 Okay, welcome everyone. Good evening. We're so glad that you're able to join us tonight. For our bridging knowledge webinar series. I'm Cindy whole project manager, the scholarship program is sponsored by the IMLS. We're pleased that you're able to join. As students continue to join I will admit them in. But first I want to introduce our guest speaker. Tonight we are welcoming Alana Eiko Moore, who is executive director of Apollo, the Asian Pacific. American librarians association. And phenomenal librarian superstar extraordinaire. And I sent her just her bio and description out via email so you have access to that as well. This session will be recorded for those who are not able to stay during the duration, or for our students who have other commitments. We know that you're busy working professionals and we're very glad that you're able to join us this evening. So without further ado, I would like to welcome Alana to go ahead and introduce herself further and tell us a little bit more about what she's going to share with us tonight. Great. Thank you so much for that lovely introduction. I am so excited to be here tonight with all of the bridging knowledge scholars and I want to thank Cindy for this wonderful opportunity to speak with you tonight. I'm going to go ahead and share my screen. Okay. All right. So what I'm going to be talking about tonight is leadership care and community. And I'll just kind of touch a little bit on leadership values, the importance of community and the importance of self care. So it is finally, it's finally Friday, but it is not Friday, which shows how my mind is working. Time is a very strange thing, but it is not Friday, it is Thursday, but it feels almost like Friday for me. So if you could go ahead and go to Slido and then just one word describe how you are feeling right now. My word would be a little bit scattered because I did think it was Friday when I got started today. So how are you feeling right now in this moment? Are you feeling tired, relieved that it's kind of the end of the evening? And feeling a little bit looking forward to the weekend. How are you feeling today? Energized. I love that. I, my kids just got home from aftercare and they had so much energy. And so I was able to grab a little bit of that before joining you all. They are five and seven and have a ton of energy right now. So how are you feeling? How are you feeling right now? And if you're not able to get on Slido, you're more than welcome to drop that into the chat if you would like to do that instead. Okay, so we have someone feeling happy, someone feeling energized. I'm feeling a little scattered. Okay, so feel free to keep on adding in here how you're feeling ready for the weekend. I know me too. I'm definitely ready for the weekend. My partner is working all weekend, but I'm looking forward to having some time with the kids. We've had kind of a heat wave here. So maybe hitting up, hitting up some water as well, heading to the beach if we can find parking. Okay, thank you so much everyone for participating. Feel free to drop those things back in. Before we get started, I'd like to do a land acknowledgement. This is a photo by Lance Gerber. He took this photo of Indigenous artist Nicholas Galanin's Never Forget art installation. This is located outside of Palm Springs, California, and it was installed in 2021. So I would like to recognize and offer gratitude to the Indigenous people who have cared for the land I'm on today. I want to acknowledge that they have been dispossessed of their land through violence, deceptive processes, and colonialism. I would like to acknowledge the Kuma Yai people as the caretakers of this land and surrounding eco-scape in which I work and love. I support Indigenous peoples in this place, past, present, and emerging. And since land acknowledgments can be performative without action, I would like to make a donation today to the National Indigenous Women's Resource Center, and I'll go ahead and drop that into the chat. I'm sorry for those other notifications going on. So a little bit about me. I grew up in Hawaii as a fourth generation mixed race Japanese American. It wasn't until as much older that I realized that I was a settler and guest on colonized land. My maternal side came to Hawaii to work in the plantations, and my dad came to the islands from Missouri to work as a janitor at the YMCA, which is where he met my mom. I spent most of my childhood learning how to swim, do bone dance with the Japanese side, and I was a pretty rebellious teenager. I acted out a lot. So after high school, I wanted to go to college. We had no money to do those college tours that a lot of people do where they go and visit different places. But I had gotten a lot of financial aid from a really small college in Oregon. So I moved to Oregon and not being a librarian yet. I had no idea how to do research. And so I did not look at census data or demographics. And then when I got to Oregon, I had this huge culture shock. I had never seen so many white people in my life. The culture was different. People shouted out answers in the classroom and that kind of combative interaction in the classroom was very much encouraged. Nobody shared food, which I found really hard. And so in my four years in college, I actually really struggled. And I tried to adapt. I tried not to stand out, right. In my last year of college, I came out as bisexual. I now identify as queer. And I also got really involved in racial justice work and it was here that I, you know, was able to be in community with other black indigenous people of color. And I kind of felt like I found my place right. So I ended up working for eight years after college. I had a lot of nonprofits throughout Oregon around issues of racial justice, gender justice, domestic violence prevention, police and prison reform and LGBTQ human rights. I then did a really short stint in New York City, which was too crowded and did a few years in Chicago, which was too cold, but I did get my MLIS there. And then I landed in San Diego, where I now live. This is my house. This lovely person in the middle of the first photo on the college campus that I currently work at the UC San Diego. I work here as an ethnic studies, critical gender studies and sociology librarian. We were friends for a year. We dated for a year. We legally got married. And then nine months later, the state declared it was illegal to actually be married. It was interesting and awful at the same time. My partner identifies as transgender or non binary. And you can see that we have two incredibly beautiful amazing children that may or may not make an appearance at some point since this desk is in a corner of the kitchen. So in addition to identifying as mixed race, Japanese American queer, and as a woman, I also have invisible disabilities and I also have a lot of privileges. I'm light skinned. I'm cisgender. We are currently middle class. I'm able bodied and I'm also a college graduate. So when Cindy asked me to talk about leadership and the challenges of working as a black indigenous person of color in the LIS field. And I honestly, my first thought was like, oh my gosh, like what would I even have to talk about. Right. And I think that, you know, growing up being mixed race growing up being bisexual and queer, I've often struggled with feeling like I'm never enough, right. I'm a chaotic household. I never thought of myself as a leader. So I often am surprised when I realize I am in positions of leadership. And it really makes me think about, you know, what are the images that were often shown of what what a leader looks like and what a leader is supposed to be right. What characteristics to society and our profession tell us that leaders embody right. When we look at the heads of libraries we can see that despite a feminized profession that folks at the top are usually white male identified cisgender and able bodied right what we see are white men. And so that's problematic right because we are all leaders we all have the capacity to contribute in amazing ways to our profession. So, when I entered librarianship. You know, I felt like I didn't look the part I was like the small plug on the left and people who were leaders were like the big confident dog on the right right. I feel like I didn't look the part right I didn't speak with with authority and conviction I tend to. I tend to have a conversational style that you know ends with you know what some folks have told me sounds like a question at the end but really it's sort of the sing song way that I grew up talking to my family. It is a conversational style that I believe invites conversation and collaboration. So, I've actually had people coach me on my communication style and say like you need to lower your voice your voice is too high pitched. You always sound like you're asking questions you need to speak with more authority and conviction. And, you know, like I think I tried at first but it didn't feel like me. And so, I think now like many years in, like, I'm just me my voice is I pitched I speak the way I speak with the cadence that I have. I think a lot of times we think that our leaders. You know they use these big words they use academic language and a lot of times that wasn't me either like. I don't, you know, say therefore and here to for and you know, according to so and so like I tend to use smaller words I don't use academic language and at first I felt like that was a fault. That's not what leaders did but really I think that it makes us more relatable to the people that we serve it makes us more relatable to our colleagues. We're not putting on airs, you know, and I think that another thing that I do that isn't always seen as a leadership thing is, I say I don't know all the time. I don't know. There are so many things I'm still learning my, my people around me teach me things all the time and I do not have all the answers. So, the longer that we swim in a culture the more invisible it becomes right so this is an image representing like white supremacy culture right our profession has a long history of exclusion and assimilation. Our organizations are really white our graduate schools are really white, you know we're rooted in it right. The culture kind of includes a lot of those kind of norms of behavior right those unspoken behaviors those unwritten rules that language the structure those shared understandings that a lot of folks have around the way that you know things work right. Those white cultural norms policy isn't values really create barriers for librarians of color, right, and it affects our careers it affects our ability to lead it affects our ability to move up. So this next slide, kind of, is how I feel sometimes when I look at the whiteness of our organizations and China navigated, you know, from a perspective of a person of color like it makes no sense to me. You know that organizational culture that culture where some behaviors are accepted and others are not right. How do we navigate this when whiteness is pervasive when heterosexism is pervasive. You know, oftentimes assimilation seems like your only option, but how do we honor who we are, while we navigate structures like this, you know, with our race with our gender, you know with our bodies and with our heart. It could also be that this chart looks really awful to me because I also have ADHD so when I look at this I'm like this makes no sense. All right, so this is a quote from Porter and Vasquez about supervision, and I did a lot of reading around supervision and management. When I was a supervisor and a manager, but I really feel like this quote is also embodies a lot of what I feel about leadership right so the quote says that a feminist supervision but I've crossed it out feminist leadership model is about a collaborative relationship that's characterized by mutual respect genuine dialogue attention to social identity factors and analysis of power attention to diversity, social activism and self reflexivity and leadership to me is all of these things right collaboration respect, having genuine dialogue, you know, acknowledging that we're not all the same that we have different identities and power and privilege, you know, and that self reflection is also really, really important. And I feel like we each have responsibility to become an active player in the fight for social justice. Super important. There was a recent summit called path to leadership, and it was a national forum for advancing Asian Pacific Islander American leadership, and it explored the needs and barriers to leadership. And a lot of the things in there were about folks wanting to have more collaboration, right, more self reflection. And so, you know, some of that research is showing up. So, a lot of leadership is informed by values right and I think as I've moved through my career I've come to identify values that are really important to me. So I'd like to ask you now, what values inform your library practice or work what values do you want to bring with you into the discussion. What are things that help fill your caught what values do you hold dear. So you can go to slide.com, and the number is 2057217, and you can type in what values inform your library practice or work. If you don't have access to slide out you can feel free to drop that into the chat. But what values are important to you. So we have inclusivity, which I feel is really important to me as well, we're definitely having some great minds thinking alike here. We need to have a profession that embraces inclusion. Learning about our history is a super important value as well right we can't move forward in a positive way if we don't know where we came from integrity. Also super resonating with me as well. Yeah. What are the values that help inform your, your practice or your work things that are important to you that you want to make sure to bring into the field community that is one of my favorites, definitely that sense of community and humanity. Yes, these are all fabulous and thank you so much for adding these to the pool. Community, history, humanity, integrity, inclusivity and equity. Definitely all on the same page here. So when I reflect on values that inform my work that inform my leadership. One of the things that I think a lot about is authenticity and heart. So, you know, when I first entered the profession, after working for so long in communities of color, it was really charming for me, I again felt like that undergraduate freshman on that college campus, being like oh my gosh there's so many white people and where are the black people, you know, the color of my profession is people of color. And so I think when I first entered the profession, I wasn't authentic to myself. I think sometimes I tried to be somebody that I thought was the person that would be more successful the person that would be more palatable the person that would rock the boat less. I just feel really bad that it was actually attracting the wrong types of people to me, right, people who thought I was this person that I wasn't. And so I think I quickly realized that like, I can only be my full authentic self right and sometimes that might rock the boat, sometimes it might make people uncomfortable. But by doing so, I think that it also makes space for other people to be their authentic self right, and it allows me to lead with my heart and to lead with with compassion and with care. So I think authenticity is a really important value to me. I also try to be humble, part of my leadership is being humble. This is from Borkin and Coolhane Para, and this is their approach to cultural humility and this is actually the slide is borrowed from my friend to want to hodge. And this approach of cultural humility goes beyond that concept that we talked about of cultural competence. We actually really approach every encounter with the knowledge that our own perspective is always full of assumptions and prejudices. So we need to always keep an open mind and remain respectful of other people around us. So the age is being humble about the assumptions we make about knowing the world from our mentees' eyes, from other people's eyes, from our colleagues' eyes, how our background can impact the care of each other. This slide is specifically around mentorship, but this is for everyone, how we can learn more about each other's background, culture, beliefs, and practices, and incorporate this knowledge into our relationship with others and also incorporate lifelong learning and respect. Another value I really hold dear is connection. I think especially in this profession that there were many times where I felt like I was the only BIPOC in the room, the only BIPOC at an event, and really needing to find that connection with other people with other BIPOC. And, you know, connection with others has really been proven to improve BIPOC mental health. And when we work in primarily white institutions, we really need those connections. You know, people always come first. That connection always comes first. And sometimes folks around us might be more concerned with, you know, getting things done. I always feel like we have to put that connection first, right? Then the getting things done will come after. Connection also is very clearly related to bridge building, where you want to, like, create those connections so that you can build bridges with other people to kind of promote solidarity between groups, bringing others across that bridge with you, and making things easier for those who come behind so that, you know, you're not just doing something by yourself. You're also, you know, bringing others on that journey with you. And then finally, I think one of my last values is perseverance. And what I mean by that is I don't mean, you know, gritting your teeth to get through every awful situation. I think for me, perseverance means that, you know, I do get back up when I get pushed down. And sometimes, you know, it might take me a year, it might take me a month, it might take me however long it takes me, but I always get back up when I get pushed down. And I think that for me, that perseverance has really gotten me through a lot of really difficult situations in my life, through some deep depressions, through some barriers and obstacles at work. And I think that, you know, perseverance, overcoming those challenges and those barriers, you know, has kind of helped me to build those connections, build those bridges, and to still feel like really good about the work. That I do, you know, our profession, you know, especially in upper management, you know, is really lacking in that racial and ethnic diversity. And, you know, I, I've been in my current position for 15 years. And I've been on this very awkward and strange backward trajectory where I quickly rose up through the ranks and then slowly started losing titles, losing people that I supervised. And I think that, you know, for a while it was really affecting me. I was like, what's wrong with me? Why is this happening to me? And I think that, you know, realizing that it wasn't about me. It was about, you know, the institution I'm working in. It was about certain people feeling very threatened and that that perseverance I think really allowed me to think about, you know, where else can I use my leadership skills and meet my goals? You know, where else can I can I actually get that leadership experience that I want and I need in order to like, you know, really help the profession. And so that brings me to my next, my next slide on community, which was one of the values that we talked about earlier, right? So, you know, data from the most recent Elise Statistical Reports shows that, you know, for graduate students, there's only 3.3 from, you know, Asian backgrounds and Native Hawaiians and Pacific Islanders are coming in at a 0.1 And Native, other Native and Indigenous people and American Indians are also very low at like 1%, right? So we make up like such a small percentage of the profession. We really need to have that community. For myself, you know, lacking opportunities at my current place of employment and really feeling isolated in many ways. I was able to find my community through the Asian Pacific American Librarian Association, which was a nonprofit created in 1982 and it works to enhance leadership opportunities for Asian American Native Hawaiian and Pacific Islander library workers and those who serve them. And Apollo was actually the first place where I got an opportunity to serve on a committee. And within the year I was chairing the committee because as many of you know, you know, our smaller community organizations are always looking for people to run things. Right. So within a year I was chairing a committee. I had never chaired a committee before. And getting that experience was really invaluable. And over the past 15 years with Apollo, going from a committee member to committee chair, I eventually ran for a position on the executive board as a member at large. And a few years ago ran for Apollo president, which, you know, I think if you would have asked me a long time ago if that was something I would have done. I would have said definitely not served as Apollo president for a year and then was asked a year ago to submit my application for the executive director. And I at first was like, no, I definitely don't need to be doing that. But when I thought about it, you know, serving as the president allowed me an opportunity to really work on my vision, my voice, you know, my advocacy. And the executive director role is more behind the scenes and is allowing me an opportunity to learn more about the financial and legal aspects of a nonprofit organization, which is a skill set that I don't currently have. And so I actually was like, okay, I'll throw my hat in the ring. And so I've been the executive director now for a couple months. Still learning the ins and outs, have some big shoes to fill. Lessa Kananiopua, Palayo Lazada was our previous executive director for three years and did a really, really great job. So, you know, it's been a really great thing to have the opportunity to practice leadership that aligns with my values and to be able to find communities through Apollo. And I think especially, you know, being feeling a little bit stuck at my current place of employment, being able to, yeah, Lessa is amazing looking at the chat. You know, being able to have other opportunities to lead and to feel like challenged to feel like you're having an opportunity to learn new things is so important. And, you know, all of the National Association of Librarians of Color really welcome having members take on those leadership roles. The American Indian Library Association does a lot of work with Apollo as well. We are sister organizations in many ways. And so, you know, Apollo is not perfect. No organization is perfect. But we've, we, I think we've been open to change and open to growing, right. So, when I first tried to join Apollo, I'd actually only been a librarian for a year, and I tried to join at one of those, like a volunteer type of fair. And the woman who was working in the Apollo table said, are you Asian? And I was like, I am, but does it matter because anybody can join Apollo, right? Like, it's for folks who, you know, are our Asian Pacific Islander Native Hawaiian or for folks who work with those communities or folks who are allies and supporters. And she was like, well, but I just, I'm curious. And I was like, yeah, I'm Japanese on my mom's side. And she goes, Well, you must look like your dad. And being mixed race, I had this moment of just being like, Oh my God, and feeling so much rejection for not being recognized as being part Asian. And I actually walked away from Apollo and actually did not join. And then over the next year, I met some other folks from Apollo, and we're really wonderful. And I told them what happened. And they were like, Oh my gosh, no, like, that person shouldn't have been at the volunteer table. And we definitely welcome mixed race folks. We would love to have you. And so I gave Apollo another chance. And, you know, it, Apollo has a lot of, I agree, Rebecca, that was totally messed up. You know, Apollo has a ton of mixed race folks now. And when I joined Apollo in the beginning as well, I also was like, you know, like, I'm feeling this disconnect between being with my people in Apollo, or going to the gay, lesbian, bisexual transgender group, which was mostly all white folks, right. So it's like, be queer and hang out with the white folks or, you know, be Asian mixed race and hang out with the brown folks. And so I definitely had another point of feeling like I am not sure where I belong. So I started really pushing Apollo, like, can we have more programming around like, you know, API and being GLBT, can we, can we, can we do some of that. And so we had a few sessions, and, you know, I'm proud to say like we have a lot more GLBT Apollo members now who are visible. We have some on our executive board. We are talking more about how, you know, the GLBT community a lot of times like is really invisible within our Asian Pacific Islander, Native Hawaiian, you know, Native Native American communities and so really making space for that. So, you know, no organization is perfect, but I feel like Apollo is willing to grow and learn. I know Ayla has also been really willing to grow as well. So this is the Koala Mountains in Hawaii. And I put this here because I really believe that community can help to support your growth and advancement and really help you to reach the top of the mountain, right. And we can't get there without help. And that's why community is so important. So, and I'd like to kind of close up with self care. So we talk a lot about self care, right, we talk about it as like getting a mani paddy, and it's an indulgence, right. And I think by thinking about it as something that's an indulgence. It makes self care an individual act, right. It white washes the concept and it distorts and kind of erases the necessity of care. And I do believe that in our communities, self care is not an indulgence, right. It is, it is, is an important way of like taking care of ourselves so that we can take care of others, right. It's a culture of care, and it is really directly connected to communities. You know, a lot of our organizations don't understand that self care is an ethical priority. They do not create a culture of care, which is why it's so important for us to have our communities to have our families to, you know, have those places where we feel like we can be our authentic self, because, you know, at work, we may be facing things like racism or microaggressions, like tokenism, you know, having to code switch. So we want to like really acknowledge that self care is so important, right. That, you know, a lot of us face structural oppression or inequity. And so self care is vital for our survival, and it's vital for our preservation, right. So that being said, what were you doing the last time you were taking really good care of yourself? Okay. What were you doing? It could be something as simple as, you know, you ate a really good meal. Maybe you took your dog for a walk. Maybe you lay down and had a really nice nap. Maybe you took some time to be outside and do some deep breathing. So what were you doing the last time you were taking really good care of yourself? Spending time with family. I agree. Spending time with family can be so incredibly restorative and healing. I think being with people who really see you. I think for those of us who have care obligations to other people, whether that's our elders, whether it's our children, that doing self care can be really important. Okay, reading in the cozy spot. I love that. I haven't been reading as much as I want lately, but I have been doing some audio books, which has been really nice as well. Exercising most days of the week at night. I love that. And I do know that for myself, I feel best when I get some exercise in, and it has definitely been something that's been falling by the wayside lately. So volunteering in the community and giving back is something that can make you feel like you're taking really good care of yourself. I love that. Talking story and laughing with my mom and sisters. Yes, eating good food. Yes, talking story. I love these. So take a minute. Look at what all of your friends are putting in here, maybe take one, write one down if it's something that, you know, you'd like to do that you haven't done in a long time. One of the things that I've been doing lately to take good care of myself is probably the reason I moved to San Diego is because I wanted to be closer to the ocean. When I first moved here, I went all the time. I would go at 530 after work. I would go on the weekends, like, I would go like, you know, after I was power doing lots of stuff, I would go to the ocean. And, you know, over the last few years with the pandemic, having small children, I realized like we haven't, I haven't gone to the ocean in a really long time. So the day I had an hour break, I was working at home, and I jumped in my car and I drove and it took about 18 minutes to get there and find parking. And then I just sat, and I ate my little home lunch. And then I turned around and I got home in time for my next meeting. And you know, it was so wonderful. And it was really only 15 minutes of sitting staring at the ocean but I felt it was so healing. It was so meaningful. It's why I paid so much money to live in San Diego. And so it was a good reminder for me to do things like that, to take care of myself. And it's so important for us to like demystify self care and to share our experiences because, you know, mental health is, is really, really important for us. And it's really important for us to talk about what that means and how taking good care of what that looks like. Another thing I did today that was me taking really good care of myself was I went to therapy and I talked about some deep stuff with my therapist and, you know, doing things like that can be really about self care too, right? So we can fill our cups so we can fill our family's cup and fill our community's cup as well. And so, you know, a lot of what we're doing, right, is about inclusion. It's about co-creation. It's about building something together based on everything that you bring to the table. You have so many skills. You have so many things that you're bringing from your lived experiences that are going to make the profession richer and stronger and better. And you are all amazing, you know, students, amazing leaders. And, you know, we're so happy that you're here. And I want to just reiterate that, you know, you belong here. You are worthy and you belong here and you are amazing and so happy that you are part of this program and that you are joining the profession. And so with that, I'm just going to close it out and I will drop my email into the chat. If anyone wants to stay in touch, I can go ahead and drop that into the chat and I will stop my screen share. And there we go. So thank you all so much. And let me drop my email in here if you want to stay in touch. And if folks have any questions, I'm more than willing to answer questions or talk story. Thank you so much. You really shared a lot of good information with us tonight. As always, inspiration, and I admire your leadership. I thank you so much for being here with us tonight. You're welcome. And I also encourage our students to ask a question. You can please feel free to unmute, turn on your camera, or add a question into chat as well. This is a great opportunity. Yeah, I'm happy to answer any questions. No silly questions. I have a good question for you. Well, okay. How did you choose the academic field. Oh my gosh. It was an accident. So I really, really wanted to be a public librarian coming from a nonprofit background. It really fit with that service to diverse populations that I really, really wanted to do. When I graduated, I applied for a job at Chicago Public Library because I was still in Chicago at the time and they were in a hiring freeze. And I needed a job. I needed to eat. I needed to pay rent. And so a friend was like, Oh, I saw that there was a job at this like technical school. And I was like, I don't know anything about engineering or computers at all, but I need a job. And so I applied for this job and I got it. It was just a reference librarian. And so it was one of those things where you kind of fake it until you make it. So I went to work every day and tried to learn as much as I could about engineering and computer science. And I just kept reminding myself that as a librarian, I don't have to know it. I just have to point someone to the information. So I just have to find the information point them to it. I don't have to know everything about it. And so I was there for a year and a half. And I was kind of looking around that whole time to see what else was out there and then saw this job at UC San Diego where I am now. And it was ethnic studies, gender studies and sociology. And I have a undergrad in social and gender studies. And then I thought, you know, doing racial justice work for eight years, like, I don't have the scholarship, but I have the practice, right. I can translate that. And so I applied for that job and I don't know how I got it, but I got it. And then I ended up in San Diego at this academic library and have been here for 15 years now. I honestly can say I did not plan a state as long as I have up into that point I had I think moved every five years, five to eight years to a new city. So I've been planning to move in five to eight years, but my spouse doesn't like to move. My spouse, they are, they are kind of send their ways. They don't like change. So it's like, okay, guess we're staying in San Diego. And there's, you know, that's kind of how I ended in academia, but I still think like public libraries. I'm like, oh my gosh, people working for the libraries are amazing. I would I wanted to be a public librarian. Well, thank you. Thank you. Yeah, that's great advice. They get till you make it, but you know, use research skills to. Rebecca has a question she put in the chat. Okay. Let's see what was the process like to get a job as an academic librarian. Higher education is having issues with tenure and many people entering the field are adjunct lectures. Yeah. I think that, you know, right now, I feel like right now is a good time to apply because like a lot of other sectors we are struggling to get candidates, believe it or not. And we have the process takes so long and I think that's part of the issue at least at my university sometimes like from initial advertisement to actual job offer can be a minimum of six months. Which we lose all the good people during that time, right? So I think if you really want to be somewhere, sometimes it's patients, sometimes it's putting in multiple application at the same time. I have a good friend who applied for a job with us. We weren't friends when he applied and it took so long that he got another job offer. And then was like, you know, I think I'm gonna have to take this other job offer because I can't wait for you to decide if I'm not the final candidate. So sometimes it's just juggling that. At my university, part of the reason it takes so long is we're really, really big. So the library has a job description. It has to go to the campus HR and get vetted through, you know, different channels. And then it gets posted. We have it up for a while. We get the applications back. The screening committee goes through that. So they do a first round of phone interviews, which usually takes about a month. And then they do in-person interviews. But the in-person interview is an all day thing. So having an all day interview means that you have to coordinate the schedules of so many people that sometimes that pushes the interview out by a few weeks, right? So, you know, then they do that with maybe three candidates and then the final candidate gets the offer after the references get called. So, yeah, it takes so long. And I really feel like we lose a lot of really great people that way. Smaller colleges and universities, academic colleges and universities don't take as long, but ours is so big that that happens a lot of times. Which then I feel like somebody's like, oh my God, like we lost all the really good people of color, you know? And yeah. Wow, two months for public libraries? That's amazing. That's so amazing. So that's kind of the process with academic. And I know a lot of folks are just hiring like adjunct lecturers with limited contracts, which I think is unfortunate versus like a full faculty position. Good question, Rebecca. Other questions for folks? I want to ask a question. Yeah, go for it. Hi, my name is Halala Mo'o. I'm from Laie, Hawaii on the North Shore. Yeah, so I'm so happy to hear that you're also from Hawaii. You've lived here before. I'm native Hawaiian on my paternal grandmother's side. So I was really surprised about the statistics that you gave about native Hawaiian librarians. Yeah, so my question is basically so I'm just started at SJSU as an MLIS student. And one of the things that I want to ask is how I as a student could, I guess, promote equity and inclusion and diversity in my, I guess classes are in my maybe discussions with people or in my assignments, that kind of thing. Yeah, that's such a good question. And I'm from Oahu too. I actually grew up in Kalihi on the other side. My grandma grew up there too. Oh, really? I love it. Yeah, my mom is still there, but her house is kind of falling apart because you know a lot of the houses are built on the side of the mountain. And last time I went home, I was like, it's kind of sliding. Like, I know, it's unfortunate. Yeah, I actually went to, I'm sorry, I went to junior high school, so I was in that area a lot, yes. Oh my gosh, such a good school. I love that. I love that. Yay, connections. I'll go home that often, but next time I go home, we'll have to like, you know, go grab a coffee or something. Oh, that would be great. So I think like, what a great question. And I think like, you know, you can always bring up things like this in your assignments, right? Like, how do we get more underrepresented voices into our collections, into the books that people check out? How can we create our public services, right? So that we are being more inclusive of people, right? And it's like, you know, it could be like more inclusive of LGBT folks or more inclusive around race and ethnicity or something. I've been thinking about a lot is how to be more inclusive for people who are neurodiverse, you know, how can we create services that are more equitable and inclusive. So many different assignments that you get that you can definitely explore that. Within class, I feel like no matter what class you're taking, it's always ripe to have these discussions. And I know that a lot of faculty are starting to actually initiate that on their own, right? It shouldn't be up to like, you know, the people of color who are students in the room to always bring up these issues. And so I know a lot of faculty now are having more discussions where they're bringing in these different perspectives about things as they should. And, you know, if you haven't joined Apollo yet, we would love to have you. Great place to have all kinds of discussions about all kinds of things. So yeah, great question. Yeah. And I think I mentioned that our last Apollo executive director is native Hawaiian and she's also, as Cindy mentioned, our current president as well. She's amazing. She's a very good person to know. And she's, you know, so connected in a very genuine person. So she's someone who's always open and welcoming and that's very important. That's important in any field, but especially in ours. So I had a question about that, Alana. What would you recommend to everyone here when they begin their career? How can they help welcome colleagues and create that space of belonging? That is such a good question. I always feel like, I feel like sometimes the whiteness of our profession is so like formal, like, like, welcome to your new workspace, you know, let's onboard you and I feel like that's like, like, our style is more like, welcome, come on in. How's it going? You know, you know, I made you like a coffee cake for your first day. And I think that it can be sometimes difficult to hold on to that when you don't see that around you as much. But I feel that like goes back to that authenticity, right? Like how we present to others with that warmth, you know, with, you know, in Hawaii, that aloha spirit, that welcoming, you know, and I think especially for other BIPOC, like a lot of times like they might be the only one. So seeing another person, yeah, sharing food is so important, you know. I think I have, I mentioned before when I moved to Oregon, I was like, Oh my God, nobody is sharing food. This is, we're very much like, this is my potato chip. I'm not going to ever offer you one. You know, we went out to eat Chinese food and I had never heard the term family style before. I had just like, you go out to eat, you order a bunch of dishes and everybody shares and then we went out to eat and someone was like, we're not doing family style. And I was like, you're really going to eat that whole plate of beef by yourself. That's just, it's so, so strange, right? So I think just being true to who you are, you know, making people feel like they belong is so important. Sharing food, like you said, inviting people to coffee, you know, even virtually. I saw someone speak on a panel recently and they were Asian and they were queer and they were in an academic library and they also disclosed that they had ADHD and I was like, I want to be friends with that person. And I sent them an email and I was like, you don't know me. We have all these things in common and I kind of want to be your friend. And they wrote back and we just started like doing a little chatting on text, and then we started having little zooms. And now we zoom once a month. And during the zoom, we support our ADHD by organizing. So during our two hours of zoom, we talk story, but we also spend that time just getting organized, you know, like for some folks that have ADHD, it's really hard to create systems that keep things organized or, you know, to keep track of things and not forget things because your brain just functions differently, which in my brain shift not being organized is, you know, you're not supposed to not be organized. So yeah, networking with someone just reaching out like that. And, you know, of course, like, I'm super scared of rejection. I don't want to reach out to someone and have them be like, I don't want to, you know, communicate with you but I think somebody's taking that risk can really pay off creating that community. Well, I appreciate that. And as in regards to organization, yikes, don't look in my basement. Oh, Rebecca, I'm so glad that it's, it's successful for you. Oh, all these folks that have ADHD. And you know, this kind of goes back to what I was talking about with self care and like destigmatizing something like ADHD, right, where I think in the past we wouldn't have wanted to talk about it in a professional setting, right? We don't want someone to think like, oh my gosh, like this person might not be organized. They might not be a good librarian. This person might have trouble tracking things. But I think it's just, you know, like recognizing sometimes people's brains work differently, you know, and that's okay, right? It can be your superpower. It is really fun to just organize with someone else. And honestly, I don't think I would do it if I didn't have that accountability, right? Of having someone else help me with that. I think also having people who understand how your, how your brain works and not seeing it as a fault more is like a quirk. So I know Cindy, you know, Gwendolyn, but probably once a year, I, I call her up frantically and I say, I did this presentation last year, and I have to do it again and I cannot find the slide deck. And she'll say like, let me see if I have it, you know, and, you know, so she's like, very good at like keeping track of things for me sometimes having a good friend who can then give you a copy of something that you might lose is really important too. What's that? I love Wendy. Oh my God, I love her so much too. I miss her. I miss her, I miss her. So for those of you who don't know Wendy, she worked at the American Library Association and she was the associate director, I believe, of the Office of Diversity. And she called me and told me that I won, or I was being awarded with the spectrum scholarship. And that's the first scholarship I would, I ever earned, and that was like my fourth degree at that point. And I was so overwhelmed, I was bawling in my office and I had to get up and shut my door. I couldn't believe it. I was like, oh my gosh, all these years, all these times I always applied for things. And, you know, I know that there's always a greater need than there is availability. But it was just so personal because it's something that I really felt passionate about. And so, you know, the thing about the spectrum scholarship program is once a, once a spectrum, always a spectrum. And you know, that's a family. Yeah, well you really deserved it. You're amazing. Well, thank you. I appreciate that. But I hope that everyone can still meet Wendy in some capacity again someday because you know there's 1400 spectrum scholars and we all know and love her because she brought us on board. Yeah, and I think she's a really good example of like a really strong white ally, where she really lifted up a lot of BIPOC but didn't take up a ton of space, but really advocated and supported folks. Yeah, Wendy's wonderful. Yeah. Do we have one last question tonight? We're almost at time. I want to make sure everyone has an opportunity if they want to put anything into chat. And if you're like me and you tend to marinate a little bit before you come up with a question, you can always ship me an email and I would be happy to respond that way as well. Well, Alana put her email into chat if you don't have that open. And we thank you so much for sharing. Thank you so much for inviting me. Yes, well this has been amazing. And you, I wanted to share one more thing. A few months ago I listened to you, you were presenting on something and you said that you keep a list of things that bring you joy. And I started that and I'm up to eight different things now on my list and I keep that right here. So I appreciate that advice. I love that. Yeah, I still, I think I'm still at eight. I don't think I've added any since our last conversation. But yeah, good. That's a good self care thing too. Yeah, what brings you joy. Definitely. Well, thank you all so much. So excited to be able to spend my evening with you all. Thank you so much. And please remember to take the survey students who received the link from Pat Hartnell. We appreciate you all. We know you're busy and hope you have a good evening and steady hard. Thank you. Thank you. Bye. Good night. Bye.