 So, they're obviously in control because they controlled game one pretty much from start to finish. They did. That's pretty hard to do at Denver where I will remind you the nuggets were 34 and 7 at home. Westbrook, the game now is not designed for him. It's designed for Clay, Steph, Kyrie, Lillard, shoot. Do you hear any players complaining about LeBron having control anywhere? You know why? Because it's been beneficial for all the players in the league. Chris Broussard here and welcome to the brand new Hoops on Fox podcast. This podcast will give you your daily dose of all things NBA from Fox Sports, including the best content from Skip and Shannon, Nick Wright, plus special guest, fresh NBA content from myself, post game interviews from NBA stars around the league, and much, much more. Up first, Chris Haines is with Colin Coward to break down the Russell Westbrook shooting slump and the potential for a Ben Simmons trade. Remember the family, great to have you and how are you? I'm doing fine. So I could have brought out the hammer on Westbrook this morning. I thought you were. But I did not. And I believe it is very hard in life. You're a 45 year old executive and all of a sudden 10 years ago, tech takes over the world and your son now, he's 15, he's on tech all day. He's on Fortnite all day, but a 48 year old executive, hey, be great at tech. I didn't grow up with tech. And so it's hard to pivot Westbrook. The game now is not designed for him. It's designed for Clay, Steph, Kyrie, Lillard, shoot. No mid range. I don't care. And I look at Westbrook and he's not a broken player. He's a hyper athletic guard who is a relentless athlete. You're going to tell me the next five years he's going to click and become a great shooter. It's not who he is. Derek Rose. That's not who Derek Rose is. There's part of me that feels bad for Westbrook. The game has moved in a different direction and it's not built perfectly for him anymore. You are being lenient here. I saw you tweeting last night and saying, what would you say? Wait, wait, wait. Is he hit a triple double? I was for sure you're going to be relentless this morning and vicious. Couldn't I argue though, you know, what do you do with Westbrook now? Okay. Let me say this. There's a point. But I will say this. There are still, I will still say, you know, the majority of the leagues, the majority of the point guards can't shoot like a Stephen Curry, like a Damian Lillip. So there's still, there's still a spot for players like such as Westbrook who has freakish athleticism, quick speed, burst of, you know, of everything. So I would just say this, it's still up to Westbrook as key points in the game to make the right play. And if you're not such a shooter, they don't shoot a lot of threes. Go in and attack. Be relentless on the glass. And I think the problem with him is that, look, that three-point ball is killing O.K.C. right now. They were never good at it. They were never. They've been awful. They're awful. And the fact that Portland is making so many, like threes hurt. Threes hurt. And when you can't match that, you can't combat that. There's a real problem. And then that deficit gets higher and higher. And so I think for Westbrook, look, you know, I get what you're saying. He's never going to be those type of guys when you're talking about Steph and Dane, but what he can do, do it to the best of his ability and stay away from shooting eight, seven, three pointers a game. And so if you want to be efficient in your own right, play your own game. That's all he has to do. Here's a criticism I would levy on Westbrook. I don't like the defensive effort. Most of all, Lillard's getting uncontested jumpers. Curry is left wide open. Some of this, is it possible, and I'm not just blaming Westbrook, that when your offense goes in the NBA, your defense can suffer because it gets into your head. I mean, let's be honest, defense matters, but it's probably a 75-25 split. Offense is more important than defense. I don't like Russell's defense. I don't like, okay, these defense, you're letting a good three point shooting team. Portland last night must have had seven wide open threes. Paying attention to detail has always been an issue of Russ, particularly you're talking about the defensive end. Because you look at, you know, look at his frame and everything, like there's no reason why he shouldn't be an all NBA defender out there from year to year. But he's not. And I don't know necessarily if it's his offense struggling on that end is why he's struggling on the defensive end as well. But you seeing it, like Seth Curry can't get off. He can't get wide open shots. You can't allow guys like Faruka Minu to hit three pointers on you. Those are demoralizing shots. And so that's what I'm saying. Like I get your point. You're being lenient, Kyle. Like you're evolving as a person, because you're talking about, you just mentioned that you're talking about 45-year-olds, can't adapt to time. You're adapting and changing and evolving because I was expecting, I thought I was going to defend Russ. I thought I was going to defend him. I thought you were coming with the heat today. But now I find myself, I got a pal on because of the lack of you not doing so. Yeah. I had the anvil in the car. I left it there. I just thought I thought, you know, it's easy today. He was minus 27, Lillard's plus 27. I could have brought up the anvil. Like I won the argument. The old, the old thing about the internet, they say Facebook won the internet. Stop arguing. I won the argument. Russ is hard to play with. He's not built for the playoffs. But in the end, I've just seen this so many times. I saw it with Derek Rose a lot. I'm like, the game's moving away from Derek Rose's strength. It's Ezekiel Elliott, the game moved right into his wheelhouse. He can cat, Lavian Bell. The game moved right into Lavian. Portland's not the fastest back. God, he's got great hands. And so all of a sudden, Lavian Bell goes from, yeah, he's a good runner. He didn't have breakaway speed. Oh my God, you get 85 catches, 200 carries. And let's move to this though. If Oklahoma City loses the series, and I don't think Portland's ever lost a series when they lead 2-0, Billy Donovan gets run, right? And I'm saying this, okay, at some point, Sam Presti had hardened, chose Westbrook, had Durant, didn't hug him, Victor Oledipo let him go. At some point, Billy Donovan's taking the hits here. There's one shooter on this roster. That's not Billy Donovan's fault. Is he going to get whacked? Look, they gave him extension before this season, you know, I was surprised that they did that. I saw it was I. Because I'm like, what did he do? What has the team done to warrant that? But at the same time, when you're talking about the holes that's in this roster, shoot, you need shooting. In this game today, if you don't have premium shooting, then you don't have a chance. Because threes add up. And when they keep adding up, that margin is a 10 point margin, 15 point margin, 20 point margin, it happens faster, faster than has ever happened in the game before. Oklahoma City is not built to go on a 14-nothing run. Portland is. Yes. You know, Golden State is. Boston can be. Houston can be. Utah's good, but they're not. The teams that don't shoot threes, it's hard to go on a 14-0 run. That used to be seven possessions. And that's why getting to your point, I think you were alluding to it. That's a management. That's not Billy Donovan's issue. That's not Billy Donovan. That's the kind of the way they constructed their team is the similar route and the way the Lakers went about doing business. Tough guys. Tough guys. Tough guys. Tough guys. Not enough shooters. By the way, listen, Hainsey, let's give me 30 seconds on camera here. Tonight's one of the greatest nights in America. You're not going to understand this. You're going to think of a weirdo. Tonight the NFL releases its schedule. I'm so glad my wife's under the weather. I don't have to entertain anybody. I can go home. That's mean. No, I love her to death. Just get upstairs. I got to watch this guy. I got to see who the Jaguars play. Tonight is the best night for nerds in America. I'm going to be sitting there all night just taking notes. You get to play when lost. It's the best. It's the best night. All right. Let's move to Chris Hain's. NBA guys are like, I don't get it. This is just a schedule. You lost me there. Okay. I was told last night from a source I really trust, Monty Williams interview with the Lakers. He is their number one choice. That doesn't mean he'll get the job because Monty's probably going to get the Sixers gig if they lose to Brooklyn or the Raptors. So let me just start with this. That means I think Ty lose the Lakers second choice. I think Ty lose going to get it. I was told last night, Chris, the Lakers are concerned about the optics that it's now LeBron's team. Have you heard stuff like that? I wrote that last week, actually, when Magic Johnson relieved themself. But yeah, that was always concerned. I was told, and I wrote that for Yahoo, I was told that when Magic and Polinky were compiling potential coaching candidates, then obviously they brought up Ty Ralu and Mark Jackson. And I was told at one point, Jeannie Buss said, I'm concerned with the perception of LeBron running things. This is a bus ran organization. We want to make sure that is clear. And so I understand all that, but at the same time, Colin, I think it's very important, especially where the Lakers are right now, it's very important to screw optics, screw perception, bring in the right candidate, bring in somebody who you think is going to be able to do this job at a high level and bring this franchise back to prominence. If optics and if perception is something that's concerning you and that's going to deter you from hiring the right guy, then I think that the Lakers franchise is going to continue to be in disarray. I want to go to the Warriors for a second, because I think Golden State's going to win that series. I think the Clippers, and I said this repeatedly through the season, they're really one of the best stories in the league this year. Milwaukee's a great story. The Clippers shouldn't be here. They traded their best player in the middle of the season. And in the last several years, they've traded their four best players, Chris Paul, Blake Griffin, Tobias Harris, and Deandre Jordan. They shouldn't be here. Lou Williams is their best player. I love Lou. He's your best player. You're probably not a playoff team. They are. Their bench is the best in the league. Doc Rivers has done a remarkable job. But I'm watching this Warriors Clippers series, and you know what I'm seeing, Chris? I'm thinking Kauai Leonard's looking at that team saying, man, the only thing they're missing is me. Could I make the argument that even losing this series by the Clippers, this has been an incredible advertisement as a free agent destination that we may have reached the tipping point with the lowly Clippers. They are now seen as a viable place to go for stars. I mean, even before the series started, you know, we all pick Golden State to advance. I actually picked Golden State to sweep them. You know, I have some Clippers execs killing me about that prediction. But hey, I think right now, the Clippers are putting themselves in great position, not just to lure Kauai, but have some other free agents, you know, start looking their way. Because they're one, you know, you can look at them in one piece away from going to that next level. I don't know if Kauai puts it to that next level of championship contending team, but definitely if you get Kauai signature, you got you going to get other guys on board willing to come over for cheaper. And they Clippers have cap space where they can get two max guys. So right now you look at it great coaching. They got a great culture. They got guys who play their roles and know, you know, know how to stay within themselves. Tremendous giving culture. Now, nobody's seeking minutes and points. Nope. So you bring a couple of stars on board all of a sudden the Clippers are in a place where they've never been before. Yeah, I think we're there. I want to talk about a team that is fascinating for a lot of reasons. The Philadelphia 76ers. Now they're not really a national story yet, but I find them to be absolutely fascinating. I think outside of the Warriors, they have the best talent in the league, slightly over Boston and Houston. You have the Manny William situation. Brett Brown, when I watch the sixers play, I don't know what I'm getting night to night. I don't know what I'm getting night to night with Simmons. Jimmy Butler doesn't get along with people. If I said to you one year from today, what are the sixers? First of all, do you think they beat Brooklyn? I do. I think their size is too much. I think they do. I think they've got a chance against Toronto. But a year from now, who is in Philly and who is not in Philly? Because this team's got four legitimate high-end players. That's a good question. You know, obviously they gave up a lot to acquire Tobias Harris and Jimmy Butler. No question. So it's hard to believe that they will let even one of those guys walk away in free agency this summer. With that being said, I think they bring back one of those guys. And if I had to pick, probably they bring back Tobias. So this time next year, I think Jimmy Butler is probably somewhere else. That's just my thoughts. I'm going to throw something at you. You trade Simmons. Now, it sounds crazy. I'll have my big and I have two pretty good shooters on the wing. You can get a ton for Ben Simmons. Ben Simmons does not, I've been told, get along great with teammates. He didn't make the Australian national team. Now, I'm not saying this because I don't like Ben Simmons. But if you look at Ben Simmons' game, I don't think it fits Embiid. And Jimmy Butler doesn't fit anybody. I'm just throwing this out there. If you had Embiid, your center anchor is there. You have two athletes, Butler and Tobias on the wing. You need more shooters, JJ Reddick's aging. Is it impossible to think they'd make that move? I don't think Simmons fits their team. I don't see them making that move within a year's time. Because I think you've got to let Ben, let the maturation process evolve. Look, this is the thing. Ben wants to be a point guard. And he can't handle that position. He thrives in that position. But in that position nowadays, you need spacing at that position. He's somebody who's reluctant to shoot. And so I think it's going to get to a point that if Ben Simmons, if they don't trade Ben Simmons, if he's a mainstay there, he has to obviously develop some range. But also he has to be open to moving to the small force spot. So then you can have a shooter at the point guard spot and shooting guard spot. So because they really, Jimmy Butler and Tobias, they're decent, but they're not. You need premium shooters. Yeah, this Philadelphia is a really fascinating team. I don't think these pieces work. And I love three of the pieces I love. And Ben Simmons and Butler are unbelievable talents. Next, Steven Jackson joins making CC to dissect the possibility of Tyloo coaching the Lakers. I'm just fed up with the LeBron too much control. I mean, who should they give control to in the organization? But do you hear any players complaining about LeBron having control anywhere? You know why? Because it's been beneficial for all the players in the league. He's done it for, it just hasn't been beneficial for him. The moves he's been making since he's been in the league has been beneficial for every player in the league. So like CC said, if I had a conversation with anybody on the Lakers and Kobe's not there, it has to be LeBron. Nobody else is smarter in the organization about basketball. I'm gonna go back to it, because you know I'm always the real one. They just upset that LeBron has been in control of his career since day one and he's a young black man that knows his worth. That's basically what the problem is. And to your point about how he's, players don't complain, you're not talking about just his teammates. No one. He has created, he has shifted the power dynamic within the NBA from team to player. It was, the big three in Boston was put together by Jenna's friend Danny H. My God. Since then though, the major moves in the league have been player initiated. They have been, it was LeBron's move the first time, the second time for whether people liked their not Kevin Durant's move and the Kawhi Leonard last year, the Anthony Davis attempted to this year and the way they have shifted that. Now on this specific instance, unless and until the Lakers hire Sam Presti or R.C. Buford or Bob Myers or anyone who actually knows how to run an NBA front office and has shown that ability, then of course they should lean on LeBron to a degree. But I don't even think they're leaning on him in this coaching search. I think it's just narrative. I think it's just optics. I think it's just, well, LeBron has the relationship with Ty Luzo. If we hire him, how will that look? And what better option do they have? I mean, because for me, especially with the basketball team, which I have seen that a player can immediately become a coach, can immediately become an executive, can immediately go and work in television because there's so many things that basketball, because you're learning all those things. As a football player, you only basically know one side of the ball. So you don't see that transition. So basketball players, they've been dominant in the NBA from a player to coach to front office standpoint for 40 years. LeBron is a basketball savant. Forget if you like him, forget if you don't. And Shaquille O'Neal told me this. I went to a practice with the Cavs and he sat me down. Here we go. Yeah. Stim the lights. Yeah, young boy. Smartest basketball player I've known. Remember the sets, you don't see the coach was calling some LeBron, called out their plays and everything. This was just in a regular practice before the championships and all that. So we need to give LeBron credit for the type of basketball mind that he has. He has the type of basketball mind in 30 years. If he's not Jerry West, I'll be shocked. So what does that mean? Does that mean that the Lakers should just go out and hire Tai Lu, bring him in? They want a title with him. He gets LeBron, LeBron respects him. Is that what we're all sort of gearing towards? And for some reason, Jeannie Buss doesn't want to do that. Well, I mean, if she wants to win, she has to have, she has to cater to LeBron because then the day he's gonna get this ship going. The guys is gonna come play, they're gonna come play because of LeBron. The guys are gonna buy into Tai Lu. They're gonna buy in because LeBron buy in. Everything goes through LeBron. So you have to bring in the coach. You have to bring in the players. You have to go through him if you're not using COVID. The reason why they have to give LeBron more power is because on the initial, on the initial engagement, LeBron gave them all the power. LeBron came to Los Angeles without the recruitment. Man, he could have went on a world tour. I'm going here. I'm going here. I'm going to Philadelphia. Man, I need to talk to Joel M. B. To the San Antonio. He could, San Antonio, for me, I was like, man, let's go. Let's talk the pop at least. No, he didn't. Sadness, palatial estate, Magic Johnson had the address. Pools up to the front. No worries, no courting, no dating, no, and none of that. LeBron and LeBron in his contract demands gave them the no trade, gave it back. Right. I'm gonna give you a max deal for years. That's the max he could do. Gave them those things. So LeBron gave them control. Now in trying to get this organization back on the right track, they need to be able to give some of that control back to LeBron. And that's the normal way of doing business in the NBA. Short-sighted people and businesses are concerned about optics. Smart businesses are concerned about results. I'm gonna use you as an example for a moment. When you were, I don't know this for a fact, but I got a real good feeling. When you were first trying to get into broadcast and get into TV, I guarantee there was an executive in a room somewhere that hadn't seen you on TV, didn't know. They're like, ah, what are people gonna say if we hire the, wasn't they involved, they didn't need a punch of fan? Wasn't there an incident outside of Strip Club with a gun? And I'm sure there was the optics of hiring Steven Jackson and somebody smart in that room said, man, that's a two-day headline on a stupid blog. What we are going to get is good results on television for two years. And so they, I don't know, took a chance to write a word, but they went with it and it paid off. The optics on hiring Tyloo is a Bill Plashke column in Los Angeles Times. For five minutes in a grand scheme of things. I can read you the headline right now. Welcome to the world of the Los Angeles LeBrons. And it's a story about how it's his franchise and how Dr. Buss would be fine. If you went 55 games and you're in the Western Conference Finals, none of it matters. And if you hire Bill Walton to replace Luke Walton and you win 35 games, none of it matters. Like, it is what is the best move. And if someone, people give me a hard time, they think I have an ulterior motive with Tyloo. I know Ty little bit, but I'm not in friends with Ty. I have no real deep relationship with Tyloo. Present me a better option. Yeah, you're also not saying this is the best option, but if it is, you should be able to go for it. If there is, if Terry Stotz gets fired, if the Blazers go from 2-0 to 4-2 and he loses, and he gets fired in Portland, and someone says, hey, I think Terry, I'll listen to that. You bring me an established coach with, Stotz doesn't even have it, with a championship pedigree or a deep playoff pedigree, I'll listen to it. But if it's John Howard, who I don't know, Manny Williams, who, or the other options that we've heard, Jason Kidd, Tyloo's the best option. It's an added bonus. He won a championship. Oh yeah, with LeBron. Now, Gilbert Arena's his back with Christine Lehi to describe his time in the NBA. Does it bother you in general that you're not more widely recognized as one of the best scorers in the last 20 years? No, because it was, I didn't really get to, it's like I caught fire, but didn't get to really capitalize on it. For what I did, for people to still remember me, is beyond me, to be honest. Like, you know, three years. It's, that's it, it was three years. You know, it's like really, and in two years of real greatness. So it's like, I didn't really get to, I got hurt at 25, so I didn't really get to see, you know, like what Curry's seeing now, what Durant's seeing, what, you know, James Harden sees, you know, it's like, you know, I didn't get to that level. So it's like, for you to still know me, it's kind of like, well, okay, I appreciate it. But you know, I don't look at like, somebody said, you're gonna be a Hall of Fame. I was like, no, I didn't really get to, I didn't really get to expand on what I did. It was just a quick in and out. Following Skip and Shanda's sec, the Spurs lost to the Nuggets after losing a 19 point lead. The control of this series. Spurs. Oh, you've seen a lot. Want to say that louder? They're so light. Really? So faint. The Spurs. Thank you. You know who it is. They're not the Spurs, they're the Spurs. It made me sick, and I'm glad. Cause I knew you were gonna come here and gloat today, and they've been up too old. The Spurs are in control because they did what they wanted to do. To say the series doesn't start to their role team win on the opposing team. And it started early. It started the first game. So you going back home, Coach Popovich, sure he would like to be greedy. Take sweet stakes, win both games, and he was in position to do that up 19. But to go back to your building for two games and your split one-one, Coach Popovich has to feel well. They played well. DeMarco Rosen and Lamarco Soldridge, they've had no answer for those two guys. Lamarco Soldridge had it going Skip, and then he only took one shot in the fourth quarter. Had two points. DeMarco Rosen kept it going. But they let Jamal Murray, I think Derrick White must have, he must have stubbed his toe or something because Jamal Murray lit him up. 21 made this a series. Now they need to go on down to San Antonio, get one of those games, make it another series, so you can seven and not win by case of due, like I proposed to. But anyway, the Spurs are in control. They did what they needed to do. They went, they got one of these two games. Now they're going home. If they're serious to lose. So I thought you told me the Spurs weren't even going to make the playoffs to start with. Skip, I said. You guaranteed me that Denver's going to win this series, but now you're conceding. Are you conceding the bat? No, no, no, I'm not conceding the bat. Oh. I said the Spurs are in control. They are. Oh, interesting. They're in the cat bird scene, the proverbial cat bird scene. Oh, got it, got it. So they're obviously in control because they controlled game one pretty much from start to finish. That's pretty hard to do at Denver, where I will remind you, the Nuggets were 34 and seven at home. Guess what? That was the best home record in all of the NBA. Yes, it was. So the Spurs went in there and controlled game one, and then they controlled game two twice because they had two 19 point leads last night. They had one with eight 28 left in the second quarter. That's pretty good. And four 28 left in the third quarter, 19 and 19. And what happened? You know what happened? The Nuggets are a really good team. They're a really talented team. They're probably more talented than the Spurs are. Probably. They're a little younger, but they're probably a little more talented. And they were obviously the more desperate team, and my team took foot off gas, as Golden State did at home the other night, and bad things started to happen. We took your foot off the gas. Oh, so now you're a wee, but you say we. I mean the Nuggets, the Nuggets did. All right. Yeah, we, I played in Denver. So Jamal Murray owed his team because he missed a crucial late shot in game one in their building. They would've tied it, right? Yes, we would've tied the game. I think it was for the win, as I recall. It wasn't. I think it was for the win. Okay, yeah. But he missed, as Jenny pointed out, his first eight shots last night, and I was highly impressed. He just willed home his team in ways, cause he can really shoot it in ways. Russell Westbrook can't shoot his team back into games. Jamal Murray just got going, and once he got going, he went twilight zone hot. He went crazy hot. And to your point about Derek White attempting to guard him, what they started to do was, they put a man who's literally a Rocky Mountain by himself, the Joker. They put Yokeych out on the perimeter picking for him, and just knocked Derek White down time after time again. And Ernestine Turnamy said, is it legal for him to be that big? I said, yeah. Cause he's, he's like a monster, she kept saying. He's a monster. Yes. He's just too big, right? Can you be that big? That thick, that heavy, and that agile? But you know what Skip? In this comeback, the guy that, I'm gonna mention three guys before I get to Yokeych, obviously Jamal Murray went crazy in the fourth quarter, but Gary Harris Jr. in the third quarter. He saved him. 14, cause yeah, this was about to get out of hand, Skip, and he kept them close, and they ended up winning the third quarter by three points. And Paul Millsap. Hmm. He's beastie too. They call that foul on him. That wasn't a foul that he did on Aldrich Skip. You know that too. So you're hanging on every possession of Spurs games. I thought you said they were broccoli. I thought you said you can't watch them. And now, you know what? I think you're turning into a closet Spurs game. No, I'm not. But I know we were gonna talk about this game especially. Things were not looking very good for me early on, especially in that third quarter when they were down 19. I was like, man, Skip got to be the lucky. I said, why can't I win a bet against him? I said, this is the luckiest man alive. Why don't he go to Vegas? He should have put down 100,000 on Tiger to win. Yeah. I should have. Cause you lucky. There's my way. I'm just smart. Skip, no, no, no, you're not smart. There's no way you should have won a bet in which a team was down 31 points. You should not have won that bet. So stop saying. I liked the Clippers to win that game. I just didn't know how. Skip, they were down 31 points to the defending champs with the best player and the finals MVP two times. And they came from 31 down. You know, you know, you're supposed to have conceded that. You're supposed to call me. You keep telling me Kevin Durant's way overrated. No, no, no. I can't tell, but I just want to know one thing. Let that had been LeBron James. And his team lost to 31 points. And he always starts back to LeBron. Ooh, we ain't beating Steph Curry up in Draymond like we would have done LeBron. If that had been LeBron lost to 31 point lead as the number one seed to a seed. I agree. And didn't talk to the media. It didn't talk to them. Oh, Kevin Baylor. This is what I'm talking about. This is my drama. Kevin Durant has two feet out the door. And those are two big feet. Yeah, that's the toxicity that's around Kevin Durant, huh? Is that the toxicity we talking about? I got some toxicity in the locker room. I think they got a little dissension. I think there's a lack of trust. Like he's just going to jilt us and leave. Well, you got some more toxicity coming on Friday. Don't play again Friday. When the nugs play y'all again? Thursday. Thursday. Y'all about to catch up another. Oh, well now, you just said that they're in control. They are! What are you trying to do, the reverse? No, no, no, no, no, no. You guys are controlled. I don't know which side of your mouth you're talking about. You're going home, you're tied, you are in control. But I want you to catch up. Well, you wanted, but are you predicting it? No, I'm not predicting it. Oh, okay, thank you. They're going seven games. What did I tell you before this series started? This will be the toughest of the three series that San Antonio is about to play. The three series. The younger middle three, you're not playing three. This is a hard one. This is tough. This is seven versus two. They are the two seed for a reason. And last night, I would have won if the referees And don't do that. Wait a second. If the referees hadn't allowed the home crowd, and you know that crowd, it gets loud there, the crowd began to control the referees' whistles. And the turning point of that game, because it was still right there to be one, with 441 left in the basketball game. Could we see what happened to Bryn Forbes as he tried to stroke another beautiful three from the perimeter? Boom! He gets knocked down. They went Broncos on him. They went, it was like a Broncos double team. He tried to sell it. He didn't try to sell it. He got knocked down by two of them and they swallowed their whistles. That ain't Clay Thompson. That's not Steph Curry. He didn't get that call. You know what? James Harden would have gotten four free throws on that. Four. They would have said you get four free throws because you got knocked down. Bryn Forbes hasn't earned that kind of call. So what happened within seconds? Greg Povich, because Jamal Murray eventually made another shot and it was going crazy. So he tried to run up the sideline and catch a ref's attention to call time out. And the ref turned and said, get back in your box. You know who gave him that tech? The only guy to throw LeBron James out of the game. Is that that? Change fifth journal. I told you he gonna get you. You loved it. That's LeBron. LeBron has to know better. Pop needs to know better. Not to mess with Kane. He teed him up. Not to mess with Kane. He teed him up. He teed LeBron up. It completely changed the game. The floodgates opened after this right here. You're watching what happened. Get him Kane. You say, how can you tell me to get back in my box? I'm trying to call time. That's Kane. I'm trying to get your attention. The citizens Kane. Citizen Kane, okay. Way to go. I don't like when it shifts the momentum though, because then the whole game, the whole game just went crazy. You can't be running out on the court. You can do just to get their attention. They're going up the court. Hey, I want time. I want time. Time out. Time out. What are you doing to me? I like the way Air Malloy do it. Air Malloy do that thing quiet. Yeah. Little tiny teeth. Yeah. Air Malloy. Nothing like these there. Well, the referee's choked last night, but it's okay. No, no, stop doing that skill. Yeah, because we proved to Denver we could have two 19-point leads in the same game on their home floor. And collapsed. And collapsed. No, we just got shot off. No, you got collapsed. Yeah. Say it with me. It was like Ray Allen reborn. No, we're not doing the Ray Allen. Is it a Ray Allen? You went Ray Allen. No, he did. Yeah, he did. I've never seen anything like it. First of all, Ray on the hip, like one shot in that fourth quarter. So stop. And you know what, speaking of Derrick White's defense, how about his offense? What do I tell you? This team goes as Derrick White goes. Do you see what your stats tell you? Yeah. He shot 11 times last night and made seven of them. Yes. He shot one time in the fourth quarter. You're talking about Lamarcus. How about Derrick White getting the ball in his hands? You know what? He's tired. No, he's not tired. Yes, he did. You see what Jamal Murray, that altitude, tried to come up and fight through that pit? Let him, because he held off the first rush at the first 19 points, he was the one who shot them right back. I get it, he dunking on people. I'm like, oh, look at Lil Derrick White. You can stroke those threes too. Actually, I got a cousin named Derrick White. Do you really? I do. Okay. And can he dunk? I don't know. Can't dunk. How should I put this? Right now, he's in Club Med. Oh, one of those. Okay. Well, sorry about that. Yeah, he'll be sorry. He should have been sorry before he did what he did. But that's not the hurdle there. I think game four, I might bet you on game four. I feel the nukes gonna be that one. They better get one of these, or they're gonna be done, man. No, we don't. We go back, win, and then we go back, you win game six, and then we game seven. Finally, Matt Barnes at Catino Mobilear with Whitlock and Wiley to break down the Katie versus Patrick Beverly rivalry. He's apologizing for disappointing his owners, his coach, but after the game, he kind of was a little feisty and sane. He kind of enjoyed getting into it with Patrick Beverly. Question, do you like KD's attitude here? I like his attitude now. I like his attitude in the moment. I thought it was a lighthearted tussle. And it lasted three, four quarters, but I think the referees kind of took it a different way than the spirit of what they were engaging. One, that is Patrick Beverly, and two, KD did everything with a smile. So it never got to a point where I thought, oh my God, this is going to boil over into some issues. But I do like him taking a deep breath, realizing what this fan base is doing, hanging on to his every word and breath. Is he staying? Is he going? So everything gets translated in that lens. And he's like, yeah, you know what? I'm here for y'all. It may not only be a couple more months, but you know what? Let me respect y'all in this moment. Led the league in technicals during the regular season. Did he get suspended? Led, he's got two, one game into the playoffs, five, and five more in soccer. They use up all the time they can. You use up all the time out she got, but you don't go too far. He didn't go too far and get suspended. You know how you've been around people before, Matt? All of us, right? You've been around people before where you have you and your group of guys, right? And it gets rowdy and y'all loud. And y'all may be saying some derogatory stuff, not like the racist stuff, but just cursing at each other, being guys. And then people that's not around you guys, they get like nervous, like, well, you guys okay? Right? I think that's what the referees did, because where we're from, you talk crap to each other. It brings, it builds the energy. So I have no problem with that. Now, listen, if that game was close, I seriously doubt Kevin would have done that. You're up about 20, right? Like, Patrick Beverly is like a little, he's like a fly, he's a net. He bothers you so much, but yet we're used to that. He's from Baltimore, DC, that area, where we're from, you like to talk crap. And then that he got caught up in that. I don't, you know, I don't feel there's something wrong with that. I mean, for me, it's, the refs are always overreacting. I mean, like you said, this is, this was lighthearted spirit of the game. The fans loved you. So when Katie got kicked out, his teammates were all for him. I like it from a standpoint of, you know, he's letting Patrick Beverly know all these little antics you have going on aren't going to work. And like Kat said, if it was a closer game, Katie wouldn't, wouldn't have got, I guarantee he wouldn't have that second take and got kicked out. But I like him just letting them know, like, you know, you can do all you want. I still have my normal night, you know, I shot 50%, 25 points, you know, five assists, three rebounds, whatever the stat line was, it was pretty consistent. And they were up my 20. So, you know, what Pat Beverly does, doesn't always show up on the stat sheet. You, you want a person like that on your team, but I mean, he's guarding the best player in the world. So he's going to have to do more than that. How can we not argue that Patrick Beverly didn't win here though? He got KD tossed out of a game. He now has two technical files. KD fell for the bait. Oh yeah, definitely. I ain't, look, somebody, I don't play chess, somebody told me, hey, a pawn took out a bishop and that's big. I mean, so I was like, okay, respect to that. I think if the game was closer, it would have never happened. Like, that's how you don't win. KD, KD led the league in text, but KD's very calculated. He might go the rest of the playoffs and not get one more tech. I feel that. You know what I mean? So I just think two techs is a big, if you look at the big picture. The guy that led the league in technicals, if you had to bet, you think he's getting no more technicals than the playoff. I seriously doubt he'll get, what you're doing, now what you're doing, you're playing with the words. He won't, for real, no. He won't get technicals when games are that tight. I don't think that will happen. He's not a Draymond Green. And he understands the history of what it did for the Golden State Warriors a few years back. Yeah, and I think, like I said, even though he led the league in text, they were calculated. I think he knew what he, I used to have calculated techs. I knew if I did something, I was gonna get a tech and I knew what it would do for my team around, up and down, whatever the situation would be. And I know KD's the same way. He knows he's too important to be at it against when it matters, but the last game didn't matter. When you're the best player on your team, two-time finals MVP, I'm just not sure you should be taking these kind of risks. And y'all said he's not Draymond Green. The longer he stays in Golden State, the more he starts to look like the seven-foot shooting Draymond Green. I mean, you do admit his personality has changed. For the better. For the better. Thank you. Can you say that, Matt? For the better. You know what I mean? He was always kind of in his own little bubble before, and I think Draymond brought it, like this is who KD has always been. I think Draymond brought it out of him, but I don't see it as the bad thing. I see it as I'm the best player. When I wanna talk, I'm gonna talk. When I need to play, I'm gonna play, but he just let Patrick Beverly know like we're not going with this. Great point by Matt. How about this? LeBron James for so many years, just about a few years back, he started saying that he was the best. I mean, it's been 16 years. We all know he's the best. One of the best things smoking, right? Like sliced bread, just amazing. No, now he's saying it now, you could have been saying that then too. KD, he's growing up, and I'm not gonna let you keep bashing me every single time for all these years, and then now I'm not gonna keep saying none. No, I'm gonna say I am the best, not what you're gonna do. And it's smart in the first playoff game. Look, it's a series that more than likely, we all know they're gonna beat the clip. But I got a tone setting moment. Coaches just always say, I need a tone setter. Like go out there, and he knew it wasn't gonna have impact on the game. We're still gonna win, but I'm gonna let you know Patrick Beverly, I'm gonna let the whole playoff snow. You're not gonna keep bullying me. It ain't coming that way. He's stepping into Draymond's lane. That was Draymond's role. No, not necessarily. Only reason you say that is because he's on Draymond's team. If he wasn't on Draymond's team, you wouldn't say it like that. You wouldn't even compare the two like that. But because he's with Draymond and DeMarcus, right? Like, oh, you know what? Yeah, you are kinda like that too. Nah, listen, he is one A, one B best player in the league. So that's great. But I'm saying that's great. He can also make mistakes. Everyone does. And get caught up in, again, just remember what that team is, because of Boogie, because of Draymond. I'm not sure if I want KD, my best player, setting that tone. Let Boogie and Draymond be the emotional ones. But those two are different than KD. Like Matt said, KD will not do that when that game is started. It means more when KD does it. I mean, everyone's coming to him. So when you have that person coming back at people, it means more, you know what you're gonna get from Boogie and Draymond. Sometimes wildcard, you gotta pull him back. But KD was smiling the whole time. I like, he jumped in his face and laughed. You know what I mean? Like I said, if it was an important game or it was back and forth, it wouldn't have happened. But like I said, I calculated. Y'all got kids. Y'all got kids. And when kids do little bad things, that oh, and then you just, do you sit around and go, oh, they won't do it when it really matters. No. No, I know where you're going, but you know what I do respect it. It's probably like it's KD doing it and not Draymond. And Draymond would have responded with like, here you go again. He has to learn. KD doing it out of character. My bad kid actually doing something good or the good kid doing something bad. He's not out of character. He led the league in touch. He shot 50% that game. Steph and Curry had 40, he's shooting from 40 feet out. It was a fun thing and he's laughing when he's doing it. It was more of a like Sunday play early in the morning. But set the tone, set the tone, set the tone for the whole series, for this series and the rest of the play. I'm not going for it. I'm not gonna have it. And now that's gonna get Draymond and Boogie more protective now. Like I'm gonna take, if anything else comes your way, we got you. Yeah, I can't believe, why wouldn't we see it as Patrick Beverly set the tone? No. How, how's he set the tone? What tone? What tone is he set? Do you hear the winds? Yeah. First of all, are they down three or one? Was this a pivotable moment? No. Patrick Beverly, you're not doing nothing. He didn't set the tone. I didn't even see him. I can get in KD's head. Patrick Beverly's head was at his waist. He wasn't even bobbled him up though. Patrick Beverly. And he been loving him. He says it's Arkansas. All them games, they boy. That's all he got. That's all he got. Draymond and LeBron are cool. But LeBron baited Draymond into some dumb stuff in the NBA finals and it cost him a championship. Thank you for listening to the Hoops on Fox podcast. Don't forget to subscribe and leave a five star review, letting us know what you think of the show.