 All right, I am so happy to be here with Hiroboga. I have seen her being mentioned and featured for years now and it's so great to finally be here with you Hirob. Thank you for doing this. Oh, thank you, George. Thank you for inviting me. Yeah. Well, let me go ahead and share your background with everybody and then we'll get into the conversation. So Hiroboga is a writer, a business strategist and a master teacher of transformation and soul alchemy. And for 40 years, she's been pioneering in the field of conscious entrepreneurship, holistic and transformational, transformative business, energy alchemy and soul-inspired creativity. And she's helped thousands of clients and students in their business in terms of reclaiming the joy and their freedom and success and creative sovereignty. She is an award-winning author of several books and offers beautifully designed self-study programs for creative entrepreneurs through what's called the DEVA Alchemy Academy. So I wanna start there. The word alchemy and energy alchemy is important in what you do. And I just love for you to talk about that a bit and then I'm sure I'm gonna have some questions for you. So what does that mean energy alchemy and how does that relate to us business owners? Well, I'll start out by saying that the language that we use to talk about what can't be talked about is always a translation. So when I use the term alchemy, in some ways I use it because it is the closest approximation to what happens when people step into a field where they are bridging the whole of their human ecology from the very essence and subtle energy realms into the very down to earth and practical. And there's an ongoing process of alchemy in that. I mean, that itself is an alchemy. This alchemy of us having come out of formlessness into form, into, here you are George and there's nobody else like you in the entire universe. And that is an extraordinary thing. And yet at another level there's a place in which we are both expressions of the same sacred spark. So that's one way in which I use that term alchemy is that our very existence is all chemical. It is a transmutation from formlessness into form, from the abstract into the concrete from the universal into the very personal. And then within that, there is a whole sort of kind of energetic map, if you will, or an energetic reality in which we exist. This is not something that I've made up obviously, it's something that has been part of spiritual and mystery technologies in schools for thousands and thousands of years. But there isn't a kind of practical set of skills that you can work with, that you can learn and you can practice that allow you to move through to navigate this whole ecology and all its different parts which all function differently. They function together but they have different laws. The laws of physics apply on this planet and we're subject to gravity and time and space. And at the same time we have access through that universal aspect of our being to aspects of the universe that function according to completely different laws. And so when we know how to navigate where to apply what skill sets, where to, how to live in each of these realities that intersect within us, we have the ability to do so much more than we are able to do with our kind of limited sense of self, right? Yeah, I love that reminder and that teaching. Yes, yes, it's beautiful. And I love that you weave it together both the soul, the evolution of it. So that's actually one of the things that you talk about is that there is this soul in our business. And I find that very interesting and that it evolves and you kind of have a relationship with it and that's part of the work that you do with clients and students is helping them relate to that, the soul of their business. So talk about that, because that's not, you know, most business teachings don't mention that at all. And yeah, so what's your perspective on that? Well, so much of business the way that it's done at least in the West, I'm from India, I grew up, I was born and raised there. So I have a different cultural perspective perhaps, but so much of business here asks that you leave your soul at the door, that you leave it outside of the reality of your business. So it's not just the soul of business that's not spoken about its soul in general that isn't part of the conversation, mostly in business. And yet every creation that serves a purpose beyond itself has a soul and your business is no different. It has its own soul. Once you understand that, you have a partner in your business that knows what its life's trajectory is all about. It knows what its purpose is. And as in any partnership, you know, you come to it with your vision of what you want to accomplish in the world through your business, but that vision cannot override the purpose that the deva or the soul of your business has for its own life, because it is a sovereign being and you are in a sovereign relationship with it. So it's much like if you have children, you know this, you know, they come, I mean, we women carry them in our bodies for nine months and they literally come out of our bodies, but they are their own beings. They have their own life. They have their own purpose right from the get-go. And our job is to partner with them for as long as they're in our care to help them establish themselves in this world and to be themselves so fully that they can then take on the task of being human. And it's the same with our businesses. We do the same thing with them. You know, when you understand that your business has its own soul, you don't have to question everything all the time. You're not just relying on your own discernment, on your own wisdom, on your own understanding. You have a partner. And within that partnership, you have different functions because the soul of your business doesn't actually have an incarnate beingness. It doesn't have a body until you give it one. So the diva of your business cannot act in the physical world, only you can, which means that you are as essential to that partnership as the diva of your business is. A lot of times people kind of get into this, oh, wow, my business has a soul. Now I'm just gonna ask it to tell me everything and I will just do exactly what it says. But it doesn't work that way because it's a non-physical being. It does not understand human limitations. It doesn't understand that no, you can't, you know, because it's got this amazing vision for its life that that vision still has to unfold within the laws of time and spaces they operate on this planet and within the limits of your energy and your capacity and you know, and so it's like any partnership, it's like any relationship. More deeply that you get to know each other, the more love there is between you, the more each of you is able to function in a way that you couldn't do by yourself. What you create together through the synergy of that relationship, the business that you create has, I loathe the word impact, but at the moment that's the, you know, it has repercussions in the larger world in ways that I do not by myself, you know, I mean, I'm a 72 year old woman born in India, living in Canada's and, you know, all of my adult life. And here I am talking to you, you're in another country, we are on this technology that is absolutely remarkable. And just as this technology allows us to communicate with each other, there is a spiritual technology that lets us communicate with the souls of our businesses. And through that partnership, our businesses can affect transformation, can have an all chemical effect on much larger world systems than we are able to do by ourselves. So it is a really profound, it's a profound relationship, it's a profound co-creative partnership and it, for me at least it's been, you know, I mean, I have two children, two young men, they're not children anymore, who I would give my life for. And yet this relationship with my business theme is the longest relationship of my life now that my parents are gone, you know? And I know it and it knows me better and it knows me better than anybody else in this world. So that's the potential there if you choose to go there. Yeah. And maybe you can give us a little taste of, what is it that you do to connect to that soul or data of your business? Is there like a particular practice that you do regularly or? There are a number of practices that I do. I think in some ways my entire day and how I live my life is ceremonial in that way, not, you know, it's not, I don't burn incense and light candles, I don't do any of that, but I have a real sense of myself and my soul and we all do, I mean, we all have this inner knowing that this is the core of who we are. You know, that beyond all the noise and all the obscurations that there is a pure essence that is the essence of who we are. And if the practice is really to keep returning to that and to have a daily practice of kind of cleansing and clearing what obscures that. And then from that place, you can connect with any being, whether it's the day of your business or, you know, in preparing for our session today, I attuned to the day of your business and to your soul and it brought me to tears, you know, just the depth of love and service that is in the field of your business and in the field of your presence. Yeah, so if you want me to, I can lead you through a very short sort of couple of minutes of just attuning, you know, I use that word attunement and it doesn't mean merging with anything, it simply means entering a field in which there is resonance between whatever you're attuning to and yourself. Oh, if it's, yeah, if it feels appropriate to you, I would love to, and I'm sure those who are watching and listening would enjoy it too. Okay, well, let's do this then. So I'm just, take a moment and just close your eyes and drop your gaze down into the cavity of your body, let your presence settle into the back of your heart, just the most receptive space in your body and let go of everything that you are thinking and feeling, just put it in a big belly jar in the corner of your room and put a lid on it, it'll still be there when we're finished with this and just let yourself experience your own interiority, your own soul's presence, which is the presence of love. And from this place, think of someone or something that you love unconditionally, it may be a person or a place or your business even and let that love flow throughout your body and out into the energy field around you and let it flow towards the soul of your business. Invite the deva of your business to come and meet you just outside the boundary of the energy field, which is about arms with all around you and just let your love flow towards it and let yourself experience its presence. The way that you experience the presence of somebody you may never have met before and yet you know things about them because their presence speaks for them and speaks of them. Remember, this is a non-physical being, it's not male or female. So don't project your own ideas about what it is or who it is, just let yourself experience it right now and feel the love that it holds for you, flowing back to you, from it to you and then feel the power and the resonance of the field between you, which is formed of the relationship between you. And from here, you can simply explore this relationship as much as you wish. You can bring to it whatever is in your heart, whether it's about your business or not about your business because its commitment is to you as well as to its own life. So the next time you find yourself needing to make a decision about your business, something that feels complex and difficult, step into this place in yourself first and then into this place in your relationship with your data of your business and see what happens. You know, you learn how it communicates with you because it will communicate in whatever way you can hear. So for me, it's like a whole body experience for somebody else, it might be through words or through images or through sense or sounds or memory or, you know, but it's a relationship. So you get to know it and you get to know how it communicates and you can ask it, you know, if something's not clear, you can say, hey, I don't really understand what you're trying to tell me. Can you tell me another way? Can you show me this way, you know? That is beautiful, yeah. Well, you just opened a world of possibility for those who are watching this and listening and yeah, so much of business training has been about the sort of like do this, do that, you know, click this, click there, right this, right that. And I love that you are bringing this much deeper perception and like you said, relationship and partnership that if that perception and that partnership is there, you know, that's where the deep work really is. Yeah, and that's where the value, yeah. It is really practical, you know, if you think about it, you know, rather than kind of, I mean, I had a conversation today with one of my staff members and, you know, there are all these books about how to have difficult conversations. Well, to me, it wasn't difficult at all, although it could have been because it came from this field of love and trust and honoring and respect and nothing is really difficult from that place, you know? So each thing that you do in your business, you have to decide, okay, am I going to partner with this person or that person? Just tune in, the answer is right there, you know? Yes. It's like once you know what you value, once you know who you are, and once you know what the diva of your business values and what it is and what its vision for its life is, those things become really straightforward. And you have this beautifully created playbook, you call it, that gives the prompts and exercises to develop this relationship with your business. And it's called the world of your business playbook. So tell us a bit about this. I'm gonna, of course, link to it below and that people can, yeah, there's different places, people can get it, but tell us about kind of the vision behind this. So I created this, gosh, I can't remember when, it was at least 10 years ago, and then published it in kind of book form because people wanted an actual physical book that they could have a few years ago. And in essence, it kind of walks you through every aspect of your business, those questions that we really should be asking ourselves at the start before we start building this world that is our business. But most of us don't, most of us kind of stumble into business or we come in through a doorway of ambition or a doorway of necessity or, you know, we come to business from different entry points. But ultimately, these are the questions that we need to ask, like what is my business's purpose, why is it here? What are its values? What are the spiritual qualities of this? Qualities of soul that infuse the world of my business and how do they show up in the practical day-to-day aspects of my business? What is the lineage of my business? Where does it come from? You know, what is the lineage of my craft and what is the lineage of my business? Both part of this world that you're building, who are the citizens of the world of my business? Who are the people who come and who belong there and stay there? Who are the visitors, the ones who come and kind of check it out and then leave again because it's not right for them? You know, what are the pathways through which you welcome them and what is the journey that they experience when they come into the world of your business? How are they changed by that journey? And then it goes into really practical things. How much money do you need to make to keep this world thriving and alive and vibrant and evolving? You know, what kinds of boundaries do you need to create in order to protect what is tender and nascent and emerging as all things are always tender and nascent and emerging at every level, right? So, yeah, this is, you know, my gift from my heart to my world to start to think about your business as a living ecosystem and a living entity that you are helping to build and helping to establish and helping to nurture and nourish so it can nurture and nourish the world around you. Well, I mean, it's brilliant actually because I hear in some of these things you're taking some really important questions that do need to be answered and you're bringing an artistry to it and a soul connection to it that may help those who are more visionary and creative to actually engage with those needed questions. And so it's wonderful. I look forward to checking it out myself, of course, and the link is below. And of course I'll have the links to your website and elsewhere. Do you have a kind of a send-off for us as we complete this conversation to those who are watching? I just, I wish you the blessing of knowing that every moment of your life is a miracle and that your very beingness is a miracle and that you don't need to try so hard. You don't need to listen to all the people who are watching. You don't need to try so hard. You don't need to listen to all the voices that tell you how you should be doing things and what you should be doing and who you should be. And you can really trust yourself. You can trust your soul. You can trust the soul of your business. And may you go forth and prosper. Thank you. Thank you. That was wonderful. Thank you for the very deep and nourishing work that you do and your community is lucky to have you. So folks who are watching, take a look at the business, the world of your business playbook. The link is below and check out here as website as well. Thank you so much, Hiro. Thank you, George. Bye.