 Well, good morning everyone. Thanks for joining this session about innovation and the future of Drupal. I'm Alex Moreno, I'm always thinking about the previous role I used to have for the previous company. I work for the Drupal Association, I'm the innovation manager at the association. And a funny thing is all this talk is about innovation and the future. When I sent this session it was actually not working for the Drupal association. So you can see that I'm quite passionate about this topic. I'm joined by some friends, some colleagues that, you know, I think they bring different perspectives to the table about what is coming in the next months, in the next year for Drupal. And I would like them to, you know, I'm going to have like different questions. I want this to be very interactive because actually you asked me as well, you know, to try to make this more and more interactive. So if anyone has any questions at any point, don't wait for the end. We have a microphone there, you can come here as well. We have enough microphones for everyone. And, you know, let's make it interactive. So you feel the urgency to have a question, to make a question, just stand up. As I said, I have four friends from different perspectives, from different same industry, about different experiences. So what I'm going to do is I'm going to start with a first question. What does innovation mean for you? And is Drupal still innovative? And I will let you introduce yourself and answer the question. I'm going to start with Scott. My nightmare scenario. I have to start and give my opinion on the future of Drupal. To the community who's building it. It's like, is your baby ugly? So yeah, my name is Scott Massey. I currently work for a Drupal agency named Morft in that's based in Sydney. I live in Tokyo and they have like a DXP that does privacy centric personalization and other stuff. Prior to that I worked for over 10 years at Pantheon number 10 ish employee running customer success and then our global expansion. And then prior to that worked at Drupal agencies and doing IT support. Originally I'm a CIS admin. And I love Drupal. I changed my career for Drupal. I'll mention that. Like I worked in IT support and found Drupal and that's, you know, it's been in my life since then. So what does innovation for you? What does innovation mean for me? So I think there's like I thought about this a lot and I thought about like our conversations and everything and I thought well the obvious answer like is Drupal still innovative? Like the answer would be no, it's declining. It's in a it's a part of a shrinking market and there's challenges and everything like that. Then I thought about it again and I thought I want this crowd to like me. So I should say yes, it is still innovating. But I think like to your point I think innovation for our community means are we setting initiatives that help our users help our end users and are we consistently hitting those, you know. And I think the fact that when you look at the entire market and you take out, you know, the outliers of like none, no CMS and WordPress. We are still a very viable option across many sectors like we are competitive and we are part of the decision making process when people are choosing what their CMS can be. So I think yes, in that sense we are still innovative. But I think there's challenges to that and I think, you know, that's something that we're not the only session on innovation that's actually happening at this event. Like it's a constant sort of discussion which I think is also really healthy and the mere fact that we have a niche market which I think has become much more clear over the last time. Years or so, like we've seeded some areas, but we remain strong with certain segments is something that we shouldn't take for granted because, you know, when we compete, when agencies compete, they're competing against a pretty standard set of competitors. Like we're not competing against, I don't know, like some generic sort of MVC framework or something like that. We're competing against a set of other options that we're competitive with. So yes, I do think we're innovating. And I like that, you know, we are actually not just waiting, like continuing building features on Drupal but worrying about these things like the new initiatives about innovation that I'm working on and the new initiative that just announced yesterday about marketing. So Scott brings a lot of experience in the table, so thanks a lot for joining. Next on the table is Amy June. Hello. My name is Amy June Heinlein. I use Volkswagen Chick across Drupal.org. I am tan gentle to Drupal right now. I work at the Linux Foundation. I work on the certifications for emerging technologies. But before that, I worked at Red Hat when they cared about open source and I worked at opensource.com. And before that, I worked at a Drupal agency who paid me to 100% to give back to Drupal. So I'm a Drupal core mentor. I'm on the community working group. I work with diplomacy in the issue queue. And everything I do after I got out of Drupal supports Drupal. So for me, myself, I try to lead that innovation like when I went to opensource.com. It was all about how many of my friends can I have write Drupal articles so Drupal is relevant among the wider open source audience. And now at the Linux Foundation, I work with subject matter experts creating exams and certifications and how many of my Drupal friends can I come in who are subject matter experts in get ops. So they're talking to other people who are in the industry and they're saying I work in Drupal. And people are like, hmm, Drupal, is that still around? I hear that a lot at the Linux events. And so for me, the innovative part is us going out into that wider market and bringing in those PHP developers and bringing in those symphony developers and bringing in things that solve the solutions that are a little bit outside just that PHP CMS. So for me, I'm very hopeful for Drupal. It just has to be done in a way where we create a contributor pipeline and not only like a contributor pipeline, but a diverse contributor pipeline because that's where our innovation comes from is the more people who come in who have the use cases that are different like opensource.com's use case for Drupal is much different than a brochure site that uses Drupal. But if we have developers from all of those markets and we have developers for all of the continents then we increase that developer pipeline of diversity of thought. And that's why I think Drupal is very innovative is we have people all over the planet working on it. We have people all over the planet contributing their feature requests and then their feature requests are actually looked at and not ignored. And I think that's an important part is that we do have conversations and we do come to developer days and we go to bad camp and we come to Drupal con it and we all come together for a week and we talk about it and I think that's what drives the innovation in Drupal. I mean as well one of the winners of the pitch pool initiative and working with her on this innovation initiative and she brings a lot of perspective from the mentor side. So thanks a lot for joining me. Who is next? Hi, good morning. We had a great Belgian night so if my voice is a bit lower than usual. I apologize for that. My name is Nick, I work for GitLab. You probably know GitLab, it's also part of the whole Drupal.org ecosystem. But my role at GitLab is contributor success. Now what does that mean? It means that I'm responsible for both figuring out how to gain new contributors and how to convince some to try and contribute to GitLab itself, GitLab's open source project. Also the whole life cycle of how do you even get started, local tooling and a bunch of other items to get started to make your change. But then also I think this is where it gets interesting for Drupal. The journey from contributing your item or your change or anything that you're trying to do. And then figuring out how to get to a merge or at least like a fixed state fast enough. If you've submitted a change to Drupal.org and I heard some sessions in the last days sometimes it can take even five years for something to get closed. That's not a very motivating journey in a way. Also at GitLab I focus on shortening that journey and maybe to answer the questions for me innovation at Drupal. I won't be opinionated on what should happen. If you want to do crypto, by all means go for it. Other items, that's not really my cup of tea in that sense to tell you where Drupal should go. But if you don't have the capability of getting it in half a year or even like a shorter amount of time then it gets not really working anyway so your innovation will never get there. So the rate of innovation I think to me is a very important topic that we should talk about and in the census Drupal is still innovative. It's a very good question. I think there's a lot of items happening in the ecosystem but maybe I'm not the most qualified person today to answer that. Maybe it's you that should be able to answer that question. So I'd love to hear I think from that side like are you still able to do all of these things in a short enough time to get that value out there. And that's something that we have discussed a lot. Nick is helping with the innovation working group. He's given a lot of ideas in terms of non necessarily innovation per se but innovation is actually unblocking innovation. I'm not trying to control in the Drupal Association not necessarily to come with innovation I'm not the smartest guy in the room but I'm trying to find the smartest guys and maybe have some very good innovations somewhere in the queue but they are blocked for some reason. That's what we are trying to do, right? Unblock those smart people in those innovations. Thanks Nick. And last but not least, Cristina. Hi, I'm Cristina Chumillas. I'm coming from Barcelona. I'm a co-provisional front-end framework manager and usability maintainer. I'm actually a senior front-end developer but I studied graphic design so it's kind of the two things that I can do. And that's what I've been doing in Drupal for years. And I think I have a few strong opinions about how Drupal could be like more innovative and could innovate a little bit more but I think the key nowadays should lie on how actually the Drupal ecosystem has changed. We are not a group of hobbyists anymore. Most of us come from agencies and we don't work on Drupal over the weekends. We don't sit on a room and start coding. We prefer to have a life over the weekends so this innovation usually relies on happening during our working days so we need to make it happen with the companies. And I'm going to shut up here. Leave it for later. I love the experience that you bring because as I said, we have very different experiences. You bring the experience from the developer, not just the developer, the core committer point of view and Lula bot, I think we all know Lula bot and the experience that you have in Lula bot contributing, I think it's great for the table. Thanks for you, Cristina. I'm going to make the first... It's the second question but I used to be a C developer and I started with zero. I can't avoid that. I'm going to ask how is Drupal doing before I just throw the question and I'm going to show you some numbers. Some numbers we already know these ones. I didn't want to look at the top all internet but more like focusing on the positive side of things, right? Things like the top ten and the top 100,000 sides and you can see that very recently Drupal is still growing strong at least on this group. That peak there we have to be careful. We don't know what's going to happen because we can see as well some peaks at some point so we don't know what will happen after this. This you don't know this graph, this is new and I like it because actually you can build a graph and you just go to Drupal.org in usage Drupal and I build this graph using those numbers. What I like is finally, if you see in the middle, we have more Drupal 10 or Drupal modern as some people are calling it sites installations that Drupal 7 and it has taken some time to get here. So this is good. And again these graphs are new. This is part of what I am doing at the Drupal association with help from people like Nick. This is looking at the number of issues fixed for example or the number of days that some issues are opened and you can see that it is a lot, right? Some of them are decreasing, which is good. Some of them we need to work on that. That's what we need to unleash now. Let's see if we can make some tweaks and we can unleash some innovation and we can work on people, etc. I want to bring the perspective from the external. I will try to explain this. Maybe if you go one slide back. As said, I also explained that I am probably not the judge of what innovation is. What kind of topics you want to work on that's not up to me. I think it's up to all of us to enable that rate of innovation. It's a good question. How do you measure that? What's the measurement that we should keep ourselves accountable to? You can see here that this day is open is the starting point of us understanding what's the rate of innovation. So how fast can we go from an idea to actually getting it in. You can see that in 2016 this was terrible. It took two years and a half, more o less, as 783 days. Today, a year to date, is 337 days. That's still almost a year. I think we should be very ambitious about that rate of innovation and maybe even get it to below 100. I think a month is maybe a bit too ambitious in that sense. But if we can get something from idea to execution with someone that's willing to execute it's not just I think this should happen. There's a lot of people out there that have a lot of opinions, but it doesn't really help because you have to execute. This counts more from that execution phase in that sense. The other important part is the credit users or the amount of contributors that you have on a monthly basis or a yearly basis. You can see here, this is like 680, 6500, 6800 something, credit users. I asked also Alex to give the number on a monthly basis just to understand some trends and ideally we both get the rate of innovation faster and we grow the amount of people and then in theory we are more innovative. That's a bit of the system thinking and that whole question of is Drupal still innovative while we can actually measure that in a way. And then I think if you go to the next slide, sorry for taking a bit more time in that sense, in my day job I asked myself a lot of these questions about what does that mean also for GitLab and then I looked at other systems. There's like lies and statistics, so take it with a grain of salt. The only thing I did here is I looked at how many unique committers as in Git commits are there in a specific project on a monthly basis. And then you can see some interesting trends. So for example Elastic is steadily going up in that sense. Also take note this includes also paid people. So this is not just as quote-unquote volunteers. It was impossible to do Drupal here because Drupal uses a different system to get commits in and it was not compatible with the system that I used to get this analysis. But you can get the idea to understand where does it become blocking. And there's an interesting trend here that you see around 180 or something. It gets actually very difficult. Somehow it's hard to scale an open source project beyond that number. And it's similar to your companies. Depending on the size of your companies you will probably feel that if you go from 5 to 20 it's a whole different way of working together. If you go from 20 to 100 it's like again completely transformation. You can see here which projects succeeded in actually doing that transformation and we should figure out where Drupal is on this curve and then figure out how to transform ourselves to allow a lot more people to get in. So that's a bit what I wanted to show here. And the data that we have at the moment in Drupal is not necessarily that we can have it. It's just that we are working on that data. It's pretty difficult to get it from Drupal because what I'm doing here is just go to the node issues and try to fetch that information from there to just have a look at any issue in the Drupal list of issues and try to guess what is its thing automatically. So at some point we will be able to compare that data which is excellent. Maybe one last sentence. You can do this in your companies as well. These ways of measuring innovation is not just for open source projects. You can also do this in your companies. Like do you understand how long it takes to open something and close it. These measures are called okma. I think that's kind of the standards around it. It's very fascinating to understand what you can measure don't go too deep as well. Then I will throw the question. But first, I didn't say that there is an app that you can ask questions. So if you prefer to ask the questions I will read them or if you prefer to stand you can just stand and ask any question. Anyone? Nope. So who wants to go? Of course. Yeah, I think to a couple of the points that Christina and Nick made. I think that if you look at open source products or projects in general there's a lot of different ways to classify them. But one is this is it a dev tool or is it a user tool? And if an end user is logging in and doing stuff in Drupal in Drupal or in any project let's just call that a user facing project. So that complicates Drupal's growth and how we innovate because we are trying to keep developers happy we are trying to keep end users happy we are also trying to keep the agency owner excited whether you're going to be a dotnet shop or a PHP shop or a square space shop which are a valid there are many of them now. I also think that even other CMSs aren't really Drupal's competition so much like when I talked to I was talking to a friend in California who was starting a business and he wasn't even worried about a website because LinkedIn was going to do everything that he needed it does lead capture it has content it has ads built into it like that's fine when you look at that when you look at Google who has always been chipping away at sending users actually to a website as opposed to just keeping them on the platform there's a lot of different things going on so I think where Drupal is going now there's a reason like Christina said it's very much connected to business use cases now and it's heading that way and I think in general in terms of a business strategy you double down on what's working and you experiment in other markets as conditions change so I think it's going to continue to develop in that direction but I think to the extent of keeping the developer community engaged and happy like I joined I got into Drupal because I saw maybe it was Lullabot it was WebChick definitely who would they would build base camp in Drupal each year or do something like that and I was like wow that's cool that's awesome like you can do all this stuff with it and you would never go to market with base camp built in Drupal but it was showing me that like as a technical person like it had such power and flexibility and sort of like it captured that spirit that I think like that goes away when business runs everything like businesses are generally boring by nature and non-controversial by nature but I think part of Drupal's future is still trying to create like that sort of interest in magic from developers too that's an interesting perspective in terms of you know we are trying as well to attract young people new generations and the sample of base camp I've seen building base camp with so many different languages when I was starting so maybe we are lacking that in Drupal we are lacking that developer relations that marketing side of getting the technology closer to the heart of new generations yeah I think that when we talk about amazing digital experiences I think that's where like design needs to be a big part of it you know the look and feel and not so much like is it solving a business problem but Drupal has such talented design designers that part of it is bringing back putting that up front and not just like we made a new chamber of commerce site that looks like every other chamber of commerce site but have like tracks that show maybe business isn't going to pick this but this is all the stuff you can do and sort of push the edge of like what the possibilities are for Drupal functionally and visually so any more opinions I'd like to say something I think as some of these current initiatives come to completion things like automatic updates and project browser Drupal will become a little bit more relevant because we lost a lot of our site builders at that very complicated learning curve between 7 and 8 so I do see a lot of hope because we've lost them to that quick UI when you go into WordPress it's really easy yes you have to pay for everything but as a non developer going into Drupal UI you can't even extend your site so I have a lot of hope for the future of Drupal as these experiences open back up to those site builders we don't you know if you have a non profit to have a $200,000 developer now to do your updates you can have a site builder and I think we'll be seeing more of those smaller sites and more of those universities more of the multi sites where everyone has their own site that they have to you know you have your main site and then everyone maintains their own site and you can't afford to have a $200,000 developer on each of those little sites so I do see a lot of hope for the site builder experience that we've been lacking for a couple of years that's interesting and maybe explains why when I was showing the graph before we are growing on certain segments which some people call enterprise in Drupal but we are losing people that cannot afford companies that cannot afford those expensive sites, Cristina yeah so probably and my answer is going to be a little bit depressing here but Drupal is not doing super well basically I would say we are on a place where or we take off or we are on with serious problems on the innovation perspective and in my experience with all the initiatives that I've been involved usually the problem is having like teams working on that not some people working from time to time but really a lot of people working if you want to make a big change you can't put a few hours on a week and that's all you need teams that review each other work and are there all the time and if you don't have that that won't happen you can make big changes and actually the way the competitors we are competing with right now they have funds and they have people full time innovating Gutenberg weeks like if you think about the experience the UI experience that there is outside our island it's amazing and we're not keeping up and how can we do that and the only way is like having teams that work on that and it's not that simple like us let's create an initiative and let's hope that people show up so maybe to add to that I think there's two large elephants in the room and we might not have mentioned that but do you remember what happened like last year or like the largest innovation that happened earlier this year what's it's name xa qipiti ai it's an elephant in the room that I think we don't mention enough and then I think also for us like this where the eyes are so okay we have the eyes all there and then we have to look at and towards what you said where are those people and what do people study if they come from university if they go to web technology what's the language that they they learn this is not python a bit but that's more for the data engineers in a way but it's javascript so there's a lot of people and eyes on javascript and then we have the good question where does Drupal fit in if you talk about these two elephants ai which is not very open source compatible yet so then it's a good question like how fast should Drupal go there and how do we cater to those that come from university I think it's not really possible to transform all the universities I think it should teach BHP I think we should teach motivations and figure out how to convert those bright minds into that ecosystem of Drupal and then work on those initiatives but have these inspiring initiatives as well and maybe we should talk about like what do we do it ai what's our direction that's interesting in terms of we are, I've written an article where I say that Drupal is boring it is boring because in that article where they talk about boring technologies they are established technologies they are very strong, they are very stable so in a way it's good that it's boring it's not a bad objective maybe we cannot compete in javascript but we have a very strong technology that works really well with javascript why don't we use marketing and we use the power of the wizards that this was talking to position ourselves at the best technology for whatever the young people or the new people we can be bold we should be bold Scott? yeah, what was my point so I think that sort of to maybe talk about kind of Christine's point again about I don't know maybe I'm just a dumb American optimist like I have to respond with optimism no matter what well the reality is I think that for large projects for big code bases in general like eventually if there's two kinds of innovation incremental and disruptive disruptive disruptive innovation is very difficult for a large project or any large application I think when I was thinking about it the symphony the symphony integration is an example of how easy it is to shift it in the other direction but it's really hard to shift things we couldn't just say I think wordpress tried it and said let's make react the front end and I don't know if it's really Gutenberg is good at what it does but did it shift things in a positive direction and I think probably not in fact wordpress is flat in the last couple years in terms of market share so I think that we should somewhat accept incremental innovation and figure out how to get the most out of it but I also think that Drupal core like do we put AI into Drupal core like does that create more benefits or consequences and I think that a lot of the innovation that we see that I see in Drupal that looks cool is one level down from core it's what the agencies are doing with it and I think that's what's gonna have to probably drive innovation and bubble up to core when necessary and Drupal core needs to be focused on focusing the innovation and keeping it alive so agencies can find their verticals and target their verticals or do marketing automation asp kind of stuff or innovate down at that level Question from the public Yeah, I was gonna ask do you think that Drupal needs to kind of define its target market more instead of at the moment it feels like Drupal is trying to be everything for everyone and kind of then it's kind of nothing to anyone because is the sort of like where do we innovate right what's the niche that we're going after or the niches and then that will kind of help know where to focus the community on the initiatives whereas where at the moment it feels like we're just kind of hey whatever people want to do you can self-organize maybe if you've got enough time and we'll get it in is do we need to sort of take a step back and work out what are we building so that we can then what we need to build and sort of gather around that kind of innovation because yeah you're sort of like should you know the question of should open AI be in Drupal or should AI be in Drupal why should it be in Drupal or not like you need some criteria right so are there thoughts around what the target market is So I totally agree with you there wasn't a direction set for Drupal until like and everybody like oh I have this idea let's try to put that in Drupal core or like I don't know Luckily this past year a strategy has been defined for Drupal as a product and it has defined 3 main points and I don't remember them right now sorry but it's basically I think it's about making it easier like for I'm on a miss one I think it's making it easier for beginners yeah like easier to start easier to use I don't remember but there is a strategy there and the initiatives that have been created lately like project browser for example fits in there like several things and the new strategic initiative the page building the new page building experience starts in there and this has been defined by the product managers with Lauri on the head like leading all these efforts and I think that's great because it doesn't take away the fact that there's people in the community also doing really great stuff but at least this thing about probably there are 25 different solutions to build pages with Drupal apart from paragraphs like layer builder 25 ways of work with layer builder and the same happened with components how many solutions we had in Drupal in the Drupal ecosystem for components and now we have SDC in core and it's at least the base for all the other ones to work on top of that and the page building experience is the same that's a direction let's work all together in there I think that one is still on the early process but at least there is a direction right now where Drupal wants to go I'm not sure if this is actually defining specifically the target that you are also asking but at least it's setting a strategy a path forward Nick very brief because I want to jump to the next question really rapidly so that's indeed the great direction and then it's a good question how do you move all these people towards that direction and then we have this thing called the credit system and I'm also a member of the board of Drupal and this weekend we spend a lot of time talking about how do we move that mass of people towards those strategic initiatives what already happens today is that we have weighted credits and if you are contributing towards those strategies that are set by the product or the direction you get a higher weight of the contribution you do now we probably could also talk about what does that mean for the company and should we add more value for those companies to those rewards that direction and play a bit with those rewards of going there Cristina, pretty quick I'm not sure which is the next one I'm not sure if it's related where are we going we don't do anything or whatever we are doing where do you think we are going then just a quick answer to that for the navigation we came several companies together to actually solve a problem that we all have which is the toolbar in core not being the reasonable basically 70% of sites just install something else it's not a solution so that's one of the ways to solve the problem it's a problem that it's trying to solve it for everybody why not working together that's all I think you have a question super quick, please basically I don't want to play the incremental innovation that you just mentioned but I would like to hear your opinion where Drupal will be in 5 or 10 years so what's the vision and the long term goals that we should have as a community I love that, because actually I'm going to jump to this question then because where do we want Drupal to be, right? Emilio? so where do we want Drupal to be is a complicated question we want it in a different place and that comes down to that contributor pipeline even at the organizational level we give them incentives to have developers work but over the years we've noticed a drop in organizations that pay for contrib time especially during COVID all of us were tired, time was a privilege the contribution numbers went down and then the lack of paid contributions went down as well and I think organizations need to kind of open their eyes a little bit and see that once they have developers working in Drupal core and in those conversations their feature requests will be made the way that you can drive open source is by being a part of it if you want something ask for it and work on it and we see that in some companies I'm not going to name them where they build tools to really help them out it helps them out but then they open source it too there's not that redundancy and we see more redundancy in Drupal open source than we see in the wider where we see lots of people solving it but not giving it back so I think that's something that is going to kind of drive where we want it to be it's going to go for who helps contribute to it I was going to ask you Scott from business point of view I love that I'm the business resource in this like conversation just so you know I used to be a lead singer of a death metal band called Corpse I just want to say that I have credibility I'm not just a businessman so I think that I think that the initiatives that we've talked about in the last couple years give me a lot of optimism I think the technical initiatives with the recipes and things like that sort of lift all boats they allow people to build stuff in Drupal and agencies to build things in Drupal regardless of whether they're like DXP focused or enterprise focused SMB focused or maybe even at the levels that we sort of have lost ground to so I think what I would like it to be is an open enough framework to where agencies and developers and the people that attracted me to the community are happy doing the work and are benefiting and flourishing from it I think that sort of open if it could be kept open enough and not be dragged in one particular direction I think that would be a powerful direction to go in Unfortunately, we have like two minutes Cristina, very quick Probably in five years or whatever it's going to be complicated we just seen how Twitter is dying and it was like an enormous it was a shift of how we use the web or how we use the internet so these changes are going to happen and we need to be prepared for that and the problem is that if we don't have a team of people like prepared to answer to this kind of innovation we won't be able to do that and I think we are on time still to build this team and it would be great that the Drupal Association will be somehow a key part of that because there are so many companies that want to help but then they don't know because how the way that we analyze ourselves for the navigation is because we met each other we knew each other so we could just talk about all these companies that don't know anybody like to start and to collaborate and that's I think that's a big problem and the Drupal Association can make these central part can become the central part and help all the companies join together the same efforts and maybe you don't have a person that can be contributing full time but maybe you have I don't know this extra money that could become a part of the grants or whatever or there could be like a team that is supported by the Drupal Association with several core contributors and I don't know they could be already prepared that they're working on this strategic initiative and this if there is this huge swift on the market we will be able to to answer to that I have your point of view because that's actually one of the questions I want to ask I want it because we don't have any more time like what should be the role of the Drupal Association maybe what I will do is I will put it in LinkedIn or Masthodon and we can participate in the discussion I want to finish here I want to give you an opportunity to send a message to the world about the future of Drupal I'll start if we want Drupal to stay relevant I'm not going to use the word easy because that's a reductive word but a pretty straightforward way to keep Drupal relevant is to talk about it so going outside of our bubble and talking at a Linux event or talking at a WordPress event I was just invited to talk at WordCamp US about Drupal contributions so we need to be there if we want it to stay relevant then even just once a week sharing a LinkedIn article with your LinkedIn network who isn't all Drupal so it's sort of our own responsibility to keep it relevant if there's one thing that I believe is that the whole like AI movement was transformative and it reminds me of the fight of freedom that we started with with open source we actually have that fight again AI today is not very open so what I hope in the future is like this most amazing site building experience sprinkled with a bunch of real open AI like open source AI and that's it and figure out how we can get there and I really believe that there's it's here to stay and I hope in five years we'll see another Drupal that we cannot even imagine today I think you've all been super quiet on this meeting just two people have asked questions and I'm sure in here there's a lot of ideas so I want to make sure that you all know that core commiters are open to listen you all and I have my contact open on Drupal.org and my DMs open so don't be shy come say stuff to us and I'm sure your ideas are also worth that we are doing things doesn't mean that you shouldn't so we are here so come and collaborate with us as the business resource I just want to say that right marketing initiatives that we're starting I think are very positive but you all have been marketing Drupal and we have been marketing Drupal for a long time in how we talk about it like has been mentioned and I think it's important to keep talking about it in a way that really shows like what you loved about it and be able to transmit that because I think that's the best thing we can do to you know that Drupal isn't going to have a new renaissance but if people see that there's engaged developers that are part of a community I think that matters a lot thanks a lot thanks a lot everyone see some questions coming