 Hello everyone and welcome to the most boring talk within this you know exciting event of the embedded Linux conference. Well maybe my talk is only one talk that is not covering about anything about the technological issue but I'd like to cover something quite boring issue that is a license compliance and also maybe all of some of you will be facing some of the difficult situation to make a leadership within each company to make the open source software license compliance or those kind of things and maybe you will be suffered from some of the not and not well understanding you know legal person or IP department person and I would I'd like to tell you why those kind of legal person are so so much stoneheaded or hardheaded guy. So anyway my name is Ueda and I'm coming from Japan and working for Sony and I have some of the maybe 15 years of experience dealing with the open source community through with the embedded Linux system and maybe you know that I'm one of the person who started the CE Linux forum about 15 years ago and CE Linux forum started this you know embedded Linux conference so that ELC is something like I feel ELC is something like a hometown of myself and within Sony I'm making a some of the leadership of the open source strategy and some of you were aware that Sony also have a github account github.com that is Sony's official account of the github although the number of the project within Sony's github is quite limited but we are starting something quite interesting for example we are starting to make a fabrication of the neural networking deep learning core engine as an open source software which is Sony's original software and also we I am now taking care of the Sony's GPO source code publication site as well and if you're looking to this GPO source code publication site you may find bunch of the products are already using Linux and somebody out of Sony people make accounting how many products are you know sleeping with Linux and none of the Sony company people did it but he counted out 1200 or more thank you very much for the Panasonic guy. Anyway today I'd like to consider about first about each company inside organization or some of the structure to deal with the open source software and some company is making up some of the core department of open source software like a cathedral and maybe this kind of organization they have here the executive located here and IPD stuff legal stuff and operating board and many of the engineers there like some company is saying that the 500 people or more than 10 10 1000 people are working for this kind of the department and that kind of department is taking care of a whole bunch of thing about open source software if you are belonging to such kind of a company maybe you will be definitely a lucky guy and maybe many of you will not be attending such kind joining such kind of company I believe I guess and in many cases within each company you are forming some sort of the in-house community to deal with open source software like this way as here's a scent in the center of the coordinator of the buzzer will be there and making some of the each volunteers are making some of the contribution each other and it's something like a buzzer style maybe you know that cathedral and buzzer is quite you know famous article which must be everybody where it's through but the problem is that there's somebody still have a quite loneliness in each company well nobody support me nobody no manager manager understanding me to use open source software but I'd like to use open source software what should I do what is my way what is your who can help me and is there any legal guy who can support me no one or that kind of you know struggling person will be still there I believe and maybe you will find here my footprints maybe I believe about maybe 10 years ago or something I or some of the Sony's person struggle with this kind of situation so that we'd like we'd not like to forget about the existence of those kind of people so if you are believing that you are belonging to the quite lucky guy please raise your hand within your company as well I know your company have such kind of things that's great yeah another one if you are belonging to some of the in-house you know community please raise your hand well about 37 percent okay next one is a great organization no one no no way there's nothing such kind of organization existing but I'm a lonely guy please raise your hand if you are a lonely guy maybe 26 percent and half of you have not raised your hand but it's okay so today I'd like to focus upon those two guys one is a lonely guy and another is an some of the person who are making a leadership within each company as an some of the in-house community so if you are the some of the lonely guy who have not who haven't who do not have any support from any person within your group or your company we'd like to consider what kind of world we can give to him the first challenge of those kind people will tackle with those kind of two you know misunderstandings one misunderstanding is that OSS is unconditional free of charge software this misunderstanding is a really dangerous one and which will lead another inappropriate use of the open source software and which maybe face some of the serious you know damage in each company or whatever like a litigation or whatever and second misunderstanding is that OSS is cloud with danger when it is used without OSS without any OSS to the to develop my software what should we do maybe those kind of software engineer will fall into some some of the conditional hell but software engineering itself must be quite interesting one should be quite something like heaven so that it is another big misunderstanding which make us unhappy so anyway first I'd like to recommend those kind people never give up to convince your manager to use the open source software without any good understanding of the management of people maybe the open source software use will be not so successful so that maybe you will tell something about increase of the advantage of the open source software increase of the quality avoid reinvention of the wheel stay at the cutting edge of the software innovation or whatever but what I'd like to say one thing is that never to talk about OSS is free of charge software and it will reduce cost it is really you not active for many of the management reduce the cost well it's okay but we mustn't forget about it one thing quite important thing that is the use of open source software the responsibility is up to every users the cost to use the open source software will be up to every users so that it is not true that open source software the use of open source software is cost-free use of open source software is never you know cost-free issue but we have to bear some sort of the cost to take responsibility of use of use of open source software oops here's another quite dangerous button that's here if we I put press this button screen should be a blackout anyway another thing is that we can recommend those kind of people to join some of the open community like here and maybe they will find they are not you know lonely guy and they can find out any of the partner out of the companies out of the out of the you know project and they will be able to find out some of the good you know experience there and we can exchange such kind of things for example ELC is one of the quite good place and within Tokyo or within Japan we are holding some of the three-month interval open source community embedded system guy event which is named Japan Technical Jamboree and another option will be that to initiate some sort of the you know quite light you know face-to-face meeting or whatever to have some of the network of those kind of you know lonely guy and third important thing is that never give up learning the essence of the open source software and software license of course if you can those kind of guy have some of the you know good relationship with the legal guy or some of the attorneys it must be a quite you know good health for them but even if those kind of people do not have any good assistance from the from the legal expert they should be they shouldn't give up reading the open source software license but talking with the legal guy some of the PR you may feel that legal talking will legal guy will cause some sort of trouble like this one risk risk risk risk risk risk there's a bunch of risk do not use open source software and it's something trick is here that you guess what fear risk risk and fear so that you shouldn't use the open source software that's some of the typical term of the legal guy always saying start saying I'd like to give some of the advocate advocation for those kind of legal persons before talking such kind of I'm not the legal expert so that please do not make any misunderstanding so that I'm not the person to make an official advocation but anyway for many cases of the software license license itself will prepare the license so that in order to get to know the intent of the licensor it's quite easy just read the license they're just reading the license will start is to understand what the licensor's intent is what license intent are think about open source software for example the Linux Linux kernel is licensed under gpl and gpl is prepared by free software foundation as you know but Linux community people are no free software foundation guy any cases the legal department people start just reading the gpl license and that is their majority to read such kind of you know a bunch of wordy text but think about it it will not satisfy to you know get to know the intent of the licensor because licensor and the person who prepared the license is different so that I wonder just simply reading the license term do not always suffice to know the intent of the licensor I mean that open source software community so this this is something of the pit pit hole of the legal or some of those kind guy so my suggestion is that make a some of the internal collaboration in between the person of the legal person and also the software guy who knows about technology and maybe community and then remove the risk risk risk some fear and get some of the position to use the open source software and the most important thing is to make up the internal good collaboration in between the legal expert and software community expert but in order to reach this kind of situation maybe those kind of lonely guy will have some of the many many you know difficult way so that we'd like to help them as much as we can for example I would like to make some of the suggestion to many of the people who are making the you know publication of the open source software by yourself add some of the hint to understand the open source software license like for example many people say many people say that what is the gpl contamination and second why we are not required to publish the our you know application software which is linked to the lgpl license it's something quite typical question many people raise but if it were the person who face this kind of problem from the legal viewpoint it must be a bit difficult to solve think about the case of the gpl contamination I don't like the word of contamination contamination just imply me that the gpl license software is something quite dirty or something more but it is not so that I hate to use a gpl contamination but many people are accustomed to say that gpl contamination so that I would like to follow that kind of manner but this is not my true heart anyway thinking about the gpl license gpl contamination you we have to read the section 2 for example this is the case of gpl version 2 read it for most of the you know legal department person it's quite easy they are quite accustomed to the word document the one problem is there however they hardly understand the technical issue but for the software engineer wow no way it's something like this some of them are puzzled into this kind of situation so that maybe we will be able to highlight some of the important keywords but this kind of highlighting is not always a health so much to the software engineer still not and another highlighting is here but it is also something quite insufficient to health software engineers so that we'd like to come back to the you know FAQ come to the FAQ of the free free software foundation which is saying well legal you know a program with two parts with and one program with two parts this is a legal question which alternately judges will be decide so that it's something like quite you know disappointing what is here but look quite closely into this kind of document if modules are designed to run linked together in a shared address space that almost surely means combining them into one program and by contrast types socket and command line arguments and communication mechanism normally used between two separate programs if it were the person who read this kind of text from the legal stuff maybe no way they cannot understand what it is saying but if it was read by the you know software expert it's quite easy to understand maybe everybody will be able to understand pipe socket command line argument oh that's it so that if we can tell the legal department person if it is subject to this kind of you know mechanism we can we can feel so you know easy to avoid the you know gpl license contamination or whatever that's kind of you know internal conversation within in between the legal expert and software expert will likely to be happen to make appropriate use of the open source software from in terms of the open source of the license agreement issue and second one is the lgpl issue everybody is saying that dynamic link and static link and dynamic link is okay and static link is not okay but in some case or blah blah blah something like that especially the legal guy will tend to say such kind of thing but if the person of the software engineer read the section six of lgpl version 2.1 especially a and b then everybody maybe every software engineers will be able to draw up this kind of picture quite instantly like if we follow up follow to the section 6a of the lgpl version 2.1 any linking method can be applied to link some of software library to your program and your program will be allowed to license after your choice but to this case you have to make some of the publication of the your program as well but it is allowed to license your program at your choice and second one is quite you know familiar one for many of the embedded software guy that is that section 6b if your program here is linked to the shared library with the sum of the appropriate way to use the shared library and there must be no argument about no argue about the dynamic linking mechanism of the Linux was surely used for the shared library to be linked so that we have no you know no question about this kind of thing so to this case your program is allowed to license at your choice and of course this case we are free from the source code of publication to your program as well but we mustn't forget about the one of the big you know assumption is here that is we mustn't you know for beat the you know reverse engineering to your program that's kind of thing is described in the section 6 of lgpl version 2.1 it must be rather easy whenever we can draw up this kind of picture maybe everybody will be easy to understand this kind of mechanism so i'd like to make a suggestion to many of the open source software publisher or open source software you know community people to write something about the guidance of the making the open source software license compliance from the viewpoint of the licensor of the open source software which may be quite helpful may become quite helpful for whom to use that kind of your program and maybe they will going to seek for the next phase and next phase will be a challenge to become a challenge to form the in-house open source software community that is getting into the buzzer style in order to get into that kind of style maybe it must be quite important to set up the collaboration and trust relationship in between the legal and ip experts and software engineers or some of the community relationship experts that is a trust and collaboration is quite important and important and a crucial issue but whenever we can establish this kind of internal trust and collaborative you know relationship together with those kind you know experts maybe it is a great step ahead to formulate the internal open source software user community or some of the usage you know mutual helping style so think about the in-house buzzer style this is chapter two of my presentation that is the in order to establish in-house community maybe we need some sort of the variety of the you know talents one is a software engineer who wish to use open source software that's of course and second one is open community relationship expert if we exist for many of the software engineers some of the barrier they are feeling to get into the open source community but if there's some person who have who has already encouraged to join the open source community he or she will become quite you know powerful partner within your company and third one is of course legal and ip expert and of course in-house community leader should be exist and support from the management I never say that support from the senior management or support from the executives but at least some of the management should understand this kind of situation and communication tool will likely to have and all participants should have at least minimum level of the understanding about open source software and the license so this is a case of Sony Sony have already set up in-house OSS committee and I'm taking a leadership of this this you know in-house OSS committee and about 100 members of in-house OSS user are joining this community coming from every business units within uh within a Sony umbrella and here's another group is here that is making oversight of this kind of situation that is named OSS strategy board that is also led by me and some of the person like Tim Bird or Frank Rowan or those kind of people and that kind of you know group is supported by corporate software strategy committee and also the professional advisory is there from legal ip department and public relationship and quality control department this is Sony's internal mechanism to deal with open source software and every business units have some of the person who are making a volunteer to collaborate within each other through this kind of internal open source software community and some of the person have an external OSS community relationship and some of those kind of people have already started to originate Sony original you know open source community like a deep learning core engine or whatever and maybe you will be able to see that kind of you know sprout at the at the Sony's GitHub site which I have already mentioned I am keeping it in my mind never build any style of the open source software and I have to we have to be kind enough to the person who are coming coming newly coming and joining the open source software user community within Sony and that is not only the user but also some of them are not just a user as I will mention later and of course we have prepared the guideline the guideline maybe you can guess the every company will have an internal rule an internal rule is saying that you must not do you must not do you must not set up the internet server without the uh some of the official you know approval or labor must not must not must not but my recommendation is that we'd like to start from you may use open source software you can use the open source software you can participate in the open source software community and minimize the max must not and of course it is quite important to be reminded the open source software license compliance is quite important I think this is only one must not which you we can see within Sony's internal guideline that is in order to deal with open source software community in order to use open source software never stray from the right path or do something devious that is only one must not and another thing is you may use open source software but of course adding some of the small words so long as you follow the open source software license so long as whatever but I think the Sony's internal guideline is quite permissive and of course in order to set up that kind of you know phenomenon that kind of environment we need to level up each you know employees understanding of the open source software to be raised so that we have already prepared some sort of the open source software training course one is a learning which which can be accessed even from the Sony music entertainment or Sony pictures entertainment as well Sony music entertainment Sony pictures entertainment why open source software it is because mobile applications software maybe you know that for the android application software ios application software in order to build up such kind of application software the use of the open source software can be will become quite you know casual so that even though those kind of people should have a minimum you know understanding about open source software and of course software engineers or some of the person who you know intensively relate with software should learn something quite intensive of the open source software issue so that we have prepared one training course that is 378 slides and it takes nine hours to go through and it's quite happy but more than 500 Sony software engineer already went through and they are giving me a big you know good reputation about it and of course i'm making a some of the tutor of leadership of this kind of training case and somebody gave me a good nickname this is where does open source software bootcamp but it must be a quite you know interesting unique name i like it and of course pull up 20 times if you make mistake here but that kind of you know joke i will never say and also one another recommendation is to use the open chain open chain already have a one curriculum maybe you can use this as an sum of the baseline of setting up your internal training course and you can add several stuff which is missing from your perspectives so thinking about the style of the buzzer of the user user user community within each company i think it have something quite you know good you know advantages but at some of them will be quite forgettable because those kind of people are something quite volunteer not not the expert or dedicated to deal with the open source software so that they sometimes forget about the importance to deal with the open source software community so that i will never forget about stress one thing that is never forget about open source software community and deal however related with those kind of community people and of course another thing is that i dare say do not stay just a user of open source software if you said if you find some bug you have make a bug report to the community you fixed it why not making a you know upstreaming to the community that was something that duty i always saying because when we forget about those kind of upstreaming of the of those kind bugs we sometimes say some of the strategy tragedy like uh it's actually uh experienced within my company that there's one serious bug we have found out in certain open source software but they forget to make some some of the upstreaming and later on another big bug uh happened to find out in the community side so that we have obliged to update that kind of software to that latest version and then we found out our found out another bug still there and the condition become became worse so that we should we are obliged to make another tasks to fix up such kind of things that's something of the tragedy so that we mustn't forget about upstreaming if it is just belonging to the bug fix or some of the minor minor you know feature up and also the advantage of the open source from viewpoint to technological strategy that is we can make a some of the uh become a some of the cutting edge position of software engineering or software technological stuff so anyway i think the basal style we have a bunch of you know advantages because everybody will have a good you know knowledge about open source software so that the diversity we can keep so that uh if somebody start thinking about the new businesses or some of the new challenges over the software engineering uh software technological issue we can make an adapt to that kind of you know change but on the other hand we have several you know minority like uh less possibilities to join the open source community as i mentioned and effort to maintain the participants knowledge and experience of open source software i'm getting to be something quite you know uh you know uh optimistic about it because they are training is making some sort of the success within my company and also another one is a serious one less budget so my final question right now is that our future is going toward the cathedral or not at this moment i do not think the way to the cathedral and well not our way but we'd like to uh make the sony internal community as exciting as possible and to challenge a bunch of you know challenges of ourselves to support by those kind of community okay it's all thank you very much for your attention and thank you and if you have some question or discussion or your experience uh please let us know thank you very much okay i see i cannot remember some of the exact case at this moment but some of the r&d team are now start challenging that kind of thing and quite shortly that will be subject of my problem and maybe uh we will be able to solve uh just uh reading through the lgpl license uh precisely well uh to that's case maybe we will just you know make us you know publication of the lgpl library portion that is uh am i making some of misunderstanding to your question yes yeah yeah we will make a you know lgpl library portion a source code of publication that will will do and also along with the lgpl license time to be to be you know uh shown uh accompanied with that kind of products as well as you know uh or written offer the way to the uh obtain those kind of source code what should be accompanied that we are doing yeah so we fundamentally understanding lgpl is one of the type of the gpl so long as we you know circulate or some distribute the uh binary code subject to the lgpl we have to follow the way of the gpl but only one exception is linking and linked to the linked software we have we got another you know exception because of that kind terms so maybe we can uh remember the nature of lgpl library gpl and library gpl means that uh free software foundation make an exception uh thinking about you know case of the lg library special case so that that will be quite easy to be understood okay anybody else okay here we go yes off of course i i suggest you to talk to the uh you know legal expert to this case but maybe any kind of you know a way that that that he does is a turbo or whatever so long as that is a appropriate way to distribute the source code for the person of the expert of the software engineer that will become appropriate one i believe sorry but i cannot say some of the decisive decisive thing i'm a legal expert yeah i know shoot shoot shoot yeah right and you have to keep that kind of you know service at least three years that is written in the gpl go ahead of of course we know that that kind is quite controversial and somebody will say something but if it were the gpl i am believing every method of the linking or call some of the gpl contamination so that to that case if that kind of software library is licensed and gpl not lgpl to that case every software should be obliged to follow the you know obligation of the gpl like you know source code publication or whatever so that's what i am thinking are you asking me about uh sony internal guideline or some other you know general yeah we have we have such kind things and i personally have one of the you know challenge to make those kind of you know things in a some of the public space and i am now communicating with with a book publisher if it is possible to make that kind of thing available in a you know open place but sorry starting from the japanese yeah definitely that that and i think the deviant case is something of the best practice and many of the open source community people should follow like that kind of you know guidance the users should be quite feeling quite at ease and will expand the case of the user user base anybody else okay thank you very much for joining this boring you know talk and have a good day