 The MHPM would like to begin by acknowledging the traditional custodians of the unceded lands, seas and waterways across Australia upon which our webinar presenters and participants are located. We wish to pay respect to elders past and present and we acknowledge the sovereignty of all First Nations people. Hi, I'm Damien Wicks and welcome to the 900 plus people who are registered for this webinar and the people who are watching us live today. Today's webinar focuses on a new initiative, which is a unique partnership between Black Rainbow and the Mental Health Professionals Network. And this is the first in a series of four webinars and we'll talk about the second one at the end of today. I'm produced in this partnership and it explores how practitioners can better support the mental health and social and emotional well-being needs of the Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander LGBTIQA plus SB community. Today's webinar in particular focuses on the impact of COVID-19 on the Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander community and how to strengthen the well-being and mental health literacy of services and increase the access to these. Next slide, please. So I'm your facilitator. I'm Professor Damien Wicks at Flinders University and I'm also a psychotherapist who works in private practice. And today's speaker is the founder of Black Rainbow, Damien Bonson. Damien, could you tell us a little bit about Queer Robbery and how it came about, please? Yeah, hi. Hello, everybody. First of all, I'd like to acknowledge the traditional owners and the lands that we all are meeting. And I'm going from Larrakeer Country up here in the Northern Territory. Queer Robbery came about as a creative way of coming up with giving information in regards to Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander queer folk and the work that we are doing. It's become creative in terms of that, you know, in a post-COVID world or post-lockdown world, the embracing of using videoconferencing. And it was a really, really unique way for us to reach those that can't attend conferences or even when we don't get opportunities as Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander queer folk to present at conferences. This is a way of greater reach. And the number of registrations I think is really testament to how effective this vehicle is. Thanks, Damien. Next slide, please. So as we've already mentioned, the aims of this webinar are to discuss the impact of COVID-19 on Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander LGBTIQA and sister girls and brother boy community and how to strengthen the mental health and social and emotional wellbeing, literacy of services and to increase access. You've got our learning outcomes here. I think they're going to be really well covered in the material that Damien's going to present to you now. And then we're going to have quite an extensive time for questions, some of which you have all kindly sent into us already. And we've had a great time looking at those together and also those that come in live during the session. Next slide, please. And I'll hand it over to Damien to start talking through this project that he conducted and the outcomes that he has found. Yes. The report for us was an opportunity. For those that are familiar with Black Rainbow, we operate on donations. We're an unwavered volunteer organisation that I founded. And so the opportunity for us, we saw COVID as an opportunity to collect some data. There is no data in terms of First Nations LGBTIQA plus people. I began speaking publicly about that in around 2016. So this was an opportunity to draw on our donations and engage with one of our community partners, which is Macquarie University, to get some baseline data. There's a sense of pride for us at Black Rainbow for producing this report. And that this study has been led by Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander Rainbow folk. And it's been written by us as well. In the process we've had to go through to achieve this, which is to use donations to be unwavered volunteers. It speaks to the structural barriers that exist for Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander queer folk when it comes to preventing suicide within our mob. Thank you all so much for registering and attending today. We're really glad that there is an interest here in what we have to say and what the results tell us. Next slide, please. You will receive an access to the report just in a couple of days. We just had some technical issues on my hand to make sure that it was all ready. So the slides that you'll see today are snapshots from the report. And they draw on the information from the report that is more pertinent to the mental health workforce and also those that are attending today. Within the report there will be a lot more information. But this is what we'll talk about today or speak to. It's more specific to the mental health profession. Now all three of these infographics are of particular concern. Because we have no baseline data to make a comparison, we are comfortable to assume that these are elevated experiences given that we've all experienced COVID and COVID lockdown at a national level but even at a global level and the impact that that's had. Nonetheless, these are alarming that half up to close to half of the participants experience suicidal thoughts is particularly distressing. It is worrisome because there hasn't been a substantive investment in the Aboriginal child transgender, you know, LGBQTI plus sister girl brother boy suicide prevention. And therefore we actually don't know what should look like in terms of intervention or prevention for our community. So that half of the respondents indicated, you know, having these suicidal thoughts really should alarm people or pique their interest to to mobilize to to at least champion that that work needs to be done. Similarly with the high numbers of the negative impacts on mental health, we don't know what mental health interventions look like for our community during these moments of distress, let alone if these these moments are prolonged and go on for, you know, plus or three months and turn into a diagnosis. What then does the support look like? Next slide please. It is heartening that in the light of what the previous slide has told us that a significant number did access support from within their family and friends network, that they were actively aware of who the guess the lack of better word the stress that they are in. They were mindful of that and very conscious of that and they had someone to go to is also a strength and I think that speaks to to the I guess the the close knitness of the average entire China community, especially at a family level. Next slide please. That the connections were strengthened for a large part of the respondents is also really positive and we just hope that there's longevity in that that it's not just in in the light of you know, such a catastrophe or crisis that is covered. But at the same time with the quarter saying that they felt less connected. This is also worrisome. We don't have any baseline data to even know how connected they were initially but that you know just over a quarter express that they felt less less connected is a cause of concern in terms of what supports are going to be out there for those people who are feeling isolated. When I first started Black Rainbow on my iPhone 4 back in 2013, it was with the premise that an average on charge trying to get online and see themselves reflected positively and I created those two accounts on Twitter and on Facebook because there was nothing in suicide prevention for our community and to say that you know, six years later is the first time they're going to have any baseline data. There's a lot of work that still needs to be done and particularly the speed in which it needs to be done. What I would really like to sort of comment on and maybe ask you to comment on is you know some of our viewers today may wonder about the sample size that you've got but I'd really like to remind people that you know Indigenous people are a bit over 3% of the population of those maybe 4% maybe more are queer. So I think it's we need to keep those figures in mind when we think about the size of this sample. I think the size of the sample is probably likely quite representative. Is there anything that you would like to say about that? Look absolutely, we're really pleased with the numbers that we got for this survey. It was the first of its kind at a national level as well and so to have these large numbers it's the data is really rich. I was saving this to the end of the presentation that for those that are watching and see opportunities of how we can implement some of these findings or assist with implementation science of some of these findings. I'm not across everything and how to do everything and you know Black Rambler were always seeking support from outside of our networks or even with new networks but there is quite a bit of data in here that can one mobilise I mean prevention efforts and prevention efforts but also around research and we'd love to continue to partner with new organisations and institutions to continue during this research. This is number nine is it? Yeah. So I think the the connections were really strengthened. Sorry we're strengthened it's really positive. Again we are nine or ten sorry. We're on the correct slide that you should be on. Yeah no sorry I just realised I was repeating myself. Yeah so the use of this particular slide here it's the use of social media which I think can direct us to where more specifically tells us where help can be provided or that interventions can be created. I know from our experience at Black Rainbow we weren't active on Instagram until early 2020 so just before the pandemic hit and lockdown hit we hadn't been count but at the time we only had about 220 followers. As of this morning we have over 16,400 followers. So in that first year the rise of numbers by Instagram was actually quite astronomical. We have healthy numbers across Facebook and Twitter. I think Twitter is just under 9,000 and Facebook is hovering around I think 13 or 14,000 but Instagram for us is quite a there's opportunities here in terms of interventions and support and we've been using our presence on social media more as a community notice board for sharing information as well as providing a place where people Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander queer folk can come to you to see themselves in the work reflected positively but we're fully yet to harness the reach that we have in terms of the support that is needed so there's plenty of opportunities ahead. I do think Damien that perhaps some of I wondered just off the top of my head if perhaps some of the increased reach on social media has both about people needing that support but also in terms of visibility. I know people like Courtney Act has been a very strong advocate for the work of Black Rainbow. I wonder if you know how that has helped your outreach and uptake. Oh absolutely our accomplices in our work that we doing have been very valuable in increasing our reach not just within our community but also to the broader community outside of ours as well about who we were you know the both times that Courtney has been on Dancing with the Stars we've been her charity of choice so that's given us millions and the reach from that from from mainstream TV is being quite substantial and it's really supported us also around being able to have conversations because of Courtney's audience and who is in that audience who has now come over into ours and reach down and say look what can we do which has been really helpful. Next slide please and this here you know this slide in particular in light of the levels of suicidality and mental health that were on one of the previous slides these help-seeking levels are of considerable concern. The only way I can see that this will increase is through an investment in Aboriginal Torres Strait Islander, LGBQTI plus SP, suicide prevention, mental health and social emotional being. As I've said previously there isn't a substantive investment in our health and well-being at this moment in time and you know to increase these levels that we need to ensure there needs to be an investment one we need to understand what are actually help-seeking behaviors of our community and what services do we need. At the moment there is there's some preliminary data that identifies the need which we knew anecdotally and I certainly did I created a workshop about six years ago to increase the cultural competency of suicide prevention services and now more broad into social services so that they were a lot more I guess first-nation queer friendly so that to increase access for for our community but this as I've said before there's there's a considerable amount of work that still needs to be done. This report is the first national study that even has in the baseline data that even mentions around the suicide ideation or suicidal thoughts so there's still quite a bit of work to be done and you know with suicide being such an important discussion to have but also you know the the I think the latest data that came out that Aboriginal suicides went up during the pandemic others went down in 2020 the rates of suicide are much higher than 2019 and it's been a steady climb. Next slide please. For those that were accessing mental support this data provides a foundation of where where and what can be can be strengthened you know these are still quite considerable low numbers but they are I guess encouraging and it's looking at those particular areas of support which are you know across Telethon and video conferencing the online support and also during the crisis text or the crisis hotline is that our mob are actually using these services so how can we strengthen these services and this here is going to take around looking at the help seeking traits of how and why and what attracts people to these services but also what's not attracting you know the other two-thirds of our population who are who are identifying that they are in distress so again there's quite a bit of work that can be done but it is it does give us some insight into of a starting point of where we can go where we can be we can begin I mean you mentioned on the previous slide you know the low numbers of people accessing services and you said what needs to change but what are some of the barriers that are happening at the moment is it about there aren't queer specific First Nations services is it the First Nations services aren't inclusive of queer people what do you think it is about this meaning that low uptake looking I mean there could be more universal you know response I can give around you know stigma those types of things but in terms of services what we don't see is we don't see services our enough services you know I think there's a handful that are doing this but we don't see services that from the outside looking in are presenting themselves to the First Nations you know rainbow community saying come through our front door access our service you are welcome here and it's something really as simple as that these services are essential services it's getting people through the front door and if that front door doesn't look inviting people are going to access it next slide yep thank you so with them with the one-third of respondents who did access professional support nearly half of them reported obstacles and for those who went looking which wasn't captured about a quarter of said that the service that they needed did not exist or was not available to them and I think this also goes to your question you just asked Damien is that however I think that we need to know what the service what the service is that people need it's the first instance and that did not exist and was not available and is it racism at mainstream services that is stopping our mold from accessing those services is it the presence of the phobias among Aboriginal and Tarsha Honda services that that isn't stopping our mold from accessing those services so if when those things exist either in actual or they're perceived then we have two significant service providers in this country that our mob aren't accessing and that's when that that's when I think that becomes that the service that I need isn't available I don't believe that we need to start setting up First Nations queer services around the country I think this is about increasing the cultural competency of both First Nations organizations so the Aboriginal medical services to be better equipped and engaging with you know the LGBTI original community but also with mainstream services and this includes LGBTI services as well around being better at and better equipped around increasing their position and strengthening their their reach and also their attractiveness to to First Nations rainbow mob. Next slide please and so these here are just a selection of the findings that were applicable to today's webinar for myself four and five are of particular significance you know as I said earlier you know Aboriginal and Tarsha Honda you know lesbian gay bisexual transgender queer intersex you know non-binary um sister girl and brother boy so we are considerably absent from from suicide prevention efforts particularly at a federal level there are some states and territories that are mobile at localizing but when you look at federal funding and the overarching plans so the fit mental health plan the implementation of all that funding there's nothing for our community and it goes back to without data there is no policy without policy there is no funding so it is my hope that even this preliminary data that we've uncovered here through our research that this we can use to champion to change policy to affect policy to create a new policy so that when it comes to funding that there is money allocated for those who want to do this work or within the existing funding that there is KPIs there that people need to report back against to say yes we are actually investing in to preventing the suicide of Aboriginal and Tarsha Honda LGBTQ2o plus people and one of the things too that I highly recommend if you're in these positions of leadership within suicide prevention is to include Aboriginal and Tarsha Honda LGBTQ2o people within that within those leadership discussions and and as someone who has a first-hand lived experience of you know I've had depression anxiety about first-hand lived experience of suicidality first-hand lived experience of bereavement we need to have people at the table that bring more than just lived experience we need people with expertise we need people with qualification we need people that have done First Nations queer work we just can't have someone there just because they identify as First Nations or across the rainbow spectrum before anything again it when you receive this report and this is kind of a call for help I guess or for assistance is that again there's going to be data within this and findings within this report that I don't have the capacity to really to look at and say okay this is what needs to happen next so once you've received this report and you can see opportunities for implementation for some of these findings or to assist with implementation sites please reach out to us again there's quite a bit of research that needs to happen suicide and mental health are just one component there is as quite a raft of other areas of research that needs to be done something that's not in this presentation but is in the report that just over a third of respondents identified as having a disability which I think has significant implications for the NDIS there was at least half of the respondents did not feel safe in the spaces that they were in during during lockdown so that that's considerable in terms of we need to look at why that is we know that out of research out of Western Australia that came out a couple years ago that First Nation LGBTQGIFoC over there didn't necessarily always feel safe within the Aboriginal spaces or in queer spaces so there is this isolating effect that happens so please do reach out there's some quite a bit of work to be done and many hands make light work and I think something so important that comes from this research is that you know COVID's not over so we know that First Nations people experience compounding effects of racism or colonisation so that's sort of a baseline and that you know it relates to suicidality and then for First Nations queer folk we have compounding phobias as you mentioned before and then COVID adds to that as well so I think we need to be mindful that this was a snapshot at a point in time as you said but that point of time hasn't ended and so those elevated rates on top of the existing compounding things is likely to be continuing you know absolutely and the fact that this is the the only Aboriginal study like on the impact on the Aboriginal Toronto community I think we're we're already headed we're headed that curve you know we've started this conversation so there is this the COVID elements that this price provides foundation for in terms of you know the ongoing pandemic and then long COVID but then there's the the service provider stuff you know as well in terms of how to strengthening services or the need for services to to strengthen their outward facing their look but also around you know we need to collect this information that nearly 50 50 percent of respondents again as you said it's a lot it's a quite a decent sample size express express suicidality during that or suicidal thoughts during that period is really quite quite concerning and also that there was elevated periods of mental health distress as well and the two honestly always related they can operate in you know individually suicide you know being behaving mental health being more of a diagnosis and experience they're not necessarily related but sometimes they can be which just makes that heightens the risk already particularly for first nations queer folk where we know that racism is a significant risk for suicide but also the phobias that we experience as lesbian gay bisexual trans queer intersex non-binary you know sister girl and brother boys thanks to me so as everyone can see on the slide here uh questions can now be asked using the speech bubble icon um we've also got some questions that have already come in and we're going to start by having looking at those uh so and and also I've asked to to remind you that you can join the chat by clicking the two speaker box icon on the top part of your screen you can also ask the question by clicking on the speaker box icon on the bottom right of your screen so there's lots of ways to engage with us now so a question that we got asked before the webinar we had a whole lot of lots of questions coming before the webinar so we can't obviously get to all of them and we won't be able to get to all the ones that are coming in live now but we've chosen a few that Dan would really like to respond to so one of them is living and working in remote Aboriginal communities has been very challenging to assist Aboriginal Torres Strait Islander LGBTQ young adults and children they often get bullied a lot and are scared to stand out for themselves as a professional how can we support them and their family to live their life in freedom cheers Damien I've worked predominantly of my career well they've been the better part of the last decade in the northern half of Australia for the first half of my work in suicide prevention was working across the Kimberley within those more remote community spaces and what I know from when you when you live in those towns and work in those towns that during your date when you're working hours you're in a particular role but also outside of that you're part of the community so there's a couple of things that I would suggest you could do there's visibility of Koreanness within your workplace or First Nations you know LGBTQTI visibility Black Rambo to see behind me we're going to have some merchandise promotional stuff like these posters available later this year simple things like wearing badges I'm also rocking our wear a purple shirt wear a purple day shirt that we've got available for the next two days so these are these are the I guess the symbolisms for that can our mob can connect to and say well that place there feels like a safe space for me because it's presenting in a way that is welcoming but outside of your role you can still do the same things and in so that you have a community space in that environment they can see themselves reflected positively as well and but also what I found is that when you do this it also promotes conversation between those you don't know much about this topic and then that just grows the visibility the visibility and support at a community level thanks Damian we just had a comment come in live from Mary and she very kindly said that she hadn't heard of Black Rambo before this webinar today and she's definitely going to reach out and engage and in her work in inpatient units at a hospital so it's wonderful to hear people are already learning today just by attending the webinar so another question that we had came in earlier was I'd love some advice on supporting a young brother boy who lives off country and who is not well connected with mob looking for advice on seeking permission from their community to self-identify as a brother boy as per cultural protocols yeah firstly for those that aren't familiar with the term brother boy or sister girl these are these are culturally or socially acceptable terms for some of the indigenous trans community then they're not applicable to all trans folk some some trans folk are actually non-binary and so they don't identify as sister girl or brother boy or male or female so these are excuse me these are self-selected names and so a brother boy isn't as could be an indigenous trans male now in to answer your question I'm not aware of any cultural protocol that does exist in communities but I would encourage that person to be who they are and but also in doing so providing that kind of wraparound support while they're doing so you don't want to just push somebody out into the you know out into the space without providing that support so be very mindful that you're also going to be providing support for them we know that at the point of realization whether it's you know your sexuality or gender identity that is one of the highest places to be in terms of suicide risk this just adds an extra bit of layer in terms of acceptance around that and when I say that that I'm not aware of any cultural protocol it's not to say that nothing exists it's just that I'm not aware of it and something that a few of us have been doing for quite a few years is how was even trans defined and expressed you know pre-contact so if you go back you know 100 sorry you know 10, 20, 30,000 years how was that the language that we are using and even the representational trans now would be a lot different and so we can ask questions around you know cultural protocol for trans but we have to make sure that the language that we're using to describe what's going on actually meets what the community already understand or interpret transness to be prior to and then tell them about BlackBrainbo when BlackBrainbo exists online sorry Damian particularly on Facebook and stuff and on you know Instagram obviously so that when they don't feel isolated and lonely that they can see themselves reflected positively and what we do know is that our mob are quite resourceful so they they go through a lot of the comments and able to then identify people like themselves and there's been connections for that and it's an informal peer-to-peer support that we find that's happening. Thanks Damian so Judy's asked if the slides are going to be available yes Judy they absolutely will be available to you after this webinar we've had another live question come in Damian saying what are some of the best practices or current good ideas to making the front door of a service welcoming or inviting I'll tell you a bit of a story I deliver it um you know that they said there's some personations queer cultural competency workshop and I delivered it in um Tennant Creek um I delivered it throughout the Northern Territory did a bit of a road trip down to Alice Springs and uh Ani Nini is the Aboriginal Medical Service in Tennant Creek and I delivered to third of their staff so it's about the 30 or 40 staff at the first um the first workshop they invited me back the second time so I worked with them to find some additional funding to get me back down to Tennant Creek and when I just before I started um there were people who had been to the first one who wanted to come back to the second one and what they shared with me was that they had um one of the thing is their family and um and children's centre which is on the main street which in Tennant Creek everything's on the main street um on the Stewart Highway there were three flag poles and only two were being used one for the Aboriginal flag and the other for the Torres Strait Under Flag they actually had a rainbow or pride flag in their office space and so they put it up um I also hand out badges um throughout the workshop as well once and once it's been completed and one of their clients um was who was accessing the service as a single parent um getting support um you know in the stresses that they were experiencing shortly after that flag went up they disclosed to the person that their therapist or the person that they'll see that they were actually in the same sex relationship and that they then started to bring their partner into the conversation or into the into the service prior to that they didn't know that they could feel comfortable enough to to share um that they're actually in the same sex relationship um similarly with um a younger client um their their council support worker had a rainbow um I have the rainbow badges that I give out have also the black and brown stripe on it as well to be more inclusive they saw that and they disclosed and this was after a 12 month relationship therapeutic relationship they disclosed to their support worker or council that they were um you know their sexuality differences and this is the the simplicity of this symbolism has it's opening up um and in in strengthening the relationship to the therapeutic contents and this particular young person um the the work that they were doing together was able to really get to the root cause of um what was causing and the distress and so they the service that was able to provide it was a lot more richer and it just came down to a badge and a flag so these are really these are starting points um again essential services are behind these front doors so they must must be welcoming for everybody to go through. Thanks Damien and I think in a way uh Damien's just answered a question that came in from Amy on the live which was about good cultural competency training and I think you know Damien's just mentioned he's delivering that training so certainly reach out to him and if he can't get to you or you know a webinar doesn't suit you um then he'll certainly be able to connect you in without the services who are doing that work. So we'll go to another one of our questions that we got ahead of the webinar today which is I work as an EAP counsellor mostly on the phone or zoom I would like your views on any specific considerations I need to apply when speaking with Indigenous queer folk. Um I would um apply the same considerations that you would use when in person um I think that there is um you also to be this is where the person centred focus comes into play um don't come with any kind of assumptions around um oh I've got an Aboriginal person you know on the phone or on the video or in person I need to behave in a certain way um at the previous webinar I've done for MPHN the the theme that I said is just don't be racist um and then it's also you know in in terms of you know the thing with the LGBTI as well it's just don't be homophobic don't be transphobic and perhaps do a little bit of um you know research to see what that actually could look like um but also you know there's there's a few myths out there um around Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander folk and and they're not in this I mean some of some myths are based in reality but some of them are not applicable to all of us you know about not looking people in the eye I mean that's certainly not the case for me um again as an Aboriginal Torres Strait Islander person um I feel quite comfortable seeing a female clinician um some won't so it's about ensuring that you've had that conversation or you're aware of um who that client is in and really delivering a service that is centred on on who they are and on their needs and their level of comfortability. Thanks Damien. So we've had a question come in the live asking about what are good strategies for organisations to reach and support brother boys and sister girls? Wow um again I think it's just around visibility it is you know the the biggest barrier from the conversations that I've had with our mob is that if like because we we live in a world where there is there is quite a bit of racism and there is quite a bit of phobia you know across the um the sexuality and gender minority spectrum that the apprehension of going to services just on the thought that the experience um you know is going to be negative that they're going to experience racism or they're going to experience one of those other um you know phobic aggression it's going to stop people from going through those front doors so sometimes it is just as simple as um you know putting a flag up and I I draw on that experience as a bit of a bit of a reader back in um my I was living in Perth in my 20s and the bookstores that had the rainbow flags I knew that there were stories in there about me so that's what got me through that front door and so don't be fearful of having us through your front door I know that there's some people saying oh but when they get through the front door they could make it even worse what's also worse is that people aren't accessing the services that they need um and and the only barrier could be is that those services um don't look um that they are welcoming and and so you need to be able to stand outside and if you know any First Nations queer folk or First Nations folk or queer folk get one of them and stand outside the front door with them and say well do walk through this door and if they say no ask them why not um you draw on your local community and those that access to your services Someone on the live has asked a question which I might start responding to and then pass over to Damien is what's the difference between an ally and an accomplice I think in my understanding an accomplice is someone who's really willing to get there in the trenches and really do that work and as opposed to an ally who might be someone who's supportive and and may have people's back and an ally may not as well and an ally might just be someone who you know does talk the talk but doesn't necessarily walk the walk but it encompasses someone's really willing to sort of get in there and and be accountable and you know do stuff with their privilege but what are your thoughts on that Damien? I look both are I think of of equal value or are both valuable you know the the more allyship that is shown for us and whether it is just waving a flag it all helps and this is something that I've learned over the time you know through Black Rainbow's presence with social media I've been asked I do a a lecture session for um of course out of Macquarie University and I get asked about selectivism to me it all actually it all plays a role um if it increases the particularly I guess for us if it places if it increases the visibility or first nation queer folk I'm all for it the encompasses stuff like this works hard work it's really hard work and you know I this was not something that I Black Rainbow was nothing that I set up to where it is now that I've ever envisioned it would be I had a job I had a creative directory um doing other stuff I'm bit of a nerd I want to create apps um but you know the way in which it's evolved based on the feedback is and you know through this experience is that the tough conversations and people say you're going to have tough conversations they're brutal and they're also brutal in terms of like ultimately I've got to say to the Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander health sector you're being homophobic you know I've got to go back to this community my own community and say you're being homophobic and then also then to the LGBTI community and say look you're being racist you know the barriers that you're putting up the structural racism here exists and so it leaves you in this place of you know being quite isolated because you've just you know the two other arms of our service provision in this country outside of mainstream is it you know the rainbow service industry and the Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander ones and the leadership I go to well there's racism and there's homophobia that you're that you're presenting and both groups don't want to hear that you know they don't want to hear that they're behaving in that way so it and this is where I think there's a lot of struggle in terms of the advancement of First Nations queer work is that we are talking back to our leaders and saying in both the queer community and the First Nations community it's like your behaviour is harming us homophobia is a risk factor for suicide racism is a risk factor for suicide at a structural level and as I at the beginning of this when I said this research was funded by donations this it was through the partnership with Macquarie University and this is the accomplices stuff stepping up and saying yeah we're going to join you in this we're going to get this work done um like our babies are dying too and so it is tough work but it's important work so the accomplices they're the ones that you know they have the capacity to get into those trenches and take a few of these punches with us as well thanks Damien um Jackie's asked a great question which is when it comes to visibility some may feel that while our identities are becoming normalized that our visibility may expose us to danger and violence is there any advice for opinions you could offer in regards to navigating the sensitive and vulnerable space wow um I think that you know and I can only draw and I guess I can't speak for I guess anybody else but I can just draw in my own experience we become some really resilient folk and individuals um in terms of you know simply just coming out there's a lot of celebration these days and you know in terms of people coming out um but I also think that there's a significant proportion of um queer folk who have been out for a long time um and it's hard it does it I mean I I'd hope that it's it's better now um but it is around you know if you're more aware now of the um as I guess as non um non queer folk of the um the challenges that are out there then you can step up and provide that extra bit of support um for those people or even at a community level um I can't tell you how much of a relief it was um for marriage equality the past I mean that there's a cultural shift um for us as a as a nation um when marriage equality apart and um got passed and the message that we got loud and clear is that you know for a large portion of our population group they're on our backs um so that was really heartwarming um I'm not sure if Damien has frozen um Dam can you let me know please okay oh while Damien sort of resets I'll step in here uh for a minute something that I would throw into this conversation about the cost of visibility is I've read a book recently wonderful book by Mark Hebe called Black Trans Feminism and it really talks about you know the the quite steep rise in the public visibility of trans women of color in particular across the world so we think of an example like Laverne Cox in Orange is the new black and so that you know and she was on the cover of Time magazine it was labelled a transgender tipping point so to have a black trans woman as the figure of that tipping point is really important but I think that um what the book Black Trans Feminism really talks about is that sure that visibility so important it gives other black trans women awareness that they're not alone but then it comes at this great cost of of black trans women in particular being targeted for that visibility so absolutely we need to be mindful that when people are becoming more visible they also become more vulnerable and so that becomes the work of the accomplices and the allies to really step in and step up and say hey not just I've got you back but I'm going to respond to that racism I'm going to respond to that transphobia so that visibility isn't solely a cost uh to and in this instance to First Nations queer people thanks Damien I'm going to be back again and you're on mute Damien I'm mute yes but I'm back so we might go to another question that we got uh before uh the webinar today um which is what feedback have you received from more remotely located communities about service availability or barriers and what providers or services will be beneficial to folks from the queer community in those locations? Um more more information more knowledge um tell us more um one of the things that came out of the study that we did in Western Australia um came from our elders which is really rich they said tell us what we need to know so it is around maintaining these conversations and uh bringing these conversations into those communities but it needs to also be done in a respectful way again the workshop that I deliver I deliver to um to services but what I know from you know working in regional remote um Australia is that a lot of First Nations mobile average on tire show item mob work at these services so by attending the workshop not only am I sharing them information they can strengthen their service delivery but outside of their work hours this is information that they can go back and have conversations in their families in their communities and what we are seeing and I'm not saying it's a direct result of my workshops but really in terms of the conversations around First Nations Koreaners and the visibility is we're now seeing a lot more engagement you know in pride by First Nations organizations or support um from Aboriginal medical services and the like but also during NAIDOC we're also seeing um you know the First Nations queer folk being sought out to actively participate and become speakers at these events thanks Damien and just thanks to the people who we've answered their questions for posting your thanks to us it's really great that you're engaging in that you're feeling like we're we're getting to your questions and we're doing a good job in answering them so another question we got ahead of the live was uh the specific obstacles in receiving mental health care by the communities that we're talking about today again I think we touched on this earlier on it's like apart from the the universal barriers that exists for all the people you're more namely stigma you know it's the need for organizations to engage in First Nations out queer cultural competency training to at least understand and and part of this here that you're doing is part of that is that for a lot of people they they when totally participating in this conversation is they didn't even know of the the risk or the that Aboriginal child trying to you know LGBTQ child plus more work of considerable risk across part of a large range of issues I guess for this presentation here this webinar you know we I'm focusing more on the suicide outcomes here or the data and also the mental health so we need to be able to ensure that you know the the services to if you're particularly delivering in those areas um again increasing access um but also it's around you know when you're speaking it is that person centered their client centered approach is understanding um your client or your consumer whatever term that you use understanding their story and what it actually means to them also to be First Nation First Nations queer folk don't bring any stereotypes or any myths to the table seriously simply sorry not seriously simply just focus on who they are as you will with others and and not make any prejudgements um and something that I say and is be easy on yourself if you make a mistake just apologize for it um you know the overcoming that fear of making mistakes going to make the relationship also a lot stronger which is the outcomes then also for your client um so you know when only you know you're thinking about 30 percent um had engagement services be mindful of the distrust that may already exist and allow for the relationship to develop it may have taken some really big strides and big steps for that person to you know to realize not only realize that they needed the support but to go in the face of potential you know um microaggressions or racism or phobia that they knew they needed support and so they'll take in that step so be mindful that the there could be some fragility in that initial part of that relationship and something we spoke about in our last webinar we did together Damien on LGBTQ people and suicidality was around if we make those those slips those mistakes for example if we misgender someone to say thank you for being corrected and I'll do better next time because of course when we say sorry the cultural response is to say that's okay but it's not okay that we've misgendered someone so we don't want to put trans people for example or if we say something unintentionally racist we don't want to put indigenous people in the position of having to say that's okay because it's not so we sort of we say thanks thanks for correcting us um and I'm really going to do better next time um I'm going to learn from that so a question that we've had coming on the live from Matty is can you comment on ways that communities could be connected on a more grassroots level so that people don't depend only on government provided services and can build resilience within themselves you would know your networks better than I do build those strengthen those start those conversations with the other services that are in town um there's a whole lot um they can be done um independent of you know government funded services you know I know this from working in regional remote places um the workshop that I'm about to when I roll out throughout the northern territory um I think I get about 30 people at each session they could be up to 10 different organizations at those um at those workshops and even in small places I can almost guarantee that not everybody knows each other we're talking to each other but what I find is happening is that because everyone attended this workshop it strengthens or creates a relationship because they've come in and they've just spent a whole day learning the same thing and so there's a more of a collective response out in the community at a service provider level but also after hours as well in terms of supporting um First Nations Rainbow Folk and that in a way sort of answers the question that you might want to say more to Damien that's just come here on the live from Geordie which is asking what can people do to support financially as a volunteer or in terms of services in terms of the lives of First Nations LGBTQ sister girls and brother boys um the first thing we do is you know in the environments that you're in um see what's what's locally happening um and um one of the things that works really well for us is that people come to us and say um these are my skills do you need them or this is what I can do or um what can we do um you know in terms of um funding or don't look you know black room operates and donations we we are very particular about where we spend our money as well I'm I've been working in health for over two two decades now and the thing that has was drummed into me in my very early in my studies when I was doing my social work double degree is around outcomes and impact not just outputs that the has that what you do has to make a difference so that's why for us our investment in this research is that this is this is not an output for us this is an outcome with the hope that there's going to be other outcomes here so we can create that impact you know the fact that we have you know some of the first baseline data around mental health and suicide ally for our community um again is one to be celebrated but also you know in 2022 this is where that has taken this long to get here um so you I would in your first instance um in your in your surrounding in the community or in the environment that you are um see what's operating there but I know this as well in in the creation of black rainbow is that we've had to take our lives online because at that our communities you know don't necessarily always accept us so we've taken our message online so if you don't have access you know if your community is online or in you don't you don't not aware what's in your your local community space by all means support us um you know your money goes towards um work that needs to be done everything that we do um there's a reason behind it um our graphics are really amazing our colors are really stand out um but there's a reason behind what we're doing and and there's about also the messaging around um that First Nations queer folk exist because a lot of folk don't know that we do um and also that there is um this this this this initialism with these funny letters lgbqti are really quite confusing for people and even um I know some non- Aboriginal heterosexual folk is like who are my my mates in school and they're like we have no idea what this language is or what gender affirming care is so we're using our position and our place and our visibility now reached to to provide that also for that education thanks Damien well unfortunately we're at the end of question time I think a few just came in at the last minute which always happens but I think a lot of what Damien just said now actually answers a lot of those last questions about resources and the best ways to connect with people including you Damien was just talking about uh online and obviously some of his findings suggest that Instagram is a great way to reach out of people uh next slide please so thanks again to Damien for everything that he spoke about this evening and being such a generous speaker and answering so many uh questions um in terms of resources uh that have been recommended by Damien there's lots of them available there including contact details of Black Rainbow which as we've spoken about many times is a great place to start the conversations even if that means Damien directly somewhere else I think it's a really important place to start and so you can see that on the resources tab and we'll also have this information coming up to you along with the slides uh as a follow-up to this webinar next slide please please please before you log out today um complete the survey reminder and you also get a prompt about that it's really helpful for a match being to learn what was done well and what we could do better or what you might like to learn more about in the future um your statement of attendance will come out um within the next month uh and we'll give you as I said that you know a link to the online resources that that have been compiled just to to support the webinar today um I'd also really like to emphasise which what we said at the beginning of today's webinar which is that this is the first of four of part of the Quiraburi series uh the next one's going to be on November the third and we'd love you to join us for that and the next one coming up after that will be in February next year Damien's already lined up some amazing speakers who will talk through a real diversity of topics in this area so I really encourage you to join in for that and the next mhpn webinar is coming up is one in partnership with emerging minds which is supporting children and families to recognise and navigate pediatric anxiety on September the 7th I got my email about that this morning so hopefully you did too and if you're interested we would really encourage you to sign up for that webinar as well just on um sorry the um the next Quiraburi webinar that's um the study at a WA that I would be referring to equal breaking the silence another groundbreaking study led by our First Nations pre-focus well and I think that's what's so important about this series is you know I'm not First Nations here and so that's you know a complex issue for me sitting here is the facilitator on Damien's invitation but you know each one is being determined by Damien and who he invites and the content is being determined and delivered by First Nations people so I think it's such a vital space and for people to be hearing about the latest research I mean today you're hearing about Damien's research that isn't quite out yet in the next couple of days it will be but really getting that cutting-edge information that otherwise may be hard to come by and but hopefully is really helpful to your service here on the screen we've got some other mhpn webinars that are coming up in the next month or two and we've also got a podcast series you can sign up through the mhpn portal to get more information about this you can obviously follow the twitter feed mhpn twitter feed to make sure you're hearing all the latest information and not missing out on anything next slide please so you probably know the work of the mhpn is support 350 networks across the country you can go to the mhpn website and check out any information there that has endless resources all these webinars are recorded and so obviously you can go back and watch them you can access the resources that support them so it's a wonderful free service that is provided for people to connect so before I close I'd like to acknowledge the lived experience people and carers who have lived with mental illness in the past and those who continue to live with mental illness in the present thank you to Damien again for such a wonderful webinar today and I hope everyone joins us into future episodes of queer operate thanks everybody really appreciate your time I think we've got just under a minute to go just to give a bit of a plug if you are looking for doing something for wear at purple day get on the black rainbow website grab one of our shirts we have a limited number and the shop shuts at midnight on Thursday night so we can get them to in time thanks again and I really appreciate you attending today