 All right, thank you and good evening, everyone. Welcome to our December 9th, 2021 airport advisory board board meeting last meeting for the year. Michelle, would you mind please calling the role. Sure. Steve bliss. Malcolm Dean. Here. Harrison Earl. Present. Kent Jacobson. Here. Linda Jordan. Here. Russell Robison. Here. Orion Wiseman. Here. Council Member Peck. You have a quorum. Thank you very much. First item on our agenda is public and invited to be heard. But I don't believe we have anybody in the meeting, nor who I asked to speak. Stop for a second in case I missed something. Hearing none then let's move on to approval of the minutes from our October 14 2021 regular meeting. I don't have any comments changes on the minutes. Mr. Rosen. Page two line 10. I think it's just a homophone error on site should be on hyphen. Noted. Okay. Anybody else, Mr. Jacobson. I hate to be the proverbial nit thicker, but a couple of comments. The last line in that section. The word repaired. It should be repairs. So that's page one line 29. Okay. And. On page two. Under final call, the paragraph starting with Dave cop. Third line. The word needed should be stricken. And it should read that needs repair. Or that needs that needs repairs. The way it reads it's it's looked like it's asking for more broken fuel pumps. I don't think you want that. That's what we've been doing wrong all this time. So, so Ken, that's lines 34 and 35. I'm sorry. I'm going to start over lines 34 and 35 of page two. And basically the way what you're suggesting is striking the word needed. Yes. Replacing it with that need repairs. That need repairs. So we would say and agreed with the previous caller that there is more than the broken fuel pumps that needs repairs at the airport. Yeah. Perfect. Did you have another one? And I appreciate your nitpicking because I read through it did not catch any of it. Yeah. Okay. Anyone else. I would entertain a motion to approve the minutes with those three amendments then. I'll say I'll start that. Make the motion to make the motion for that. Okay. Okay. Okay. I'll make the motion for a second. I'll second the motion to accept the minutes with the amendments. Moved and seconded. Any more discussion. All those in favor, raise your hand, please. As we're all removed again. All right. No one in post. So carries by all of us who are present unanimously. Move on to old business and our financial update. We'll at least start us off here. Thank you. Chairman Earl. So Johnny Marsh, assistant city manager. Nice to see you all again. So I am not sure what format David provided, but I did get a budget report run yesterday. So Jeff and I could take a look at where things are at. Obviously Michelle and I have been keeping up on that the whole time so that we are not, you know, wildly overspending the budget. Obviously. I'm not sure if you're aware of that. I'm not sure if you're aware of that. As it stands right now, we have about $76,000 left in this year's budget. About 15 of that is our admin transfer fee that will automatically be taken out at the end of December. And we have the rest of the $61,000 are in encumbrances. One of those encumbrances is for. The fees for. Jeff's firm as they manage the airport. And we have a lot of funds in the amount of the funds that are being taken out this year as well. So those funds won't be fully expended in 2021. And then we have funds encumbered in two other PO's one for snow plowing in the amount of about $10,000, which while we wish it would snow, it doesn't seem like we'll expend to those funds in 2021 either. So we just put a, a bigger amount in there just to hold it and make sure we had adequate amounts. And then we're going to be able to, we're going to be able to, we'll be the payment for the detention pond that was built with the Kropowski hangers. So I have checked into the status of that project. It is not finaled out with our engineering inspection staff. So I can't pay that until that happens. And it sounds to me like that probably is going to carry into January. So those are some of the things that are hanging out there. I think that's a good point. I think that's a good point. I think that's a good point. I think that's a good point. I think that the employee leaves the city or in our case where David passed away, we do have some additional expenses in the personnel line items where sick leave is paid out and some other insurances come out of this, the airport budget. So while it looks like there are some, like we've gone over budget, those are pretty standard where we, we pay out someone sick leave according to our regulations. And if you have any other questions, I'm happy to answer what I can and we'll figure out a better format to bring this to you going forward. Yeah. And Johnny, I can share what David had previously given to us the format. I mean, I don't know if it needs to necessarily be in that format, but at least as a guy or how we're, how we're used to seeing it. Yeah, I saw the form and it. So I'll need to spend some time around someone in finance to spend some time to pull that together for Jeff and I. Okay. Comments, questions from board members. Yes. Yeah. We'll go ahead and rest. Russell. Yeah. There we go. I'm mostly interested in the CIP. I think usually at the beginning of the year, David would give us an update on that. Maybe update the plans for the next few years. So I guess my request would be at our next meeting. And I'll be giving a sort of a partial update on that and some of the new business items that are sort of CIP related. And then we'll make sure on the January meeting that we have a complete CIP review for you. Correct. Linda. Yeah, just looking to next year, was that budget. Had David. I think you've done the budget that was done earlier in the year. So we have an update ready to go for the CIP balance and any plans for the next 10 years or so. Yeah. I think you've done the budget that was done earlier in the year. So we have a budget in place. Don't we? Going into 2022. Commissioner Jordan. We do. So. Yeah. David did the budget. I approved it. It went through council. And along with any CIP items. And as you know, any CIP, like the South side utility project, that's all still sitting in CIP encumbered and that will roll over so that we can get that project started hopefully. And out to bid in January. I think we're going to be able to do that. But yes, we will make sure we, yes, everything's in place for 2022. So how is the, the billing. Lisa's, you know, the, the day-to-day business to collect income for the airport. Who's handling that? Are you guys, is that still you and Marika doing everything? Or is that just, are you doing that job? I'm picking that up. I don't know. I don't know. I don't know what to add. Joni had one of her analysts start reviewing a lot of leases to sort of figure out where we're at. I've picked up that ball. And spent a tremendous amount of time. Really making sure that our invoicing process is matching the terms and conditions of the agreements themselves. There are some inconsistency because. Some are quarterly, some are annually, some are not being billed consistent with the lease. There are some time periods that are not matching as far as annual renewals. So I'm pretty close to, I think by the end of next week, I'll have that all figured out. We are behind by quite a few months. On invoicing pretty much since about July. So those invoices will, some people have been great and sending their check in without an invoice. But we will be getting all the invoices sent out over the next two weeks before the end of the year. For any of the back end voices so that we can get those up to date. I will tell you that probably because of my review and some changes, it's going to raise some questions. And so we'll deal with those as they come. Yeah. No, that's good though. Yeah. I think that's good. As fuel flowage and leases and our, our income sources are finite and then the, the tower leases, those are probably on our auto pay, I'm sure by the. Telecom companies. So. Which you're right. Those are the two biggest ones. Yeah. Those are actually up to date. Good. Yeah. We've been sending out. We got caught up on the elite aviation invoices. We've been sending out. We've been sending out. We've been sending out. We've been sending out. We've been sending out these. So those are up to date. And I believe the tower one has been paid on a regular basis. Nice. Nice. That's a good cash cow. We got there. So that's good. Well, I appreciate that because that's some, you know, that. We need the funds and. Everybody's got to pay their rent. So I'm glad that that's getting a look. So we'll get some cleanup done. That and have a, um, will we. How do we, uh, You know, you know, you know, income wise after the audit. Um, Can't do you make that kind of change, Joni, and, and reflect, uh, anticipated income higher than what was budgeted, or did we just roll with it and see how the year goes. Probably gets picked up between fill flow and some of those ramp fees and some of those other variables. I would imagine. Yeah. So typically we provide revenue projections during the David provided I did see those. We typically don't get asked for updates from our budget office prior to that, but certainly we can take a look at that and see if there are any changes that we can bring to the board. It won't change the actual budget, however, for 2022. So, but yeah, we can take a look. Good, good. And I don't think what my review is really identifying any significant revenue changes. It's more of, you know, someone's pain for a year's worth of rent in August when it really should be April one. And so there's this overlap of a period of time which we had to, we'll have to slide the invoicing to get it on the same time period that the lease agreement is. I don't think there's gonna be a significant change other than as we all know, inflation is up. And all of these agreements are adjusted on an annual basis based upon the Denver or Lakewood CPI. The last 12 months ending September of 2021, CPI had a 4.5% change. Two months prior to that, it was 3.7. So some of these invoices that we will be sending out during this time period will reflect that change. And so you'll see an increase in revenue because of that because it wasn't anticipated being that high an increase. Okay, thank you. And can I just follow up on this, maybe just an admin question more, but as you guys do this billing, as we know there's a lag because we're behind, all that revenue still gets booked to 2021. So we don't have kind of these weird swings when we look at prior years. Is that there even if you collect it in January or how does that work, just so we know we're not, I don't wanna see like a wild swing in 2022 revenue from four months of 2021 basically, just as much. So anything we bill, that's why Jeff was saying, we're trying to get it all billed in 2021. So it can be recognized as 2021 revenue and I'll double check with DN and make sure that that's how they're booking in. It shouldn't be a cause for concern. I guess that's a good question. Are we cash or are we accrual? Is the city accrual? Okay. Well, all the municipalities I've worked with are always on an accrual basis. So as long as we get the invoices out, it will be recognized in 2021. Okay. Any other questions from any other board members? LaJoni, you alluded to this outside utility project. So can we just move straight into that under our new business section? Sure. So update is short and sweet, but it looks like we'll get that project out to bid in January. I met with the engineering director and his team and Jeff and I have met with them. We've had the Dibble folks take a look. There were some changes because we think some of the initial design was gonna lead to some pretty significant change orders potentially. So we wanted to make sure we didn't run into a project we couldn't afford at some point because we do have some limited funds. So we've changed some of the design and the layout. And Alexander Doska is the city utility engineer who is getting that project completed and purchasing. And Alexander let me know that they believe they will have that ready to put back out through purchasing sometime in mid January. Questions from any of us. We've gone through a few iterations of design and on this project already. Anyone have any thoughts on that? Mr. Robinson. Yeah, I just wanna make sure I understand or remember correctly at this point. It's been planned and engineered, but no actual digging has been done at this point, is that right? Correct. Okay. So we have to follow the city's procurement processes and go out to bid and do the whole formal city procurement process that's found in the municipal code. So that does take some time. And hopefully Si would garner by if we put it out for a few weeks and do all of the requisite meetings and onsites with any interested in perspective contractors, we might be under contract in early March. Based on the design, as it's revised and knowing what construction costs have been doing, you still think this is within a budget that was originally presented as part of the CIP or are we at this point with budget on this? So the budget for that particular project was a little over $740,000. And we do feel fairly confident that we can get that project done, at least engineering folks, based on the bids they've been seeing, especially for other city water and sewer projects, they feel that that is still an adequate amount of funds. And that's something we'll certainly keep our eye on because there's not a lot of other options in terms of pots of money for that project. So our goal, if we need to make changes to meet that cost, we can certainly do some of that once we see the bids. Yeah, and just to add on to that from the meetings that Joni and I have had, the primary change that concerned on the change orders was the original design was basically running along the roadway where South airport side goes. And anytime you're dealing with roadways and fencing and things like that, you have a lot more impact. The redesign is basically bringing it infield and running along the south edge of Taxiway Bravo. So you basically are just dealing with raw dirt. And so a lot less physical impact of existing infrastructure. So that's one gonna say time and money. Second is that because we're staying on the inside, the flexibility that we have because the south side development past what is already developed is not gonna be done all at once. And so we can not take those sewer lines all the way down the south end of the property. If we don't need to to save on some money and have it be designed more in a phased process. Jeff, is the line that's going in in size to be able to support that future development? So we don't have to kind of go back in and fix this? Yes. Okay. Russell, I saw you had something. Thank you. I was just looking back at the original CIP that David gave us two years ago and it shows that 400,000 out of that 740 was supposed to come from Colorado State. Are those funds secured? I mean, what is that? Yeah. So they have basically promised that they'll give it to us when we need it. Yep. Okay. It's been approved and they've been communicated with and they are standing by for our time and need. So that money is there for us. Great. Any other questions? Well, and Jeff, you're up on a prairie dog mitigation. So prairie dogs are abundant out of the airport. When I do my inspections, I see them regularly. We've had several meetings with the city department that oversees city-wide prairie dog mitigation. We have a plan. There's been a plan that's been in use. There may have been a little bit of a slowdown when there wasn't people pushing the issue but it's back on the radar. We've had now two months in a row, end of October, end of November efforts to deal with prairie dog mitigation. Just really briefly, the process is, is that a landscape company comes out in a designated area, fills up all of the prairie dog holes, puts the dirt back in and covers them up. Two days later, the city staff will come out and see which ones have been dug out because lots of prairie dog holes become inactive. So you obviously don't wanna target the inactive ones. You wanna target the active ones. So once they have been dug out then they work on dealing with the prairie dogs and those active holes. I've also been doing one of the meetings because there are times where we need, they only do that on a monthly basis, March through November. Prairie dogs are fairly stagnant and they don't hibernate per se but they don't come out as much. So it's hard to identify the active holes during the winter time. Of course, we haven't gotten a winner yet but I have been provided some canisters to address individual holes that may be problem childs out there. And yes, if you have a vision of Bill Murray and Catty Shack, I do too with the canisters and stuff but we will be actively have been and actively addressing prairie dogs at the airport. Jeff, has this something that's been going on for a while? This hasn't been a topic that's been talked about in the last, all at least 18 months or so. Well, I certainly have gotten my ear full from airport tenants about prairie dog issues. There is opinion out there that there was an aircraft accident caused by a prairie dog that got on the runway. They can be a safety hazard. And so we have $15,000 a year right now to address prairie dog mitigation. Anyone else questions? All right. You wanna keep on rolling into snow if it ever arrives? No removal. I thought coming in at the end of October that my first challenge was gonna be snow removal. Did too. Here we are almost mid-December. We've beat an 1889 record and tomorrow will be an 1887 record and be the longest stretch this area has ever had without snow. Made my job a lot easier. But I will tell you, there is a plan in place. I've met with city public work staff. We've gone all over the procedures and safety procedures for doing snow plowing. The triggers of how much dry snow, wet snow, slush will trigger snow removal, the communication protocols and all the safety protocols necessary. The city public work staff will be working in conjunction with a contractor, Nixcavating. They are a city-wide contractor that assists with snow removal as well. So I have sent out to all of the airport tenants the snow removal plan, a graphic of the areas and the priorities of those areas that snow removal will take place. I know we may have some snow tonight, but I don't think it's gonna be enough that's gonna trigger snow removal. And I'll let you know at the next meeting, hopefully how our snow removal plan is gone. Questions, comments from anybody. I'm glad we had the time, because it would have been difficult had something big happened in the interim. So I'm glad you've had the time to do it. Now it's in place, now bring on some snow. Exactly. Let's test it out. Was Nixcavating doing the plowing before? Were they on the airport before? They were not. There was another contracting company that was doing it before. And since a lot of the effort now has been transferred to city public works, they wanted to feel more comfortable of working with a company that they've been working with on an ongoing basis. And so that's I think the primary reason for a change. Plus I believe there was a bidding process, a city procurement process that Nixcavating was the bidder selected. I will say that the one thing that I anticipate to be the biggest issue slash challenge is that Mr. Slater used to go over and borrow a pickup truck with a snow plow and assist in the process, focusing primarily on a tenant leasehold and removing their snow. That is not in the current snow plan. Our focus is gonna be on the city areas, the runways, taxiways, the public apron areas. So this has been communicated to the tenants. I would love to find a way going forward to do a more comprehensive plan, but there are liability issues, there's cost issues when you're plowing on exclusive tenant use areas. That's been a discussion for a while. So no surprise there. Mr. Weisman. I wanna know in the last meeting during public to be heard that there was some questions just about, or some concern just about the airport and its priority when it comes to plowing. Can you speak a little bit to the current plan? And you said there were triggers by which plowing will commence, but kind of how that will work in concert with the other responsibilities at the city house. Yeah, and so working with Matt McKenzie and Ryan Freeman over at Public Works and the fact that we got an excavating as our contractor, I've been given assurances that there will be sufficient equipment and personnel to meet the demands when those triggers are hit. And I don't remember them specifically off the top of my head, but it's three inches of dry snow, one inch of wet snow, and I think one inch of sludge or something to that effect, which are those triggers of when snow removal needs to take place. Okay, thank you. Uh-huh. Anyone else? Okay. Then Jeff, we still got you in a second at least and the Vassie. I had to shut my office door, sorry. No problem at all. Vassie, quick, the Vassie that was taken out in an accident, which possibly was the one caused by a prairie dog is still down. We are actually, I shouldn't say we, the FAA is actively looking at finding a replacement and or repair. When I came on board, there was a lot of, no one really knew whether the city owned the Vassie or the FAA owned the Vassie, which obviously would dictate who was responsible for finding a repair. The determination through the FAA was that the FAA owns the Vassie. So that places the responsibility on them, both cost and effort. They are working at it. The problem is Vassie is our old technology. They don't have replacement in stock. So that's what's slowing this down. Our firm was managing the Boulder Municipal Airport for a period of time. They since hired my employee away from me. And he's now the airport manager, which it's all fine. It's good, small industry. But he believes that they have an old Vassie in storage when they replace their approach system. That has yet been validated. I'm hoping that's true. And then we'll be able to borrow theirs or actually take theirs if they don't need it. So don't have an end report, but just in progress right now. And Jess, I should have led with this. For the non-pilots, can you define Vassie in 30 seconds? Vassie is a visual system that pilots use to determine whether or not their angle of approach to the runway is on course, whether you're too high or too low. Red over red, you're dead. Red over white, just right. White over white, too high. So that's basically how it's used. Well, and that one's important because you're coming over those dark fields at night. It's so dark below you, you've got very little reference. I will attest to that. I brought my plane in. I flew in from Lincoln, Nebraska last week. Landed at about 8.30 at night. I saw you. I saw a plane coming in because I looked it up coming in from Lincoln. You've got a twin. Yeah, I saw you come in. I was coming down Airport Road. Yep, nice landing. I saw that. The other thing that comes to my mind is really totally an aside is that we have the technology, the Innovation Center, which is with the school district and they are working on aircraft and all kinds of things. So if we needed somebody to actually solder and weld and fix what we've got, I don't know if that's an option, but that was the first thing that came to my mind when you were talking about that, that the Innovation Center, they're building an aircraft. They have a ground school. It is got an aviation focus. That'd be a great exercise. I was thinking scouts at first and then remembered the Innovation Center. So yeah, if you if you could send me some information on that, whether the Vassie, I'd love to go over and visit them and certainly give them an opportunity to come up to the airport. Yes, yes, because they're over in their own space. They were just doing drones, but then they've moved into aircraft and we've got two members of the airport that used to be on the board that are on their advisory working with them. So they were building an RV over there and they're doing a lot of really cool stuff. So all right, I will do that. Thank you. Anyone else have questions, comments on Vassie? Yeah, move in quick tonight. Then let's talk state grants and pavement markings. Jeff, I'm hoping you're telling us we're getting a lot of money from the state. So we are going to be getting, I forget the exact number, sixty some thousand dollars from the state for pavement markings. I worked with Dibble to identify, create a map. I mean, one of the first few things I noticed during my airport inspections that quite a few of the markings on the taxiways part of the runway are quite faded. Many of the taxi lanes are quite faded. Dibble came up with a budget of around $89,000 of work that could be done. There are some ways to prioritize that, but we are supposed to, I believe, in next week's meeting at the State Division of Aeronautics Board, we'll get that grant approved. Once we get that grant approved, then we'll make sure Dibble will put together a bid package so that we can go out to bid through the city procurement process and get a plan in place so that once winter comes and goes, that we can actually do the painting during the right season, which will probably be in April or May. Jeff, can you say the numbers one more time? What Dibble identified and then what the grant was? Dibble's number was around $89,000 for doing all of the necessary areas, and the State Grant was in the mid-60s. I don't remember the exact number. That's fine. Do you remember, Joni? Yeah, it was in the mid-60s. I'm happy to follow up and send an email around what those exact numbers are. Anyone have a... Sorry, Jeff, didn't mean to catch you off. Go ahead. No, that's fine. I'm happy to answer questions on that, but I did attend a meeting today, industry meeting of general aviation airport managers that's facilitated by the American Association of Airport Executives. One of the things they talked about during this was the infrastructure bill that has been passed by Congress, and they had some detail on how much are for airports, and more importantly, how much are for the different types of airports. General aviation sort of being in its own silo and pool of money that the FAA gives out and that the Congress gives out. Just to put some things into perspective during the previous bills related to COVID and recovery and things like that, there were three different bills put through by Congress, ones known as CRSSA. General aviation airports had $45 million in that pool. The next one had $100 million. The last one, which was CARES, also had $100 million, of which Longmont got a small portion of each of those and a few tens of thousands of dollars, but nothing big. Putting that into perspective with the infrastructure bill, instead of $100 million, General Aviation Airports gets $2.5 billion over a five-year period. So that's $500 million a year. So in essence, five times that $100 million number, five years in a row. So while we have no specifics on how that will be proportioned out through the General Aviation Airport community, what kind of priorities will be put in place, how those monies can be spent, obviously infrastructure focused, but still the FAA has to put the bookends on what defines infrastructure. As you know, there was a lot of debate in Congress on what defined infrastructure, but I'm confident that we are going to have some monies available to address some future projects at the Longmont Air Force. So, Jeff, on that, just I'm trying to remember of order of magnitude. The previous bills, I think, were somewhere in the range of 30,000-ish to Longmont. So if we're talking five times that over a five-year period, so 150,000 a year for five years is at least ballpark-ish. That's the same math that I did here to some. Again, there's been no specifics other than how much Congress has appropriated to General Aviation Airports. So how the FAA then takes those appropriations and hands the money out is an unknown. I did the same math that you just did. And just one other clarification, and sorry, I don't mean to go first on this, everyone, but at least cares on some of the prior ones. There was zero match from the airport. My understanding is the infrastructure bill does require the kind of traditional AIP match, the 10%. That is my understanding too, which is basically depending upon the type of project, either 90, 10, 80, 20. And so there will be some matching responsibilities out there. And also on the CARES money and the other money, there really was no restriction on its use other than anything that an airport normally spent money on, whether capital-wise or operational-wise, you could do it. That won't be the bookends on this. It will be more infrastructure-oriented. But what I heard today is that traditional AIP money, Airport Improvement Program money handed out by the FAA is quite restrictive and prioritized based upon certain types of infrastructure and safety. This one will have a little wider bookends on it, but still around infrastructure. Yeah, at least from the commercial airports that I work with, my other world, we're using passenger facility charges eligibility as the kind of bookends, which includes terminal programs and some other things that aren't applicable here, but certainly wider than AIP. Mr. Weissman first, I think you guys were timed Russell and Orion, but I'll just start, you're on top of my screen, Orion, so go for it. All right, well, I think I was just, you know, the thing that always jumps to mind whenever we talk about grants or possible monies for the airport, it would be a runway extension. I know that's kind of core to a lot of the improvement plans that many people would want to see. Do we think that that's the type of project that could possibly be funded through some of these monies? Do we expect a grant process or do we think this is just going to be allocation based on some formula for each airport? So I can answer that question partially. Would that type of project be eligible? Yes, because that's a very infrastructure-oriented type project. Obviously, doing the math at Harrison, there's not enough, because I believe that a new runway extension budgeted many years ago is $14 million, so obviously there's not enough money just from this infrastructure bill to do just that. There may be monies to do, maybe some land acquisition, things that could lead up, you know, moving that bar forward. But again, that's not a decision I can make, or Joanie, it's more of both city council making that final decision, as well as obviously having the monies available, whether through state, FAA, Congress, or a combination thereof. Mr. Riversan. Thank you, Mr. Chair. Jeff, we got a presentation from Dan Dunn in August and it mentioned the money from the CARES Act and his opinion as an airport developer was that we should use it if we got it for a lot of things related to electric aircraft, such as charging stations, solar power shades, green airport buildings. Do you think that electric aircraft are near enough to being commercially viable and readily available and that would be something one much should look at seriously? Would that help us get grants if we're presenting ourselves as a green and sustainable type airport? Or what's your opinion on that whole idea? Yeah, so I think the first answer to that question is that electrification of aircraft and airports is not an if but a when. It will happen. There are enough aircraft manufacturers by aerospace here in the state of Colorado that have completed design and starting manufacturing. In fact, there's an electric King Air that's in operation up in the state of Washington. A lot of the vertical aircraft that are being designed are electric, the Joby being one of them. So it is a when, not an if. I think that to start spending money today is premature because there's a lot of unknowns as far as what kind of plugs is there going to be a standard plug for these aircraft? What is the best way to bring electricity because it requires a lot of electricity? You have the AC to DC conversion. The best way to do it is DC storage and DC charging because it's faster than AC to DC charging. So there's a lot of unknown questions that still need to be answered to make definitive decisions on where those money should be spent. But to answer your question in more broadly, I do think that airports need to be starting to think about those efforts. I do think they're gonna need to start thinking about those efforts because airports will be having to service aircraft that will be charged through electricity. The challenge that both airports, the state and working with David Yulain, the executive director of the Colorado DOT, the challenge is that our aviation system is funded off gasoline FET and has no methodology to collect monies from electrification. Airports have no money, no set up infrastructure to collect for delivery of electricity. There's currently fuel-flowage fees for that. That doesn't mean that those can't happen, but those haven't happened yet and those kind of decisions and need to be put in place both at the federal, state and local level. How would we position ourselves then to move forward in that direction? Would that be like a subcommittee or will the city kind of take the charge as they work on it? Well, I mean, I think of the car program, but ours would be different for sure. How do we move forward to be getting ourselves on track to be in line and not way behind when the time comes? I think the key is staying abreast of the issue. The state of Colorado Division of Aeronautics is in the process of forming a statewide committee to study this issue so that they can be prepared both on setting up a funding mechanism but also staying abreast of how they are gonna have to provide grants to airports to be able to support the charging stations, the methodologies for bringing electricity to aircraft, whether that is solar or otherwise. So I think that it's premature to set up a committee to make decisions because there's not enough information to make decisions on it. So I think it's more of making sure whether it's someone at the city, someone at the airport, likely the new airport manager is charged with staying abreast of this issue, bringing back the information both from a federal and the state level because it's a regular topic of discussion. We talked about it during our meeting today and make sure that we bring that information back to the board and the city. Yeah, that's what I would think of be the airport manager or like we have the Longmont 2.0 group that Russ has gone to all the meetings so far on, I think, or Russ and Harrison. And so participating in that as part of the community, this would be more in the community. And then I guess the other question I just have out of curiosity is who is working on developing, would that be a Longmont power and communication thing that they would work on the delivery and the monitoring and the chart, turning it into pay phones for us to generate revenue from the charging stations. So is the LPC got a, have they got a, can't find my words. Have they got something going on that, Joni? I do, Linda. So right now there is an electric beneficium. Oh my gosh, I can't speak. Okay, you can't hear. Beneficial electrification committee currently charged by council that's working on all things, be it EV roadmap for surface transportation, my planning manager, my building official also participating from a building electrification standpoint and how we might adapt to those codes. So council is certainly moving down that path. I sit on the steering committee, obviously for the city of advanced 2.0. So that topic of conversation continues to come up regularly. And I think that when your new council liaison joins us, there'll be some more advocacy and excitement around the airport electrification and what we can look at going forward. I think the benefit right of owning our own electric power company is helpful. And I think that we're looking also at solar options. Nice. Solar array options. So I think that there's a lot of opportunity and the electrical, the beneficial electrification committee, I think will be completed with their work in June of next year. So then they'll kind of roll out the next set of recommendations. I think that's good news because between Dandan's proposals and discussion in the past and the board being in agreement with him in general, that we keep trying to figure out how to make our airport have an impact and be a destination and be set ourselves apart. And in that our marriage having LPC in our front pocket should help us be able to be pioneers in that area. And succeed at it because we've got the resources. So that's interesting. That could be one of the things that sets us apart. We're always trying to figure out how to make the airport more unique and draw visitors to it for unique reasons. So that's encouraging. Hey, Harrison, I had to go. I just got an emergency call from work. I just wanted to let you know. All right, Malcolm, well, thank you for participating so far and we'll see you next year. Yeah, January. Sounds good. Thank you so much. See you, Malcolm. I did want to tag on to what Joey was saying and Linda and Linda and that long one has a huge advantage of having a power company and and also the city looking at electrification citywide on a lot of different issues. I don't know how well this comes across, but that's my light. I think this. Yeah, no, I can see it, but you got a charging station. So that's a charging station at an airport. Oh, that's at Bentonville, Arkansas. I was there in October flying through and saw that. And I was like, wow, what's someone has electric charging station by a company called beta. And literally, it's a beta version of an electric charging station. They put several they put about 10 of them across the country as a beta because they wanted to prove that electrification of aircraft. So they flew electric aircraft from all of these airports across the country from East Coast to West Coast and Bentonville was one of them. But what's really neat about that charging station is that it has three functions. And this sort of comes back to my comment about electrification not only on the land side, but the airside cars aircraft is that this charging station can charge an electric vehicle. It can charge an aircraft and it can act as a ground power unit for aircraft. Lots of times, it's primarily jet aircraft. They don't want to power up their engines to run their avionics. So they have a ground power unit. Sometimes, you know, pulled a cable pulled out from a hanger or an actual diesel engine that runs the generator. But this acts in three functions. So I think that concept would really be embraced by the city of Longmont where you could have a charging station along the fence there where you have a vehicle parking lot on one side, airplanes on another and being able to charge either or both. I love the sound of that because that sounds like our cell tower revenue just sort of happens, you know, it build it and they will come. So that is exciting. That's very exciting. Yeah, I didn't think about the portable for the jets. Yeah. I'm just wondering, and this may be a better discussion for January when we have CIP, but I pulled up the CIP plan. So we've got, you know, in 2023, a new taxi lane and 2025 rehabs and joint seals. But all three of those projects where we were putting it substantially more than the local match, probably because of the grants that were available. And it'd be really nice to use some of the infrastructure money to reduce our local match now. So we have it available as that electric, you know, as we kind of get the standards for electric charging. And so we basically have the cash to be able to do that quickly and be able to be that later. I think that would be a really interesting discussion to see how we can use that infrastructure money to do that. Look for that. Anyone else on, let's just say funding broadly, including the grant for pavement markings, which we moved past. Not on the agenda, but I still want to bring it up under new business. Joni, can you give us a quick hiring update, please? Can. And I'm happy to be able to do that. So I did hear from HR yesterday after submitting to them some time ago that they did post the position yesterday. And in addition to that, Jeff was kind enough to provide HR and myself with additional posting locations beyond the city's website. So the American Association of Airport Executives, the Northwest chapter of that group, as well as the Colorado Airport Operators Association. So we'll get those three links posted tomorrow, but the job is posted through January, or sorry, not January, December 31st. And then I'll take a look and see what applications I'm receiving as we go along may change and leave it open longer to depending on how many applicants we get. So I'll probably have an update for you in January. I did see it in my AAAE email today. So I was really pleased to see that it was going out to airport folks. Yay. Thank you both for coordinating that. Mr. Robinson. Thank you, Mr. Chair. Are we still doing the full-time employee at the same time? You know, so what we have, what I've decided to do for the time being is that our public work staff also has several openings in their operations and maintenance group. And that's Matt and Ryan's group who've been helping us with most of the airport maintenance. So for right now, they had several openings. So they were gonna open that up and see if they couldn't hire a person that could also work at the airport for the duration of this year, which I don't think has happened because they're having a hard time finding anyone, apply for any of those O&M jobs. And then the funding itself for that position doesn't come into play until January when that's a budgeted item in 2022. So Jeff and I probably just need to revisit that with Matt, see how his recruitment has gone. Harold would prefer that we stay with a model where we utilize a team approach to making sure we have maintenance as opposed to just assigning one single person to the airport at all times. That way we have coverage for whenever we need it. And I personally prefer that approach as well. It gives us a lot more options when we have people cross-trained to do work at the airport and fewer single points of failure. But today we do not have a separate job posted nor anyone hired. Anyone else have other questions on hiring? And Joni, my question is with a December 31st, initial deadline at least for applicants. We're pushing up against what I assume is the 90-day contract we originally did with AMCG. I imagine we're not gonna have someone hired even if you have a perfect candidate on December 31st by mid-January. So is the plan then to extend that contract out? That is my intention and I have talked to Jeff about that. Knowing that we've had some timing issues with getting that posted. So that will be the intent that we will continue to keep Jeff's firm on site as long as we need to to make sure we have a smooth transition. And that's still at least partially funded through the city manager's office. Partially funded through the airport fund. You know, as we look at the monthly expenses, again, we're using the FTE costs that we're not expending. And actually we'll have more FTE costs with the other position. But yes, I will be talking to Harold about some additional funds from our contingency fund to make sure we piece that together and are over-stretching the airport budget. Great, thank you. Mr. Weissman. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I guess this question is directed towards Jeff and I know it's not apples to apples, but do you know how long it took to fill the open position at the city of Boulder for their appointment? About a month and a half, I think. It wasn't that long. I think the advantage was is that they had their candidate right there. And so it went pretty quickly. But I think from the time they posted to their decision was about a month and a half. Yeah, thank you. Anyone else on hiring? Well, and if you guys want to indulge me, I have one more because of my failure to make sure we followed up with bylaws and put this on this month's agenda. We have a smaller group, but I at least want to bring it up as the topic again, if anyone wants to at least start the conversation tonight based on the bylaws, we can't actually amend it until we without giving everyone written notice. But if we want to have that conversation now or if we want to save it for January, it's my failure. We didn't, it's not on there to start with. So I'll open it up if anyone wants to wants to talk through any of it right now. Joanie, please. I just need to bump in. I actually have another meeting that starts at seven o'clock tonight. So I'm going to need to leave, but thank you for your time this evening. And if you have any questions, feel free to reach out to myself or Jeff whenever you need help. Thanks for that. I'll just ask you then under board city council and staff comments, did you have any other comments that we didn't address? No, I think we got them all. Thank you. Thank you. Okay. Thanks, Tony. Mr. Robinson. I'm pretty sure you guys know my feelings on this, but I'll go ahead and state them anyway, just to make sure. My opinion on the bylaws is I'd like to respond to public invited to be heard. Even if it's in an informal manner, if it really doesn't even seem like human behavior when we listen to them for three minutes, then you say next without any kind of response at all, that just gets under my skin. Even from before I was on this board, I would go to city council meetings in the various places I've lived occasionally and it was all the same. I mean, they all kind of followed the same format that we do here where you get to speak and everyone listens politely and then nothing, just silence afterwards. So that would be one. So that would be changing the, I guess the regular order of business we would have to have, board reply put in there, something like that. And then the other one would be since we have rules of procedure specifically stated as Robert's rules of order. I feel like our group is small enough that maybe we could come up with something less formal in that direction. So those are the two main ones for me. Mr. Weissman. So maybe later tonight, I'll speak a little bit more on this point, but I am coming to the end of my term on this board, but I've been on this board. I've served on a couple of HOAs. I like the direction that you're going as far as trying to encourage a little bit more dialogue with the public when they do wanna come forward and they're bringing an issue forward. I will warn you though, that some of those rules exist to keep order when things get a little disordered. And also, I think the word's a little strong, but I'll say it anyway, to maybe protect the board from things maybe getting a little too personal. So I would just be careful when you guys go to change those rules, but I believe that the intention is good. So I guess I would be my word of caution, just make sure that if there is a response, that there's probably still just some sort of amount of time so that it doesn't just be coming back in part. Yeah, definitely get that. We need to give Harrison a big gavel for sure. Well, in Lake City Council, I think we've all either watched or been at a meeting where 90 people came to speak and show up, have a show of force. And so then that time, we were doing public comments until 10 at night at a council meeting and business didn't start till nearly midnight a couple of times. And I've been at those meetings. And so that's that timeframe. And then, but the response, you're right. And that I think that would be, our response would have to be in the form of questions, clarifications, because we're not able, as a board, I think it's to protect us from me making a statement saying, that's a great idea, let's do that. Or something where you're taking responsibility for the whole board as an individual because we haven't had a chance to talk about it. But I do agree. And that had always been my point is I took notes when they spoke and then tried to bring it into the conversation later in the meeting. So if we aren't able to change it for some reason, that's a tactic I've used. If they had complaints or things they wanted to address, then I could bring it up later under new business. And I do agree with you that we wanna acknowledge what's being brought to us and get that cohesiveness in the airport community, get them to come to our meetings, get them to participate, tell us what's on their mind. So it's a great way to do it. And it is more rewarding if they feel like there's gonna be some kind of acknowledgement of what they've said because it's very heartfelt when people get up there to speak. So I definitely agree with that. If there's some way we can make that work, yeah. Jeff, it looks like you have a comment. I'm curious what you've seen at other airports around the country. Yeah, I've seen all forms of formal and informal meetings, both in advisory boards as well as policy boards. And there's no perfect way to make it work, but some of the things I've seen is that, one, during public comment, you don't create a process where there's an immediate back and forth. That's where, one, you don't have a time to breathe before you respond. It's more of an emotional response. Two is that it almost invites that person that's still standing there listening to the response to say something again. And that's where you don't wanna really get into a back and forth. So what I've seen is you allow the public comment process to go through, then at the end of that, if any board members would like to respond to that, then they have an opportunity at that time. It gives them time to breathe, gives them time to respond, but doesn't create a back and forth scenario. Thoughts from anyone on that kind of idea? That being effective, something in between where we are acknowledging in either saying we'll put it on the agenda or we'll, we're giving them some kind of feedback. So that's a good way to handle it. Yeah, I understand that we don't wanna get into a heated back and forth, but a productive back and forth is exactly what I'm looking for. And I think if the president of the board has the latitude to say, okay, we're done with this. If it's getting to be too much, then a little bit of back and forth is exactly what I'm looking for. Because the people that come to our meeting, typically there's one to three that really care about the airport. And they're not there to start a fight or anything. They honestly have a productive something to say. And if it just comes back as, thanks Don, we'll go check that out. That might be all that's needed for a simple little two sentence back and forth is mostly what I anticipate it being. I get that the potential is there if it's unlimited for the person to just keep on going. But I think that's up to the chairperson, I guess it is not the president to rein him in with his big gavel. Russell, I think back to, we had those meetings on the safety risk assessment a couple of years back and we had substantial public interest in that. And we actually, we broke from Robert's rules under the previous chair and actually had a back and forth with one of the commenters. And it was incredibly valuable. Because I think it informed, it certainly informed my opinion. It got some perspective from those of us who weren't at the time skydivers or, I thought it was really useful. So I guess I'm just, I hear Orion's word of warning. I'm worried about it too, but I really, I want to figure out a way to do what you're describing well. I just haven't been able to wrap my head around how do we do that with an appropriate limit? That's also fair to every commenter. So we're not picking and choosing who we, who we want to prioritize in a discussion. And honestly, I don't, I have not gotten my head there yet at least. So that's a struggle where I am. You know, we live in the age of email and cell phones. If people are upset that they didn't get there, they're full a lot of time with the chairperson. You know, there's ways to get old of us, all of us. I think for all of our emails or contact info is public info. So I'm not going to buy that as a way out of us. That changed though. Do you recall that a year or two ago, we used to be that people could use the button to contact us. It was masked, I think, but then everything had to go through the city. Nobody could communicate with us. And I don't think that's changed. I don't know who that person would be that it would go to. But I remember being skilled on that, that people could not talk to us directly. And they had to go through the city. And it's not really clear. So the board meeting really is their opportunity. And... I think you know what I'm going to say to that. Yeah, yeah. That's changing back. I mean, it's masked. Giving a masked female a way to get hold of us. Yeah. And it was a throttling mechanism at the time and where we weren't really allowed to speak. And it was irritating because the public gets to speak, but then we didn't get to. So it kind of got backwards on that. And then I do know I will also acknowledge that I, from the notes that I saw, meetings that I didn't attend, but saw the recordings and all that Jeff has had an earful from the usual suspects at the airport. And he's heard everything that's ever happened there. I was a bit embarrassed and horrified at how much sawdust has been re-sawed so many times. So we're all really ready to move into what's new, learn from what was not done well, but move on because some of those things that are being brought up are now five and 10 years old. And so that also being our focus to say, you know, the thinking being, you don't get to just come up and complain. You can complain about something, but also provide some type of a solution and an idea, something to move it forward and not just come up. And I feel like Jeff got just the complaining, lots and lots of old complaints. So we're ready to have dialogue and get that energy that people bring to us with their observations and the public forum is really our way to do it and be in the sunshine and be all good on everything. So to be able to make good use of our time, we give up our night to come, you know, maybe there go sit at council chambers or be in these meetings. And I really preserved this time and figure when we used to go until like 10 o'clock at night with these meetings because there was so much participation and I'm always prepared for that. And I, you know, I have one night that we can have open discussion on things. And so I really try to make the best of that and be sure we get everything out here that we possibly can because most people's schedules don't allow for a lot of side meetings. So anything we can do to make the best use of our time, the public's time and move advanced things as opposed to just listening and taking notes. I think we do agree on all that and that's the board's intent and we're getting kind of another start with the changes. And so it's a good time to have that discussion and formalize it. And then you give that warning, Harrison, that about being polite and not naming names and keep everybody in line. And you can also use that to shut stuff down if it's out of line, yeah. Well, and I like the idea of, you know, moving forward, moving into the new, you know, next year we'll have a new airport manager. We will have at least some changes on the board and we'll be very sad to see Orion and Kent not with us. And, you know, with those changes, with the new manager, it's probably the right time to be setting the new expectation for the meetings and the comments. You know, so that manager has that day one. So I think my question would be, and if anyone has further discussion, please interrupt me. Do we want to kind of discuss word by word changes in January or do we want to have a smaller group? And maybe that's me and Russell or Melinda and Russell or whoever that is kind of draft up what that looks like for us to discuss then specifically in January. That'd be the most efficient. I think that'd be the most efficient to have it ready so we can make progress on it. Because otherwise we end up two meetings down the road for everything. So that would be good. Yeah. Everyone here who cares, you know, bring a draft of whatever amendments they want to do. And everybody has a draft ready to go and we'll discuss it in January. So if that works, we can, we do have to provide each member five days written notice before we can amend it. So if we do that, we can't amend till February. Yeah. So that would be where we're comfortable. Well, I guess we have a new member at least. So yeah. I mean, there's no big hurry, but. Yeah, kind of. Yeah, just kind of get things started on the right foot. Yeah. So let's have that conversation in January then. Everyone come with a red line. Orion, Kent, if you'd like to, we would very much welcome you in public invited to be heard in January. No, please. You can. And bring your team then. Um, with that, then, and seeing nobody from the public still on to do final public invited to be heard, let's move on to a board council and staff comments and I'll just kick us off with a farewell to Kent and Orion. Both of you, we've, I've really enjoyed having you with us on this board. I have been appreciated your questions, particularly Kent, some of the questions coming from a not a pilot perspective. Because they, they, I think they, they ground us a little bit differently and they approach it from a different issue and they've been enormously helpful to me to make sure that I'm at least keeping that perspective in my mind, even if I'm not approaching the question that way. Orion, the words of caution, the, the perspective, the forward looking, I mean, I have appreciated having you both on here. Very much. Yeah, you've brought some with your real estate experience and yeah, you guys just bring, you ask those questions that we don't think to because we're either too close to it or it just doesn't, you know, we're not thinking, I think it's always good to be a third person observer and stuff like this, bring a different perspective and you guys have been wonderful and we'll be one short. So that'll be a shame. And I don't know if it's too late for you guys to change your mind, come on now. You know, I wanna, I wanna thank, I wanna thank Harrison and the rest of the board. I've learned a lot being a non-pilot. What I had hoped to bring, and it's interesting, I spoke up too late, but literally one week, roughly, Harrison knows this, but the rest of you, I don't think do, one week before David's passing, I had written him an email saying, my real estate experience, I had hoped to be involved in improving the lease negotiations and making sure a lot of what Jeff opened his meeting tonight saying about CPI increases, are they being administered properly? Are the rents, you know, are the, that was, that was where I had hoped to bring some expertise to the administrative side of the airport. But I just didn't find with David's personality and lack of openness, and my not speaking up earlier about my intent that it just never happened. And so from that standpoint, I feel badly, but I think I really like what the board is doing on the run on my track. I think Jeff, it sounds like he's doing a great job. And I just hope that you get a new airport manager that you, we can all relate to, not that David didn't do a good job, but it just wasn't opportunistic to forge ahead in my opinion. I'd been offering for, I don't know, three years while I was contracting to come in and help with anything. When he was overwhelmed, I constantly offered to come in because I managed an airport in my past. And I offered to go in and help him out and just as a volunteer. And I also, there was, I didn't get taken up on that offer. And so that's, yeah, I respect what you were trying to do and that's an important piece of what we do out at the airport. And I appreciate that you did that, but don't feel bad because I don't think you would have had it. I don't think you would have had him take you up on it anyway. Unfortunately. Thank you. Yeah. And I do hope though that as you keep an eye on the agendas, as these topics come up, you know how to reach us all. And we would very much welcome your perspective and input, particularly in a public invited to be heard where we can have it back and forth a little bit. And really understand the perspective there because that's a perspective that the rest of us don't have. Well, thank you very much. I look forward to seeing you guys out there with Crenzel and Don Dulce and the audience. Definitely, Ron Crenzel. You're going to be in charge of telling him to sit down or Howard. Does anyone, or I am sorry. Yeah. So I just want to take a moment to tell you all that I have appreciated working with you on this board and honored to be part of this board. And I think Melinda, you put it well. There's a lot to look forward to with the airport. I think one thing that, you know, that we've said as a board a few times and sometimes it feels like it doesn't always resonate is that the airport is valuable. It's something that really sets Longmont apart from some of the surrounding communities. And just some of the available space to develop the airport. That's something that other airports don't have. So I'm very confident that you guys are going to keep moving things forward. I just, I want to take a moment to say that how much I've appreciated the opportunity to be part of this. We've enjoyed you. I'll use that segue to ask Jeff on the hangers. I know you've been working to, and that was one thing I'd offered to help David with assess the hangers, you know, just get an inventory and be sure that we are maximizing our investments out there. And I know you've been working on inventory. I also, and one of the admins on the Facebook page for the airport, and we do get at least a couple of times a month, I get increased people looking for hangers. So just to let you know that that's always happening out there, we would try to refer them to elite. I don't think that got us very far. David kept a list, he kept a callback list. And of course by the time, you know, there'd be 12 people on it, and the first eight on it had found another place to park their planes. But it's just a service, a kind of a value add that is important. And then with that, I'll bring up the unpopular idea. It was unpopular in the past. The idea of an audit were some form of verification that the hangers are being used properly. And I say that from a very personal perspective in that I pay for storage units and I pay a lot for them. And they don't hold half of what a hanger would hold for more money. And so I'm sensitive to that, that it is attempting to convert a hanger into a storage unit. And then there are, I was at the airport, we were having an air show and a girl was walking past me and opened up her hanger. And I, she was getting ready to open it. And I said, what kind of plane do you have? And she's like, oh, don't tell anybody about a plane. And she had, I mean, my jealousy factor, had she had a plane, maybe? She had two of everything, wave runners, a boat, motorcycles, standup paddleboards. I mean, the girl had so much kit in there. And I could walk you to where that hanger is. And I don't know if that was a legacy. Maybe her dad had the hanger or her mom or somebody else. And she inherited it, but it wasn't an airplane anywhere in there. And ladders and all kinds of stuff. And it was very, I was in the middle of an air show with hundreds of volunteers that I was managing. So I couldn't do anything. But at the time I just thought, wow, you don't know who you just showed that to. And, but then every time I brought it up, David didn't want to be that guy. He didn't want to be the guy that went around and did inspections. But there are, we know of some that have an airplane packed in the back with stuff all in the front. And even people leasing out, sub-leasing their airports to people that are living there, not just having an office. And so there is some nefarious stuff going on that's not the end of the world, kind of live and let live stuff maybe, but if we've got rules and regs for a reason and at night you see things at the airport that you probably shouldn't see and that people are camping out and staying out there. And that's, I don't know if in the future we'll have maybe a better camera system or we could hire secure toss or somebody that would just patrol and take an inventory or something like that. I've seen you out there working quite a bit and maybe the airport manager, the future would have a night or two in their plan where they would do a night audit, that kind of thing. And then the other thing I would just add is that, your friends just down in Boulder, you should probably keep it in Boulder County. And then you could just come run our airport. You know what's going on? Just a shameless plug. I'll commit to you, I won't be your future airport manager. My consulting company, I have 12 employees. I've had my company for 24 years and I love what I do and I've been enjoying thoroughly what I'm doing in the long run. Isn't it time to move on? Is it time for something fresh? Will you be part of the interviewing team? I don't know specifically. I know that I'll be involved in some way, according to Joanie, but I don't know what my specific role will be. I certainly wanna make sure that the airport gets a person with the right energy, the right focus and the right experience for the airport based upon what I've learned during the last seven weeks and probably for the next many weeks. But I will respond to some of your comments and questions. Melinda, Mike Bocas has been sort of threefold. One is getting a good communication mass email list. I hope most, if not all of you, if you're not make sure I have your email address because I've been sending out about every two weeks an email to everyone. There's 262 people on our mass email list and talking just about things that I've been doing, things that are happening, grants, prairie dog mitigation, snow removal and things like that, just trying to keep people up to date. So my first focus was, okay, who should I be communicating with? Second is a review of all of the leases, making sure I know who has a lease, who are they, their contact information so that I can start the process. Third has been getting all of the invoicing up to date. Fourth is going to be compliance. And I'm probably a really good person to deal with this because they can get mad at me and then I'll leave and then the new manager can come in and be the hero if they need to be. But the non-aeronautical use of hangers is not just a rule that your airport has. It's an obligation that the city has as an airport sponsor to continue receiving funding from the FAA. And there's some very specific and recent guidance from the FAA on non-aeronautical use of hangers. So that certainly will be part of our compliance review. I wanna roll that into that my experience at the airport has been nothing but pleasurable. I'm not gonna say it's always been easy, but the tenants have been very welcoming. They've been easy to talk to. I would say there's only been one person that was semi-obnoxious. But for the most part, everyone has been really welcoming to me and it's been good. On the city side, even better. One of the things I heard during my first board meeting when I was introduced, and then after I came on board, we had a public meeting where anyone, tenants could come and talk. And then some of my one-on-one meetings, both with the Long Lawn Pilots Association and other groups, what I heard a lot about historically is that the city didn't care, that the city doesn't support the airport. And I agree, I don't know if it was Harrison or Melinda that said that history let's focus on now and the future. But what I'll tell you and what I've told everyone is that I've seen nothing but support from the city towards the airport, whether it's public works, whether it's fleet services, whether it's legal, finance, environmental services, parks and rec, anyone I called asked for help, I got the help immediately. I got the information that I requested. So I don't know if that is new. It is. Or it may just be something that happens for a reason, and I'll tell you what the reason I believe. And I heard a comment about Mr. Slater and I don't wanna comment specifically on how Mr. Slater managed the airport, but relate this more to what I've seen in other airports is that airport managers that come in in city and county airports feel like, they're the only one that understands airports and that there's an expectation from the city that they need to manage the airport and do everything there. And that creates this environment where they're not as encouraged to reach out because by reaching out, they feel like they're not doing their job or they're a little bit of a failure. And so I'm quite the opposite. I'm very capable, but I'll take any help that I can get. And so that's one of the things that I'm going to encourage. And because I know that Joni has talked that there'll be this transition period between me and the new airport manager. And I'm going to give him every single contact that I have gotten over the time, explain to him who's there and ready, willing and able to help. I encourage that person to reach into the city where they help because again, it includes Joni's staff and Harold and everyone that I've seen nothing but interest and support for the airport. I do, things have changed in the tone with the city. And I think it'll be interesting. I'll just speculate that if Marsha ends up being our liaison again, because she's really in that green initiative, it would be interesting to have her be back with us. We had her a few years ago. And we had all the skydiving lawsuits and it just went on for years. And so the city really couldn't embrace the airport because there was so much perceived opposition. The opposition wasn't, it was a big show. And they put up a lot of dust and stuff in the air. And it seemed as if the whole city hated the airport when it was about, I don't know, nine people. And, but the city really couldn't politically embrace the airport. And so we also let all of our projects, all these things that are so far behind was also that we had to hang back and couldn't be very aggressive, not knowing, not having the support of the city and the future being clouded, not necessarily uncertain or cloudy, but just clouded. And so those were settled out, ultimately in the Supreme Court and there's still the part 16 issues that we still have to face. But it's in everybody's rear view mirror and the city is able now to embrace it as part of the 2.0 Advanced Longmont. And then again, if we really devote energy and a commitment to the green initiatives, we will always find favoritism and we'll always find a way to move forward. And I just appreciate that you took a lot of hits for really old things that haven't even happened in the last five years and then some that have, but just again, this lot of old, old issues. And our prior airport manager was more a handshake and a nod, and then we moved into rolls and rags. That's when I joined the board and became very unpopular because you have to have rolls and rags. And I was sometimes the only person voting for them we didn't want to get that formal. We have two. And so now I really do see us poised for the next step with the things that are happening in city government that the end of the skydiving lawsuits, the part 16, hopefully we'll get settled out soon. I don't have, I don't know if we've heard anything on that lately. I'll give an update on that when you're done. Okay, okay. And then we're really, yeah, I think we really all are poised to, we're ready to say that was then. Now let's move forward and have some new conversations and be able to have a good idea of where to go and be more organized about it. And that's I think what we all look forward to and that we have some important popular things to get polarized around, which would be electric and all the things that go with that. So that's the exciting part. And we just appreciate that you've come in and picked up a whole lot of garbage and straightened up literally and figuratively and straightened things up for us. So that we're, I feel like we're much better positioned to move into next year and start making some progress. Again, COVID set us back too, of course, as everybody, but really get us so that we're ready to be in a position to move forward. So we really appreciate that. And again, you guys being on the board, I just wish you could hang in there to see a little bit more get done and be part of, you've put in a lot and to see that finally come to fruition, that would be wonderful. So keep looking at the newspaper. One thought I had, if I may, thank you, Harrison. And Melinda, you've talked about the future. The airport expo didn't come up tonight. And I remember Dale telling me, the first meeting three years ago, it takes at least a year and a half or two to really, and you know, Melinda, more than any of us, how much work is involved. And you've already done some, but I'm afraid if that gets kicked down the road till January, February, March. Yeah. Well, we did, if you remember, we had, we moved, David recommended that we move to 2023. And so we would need to start working on 2023. And I think we've got so many other things going on, but we do, if we've got the budget for it, we can hire a little bit more of that or build another team. So that's a huge undertaking. And I was, I've been thinking about it all night because when, you know, the board, it's no requirement of the board. It's an expectation. Yeah, I'll say that, but it's not a requirement. And it's not a requirement to have the air show, but the public loves it. And by 2023, we'll have some exciting things to show and we can bring in that electric aviation and we can bring in some things that we wouldn't have had for 2021, which was when I thought we'd be having an air show and not even for 2022. We may need to push it out to 2024 and then we'll really have some cool stuff to show. So that is my term ends this time next year on the board. I will have filled all the possible years I can do it, but the air show is a different passion project. And then with all my large scale event stuff that I've planned in the past. So I will continue to participate. I was a volunteer prior to joining the board and then I'll return that capacity, but we'll be trying to figure out who that next group is because that was also some of the senior people at the airport that ran it and are still there and willing to participate, but they're not gonna run it. So that'll be a pretty big discussion for us to have to figure out who really wants to shoulder the top tier responsibility and then filter that down and get all the committees going so we can start having meetings on that. But for those DOD clearances, it was well over a year we needed those done. So I'm in a government, well, I'm in a government contract position now. So I've been cleared and cleared and cleared. So I think I'll be able to move through all that. And then maybe we can call on some of the kids that I did their capstones with them and get them to come back, get Jack to do us a bunch of clearances because he's in the Navy now. So I do have my eye on it and I am wondering if we're gonna be able to make a 2023 show. And I don't know. So if not 2024, it'll be huge. And I'd love to have that little bit of extra time to really get creative with what we're gonna present and have it be different than the previous one. Same, you know, all the good stuff but to bring in some other elements as well and to have it again more of a air shows typically are looking backwards at antique aircraft and the history of aviation. And we've really been, and then we were in a period of honoring aviation. And I'd love for us to now have a forward focus and get the innovation center involved. And we have the opportunity to pull in a lot of other players. So thank you for bringing it up because it's been on my mind all night. Well, thank you because it has slipped my mind as the bylaws did of keeping it on the agenda. So it would be back on, I'll make sure it's on in January. Yeah. I'll make sure we bring this up and in the spirit of moving forward and look into the future we are, we have that as a priority and as a focus. And assessing what we're capable of because if it's, if 2023 is gonna come at us too quickly, then we push it out another year that, the public loves it and we wanna respond to them but we can only do what we can do. So. Okay. I'll just, it looks like can't drop off. Hopefully I'll drop back on. We still have four of us. So we still have a quorum. Does any other, any of our remaining board members have any other comments before, Jeff, I know you had one on the part 16. Anyone else? Jeff? So just an update on the part 16, I assume that everyone was aware a while back that there was an initial determination by the FAA in favor of the city. There was a few things in there that they commented that the city could do differently, but they weren't in violation of their response or assurances, which is the primary outcome that they're asking for in that determination. The appeal process was triggered by a mile high for the FAA director, the administrator to review the compliance office's initial determination. That what's called a final determination came out about three weeks ago in favor of the city and supporting the initial determination. That is nearly closing that part 16 process. There is one final appeal process that a party can make. That is to the US appeals court where they can appeal the FAA administrator's final determination. I can tell you from experience that there are very few part 16 complaints that get appealed to the US appeals court. A few do, it's not cheap and it takes a lot of time. So I'm not gonna tell you it's not gonna happen but I don't anticipate that happening. And so that is a hopefully a turning point where the city and mile high can get back on to some normal, less or relationships and find a way forward. Have you had any discussion? Do you wanna render an opinion on that? Have you been in contact with mile high? Have you had conversations or at least developed to kind of set a baseline? I have not. My goal is I have talked to people on a more general basis, but not lessies other than a lead aviation on less or lessy relationship issues. I, in talking with Joni, one of the things besides lessy invoicing there's also a permit invoice that is supposed to be going out on a regular basis that has not been. We have been receiving checks from mile high even though that invoice has not been going out. But before the end of the year, I do plan on reaching out to Frank and extending a hand and opening up that dialogue so that we can start those discussions. Good, cause they are a big tenant and it's been a rough road. And I would think that the appeals are done. There was, I thought there was an amendment or an additional, that the part 16 had another a supplement or something that had been filed a year or two ago. Is that resolved? Is that one resolved too? Yeah, that was all, I mean, that was the part 16 complaint. So the initial determination, mile high appealed that with the documents that triggered the process which is goes through the administrator for the final determination. So that was the ruling about three weeks ago on that, so. And I don't speak for anybody else on the board except myself, but the fueling operation did provide finance money for us. And we don't really talk about it with David, we didn't that when we asked about fuel flowage fees and why they were down, we were given a lot of other reasons, but that big old truck, you know, all that came to us and it's not at our airport. I don't know, my understanding was that Frank wanted to get that back at Longmont. He's made due and got to work around, but he preferred to be on the airport. I know I'd prefer to see the fuel flowage coming to our airport. And so if that's something that is, do you think that that's possible? Cause I know the soil testing and everything he had to do came back negative that there was not, he wasn't leaking into the ground over there where he was parked. It didn't bother me, but it might bother other people. I just, I don't know if that if, I guess I would say, I'd hope that that would come back onto the table to have a discussion if it's viable for him to bring fuel, to bring his fueling operation back. Yeah. And in this public forum, I don't have enough information to really provide an opinion of what happened historically. I agree that any fuel we can bring on to the airport that is financially beneficial to both tenants and the airport sponsor is a good thing as long as it can be introduced in a safe manner and one that is not unjustly discriminatory to other users on the airport. So I imagine that those will be some conversations that will be had with Frank when I opened that door. Fantastic. And I'm glad to hear that. Yeah, I'm glad to hear that there is going to be and then you'll be able to pave the way for the next manager to get that line of communication back open. So that's good. That's good. It's been an awkward situation for quite a while and it's a huge operation at our airport that draws a lot of positive and it really has been taken out of, out of context and caused a lot of problems for years for reasons that didn't need to exist. And so our antagonist has moved to Florida and it's gotten very quiet and a few people that used to come speak on her behalf also have stopped talking. I do see him on next door quite a bit but he talks there but he isn't even coming to our meetings anymore. So I think we finally, I think people have moved on, thank God. And it'll be good to get that normalized for the future. I think we'll all be happy to not talk about it and just have a normal relationship. So I appreciate, again, everything you're doing and that you're willing to walk into the fire on a lot of this stuff. With that, I'll give one final chance for anyone, any other comments? Well, then let's adjourn our meeting for the evening. Thanks everyone for the discussion. I'm really pleased with where we're kind of going as a group in the discussion about moving forward. Orion, we'll miss you next year, Kent, we'll miss you next year. And look forward to seeing everyone in January. Thank you. Good night, you guys, Merry Christmas.