 Put your thumb up when we should start area. Hi, my name is media Benjamin I'm with code pink, and I'm very happy to be joined today in this webinar by a dear friend Iranian American who grew up in Iran has been working as a peace activist she is a scholar. She's taken dozens of delegations of Americans to Iran, particularly people in the faith based community. She has organized delegations for code pink to go to Iran. And she is also a member of the code pink advisory board that has been working with us for a long time to try to figure out how we can improve us relations with Iran. So I'm delighted to be on with you Leila thank you for taking the time on a Sunday to be with us. Thank you very much for having me. It's my honor and pleasure. Certainly we're in very difficult times. It seemed like last week that World War three was going to be starting. I know you were very upset and, of course, everybody in Iran was upset and all of our friends here in the US, thinking that we were just about on the brink of an all out war. And I don't like to say we were on the brink of war because we've been at war with Iran. Now for almost two years since the Trump administration pulled out of the nuclear deal and impose these brutal brutal sanctions and we'll talk more about. We thought that the shooting war was really happening and Iran responded to the killing of Soleimani with quite a brilliant restraint by a hitting the US bases while they're Iraqi bases but where US soldiers are in Iraq. But really making sure that they didn't hit Americans, and fortunately no lives of Iraq use were taken either. It was to prove that Iranians had the ability to reach those bases without going through their allies. And it was also to show they didn't want to move into this all out war. And I know that you grew up, Leila, during the time of the Iran Iraq war so you could you tell us a little bit why this memory that people have, how it affects people's views on where we stand today. Yes, that is actually, I was eight years old when the war broke out and I was 16 when it's ended. So I remember. 80 to 88. Yes. And so I vividly remember the going to the shelters losing my friends and losing friends, families, and also waiting in the shelter for a bomb drop to hear it and say oh thanks God tonight was not our, you know, turn probably next day. I remember when going to school the school windows was shattered everywhere. And these are the time that, of course, the rest of the world gave Saddam Hussein all kinds of weapons including chemical weapons and I'm talking about Tehran, the capital which was not really engaged in a war to the last days. People who lived in the borders from the moment that the Iraqi army got the green light from the United States that they can invade Iran, they were involved in the brutal war in a real war, and it was not only bomb or missiles, it was also a one to one fight. So for first 40 days, which Iranians remember it as a 40 days of resistance and still the army was not because it was as you remember it was immediately after the revolution so the army was not really ready to go to the border. Nobody knows what is going on, the new government didn't know that and then the Iraqi when they invaded Iran, the Iranians took their utensils, they took their asses and shovels, they took, you know, whatever they could find in order to go and fight with the enemy. And this is very important to remember that then the Iran's population was 36 million and still there is a sign in the border city Khurram Shah that they said the population of Khurram Shah is 36 million because everybody before the army and the Artej could just grab himself and go to the border, everybody took something and started to fight because it was the attack on our home on motherland. I know in America people say fatherland but over there because mother is very precious, so it was the motherland that it was under attack. And actually last time I was in Iran almost two years ago, for a project I interviewed many women who were active in the border and at that time they were either, you know, 15, 16 years old and they tell me that our parents were worried for us because you remember what happened to Yazidis in Iraq and a lot of rape, a lot of, you know, like the slavery of women, so their parents were very worried for them but they said one of them told me, I asked, I told my mother, mom, either, you know, you are going to lose me or you are going to lose Iran, which one you are going to choose and my mother said I prefer to lose you, stay here and fight for, you know, our homeland. And so this memories that I have, part of that is a memory and the other part is through hearing other stories. I think it's a very important for everyone, specifically for the government or for the White House, for the President Trump, for everyone to remember that Iranians are very, I don't know, sometimes the word nationalism has a, you know, a different meaning or a negative meaning, but I want to say they really respect their motherland, they really respect their home. And probably that is coming from a very ancient culture that they, you know, like Zoroastrian culture that there are a lot of respect for the land and for what we are coming from. And so I don't want to just, you know, stutter my talk but I want to say it is very important to remember that whatever happened, no matter what is going on among people in Iran or between them animosity, hostilities, whatever exists, when there is a foreign threat, when there is a threat of an enemy from outside, people get together and they stand hand in hand to defend their identity, their home, and their being, basically, and I think it is possible that a lot of places are like this, but there are some policies in the Middle East in the past decade or so, or maybe more, that people are thinking because Middle East was created, you know, in the later years after the World War One. So there is not some specific nationalism among Middle Eastern people like what happened in Iraq or in Syria, like people say, I'm Sunni, they are Shia, the other one is court. The story of Iran I think is a little different because Iran has been a nation state for millennium, and we live together next to one another without caring about, you know, each other's religion or political interest or whatever can divide people. And that takes me to say today Iran also is a very diverse country, you know, we had demonstrations two months ago against the government for the political and economic reasons, we had demonstrations last year, we had uprising 10 years ago, and I can say people in Iran are not happy, definitely, because of the economy condition, because of the political condition, because part of that is because of the government, other parts is because of the foreign involvement and sanctions and threat of war, all of them, so made people of Iran to be very unhappy, and they show it, they are not fearful of showing it. And these are all domestic issues. And we are like a family that we feel that we are, you know, we are okay to just hold each other accountable or yell at one another, but as soon as another person from a different background or from a foreign background, I would like to use mostly the word foreign, because the foreigner means foreign to our culture, foreign to our, you know, identity, foreign to collective understanding of Iranians of what Iran and Iranians are. And specifically with the respect that we have to be history or history and culture. So it makes people to be united and to be together. I was talking to my brother yesterday, and he said a friend of mine came and said, Oh, thanks God you don't have immediate family in Iran do you don't have immediate family. And my brother said I looked at him and I said I have 80 million immediate family who are living there. So, I guess this is a perspective of most of us. I wish I could send, you know, because President Trump apparently can speak Farsi these days. So I could send the Farsi letter to him and say, Hey, you know, you are involved and you are just encouraging people to continue their demonstration which also I encourage because those government should be accountable. But don't be happy that if they are demonstrating against the government that means they are, you know, getting ready for you with the sweets and flowers like what President Bush thought about Well, thank you for all that. I think you said something that I just wanted to go back to which is that Iranians are not afraid of showing their opposition and I wonder, you know if that is truly true all the time because when people came out in November against the increase in the price of gasoline. There were hundreds of them that were shot down and you know that kind of brutal repression. And yet it's so confusing from the outside, because we see then the millions of people that did come out to show their morning of the killing of Soleimani and then now in the last couple of days we've seen people out on the streets protesting the plane crash and the government's refusal to immediately accept responsibility for that. And that too was repressed from what we see. On the other hand, Donald Trump and his administration go out there and say yes get out on the streets, you know we are with you. And so it's hard to say you know what is genuine uprising from legitimate demands of people inside Iran and certainly legitimate morning and what is really being egged on by the US and I think this makes it harder for people inside Iran to be building reform movements and protecting human rights and those, what do you say to that. Definitely, definitely. Just one quick example. There is an Iranian director, a woman very successful you also the code think you met her in Iran. She is a woman who made a lot of film about Iranian women and their movements and their sufferings. And so she announced, I think it was two days ago, she announced a rally and morning rally basically for those who lost their life in this horrible plane crash and then the rally was ready everything was prepared a lot of people follow her of course, and then immediately when the tune inside the inside Iran, turned to be a little violent, and then, and they found out that British ambassador was participating in for whatever reason even taking photo or whatever. And also Donald Trump to keep tweeting and a lot of foreign involvement is there. So he immediately she immediately came on Twitter and other social accounts, accounts and then announced that the plan is cancelled because I don't want those who are enemy of Iran, use this opportunity and ride on this, you know, emotional time that people are having. So this is a very basic and and very, you know, I think raw material that we have in front of us to see how these kind of behaviors from outside can destroy movements inside Iran. So, you know, Iranians, we have done everything we have done revolutions, operations, war, killing, whatever possible we change the 2,500 years of kingdom and we change we brought you know, a lot of things that probably countries experience in their lifetime we did it in the past 100 years. And we understand that change, it's, it's not coming from abroad, it's not coming from above, it's change is something that we individual people in a society can make it and that is the real change. And as soon and because of the geopolitics of Iran, a lot of foreign voices get involved and as soon as they get involved. That means the movement inside either will be crushed by the government, or if people are smart enough okay I don't want to give this opportunity to those who want to misuse this condition and they just keep quiet because also we have seen in the past decade Iraq and Afghanistan and Syria particularly that because of the non violence legal demonstration and asking for a democratic society, like what happened to Syria after 10 years, and by the involvement of foreigners. So there are many different kind of movements. Because Iran is a very vibrant society. Most people know about the, you know, culture and society and the average age of Iranians and the education of them. So, it's very vibrant and there are people from many shades of beliefs and ideologies and interest to the government. And one of them wanted show their own interest like in November we had a demonstration against the government that turned to be really wild and lots of damage to the to many infrastructure. And then later we had in general Soleimani's funeral, we had a huge turnout. And now of course this horrible plane crash or plane, I don't know attack or it is really sad it is very sad. And then a lot of people are, I believe is rightfully angry and sad and they want to show it they want to feel you know solidarity to the families and also they don't want to feel alone at home and sit and cry. But again because of the foreign involvement, their simple demonstrations has to be crushed by the government again or controlled by them. And these are these are the situations that makes every democratic movement destroyed. And that happened in Iran many many times, unfortunately. Yeah, thank you for explaining that we've seen that in our own travels to Iran where in earlier years we were able to meet with civil society groups with non governmental organizations. And then when things would get tougher with the United States, those groups would either disappear or be afraid to meet with us. But there is one group that we have always really felt honored to meet with when we travel to Iran and that is the Peace Museum. And at Peace Museum, it really explains how horrific the Iran Iraq war was. But this year when we went there. We also did an apology from the American people for the shooting down of an Iranian plane that happened at the end of that Iraq, Iran Iraq war and 1988. I wondered if you could explain what happened because it's an important reference point to contrast the way that the situation with the shooting down of the plane, the Ukraine plane is playing out today. Actually, there are a lot of talks also around that among the Iranians they say, we don't see, you know, whoever has done this. We put it in an equal condition as whoever did in 1988 to the Iranian airplane, which caused 299 civilian lives. So both are mistakes. And, you know, in the best condition we can put it this way that both are mistakes. Some people say the other one was not a mistake it was, you know, intentionally and so we really don't know still probably in 50 years or so the history will give us the answer. But the difference is, although the Iranian government, I believe the horrible thing that for three days made people to wait. If they knew it, I don't know what the condition was still we don't have the clear news if the government knew from the moment that they, you know, the plane was crushed if they knew it it was something that the Iranian military did if I really, we still are not sure and there are a lot of things around that but at least they came publicly they apologize and the Iranian military colonel came yesterday I guess I couldn't watch all the talk because emotionally I was really sick to see the innocent lives and this poor guy also he was miserable himself explaining and saying it all was our mistake and we apologize and forgive us and whatever he could say to make it clear that he understand it was the mistake from their side. Some people say still there are, you know, arguments around who really did it or whatever, but he did that. And then we have in the other side of this story we have 1988 that just the country came out of the war with Iraq actually it was in the process of the peace negotiation with Iraq we lost a lot of beautiful lives of Iraqis and Iranians during the war. And then oh yeah US gave many different weapons including chemical weapons that Saddam used against the Iranian anime and Iraqis 5000 people died in a second because of use of chemical weapons in both Iraqi and Iranian sites. And nobody even you know one of the anger that they still keep it here is because when Saddam was in a court before he died, nobody even mentioned that that you are responsible for 5000 innocent lives of courts in in both Iran and Iraqi site. So yeah United States supported Saddam during the war also. Many times when Saddam was losing us helped from attacking some tankers in the Persian Gulf, and not just us but also the Saudi Arabia and other Arab countries help Saddam saying and weapons. Interestingly, I strongly suggest we read again three top artists work treacherous alliance because in that book, he specifically discuss the matter the only support Iran had for a while, or the main support Iran had was Israel. So it's interesting to go back and read that but yeah United States help Saddam and this time when Iran was in the process of the peace negotiation, the US the Winston Navy with the Captain Rogers I think was his name. And we sense we sense and yeah sorry, we sense and then 1988 in fourth of July, they hit the Iranian airplane, which had 299 people going from Tehran to Dubai, and all of them died, not one person and stay the live and then that was one part. It was only that I would say if the United States would come and say and apologize or say it was a mistake or whatever. It could be acceptable we say okay mistakes, you know happen. But the problem was, not only the United States to this very day has not apologize for the life of 299 innocent people on that plane, but also President Reagan, handed the middle of honor to Captain Rogers, because of the bravery that he showed. I cannot explain that and I cannot understand what kind of bravery is that. And that is still for Iranians still is in their mind. I would say in a very modern history when we talk about 1953 that is still Iranians remember of the coup in Iran CIA coup. This is another also a very harsh memory. I really, really appreciate code pink in their last trip, and they, they acknowledge that they recognize that and they talked to the people in the peace museum and they handed a beautiful booklet or small book to them, and told them that if our government never did that if our government never reminded that but we remember your loss and I think it was a very powerful. Thank you. And we are also today. We have put together an apology to the Iranian people, because we feel that the present conflict and the stress that 80 million people in Iran must be feeling is caused by Donald Trump. If anybody wants to sign on to that please go to the code pink website and sign on to our apology. But going to where we stand today. You know they talk about tit for tat, as if there are two equals that are fighting each other and I don't want to excuse the Iranian government for anything that they have done that have increased the tensions in the Middle East. But I don't think we should be using that kind of terminology, I think we should be totally acknowledging that there was a process to keep Iran from getting nuclear weapons the Iran nuclear deal, but as the foreign minister is a reef told us when we visited Iran and our last visit, he said that we chose this one to work on because we thought it would be easy because Iran was not did not have nuclear weapons. And we thought that this was the beginning of a process to then start negotiating about other issues. This was a tremendous breakthrough from all of the years of hostility since the 1979 Revolution and the constant sanctions that had been imposed on Iran to move into a different phase. And the people in Iran were so hopeful and happy, and many of us here were really hopeful and happy as well. And then to think that instead of moving on from that deal to the next issue that could be discussed in a way that would start bringing peace and stability to the Middle East, where we know that all the players have to be involved, the Saudis, the Iranians, the Israelis everybody. It went that Donald Trump ripped up that nuclear deal and brought us now to this brink of war, but it's important to say that it wasn't just ripping up the Iran nuclear deal. While Iran has been under some sort of sanctions since 1979. The Trump administration has taken this to a new level. And the sanctions you wonder how it is that one person Donald Trump can make the lives of millions of people in Iran so miserable, just through these executive decisions that say, not only in US companies, not trade with Iran, but we want to make the rest of the world, not trade with Iran. We want Iran not to sell one drop of oil, which is the bulk of the foreign currency that they receive. And then, after this latest round of conflict of the murder of Soleimani and the Iranian response, Donald Trump, instead of taking this as a moment to really say, Okay, you know, we're going to step back. We want negotiations with Iran. They announced that there would be new sanctions, and then the day after that actually impose new sanctions that affect the mining sector, the textile sector, even Iranian carpets. As if any of this is really a threat to US national security because that's the legal basis under which this is done. And so it's really just a slapping the Iranian leadership around some more to say we're going to continue to escalate because the Iranian government had said at the last United Nations Security Council meeting when there was a proposal for Donald Trump to speak to the Iranian president Rouhani Rouhani said no, as long as these sanctions are imposed on us and are hurting our economy so much we will not sit down with you. So it's really disingenuous on the one hand for Donald Trump to say, Oh yes, you know we are open to talk with Iran and on the other hand, do exactly what they know would make those negotiations impossible, impose new sanctions. So I wonder what you can have to say about that. I certainly agree with you agree with everything you said because, you know, sanction, it is sanction is war sanction is act of war sanction is healing slowly, and sanction is actually destroy the society is not only one day meal that gets more expensive. But it's everything, it's education, it's relationship between a family members. It's, you know, it's power is power that specifically women lose, because, you know, in a, in a society like Iran in a Middle Eastern society that, or probably international still men are considered as a bread winner to the house they bring the main food to the house, they, they, they, they work. So the first ones who lose their jobs are women. That means they lose their power they lose their voice. And the first ones who hurt are sick people because they cannot find medications, you know, in general, people with already vulnerable in the society. They, they lose a lot because of the sanctions. And, you know, in Iran, Donald Trump or anyone who has done sanctions they believe they think they can make Iranian people to go against their government. I think that's a big mistake for two reasons. One, if the people like the in November people because of the gas price got high and people got angry and they went into the streets and they was, you know, demonstrations and whatever. What happened, government has started to kill people. So this is one thing that is one reason that by sanctions and creating difficult time not the slapping on the government of Iran but the slapping on the people's face. They cannot change the regime because of sanctions if they got if the United States or Trump thinks he can do that. The other reason is because of again the cultural matter that we have expression among Iranians we say, you know, if we don't have it we keep our cheeks red by slapping ourselves because the cheek and the red cheek means you are healthy. And people say I, you know, just slap my cheeks to show that I'm happy or I'm healthy, but because that's a cry. I tried that people want to go outside and tell everyone that, you know, I am suffering, I am hungry I don't have. I cannot provide for my kids for my family. And other thing I want to say in the interviews that I did with women, two years ago that I was in Iran. These women, the same women who were I told you at the beginning of this talk that they were in the border of Iran, Iraq, Iran, Iraq, border of Iran during the Iran-Iraq war and they experienced the war in the first time when they were 16, 17 years old. And I asked them, and now today, of course, they have their own children and they are dealing with this condition in Iran, the condition of sanctions or threat of war. And I asked them which one is more difficult. And they said this one. They said sanction is more difficult and harsher than war. Because at the war time, you know, everyone are suffering as much as you do, and there is nothing that you prevent from talking about, you know, there is a bomb is very, you know, like naked, nakedly come the violence come in front of you and destroy you and everyone can talk about it and everyone suffers the same amount. But sanctions there makes some people very rich, very rich people who are connected to the centers of power they make a lot of money out of sanctions, and they make majority of Iranian people poor. And the other thing is, because of the pride that people have, they are not comfortable to go to one another and say, I cannot eat today or I cannot provide for my kids today. So based on what I've heard from them, sanction is more violent and harsher than war than bombs. And I really strongly believe we need to do something specifically if Trump is really genuine, genuinely says, I want to negotiate with Iran. It's not possible. It's not possible to hold someone in the corner of a wall, hold his, you know, neck and say, you know, you have to talk to me. It is, it is like this, you are doing sanction on them, and you are, you know, killing their official members of their military. And you say I want to negotiate. At least if Trump administration, I believe, if they are really want to do something with the situation in Iran, I think at least they need to reduce these sanctions which are killing people, basically. And from every angle you look at that from the, you know, like the other day I was talking to my aunt and she told me the price of the potato, which always have been really cheap in Iran is 300% rise and the potato. And if you think about other things, you know, people have other expenses like medications I had a friend whose son was diagnosed with kind of cancer, and they couldn't find the medication they sent me the prescription, I have a doctor friend and I gave the prescription to my friend and said, medicine is like $500 each, because there is no insurance and nothing. And plus we need to put it in the cold, keep it very cold and take it to Iran which makes it impossible impossible for that poor father to provide, you know, even if he has money to get the medication for his son and he has to choose to let his son die, or I don't know, maybe it doesn't have any option. And so, these are the things that makes the situation makes a lot of pressure on people. And I think if we want peace in the Middle East, which we really, really want, and I think we should want it, because it's a horrible, we created a horrible condition for ourselves, there is no security, I don't know what security means for Donald Trump. But if, you know, putting the American lives in all around Iran and kill Iranian military officer, the second important person in the country, if you put all the American lives around Iran and you pressure Iranian with sanctions. How can you create security? And I think these are very important points. Hopefully, on January 25, when we go out and show our, you know, our frustration with these policies, we can send our message to our government, to our leaders, to our sanctions and let them know that sanctions are worse than wars. We need to stop sanctions on Iranian people and we have the experience of Iraq. Of course, Iran doesn't give us the correct numbers of people who are suffering from, you know, lack of medications, food, whatever. We have the experience of Iraq, we know sanctions are killing people slowly and quietly. And also on January 25, I think it's very important for us to be loud and clear that the United States troops must leave the region. I want to briefly mention this, that why? First of all, because we need our kids here. We need our brothers and sisters here at home and we can create a better society with them to be here. Being there, getting PTSD and also a lot of money that we need here for our own kids, for our own societies. For people like me who are immigrants left everything behind to come here and have a beautiful, wonderful life and then not having an insurance. So why do we spend our money over there while we can provide for our own society? And then this is one thing. Another thing is for the Middle Eastern people. See, in, I think it was in July that Iranian, we don't know if it was Iran or not. Some people say it was Iran. Some said no, they hid the Aramco oil facilities. Nothing happened. There was no war there because they understand each other's language. They know when to go forward and when to stop back. It was after that that Qasem Soleimani became not only a military general but also a politician and a diplomat to go between Saudi Arabia, Iran and Iraq to create a peace between these three. And because United States didn't do anything, Toronto stayed back and let the Saudis do whatever they want to do and Saudis decided to make a peace with Iran. So if the United States leaves the region, the region will see peace. That is another reason we need to be loud and clear on 25th. Well, thank you for moving us in the direction of what we can do because I think people listening to this, that's what they are most concerned about. So one of the things is to be out in the streets. We've already had a day of action that was called in just a very short time on January 4 after the killing of Soleimani on January 2. And it was amazing that in over 80 cities people came out. And then we had another day of action last Thursday and over 300 cities. And this one is a global day of action where we're getting responses from people in Africa and the Middle East and Latin America, the one to join in an international call to say the world says no to war. So please go to the code pink website and look and see if there's already a city that has signed up in your community. And if so, please join that. And if not, you should be the one to call for a demonstration. It doesn't take a lot. You just put up will help you put up a Facebook page will help you advertise and voila. People want to come out and express their disgust with what Donald Trump is doing to drag us into another war. There's also a lot of work to do in Washington DC. We did pass the war powers resolution this week in the house now it's going to go to the Senate we need to lobby. And there will be other senators who are on the fence about this, and there will be other resolutions to actually cut off all of the money for this war, and that would be coming from Bernie Sanders in the Senate and Donna, we have to get behind those efforts. And there is something that code pink is working on to really call for an exemption for humanitarian aid, which the Trump administration says is exempt from the sanctions but it is not. So there's a lot of work in Congress to be done, and then separate from that, we have to reach out to whatever networks we have, whether it's in the faith based world if you go to church, a mosque, a synagogue, whatever. Get them to do an educational event in the church or come out with a statement and go into a union if you're related to a union part of one or you have friends who are get them to come out with a statement and then we're going city by city and we've done this in the past we got to do it all over again, get your city council to pass resolutions. There are already some that have done that we're going to put it up in the toolkit on the code pink website, but that's another way to get your community involved. This is the time where we also have to reach out to other movements, environmental movements, anti racist anti mass incarceration movements, women's movements like the upcoming demonstrations that are happening from the women's march next weekend. Go out there with your sign saying that war is bad for women and children and other messages you might have. We are asking people to go out with clipboards and sign people up for code pink anti war activities and we have that in the toolkit as well. So there are lots of ways to really build up a movement that we have to do. We've just gotten a breather because we're not in an all out shooting war. But who knows how long this is going to last. But as we have the time right now we have to use it wisely to build up a very strong movement to show Donald Trump, not that we want him reelected by no means in the White House but he has to know that this is not what the American people want. And so there are many ways to get involved with us. Please contact at code pink. If you want to send us an email you can do that at info at code pink.org. And Leila I just want to thank you for all the work that you have been doing for so many years to try to build links between the Iranian people and the American people, all the delegations. And I want to thank all the Americans and anybody else in this country to Iran, and the work you're doing right now as well. And for giving us your time in a very beautiful webinar this morning to educate people about the Iranian people. Thank you very much. Thanks a lot for everything for everything you do for peace and justice. So we'll sign out from this webinar but please keep in touch with us and let's keep building this movement. And we will have more webinars with people from Iran from the Iranian American community as well. And thank you so much. I know trying to find them. We're signing out here. Okay. We got it.