 Welcome to the ITU studio in Geneva. We're very pleased to be joining the studio today by Stephen Burrow who is the CEO of the Utilities Regulation and Competition Authority for the Harbors. Stephen, welcome to the studio. Hi, thanks Max. It's good to be here. Now we're here at Council 2019 in Geneva, but you've also been chairing the Lead Group, Lead Drafting Group, I should say, to define the theme for another event, the World Telecommunications and Policy Forum, WTPF happening in 2021. Can you tell us, let's talk a little bit about this process. Yeah, so at the last PlanetPotentiary conference in Dubai in 2018, one of the decisions of the PlanetPot was that we should have another World Telecommunications Policy Forum. The last was held in 2013 and it was felt that it's time for the world to get together again, to discuss policy approaches, particularly in light of all the new technologies that are around, and to give an opportunity for that kind of policy discourse, which is not a decision-making policy forum, but it's one where we can come together and have opinions on ideas for how we move forward. And has it been an easy process in terms of looking at, because I would say the next one is 2021. There's quite a distance in terms of time between the two events there. So has policy changed? Is it having new challenges? It's definitely having new challenges and the process to decide, so at this council, we're deciding, one of the things we've been directed to decide by the PP is on the theme and the process for preparation. A unique thing about the World Telecommunications Policy Forum is it is defined very, very narrowly really around a theme and around particular questions, all of which have to be included in a report from the Secretary General into the conference, so that the whole discussion has enough focus for it to be useful. So as part of my task as the chair of the working group was to help us to reach consensus here at council around a theme. And it's an iterative process. It's one that you start, you don't always know how it's going to end until you get into it and see what the room, how people feel about the theme. But we were quite pleased to be able to reach a theme that everyone is comfortable with. Are you allowed to say what it is yet? I think I am, yes. Well, I can't remember the whole theme, but effectively it's a discussion World Telecommunications Policy Forum 2021. We'll discuss new and emerging digital technologies and how they fit into our policy landscape moving forward. And there's a little bit of focus on some of the key technologies that we'll be seeing coming out of our deliberations or that we have been seeing coming out of deliberations over the past few years. So you're also using a bit of a crystal ball then in which case to look into the future and say what the technologies will be in 2021 as well? Absolutely. And that was a key part of the discussion, you know, this question of trying to say, you know, we mentioned things like AI, Big Data, 5G, Internet of Things. But will these still be a big deal in 2021 is a very good question. And it's one, obviously as we go through the two-year preparation process, which should be an interesting one to see everyone grapple with. Did you attend in 2013? No, I didn't. Okay. So what do you think will make WTPF different? Well, I think, as I mentioned, one of the things about WTPF that is different from many other things, while it's limited by the mandate of the ITU or rather it's bound by the mandate as with everything else we do, it is a discussion forum. It's a policy forum and it does not produce outcome, prescriptive outcomes. So unlike many other conferences, you go in knowing that nobody's going to try to make a new regulation or anything. So it allows for a very open discussion between all of the stakeholders that are part of it, some member states, sector members, and academia observers. And then the process to prepare for it also allows for a lot of open discussion. And it's hoped really that that's what WTPF will be able to bring to the overall ITU discourse. Fantastic. Based on your experience at PP18 as a committee chair, how has Council been different? Well, the PP process is obviously bigger, much bigger. There's a lot more time and a lot more issues that have to be addressed by a lot more people. So you don't get into as much detail. You don't really have the time to get into the nitty-gritty, especially as a committee chair, because for example if any discussion at PP, at a committee, was to try to go into as much detail, it would be sent to an ad hoc group so that someone else can go into that detail. So one of the things about certainly chairing at PP was this, you know, you had many, many issues that had to be addressed and you really had to be very much in control of how the floor, how the floor went, how much time was given to any particular issue. At Council, it's less people. There are 48 Council members, so it's less people. It's a smaller group. And then when you get into the working group or the drafting groups, it's an even smaller group still. And I think they all have a closer working relationship because many people, although this is my first Council, many of the members of Council have been here before and we know what we're getting into. So it makes for a very engaged discussion, which you can't always have or couldn't always have as a chair of a PP committee. I was going to say, what will be the overriding feeling that you'll be taking back home with you after this? Well, I think it's my first Council experience as a member of the Council. So I think I go back with a lot of new information, a much better feel for how Council works and sort of looking forward really to coming back next year and coming back over the working groups and the other sessions to make some more impact. Well, you've certainly made a great impact here. Thank you very much for joining us in this studio and we look forward to catching up with you again next year. Absolutely. If not before then. Yep, I'm sure. Okay, thanks. Thank you. Cheers.