 Good afternoon and welcome. My name is Molly Martin, and I'm the director of New America Indianapolis, and today we'll be doing another episode of Inside Out, where we discuss ideas from the heartland, in this case from Indiana, that we think are useful and scalable to other parts of the country. This is a special part of Inside Out, a series we call Youth America, youth-led policy in the heartland. Youth America is a storytelling for action project between New America and voices. We'll hear more about voices in just a moment. And our goal is to help youth policy advocates safely share their stories and ideas to improve and reinvent the systems intended to serve and protect young people in Indiana and beyond. Today, we're so honored to be joined by Legend West and Daniel Dabney, both of whom are youth policy fellows with voices. Daniels and Lake County, Indiana, and Legend is in Grant County. And in addition to being youth policy fellow, Legend is also a social services professional. We're also joined again today by Lauren Hall, senior leadership team member of voices and a New America Indianapolis IUPUI fellow and Kea Wells, founder and executive director of voices. Thank you for joining us today. We hope that you'll join the conversation by asking your questions and leaving your comments in the chat or going online and joining us at hashtag Youth America on Twitter. I'm really excited to dive in because today our youth policy fellows are going to take a deeper dive into education funding and youth support funding and school funding formulas, things that not everyone assumes young people are interested in and yet young people are the most impacted by the decision. So before we dig in with Daniel and Legend, I'd love to turn to you, Kea, and talk to you a little bit about voices. We have folks joining us from Indiana and also folks from across the country. And I think they'd be really interested in your model. Well, first, thank you so much, Molly, for having us. We are always grateful for this platform and to elevate the voices of the young adults that are working with us. Voices were started about 10 years ago. My background is in juvenile probation and it really was born out of the need just to create some culturally relevant programming that addressed a lot of the root causes of the violence that we were seeing in the neighborhoods. And so at the time, all of my friends were artists and I brought that into the work to help bring that, you know, neutral zone and safe space for young people to be able to discuss what was going on with them. Fast forward 10 years later and we are working with Department of Child Services, juvenile probation, and really keeping that model of just centering them in our programming and making sure that we create these spaces for them to be able to advocate for the things that happen, you know, in their past and, you know, that attributed to the systems that they were involved in. So we're really excited to be able to continue this work. Last year, we got really intentional about training young folks to be leaders and to really kind of push that platform and their narratives a little bit further. We're just expanding on that with the different partnerships. We were awarded some funding recently that will allow us to continue this work for a couple of years going forward. And so we're really excited about this new partnership coming up and just creating these safe spaces for kids. Thank you so much, Kia. You can learn more about voices and I will drop a link in the chat, actually, and I believe is it voicescorporation.org? Kia, what's your URL? It's voicescorp.org. Voicescorp.org will drop that in the chat. Thank you. So, Daniel, I'm going to come to you first. I'd love to hear a little bit more about who is Daniel. What brought you to this advocacy journey? What brought you to voices and what sorts of issues are you particularly passionate about? Daniel? Hi, everyone. Again, I'm Daniel and I was brought into the Youth Voices program, drew my mom's job in the Indiana Parenting Institute. Youth Voices reached out to Indiana Parenting Institute and they reached out to me and through them, I was able to get connected to the Youth Voices program in August. Since then, I've been trying my best to be a good advocate. At the time, I was dealing with advocacy with housing and homelessness. I'm currently dealing with advocacy around racism. Thanks to Lauren. I recently gained the ability to write an article about racism that I'm nearly finished with and could hopefully spread my wisdom and my story to the world. And I am very passionate about things like racism and homophobia and sexism and I look forward to finding ways to fix those issues. Excellent. And I have faith that you can fix those issues and I'm looking forward to watching it for sure. So thank you so much, Daniel. We'll get back to you in a moment. But legend, I'd like to come to you. And same question. Tell us a little bit about your advocacy journey and what brought you to voices. My name is Legend West and I got plugged into Voices on the, I'm a member of the Journey Fellowship, which is a social worker fellowship in Indiana funded by Lillian Dalmat and someone had shared the application for the Voices program on our Journey Facebook page. And I was really interested in getting more involved in policymaking in Indiana and was so fortunate to, you know, have a little part of the program and to me, Lauren and Kia and Brandon and Ms. China, who've, yeah, just given me so many amazing opportunities. As far as what I feel most passionate about going forward in, you know, my ability to influence or impact things. I have worked in the foster care field the last two years. I'm a, I guess I'm a foster care graduate. I came out of the foster care system. And right now, I, I guess, like, overall, if I could, like, as just as far as, like, finding equity and social justice and getting to, like, the root of those things, like, where those things are caused, and, you know, finding class, you know, class solidarity, and I guess just overall just very passionate about social justice. Thank you so much, legend. Hearing younger people say class solidarity warms my ancient heart. So I'm very happy to hear all this energy. This is great. Before we talk a little bit more about some recent advocacy that legend and Daniel have done. Lauren, would you tell us a little bit about this process by which youth policy fellows engage with Indiana lawmakers? Sure. First off, I think it's really important to know that brilliance is latent within our students, our youth, our young adults. And so it's really been a learning journey. I think, you know, every sort of teacher is really intentional about learning with and from their students. And I would, I would orient in a similar fashion. So I would say throughout our journey together, you know, legend Daniel, their peers were certainly engaged in the process of, you know, mapping their personal experiences onto collective experiences onto systems, which are, you know, of course, ruled by these different policies. And just being super transparent with you, I think I fake it really well with Daniel and legend. I mean, they're over here thinking I like write policy and do things and, you know, I think I'm enough to be dangerous. And I think it's just, you know, when I started and now that, you know, I've channeled forward, I think we are all just much more equipped to interrogate those systems, the policy. And realize that at the root of it right like policy and systems have people in them. And so I think what has been so profound is that what we've kept intentional as part of our program is this fact that people are what make up society what make up policies what make up systems. And so therefore how do we hold truth to our own stories our own triumph over trauma and, you know, rooting and healing, and how do we really look at again their rules right. You know, I've certainly heard this before and I'm, I think it's Brittany Pachnick Cunningham I think I've heard it from a few other folks just talked about rigged rules right and so really trying to understand how are these rules ie policies rigged. And even not intentionally right and I think that's been a big learning for me is just the fact that really helping myself and folks in the program to see all sides and still be able to come out of that and seek aspects of solidarity amongst folks who are who are benefiting from these rigged rules. So that was very abstract and passion centric logistically it was truly competitive application, we had to turn away some youth who I who I think are, you know, incredible had just as much conviction, but we really wanted to keep it to a small group. From there we broke him into cohorts. They worked in on policy issues as Daniel mentioned he was working on housing and homelessness legend was actually the first one to bring up specifically before there was even low legislation and bigger conversation about school funding. She said, I care about school funding issues, which was like oh interesting okay. And so just helped them journey along in understanding that content knowledge as well as the shared systems knowledge and policy knowledge required to advocate. They spoke with legislators to cohort to cohorts actually submitted policy that manifested in different pushes in the State House this year and then we were able to follow on with that advocacy prior to the session by having legend and Daniel come to the State House. And that must have been quite a journey. You know, I'm not sure when the first time I was in a State House was but I was probably around your age and I would have been terrified. So let's get to that let's talk about what it was like going to advocate to Indiana lawmakers and Daniel I'd love to start with you and let's kind of start with the end and we'll work backwards in the story. So talking to your your representatives, folks who really work for you. What were you asking for, when you talk to your Indiana lawmakers, this last visit this last opportunity. When I went to the State House I went there to ask for more funding for special education. I chose that topic because my brother is a person with autism. And for the past two years, he and my family has been struggling to help him get the quality education that he needs, because he's a specialist student. And I decided that this would be the perfect opportunity for me to go about helping him with that and I basically told them that my school, my school has many different programs like many other, like many other schools that do special education, but these programs are not full of people who are entirely qualified or entirely have the resources to help my brother get the quality education he needs. And I go to 21st century charter school at Gary and this is the school that kind of considers themselves to be a specialty school. And if a specialty school is struggling, then the other schools are definitely going to be struggling. So I figured that it's a perfect time to advocate about this stuff because I don't think that people are paying attention to specialist students the way that they need to otherwise this would not be happening. So that's basically why I went to the State House and why I talked about what I did. That's fantastic. So you're not off the hook with me at Daniel. I'd love to know you're looking at the supports available to disabled people, people who need special education, your brother who has autism, as you said. What, where's the money going, if it's not going to support people with the highest need as a student, where do you see funding and support going in Gary schools. I definitely believe that all of the funding that is supposed to be distributed to people with special education is definitely going to neurotypical people who they believe are at the high end of the education. But it's the gifted students and highly intelligent students that they believe need to have all this funding and all these resources to help them succeed because those are who they consider to be the face of their schools, the ones most worthy of the funding and resources that they get. That's really astute and so as you're watching school systems essentially make bets on folks that they think are going to come out further ahead or on top that must be incredibly frustrating and so you and your family are advocating with and for your brother for supports. Were you ever asked what do you need or did you always have to ask someone else and volunteer what you needed. That's a good question I never really thought about that before but off the top of my head. I don't believe that I've ever that I've ever really had to ask for these types of things until until this covert thing happened. I truly believe that cope that COVID when it started it revealed a lot of the secrets in this country, especially in the form of education. But I never really had to deal with these issues to the extreme that I did until COVID happened and I feel like that really changed my outlook on things and I probably wouldn't have even considered it had that not happened and kickstarted all these events. That's really helpful. So I'll be back Daniel to hear more about your journey in a moment but legend I'd love to come to you so even though Daniel has a personal passion and reason for pursuing increased special education funding it sounds like you were the first in the cohort to say educated education funding is where the action is that's where I want to be. How did you land there. To begin answering your question. When I went into foster care and kind of like all through my public school journey, it was always teachers that you know sit in the gap that were very much like the unsung parents like that. You know, I very much pay a lot of respect and like, oh, like homage to them for kind of who I've become today. And I've lived in Marion, Indiana for the last since 2016 to the last like almost five years. And it's one of the great counties one of the most impoverished populations in Indiana and Marion in particular is predominantly, you know, full of black kids and super impoverished and there's very little industry. My college roommate is a teacher just down the road and my husband actually is a teacher at the same school. And over the last two years seeing them work in the school system in just a year. You know, every single year for the last five years the superintendent has had to cut you know $1 million from the school budget. And I'm just like, where is that like, what are you not you know what, what, how, how much is this depriving the students of you know the people that these students need the materials up to date, you know, her curriculums. You know, having two people that I care very much about and, you know, in my, my full time job that I was doing. I had, you know, children who were in foster care, then in the school systems, and foster care social workers rely so much on the school because after the foster parents there would be kids the most right. If I was visiting a kid, you know, once or twice a month, I'm going to get just as much information from their teacher about how this child's doing, as I am from the foster parents so as a foster care social worker, schools are the pinnacle they are so valuable to us. And when I got plugged in with Lauren, and I was like hey I'm not really sure where I fit in in this crowd. This is something that I really care about and I'd love to know what I can do, because I feel like for most of my life I would be like oh I care a lot about this but I have absolutely no idea how to influence it or, you know, who do I have to yell at. And having the opportunity with Lauren called me up, I was like, yes this is awesome, because navigating, you know, I think that there are so many barriers right between how I feel and what I see happening to the Miriam Community School Corporation. And who do I, like, getting from here to here and kind of saying like, hey just so you know this is what's happening to these students because of the money you're taking away from the school system. And so I'm interested, I don't even know, I feel like I lost myself from the beginning of your question. I've got you. I'm with you. I think what I'm hearing and it's a clear tale is you were looking around as a person who had experienced being lost in the shuffle. You were working with students are being lost in the shuffle, and you're getting a headline from from somewhere from on high that says million dollars out the door, and you're looking around and thinking what is a better use of our money than this. You know, schools are asked to do a lot, but they're also one of our only ways to keep track of what's happening with our youngest people. And so when you feel that way legend and I can tell it's something you feel very personally and passionately. How do you communicate that to a lawmaker who has maybe limited time, how do you do it quickly. So, thankfully, I think we gave ourselves two minutes. I think, you know, when Lauren and Sarah were prepping us they said, with this up committee you'll have two minutes to testify. And I was like how do I, you know ring the most of two minutes get these people to like, leaving care about what I said. So how did we get there so we had to be there by, I think we ended up saying one o'clock. So I drove an hour and a half from there in Indiana to get there. I waited until the session was over, which they like pushed back the time so far that they couldn't push it back anymore they got to like the very last time it was like, hey, we have to start the session. And I think it was probably like six o'clock by the time we got to the subcommittee. And then there were a few people in line ahead of us but Lauren is like so proactive. And not only was she like so like practical and kind about it. But like she just got it done she was like, I have you here and they need to speak and this is important and choose. Wow, that's who I want to be when I grow up. And so thankfully, because my husband was there with me and he and I, you know we were committed to getting Daniel back home, who Daniel was traveling from me from Gary, Indiana. It was like two and a half hours from Indianapolis so poor Daniel was in the car so much this day just for two minutes, and he made them count like I'll let him see for himself but he made them count. Literally when Daniel left the subcommittee room. Everyone in that whole class for him because. Yes, because he's a great advocate. So you get two minutes, typically, and we. You know, kind of Lauren and Sarah Peptus like use your story. And then like have your big ask make sure they know what your ass is in my asking particular was. I'm a social worker. I'm familiar with foster care. The schools are super important to our kids and I'm asking that you consider, you know, these two things in particular. The English language learners are in a school system as well as how many kids are on free and reduced lunch. And interestingly, when COVID the pandemic began, Mary community school systems began giving free and reduced lunch to all of their kids. And I thought that that was what the whole state was doing, but that's just unique to me and because they know the level of need the kids have. And the beginning of the fall 2020 school year kids have been back in session and Mary, you know, it's meeting schools, because the school like the kids use at the school so I can really a lot about the school corporation in particular and when Sarah share with us kind of like what the budget for this for the next two years looks like. They're just like a little bit of joy like maybe those two minutes counted. I'm confident they did. I will say I am not sure anyone has the power to move a lawmaker like younger people do, to be honest, but you've hit on something really important their legend actually want to talk to you about a Kia. So, Kia when you are working with systems involved youth, or youth have been attracted to a policy program, you're dealing with passionate people. You are dealing with people who are probably rightfully angry about the way things work. How do you coach your colleagues your youth colleagues and your charges to take that anger and condense it and and make sure that it stays the wind beneath the wings of something that's maybe a little more concise, and sometimes a little dispassionate I mean how do you even begin. Now I think that's always the balance right you know and helping the kids kind of channel the energy. But I think more of the challenge for us is with the adults and trying to get their their mind wrapped around kids being experts right and we fight really really hard to make sure that they are at every table that we're at that they're prepared to be at these levels and that folks take them serious, you know, most of our kids as you said our system impacted from either juvenile justice is mental health addiction there's we touch all of the systems. And, you know, we were really intentional when we started this youth leadership program that those were the ones that needed to have this this platform. You know they were the closest to the issues that we're trying to solve and so it really when we're working with these young people that's the easy part for us. Because we get all of our energy from them, and you know their innovation the way that they see things, you know that helps us kind of create this, you know this programming. You know, again the hardest part is the adults in the room, you know shifting that power to the young people in the communities that are most impacted and so. To see them transform the way that they have and to see them change the narrative of you know whatever system they're connected to, to see them grow in their power. It's amazing, you know you can't beat the feeling I mean you guys hear them on your now it's like I'm just saying that I mean they're incredible young people and I think that we're you know as a society are coming into, you know this space where we're starting to understand that you know they need to be front center and that they need to be the ones driving all of this policy change. Well put, and I think that you've highlighted the thing that is the biggest problem right we tend to. If we have some power we tend to get afraid or nervous or we begin to other the people who are really living the experience we're trying to address and I have to believe that age is a big part of that I'm sure race and gender are also huge parts of that. So clearly you did you did something right all of you did something right because Daniel walks in and the place explodes in applause so Daniel tell me about that when you were preparing your testimony and you're coming all the way from Gary and that's a hike. And you're being pushed back and waiting waiting and just kind of enjoying the bureaucracy. And all of a sudden you're facing down some people who want to go home, who think you're too young, who believe they've heard every sad story. Tell me about the mental preparation even the academic preparation you did how'd you get there. It took a lot for me to even consider doing this, like when I got the news from Lauren, like I immediately went into full panic mode and I mean literal panic mode. I had a panic attack for the first time a week before that. And it was just tearing me apart for an entire day. And I asked her if I could sleep on the issue and some way somehow some miracle. I had a dream that literally told me to do this and I have no idea. I had no idea why and to a degree I still don't know why that happened. But after that I knew that I had to do this now or it was going to eat up my conscious later. So I do all this research. I come to the conclusion I want to do special education like I said earlier. So we get ready to go there and I'm in this like three hour drive with Lauren and we're talking and we're getting my stuff together and I'm feeling a lot more confident than I was before. We even had a Zoom meeting before then and I was feeling so confident. I had all of this confidence and all of the panic just went away until I got to the state house and they delayed this meeting multiple times and it's it's like with every delay. I got increasingly more nervous and even more panicky right back to step aside and I have to call some people are texting people and paste back and forth in this own in this private area until I was finally able to get in there and talk to them. And I came in ready I had everything in my head and then for some weird reason I just lost everything and I froze and that that's really something huge for me because I do not freeze. And I know that sounds like that might sound somewhat egotistical but I never freeze in these situations when I speak I speak and I say what I want to say the way I want to say it. But here all of that just went out the window and I was just frozen in fear and luckily for me a senator senator Eddie Melton who who is a person who's always around me but I never get to interact with him. He was at my school is at my mom's job but I never met him and he helped me feel a little bit more confident in that time when I was just frozen and then there was another senator who asked me a question and drew her asking me that question. I was able to get back on track and I said everything that I needed to say but I certainly everything that I wanted to say even and I was a little bit disappointed because I didn't get to do everything I wanted to do. And then everybody gave me this huge applause when they when I came out and talking about how brave it was. And I got to meet Senator JD Ford and he gave me this this label pen this really rare label pen and a bottle of water which I desperately needed then. And then I got support from Lauren and legend and her husband Noah and I got to listen to some really cool music from legend on the way home and everything just became so much better afterwards like I felt so disappointed in myself for like for freezing. When I typically don't freeze but after looking back on what I did even going there saying what I needed to say having the support of all my friends. It was just like it didn't even matter anymore. I love that story and hopefully there's some policymakers watching now or maybe watching in the future and listening to what a difference it can make when our representatives are in community with us. We should be working on policy development together asking questions, cheering people on wanting them to succeed even in times when we disagree. So it sounds like you knocked it out of the park but you did say there were some things that you wanted to put out into the ether that you didn't get to. Now's a great time to Daniel is there's something that you didn't get to say to the Indiana lawmakers that you love to get on video today. Now I I can't really think of it because what I wanted to say to them was something that was very specific to my school in terms of the the programs that were going on. And I believe it has something to do with with like there's a separation of time there is the normal time that people with neurotypical education typically get and then there's a special education. And the special education takes out of the regular education and that just and they call it extra time when in reality you're just sectioning off time, you're not really giving extra time. And this extra time that I'm talking about is is those programs where Kai is Kai is my he's my brother and I'm talking about. And that's the only time that he ever gets to actually learn anything, because those are when he's surrounded by the people who know how to deal with him, and are able to give him what he needs to succeed. And when he's back in class with other kids and he's like distracted or doesn't get the attention he needs because there's like 20 other kids in the class with him. He's not learning as much as he needs to. So he's, it's not really extra time in the way that they're saying it if he's not even getting the normal time that we're talking about. And that's what I wanted to say to him. That's really instructive, and I think it's one of those first lessons of policymaking and yet we forget it all the time. Ask the people who are living it how does this feel when we call it extra. Are you getting enough time. When do you learn so I'm really glad that you raised that here today. So, legend you said and Daniel said something similar I hope it made a difference. I hope I did a good job, and I think it's clear that both of you did. And as luck would have it and and you contributed to this work there was a positive development last week on on the education funding front here in Indiana and I was wondering if you would tell us a little bit about how that how it felt reading that news what you understand of that news. Before I begin I will, what was, I wanted to like interject and make sure Daniel is not selling himself short. What he showed us was the power of engaging them in conversation. After we do like that we was a pause it was a very powerful strong ties. And when he came back in he engaged them in conversation. We applauded because of because how intentional his thoughts were, and like, he really broke down the barrier like so it was like, Oh, here's this stage here's a podium you have your two minutes with Daniel and gave some appreciation. And that is that was just so much. It was just very powerful. For your question, as far as how it felt reading to the article, we kind of broke this down with Lauren and Sarah thankfully getting through the jargon. So, public schools are a great equalizer I guess they kind of level. It's not a great term. They level the playing field and in Indiana we have, I think it's like Indiana is one of the biggest voucher programs or has the biggest voucher program. And so the shift kind of moving away. And whenever that happens, it's people with power and money that get a better education. It's like the people who who need the resources don't it's usually kids in public schools. I've learned so much through this right and so to read through that, and to feel grateful that okay you know this is a step in the right direction. But then to see there are dissenting voices that are saying you know like oh well this isn't the last of what we will we want for this voucher program it's just really interesting because I because I will always advocate for people over profit. And I think that in the United States and in the Midwest there's a lot of like, well I want my individuality I want to make the choice for myself. And if that choice that you get to make for yourself. Sometimes that means like taking away something from someone else. And it's been really, really fascinating, just to learn and kind of be humbled and you know there's still so much that I don't know, and wanting to be on the right side of history and making things. You know, better for the kids at the least. Yeah, I'm so glad you are. Lauren legend talked a little bit about this development in terms of taking a little wind out of the sales of a move towards more voucher dollars and kind of reallocating those in different ways. What was your reflection on on some of these developments that we've seen from the State House in the last week. Yeah, so I, you know, since we are not convenient here just to dive into complexity funding I'm not going to turn on to extreme teacher mode and try and like analyze all the different processes both because I don't think I completely do it justice and also fairly because I think, as I reinforce to legend and Daniel and their peers, you know, often it's the fact that complexity funding kind of you heard legends say jargon right working through the jargon, the idea of complexity funding will need brother you know they, they deserve some complexity be on just one student equals this amount. And so therefore, if we are thinking about that what are ways we can make our equation complex to validate and value and put money behind the resources, folks need to be able to thrive and so we did see good movement. And again, you know kudos we've been bringing it up but I think what an underlying thread of the story to is that we're doing this as part of a movement right the Indiana teachers across the state of Indiana teachers locally through tapes you know we have been educated by and with and you know it's been mutually beneficial for us to think about our kids have these experiences and these passions and these things. How do we educate one another. So I'm getting a little off track but my point is simply that, you know, I think that we see a our state getting more educated about complexity funding I mean, Daniel and legend we're not the only ones testifying right the reason why I was doing my, you know, judicious professional relational self and advocating for them to go early and go together was because, you know, everyone showed out, you know, a superintendent for multiple school schools across the state. Some of the biggest you know nonprofit leaders, folks were just here. So I love the development I would say the big things are one that people are getting more educated about how money is being spent and they realize how much it matters to is that the biggest sticking point for me is that the fact that we've seen complexity funding in recent years, actually not go to the schools that one might rationally think need it right high percentage of low income students. And instead you see that that formula leading to increased inequity in school funding, even though it's meant to do the opposite, I would say the third thing which huge kudos to Daniel and I think this feels like such an important point to make Daniel was speaking about special education. We saw a huge increase commitment in special education funding. And I deeply believe that, you know, as legend said the conversational tone. And Daniel was able to bring as well as just that vulnerability and that emotiveness. I think it being, you know, with love, you know, I think created a space amongst amongst very tired beleaguered elected officials that they were they were tapping into their humanity in a way that was just unique and different and profound. And I believe that that success we see in special education increase definitely Daniel was part of a collective movement to make that happen. Super proud of them. And I think just on that note around his his whether he causes it a freeze or legend causes it, you know, a thoughtful pause. I think what I noticed about that moment is that I feel so often. Sometimes people avoid the idea of doing youth leadership development or, or even bringing diverse voices whether that be age race class background geography, what have you, because there is this acknowledgement that tokenization. We don't want that right. At the end of the day, Daniel and legend could have been tokenized right, whether it be by their, you know, age, their racial identity, where they were coming from. And I think what's so powerful is that, you know, as Daniel mentioned, Eddie Melton spoke up and said, you know what like Daniel you are representing right so the idea that you're not a token here Daniel like I am breaking down that wall and you're representing like a whole group of people, we hear you advocating for your brother. And so really being critical as educators as policymakers and not tokenizing people, but thinking, Wow, they are representative voice and knowing that he is multiple and intersectional, because not only was he represented representing his community, but we see, you know, what could be labeled as, you know, like a white girl from rural Indiana and a black boy from urban Indiana, actually, you know, breaking down what it means to be tokenized and representing not just themselves but this collective that is the best of Indiana I think and really is relational and able to create change if we truly try and see the complexity and understand the representation but not the tokenization. That's really helpful, Lauren and that's a great point about do can we weaponize tokenizing and can we flip the script a little bit. And while you were explaining and legend was explaining the recent developments I did drop a link to a article in the chat for folks who'd like to dig in more but I thought you both captured a beautifully it's a very complex issue, and you made it simpler. I don't know why we always make things so hard. Daniel, when we were talking at the beginning about your own advocacy drivers the things that really get you up in the morning. You mentioned anti racism work. You mentioned LGBTQ work. Can you talk a little bit about what's next you have kind of an advocacy wish list of things that you really think Indiana needs to act on soon. Yes, I, I definitely have when I, when I get the majority of the work with this racism issue done. I want to quickly move on to the LGBTQ, LGBTQ work, because it's come to my attention that that there is, there is not enough for LGBTQ people in in my city particularly in Gary I don't know if it's like that for the entirety of Indiana, but for my city I know for sure we need a lot more support for this, because as a LGBTQ person, I have realized that I have not gotten the support that I really needed. And I kind of, I kind of touch on that in the racism article that I'm writing, but it's not entirely focused on the LGBTQ aspect of me, but the support we need a lot more that and I'm surrounded by primarily African American and we have our own issues regarding LGBT, regarding the LGBTQ community with the stereotype that that we're a very homophobic grace and there's no getting out of that. And I think people, people have become a little too comfortable with that idea. And I really want to break that out and give a lot more help to people who are like me. Do you think Daniel that there is a role for schools, since we've been talking about education, is there a role for schools in helping provide community supports for LGBTQ youth especially. There is absolutely a role for school. In fact, like, before all of this, all of this COVID stuff happened. I was literally about to start. I was going to suggest starting a program at my school for this and get a bunch of my friends were also going to the LGBTQ to help out and like lead this thing. I believe if we're going to do this, it definitely has to start with the youth. That's because like, I don't I don't want to stereotype Gen Z, but we can be very, very, very out there when we we want stuff done. And I know that if if I have started that program, I could like revolutionize something right there. So yeah, I think schools will definitely needs to get a program started. They definitely need to get youth leading it. And then like the entirety of the the cities that schools are in, maybe like one by one, we start working together start integrating that into like, into legislation or something like that. I don't know. But we definitely need to start coming together and doing something about it. Thank you, Daniel. That's so important. You opened the door. It's perfect. Legend. I want to talk to you about Gen Z. I have it on trusted authority that this is something that you like to talk about. I am 43. So I'm a Gen Xer. And they told us that we were such slackers, we're never leaving the basement, we were lazy, etc, etc. Some of it probably came to pass and some of it didn't. But I personally have been really excited and impressed by Gen Z's ability to mobilize and organize and that's you know, I'm painting with a broad brush. I don't know all the Gen Z years, but things are going to have to work differently. COVID has taught us that as Daniels pointed out, life changes right this is the point of having seasons and talking about generations. What do you think Gen Xers and Millennials and older lawmakers are going to have to start doing differently? If Gen Z has anything to say about it, how should they work differently? How do we need to change? Oh, that feels like a really heavy, like a loaded question. So for myself personally, I know that I am not at all interested in legalism or anything that's going to any kind of structure that's going to continue to perpetuate hierarchies. And that goes down to like the clothes that we wear, Lauren kind of teased me, you know, we went to the state house, kind of like remember to dress professionally, like there's a time and a day to take down the patriarchy and it might not be when you're advocating for school funding. And you know, this is also wrapped up in each other, as far as, you know, what, gosh, as far as like we live in a great capitalistic system, I don't know, I feel like I could just like bounce from thing to thing. I very much, I think that what I can, what I expected of Gen Z is obviously a huge push for environmental justice, as far as like, if current lawmakers, you know, want to stay in their positions, getting with the pro, you know, I'm very much an abolitionist for Citizens United, right is that the right thing. I don't think that needs to stick around long like I'm ready for like myself and the oldest of Gen Z to get into elected positions and I think that there will hopefully be a huge change in who and how our elected politicians supported financially. Like, my own little like thing is like I want to see the abolition of the 40 hour work week, or like this structured work week right I think we've all felt through COVID. Why are we not focusing our lives are on the home, and how can different industries, better support families. And for one week I like, had a 13 year old that my husband and I were were watching for the for the week and I was a babysitting. He lived with us for a week we took him to school, and I had to go late to work every single day to make sure he got to school. And I'm like, what are we do, what are we doing wrong, whereas like, start, start and start times for work and end times work aren't matching up with like, where people's children are. Um, so I, I don't know, I could, of course there are you know pros and cons of everything we do. One thing that I've kind of learned is that with every, you know, every like I'd love to see this change. There's usually a group that's mixed in that's going to get hurt by something. And we, it's you can't always see where those, those lines are and that's why it's so important to practice radical listening. When someone comes to the table and says the thing that you're doing is hurting me, whether it's what you're saying or this action to practice radical listening and hearing that from, you know, people who are in the margins and then integrating that into how we live. Um, I thought I had to go on all day long about that. And I wanted to piggyback on what Daniel said, as far as like advocating for LGBTQIA plus youth in school, we need comprehensive sex education. That's the next thing. So, right, this is really working out for me. My mom was a sex ed teacher, which was mortifying at 13 but in my old age I think this is great like this is you got to start early talking about this stuff so not for nothing I agree and, and I like the points you make legend I think what COVID has taught us is that we can break apart some systems that we have long thought were immutable in this country, whether that's a work week or a physical space or to Daniel's point the way school works. But we have to be willing to do a lot of work. Once we're in this broken space, right really practice radical listening and pick and choose the policy levers that we can change when we can change them and, and I do think a lot of it is youth and a lot of it is generational progress and that's always good and I think Gen Z has some powerful allies along the spectrum across ages and groups to bust up some of these systems that obviously aren't working if they were working. I wouldn't have seen this great schism that Daniel highlighted when COVID, you know really revealed and exacerbated so many of these inequities they're so long standing. Kia, I want to come to you because we actually talked about this in the first inside out episode we did together and there's a link to that first episode in the chat for those who missed it. We talked about showing up quote professionally and you mentioned what Lauren said and I think that's a good point it is a very fine line threading a needle to show up professionally because your professionalism is often being judged by someone who isn't your age isn't your gender isn't Kia what advice do you give to the folks at voices or would you give to people in the audience especially younger people about showing up to engage with policymakers, maintaining your authenticity and being aware of some of these trip wires. That's a hard one. You know, I told the story last time when I was in college and I got my first job as a juvenile probation officer, and I had this massive fraud, right. I mean I had worked hard to get this fraud as big as it was. And so I interviewed had the internship and I got the job, and then I put a perm in my hair so that it was straight. I walk into the office they're like, what the hell did you do to your hair why what what happened we left your afro and I just thought that that's what you know was required of me to be in this corporate environment. And you know that was the first lesson they were like we didn't care about your hair it was your passion it was your education it was your drive like who cares you know, but even now like in the spaces that I'm in, you know, I have locks, you know what I'm saying and so I'm going into these predominantly white male spaces and it's, it is a thing that I'm aware of that I'm like well are they taking me serious you know my my t shirt says protect black youth that, or you know what I mean and my hair is in locks and you know, it is a thing recently my daughter got some braids in her hair and they were lime green, and I lost my mind. I'm like who in the world, what we're no we don't do that's not how we show up and she was like why. And it was just the way that she said it I'm like you know what you're absolutely right. Because you have green hair does not mean that you are less intelligent or less capable. I think it's just the way that I was raised in the time period. You know I'm still in that you know that space of you have to show up a certain way but I think this younger generation is getting it right, you know, long as you are authentic. Long as you are who you are, you know that's not saying we have naked in court rooms and things like that. But I think you know that they're they're getting it right I think it's us I just turned 40 last week that needs to kind of start, you know, seeing things a little bit differently and giving space to people just literally showing up who they are. You know, in New Orleans they just passed the Crown Act. That is the fact that you needed to pass an act for black women to wear their hair naturally to work still. I'm still stuck there. But it got passed and then we know what happened with the anchor woman in New York, you know who got all of this went viral because her hair was in a natural state and so, you know that's not always an odd balance for me, you know being raised. I'm not going to go to school, but I am definitely learning through my kids and through the young people that we're working with it it's much more important just to be authentically you. That is what's going to outweigh anything so it's it's a growing process, and we'll keep it moving. That's terrific insight that's great advice and can I agree with you I think the younger younger folks are doing it right I think we're really on the cusp of something great. So we are heading into into the last five minutes which I can't believe time tends to fly with these because they're so great, but Daniel and legend I'm going to ask each of you to take us out by giving us a magic wand wish. I have a magic wand for a day to change one policy or program or thing about the way Indiana runs for young folks, any young folks you pick. How do you spend that magic wand moment, what one policy, would you like to see change that you think really changes lives for any youth in Indiana but especially those who are systems involved or marginalized in some way. I'm going to take a long dramatic I'm going to take a Daniel pause, a thoughtful pause, give you a chance to chew on that. Okay, I know. Legend go for it. As far as policy in this magic wand is a heavy lifter. In Indiana, I would see a huge up and efficient public transit transportation is a huge optical for people getting out of poverty getting to school getting from jobs getting to the grocery store. I think it's, you know, make more walkable communities in the United States is so reliant on cars so if I could do that this is a heavy lifting wand I would make our communities much more walkable and more affordable or free efficient public transit. It's a good one. Daniel, how do you use your magic wand. I feel new to all of this politics and live in legislation stuff so I don't really have an opinion to give you on on that kind of thing. But I do, I would definitely wish that people would be a lot more welcoming to people as a whole. Like we have, like shut out a lot of people's stories or opinions or experiences in a way that's just really not not good for people. And I think we need to be just like more open to everybody's experiences, whether you like agree with their views or disagree with them as a whole like I believe that one thing that definitely needs to change is how we welcome the individual people that we deal with. That's a great one and I think that is kind of a policy, a piece of policy advice. Who's at the table, and how do you let them come in do you do you reschedule the hearing four times. Do you make the space welcoming and accessible. Do you make sure there are rides do you make it free, or do you require a very particular kind of archaic approach that that might shut out people who've never done it before. One of the least welcoming spaces in this country can be a city county building right you're going to pay a traffic ticket or learn something or register for something or maybe you need to go to a court hearing. Those spaces are not meant to make you walk in and feel like you are in charge of what's about to happen. And I think you make a really good point the more we're welcoming people as they are. And thinking differently about how big our tables can get we always like to say oh we don't want to get too big when we're planning a policy and then we end up leaving out a lot of folks. We do have a few minutes and so I'm not going to let Kia and Lauren off the magic wand hook. So Kia I'm going to come to you first how do you use your policy magic wand. It's a hard one. There's so many different areas. My magic wand, honestly, would be to start over. If that makes sense. Last year for us, you know, me as a mom raising three young black men and the, you know, the majority of the youth that we work with here locally in Marion County or young black men. And, you know, it was such a heavy emotional lift last year to walk them through what they were seeing in the media, just recently a couple of days ago. And, you know, my oldest son is 18 now and I'm supposed to release him into this space, you know, and I'm like how do you do that, you know, it's, it's a it's a it's a heavy lift. I'm in this space professionally and personally and it feels more and more the same thing that my parents talked about, you know, going through the civil rights era is that some of these, none of these systems are designed for everybody. And so if we start there, we need to start over. And so I think that's where my magic wand would be used. There's a wand well spent for sure. Lauren, bring us on home with your magic wand. Love this Molly because you are holding us accountable the way I try to hold myself accountable if I ask you the hard question I'm like, Oh, I have to answer that. Oh, intimidating, and you bought and you empathize and you work through it. I don't remember what I said last time which is, I wish I did because I, you know, I should probably have some consistency there. I want general annual income that has an addendum about needing to have some sort of gun regulation tied to it. We know, you know, can I both know that the number one reason people say they have guns is because everyone else does. And so I think if there's some way to both interrogate and address, you know, deep, deep wealth and income and equity, based on race in particular, to actually give folks opportunity that isn't illegal or tied to some sort of choice. That is actually out of unselfish reasons, but may cause harm or, you know, a criminal offense. I think if we can tie that in with the fact that we have way too many guns and we need to move legislation fast and strong. That would be my, my wish. I think that's a great way to bring us home because it's a message of keeping young people safe keeping each other safe, keeping black men safe in this country and these are all things that we should all commit energy to do. I want to thank you all for joining us today I want to especially thank Lauren and Kia and Daniel and legend for sharing their time and sharing their insights. Thank you for coming and let you know that if you registered for the event will push out a transcript and a recording, and we hope that you'll share the recording with people that you know, and we hope that you'll remind the people around you that as we say in this youth America series, youth belong at the policymaking table there's really no good reason to not involve them deeply in design. It doesn't have to be complicated it doesn't have to be strange and kind of foreign it just needs to be practical, and the people who practically do this are the people who are living it every day. So that is a message from New America to you. Thank you so much for joining us everyone stay safe and stay well, and we'll see you next time.