 Good afternoon and welcome back to the touchline on Y25, my name is Maxwell Wasikoso, robot is still with us, my elbow co-host and joining us is a big man as far as the word of cricket is concerned, not only recognized locally but he's made headlines even on international front, cricket legend and icon Maurice Odumbe himself joining us for the second time big man, how have you been? Very well, thank you very much. Long time man. Long time, thank you for having me. How you settling in as a batting coach for the Kenya cricket team, how are things so far? So far, okay, I'm supposed to be the national team coach at the moment but things are not good, the boys have not been practicing for the past two months because of issues to do with contracts and we just don't know what is happening. There is no office, the office that had been put there, the interim committee, they are mandated as a lapse, they were given three months, so that is over. Now we are waiting for directions from either the new CS Ambassador Amina Mohamed or from the sports tribunal because I believe there are cases out there. Rankling has been a major monster as far as these federations, not only in crickets but basing on the sport which you yourself is a specialist in, what might be the source of this never ending disputes? It's got a lot to do with ego, some people feel that they deserve more than the others and also pride and if you ask me, some of these people have been in cricket long enough, they've run the game and for them to be coming back again, I think it is not on and this rankling will never end as long as we have people who feel that look, I've given so much to cricket, now it's my turn or it's my time to be running the game, it's not on and as I said there are a lot of egos going around, it's got nothing to do with cricket at all because these are two camps that they can sit down, come together and quash out all these manenos and we move on. But why would they want to run to court? For what? What is it that I'm protecting? This is a game, I was there, I played, I left, somebody else took over, so it's the same way with the officials and I'm not only talking about cricket, I'm talking about all sports across board, some people never wanted to leave, they had to be forced out, so it's the same thing that is happening to cricket, some people don't want to leave and in the process everybody is suffering, the coaches, the players, the guys who are maning the office at waraka, so not everything has now come to stand still. The question will be, the major reason that they don't want to leave is it money, pride or what is it? Does cricket can make a lot of money that these people want to sit there and have the cash every day or what can be attributed to? Well, there is money, but this is not money that it will be easy to sort of put your hands in the coffers, it's not that easy, but it's all about pride, I'm the chairman, I am this, people listen to me and going for those international meetings, interacting with all these top guys, the shaggs and the sas and all that, that's what it's all about. Because if you ask me, if these people claim that they love cricket and they are doing it for cricket, we should not be in the courts, we shouldn't be. And some of them should be man enough to say, look, I'm stepping aside so that the game can move on, but nobody wants to do that. Osora Robin, you and I, by the virtue that we have had passion for this industry of journalism, especially sports, I know we might have been lucky to watch one moriso dumbe at our tender age stage, but now looking forward, going forward cricket, just like golf, is not a sport that is closely associated, is not meant for the majority unless you have got exceptional talent and you also have got unwavering passion for the sport. From what the champ is saying, going forward, I don't know, from where you sit objectively speaking from the journalistic angle, what's the long term solution to this debak? Well, it's hard for me because I'm not an insider of cricket Kenya, but I think it's all about removing in this office completely a big overhaul of the office, like work a born federation I've done in football, just crush out the whole office, get everybody completely out of the office and bring in new people who can run the sport forward. You don't want to have, because from what the champ is telling you about, it has people who have been there for a very long time. I believe even the day you made your debut back in 1990, there was someone in that office who was there up to today. No, some have passed on, but there are some who have been around for quite some time. And if you look at their track record, it's not impressive at all. And these are the people who should actually make way for others. People should be given a chance also to lead. I might have better ideas, who knows. But because somebody has friends who will be voting for him, it's practically impossible to get in there. And another reason why we are fighting is we need to change our constitution, then have elections. We need to spread the game, take it even all the way to Mandera. That is what the new constitution is. At the grass roots. At the grass roots. Kabisa at the grass roots. Now some people are saying, oh we don't have time for this new constitution and without that constitution we cannot have elections. So what happens? The former CSHS had to put in an interim committee for three months. Now the first committee came, they didn't do anything. Those 90 days elapsed. Without them doing anything at all. Nothing to do even with the constitution, maybe not even one page. Leadership continuity, nothing. This is it. And then they ask for extension. Now even this group now, whose term has elapsed, they might ask for an extension but why would you want an extension when in 90 days you've not done anything? Yes. Right? So to me, I think Ambassadamina Mohammad should just crack the whip. You know, tell these guys we draw the cases, whoever has filed a case or whatever at the court, we draw, we are sitting down, we are thrashing this matter here and now. Because another thing, sorry. Yes. We might even get banned by international cricket conference. As we speak they refuse to release money to cricket Kenya until and unless we get our house in order. Yes. And this affects the under 23 and the under 19. We lost to Nigeria, Sierra Leone just the other day. Now next month we are supposed to be going for Africa qualifiers, same as what the under 19 went for. Yes. No, we are not preparing and those other guys are preparing. They are not waiting for us. For the past two months, myself and David Obuia will go to the ground, sit for two hours, nobody turns up and we leave. And come the qualifiers. What's the reason for players failure not to turn up? Is it because of unpaid allowances and salaries and their dues? Salaries have been paid but they don't know the way forward. They don't have contracts. We will not be coming for training when I don't know what I'm going to get at the end of the month. At least there should be some commitment for the players. Even for us, I don't have a commitment but I'm still going there. Because of passion and love for this sport. And since I was appointed I've not been told, hey, pack your things and go. So I'm assuming I'm still handling them until such a time when they will have elections and things are done properly. In other sporting disciplines like football and rugby we've seen former players getting actively involved in the administrative, even managerial level and several things that sport entails. As we speak right now, Amfrika Yangi is involved. He's a former rugby player. He's even having a position at the National Olympic Committee of Kenya. He's a former captain for the National Team of Rambestas. He's a former national champion. Do you think the same should be applied in cricket? People like yourself, Steve Tikolo or Buya and the rest, getting actively involved and being given a prominent role. And that should happen. It should be automated. If you look all over the world, it's the former sportsmen and sportswomen who are being called back. Even look at football commentators. Most of them are former players. But it seems it is only here in Africa where former players are not liked. Up to now I am flabbergasted that why is somebody like Bobby Ogola? Somebody like Dr. JJ Masiga. If these are not people who should be involved in football then who is? No disrespect to Nick Mwenua. Maybe he played village football. I don't know. But when you compare to people like Dr. JJ Masiga. You look at scenario like Zambia. Back and bar and I don't know who. They played football. We all know what back and bar is in Germany when it comes to that football. But maybe unwillingness and reluctance of former players. No, we don't have the money to be contesting. Because if you look at people who are there. Who have always been chairmen and all that. There are people who have the money to lobby. No, I will not expect somebody like Bobby Ogola to be going around 47 countries. Trying to convince electorates to endorse his candidacy. No, it's whoever takes over as the chairman then you look around. Who do we have? I have Bobby Ogola here. We have Bobby Ogola in charge of all the academies in the country. Something like that. And I had you talking about from the grassroots why God is not having its own academy. They should. But if you ask me we need to do away with teams like MOW. Small, small teams. Let's go original. Do away with this business oriented parastartal teams. Do away with that. It doesn't help. Because if you have Nairobi playing Eastern. Yes, that's true. But if you have Sofapakha. Because the rivalry will be on another level. This is it. I'm supporting my city. Tottenham. My town. Manchester city, Mani, United. These are towns. So that is the way I think we should go. It will be painful to do away with Gormaia. I have still no pots. But if we want to grow our spots. We need to go original. You realize like in the Kenyan Premier League for example. Or cricket for example. Most of the clubs are based in Nairobi. This is it. Yes. Out of 18 clubs, 10 or 12 clubs are in Nairobi. Even our regional. So they don't represent national outlook. No, they don't. It's not. You need clubs going back home. You need a club that let Gormaia go back to Kisum. Or Homa Bay. Come back with a lot of fun. We have to go back to Ebuye. Because you have a home base. That is already waiting for you. That can help you build. Clubs like Shabana. They are trying because they are based at home in Kisum. And it's their own region. But when you come to a club like Sofa Parka. You are based in Machako. You don't have that appeal to the locals. This is it. You don't have that. You are actually just using your facilities. But if they were training there. There is an identity. This is it. And there are age groups. Under 21, under 19. Those are things that we should be having in each and every county. Why are we losing to these other countries? We should ask ourselves. What kind of facilities do they have? We just don't have to prepare two months prior to a big event. No. These are things you start preparing 10 years from now. Olimpigs. Are we going to produce a swimmer? Yes. We start now. That the kid may be 10. So by the time the kid is 17. He or she has already started climbing that ladder. But for the shortest time. For the shortest period of time you've been at the helm of Kenya cricketers. They are butting coach. What do you make of the level of potentiality and capability in the players and even in terms of young talent coming up to join the national team? The talent is there. But the question is this. Do these players have peace of mind? It's all about peace of mind. You don't want to go somewhere and you are worried that when you come back home you'll find a padlock. And you are a national team player. These are things that should not be happening. A team player or a national team player or even local because now they are professionals even football. Your job is to play. You don't have to worry about my allowance as delayed. Oh my salary has not been paid. No. You don't hear those kind of things in Europe. So why is it happening in Kenya? I'll talk about Kenya because this is home. Yes. And these are things that I don't understand. And we seem to have... Not even happening today. It has been happening. We are still happening up to today. So we need to change our setup completely. Look at the other day they recalled the volleyball team, the latest volleyball team. Yes. Kenya prisons. How embarrassing is that? They were repatriating. Because the government claimed the left... The demotora is their departure. So who paid for the air tickets and all that? Yet they are policemen. They are policemen. Government employees. Yes. And they were even sucked until Matiangi intervened. No. Those kind of things. What kind of an image are we portraying? What message are we sending out there? To be honest with you. And I know for a fact, Kenya is a very talented people. And not only in sports. A lot of things. We travel, we see, we interact with these people. Yes. Right? But the amount of talent that is... It's too immense. A lot. They talk about to a different cycling. How many cyclists do we have in western Pandei who used to ride black mambas? We can go there and give those guys a run for their money. Chris Froome was being coached by... Some guy was riding a black mamba. They talk about this rowing. We don't have those guys who can row. We have them. Good facilities, good training. You want to tell me in six, seven years time this guy will not even bring a bronze medal? They will. But we are not making the atmosphere conducive for our people to excel. I don't believe it's only Wanyama who can play out there. I don't believe that. There are so many out here. Moris, in all your experience as a player, as a coach and as a sportsman in this country, it all goes down to policy for government policy. The government seems to be the one that has failed everybody. It seems from the time we are independent to realize that our government knows just have that initiative to go out there and say sports can help us in economic development in the country. Very true. But you are very right. They promised us how many stadiums. Five. How many have been built? None. So now, what are the youth supposed to do? We are lying to them. We will build stadiums for you. You don't have to be a doctor to earn money. You can be a sportsman. And who earns big money in the world? Sportsmen. Sports people. I was reading 500,000 pounds a week. Yes. 50 million bob. Come on. The likes of Tiger Woods in golf. This is it. And we have these guys, but is the atmosphere right for them to showcase their talent? I don't think so. So the policy is totally wrong. Compare the contrast in your hey days of sports, not only cricket with the current days. We know in the past sport was not was not perceived as a key priority as an income generating activity because there was lack of goodwill from the stakeholders. Even the corporate entity didn't come to support various sporting activities in the country. But what's your comparison in terms of even growth potential? Are we getting progressive or we still stagnant? No, we are not getting progressive because if we are getting... Look, we reached the 2003 World Cup. Yes. Now, hardly 15 years down the road we are in division three. We are playing the likes of Rwanda, Nigeria. Instead of playing Sri Lanka, India, Australia and all that. Big teams. Big teams. No, in a period of about 10 years we have gone back that much then something is not right. Very true. Everybody is moving forward. Why are we moving backwards? When we know what we are supposed to do... Because you worked hard to get to that World Cup. Now it's built on from us getting to the World Cup as going forward. This is it. Not going backwards. But here is a scenario whereby we are going backwards. We are the passion. Nowadays you have to pay players. Forget it. If there is no money on the table nobody will turn up. Right? And we've made it such. We watch the manus and all that. We read what people are making and you're like, I'm representing my country. I ought to be paid. How many of our former grates are dying poor here and it breaks my heart. We're not doing anything. You read this guy 60-something gold medal, this and that. My euro, my euro. The same thing you tell me is what former international and FC Leopards player Miki Wachewans told me he coached Stratmo University nowadays. He said that comparing these days with the current crop of football as they used to play for passion and like today it has to be remuneration package. It's a determined factor. But you cannot blame this player because at the end of the day this player has got bills to pay. This player has got a child at school. He's got a mom back home. He's got rent to pay. So they have plenty of duties to attend to financial. The scenario back in the 80s back in the 90s is not the scenario today. No, totally. It's very different because now our shielding has gone up. At the end of the day you need that money for you to survive. And even if we got the passion to do this job, you got the passion to go and play passion will not put food on the table for you. During the conversation at Swell after touchline Y254 to Sike Maxola at Osorobats at Y254 channel we hosting former cricket international he was the skipper for the national team and he was amongst the squad that represented the country in 2003 World Cup for Kenya and he says that during the heydays Kenya played heavyweights and you know giants in terms of cricket the likes of Sri Lanka, Australia, India but he says that nowadays the standards have dwindled and looking forward to the restoration of lost glory. Keep contributing and of course we're going to be sampling some of your views during and even at the tail end of the program. Yes. For the shortest time you've been at the helm of Kenya cricket what can you be proud of as the achievements you've attained so far? Okay. Because we've been starved of trophies we've not won a trophy for I don't know how long when we went to Rwanda and won an Africa Cup. Right? I think that is the achievement that I can talk of rather. Right? But if you ask me that's not an achievement compared to the kind of opposition we used to play because it is expected of us to go and win this kind of Africa qualifiers and all that because at the moment even beating Uganda we tend to celebrate. It's an achievement which is something that is not supposed to be. Not at all. So for us to go and win in Rwanda it's an achievement for Kenya cricket now. Do you miss it? I don't miss it. You playing the game? I don't miss it. I miss playing hard and just giving your best and there's nothing as good as representing your country. It's something. Plenty of questions trickling in. Of course some guitar is asking. Just a funny one. Are there ball tempering issues in Kenya's cricket and he's saying that with comparison to Australian team captains who tempered with that ball while they were getting in South Africa? No, there's no ball tempering because the level we are playing even if you you temper with it it's not going to make any difference so there is not at this level now. Not at this level. Not the Kenyan level. Not at Kenyan level. We've got cricket clubs here in the country and we are an amateur country in terms of cricket. If we professionalize it how good can it be for cricket Kenya? Very good. Very good. If we take a regional where we have Kisumu, Mombasa, Nakuru, Eldoret, Taker it will be wonderful. There will be more sponsors. TV will come on board. You'll be having academies. You'll be having kids coming through because all these regions will be required to have an academy and to have a setup of under this, under this, under this and under that. That is what needs to be done. That each and every club or each and every team must have a line where this fits this one and then this one. Like what they have out there. You'll find Barcelona has a youth team I don't know what. So you progress. Edge grade categories. There you go. And Felix Okura is asking that presence of the champ in the national team is it ceremonial because he says towards the end of last year you were supposed to travel they were supposed to travel to South Africa but at the 11th hour you got knocked off the travelling party. So this happened? Yes. It's not the first time I'm surprised that you can remember that. Yes. This is what I told you guys earlier about egos pride and trying to exercise powers. Stamping authority. Yes. We are leaving Morris even if it's the national team coach we are leaving him. This is what it's all about. So what does that tell you? It's not about us winning but it's all about making sure Morris Odoomba doesn't travel. Irrespective of what he offers the team. Irrespective of his experience and all that. That's kind of witch hunt. It is witch hunt. It is witch hunt. I'll be very honest with you. I've been mistreated once I've been there. I'll tell you that for a fact. I've been mistreated. I've not had a smooth run at all. At all. So what's the essence in the first place appointing you to be in charge of the national team when you can't travel with the rest of this code? Why hire me then? Because the thing is maybe it will look good to silence the critics we brought him back. Remember he's been out. So we've brought him back but when it comes to the major so-called major events Morris will be left behind especially when we are going to countries where cricket is known because that's where the assumption is my name is big or there will, you know attention will be on him. So if it's Rwanda it's okay you can go but not Dubai, not India. And how was the performance in South Africa now that they traveled without you? Very poor. It has always been poor. The only time they've won an event is when I went with them to Rwanda. That's the only time. But every time they've left me behind they've come back with a very poor performance. For performances, yeah. Plenty of stories and plenty of questions as well. Some guy from Rwanda in Nakuru Festas is asking Morris did he take bribe from the book markers as it's being alleged? Because he has insisted this before several times but once again and I'm asking this for the last time. The thing is this will you pay Harambe stars to lose to Brazil? For the sake of patriotism, no. No, but do you think Harambe stars can beat Brazil? No. What are the chances? Exactly. So when Kenya is going out there to play against Australia what are the odds? So you cannot... The probability that Australia would beat Kenya is high. There you go. So the book maker was a friend but as I said again how do you bribe Harambe stars to lose to Brazil? It's next to impossible. So there was not... So in this case Kenya was playing against whom? Well there was never a match. It is just that this guy was a friend so you can borrow money from a friend, can't you? So that is what it was. It was a friendship and let me be honest with you also I'll tell you something when these teams travel out there they stay in a hotel maybe you are down there having tea or something and somebody comes and joins you hey Wanyama, for example are you going to start asking this fellow oh, what do you do? Who are you? Are you a book maker? Will you do that? No So it's the same thing then we had a relation but later on it turned out that it was a book maker but if you look at the story even my case it was a miscarriage of justice if they had found me guilty of taking money from the book maker they would have given me life but remember Yes, they would have given me life ban but what was my accusation in appropriate contact with a book maker that would have brought the game into disrepute so which game did I bring into disrepute? None but because I'm from a small country Kenya no Godfather they wanted a scapegoat there you go how many have been caught red-handed and they've just been fined 5000 because like this ball tampering how many were they given? 12 months because they are super power Maorisai, you know during your head days representing the country performing better on both continental and international fronts several people associated with you you had plenty of friends government representatives who are so proud of you is still the same case? No, it can never be the same case Kenyans like to worship heroes and thieves they glorify this is it but the minute you sleep a bit and even when you think about it country never stood behind me when these guys were coming after me they never did because if you look at any other case where it involves much fixing look how their government gets behind them and not only in cricket even these guys who are being thieves of drug cheats they have to be very keen and know it could be a scheme to finish them look what IAAF is doing trying to curtail certain races like Russia what they did to Russia and the Olympics so we have to be careful let's not accept anything that is we are spoon fed because a lot of people don't know I was charged because of inappropriate contact inappropriate you have friends with a bad man why? now how would you know this guy is bad? so you know those kind of things so we need to be alive to certain facts that hey let's not take things at first value oh Ali Shtaikiwa he was found guilty but then ask yourself who are their witnesses? in fact like in my case who are their witnesses? ex-girlfriends and not even a single cricketer so what does that tell you? so has been life of the heroic circles have you been coping up with life of the crickets circles and of the glorifying days of yourself? we can't complain to be honest with you because as I said handling the national team you know something to do but again there are problems we don't know if we are going to be paid our salaries there is nobody to sign the checks so we are in a limbo again God knows for how long so I cannot say oh it's beautiful things are working nicely no they are not because our cricket is dead and it's more or less buried but I refuse to accept that cricket has gone down it's a question of just removing a few officials and we move on now your final word in terms of as you wind up on this particular segment what will be your advice to the footballers not only in cricket but across sporting disciplines with regards to what should they do right now and heading into days of their life after the sport well you know they always say that oh save and invest and all that but how much are you being given for you to save and to invest we are not talking about the wanyamas of the world fine they say oh even if it's 10 shillings you can still save but what I could say is that just plan for the future doesn't matter how little the amount might be but just put kidogo aside and you never know those rainy days it might just help you but you know with the African society once everybody knows you and kidogo there is a cousin here there is this here it's a bit difficult but the best thing is just prepare for the future thanks man for coming lot of problems thank you for having me more is available cricket legend and Icon joining us to dissect about the state of the cricket in the country and talking about his hey days denying claims that you know he received bribed from bookmarkers to fix again giving a comparison to a match that probably would involve Kenya Brazil or Australia as far as the word of cricket is concerned this is the touch line on Y25 my name is Maxwell Wasike the fan zone the fan favorite segment as we give focus on international football is coming up Olegunasolshia the Norway international has been given full managerial capacity as the man to steer man united to another level that forms the basis of our discussion up next don't go away stay tuned