 Okay, we are live. Okay. Thank you, Alec. So, uh, well, I think I'm gonna start screen-sharing Play the way and Hope you can see my screen Yeah, it was muted. I can see the screen. Yeah, perfect. Thank you. So, um, yeah, I already put some some template for the Minutes of anything today a For now, it's And the agenda is pretty straightforward We should follow up what we were talking about the last meeting and I actually I would like to go two meetings back because there was some action points on me and then let's check the status a Maybe talk a little about the release candidate that we're planning to release in the middle of July it didn't happen. We had our reasons and Any new business there are some issues or pull requests that that were created lately Anything else you would like to add to the agenda Oleg? Nothing. Okay. Very good. Thank you So regarding the follow-up as I said, I would like to move back to the not the last meeting But the previous one and there were some action points on me I would like to briefly go through those when it comes to light notifier I I only made it work with Jenkins configuration as code. I did not touch the JEP 200 compatibility yet I don't think my my PR was merged But I got in touch with the the maintainer maintainer So I don't think we need to take over the plugin I will there is no rush when it comes to light notifier. It was just something I wanted to do But I will continue with that And when it comes to closing issues that can be closed Well partially done, but new issues are appearing and this is also ongoing documentation improvements There are some PRs pull requests both on Jenkins.io and on jkask Repository and so this is happening Also today when I was going through my action points I realized that I promised to mention this document we're looking at right now and the link To the document in jkask Read me and there is a pull request for that that you already approved I think I will like wait a couple of hours or As to object but also last time I checked that there was some Checks running being run So and then where there were two action points on you and one I can see you commented that it's It's done and what about the local plugin patches anything you want to you want to Say about that one. Yeah, so regarding local patches. I did a major first lift of the plugin So now the patches can be applied, but I haven't done yet, but yeah It's not about adding support. It's trivial. It's about adding or test automation And before doing test automation. Yeah, we'd rather prefer one that Sorry release candidates to be released. Mm-hmm. Okay Well, this is not loading so I think well, but there's not that much insight anyway Okay, so I'm gonna like take it slow and make notes already Okay Yeah so Regarding my action items Firstly, I finished the jcask compatibility dashboard. It's not something brilliant there, but It should be good for now Regarding the wiki page in the current state. It's not really valuable, but it's also published Maybe firstly need to understand how we are going to maintain these pages Because yeah, there are two options one is a gap to 100 maintenance mode when for every issue We add some description clarify how to work around it if needed It's much more useful from user perspective, but it causes a significant maintenance overhead And another way is like I did now just link Jenkins g-ray filter Okay, but then can you can you quickly explain because so the okay page about yeah Let's could you please open the current wiki page or just second? I'll put the links to the document Yes, sorry, I cannot screen share today that that's okay Okay, okay, so this is I got lost in tops Okay, so yeah, this is dashboard And yeah, and this is wiki page So wiki page As you may see it's pretty empty So yeah, something else we could do is Plug-ins affected by job 200 So yeah, you can just compare how they look like okay, so let's start with the JIRA Okay, nice start It works for me Well, just a second most likely you don't have permission to see the JIRA filter I'm checking it right now. Thanks. Yeah, it's all it's always a problem Jcast compatibility issues Yeah, it's a filter thing again, please try again. Okay Yeah, so it looks like something like that so we have component we have some summary we have released as field and the current resolution status Yes, so label jacos compatibility to get on the dashboard And if needed I can add some filtering so for example unresolved issues will go to the top or so But yeah it's Still complicated because even now you may see that there are some Strange things for example configuration as code Component added to EC2 plug-in So yeah, it impacts user experience and moreover It's not exactly clear what to do with that and it's automatically generated if you open the job 200 compatibility So yeah, if you scroll down Yeah, it's a bit different Mm-hmm So, yeah, no full issue. There is a description. There is some work around Available, but yeah, the problem with that everything you have to manage on your own Yeah, so yeah, if you have some spare time to do that, it's cool But yeah, just 200 maintenance is quite time-consuming. I'd say yeah So I'm actually quite happy with it I mean if you're interested in the specific issue you just go to the issue and there you find the more information Yeah, right I'm very happy with this dashboard. So, okay, I will polish it a bit. I'll add some description text, etc Unfortunately, we don't have so many Jira plugins installed But yeah, I can improve a looker and feel a bit But if you agree that this page is generally enough how it looks like Yeah, I'll stick to that Yeah So the wiki page is just like a like a Yeah, wiki page is just a redirect to this page So technically you can take the entire content of the wiki page and put it to the plugins read me instead And then we do move for this wiki page Okay, and then there is a there's in a Jenkins configuration as code. There is a PR Is it already is it already approved because there was an issue our PR where I was supposed to Put the link in the documentation. Oh, maybe it's an issue so I can proceed with Yeah, that one so you said Anyway, you're happy with the with the With the page right now and I can I can I can continue with this issue. Yeah, right. We're good so technically we cannot Adjust it to documentation and that's it Okay, so regarding the rest of the fixes on the weekend this or previous weekend I proposed Detaching a configurator API to a plugin and he's a moment of frustration for me Because I thought we agreed that it's something we are going to do Yeah, the meat, but yeah, then Nicola comes and says so that it's not needed So yeah, they effectively I'm not Very happy about that and I think that Nicola should really start participating in these meetings. Otherwise we get miss connects So the command would be How do we say it Well Is that correct or not really? I'm not sure we we're discussing that we are doing that Okay, but yeah, then Nicola comes and says that he doesn't think it's needed then He takes a bit of my pull request for configuration context Which is really important because configuration context. I think should have been merged Before release candidate But yeah, the problem of that If I want to recover this pull request now, I will have to spend a lot of time Okay again and I think that Should have done a betty some cup or whatever So would it make sense to organize a Detaching configurator API plug in a dedicated meeting Without waiting two weeks for another office hours Yeah, we could to do that preferably next week anyway, okay, so I will try to organize a meeting Yeah, so I will be Available to rework it if we decide that we wanted But the I wouldn't will not be making any such changes Until we have discussion because it's not a good experience for me. Okay, so let's let's let's try to meet three of us at least of course someone else can join and will Probably make them Regarding the meeting in Gitter channel, but I will try to organize a find a time that works for all of us and Okay Anything else Not for me, okay, but we have another person on the call. Oh Do we? Oh, hey, yeah Hey, hey, I'm Mostly just here to listen Okay Welcome The other otherwise I'm listening to it afterwards on the recording anyway So I might as well join life when I since I but it's it's nice you join So you are you are doing a lot of tests lately. So like if you want to We see So actually, yeah, there's status sync up. I just wanted to go through the What basically status sync up and release candidate could be one point in the agenda And we are postponing a release candidate for some time and I don't think it's the end of the world but it would be nice to to have it at some point and We can also postpone the actual release a little but not more than in two weeks So coming back for a moment to this detaching Configure a configurator API plug-in discussion that we need Oleg do you think that we have to figure that out before release candidates again? I know no we can do it later. So Yeah, this change will remain binary compatible It may cause some issues with the docker packaging You will need to do it carefully, but yeah, it's not a Managing for the release candidate. Okay So, let's go through the release candidate open issues And the NHPA run fails to load One of the issues I described how to work around It's a major problem for us because you cannot use beta annotations for extension points If I understand correctly, Nikola has reverted my patches. So you may see the last commit So technically it shouldn't be a problem currently in the master branch But I should we then Yeah, it conflicts with two seven eight It's a problem So because Nikola Moved a better notation. So it means that now everything is public mm-hmm, I Think that we still can leave with that if because we will still have a release candidate in the label mm-hmm, but yeah regarding this thing Yeah, I think that Now this task can be closed annotated only PS and Nikola has a river some blocking changes So it can be just closed The Three to two No two seven eight Regarding three to two, it's a rather question to Nikola. Okay, so I do not use a maybe an HP run in my development So, yeah, I haven't tested it after Nick patches by Nikola Okay, but anyway Two seven eight can be closed. So I want to like go through the through the issue anyway After the meeting and then I will close. Okay, and then this one we Keep but it's mm-hmm There we have actually two Mask heads only In 77 I asked for boost feedback mm-hmm, so technically it needs Yeah, yeah, documenter dry mode that's yes, and I think it's not enough because Yeah We still need to invoke Dry run mode before we invoke the current common mode. Otherwise this ticket isn't fixed Okay, so I mean we have to but it's not being used It's maybe a few code line patch Think what if somebody needs to do that this is set a documentation Okay So, yeah, I Will try to have a look at that. Maybe maybe I can I can I can implement it but That's that that's something that is that couple of lines of code maybe so it is possible to finalize that one relatively so Yeah, right. So it's another question. Who does that? Yeah, I I'll see I'll check if I can so Okay and Was it and then we have several configurators outside of Jenkins elements. This is like super old They have no idea what's needed to be done there and I have no idea why it's needed at all So I think there was the mini GUI requirement. We are Promoting the plugin with mentioning that it's it's making UI. That's why we wanted to have, you know, the root configurators kind of Relative to what we have under mana Jenkins page Okay, since Nicola is mentioning some some Changes in Jenkins core I don't think This is something we can easily fix and then maybe you can you can you can Explain explain it to me. Oh, like so we now have some root elements. We have configurations code We have Jenkins. We have we have plugins. We have a number of unclassified One contains a lot of different configurators So we have it like that and then we release the official version Can we then change it or will it be a compatibility issue? So you can change it because the current design of jkask YAML Supports version what you will need to do is To Create a new version of format Somehow make jkask plug-in to support both then you can change the format without compatibility issues Okay, so I would say I'd like to remove that one from this candidate milestone and just follow up because it seems like we're Mm-hmm What he says Like Nicola says something something if you want to follow this direction So it's it seems to me that yeah, I had I had my reasons for creating the issue But I'm open to the discussion and I don't want to like rush Regarding that one especially now if you say that it won't be the end of the world to change it So yeah, so it will be still a serious effort to change that Yeah, it can be done Okay So if we want to have this release Candidate I I I want to remove it unless anyone unless you're in strongly objects Okay, I can't hear you objecting. So it's done. I just Know objections here Very good. So where does that leave us that leaves us with some Documentation that needs to be basically approved and I hope we can we can do that soon with the Jenkins.io So we need documentation we need 77 And yeah, that's actually it 77 that's the one that I said I was looking to write Pull requests and Jacob so my my Poor request is Has passed all checks Okay I'm taking a look right now. I've commented something if I recall correctly, but Yeah, oh, there's this empty line and then I can I can I can remove that empty line But then how do we can we anyway we can speed it up or? I don't mind if we keep an empty line Actually passes Not a big deal for me. Okay. So you added this work in progress label and I Need to remove the labels. Yeah. Yeah, I can't do it Right. I have permissions So we have Jenkins configuration code Have you already put the jcask logger to the repository? Yes, yeah, I'm just a bit surprised that it's on the root level What? Yeah, so if you take a look It's located in a slash images slash jcask logo. Yeah, it's a content images jcask logo I think I I put it the same place. I found Jenkins X logo Or yeah, it's quite surprising to me, but okay, I can move it, but the just needs Yeah, the problem that oh, yeah Yeah Yeah, we'd rather create a separate directory for jcask and keep all the stuff there Okay. Yeah, it's rather minor thing so that you get your own folder where you can do whatever you need So like like blue ocean has image folder under projects where the rest of the file is I have jcask with In your opinion I would rather create something like slash images slash projects slash jcask And put it there So we have images. Yeah, right Go here projects and jcask Cool. That's so let's let's not remove the label now. I will Yeah, right, which accordingly and I will let you know we'll see everything classes and then yeah, right Regarding the rest once this image is fixed. I'm ready to integrate that Everything seems to be fine. So your approach is that you don't create a special interest group for it Not for now, let's Start with was it cloud native? Yeah, and If it works out or if it's taking too much time and we need to separate Let's see So so far configuration scope is not announced as a Part of the cloud native 6 scope Let me just make a note. Yeah, right So I'm not against doing it as a part of cloud native 6, but yeah, maybe it needs to be discussed in the code native 6. Yeah So we have already some Meeting time slot selected for that one or should we use a mailing list? Okay. Yeah, so we have these regular meetings. We can just Add them to cloud native C umbrella. If you want Yeah, would it be possible for you to start the Discussion about J cask part of this cloud native seek and maybe during the discussion will before even joining will figure out that it's better to have a separate Okay, I can do it Thanks Yeah Yeah, very good Okay, I would say you will use candidates Possible next week Yeah, I think that With the current scope if you do 77 over the fence we can do it at any moment Okay, yeah, next week is fine. Very good. And I will update The deadline for that one Are we gonna get a new alpha before then or I? Think so there were some There was a number of inquiries who fixes and it's about two weeks since the last one. So Yeah, so one major fix is about configurator context because it Completely breaks compatibility with all possible external implementations So we need to get it alpha released So then then I just want to make sure that everything works And then then I'm good. I can release basically So it will happen this week then I'm right now on the latest incremental the 383 And I'm having various problems right now. It's I can't get it to read my job Descriptions so But I don't know if that's a weird artifact of that one version Not yeah, I'm trying to debug it right now now. I found the found the issue that John bro hug had Mentioned where I can see that there is actually a new syntax for for the jobs that you have to Put script colon and in the YAML So I just tried to change that and as far as I can see it is still failing so Okay Yeah So I like yeah before I Not I don't know something but I will I will reach out to you regarding You had now if you already have them then Yeah, right so that's Let's see how it goes and then there are some new issues and And this is something that I was thinking about trying for some time and I'm fine and on the time for that Do I either using Jcast with MVN HPA run and it was just you know using the environment variable Very nicely or I was using Docker and it was also another case but yesterday. I just installed clean Jenkins On my machine locally and I just can't find a way to feed it with the location of the ammo Yeah, right. You still have to set the environment variable. Otherwise. It doesn't work So but but but there is like a default one and that's it doesn't work Doesn't work. So yeah, I thought that it's designed behavior, but maybe I'm wrong At least on my installation. It also doesn't discover yamls until I said I'm explicitly Okay, so So we have this default Jenkins yaml pattern. It doesn't work. It should discover the Jenkins yaml in Jenkins home and Yes, you can check the logic. I think that it's rather about a Jenkins home location Okay They don't recall. Yeah, I just hit this issue set the environment variable and moved on So probably I should have reported it Okay, but so I'm trying to to like recreate the use case that Beginner Jenkins user would have So let's say it's it's a windows or I have my mark so I just clicked and And it installed Jenkins and it started and then well, I I thought I said the environment variable, but kinds of like not getting it So having that that's the other problem I had so either it should work from Jenkins home It doesn't and then how to make it make the environment variable Okay, available for this Jenkins. I think somebody needs to take a look. Yeah. Okay, but it means I am not missing anything obvious It's There is still a probability that it's something like yaml versus humor But yeah, okay Maybe this issue is still there So I don't consider it as a candidate stopper because it's just it won't be any like a big change We'll just add the feature. It would be of course nice to have it and I will Find a way to solve it But if not, I I would still like Before the actual release Postpone Okay This is basically all I had Oleg is there anything you would like to Talk about during this meeting now. Nothing specific So yeah, I guess everything is fine for now just need to get it over the fence and plus one to what Jan said We need New alpha release I Have a quick question now that I have you on the line Because I'm just testing some stuff and seeing a bit of a weird behavior. Maybe you can just tell me that it's us to being stupid We recently Split up our Jenkins YAML into multiple files. So we took all the The jobs job diesel parts and put those into separate files in a subfolder And that Seems to work fine and it reads all of all of recursively all the stuff in the subfolders as well But now that I'm trying to debug why it's can't understand my job diesel with the newest incremental builds I Went into it's failing in when it starts up Jenkins. It just comes with a Illegal argument exception with the script source implementation not found or something And then and then I edited the Job files and it's still complained and I deleted the job file that is complaining about it It still complains about it and I deleted all of the job files that is still complaining. So is it caching something or? You have any idea of what's going on I'm running it in in Kubernetes is Ah Maybe that's what's getting me. It might be it might be a mounting issue from what is mounted into I'm adding it on the virtual machine where I have the files not into it might just be the darker Image that is confusing me I'll get Bell. I'll I'll dig into it a little bit and then I'll if I still can't figure it out I'll report it. So I just wanted to I Probably end up like we're moving the volume Sometimes I'll try to I'll try to Execute into the container and see how attack what's actually in there before I That's like a good idea Okay, well, that's that's all for me then I look forward to the alpha Sure, you know moment It's available. You'll know about it. So it seems that we're like No one else has anything to add so we can Maybe one question I raised is about packaging so you're currently Your configuration as code plugin has pretty strange your group ID So I mean that it uses IO Jenkins configuration as code But yeah, there is no plugins or whatever in group ID So I find it a bit confusing Yeah, and then there is Nikola comments that he wants to consider it as a top-level project not just yet another plugin well that when you have Something else Adjudged to this group ID. It may become a bit confusing because you have configuration is called group ID and configuration is called artifact ID So it means that Yeah, if you add something else Then yeah, it's just complicated. So I would rather suggest Doing the plug-in somewhere in the group ID, okay, I I must admit How does group ID works but I mean I understand that It's not may we may want it to not be just yet another plug-in, but it is a plug-in after all so I Object against them, you know having plug-ins somewhere in their group ID But we can yeah, I will I will put a comment in the in the issue Yeah, right. So I just need more votes because yeah, I understand from when Nikola comes I Don't really agree with it But I didn't have a chance to discuss it with Nikola so far. Okay, I will I will Put my comments there and I mean this sound seems like a Pretty pretty simple thing. So we should be able to discuss it in yes, so it wouldn't be even a breaking change Okay So it's something that we can We don't have to solve Before the release, I mean on the other side it seems like a pretty pretty So yeah, I will I will In the issue and hopefully it will be enough to have a discussion there and we'll figure it out But I yeah, I understand it's not just yet another plug-in hopefully but Can't see a reason why we Want to plug in plug-ins there it is a plug-in after all Okay, and anything else But I think nothing for me, okay So Thank you all for joining and those of you who listens now or will listen later thank you also for all meant and Have a nice rest of the week. We're melting here in Copenhagen And talk to you in two weeks I went to Russia because I thought he's going to be called there And now it's 20 degrees Well, I'm going to Stockholm tomorrow, and it's supposed to be 32 so Okay, enjoy I can stop sharing now and I guess we can stop Streaming Okay