 Oh, there was it was the issue was the room mic. Yeah, what happened was I hadn't plugged in my mixer for the Alpha Geek radio stream But I had launched the broadcast tool So when I plugged in the mixer the broadcast still didn't pick it up I went ahead and went live so the broadcast tool was like when there's no mixer what mixer? I'm just gonna use the mic on the laptop And that's why they weren't hearing you But it was why I was like looking down like I I hear him I see his levels went I should I've done that before I don't know why I didn't figure that out faster getting old, but Justin losing a step dude We all do yeah wolves come for us all. Yeah, they're right. They're on my heels Dippin at the heels. Hey Everybody thanks for watching. Hey, what's up friends? We do this pre-show now on purpose I know Sergeant Muffin's like hey, you don't have to start early the thing catches you really fast now these days, which I appreciate But so many of you said, you know what I really enjoy a little pre-show banter So they're Joker do that for you Well, not you because you don't like it. I understand you can skip forward. It's fine. Hey, by the way I've also become very obsessed with Sticker pricing. So if you ever want to have a conversation about sticker pricing, yeah And all day like the sweet price point you found trying to find that perfect price point is balancing out volume of stickers. Yeah So you get your your demand or PPS down right right? It's not exactly well demand price per sticker Yeah, it's actually not terrible because it's it's gonna stay fine. It's like it's gonna go bad, right? But you want to maximize it you want to get that demand up as high as possible I mean sure. Yes, but that ultimately the big things that don't move are postage Packaging So you want to gather an attractive package That is her sticker. Here's here's a sticker secret. I would like to know. Yeah, do you meter or do you just use stamps? I just use stamps. Okay, would it save you anything to meter? Is that like the floor is stamps and so there's no point because we All right, wait by meter, what do you mean? Like you can get the little meters and then it tells you exactly how much to pay per envelope Versus just going with the stamp. Oh, yeah. No. Well, I have like I'm working on the dymo thing, but I Don't think that there's really like you can't get less than then the first-class stamp. Yeah Gotcha I guess you can get If you can do bulk There's there's carrier route sort. I don't know what that is. I'm just saying things that might I mean listen This is the rabbit. Oh Darren knew this when I was talking to him I went to him for his sticker expertise and he was like listen. It's a dark rabbit hole And the postal system We'll pick up sticker talk after the show. Are you ready? Go? Let's do this Here we go Podcasts about technology in your daily lives from people who like to put pants on frogs and one guy with a trustworthy looking beard The Daily Tech News show with Tom Merritt is brought to you by you and I at Daily Tech News show comm slash donate Well, it feels different feels I made it crunchy. This is the Daily Tech News show for Thursday, May 12th 2016 I'm Tom Merritt. I got a new mixer Justin Robert Young. Hey, well You've got an old friend in me so we can News together Excellent. Yeah, we're gonna talk about Apple's Pivot There was a very interesting article on about Avalon comm which is really just a site run by Apple analyst Neil Seibart about The R&D budget of Apple and why no one's really talking about it and well now everybody's talking about it So we're gonna talk about it to give you our perspective about Apple and cars, but let's start with a look at the headlines Google launched a keyboard for iOS Thursday Google launched a keyboard for iOS Just in case that's not quite syncing in called G board, of course It includes swipe typing which is common on a lot of keyboards easy access to GIFs Emoji search so you don't have to go. Where is the fish flag? You just type fish flag Google search of course has a button of its own that you can activate and then search without even exiting the keyboard search results show up as Cards that can then be tapped to paste a link into whatever you're typing And you can also use the paste button from iOS to add the card itself into say a text message You know, I feel like we're kind of getting back to the good old days, right like yeah How so Google has a vested interest in making best-in-class iOS Software which is where so much of the initial success of iOS came from with you know maps being something that was very very good Obviously you are still Use I mean Google Maps now is an app right and they they've never stopped developing for it, but That this you know, this is something that I'm very excited about I just went ahead and downloaded the GIFI keyboard get out of here now This is going to be a way better and easier way that I can do what I want on these keyboards It's also another win for iOS Loosening up the restrictions on the keyboards and saying hey you want to know what this is an element that we are now an element of our Platform that we are secure enough that you can let some wacky stuff in there And if something goes awry, you are not going to blame iOS as a platform although as loose as they went a Couple years ago when they had the keyboard thing and I still have problems where oh wait My keyboard isn't showing up in this particular situation or wait. How did I switch back to the default keyboard? What happened so it's not it's not like it should be where you just say this is my default keyboard Make that the default keyboard everywhere. No, and and it is certainly not user Intuitive to hit like oh the globe is what brings me to other keyboards That makes a lot of sense because when I think typing I Think of a world of typing and therefore I press the globe. Yeah, but but but you're right No, it's it's kind of cool to see Google making a really good keyboard for iOS. Hey, man Maybe someday I have OS and make a keyboard. No, that'll never happen. I mean come on. Yeah, that's that's great That's pushing it too far. Hey, you want to know what Apple? Will do is okay faster Bloomberg reports that Apple has reduced approval time for new submissions to the App Store from a mean of 8.8 days one year ago to a mean of 1.95 days Today now this Bloomberg article does point out that the number of app submissions is probably pretty steady these days So it's easier to to build a system around it, but that does a pretty good reduction no matter what So lump this in with some of the rumblings that you had with the podcasting Store and and and big podcast All right We're we're you know rattling the gates of of Apple saying hey you want to know be a better partner to us. I Feel like if there is and we're gonna get a lot more into the future of Apple and certainly it might not rely on Services, but it is encouraging that in this pipeline, which obviously is very important to them money-wise You know people who are buying apps is a huge way that they can keep Iowa's fresh And is a revenue stream for them that they actually made progress on it. This is a this is a a developer Friendly move that they apparently have taken a concerted effort and have now made better Certainly, this is inside baseball for me and you but we can certainly hope that maybe that extends out to things that are a Prestige project and not necessarily something that makes the money like pot. Yeah, for sure and and granted They make money off the app store, but it is a small percentage of the money they make It's not insignificant. I'm not trying to belittle it, but I'm saying like this This isn't where they make their bread and butter, but they are devoting Some energy into making it a better developer experience to keep people on the platform. That's fair That's a good thing to do and a large element of wherever they go hardware-wise If they always want to be the guys who make the great hardware and platforms, they will always rely on developers They need you to take care of developers This was a long overdue way to do that for so many. Yeah, and I guess my point is the yeah There's some money there, but that's not they're not doing it just for the money They're doing it for the little I mean, I only said money just to differentiate between they make yeah on amount of money doing apps They make zero money with Opera's latest developer version of its browser for Windows and OS 10 now features a power saving mode They hit just keep on coming from opera Again, this is in the developer version opera claims the mode can increase battery life as much as 50% Compared to chrome or older opera versions by reducing background activity and page redraw frequency as well as changing the way video Playback works the mode automatically turns on when you unplug your laptop if it tells you're on battery power Just switches into that power saving mode for you So what's the deal? I mean are we just gonna get a pony is opera just gonna say like hey Give us your address. We'll also give you a pony. Yeah, I would expect that is the next announcement They're like hey, we're about to be bought by Chinese investors who wants a pony. We're supposed to spend the cash Who's got who wants it? Yeah, I just feel like that's some point at opera There was a whiteboard of stuff They'd like to do and then as soon as this developer merger and and this merger kind of came along or this this buyout came along They just started the the red pen got lost and and the green pen became all that anybody could write with and everything got a check It was like opera like I'm sure the project managers gave me into the development VPN gets developed Yeah, absolutely Humanize as a 799 dollar virtual reality camera called the views up for pre-order Camera has eight lenses two on each side of the square device and you can capture 360 degree video in 4k the camera comes with a software suite that stitches together the video and lets you add filters to edit shipping starts in October this is a very weird time for this kind of product time Yeah, we got we got all kinds of stuff that came out of Mobile World Congress came out of CES We've got a lot of people doing very inexpensive 360-degree cameras that only use two sensors and of course we also have I'll just go ahead and tell you about it the $15,000 version if you had that to spend You've been approved by GoPro and you might be seeing your 16 camera GoPro for Odyssey Arriving soon GoPro told the Verge that the first few have shipped To the first people in their limited access program. That's mostly VR companies VR production companies GoPro says it's still accepting applications though and shipping out rigs and waves as they're made so I Guess what views is trying to say is hey, we're better than those two camera sensors We're gonna have a pretty quality thing here. We're gonna give you some stitching software So it's not entirely, you know the cheapest approach you could take but you don't have to spend $15,000 So here's you know GoPro is for many in in in many ways the industry standard for Professional VR now there there are rigs that you then run through a stitching program the problem with all of these is that unless you are getting paid And and and I I take this from having worked with Discovery Digital for the VR videos that we did with Brian Unless you have money on the other end of people saying hey go do this in VR for us These are not products being created for end users in mind. It's not like You know for example, let's say obviously Facebook live video is a big thing Periscope is a big thing if you developed a camera for that specifically you are now developing Hardware to solve a specific solution There was the all the millions of super cheap high-definition cameras that came out for vlogging or Personal photography and stuff like that. They were use cases for these things to exist I get the $15,000 one on some level because you can then say hey look Brands we have the best and brightest equipment that we are going to shoot your hashtag content on I don't quite know where the $800 one Steps in unless you are very interested in doing Something that is that is sub that or you want to get started in in in brain. Yeah, it's the it's the enthusiast It's the prosumer and and views is making a gamble saying hey if we can get some people using this Then as that crowd grows hopefully we'll have a name out there that people get passed around like you know I got that views camera and they have a new one out. That's even better and cheaper and whatever now. I mean I Think for that you are certainly seeing you you've had a lot I mean I think more so than I would have expected hullabaloo around both The Oculus Rift and more specifically the Vive in terms of user experiences if for whatever reason Original video content becomes something that is interesting for people who have those devices then I can see an $800 Device being something that yeah And that's the gamble right is like YouTube allows 360 degree now Facebook is allowing 360 degree And of course you've got the the Oculus and the and the red rifted error in the vibe and you've got PlayStation VR coming They're wanting to get that out on the market. Remember not shipping until October Yeah, so they're trying to build up some pre-orders so that you know, hopefully by the end of this year There's a little bit of wave and they can ride that but let's let's be clear 360-degree video in a browser right now is as interesting as and exciting as Downloading a PDF to read a novel on your computer was pre Kindle pre iPad and some people got really excited about that there were and It's like no, you're right. It's such it's such a good analogy Like most people were like why would I do that and there were some people like look I'm reading a book on my laptop It's amazing. Yeah Recode has sources that back up an earlier report that the information of that the information reported that Google is working on a voice Activated assistant similar to the Amazon Echo Internally it is apparently called chirp Plans are to launch it later this year although it may be showed off at the Google I.O My guess is it won't be called chirp at Google I.O. If we see it. That's probably just an internal name I don't know it seems like it'll be called the the g-sistant or something if it were to fit the g-unit the g-man G-unit But yeah, I mean it's about time that we saw okay Google. Oh, sorry everybody fit into a Device I think that's smart given that what Amazon Echo is doing and the fact that Google has a smart home initiative Alphabet owns nest so they got a sister company apparently Tony Fidel's group at nest was going to work on something like this and that didn't happen And and Google's building a little hardware thing. They've got they've got projects They've got the Nexus devices, of course, they've they've got the on hub a router We're gonna see a little Google Google Google hardware. I don't know what to call it It's not an empire, but a little very solid Google hardware business developing And let's let's what we will see where this goes I think they obviously have their their voice activated technology in the right place They they certainly have the algorithms that can make it as smooth as They know Amazon has with Alexa. Sorry for everybody but they You know what we'll see what we'll see where this where this lands also We will see where the where where the mood of the nation is as we start to get a little bit more of these like Well is the FBI Just like I do that. Are they able to just kind of listen to this always on microphone? Well, who wait a minute wait first of all the the mood is already there Everybody assumes that the FBI is listening to anything they have. I don't think there's any evidence Yeah, you are People who listen to this show are I don't know but most people have gone through that and been get and gotten to I don't care No, I don't know if my mom has thought about that I don't know if my mom who has yet to buy this thought about that on on my mom Definitely has not it's a very good point. So Gloria and Diane need to think about this Let's schedule a little call. We're gonna knock this out. Yeah Geekwire has a write-up of paper ID a battery-free RFID paper that can detect touches and swipes being developed by the University of Washington Disney research and Carnegie Mellon Antennas are printed on paper and then the integrated circuit is added with the sticker You can also choose to draw the antenna in conductive ink Machine learning that allows interruptions in the signal to be classified in seven different interactions and they showed them off in a video So of course you cover the antenna they can detect that touching it sliding across it Turning the paper a swiping movement and even hand waving above the antenna can be detected And so suddenly you've got what is a very Limited but effective touchscreen interface that you can add with just paper This is amazing I love this technology and I love that there will be somebody smarter than me either in the chat room right now or in emails That will come into the show tomorrow that will be able to explain All the many ways that this will be amazing But right now I have no idea other than just to have that initial geek reaction saying Wow, that's cool. I mean you if you watch the video They're all demo fun, right like oh, I touched the paper and the light goes on I could put a piece of paper on the side of a house and and I can see where a lot of these demos are the kinds of things That would bring down manufacturing costs But the only one that really popped out was the pop-up book Where you have a pop-up book that then automatically causes your phone or your computer to play sounds and videos as you're turning the pages And that was the one where I started to realize, okay It's not just about cost reduction there. That's that's something that would be a lot harder to do otherwise Yes, and I think that that's really the fun part about it is is the idea that there can be these different The these the like somebody's going to look at this set of tools and say I can move the world with them Yeah, like that's what cool stuff like this always gets me really excited about Courts reports that Sunday May 8th a sunny and windy day cause solar wind hydro and biomass Plants in Germany do account for 55 watts of the 63 watts of power being consumed That is 87 percent the average that is 87 percent the average last year in Germany was 33 percent While gas plants went offline during the glut nuclear and coal plants did not causing them to have Do I have to pay to put power on to the grid while industrial consumers earned money for using electricity? Yeah, so you're seeing a lot of headlines like solar power Caused people to have to be paid to use electricity And if those people are owners of big industrial plants and you're talking about a small period of time on a Sunday Then yes, that headline is true This is not this is more about the inflexibility of coal and nuclear plants not to be able to reduce their capacity as fast But it does mean that you're generating quite a bit more renewable energy in Germany than a lot of people expected Certainly so and and you know It just kind of shows you but the You know what I mean, I don't I guess I But my instinct here is to say something very very nice about green and renewable Technology and and I believe in it And I think it is something that continues to be refined to be better and be more utilitarian, but I don't want to I want exactly that the qualifier that you put up front like you don't want to say and now solar the new king Bow down other technology close all the other plants not quite yet not quite yet But but again, these are these are the kinds of things on the way to to having at least if nothing else a more diversified energy Profile in Germany has a goal of a hundred percent renewable. So maybe they'll actually get there Google today open sourced syntax net and a component for it. That's getting all the headlines called Parcy McPars face Syntax net is a syntactic parser framework for understanding sentences. So it's it's natural language processing It's a framework that you can now use to open source and train it to recognize Language Parcy McPars face is its English language plug-in So if you don't want to bother training it to know English plug in Parcy McParks face and boom Your syntax net can understand English Google claims it can understand the grammatical structure of sentences as well as most trained Linguists and can achieve 94% accuracy on news articles, which probably is more than most of us That's amazing. Yeah And it's open source so you can just go use it How long do you think this this McPars face thing is going to is gonna last you think okay? I wondered if this was convergent evolution where they had already named it Parcy McPars face and then got a little extra Boost because of Bode McBoat face. Yeah, cuz I've that that structure that linguistic structure of Something to make something face. Yeah has been around for years. Don't call it a comeback moment now Yeah, though definitely take in the spotlight. Yeah, the the success and ultimate betrayal of Bode McPars face Has brought this to a new level that that can be that can be understood Barclays announced that its own mobile payment system will roll out in June Contactless mobile will be enabled if the Barclays app detects a compatible smartphone with an eligible Barclays account Customers are limited to 30 quid with tap and pay with larger amounts of up to a hundred pounds requiring a pin or fingerprint the platform I'm sorry the rollout will be phased out over a number of days and customers will be notified when it's available So not playing in anybody else's backyard Barclays is going it alone Corey doctor O has a plea on EFF org to save future tech companies from the W3C's approval of encrypted media extensions or EMEs The EMEs are the W3C standard, but to take advantage of that extension You'll need to get a content decryption module and you have to obtain that from a rights holder or a partner of a rights holder doctor O points out that any browser that tried to render such video without Getting one of those decryption models would Modules would fall afoul of the USD MCA and laws like it being added around the world because of things like the Trans Pacific partnership so therefore if a Company doesn't want a browser to succeed They could just withhold the content decryption module and there would be nothing the browser could do about it motion to require W3C members not to use the DMCA to attack new entrants in such a manner was overruled So this is a last-ditch effort to do something to say. Hey, we don't like EMEs We know Tim Berners-Lee says they're necessary. We think they can be used for ill and we should try to stop them or at least Figure out a way around them Yeah Tommy think that this is this is a noble cause. I I'd definitely see both sides of this one Cory doctor O is not wrong. He's right. Let me just go ahead and say Cory doctor O is right That this can be used in an anti-competitive manner. You could say hmm. I don't really like Netflix So I'm not gonna give him my content decryption module or I'm gonna charge him really high Let's just say I'm Sony and I have I have pictures and and Netflix wants to start and stream video and they're like Well, we'll give you the rights, but we won't give you the CDM like you can use it to raise prices and raise the entry barrier You can use it to keep browsers out. Same time I also understand Tim Berners-Lee's side of it Which is to say all we're doing is saying DRM exists and therefore if it exists in its widespread We can either incorporate it into the standard or still deal with crappy DRM implementations that are even worse So I mean and this is my only thought with this and I love Cory doctor And I followed his writing for pretty much as long as I've been on the internet But whenever I see his name on a very very big and important topic like this kind of standard stuff I have this guy. I think probably the same initial thought which is he's probably right but also he is has a tendency to be a bit of a bomb thrower on on on stuff and and I Do oversimplify complicated issues I think he likes to set the danger level a little farther because otherwise people don't pay attention Yeah, so it's a way to get people and say, hey, you know what you might not have Another Firefox you might not have another Netflix if Things go as bad as they can and this is the bad ways they could go your house is on fire and you run in You're like what where's the fire? It will be if you don't change the battery And it's important to change that batter It's very important Western digital finish the process of acquiring sand disc The original deal was announced in October and included Chinese company Eunice splendor buying a 15% stake in WD who backed out in February dropping the value of the deal And Another acquisition the California Public Utilities Commission was the last agency in line to approve Charter's acquisition of Time Warner cable And they did so that deal is now cleared to move ahead Charter CEO Tom Rutledge said the deals expected to close next week Just a couple of footnotes there I like to make sure to report when the deals actually happen because a lot of people think that the announcement of the deal starting is Is it? Especially for big telecom and cable mergers that's not the case like yeah, they take a long time Thanks to SB Sheridan Motang Steve IO Captain Kipper Tommy Russo all the folks at Daily Tech news show reddit.com for Submittent stories and thank you for voting on them if you went and vote voted today Print yourself a sticker that says I voted in the tech news show subreddit and go wear it in pride That's a look at the headlines All right, let's get into this above Avalon story analyst Neil Seibart Has a pretty good reputation for being able to predict where Apple is going earnings wise He's a financial analyst that left Wall Street because he says hey I was frustrated that people weren't really paying enough attention to the details of Apple So I started this blog above Avalon.com He he makes his money charging for information and newsletters and he's got a free post up today Pointing out that he thinks people are overlooking the fact that Apple is spending more and more money on research and development every year They're on track for ten billion dollars of R&D spending in 2016. That's up 30 percent over last year For comparisons sake four years ago in 2012. They were only spending three billion a year on R&D and back When the iPhone launched they were only at one billion dollars a year R&D has outpaced revenue growth He estimates that Apple will spend six point eight percent of their revenue on R&D in 2017 Historically, it's been around two and it's been rising into the threes probably gonna hit four something this month this year And he says the reason people are missing it is because Tim Cook just comes out and says we've got lots of great products for you And everybody goes yeah, yeah, yeah, we know you always do And they don't pay attention to the fact that he's really signaling like we're researching a lot of stuff It may not come out fast and Apple unlike Google unlike Amazon unlike Facebook doesn't like to share their plans They benefit from surprise marketing and they benefit From not suppressing their own sales if they were to come out and say here You know here are all the new devices We're gonna have a lot of people would just decide to wait for one of those new devices to come so what do you think of this idea that he has here that it's Probably either wearables which we know they're already in with Apple Watch or Cars that are taking up the majority of this money Justin and and Cybert thinks it's cars Well, let's also take a look in Into the past because a lot of this is is being qualified and the one thing that you can say is as this number balloons Is so has their war chest which was not what it is now What it was when they were launching the iPad or even the the iPod or something so long ago, so It is also important to note that Their lack of R&D spending has also been one of those things that comes up on You know that oh they should be spending more you should always be sending a certain percentage of what you make on R&D That's general good business practice They've in general been below that especially like you mentioned Compared to companies like a Google or more specifically Microsoft which has its own cottage industry of having a gigantic Reputational R&D department that they trot out at you know CES to show off amazing things that they never actually wind up releasing Right like tablets in 2001 exactly with all that being said I offer a hearty and official Doi They're getting in their cars doing becoming a car company is Incredibly expensive especially when you have what I believe that this is the first person to say it But certainly not the last that if Apple releases a car It will not be a product in the way that they could release a Television in the way that they could release something that is a higher ticket item when Apple releases a car And and I say that you know just in this science fiction scenario not for claiming that they definitely will they become a car Company and other things that they sell will be secondary to it either because they're on a nap a natural Trajectory of declining sales like you know we saw for the first time with the iPhone and stuff like that Or I or you know I've tablet sales have not been a forever explosion in the same way that iPhones were But because this is a lifestyle choice they will have no choice But to say buy our cars and then also we do other things on the level that they have never really done Even with the iPhone as as much as that became their dominant product They were never like buy an iPhone and then also we sell computers They will be forced to do that if they start selling Cars and more specifically if they're successful Yeah, I think one of the things cybert points out is that you would think oh well Maybe they're just gonna come out with a load of new products, but the way Apple Functionally is organized would stretch them too thin. We haven't seen them come in and add a bunch of executives They keep these teams very tight And they keep them focused on exactly what they're working on the laptops the phones the tablets the watch We see them bringing in lots of car experts And in fact we talked about not too long ago that Tesla's VP of vehicle engineering Chris Port seems to have taken over from Steve Sundeski in Whatever project Titan is Which everyone assumes is a car so I went and I did some poking around They have hired the former president and CEO of Mercedes-Benz research a safety designer from auto live a couple of tests Mechanical engineers a Tesla product design manager the guy from M code gears that designs transmission Transmissions the manager of electric and fuel cell vehicles at Ford And and the list goes on drivetrain engineers galore So they are not hiring and and some of these people are just being brought over from iOS to do the platform Because a lot of people have said well, maybe they're just gonna have a platform that is a little more robust than car play That doesn't seem to be what they're doing here What they're doing here is designing a car And we were talking in the DTNS analysts slack about the fact that drivetrain is very computer-controlled and It was a Steve eye that was saying that and so these are the people you would need if you were designing a car But it doesn't mean you're gonna build it You're gonna look for a partner the way Apple partners with Foxconn to build phones and thinking about it some more just now Apple remember didn't have a ton of retail stores when the iPhone came out There were there were some but they really partnered with AT&T and leaned on AT&T as the place for you to go buy the iPhone in The early days and they still part they still lean on those carrier partners So I imagine they would lean on a dealership partner as well Yes, I mean maybe I mean I think Cars and again, I mean are like so so yes like that that is a a very very reasonable Perfectly understandable way to look at that problem that's not the way that Tesla's gone and Tesla hasn't gone that way for very very specific reasons but Here's let's take it back two steps It is fully fully fully Reasonable I think for me to say that in five years Apple will be a car company However, I also think it's fully fully fully reasonable for me to say that in five years Apple will have totally abandoned Project Titan and wrote it off as something that they didn't do in fact If you say both of those like you just did you can now claim to be right no matter what happens Well, I but I mean I guess and here's the point is that Apple is secretive about these things because they want to give themselves Maximum flexibility they want to give themselves the ability to cancel a project at 11 59 before they are going to release it it is fully reasonable for me to think that in five years Apple will not be putting out cars But we'll have bought Tesla and and and they will be putting out cars, right? Like I think that everything is on the table. What is interesting is That this problem is something that they need to go outside of what their core strength is which is Hiring engineers hiring designers rapid prototyping and artistic flexibility to say this is not done until we really want to release it That's always been their strength in terms of building consumer devices be them Computers laptops or or you know mobile devices This is something that they need to go far outside their wheelhouse They can't just bring people in to Cupertino and say hey look at all the facilities. We have look at all the brain power We have they need to go raid other things. They need to go deal with other people. They need to go open plants They need to go rapid prototyping for an automobile is totally different. So that's where I think we get this this larger Expenditure is that like they're just they're working out muscles that they have not worked out before Which in and of itself is very rare for apple They've they've they've kind of been very good at just expanding even when they've they've gone outside of the wheelhouse It's like five percent five percent ten percent ten percent, you know And I mean going into a phone is not as big a deal as going to a car But at the time they did it was unexpected Uh, if you if you remember I've tried to find this this quote here I was throwing a big gym earlier, but uh, it was the CEO of palm at the time Who was talking about the idea in 2006 before apple came out with the iphone and basically said, you know what? They they would not be able to do that. That's it's uh, yeah palm CEO ed colligan We've learned and struggled for a few years here figuring out how to make a decent phone PC guys are not going to just figure this out. They're not going to just walk in Probably heard that quote before Yeah, so so this is a stair step up But they like to climb stairs at apple. It was inconceivable They would do a phone and they totally did a phone and they did it very successfully So, yeah, this is a much bigger jump But that's the kind of thing that apple likes to do and in fact if if you're apple you're looking at it Like yeah, we had a big jump with the ipod and then we had an even bigger jump with the iphone So we need to get wearables is a bit of a jump, but you know, we we need an even bigger jump this time Let's make a car Uh now all that being said If you're going to look at the other side of what cybert says which is that this is partly wearables and where they want to go with wearables I think that is something where And again as I still have my apple watch on I wear it every day. I like it a lot there is still We have yet to see the the iphone or ipad of the wearables Genre and that will specifically come with unaffordable cheap device that can operate functionally as something other than a mirror for My phones and and apple becoming a car company. I don't think means they become gm I think they I think they do partner on a lot of the manufacturing I don't think it means they stop making consumer electronics I think that would they obviously continue to make all of their successful products including macs and macbooks In fact, they have bought enough vr companies like 3d interface 3d sensing company prime sense an augmented reality company called matteo A mo cap startup that they are probably going to continue to roll out new consumer electronics probably in the area of vr in some way But I think what justin you're trying to say and I think it's right is Cars will dominate the business and the rest of it will become other divisions that support that Yeah, I mean just by risk and Probable profit alone Yeah, you know that there's there's you can't put out a car small Right unless you are selling them one by one out You know out of the garage of your crazy Flying saucer headquarters, right like you can't do it in a small way. It's going to be gigantic It's going to be on the cover of time magazine It's going to be this monumental thing that this company which is very well watched and very well surveilled Is going to have to do in a gigantic kind of way, but all that being said I don't know that this is this is a sign that they are looking very hard at a lot of things I don't think it is in any way a definite sign that any of this comes to fruition It's a sign that they intend to it's not a sign that will you're absolutely fine that they're looking Like they are now and that is that is news That is something that we should look at that is something that we should discuss And they are taking a hard look at pivoting and they will and they will Take every element it wouldn't I mean again This is a company that could build an entire division Have a car ready to go ready to release and they say you want to know what? We it's not good enough not good enough and they could shutter everything. Yeah, they've got the cash to do it And then yeah, maybe they acquire tesla. Maybe they acquire somebody else And maybe they just sit on the patents. There's all kinds of exit strategies there All right, let's get to our pick of the day from william bryan and schenectady new york called my app sharer He says most power users know about apks. Those are the apps that will extract the installed apk from the system for Uh, oh, I'm sorry. This app my app sharer will extract the installed apk from the system for reinstall He says my primary use is to back up apps before they get updated from the play store So in other words, he can grab that apk Just the thing that that makes the application work And and set hold it aside before it gets overwritten with the update He says have you ever been in the situation where you regret updating an app? Maybe they killed a feature or changed a ui element with the apk You can load it back. I also use it to back up the apps I know I need before wiping the phone this way I'm not searching for them in the play store or waiting so long for them to download from a restore So it's kind of a cool little thing my app sharer in the google play store Send your picks to us folks feedback at daily tech news show dot com you can find more picks at daily tech news show dot com slash picks Uh, we got something for nathaniel our electrician friend who was asking us what kind of tech stuff He might want to learn to make himself a more attractive installer Bryce in main says as a network engineer that works closely with cabling installers I think nathaniel should learn some of the low voltage cabling standards bixie rcd Certification would be a good ad rcd stands for registered communications distribution designer It's been my experience that many electricians simply don't understand low voltage cabling is different than high voltage And the resulting kinked cat six cables are evidence of that Despite the move toward wireless everything There's still a low voltage cable going to those access points if the cabling is bad So is the wireless connection and yeah being able to say oh, yeah, I can I can run cat six cable for you I can install that while i'm putting in your wires might be a pretty attractive thing I like it That's I mean it's always good to be able to bolster your skillset But that is I mean I I applaud nathaniel for uh for for for saying you want to know what let's let's look forward Let's let's uh, let's let's gird ourselves for the coming Uh, it's gonna say apocalypse, but maybe it'll be a money apocalypse Electropolis hey, and thanks to brison main uh more blackberry love coming in lots of blackberry love coming in uh seven Kevin wrote my 17 month old girl is blackberry diehard She has a bold touch 9900 from my previous company after they sunset the servers. She loves it loves the keyboard actually loves any keyboard Absolutely adores the tactical feedback. She gets from mashing those buttons She also likes the fact that unlike the five and six inch phones of today She's able to mash buttons with one hand while clenching your security blanket with the other Or two-handed for some serious button mashing while watching the wiggles me I'm still quite interested in an android phone with an actual keyboard the priv was interesting a little too big Uh with it fully extended and a little expensive couldn't get it here in australia Anyway, without some serious effort, but he's looking forward to phones that are rumored for release from blackberry this year Yes, uh 17 month old approved. Yes all ages People of all ages Love a blackberry Uh, thank you. Justin robber young people of all ages love Justin robber young too. Why is that justin? Well, probably because of my winning smile and my real engaging personality But i'll tell you what if if you like, uh You know what we do here on on the show when i'm on or some of the other projects including the morning stream night attack politics politics politics jury Here's a way that you can show That that you enjoy the stuff that I do Buy some stickers. I started so we had this live night attack show in san francisco, and I decided to make some sticker packs Just to have something to sell at the show They went Pretty fast, but we still had a few left. So I set up a little site stickers or diaf dot com And uh, I decided to sell the rest and those went within Like two hours, and so I still had more that I hadn't put in the sticker pack. So I listed a bunch more and uh They went super fast as well. So I had to reorder stickers last night Apparently there was a greater demand for diamond club or jury related stickers than I had initially expected If you would like to get your back head on over stickers or diaf dot com again Get some stickers folks know you like stickers who does somebody told us Uh, hey, and thanks to everybody who supports this show. We don't take advertising. We don't even say well actually We might have a sticker in the shop But mostly it's just you guys saying hey, we want to support the show So we'll give you a dollar five dollars if you're an analyst 20 bucks a month get you into the slack Go to daily tech news show dot com slash Support to find out how to support the show And get us to that day six goal and to that round table goal I'm going to do a round table once a month where we can just talk some stuff Uh patreon.com slash dts for that our email address is feedback at daily tech news show dot com You can give us call 51259 daily. That's 5932459 catch the show live monday through friday 4 30 p.m Eastern at alpha geek radio dot com and diamond club dot tv and visit our website daily tech news show dot com back tomorrow With darin kitchen and len peralta talk to you then The show is part of the frog pants network get more at frog pants dot com Diamond club hopes you have enjoyed this brover Wow, it's kind of amazing when you have a brand new mixer and uh, you actually set you have to set levels at the Prop appropriate volume Because it works right volume you say Good show. Thank you. That was fun. That was fun conversation That was a really good kind of especially from you Justin the whole kind of like I mean you brought up a lot of good points. I'm still on the fence. I'm still on the fence about about apple Um, it's to me. It's not so much that they have to wear with all. I wonder if they have the stomach To do full on being the car industry because there's a lot of things That you do in the car industry that you don't do with consumer electronics And that just I mean it's a different kind of gambling. I guess You know, some people might be you know, totally comfortable with playing the lotto or a scratcher But if you tell them you're gonna play pygau or Back or act and you're gonna be putting in like Ten thousand dollars a bet. I mean it's a different it's a different amount of risk Well, yeah, I mean and listen this is certainly a risk and and uh There is an element And and this is why I I almost your your instinct is why I I'm like The day in less apple Is thrilled with what they see and they are thrilled with their delivery method and they are thrilled with how they're gonna sell them And they're thrilled without people how much people are gonna buy them for which stuff like tesla's presale Has got to buoy their yeah for sure their believability in it. But if that's not the case Then I think You just go make the godfather offer to To elan musk and say hey look would you also like to be the largest, you know a gigantic shareholder in apple and and Elan like to meet jimmy and dray Uh, they've got some stories to tell you Uh You know like I guess my my my my my my larger point is just nothing would surprise me with this because yeah, no, it's absolutely true Because I like the one thing that I did find weird about that that cybar thing is that it didn't Show that number in percentage to their war chest That oh you mean to the cash on hand. Yes. Yeah. Yeah, but yes, their rnd has exploded, but so has their cash Yeah, they've got a huge cash pile I think a guy like that probably just assumes like well everybody knows about the cash pile I don't need to point that out But I think but that's something that like that has exploded I mean I like again I think that there's like yes, it is important that we look at that number because they have been rnd shot Because their point is that listen we don't need to Employ a bunch of you know bespectacled boffins in a basement You know dreaming of the future we can see where the future is Let's just focus on these two things that we know And then we'll kill things here and again, but like, you know, let's well and That's because they don't want to spend too many bets They don't want to do a like scattershot. They they are indeed a phone And then they are a d another thing and then a tablet and then you know So to me that big rnd budget sticks out even more because what it means to me is that Car car rnd is expensive So that is their thing that they're spending the most money out researching and developing Now the other element of this Is we've seen beats retain its brand value Right and you've seen apple's car stuff be talked about as they are setting up a startup within apple Is there Like is there a possibility that that hood ornament or whatever's on the front of that car Is it the apple icon? It is another Another separate thing. I mean beats has retained its brand as far as hardware goes. Yes It hasn't retained its brand anywhere else So I don't know Well, yeah, but anything else that they've done has been have been new projects that they've done within apple Well, no beats music beats music was was another pillar Yeah, and it was now apple music sure, but you could you could see a world where beats music was not long for this world Okay, you know sure But yeah, like say they let let's just live in the crazy world where they buy tesla do they leave it as tesla Oh, I think they would leave tesla as tesla my my thought is Is titan let's just use titan as a name sure Is titan automotive They're automotive thing and now that can live and die Ah, I see on its own and now that's a good question It's would be very unapple like to do that Been anything off it would be huge, but then again it'd be very unapple like to release a car Yeah, right exactly. Um, I don't know they get so much brand love out of putting that apple on things though I mean people think of how many people put those apple stickers that come on their car on the yeah, exactly Sure, I know I know who to rear end no Uh, well, it's it's interesting because a lot of these Conversations stem around whether or not apple can and what path they will take It's I've always imagined it as not so much that if they can but whether they should As a matter of course for business I mean the whole thing with mission creep and like trying to trying to stretch out Is it is it better for them to focus as an in-car component? Uh manufacturer or not manufacturer, but licensor where they say, hey, you will license you all your technology You can put whatever car you want, but we don't need to carry the liability for the rest of the car We don't have to worry about manufacturing Um, but put that put that against apples need for control No, and apples need to just actually say no, we we want to be the only ones with liability Or apples understanding that they can do customer care better than anyone and and That well get some arguments on that get your oil change at the apple store I mean Like, uh, well, I mean, yeah the apple care warranty on your car. Yeah, I mean listen, there's no you're right When you buy a laptop And it breaks You know where to take it sure and and and and you get that grand apple bargain, which is Uh, it's either free or a thousand dollars. Yeah, you know this it is a binary solution So you roll the dice and sometimes you get a free laptop and sometimes you have to pay my mind immediately went to iCloud Where they're like, yeah, um, no it just doesn't work that way. Sorry. Oh, yeah. Oh god. No I mean web services has always been there. Yeah Imagine what their genius bar would look like if they started having the field car questions Just like a bunch of uh titles Oh, I already picked it since we got off on this. I I needed to pick it before Before down so apple record. I'm I picked apple motors question mark, which isn't even in showbot Apple motors apple motors Do you know if they call it apple motors corporation then they can revive the emcee bed emcee And they can build everything back in canoes chrysler chrysler owns amc's trademark, right They did they bought them out, but they they only kept eagle and then they killed that No, but I mean owns the owns the mark or did they lose it to dimler when they divested themselves from dimler? I don't know Now here's the other question sells jeeps chrysler No fiat If you are looking fiat might own amc If you are looking if you are apple, right because they talk about like oh, well, you might see acquisitions from apple the likes of Which you've never seen before Could part of that be if they're going forward with this car Either a full car company to buy their manufacturing capabilities Or I was very interested in what you said in terms of the dealership stuff. Do they buy a nationwide dealership? To oh Yeah Like as the way that you buy an apple car Sure And then that fits in with my theory that they don't want to own a bunch of manufacturing plants No, any more than they want to own a bunch of phone manufacturing plants So they they strike a deal for that But then they buy a dealership chain So that they can immediately create some apple motors locations. That's that's a good one I like that or do they say you want to know what we don't we have we have uh, we have showrooms We're gonna we're gonna we're gonna buy this retail space and then you're gonna buy it on your phone And it'll be driven to you within two hours. Oh, I mean you can already hear The presentation at the keynote or the press conference uh, we're like Buying a car has never been easy. It's never been enjoyable. We think that needs to change No haggle pricing. Oh, yeah When you show up on our showroom, you can test drive a car You can pick the one you want and then either from there or in the comfort of your own home with the new apple motors app Uh, you can select the car you want the way you want it and have it delivered right to you financing You worked out on the app. Yeah, did you have financing worked out on for your computer? You know if it's a self-driving car be great if it just drove itself home to you That's the other element is that we're thinking of this like they want to do do what tesla's doing right and right a lot of sense But also what if they are more? We self-driving kind of cars my guess is they would have to do both That self-driving cars are still Such a question mark That they would have to come up with a a car that they could sell as drivable But at the same time be preparing for the self-driving car and like tesla have a bunch of those features in the car You drive yourself so that it's it becomes a self-driving car pretty easily um Or they're just going to wait until you know google and and and uh, everybody have have paved the way and then just pop In with a self-driving car. My only question is where would they find the manufacturing capacity To actually build a complete car. No, that's what I keep that's why I keep saying they're going to partner with somebody they're They're just going to partner with somebody who'll build it for them. They're they're not going to buy the manufacturing capacity I'm all I'm pretty And I'm probably wrong, but I'm pretty certain about that No, I I'm not disagreeing with you. I'm just thinking of people out there I mean like they could probably go with magna because they do a lot of the component Of fabbing for of the big three interior and stuff for car companies in north america But also in europe and they're huge. They were they were they were tipped to buy saturday when people thought saturday was going to be right um But yeah, I'm just curious because it's you know, you do you can have a multitude of fab plants You can have a multitude of electronics and even consumer electronics plants, but I'm trying to think of and then A situation where you could do a car that level because you would still need to buy parts separately from Contra ours subcontractors And that brings a whole whole yeah, but that's no different than foxconn That's no different than what foxconn does Yes, and no, I would just say that the the cost alone of holding inventory would be least I I don't know it's somewhere. Yeah, you're right about inventory. That's true But I mean you could get You could get capacity Yeah, but but what you were saying about control kind of Would cut into that because if they want if they do really want to I know it's all you just I mean you just strike the deal that says this is how you build it and you build it for us Is that that weird? I don't know how many we have you gone through the nh st. A Uh car recall. I mean the airbag. That's different that no, that's a different question though Well, no, but that's what i'm saying is that a lot of these I don't see this is that much different than Going and getting the FCC approvals and and the and the other certifications for a phone and then telling foxconn build This phone the way we want it to be built. I guess the difference is I don't know that there are many manufacturers out there That aren't owned by the company that also designs the cars Whereas with phones and stuff there are plenty of intermediaries We'll see When there's an apple car rolling around we could then Tell each other who was wrong and who was right Justin gets to be right either way. It was the smartest thing he ever did. Yeah, I mean, this is uh, I'm I'm continuing to evolve as a tech media guest like I Big bold predictions that are that are as Bold as they are useless someone if someone could Please go back into the episode clip out the part where he says that apple will not make a car Clip out the part where he says they will make a car separately and then send them to Justin so he can have them Hand yeah and put see I said it. Here's the evidence Uh as as tony kornheiser says I believe I had that one. Yeah Absolutely All right, uh, well that is it. Thanks everybody. We're we're published. We're good actually hold on Let me make sure I didn't screw it up like I did yesterday I'm pretty sure I did Maybe they could give you a free barrel full of gmo free apples with each new car purchase Genuine gmo free apples financing All right. Thanks everybody for watching or listening. See you folks. Bye