying to his transformative process over the past 24 years. One of his main purpose drivers from success to significance is his empathetic and empathic support of his community. He is passionate in his belief of encouraging people to thrive by unlocking their unique talents and potential to ensure that they're able to thrive in their full optimization. Love this. Every word of it. Steve, welcome to the show. Thank you so much, Dr. Joe. What a privilege to be here. Thank you. So I love to start with story because stories like what drives us? How do we get into this? You've got lots of credential certifications, training, you're obviously moving and shaking in the world and transforming lives. But how did this start? Where did you grow up and how did your background frame you for this kind of a career? Sure. Thanks, Dr. Joe. Look, it started way back at medical school in the 90s and we're in the physiology lab and we're doing VO2 maxing. And I had this elite athlete on the treadmill and I looked at his body and I looked at mine and it looked very different. So I'm an immigrant from the island of Cyprus. My parents came in 1961 here and I was born here but brought up very Cypriot, very Greek. And so food was used as a tool to deal with emotions and pain and hurt. And I was very different to the other schoolboys and schoolgirls. And so it was difficult being a foreigner in Africa. And so gained weight and they used to call me bubbles which was really difficult. It was a difficult sort of identity to adopt Dr. Joe because then that frames everything. And so you're carrying too much weight, the kids are not nice and they are nasty and they tease you and mock you. And so these sort of hurts and pain sort of develop in areas where we had to deal with them. And one of the ways is food. In a Greek home, it was all about food and so I gained a lot of weight and was probably 20 to 30 kgs. Just too much was probably about 40 to 50 pounds overweight. And then at medical school, I realized that if I'm going to have a future with regards to the health professions, then I need to really get my body and my mind in shape. And so from then I started using heart rate in the 90s to track what was happening when I ate certain foods or when I ran or exercised. And so that was my first health optimization tool or data point that really helped me with my diets and helped me with my nutrition and helped when I ate. So I realized if I didn't eat at night, my heart rate that it was far better in the morning. So I think it was an earlier doctor that was probably 1995 looking at certain data points to help me lost a lot of weight leaned up was inspired by Professor Tim Noakes here in South Africa with regards to the low carbohydrate fat diet. And that was my story and I've always sort of believed in ancestral living of the ways of Africa and using health optimization data points to help people transform their lives and and not only transform them in lives, Dr. because one of my biggest biggest sort of just the heart that I have for people is they sustain their transformation. They come into my office here patients that I saw today, and they're sick, and they've got disease and they've got pain, and then they put the plan together they follow it and then six months or nine months or a year later they just not continuing with this healthy lifestyle and they back to sickness and disease. So, what are the tools we can use what are the belief systems that we can employ to to help patients and clients and people abroad sustain their transformation. So that's my story. It's an exciting story from pain to purpose I think that there you go. Amazing. And, you know, it's interesting I didn't know your back story but it makes perfect sense because all of us have a struggle or an issue, and we find the success or this transformation and then, if we're healer at heart which you clearly are we want to heal. We want to like how can we help other people to do this. I love the word in your bio that I read the empathic part right because it takes that person you really into not only with ourselves. And it's interesting you talked about, in fact, I'd like to talk about this briefly because I'm sure a lot of our listeners emotional eating mentioned that and I think that's such a core because what happens in our family of origin is often you know there's a reward oh you did great in school let's go out for ice cream right or so tell me a little bit about how you know was ingrained because it's so common to so many, and then how did you change that. So when you were like sad or lonely or you had a reward and you maybe thought because of background to go towards food. How did that change and how could people out there listening change that for themselves. I have a credible question because I think it's just the heart of, you know, a lot of transformation because at the practice yeah so do patients and clients I said, the most simple tool to transform your life is to change your nutrition, but it's the hardest tool. It's the hardest but most simple. In other words, it's the lowest hanging fruit but it's so tight on that tree to pull it off and consistently keep it off it's so difficult because food is so ingrained in just healing because food can be so nutritionally healing to our bodies and I look at all the neurotransmitters and neuromodulators that are released when we eat and dopamine you get a huge hit from food and even serotonin so I think there's a lot of neuro modulation that's going on when we eat and my upbringing being Greek was all about food so it was a whole process and a ceremony and a celebration, which is good in certain ways because we used to sit around the table and we used to connect with one another in a lot of community, but there was a lot of overindulgence and an overeating which was very very problematic and so I linked it to my purpose and this is what we do with clients and CEOs we do a lot of health corporate optimization here in Africa and beyond we see CEOs and executives and directors and we link it to their purpose in the community. If someone can have a clear, concise articulated purpose, then often I get them to use that as a foundation to be able to have self control and be able to stick to their plan over years because the end of the day they know that they want to live out their purpose which brings them significant significance, it brings them value, it gives them meaning we use the word meaning significantly in our practice and with the health of corporates worldwide because people really at the heart need to be firstly accepted and secondly then to have meaning in their life so purpose, finding out people's purpose being able to articulate that purpose and then for them to actually use it in a way that they can then have self control in all areas of their health and their and their living. I love this so much because number one, I'm sure with first of all biohacking I want to go to that next. What is a biohacker how did you get to it I'm a fellow biohacker. And all of this we're talking about is how do we really optimize our health and we'll dive into that. But here you say this meaning of purpose a couple things come to mind. Flow states optimization of neurotransmitters. We're going to talk about that how do you get into it but one of the ways to get into flow is find your meaning of purpose and kind of follow that. Right, so you, those are the places where you find the most natural highs from the neurotransmitters that happen in those activities. But the other thing that comes to mind is blue zones which being Greek there it's the blue zone in Greece and Italy and these places these are places where the highest percentage of centenarians of those over 100 years exist and so we say what's what are they doing right and consistently over the blue zones is meaning and purpose and connection which you mentioned both of those. And I love that because you're taking a habit that may be hard like eating a breakfast every day it's healthy or fasting in the morning or whatever thing it is, and you're linking it to what do I really want to be or do or accomplish in my life. I actually make the habit stick which is why it's successful. So let's go back to biohacking. Let's talk about what is biohacking you and I know this but what does that really mean. And then, why is it, you know, I think a place where we can go to find transformation. Yeah, I think, first off if you just take a stratosphere view. It's really simple. Everybody's almost doing it that's listening to us in the modern world and I asked people this question when I do corporate presentations. Do you weigh yourself. Most people lift their hands up. Have you measured your blood pressure. Most people lift their hands up. Have you measured your glucose or most people lift their hands up or body composition. So many of these measuring devices that measure and give you feedback is a way to use data points to then optimize your health so I define it as the assessment of internal, which is your body and extra environments in order to optimize your physical mental emotional and spiritual being. And so that can come in subjective. We do a lot of subjective assessments. So biohacking is not only objective. I find the subjective where we ask questions and we ask questionnaires like on community. One of the biggest questions that we ask is who can you confidently leave your children with that your children know who you are. Who can you confidently leave your parents with and your parents would be comfortable to stay with these people. That's a really good subjective question on community. And so it's both the subjective and it's both the objective and we know about functional medicine and there's so many data points that we use as functional medicine experts that are really helpful. But it both can be just things on community and purpose like one of the biggest questions I asked from a data perspective or biohacking perspective is, well, can you clearly articulate your unique purpose. And then they say no, I can't and they'll give them mine and I say, my purpose is to inspire and empower people to superhuman health and performance so that they can thrive. And so these are the hearts of biohacking and art and science of biohacking is both through subjective and objective data. Brilliant. I think that's one of the best concise definitions I've ever heard. And it makes it seem so not because I think biohacking for, I mean you and I love this we live it. I have my math here my, you know, all my data collection points and my devices and things, but an average person is maybe just checking their weight and then checking, you know, their sleep habits that very, very subjective sleep habits simple things. It's accessible to everyone it's not an illegal exclusive practice. So I love that and you don't have to have super expensive devices I happen to love things but but you don't have to do those things to do this so love that. I mean your purpose you just mentioned you asked people about articulating I love that I think that's so crucial because that's this foundation of why would we do what we do why would we do hard habits and change our lives if we don't have meaning of purpose. So if someone says, you know what Steve I don't really have it I mean I know kind of kind of sort of what I'm here to do. How do you help them go deeper and find a particular right down their meaning of purpose. I have a question and we've got a whole two hours that we do 25 questions that we ask mainly executives and CEOs because I find what happens is they fall the hardest because a lot of their significance and meaning and purposes based on their position in a corporate. And then often what happens they they realize their purpose they're in that area, and then all of a sudden they've got no meaning and there's no significance and they start using either narcotics or they start using other things to deal with that sort of very emptiness. One of the big things we do is we do the weekend test and it's quite a if people are listening out there just take a moment and maybe stop if you don't have to close your eyes but what I do is I say picture that you've got a weekend conference Dr. And it's a full day workshop on the Saturday and Sunday and you have to entertain guests on Saturday nights and Sunday so you get your week ready Dr. Joel and you get everything done and even your family around you decide to go away for the weekend because they know how busy you're going to be and that you have to entertain people at night and your close friends are just out of town now they've gone on holiday. And so on a Friday night you get an SMS from the organizer saying that the conference has been canceled. Now you wake up on the Saturday morning. All your commitments obligations have been done you've got it sorted your families away your friends are away. How do you spend your time over that weekend. And I get people just to write they do this they do this they do this they do that they spend time care they spend money this is where they go. This is what they consume online. How do they spend their Instagram feed what do they do for Google what websites do they go so we plot what happens over 48 hours and that often gives us themes and it gives us sort of talking points in terms of where people would spend their time with no commitments whatsoever. So that's a really important exercise. People love that exercise. And they realize, Oh, if I got no commitments, I spend a lot of time reading health books and downloading, you know, ordering health things online and finding ways that I can improve my health and others and, you know, going to a health shop or going to a bookstore that and reading the health books in the store. So these that's a simple exercise. I think it's a profound exercise. And then a second one that I do is really what your eulogy test is what do you want people to say about you at your funeral. And that's a very important test because Maya Angelou said this he's she said people will not remember what you said or did but how you made them feel. And we buy hack that and optimize that to people won't remember what you said or did, but how you made them feel, think and act. And so how do you want people to speak of you at your funeral in terms of how you made them feel, think and act. And those two very basic tests and there's another probably 23 odd we've got a whole 25 questionnaire process. But those two are probably the mainstay that I use with clients with regards to them and covering their purpose which is a process it's not just well one day I do an exercise and then I know what my purpose is but and covering their purpose so that they can use it. Hey everybody, I just stopped by to let you know that my new book, unexpected finding resilience through functional medicine science and faith is now available for order wherever you purchase books. In this book I share my own journey of overcoming life threatening illness and the tools and tips and tricks and hope and resilience I found along the way. This book includes practical advice for things like cancer and Crohn's disease and other autoimmune conditions, infections like lime or Epstein bar and mold and biotoxin related illness. What I really hope is that as you read this book, you find transformational wisdom for health and healing. So grab your own copy stop by read unexpected.com. There you can also collect your free bonuses. So grab your copy today and begin your own transformational journey through functional medicine in finding resilience. Use it. Steve I'm just smiling so big and my heart is so full because you just that's if you're listening that's gold what Steve just shared with you is it I would actually encourage you right now. There's somewhere where you can write down a few other things he just said, or come back and listen to this this will be recorded you can listen again. That is gold Steve and I'm smiling so big because I didn't know that this was like this was something but I have a secret days. And it's exactly what you said is where I have a full day and for some reason it's happened maybe twice a year. Everything gets canceled, or some big event gets canceled, and also I had a secret day no one knows. And I get so excited about these secret days, and I don't tell anyone because I get to go do the things I love and it's usually in nature, thinking creating writing or learning about how you said so. And I clearly I do know my purpose so that but I love that because my heart jumps for joy when I have a secret day. You basically are creating in our mind what would happen if you had a secret day that's my definite what I call exactly love that so much. And I think, so let's go into flow states because this meaning purpose and finding so you can get curious. Find you know what's your purpose what's your meaning these are the things that will maybe decide where do you go for flow. So I think this correlates so well because if you had that secret day, the things that you would do probably put you with at least a partial flow state of joy and happiness and what we have called timeless effortless, you know time standing still send four hours of passing you don't realize it. Let's talk about flow. What's your definition of how do we get more flow. What's the state of flow chemically, because this purpose and curiosity actually can drive us right into flow. Well, I've learned a lot about flow from you and Steven Kotler and I think it's really endures and the flow research collected because I think it's crucially important and I think someone like Steven Kotler, the odd of impossible if anyone's listening out there. I know that he's been on the show it's a highly recommended book that I'm going through that I'm listening, but what I find was flow in terms of my practice is people battle to get into flow if a lot of the foundational functional medicine sort of parameters are not good. So I've looked at doing neurotransmitting. There's some tests online to see where people are dominant with regards to neurotransmitters. I'm very dopaminergic so I'm very dopamine orientated as well. So I'll do that test initially because I think that's very important. My wife is very serotonin orientated as well. And so I look at these processes and I say, okay, let's do the test is a brilliant little test in Ben Grieve Hill's book as well called boundless looking at neurotransmitters and how important that is. And then we'll we'll structure something with regards to ensuring that that neurotransmitter is looked after is the building blocks are there. So I've realized through amino acid testing without tryptophan we really battle to make serotonin. So that's another test that I would look at. So when I look at flow and they're high sort of achievers or CEOs or people that can really have got the finance arm to look at it. The first thing is I'll do my functional medicine test but I'll do my amino acid test and I love your perspective on this because I've seen a huge problem with amino acids out there and people taking way too much collagen and they're filling their lives with all this protein and all this glassy and it's causing issues. So number one in terms of flow and I know this is difficult for people listening out there that might not have the means financially all the time to do these tests. But I think it's crucially important to then assess yourself and see with these basic neurotransmitter tests in terms of the question is where are you dominant with regards to neurotransmitter and then looking at what things help that neurotransmitter because if you come into a deficient state, I find it's very difficult to hit flow. So my best days in flow is when I've got a good neurotransmitter base. And so that's the first thing that I think is crucially important. The building blocks are really, really important. So that's number one. Number two, in terms of flow, I think the distraction part I found is really problematic. So I use a technique called brain tap by Patrick Porter. He was on my show. I get into a brain tap situation getting in from high beta, which is what we probably in beta now brainwave or high beta get down into the alpha state. It's so quick for me with a brain tap you can use muse reviews muse the meditation, you might be a master meditator which is great. I just I'm not in that space and I find it easier to use the brain tap or amuse or even sense it. And it just drops me from Harvey to down into that alpha state. When I'm in that alpha state, I then get up into that place if anything's in my mind that I that's distracting. I've got this sort of distraction notebook. I write those things down and then I get into areas that I absolutely love. So I'm a creator. I inspire and empower people. I love writing content. I love talking to people like this. So I'll get into that state there get rid of the distractions. Make sure that I've either done my meditation and then get into a process of probably about 90 minutes. That'll get me into a flow state very, very quickly to get into alpha state brainwave. So that's the short summary. The reason I do that is originally from a purpose. My purpose is I want to bring the world super human health and make sure that they're thriving. So it's easy for me to block off these 90 minutes and might not be easy for someone. It might not be easy for them to have 90 minutes, but I recommend 90 minutes or start to 60 minutes and then use either calm or use any of these apps if you want to or any of these devices and non sleep deep rest now has been shown as some tracks online that have helped it's affordable because they free other than your time and you do these before you want to get into that state of flow. So I think there are many little areas walking outside in the sunshine holding my daughter's hand before getting to this 90 minutes because of oxytocin being released. She's just an oxytocin giver. My daughter, she was hugs and kisses. So these different parts community purpose having the hacks in place. And I think that's probably a short summary. I've got so many different things I mean from infrared sauna to doing cold plungers to exercise to weightlifting in terms of getting my body in a space before enter flow. I'm a person that I need some of those things before I just start working and getting into flow state. Oh, love, love, love and so many wonderful thoughts and I'll just share just a couple of personal things like you said if listeners want to pick and choose and find some things I love. I have a V light device there's many many out there but it's a red light device to my brain and it is this alpha and it for me it always goes right into the place I want to be alpha wise. Also the PMF map which is right here next to me on level three or four is really good for me to get into that state. And there are so many devices and things that you can do. The other thing I thought that was so important is amino acids and I love that you said that so many athletes and people are taking branch chain aminos or collagen, and they're forgetting that we need the full spectrum. I didn't know this years and years ago but it's certainly after my Crohn's which is like 20 years ago I started taking the full amino complex every single day for 20 years I've taken. I take thorn complete aminos aminos complete there's many many good ones out there but I don't recommend the branch chain aminos unless there's a specific deficiency and like you I test. I don't guess. So we know exactly what. So I think that's so important for people to understand you really do need those, and especially if you've had like me any get issues where you either have trouble breaking down protein maybe low stomach acid or hypochlorhydria, or some inflammatory CFO, CFO, all those good issues that you've heard me talk about on the show, you may not be breaking down into so basically proteins from animal or plant products can be broken down into the core building blocks and those are amino acids. So the very basis and you need all of these tryptophan makes serotonin tyrosine makes dopamine norepinephrine so you need these bases and like you I actually manipulate people's neurotransmitters in a really good way right that because we want more by giving them specific amino acid so I've been doing that for decades just like you. One of the thing you mentioned Greenfield and a couple assessments. One of the original guys of Braverman Eric Braverman with the years ago he has a screening questionnaire in his book. And again it's been, I think a couple decades now. I actually have that in my office for patients when they come in, but any of these questionnaires if you want to know where you're at you can take those. I'm like you I'm dopamine down it so I love that dopamine and love to support that but we really need all of them because the flow state if you look at biochemically neurotransmitter wise, it's the optimization of all the spectrum of neurotransmitters. So you kind of want to have the ability to make all of those. And this is not drugs if you're listening. We don't have a serotonin reuptake inhibitor issue. And again, not that those are bad or a problem and rarely, but those kinds of drugs that affect reuptake inhibition. Usually they're antidepressants or antipsychotics and they affect these neurotransmitters. Long term, they affect your physiology because your body's really smart when you inhibit reuptake of serotonin, for example. And you do it over years and years your body's like wait, we have a lot of serotonin hanging around let's decrease production or decrease the receptors that are out there. And then over time, if you've been on these meds for a long time, your actual production and your receptors are diminished so then when you go off you feel worse. So I know a lot of people weaning them off the meds and trying to, you know, optimize there's ways to do that by the way. That's a whole other topic but so love this biohacking love the idea of getting into flow and you gave us so many practical ways. We talked a little bit about the diet stuff again and we talked about like habits how to form habits. What in your, you know, dealing with patients and dealing with whether they want to lose weight optimize percent muscle, optimize performance. What have you found if you found any particular diet do you use multiple different types diets the timing of eating what are a few little girls on diet timing and those things that you've seen clients have success with. And I'm going to sort of just give you the preamble to that because once again with all my clients I'm always looking at purpose and community so I think those are the greatest internal motivators and internal drivers because for it to really make a change because you know it needs to be a lifestyle that needs to continue it can't be just for six months or nine months so established purpose we've spoken about a community I think is fundamentally important. Who are the people that love you accept you who are the people that value you who are the people that, you know, give you a significance and I think that's crucially important to have in place because we can't do this alone. And the stat that I shared on the weekend I did a five hour superhuman workshop is that and it comes from Nicholas Christakas' work that if you have an obese friend, you are 40% more likely to be obese. So, obesity is the most contagious chronic disease out there. And the same stat applies to depression. Now, for you listening out there, I'm not fat shaming you. I've been fat shamed for a lot of my life till I was 18 years old until I went to medical school and I made the changes. It was horrible. It was painful. And I'm still working through it at many times was my old school friends that I still see sometimes when we do reunions and say hey bubbles how's it going bubbles what's happening with you. And it's difficult for that because what happens is my identity lies in that so it's really important that you have multiple circles and communities that really want the best for you that can help you along your journey. So a circle of people that are runners or circle of my wife does zumba dancing she loves to dance so she's got a community of zumba dances, a community of people possibly with regards to a nutritionist that's got eight people in a group. I think group therapy is so important to help you along the journey so I could elaborate some community and I'll leave it up to you but purpose and community are two very strong pillars that made this drive I think they're fundamental internal drivers and internal motivators. Again, the external motivators is how we get reward often is through devices so you've got a pedometer or you've got an Apple Watch and then you look at the numbers, and then you get rewarded so there's a fantastic medical insurance company in South Africa that rewards you when you have healthy habits or healthy food so you go to the grocery store, you buy certain foods that gives you certain points and in those points you can do whatever get smoothies at the gym or get cheap tickets or whatever there is so now the external driver is reward and Aristotle said clearly that we are teleological. We love the tell us the tell us is the goal so we get rewarded with goals so two major internal drivers and then an external driver that comes through the data. That's the framework we work on. Then we look at the individual see whether they have any spirit or considerations to diet because one thing I've known if you try and convert someone who's already got an ethical reason why they want to do a certain diet. Then it becomes very problematic and I see a lot of patients from other doctors especially endocrinologists that say you have to do this diet. So for me diet is based on a few pillars is number one, does the person actually want to do this diet from an ethical and spiritual perspective. Number two, how can we work within those parameters to ensure that we can have real nutrient dense food. South Africa had a podcast with Dr Zach Bosch I highly recommend you get him on and South Africa is the number one glyphosate user in the world. Wow. Aroments have not changed the laws with regards in 1961, even more pervasive than the US and I had Dr Stephanie Sinef, another person that I think we should really have on about glyphosate. And she was talking about how pervasive it is in America, like the state of Kentucky 75% of the air water is filled with glyphosate, but be that as may we need to really work with the individual and see where they act with regards to their own dietary plans. For real food fasting is probably my biggest sort of weapon, the power of when, and I think almost every person can fast despite a few obviously people possibly women with low fat percentages or thyroid issues or those that have done extensive tests where, you know, we've got real problems with fasting or they can't produce enough ketones they are those people with naffal FD or dirty livers or liver dysfunction or any type of snip that's going to cause issues but real dense nutrient food plus fasting on my two biggest areas within the parameter of people sort of ethical and spiritual pillars. And really, and you know what you just did is you gave us a framework for whether you're on the carnivore extreme or the vegan extreme. You can find a place where you, you know, get these good news. I love that because so many people are so hard lined about one diet. And I found in my practice to I have to find out the patient meet them where they're at, and wherever they're at and I love that you have ethical spiritual concerns because many people do have a very significant attachment for spiritual or ethical reasons to a specific diet and we have to meet them where they're at and say okay how can we because there's ways. And what we know about blue zones again is it there's definitely plans you know like at some point, if possible but this is there's a huge spectrum of what works, and what we can make work and if we look at the cultures around the same thing holds true right we can have people who primarily yams primarily eat the blubber of whales and they all can have good health. And the framework I use a far I'm a simple person is father asked five questions. Okay, the what we can talk about what you're going to eat. All right, the when is about fasting and looking at that process of time restricted eating and gut rest. What you do is crucially important who you eat with eating in community has significant health benefits with significant data. So the who is significant the how do you eat with gratitude. Do you eat with faith we talk about in spiritual circles do you believe this food is nutrient dense and healthy for your body if you don't, you're causing division division within your own body and mind. If you don't believe it's healthy for you, then it's not going to be healthy doesn't matter what's on your plate because that belief system is so strong so how is really important how do you eat how do you start are you mindful the way you eat. The pace in modern day lives and Western living we eat way too quickly so we talk about chewing the food and there's a lot of research and data to improve just nutrient absorption by about 11% but just to chew the food correctly. So we've got what who why we eat is a big one I asked this question and no one gets us why do we eat Dr Jill. We don't eat to survive, which is what people think we eat to thrive. We are eating to treat our bodies and our minds and our emotions and our spirits so that we can add value to the world and to ourselves and our communities through our purpose, which we've now clearly defined. So eating and those parameters are based on community and purpose if we can put those things in place, then sustainably people can often hold on to their transformation and then what would be the last question where I think where is fundamentally important because people are eating on the run. They're not being mindful they're not sitting down. And so what happens is it becomes a thing of a quick process and not a ceremony to sit down so every single night, probably 95% of the time, we as a family sit together, no devices, no interruptions. We look at each other. R2R load shedding is a problem we've got power cuts here in South Africa so often there's no signal, no cell phones, no Wi-Fi and it's an incredible place where you can sit and connect with people, which I think we've lost the art of connection. I do too. Oh, what again another set of amazing pearls. I love this so much you're giving so much practical advice for the Lister and for those out there looking to change. And I love that back to the family dinner table I mean there's studies on that and how powerful it is in children's lives in them finding meaning a purpose in them doing well in school and and of course lifelong those habits so I love that because it can still happen parents if you're out there like there's no way my kid would put down their phone. Well, maybe you try it maybe try it for 10 minutes and then you know extend the time. Love this Steve, you have just packed this episode full of great practical information, and it is as always such a delight to talk to you. Where can we find out more about you if they want to know what what you do and where you'll find you. Three websites I think that's probably the easiest is steve stabs.com and then regenerative health.co.za that is my practice website and then made to thrive.co.za. We're big on social Instagram Steve stabs Z a or Z a as the American say on LinkedIn at Steve stabs we pretty active there. So those are probably the two biggest areas made to thrive is a health optimization company I've got eight consultants online. So we got breath work coaches we've got human coaches we've got consultants to mitigate against electromagnetic radiation by hackers and so we've got a lot of products from infrared saunas like from sauna space and the flex beam which is our portable infrared and red light device which I think you would absolutely love to get katsu which is blood flow modification at another level all my patients that can afford katsu over the age of 50 get katsu it prevents psychopenia they maintain muscle mass which is so important for longevity helps BDNF helps vascular endothelial growth factor. So katsu and blood flow modification is I think probably the biggest missing part of exercise in people's repertoire I just absolutely love it you can take it anywhere. So yeah I just I love major thrive we now in downloaded the show the podcast that I that I'm going to have you on release your book and I'm so excited about is the major thrive show we're in 133 countries in the top one and a half percent of all podcasts worldwide. So just excited by health you know I've never missed the day's work in 24 years at the practice to sickness or heal health, not a single day. I had the Delta variant on this supposedly virus, it was one day. That's what it was that affected me so my body so I love what I do thank you having for having me. I love your heart and I love collaborating with you but for people listening out there. All incremental steps. Many of them are basic many of them are free. One of them is called sunlight. It is free as you can get. I could carry on talking and talking and talking to this lovely lady Dr Jill but I know she's wrapping up so thank you so much. It's a privilege to be absolutely thriving and loving life and changing people's lives. Steve what a great finale with so many pearls again love love love. By the way love blood for restriction I have my bands over there absolutely completely agree with you there so again for being here today it was an absolute pleasure. Yeah, thank you Dr Joe all the best I'm not the clay as I do always favor and blessing upon you because you're changing so many people's lives. You have a heart to connect with people and I absolutely love it when people are so benevolent they there's so few benevolent people out there. It's the best for your patients you want to see them live out the very calling and purpose that they were called to do and so thank you. Thank you so much hopefully I will be in Boulder Colorado one day and give you an oxytocin hug the African oxytocin hug to fill you. My heart is full Steve thank you again. Thank you Dr Jill.