 Alright, so John, we're talking about what happens if we have a free program, maybe we were beta testing it, and now we're moving that into a paid format. So, you know, with, with, okay, so first of all, you can launch, of course, you can launch a paid program anytime. The free program isn't a required prerequisite before a paid program happens. Actually, I do want to mention this, a lot of people think it is, that is a required launch sequence is free Facebook five day challenge, right, or 30 day challenge or whatever, and then move into a paid program. I almost want to rant against it because I'm so sick of that sequence, you know, but not not not not about your your program, but john I'm just saying generally I've been taught that I've been I've seen that all of my colleagues I'm doing that for 12 years. And I'm like, oh my God, yet another free five day challenge on Facebook or or wherever it doesn't matter. Nowadays, there's other platforms, but, but I just think listen, if you have a program or group or product that is the right match with your audience, they should be happy to pay for it and they not should be, they will be happy to pay for it. If you have a large enough warm audience, and you've done the market research or you have somehow good market intuition that this is the right program to sell. So the bottom line. So the free program so in other words I'm kind of separating the two projects. The free group of free program which I've done before as well. I do it more like an experimentation of beta test of the concepts, the exercises, the way the program is structured. I think that's wonderful to beta test. And I think you should do it. But now, john, we're talking about simply launching a paid program. Some of the free people might not, maybe none of the free people sign up for your pay program, but your other audience, you're the rest of maybe one of or a certain percentage of the free folks might sign up. But what I guess what I'm saying is that we don't expect that just because they were part of the free thing that they that they have some kind of obligation, or interest even to sign up for the paid one and that's where kind of I that's my complaint about the, the free Facebook five day or 30 day challenges is that the creators of those free quote unquote challenges. It's what john you appreciate this because you know you and I both enjoy the bug of a guitar right. And you know, it's like the free challenge people have completely fallen to the trap that the bug of a guitar is talking against which is they completely attached to the fruits of their actions. They're completely attached to the fruits of their free challenge that literally the creators of the groups are like resentful. If the people from the free, they work so damn hard to serve the free people. Why didn't they sign up for my paid program. They feel resentful towards them, or some of them anyway. And the other thing I think which is part of the diseases and we're going off the track here but yeah, yeah, is that people buy into a formula. Yes, and they think that the formula is some secret sauce or magic. And so if they follow the formula why didn't they get the right case if they expected it. Yeah. Exactly. It's just exactly. Yeah. And so, there are so many factors right there's a million other factors like the formula was taught by a creator who already had a super warm audience a large enough warm audience, who had already been consuming their content or particular area for maybe years. And when they launched the program or of course, obviously they're warm audience who already understand their expertise and trust their people and had maybe they've done some market research. It's like, how come the format. No, no, you know, it's like, it's like you don't have all the assumptions that they that the teacher came with. So anyway, belongs to reassure john I think that you already have a warm audience. I think you should just go ahead and launch the pay program. Yes, and some of the free people. Obviously they're going to hear about it. And you should tell them about it. And some of them might join but I would say, take the bet obviously take what you've noticed in the free the part of you know what's the benefit. How can we utilize the benefit of the free group to help us launch a pay program better. Well the free group essentially is your market research group. I see a market research what I mean is you can basically number to two ways to market research right observation and then questioning right so observations like going. Gosh, what prompts or topics have I put into the free group that were particularly, you know people loved or people like really engaged with well that's the observation of these topics questions, bullet points issues, trust challenges, frustrations goals, those. I should definitely put on the sales page for my paid program. And notice the topics prompts questions issues that I thought were important but they didn't really need. I'm not going to advance for them or whatever. Okay I'm not going to put down on the sales page. I might talk about that anyway, and then questioning them so john this is a great opportunity that you should ask them. Well, I mean you probably are asking them already it's like, what other, you know, I mean you're doing a tick tock program so. Hey guys what when you think about you're doing a tick tock what's what's really, what's really, what's really difficult for your like what are you really curious about in terms of the tick tock. algorithm or the tick tock community or the near or what makes tick tock videos work like what what are you really curious about like what what would you love to like if I could just figure this one thing out. Right, that asking them these types of questions or the other question to ask them which I love doing is what other courses have you bought recently, what other programs are you thinking of signing up for anybody. And then they'll tell you oh yeah yeah I'm thinking of buying so and so's course on this or so and so's program on that and you should be taking mad notes go. That's good to know, thank you. And then you go and research those core sales page and go. What about, what is it about those that I can emulate you know. So basically, john you have a you have a captive audience for market research right now. Great, I've been learning the other bottom line question if I can just follow up is price point. I mean I'm where I'm at right now is I'm thinking about basically following your example and making it 80 bucks a month. Do you have any comments about that. Well, um, yeah, price point is a tough one because it totally depends on what your audience is used to. And so it really everybody has built a different audience. I mean, sometimes we've built an audience through joint ventures and partnerships and the people from that, that those joint venture partners audiences are used to a certain price, higher price or lower price. Sometimes we built an audience just through social media or more randomly, perhaps, or through ads or whatever and we don't actually know yet what they're accustomed what they're accustomed to in terms of price point, which is also why market research is so important, which is why we ask our group and our audience. What was the last what was the last course you sign up for. What was not the last I mean just tell me any course or program that you remember signing up for, especially in the realm of insert broad topic that your paid program is going to be about. Oh yeah I you know let's say you're going to do a course on on tiktok that the paid program let's say. So oh yeah yeah I signed up for George's authentic video creation course and that was 150 bucks. Oh no thank you very much and it was 150 a month. No no 151 time. Oh okay good to know. So then you know okay well this one voice represents probably 10 or 15 or 20 other voices in your audience and so okay at least there's one vote for this price point. Well let's look at what other votes are there. And so I mean absent the market research actual feedback from your audience on what price point they're used to in this field. What you can do is just guess. I mean really at that point well now I mean there's also observation of your peers in your who have a similar audience. What price point are they charging. Is it working. And sometimes it's hard to know if it's working because they might the sales page might look amazing, but they might have, you know, three people signed up, I don't know. So you almost have to either be friend them and find out if it's selling well, which is one of the most useful things you can do with a partner with a potential with a colleague is to tell each other what programs are selling well and what programs are not selling well. It's like that's such valuable information that you wouldn't have known until you were on the inside. So, so john I would say, you know, part of the pricing of course also involves how much time you are investing in a particular. So offering and say well for for that amount of time I'm investing. How much am I expecting to earn. So how much time you're investing and how many people do you expect to be able to sign up reasonably based on your previous launches, and without previous launches. It's hard to it's hard to determine that it's like, this is why I'm always tracking my launch numbers always always oh the previous launch of this program got this many enrollees at this price point. This launch probably into similar. Okay. Yeah, I don't. I'm sorry to interrupt. I don't have that history. Exactly. So this is going to be a question that I think might be interesting to other people too. I'm in a meditation group and the teacher actually has kind of not kind of like she has a sliding scale. Yeah, this is your basic price. Yeah, this is your she has like a very graceful kind of categories. Yeah. Well, have you have an opinion about that. Maybe I do very much have an opinion on slide for options. Yeah. Yeah, I'm going to give you. I have a whole blog post on sliding scale, which which has a video discussion on it as well which you can you can I'm going to put that in the chat below. And for the sake of time, given that I'm going to let everyone out on time today. I'll just say that sliding scale. The people who want to do sliding scale, like you are because you're very compassionate. And you care about your audience and you want it to be. Okay, so this is on the one hand there's because I don't know what the right price. Exactly. On the one hand there's in there's there's compassion on the other hand there's insecurity. I don't know why a sliding scale happens it's like I'm compassionate and I have no effing clue what what my work is worth. And so, so so it's almost like you're outsourcing the decision to your audience the police to audience tell me what I should be charging because I have no idea. So, but the problem with sliding skills many there's many problems like I don't like it I think ultimately we should do market research, of course, figure out what our own investment into our time and money and therefore what we need to be compensated back. And ultimately, we have to test with a humble offer to say hey what do you think what do you all think. Here's the price. Here's the thing. And you could offer scholarships to you know I really don't see a problem with that. I don't see it in place scholarships but sliding scale. I would say. So anyway, that's my opinion on it you can read more and thank you. Thank you so much sorry to take so much time. No, no, thank you. I really appreciate it. Yeah, I really appreciate you.