 Yeah, it's a longing for knowledge that we have lost. And I say we, I mean like the dominant culture and the mainstream of that culture. It hasn't entirely been lost. There are people in the midst of our culture that have explored other ways of knowing, other technologies, other ways to communicate with nature. And they've just been marginalized, but there are dolphin whispers and elephant whispers and plant communicators and dousers and all these things that we just kind of like, well, that's not scientific, you know, that's not reliable knowledge. And maybe privately we believe in that stuff and explore it, but when it comes down to sit at the climate policy table, no one's going to talk about dousing the earth for where we should build wells. Or no one's going to, I mean, that is not part of the conversation. I think that has to become part of the conversation because these technologies are real. They come from, this here's what they have in common. What they have in common is that they draw from an understanding that we are not alone here, that we are not alone as the full subjects, the fully, the full selves, conventional evolutionary biology, conventional thinking says that humans are the only full selves. Animals, you know, they have some qualities of a full self, but not as much as we do. Plants may be a rudimentary amount of selfhood and definitely not rocks or rivers or forests. Or clouds or the wind or the moon or the sun. Those are not selves. So any technology that depends on the selfhood of non-human beings is automatically suspect and does not have a seat at the table. So the living planet view, which I work with in my climate work, really, and it's more than a living planet view, it is a sentient, conscious, intelligent planet view. It revalidates those things and brings them back in. They don't need to be coming from indigenous cultures. They can also be coming from the marginalized streams of thought and practice in Western culture. All the things that we discard as alternative or new age, not all. I mean, there is actually a lot of shadow there, too. We're not going to automatically credulously buy into every idea that sounds appealing. But we don't discard them out of hand either. Because we know that the resolution of our crisis has to come, here I'm paraphrasing Albert Einstein here, has to come from outside of the ways of thinking that generated the crisis. So we're starting to look outside. That's the humility that I'm talking about. Humility coming again as a result of humiliation, not out of a fetishistic yearning to be humble. Anyone who tries to be humble achieves only a counterfeit of being humble that ultimately only fools themselves. Humility is a slight effect of something else. So on a cultural level, the humility is, wow, we didn't know after all. We didn't know what was real. We didn't know what was possible. We didn't know how the world worked. We were so sure of ourselves. And now we don't know. So we are open to new possibilities, to new aspects of reality that we had denied before. And that's a good thing, because if we are limited to the theory of change that is embedded in science, which is essentially a force-based theory of change, you exert a force on a mass and something changes. If we are limited to that, it's hopeless. The world is just going to get worse and worse and worse, because those who have force in their hands are perpetrating the destruction. We cannot overcome them by force. We need to align ourselves with other levels of causality. And then so much more becomes possible. When you understand that nature has its own power, that prayers can be answered, that they're effective, that rituals and ceremonies are effective, that there are other beings out there who would love to ally with us in serving a more beautiful world, then our power is vastly expanded beyond the force that our disposal, the physical force, the financial force. Those are insufficient to the task. We need allies. We need to join a movement that is beyond human beings and know that we're not alone here. So these people, like these, I don't know, dolphin whispers, these nature communicators, I mean everything, holistic healers, all this stuff. Even we could go to ETs, star people, you can go out as far as you want. And boy, does that ever come into the climate conversation. What aspects of reality are we excluding? How are we limiting ourselves? We have to bring it all in. We have to be operating in the real. Anything that we exclude, the beautiful, hopeful stuff and the worst of the worst, the insect holocaust, for example, that's going on right now. Everything like 75% decline in flying insect biomass over my lifetime. Have you noticed that there's a lot less bug splatter than when you were a kid? I mentioned that to my dad and he's like, yeah, you know, we used to sometimes not even be able to drive. There'd be clouds of bugs, like you would have to, I mean, every time you got gas, you'd have to clean off your windshield. And now like, I almost never see that, that should be alarming, especially from a living planet view, because insects are a critical tissue of Gaia. I mean, they're at the, they're central to every terrestrial food chain. Like less insects means less life, means the planet is 75% less alive than it was. So we need to take that information into, even if their carbon contribution is unmeasurable. And what's causing the insect holocaust? No one really knows. Our habit of jumping to the V cause has a say, well, it must be climate change. We would just love for everything to have one cause, but probably from what I've read, the cause of the insect holocaust is the, is habitat destruction, ecosystem degradation, but mostly the 90 year experiment we've been conducting called dousing the entire environment with pesticides. Yeah, for 90 years we've been doing that. I mean, what happens to the soil when you soak it again and again and again in life killing substances? And, and I mean, these are sprayed everywhere. When I was a kid, it was gypsy moth caterpillar spraying. They would spray entire forest. The entire Eastern seaboard was sprayed aerially again and again and again. And those don't only kill gypsy moths and life is so resilient. Life, life recovers after these. But if you do it again and again and again and now it's spraying for the Zika virus or Lord knows what else, eventually life declines. So that's just one example of the, how we need to expand our, our understanding of planetary health to the organ and tissue level and also expand our, our capacity, capacity to take in all of reality. And so that was an example of the most disturbing things that, that we need to take in, that sometimes the climate discourse blinds us to, because it's all about carbon. But what about extinction? What about dynamiting of coral reefs? What about the toxic waste that's poisoning streams? And what about sunscreen residue that, that is getting into the environment? And antibiotic pollution and xenoestrogens coming from birth control. And I mean, there's just so many things that are, we don't recognize or see as much of a threat because the, because we're focused on the one, the one true cause of ecosystem degradation like the climate change, the rush to a cause. So I'm advocating for expanding our, our vision to take in all of it, especially to take in the things that our dominant paradigms have excluded from reality. Our salvation will come from the margins, marginal ideas, marginal ways of knowing, marginal ways of thinking, marginalized races, genders, cultures, people. Our political leadership will come from the prisons, perhaps.