 You're just non-existent. I gave you challenge 22. You're just non-existent. No, I gave you challenge 22. And then I said I'd walk into it. And I said I'd walk into it. I mean, I need to talk to people who are actually compassionate about it. Instead of other mothers playing for the mothers to be raped and killed, whatever. You're fantastic. Disgusting. What's the matter? I've been following you on Facebook, and this is an absolute letdown, because I have literally just said, I agree with everything she's saying, and I have tried to be vegan. And my biggest challenge was that my health was impacted. How? My biggest challenge, because... So I was living in a different country, first of all. I didn't have health insurance. And I went vegan. And I don't know what the issues was, because I wasn't even able to go. I didn't have health insurance. I wasn't even able to go to the hospital and check. But I was a vegan for a year, and I was having dizzy spells. I went unconscious and all of this. And I understand this. This is disgusting. So it shouldn't be swattering animals. It shouldn't be forcing suffering. I have 3,000% agree with that. But my question to her is, what are you supposed to do when you're a single parent like me? I've got 2 kids and I'm truly busy. I work full-time. I need to then get rid of, say, 3 years. I'm a vegetarian. I've been a vegetarian since I was 15. But the veganism part is a massive challenge. So I've got 33 years. It seems like if you're a single mother, you work full-time, you actually overcome many challenges in your life. This is a very easy thing to do. Compared to what you do as a parent, you manage your children raising kids. I've got ADHD. So do I. I struggle with consistency and with, like, whenever I'm vegan. I think you're victimising yourself a little bit too much here. There's a lot of single mothers that are vegan. My mum's a vegan. See, this is an issue, because I'm a little insane. These are the issues I have. How can I practically implement it? I mean, I can. I mean, it seems, of course. These are the things you can do. It's just a little tap issue. It's trying to get to me. That's what it seems like. I think that you know that you can be vegan. That's probably why I feel a bit attacked right now. I've said that, that's how it's done. I know people with autism that are vegan, ADHD that are vegan, disabled people that are vegan, my mum's a vegan, my brother is a vegan, and he's like a beer-drinking, you know, and he went vegan, like, it's easy. Basically, what you're talking about is, if you're a vegetarian, removing dairy and eggs and checking clothes for wool and things like this, very simple. You're already there. Yeah, I don't, like, with my clothing and stuff, that's never an issue. I always check the label for that. That's an easy thing to do. But when it comes to, like, food... I think you like cheese, and I think you like... No, it's not. Like, is it a lot of things? Yeah, I went vegan when I left Gains, and I was like an extra drug addict, and I didn't have any education. I just apologised. Yeah, yeah, yeah. So, like, I mean, you're talking to... No, I had PTSD, ADHD, depression. I actually been in the mental ward before, like, you know. So, you're talking to someone that has been through struggles, been suicidal, and was still able to omit certain things from my diet. What's the practical solution? The practical solution is basically... There's so many how-to-be-vegan websites, right? Like, where are you living? Here? Manchester, yeah, yeah. Manchester. So, you know, there's a veganuary website, there's an accidentally vegan website, there's apps like Happy Cow. Do you know the app Happy Cow? Happy Cow. Tell you where all the vegan options are around you, like, so, like, Costa, every single supermarket, every single fast-food place. In the, you know, in Tescos and Sainsbury's and Asda now, everything's labelled vegan. There's a whole vegan section. There's Vegan Dairy, you know, there's... There's a vegan option that is... Well, usually, Costa, whatever, if there's a vegan option, I would usually go for that anyway. What milk is that? Psyur. There you go. I always get Psyur. So, it's only cheese and eggs and things like this at you? Rarely has eggs anyway, but it's... So, it's so easy to... Cheese, but it's a very small amount anyway. You must love cheese. I love cheese. I love cheese too. Not the biggest thing. I prefer other things anyway, like... Yeah. Vegetables, like, you know, I've seen all of that, like, I've been a vegetarian for a long time. So, you don't eat meat already, which is actually, if you look around, meats and everything too, you can make the same argument for meat, but you've managed to do that. True? Yeah, I mean... You've managed to not eat meat. You don't slip up and eat bacon, do you? Well, no. If someone's got bacon and you're just like, I don't eat it, that's like a vegan, but it's just one step further. Yeah. You know, it's like... But what I found with the vegan side of things is, like, you might go for a cookie, and that's got, like, dairy or something in it, or... Cookies right here, right? I know. M&S cookies, plant-based cookies. Yeah. You know, there's nothing you eat right now that has dairy in it that we don't eat every day. You know, you just see... Well, it's your go-to diet on a daily basis. It depends if we're travelling, then, basically, we've got to grab and go. If we've got an Airbnb, we can cook food. Yeah. So, like, basically, I start the day with, like, I like wholemeal bread and toasted bread, and we eat a lot of, like, baked beans or, like, oatmeal with fruit, or sometimes we have yogurt with berries and stuff like that, or a lot of tofu. Tofu's very rich in iron and calcium. Soy is an incredible health food, full of calcium and all that, and people are afraid of it, which is irrational. So, and we do eat vegan cheese. Like, I get this cathedral city plant-based, and it's delicious. It's probably the best vegan cheese I've ever had. Are you getting, like, affiliated or something? No. Because all the vegan cheese I've tried is, like... I don't get money for anything. I don't sell anything. I'm an only donation-based activist. I don't answer to anyone. I only promote things that I believe are good, and basically, we just want animals not to be slaughtered and exploited and killed and treated like commodities. So, I mean, if you believe that and you've got such a small step to go, wouldn't you want to embody that belief and just say, you know, I'm proud of myself of all the challenges that you have in your life, right? You've actually put the animals just a little bit further. It's not like you're asking to replace your life with theirs and kill yourself with it. It's just like, okay, what's vegan? What's vegan? Millions of vegans here in the UK, millions who are able to do it and are single-moms and have mental health issues. It's really, I think, you're letting yourself down a little. Impossible because of that. I'm saying there's an extra layer of resilience. You know, we all have challenges. You are capable. You're a single mother, which is strong and it's challenging in our self, and you probably already have to look out for a lot of things for your kids and doing all this stuff and organising a lot of things. Yeah. We're talking about omitting two things from your diet which lets you down because it's such a small thing that you're making it bigger in your mind than it actually is. And if you agree that animals matter morally, the least you can do is be vegan. I'm not asking you to jump in the gas chamber and stick cameras in there. That's like, that's what I would do. Yeah. But the least you can do is not harm them. Yeah. You know? It's not a big thing and I think you make it bigger in your head than it actually is. I just find it challenging like every single day because it's like, I feel like I've got so much to think about and then it's like now I want to go shopping and I get it. Like your point is well, you know, you should actually, your morals should overcome that extra challenge. Well, you don't do it for meat. You don't do it for meat, do you? There's a reason you don't go, ah, there's meat here. I better grab that because I've got her. That was a lot easier, right? It is a little, yeah. It is easy. The egg industry is... Hidden. It seems less attached to your tortures but obviously... It's a very long suffering and they are the meat industry. All those animals go to the meat industry and they're in some ways more disgusting than, you know, it's not a competition. But, you know, I just think it must... You have a conversation with someone like Mel, pretty hard-lined and I can be as well. I'm pretty hard-lined as well. But like, wouldn't it be great to say, you know what? I agree with you and I live in accordance with that belief as well. And even though... Wouldn't it feel good for yourself as theme as well just to go, I'm a single mother, I'll have these struggles but I can still manage to be a vegan? Yeah. You know what I mean? Yeah, I mean... Because I believe you can. I think of the conversation, though, that I was saying, what are the practical tools? These are my challenges. So like, how can I... And my advice to you... Your approach has been, well, you know what? I've done all of that and these are my challenges and other people have gone through them. And these are the solutions they've found. Like, that's your... Google, honestly, Google's... I get that, but I thought you were here to, like, conversation, which... You're here to promote the doc and, you know, look, you already know this stuff. Yeah. But sometimes you need to kick up the bum to go... My kick up the bum was like, I don't want to harm people anymore because I was a violent person, right? So I don't want to harm people and I was like, I feel like a hypocrite that I believe these animals matter and if I seen someone harming an animal, I would intervene. But I'm eating their body parts. I'm eating their... So I made that a priority, right? Because I didn't want to feel that way anymore. I don't want to feel like a hypocrite, you know what I mean? Yeah. And it made me feel so much better inside. Yeah. Because I had a lot of s*** going on too. I was having nightmares, recurring dream, like, you know, trying to get back on my feet after being in prison and being in gangs and, you know, so... But I just... It wasn't that hard. Once you put a little bit of effort into it, like, look, Google up. We look in the back of a packet. Does it have milk? Milk and eggs are always highlighted. Yeah. If it says may contain milk or eggs, it's not an issue. Right. Because that's just to protect people with allergies if there's cross-contamination. Right. But if they're an ingredient, they're always highlighted. Yeah. And you don't have to worry, it's like... Yeah, okay. You can do it. Right, well, thanks for the conversation. Bless you. Look, don't take anything personally. Yeah. She's defending animals and she... She's the only thing... She's been seeing that, like... It's forgettable for her to put me in the bracket like, I don't give a s*** at all. It's not true. It's not true. But you only you know that. That's why I'm here to have conversation with you. But only you know what you care about, right? But when you say, if I say I care about my partner and then I punch her in the face, you're not going to believe me. So if you say you care about animals and you can't omit two things from your diet, you know, then it doesn't really reflect what you truly believe. That's why there's... It's an easy thing to rectify, to fix. All right, well, I'll give it a go. Bless you. Take care. It's good to talk to you. See you later.