 So, we're the Drupal Community Working Group, I said, I'm George, I joined the group when it started back in March of 2013 and I've been chair since March of 2016. Previous chair was Donna Benjamin and then also in our group, we have Jordanna of course and Mike Adam Hill who is in the UK as well as Emma Carrionis who also lives in the UK and we're actually looking for new members right now. So if anyone is interested and gets through the session and is still interested, talk to us. So yeah, so that's our current composition. Last members of the group have also included Angie Byron, Donna Benjamin as I mentioned earlier, Rachel Lawson sitting in the back there and Enril de Meester. So in addition to our regular members, we also have a number of subject matter experts who we can kind of consult with on an as needed basis if we need additional advice on issues that might require specialized knowledge such as legal issues, mental health or regional culture. So the CWG is tasked with maintaining a friendly and welcoming contributor community for the Drupal Project. In order to do that, we help community members resolve conflicts through an established process. We act as a point of escalation, mediation and sometimes arbitration in case for the community members in case of intractable disputes. So part of that, we also are responsible for upholding the Drupal Code of Conduct. So if there's an issue or question or a violation of that code of conduct, we're asked to weigh in on that process. We recognize community leadership through the Aaron Winborn Award. Aaron Winborn was a well-known, well-loved member of the Drupal community who passed away from complications due to ALS a number of years ago. And so in his memory, every year we have given an award which Jordana has in her suitcase right now, in her backpack right now, to a member of the community who shows kind of above and beyond, you know, sort of, you know, caring and impact and effort and love for our community. So Kathy Thies, Gabor Heitchi, and Nikki Stevens, hi Kathy, are all passed recipients of the Aaron Winborn Award. In addition to that, we provide resources, consultation and advice to people and organizations in our community as they need it. One thing that we've done this year is we kind of stepped in because there was no sort of clear or obvious vehicle for the community's voice to be sort of heard in the process of trying to understand how we move forward with next steps on community governance. So we basically brought together a bunch of people who then went on to organize some meetings and gather some feedback from the community around that, came up with some takeaways that were then shared with the rest of the community, you know, and with others, you know, with Dries, with the Drupal Association, and kind of helped inform both the creation of the Drupal principles that Dries talked about on Tuesday as well as, you know, some of the conversations that are occurring over this week around governance both for the community and for the project as a whole. This Tuesday we organized a teamwork and leadership workshop here at DrupalCon. We may talk a little bit more about that later, but, you know, the idea was really to try and help provide resources and tools to enable people to kind of take ownership of their leadership potential within the community, to learn how to work together with folks as a team, and I think it was a really good sort of first start at doing that, the idea really that we're helping to build a community and a culture of leadership in Drupal. We talk with folks from other open source projects, share ideas, experiences, things that work, things that don't work. Those conversations are fairly informal in ad hoc right now, but hopefully that's something we can forge stronger ties and make stronger in the future. And in general we do whatever we can to sort of promote the overall health of the community if we see that there's a pain point or a problem. We do what we can within our limited time and non-existent resources. By the way, we're an all volunteer group. We don't get paid to do any of this and we're doing it all out of our time and as our way of contributing to the community. You get paid by hogs. Rarely, but yes. So, yeah, so I mean to be clear that we don't have a formal relationship, you know, with the Drupal Association. We're an independent group that's currently chartered directly by Drees. So he either appoints or if we say, hey, there's someone we'd like to add to the group, he will, we will run that pastries and he'll usually say, yep, sounds good. And if there are appeals of any of our decisions that are made, those would go to Drees who would then decide either to review them himself or to appoint another person or group of people to review the decision. So, I'm going to spend the next few slides talking a little bit about conflict and specifically negative conflict, you know, the kind that we kind of all think of when people have disagreements and can't get along, right? And I've got a few slides that kind of leads into some of the kind of broader issues that we see and deal with in the Drupal community and honestly, folks in other open source communities see as well. So negative conflict is often caused by unmet needs, right? And so those are things like I don't feel heard, right? I don't feel like my contributions are being valued. My interests aren't being represented. I feel hurt by something that someone else said or did, right? So probably nine times out of ten, the issues that we, that come to us, no matter what the specifics or details are, very, very often boil down to one of these or related set of unmet needs. And so to, you know, a way to kind of frame that, if these things are not dealt with, they have negative conflict, right? And the consequences of negative conflict in Drupal and honestly in other open source projects as well is pretty bad, right? And conflict is fairly widespread. So last year, GitHub commissioned a survey of thousands of contributors across dozens of open source projects which found that 18% of respondents have personally experienced a negative interaction with another user in open source but 50% have witnessed one between other people. Those numbers are actually pretty consistent with some research that we've done here within Drupal. Back after Drupal 8 was released in 2016, we did a survey talking about whether you had seen or experienced conflict during the Drupal 8 development cycle and in the people who responded to our survey, about 60% said that they had. So this is a pretty common problem. So obviously this leads to things like decline in contributor morale, decline in productivity, decline in collaboration, people leaving the project, right? So if we go back to that GitHub survey, 21% of people who experienced or witnessed a negative behavior said that they actually stopped contributing to a project because of it, right? People choosing not to join the project. We don't have any way to gather stats around that. And then the other thing that happens as well is these issues, it leads towards reduced gender diversity because these issues very often disproportionately impact women, right? So an open source in general, only about 3% of credited code contributions are made by women, okay? In Drupal, we're doing way better than that because it's 6%, okay? That's not anything to be proud of. That is still nowhere near enough, okay? And even at in-person events like this one, right, DrupalCon, we're lucky if we can get 20% women in attendance, right? And so we're dealing with an issue already that is amplified and sort of exacerbated by the way that women often get treated. They're far more likely than men to encounter language or content that makes them feel unwelcome, far more likely to encounter stereotyping, far more likely to encounter unsolicited sexual advantages. And unsurprisingly, as a result of all this, it means that women are also more likely than men to seek out help directly from people they know already than to ask for help from strangers in a public forum or channel, right? And if we think about our experiences in open source and the way that open source works, being able to have strangers connect and collaborate is really, really, it's part of the lifeblood of open source. And so these are systemic issues that need to be addressed. So bringing it back to the work that we do specifically, the sorts of issues that get reported to us. And so in 2017, we received 43 official incident reports that doesn't count sort of informal contacts that were made one of us or some of us via e-mail or via other channels. But 43 official incident reports filed through a form 2018 so far, and we're what, about mid-April, we've received 13. Might be 14, actually, because I have not updated my slide since last night. So sort of some issues we receive are kind of most common. Our community members being disrespectful and rude to each other in issue queues. This is very often related to the second one, which is technical disagreements and frustrations that turn into personal attacks. One thing we've seen increasingly often, particularly in the last year or two, abusive language and harassment in Drupal Slack channels. We deal with sometimes where someone or a Drupal Slack moderator will kick someone out of a channel or ban them and then that person will be like, will appeal that decision to us, you know, and basically will look at it and determine whether or not the moderator was doing what they were supposed to do and acting within their authority. And so, you know, very rarely would that, you know, be overturned, but sometimes folks do ask and we, you know, and we do review that. Inappropriate language and content at community events, harassment and trolling of community members on social media. I'm going to talk a little bit more about that later. Physical harassment of community members both in and outside of community spaces. Again, I'm going to talk about that one a little bit more detail later. As well as sort of ongoing issues involving specific community members. And this falls into kind of a few different categories. Sometimes we have folks who have sort of an established history of sort of being involved in issues or having reports made and or they may, there may be some other reason that we end up dealing with. What I'm basically trying to say is there are some folks who we end up spending more time dealing with than others, which I think probably isn't a surprise. So, there's this wonderful quote from Bell Hooks, which I think for me really summarizes the sort of balance that we're trying to achieve in the community working group, right? And said, for me, forgiveness and compassion are always linked. How do we hold people accountable for wrongdoing and yet at the same time remain in touch with their humanity enough to believe in their capacity to be transformed? So, you know, I said this and we say this in pretty much every meaning that the community working group is not chartered to be the Drupal police, right? And it's not our role to decide necessarily who's right or who's wrong in a given situation so much as it is about helping people understand and take responsibility for the impact that their words and actions have on others, right? Ideally, what we want is to help people find a resolution that enables them to continue working together with others in our community in a mutually respectful way, right? That's the ideal. That's what we're always striving for. That's not always possible, though. And when it's not, we can and will take the steps that are necessary to protect others in our community. So, I'm going to just kind of briefly talk about we have this very established process for how things happen, what it boils down to are these kind of seven steps. When an issue is filed, whether that's through the incident report form, email, or public issue queue, wherever, it goes on the agenda for our next weekly meeting. If the matters of a serious or immediate nature, we're also in a, we have our own Slack channel so we may choose to take immediate action to address the situation and or meet outside our regular meeting time. But in our regular meetings, we discuss each item as a group. We come to agreement on next steps and then assign someone to follow up with the individuals in question, right? So, in a typical case where there's a dispute between two or more individuals, general approach is first together as much information as possible from all involved parties. And to be really clear, in order to ensure that people are able to share their stories with us in an open honest manner, we don't share any names or other sensitive details outside the group without the permission of those impacted, right? So, we've reached out, we've talked with people, we've kind of heard where the different parties are coming from, what the different sides of the story are. And once we have a sufficient level of detail, we'll then meet again as a group to decide how to proceed, right? So, depending on the nature of the situation, this could involve one or more CWG members providing mediation between the parties in conflict or suggesting ways that they can resolve the issue themselves. You know, and again, in the case of a very clear code of conduct violation, we'll take the steps that are necessary to ensure the safety of others in our community, which up to and including recommending permanent or temporary bans from various project and community spaces, right? So, in some cases, we might receive an after the fact report about a situation that's already been resolved. In those cases, we review the incident, we decide whether further action is necessary, and we keep it on file for reference in case something similar happens in the future or the same person is doing the same things over and over again, right? So, you know, if you're looking at this and you're like, and hearing this, like, this sounds really long and drawn out, right? That's intentional, unless an issue requires immediate action, our process is designed to enable resolutions that are as thoughtful and as permanent as possible. So, as much as possible, we share what we're doing with the community. We take our minutes from every week, and we, again, remove all of the personally identifying details of the incident to summarize them and publish them in a publicly available Google Doc, which is, so we have a Google Docs folder with all of our weekly minutes, and then every time the new one goes up, we tweet it out via our Twitter channel or our Twitter account, which is at Dribble Community. Occasionally, we will issue, if there's a big roaring issue that the broader community, you know, is impacting the broader community, occasionally it may be necessary for us to issue a public statement regarding that issue. Those are typically fairly few and far between. We have a public issue Q on Dribble.org where we respond to feedback and questions. So, you know, one example is that last summer when Whitney Hess did a lot of community conversations to kind of gather people's thoughts and feelings, there were a lot of comments and questions directed specifically toward the CWG. We took those and we just put them in our issue Q, posted our, you know, kind of response to them but left the conversation open for other people to also weigh in. We've closed a few of them. We have a few that are still open and we're continuing to work through those and also, you know, new items that come up. And then, you know, what we're doing right here right now, right? Presenting sessions at DribbleCon. We also go around to other camps and events. I was at the University of Illinois web conference on Friday giving a very similar version of this talk. That's a university web conference. There's a lot of Dribble people there, but there's a lot of not Dribble people there, too. And I'll be speaking at a conference in Berlin in June. Again, just kind of spreading the knowledge, listening and hearing, getting perspectives from other communities. So over the last couple of years in particular, we've learned some things, some big lessons. One is that when you're in the conflict resolution process, it's really, really important to ensure that expectations are set and managed. Communication is key. You know, once again, we're a volunteer group. You know, we're not and we may communicate with someone and it may be another week or two before they hear from us, but we need to make sure we communicate that expectation so that they understand that we're not ignoring their issue. Similarly, in the conflict resolution process, right, you know, making sure that folks understand what this is and what is going to come out of this process and making sure that they understand that before they enter the process. That's, you know, for mediation to be successful, all involved parties need to agree to accept the outcome of the process, right? We can't always assume that both parties will be in good faith, will act in good faith, right? Very often in mediation process, we say, well, you know, either, you know, one party is going to give up something to the other or both parties are going to give something up or maybe both parties are going to walk away and that process can't be effective if one party is like, well, that's fine. You said I should do this, but I'm not, you know, screw you, I'm out of here, right? That happens and, you know, and we need to make sure to manage expectations as much as possible it does not. Escalation and appeals processes need to be well-defined and well-communicated. This is something that we are still working on. Let's talk about this a little bit more as we talk about sort of the governance piece. You know, right now, you know, it is documented, it's part of our charter, but I think it's not necessarily clear to everyone what happens if, you know, we make a decision and that needs to be appealed what that process looks like or how long it takes. And we need to keep communicating with everyone about our purpose, about our scope. We need, about our processes. We need to be sharing with the wider community. We need to be working to answer questions and concerns that come up about governance and accountability, right? We're not a secret group of judges hiding behind, you know, a black curtain, right? We're here, we're people, we're members of our community and, you know, and so we really want to, you know, be working to meet the needs of that community as much as possible. So I'll talk a little bit about a couple of sort of what I'm going to call like emerging issues, right, things that were maybe not as much of a problem a few years ago, but I've kind of increasingly become a problem in Drupal and other open source communities. And one of those is trolling, right? And we're seeing particularly in the last couple of years a lot more reports where people are kind of just trolling others mostly on social media, right? And this is a very kind of tricky problem because, you know, I'm old enough, I grew up in the age of Usenet, right? And so, you know, which was a pretty, could be a pretty wild place, but these communities formed and we had a thing back in the 90s called, I don't know if anyone remember, called Neticut and, you know, and it was these kind of ground rules that you followed and one of them very often was, don't feed the trolls, right? So someone would come in and start being a troll and saying outrageous things and the advice was ignore them and they'll go away. That, so that's kind of my personal sort of like perspective where I go from this, but I understand that the trolling has now become so massive and so weaponized that it is very often impossible to ignore the trolls and they very often do not just go away. So we need to find better ways to deal with this, right? There's this wonderful quote. There's a really, really fantastic, very long article that appeared a couple weeks ago in the New Yorker Magazine about Reddit and about Reddit's challenges as a site and a platform that has kind of allowed this culture of trolling to develop and realized that once that culture had taken root, it was almost impossible to get out of the platform, right? And it was really tearing Reddit down and so it's a very sort of great article. I highly recommend everyone read it, but there was one quote in that article that really stuck out of me. So trolls set a cunning trap, right? By ignoring their provocations, you risk seeming complicit, but by responding, you amplify their message, right? And this is again the balance that we're looking at all the time, right? Someone goes out and attacks someone in an over-the-top and outrageous way and we want to condemn it, right? And people say, if you don't condemn this, you're saying it's okay, right? And I understand that. I get that, right? And we have to balance that need to condemn trolling and harassment, all those, we always condemn harassment, right? But people who are saying stuff to get a rise along with, are we going to actually amplify that message by putting out a big statement or saying something about it? So this is something we're still struggling with and I think in a lot of cases, it's very context dependent, but it's something that, like I said, it's an emerging issue. We're working on it. We're dealing with it. We're trying to understand it better. Some other new challenges. Dealing with, we need better tools and procedures to address harassment that takes place outside of project spaces. There are some people who feel that no matter what they do outside of a project space, only their behavior inside the space should matter, which to me seems clearly absurd, right? If you're harassing and attacking someone on social media or in some other venue, and then you want to turn around the next day and be like, hey, let's work together on this patch, right? Like, that's not a thing. That doesn't work, right? So it would be really clear. This is not about free speech. This is not about political correctness. This is about treating other people around us with basic human decency and respect, right? So this is what we need to do when we deal with issues. We're, again, looking at the impact that those incidents have on other people, not necessarily, you know, where they occurred, right? We need better reporting mechanisms and procedures for handling reports of sexual harassment and assault. So this has been an issue in several other communities. We have dealt with it a little bit in our community as well. And again, we face this really, really bad vicious circle, which is that there are incidents that sometimes do not get reported for a variety of reasons, very valid reasons. Sometimes people don't feel safe. They don't know where to turn. They, you know, don't feel that there's a good way for them to report the issue. They may not want to report it, any of those reasons. The incident doesn't get reported. And the people who are in a position to take action don't necessarily know that it occurred, but other people know that it occurred, right? And they're like, that thing happened and no one did anything about it, right? And what that means is that future incidents are also less likely to get reported, which again just makes the cycle worse and worse and worse. So we need to find, we need to develop much better ways of making sure that people have ways that they can report things in a safe, anonymous way so that the people who are in a position to do something about it have the information they need to take the action that's necessary. We also need better ways to recognize and address incidents that occur across projects. You know, I was talking with Steve Francia, right? Steve Francia works with open source at Google. They have tons and tons of different projects. And they've had several incidents where, you know, somebody who is a known bad actor in one project will kind of wear their welcome out and then they'll just move to another project and do the same thing. And it's the knowledge doesn't get transferred or shared. And that's something that we need to kind of get better at in order to address these problems. And so, you know, I don't know, maybe some sort of united nations of open source or world court or something, I don't know, but this is an open need. So talk a little bit about CWG's role in Drupal's governance. So there's been a lot of conversations happening at different levels and with different people about governance this week and right after this session, I'm going to go into another one. And, you know, and essentially where I think most things are at this place that people are, yes, thank you, processing feedback and everything. And so there's no decisions about where things are going or what next steps are. But challenges that we have with the status quo is that, again, all volunteers, body, no staff, no resources, and no legal protection, right? The work that we do is complex, time consuming and emotionally draining. And having a single person as our escalation point is not scalable or sustainable, right? Those are the challenges we have. So there's some opportunities, right? We have the opportunity to, and as we're looking at what our role in governance, you know, looks like moving forward, we have the opportunity to improve. We will can, we want to be able to maintain independence while being more accountable to the community at large, right? We have the potential to separate the code of conduct enforcement side of what we do from the conflict resolution and mediation side of what we do, right? Maybe those are handled by two separate bodies. Who knows? We have the opportunity to be able to focus a more proactive steps to improve the health of our community less on triaging crises, right? And then hopefully we can also, again, collaborate more closely with other projects and communities on best practices for supporting community health. So my final slide for some Q and A. I think we'll have time. So what can we all of us here do to help everyone be more successful, right? Based on, you know, what we know, what we see, we need to continue to work on streamlining code and project review processes, so many conflicts. There's been a lot of work done here already, I know, but this is still where we see a ton of conflicts come up. Just improving communication channels, right? So this means that we need to kind of embrace that people are using multiple communication channels, multiple kinds of communication channels, real-time stuff, video, slack, asynchronous stuff, right? Stuff that occurs on forums or issue queues. And, but we need to make sure that those communication channels are well documented, well developed, well maintained, and well supported. We need to better communicate Drupal's direction purpose and technical roadmap, right? We're making progress here as well, but it's much easier for people to contribute and understand where they fit in if they are able to know where things are going. Mentorship, we need to continue working to expand mentorship beyond newcomers, beyond core office hours, and create more opportunities for non-code mentorship, right? Think about camp organization. Running a Drupal camp is a huge, massive, massive effort. And frequently, it falls to the same people in a local community to do year after year after year, and eventually those people get tired and burned out, and the information doesn't always get passed to their successors. So then those people end up having to reinvent the wheel, and the cycle goes all over again. If we had ways people with well-run established Drupal camps could help train and have mentor people into what they do and how they make their camps run, and then those people were able to either step in at that camp or some other camp and run it on their own, that would be amazing. And finally, creating opportunities for community leadership development. We started doing this this week. I think we were talking there's opportunities as well instead of not just in group settings, but also maybe some one-on-one coaching opportunities for people who to really kind of work through some of the challenges they have with understanding how to work with other people in our project community. So that is all my slides. And Tradana, did you have anything to add before we go into Q&A? No, basically the thing we are trying to do is lower barriers. Right. And that's like a very important thing we're hearing everywhere within the community. So, yeah, please come on up to the mic. A couple of quick things. First of all, thank you to the entire CWG board for what you do. I know it's incredibly difficult, but we appreciate it. One of the issues that you highlighted a few times is your lack of independence. Is the hope that lack of independence from having Drees is kind of the final empire? I wouldn't frame it that way. Actually, the fact that we are chartered by Drees actually gives us a tremendous amount of independence because Drees is very hands-off, right? And so that's actually one of the few advantages is that we're very flexible. We have a lot of freedom, and where it becomes a challenge, though, is when there is something that has to be escalated, right, when we've seen that happen, that's where it becomes a blocker or a barrier and is not really sustainable. Ideally, I mean, and the other issue as well is that because we're chartered by Drees, we just don't have access to staff or resources, money, you know, things that could help us do our job so much better, right? One quick thing is as somebody who was involved in one of the issues that came up this year of getting involved in a disagreement that ultimately led to personal insult, I'd just like to say for the record, given this is recorded, that Chris, I am sorry for what I said, I did get too wound up and I should not have said what I said. So that leads to the question of four people who are heavily involved in the community. Do you have resources, recommendations, articles, et cetera, for people to recognize scenarios that could get difficult before they happen? Boy, that'd be awesome, wouldn't it? But we are working on it. We are working on it, yeah. We're trying to get some guidelines. We talked about it at the community summit, it said, well, for people to learn how their communication impacts people and maybe with language barriers and cultural differences, how things could have an effect on others. Yeah. I mean, we need to continue working on stuff. We have a few kind of outdated links and resources on our site right now, but we, and you know what, and honestly, there's other communities that are doing this as well, right? So. I'd like to plug. Hi there. Hello. So to that topic, I'd like to plug the responsible communication guide. Yes. The guide that has already been put together by a bunch of folks who have thought about these particular communication styles issues. That's awesome. Yes. So that's a resource. The folks at Mozilla are putting together a ton of great resources. There's a, again, as I said, a lot of great work going on out of the Google open source. A lot of folks are working on this. And so, you know, I think it's our hope that we're going to do what open source does, right? We're going to, we're going to steal from the best and put our own little spin on it. And hopefully it'll help everyone. Sorry. There's also stuff about nonviolent communication. Yeah. Which is also very handy for any everybody. Yeah. Go. Cool. Yeah, thanks as well for all the great work you do. One thing that came to my mind is so, I think what I understood is that the process should be very detailed in order to, if, in any case, you need to take a decision, you want to take the best decision possible, like, did I get that right? That's part of it. Yes. Do you say ways where you could, like, quicker come to intermediate results? Let me be really clear. All right. If the situation warrants immediate action, we take immediate action. Okay. All right. Very carefully. Yes. Lots of discussion. Yes. We talk about it. We don't just, you know, make impulse judgments, but that's the whole point, right? Is that very, very often in situations it's this thing where if people are full of emotions and they're in the moment and they're frustrated and they're angry and they're saying things they don't mean, right? And if we can kind of slow things down, pull them apart, talk with them, help them understand, you know, the impact of what they're saying, then we actually have an opportunity for them to think about it, for them to understand, for them to grow as a person and for them to not make that same mistake next time. A lot of the times it's also intent versus impact. Sometimes you don't intend to cause any harm, but still something you've done has done that. So we need to be able to all take responsibility for that and not just make excuses, but just say, all right, how can I not have that happen again? Anyone else? Hello. I'm Matthew. And I would like to extend my thanks as well for your work. It seems that there are two parts of this at least to the community working group and you guys deal with a lot of the reactions and the follow-up and the finding appropriate responses to incidents that have happened. And I think I've heard you talk a little bit about working on the improving situations going forward and raising awareness. And there's been a lot of interest recently in the Drupal community to this idea of diversity and inclusion. It sometimes seems like we sort of conflate diversity and inclusion with the kinds of things that you're working on. But I have a specific question which is how people who are not part of the community working group can help support your efforts to create a situation where these things don't necessarily happen in the context of everyone working together more nicely. Yeah. Do you want to take that to the same page now? I think we both can. But I would suggest what a lot of people already do is sometimes step in and kind of do that same thing where you slow things down and try to have people see each other's perspectives. It's having patience with each other because that's a lot what we do as well, patience and trying to see everything from it, like trying to understand, right? And if we all, it's really like if we're all just patient and respectful to each other, like we wouldn't have to be here. But it's easy to say that but sometimes it's just the acting of it. Maybe just a follow-up then which would be that I know how I can work on that for myself. But one of the questions I've thought a lot about this week is how we can help each other without trying to control other people. Are there types of activities you talked about, like for example, you know, in my, I was thinking in my work as a local camp organizer if there's kinds of things that we could do to help support these or any other resources, things that you've come across that just can sort of help build the community in a broad way? Yeah, I mean that's exactly what we'd love to do. And again, I think it goes as question of, you know, we have this amazing community with a lot of knowledge and a lot of expertise. We have access to, you know, materials and information out there. And yeah, I mean, you know, maybe we can put together a couple of initiatives to try and, you know, create some, you know, I've talked with numerous camp organizers about like wouldn't it be great if, you know, you're running a camp, you're trying to do all the things, you're wearing all these hats, right? And you're like, I know I need to have a code of conduct for my camp, right? And so most folks get that right. What they sometimes miss is the, but I need to have somebody, you know, who's there to address any questions or issues if they come up. And then that person needs to know how to handle and address conflicts and questions issues. So the conversation I have with so many camp organizers are like, wouldn't it be great if we had like a kit or a playbook, you know, or some training ideally that we could provide, you know, to camp organizers so that they had the tools and then they could share those with others as well. And I think this is just part of a cultural shift maybe that we need to make, you know, is in terms of really, you know, having this culture where we're kind of all looking out and caring for each other and taking care of each other, not that we don't already, but, you know, in a way that's more visible, I think, you know. And maybe more active, like we kind of, like a lot of people I've seen already kind of mentor people or help them out, but maybe we can find ways to more actively do these things. Like I know, like if I know my strength is in this, I can help with other people who have a different strength and work together that way. Yeah, I mean, the reason I'm here is that, I mean, I've been active in Drupal for, well, 12 years at this point, right? I have not contributed, personally contributed a line of code to Drupal. Okay? I'm not a coder, okay? My company has done that and everything, and I've helped pay for a lot of code to be contributed to Drupal, but it's not, I've not sat down and done that myself. But I know that, you know, that there are like certain skills that I have developed and learned over the years, and I can help make, you know, if I can help make the community a little bit better by applying those skills, then that's how I'm going to contribute, right? And I think we get so stuck in the idea of contribution is code, right? And we don't always pause to think and say, you know what? There are so much more to all of us than that person who's building websites or developing code. We have other skills and resources. Let's bring more of that to the people that we are in the project and how we engage with others. So is that, I'm just going to keep going. Nobody else is here. Sorry, is that mean, you know, more talks, more tracks at conferences, more user groups that focus on issues that are more human focused, like empathy or something like that? I mean, because again, like individually in conversations with people, I can do everything I, you know, I can listen and in trying to be supportive and, but taking that to like the group level, it seems like on the one hand, I know there's a problem. I know there's a problem because I see people that are frustrated, right? But on the other hand, it seems like our community does a really good job of that, especially with our sprints, with all of these different sessions we've had, the leadership training that you guys organize all. I mean, I've been to a lot of these kinds of sessions just this week. So yeah, seems like there's a lot of good. There is. And you know what, I think we should all pat ourselves on the back a little bit. Like, like we are, we are, we're not perfect. We're frustrated. We're burned out. We got a lot of problems. Let me be really clear about that. And actually, I do think maybe we do need more tracks and more open communication because we do have like a camp organizer slack, but not about like, how do we, not just like, okay, but how do I do deal with Code of Conna violations? How do I do these hard things that we don't always talk about? Like these, this underlying like, how can I communicate better with my team? Well, so, and one thing, but one thing I wanted to, to Adam, before I get to your question, which is that, you know, I would love to see not just more tracks and more sessions that focus specifically on these topics. I would like to see these techniques and tools integrated into more sessions in our regular tracks, right? Because, all right, let's look at the number of people who are in this room compared to the number of people who are in some of the other sessions that are going on right now, right? If, if, if, if, if we have, if we take all the people stuff and just put it in its own track, it's not gonna solve the problem, right? Gotta do more than just that. So, yeah. So, I had a couple questions. One was, you talked earlier in the presentation about trying to improve diversity in the community and, and so one thing that's come up in a few buffs and sessions since I've been here has been trying to think through how, whether, and if so how D.O. and, or DrupalCon events collect demographic information. How to manage that, how to figure out the privacy of it, how to report it, and so I'm just curious if you have any, if the CWG has done work around that or how you think about that or, or how people can offer their opinions on that or just sort of that stuff. Well, the good news is that there's a module for that. So, so, so, yes, actually, so there's, and we were, we were actually just talking about this the other day. There's, I think some of you might be familiar with the work that Nicky Stevens is doing with the Open Demographics Project. And so, so they're developing basically kind of a, a set of, of, of fields and demographic information to really gather any, again, safe, responsible, and privacy-respecting way, better information about demographics and diversity in our community. And I will tell you from my perspective, right, that that would be incredibly useful. I, this presentation, right, and I talked about gender diversity, you notice I didn't talk about racial diversity in open source, and you know why I didn't talk about racial diversity in open source? Because there are literally no statistics on how many people of color, no good statistics on how many people of color are in open source. When they, when, when the folks at GitHub did that, that big, like, well-funded, massive study and everything, the closest they came to asking was, are you a ethnic or racial minority in the country in which you live, right? And that's not a very precise question. That's not necessarily always actionable. It's not precise, right? So, you know, and by the way, the answer was abysmally low as you might expect, you know, but, but part of the, right, if, if the problem is, is invisible, then, then it makes it less likely for people to recognize and address the problem, right? So, yeah, so I think I would definitely take a look at, at, at that work, that, that open demographics work. It was really interesting because we, we talked about that a little bit, I've talked about that a little bit yesterday with Adam Goodman, who was facilitated at the workshop on Tuesday, and he's like, and he's a professor at Northwestern University, and he says, you know, we're actually trying to solve the same problem in academia right now, and he's like, when I learned about this project, he's like, oh, we could use that, right? And so, so I think there's a, there's a good opportunity there, you know. So is there any specific, because I, that was referenced at the board meeting yesterday, too. So I know it's something that people are thinking about, but is there any mechanism for like, like who is making those calls? Is there an issue for adopting it or not adopting it, or like how, where's the influence point? Well, if it's on, if it's for DrupalCon or Drupal.org, then that decision is, you know, ultimately going to be made by, by the Drupal Association, because they're responsible of those. I think there are open issues on those topics on Drupal.org somewhere. I don't know exactly where at the moment. But yeah, I mean, if you're interested in this, definitely check those out, weigh in, see what folks are doing. Okay, and then my other question was just a smaller one. You said, I think there were 43 incidents that you dealt with in 2017. That sounds about right, yeah. So while understanding that the number of issues reported doesn't necessarily reflect the reality of what's going on in the community, I'm just curious how that compares to prior years, or like if you see trends in one direction or another. We're dealing with more issues every year. Yeah. And we've responded. So, excuse me, until last year, our group was only four people. And then last year, we grew to six. Rachel took a job with the Drupal Association, so we're down to five. So we're looking to add one to two more folks to the group. And again, we're looking at as an opportunity to make sure that our group has the tools and the experiences and the perspectives, because we're an increasingly global community. And it doesn't always make sense for us to be tied to the same like six hour block of time zones, which we are right now. It makes scheduling meetings easy, but it doesn't make it easy when an issue comes up. And it, you know, it's the middle of the night for everyone. Also for cultural awareness. And cultural awareness, yeah. So that's, yeah, that was the main point of what I was trying to say. Okay, thanks. Anyone else? All right. Oh, Kathy's got one. I wanted to say that I appreciate the particular and careful way that you use language when you talk about these things. In particular, when you talk about impact versus intent, I appreciate that a lot. And when you mention, you know, having a, I don't remember if you called it a goal, but keeping in mind wanting to protect people. So those two things especially jumped out to me and that was really great. Awesome. Thank you. Thank you. All right. Well, if no one has anyone else, anything else, I actually have another place I need to be in. In two minutes, do you, and yeah, Jordana does too. So thank you all, everyone. And yeah, and we'll be around for the rest of the day if anyone wants to follow up with us at any point or after con, whatever.