 Okay, good morning, everybody, and welcome to our course on Christian counseling. It's so pleasant to see all of you. And I'd also like to welcome all our students on the e-learning portal for this class. I really hope that the next couple of weeks as we discuss about Christian counseling, we all will be enriched and we will grow in greater understanding. We will be equipped with skills also as we explore this course. So just quickly, maybe one or two introductions that would be helpful for us to have some form of an interaction. So if you're comfortable, a quick switch on of your video and just your name and where you're from and maybe what you're doing. A couple of minutes and then we can move ahead. Who can we start with? Jefina, you're on mute. Yes, Master. I'm sure you already know me a little. So I'm Jefina. I'm Stamela. All right. Welcome, Jefina. Yes, anybody else? Be nice to just know your names, maybe just a quick show of your face. Anybody else? Hi, ma'am. I'm Divya. Hi, Divya. Yeah, I'm basically from Kerala. Okay. But now in US. All right. Thank you. Welcome. Hi, Sebastian. I'm from Patna. Welcome. Welcome, Sebastian. I'm from Lubega. Thank you. Thank you, ma'am. Hi. Hi, Ruby. I'm myself, Ruby. I'm from Orissa, Ralkilla. Okay. Welcome. Welcome, Ruby. Hi, Pastor. Hi, Pastor John Paul. I'm John Paul. I'm basically from Kerala at present in Maglam. Welcome. Welcome, Pastor. Thank you. Anybody else? Or we could get started. Yes, Lubega. You're on mute, sir. You're on mute. Okay. My name is Lubega. Colin. I'm in Kigali, Rwanda. Thank you. Welcome. Welcome. What time is it there? Right now, the time is 20. It is 27 minutes to 7. 27 minutes to 7. That's in the evening, I suppose, right? It is in the morning. Morning. Morning. Okay. All right. Okay. So welcome. Welcome, everybody. Welcome to the rest of you as well. We keep going. So I think, you know, in while we are, while we start with this class, I think one of the most important ways or methods to learn better in this is through interaction. Counseling is not something that actually is really a teaching subject. It is actually a doing subject, you know, something that you need to be involved in. So the better the learning when the participation is greater. So I'd really want to encourage all of you to stay keen to get it because I think that's how you will learn. That's how your classmates will learn. That's how I'm also going to learn as we go forward through this. All right. Give me a minute and I'll just, I'd like to just share my screen. Just give me a minute. Are you all able to see my screen? Yes. Okay. Yes. All right. Okay. So I think we'll just get started. Sorry. I'm just going to be moving through a couple of slides. Just, you know, just, just getting straight into the important things. Okay. Now, even as we, before we get started, I'm going to bring about a certain question or a, you know, a scenario to you and help. And I'd like you all to tell me how would you respond. Now this is, this is a scenario that is a woman who comes to you. Her name is Susan. Okay. And she comes to you and she says this. Okay. She's sharing something with you. And I'd like you to think about how is it that you're going to respond. Okay. So Susan says, I don't know what's wrong with my husband. He just doesn't allow me enough space to just be me. He always wants to pry into what I'm doing, who I'm talking to. I'm having quite enough. I have second thoughts about this marriage. Okay. So this is what Susan's told you. Quickly take around 30 seconds to quickly write down. What is it? How would you respond to Susan? So basically you're going to write down a statement that you will be. Suppose I'm Susan and I'm talking to you right now. And I've told you this. I want you to come back and write and state to me. What is it that you would? Okay. So 30 seconds quickly put this down on your paper. And I'd like to hear some responses. Okay. Don't worry. There's no right, wrong, correct, best answers. Remember, we're learning and that's what we are attempting to do. Okay. So go ahead. Yes. 30 seconds. Okay. If any of you are ready to answer, please, you know, quickly unmute and answer. Don't wait for anybody else. Just quickly unmute and respond. Okay. So we don't waste too much of time and we can optimize our time here. Yes. Go ahead, Divya. Go ahead. Yes. What would you say? Yeah. I think I will ask her a question back. Okay. Just to know, like, since I have only one side of the issue, so I just want to know, like, how much time do you talk to each other? Okay. So you will bring forth a question. You would want to know some more information. How much time do you talk to each other? Good attempt, Divya. All right. Thank you. The others? I would ask her, what does the Bible talk about this second thought about this marriage? What is the Bible perspective about her? That will help her to get engaged into talking and then we tell her, so we need to talk to him and then we go to other steps. But I would tell her that second thought is not there. We wouldn't have it. All right. So you would question the second thoughts that she has or ask her, what does the Bible say about it? Okay. Thank you. I think Rosalind has written, you would say, be patient, Susan. Don't jump to this conclusion. Okay. Good attempts. Others. Come on. I think there are some 13 of us in the group. And I'd like to hear answers. So don't worry about right, wrong. This is learning. And this is where you can just make attempts. Yeah. For me, I think I have tried to calm her down a bit. She looks very frustrated with the situation. So if I say, Susan, you look quite frustrated. I understand your situation. Okay. Let's just talk about it and maybe that helps. Okay. Okay. Wonderful. So Jeffina says, I'll just not get into any of the details. I'll just be with her, be present with her with the emotion she's going through and just help her to calm down and just help her to maybe discuss more. Wonderful. Jeffina. Thank you. Yes. What about the others? Yes. I would tell her that she cannot develop a fence around herself because as long as she is married, she has to cope with her husband and at least the husband deserves the right to know a little bit, not maybe all, but a little bit about what she's doing. So let her don't build a concrete wall around herself. It can be not good for a marriage. Okay. All right. So I know it's okay. Wonderful. I like your answers. Okay. Others? I would say thank you for choosing to open up and it is very important that we open up and I would appreciate her heart to start sharing and would like to know more details, little more details about this. So I'll patiently listen what she has to say and give her a chance to open up. So first appreciate and then listen. Okay. So you would appreciate, thank her for actually coming and opening up and talking and give her that space to talk and listen. Good. Good. Any other, any other answers? Okay. So what I'd like you to, so these are generally some of the common responses that we've heard and I think, you know, it may sum up some of the things that, sorry, it may sum up some of the things that you have also written. Right. So some of the common responses you would, you would hear like your rightly said is, sorry, are you able to see my screen? No, it's gone off, isn't it? Yeah. It's gone off. Oh, I'm sorry. Sorry. Sorry. Sorry. Okay. So some of the common responses, like we said, you would definitely hear is what we would call like maybe an advice giving. Okay. That's what we would do. We would give an advice and some of them, some of the responses that we had is, you know, you shouldn't build a wall around yourself or, you know, it's not something that you need to think about a second marriage is something that you shouldn't be thinking about. So the, some of the responses that we've given are quite in the place of giving an advice. Okay. The second kind of responses that we may given is in the form of a question. Like some of you said, I would ask her more details. You know, what are your, what is your situation really like? What does your husband say? I need to know what he's going through, what's happening. So that's the second kind. Okay. So that may be questions. The third kind of responses that we may, we may see is a kind of response that we tend to moralize. Okay. So what do we mean by moralizing is that, you know, this may not be the right thing for you to do ABCD other steps that you need to go. And I think we commonly see this among us as believers where we are often moralizing somebody who's actually discussing a problem with us. So that's the third part of it, you know, moralizing. The fourth part of this being in a place of silence, you know, not knowing what to say. And I think some of us didn't have anything to say. So we're like, okay, what am I going to do right now? Maybe the best thing to do is just keep quiet. So that's also a response. You know, when you don't bring about a response, the fifth kind of response which some of you said was, you know, just hear her out. Some of you said appreciation. Some of you said, you know, you will join and acknowledge what she is going through, help her to bring about some sense of a calm and working up, right? Now, all of these are responses. But what we are looking at is to, we need to really action as well as that brings about change at some point in the life of the of the councillor who's coming to you. Okay. Now, I'm not going to make any kind of a, what do you say, a judgment on any of your responses. We will come back to this question a little later. Okay. But I'd like you to think about your own responses and look for yourselves to see whether your responses, what you feel your responses are. Has it, is it effective? Is it somewhat effective or has it been really effective? Now, how do you judge this is when, when you understand your next line from your from your counselling. Okay. So that's something I'd like you to keep a thought on. Can all of you hear me or is it just Divya who's unable to hear me? Can all of you hear me? I can hear you faster, but in between your voice went off and it came back again. Okay. All right. Okay. In case there is another issue, please stop me and let me know. I think it's, it's maybe a glitch in my, if there is a problem just somebody just yeah. Thanks. Okay. So, so I'm going to come back to this. It's better. It's better. Okay. So I'm going to come back to this in a couple of classes and we are going to be looking at the same example and we'll work through, work through that once again. Okay. So, another question that I have for you, what do you think, what do you think is counselling? What have you, what in your reading or in the way that you've dealt with people do you think is counselling? So some quick answers. What is counselling? Giving guidance. Okay. Other responses? I think counselling is not advising as you already said. But I think it's just letting them know that they are there and let's help them to understand the situation maybe, maybe they don't understand it but when we speak, maybe they can figure it out. Okay. All right. Thank you. Yes. What about the others? I think Rosen has written to listen to someone first before giving them some help. Okay. So, counselling is a lot about being able to listen. Subash says giving time and listening. Okay. Other, other thoughts? Counselling is all about hearing somebody who has a challenge and guiding her or him through counselling is all about hearing somebody who has a challenge and guiding her or him through finding a suitable answer for him or for herself. Okay. All right. Thank you. So that, that was some wonderful attempts. Okay. So before we figure out what counselling is, I want to help you to understand what counselling is not. Okay. And so the first and foremost giving advice and it is not taking answers to their problems. So, you as a counsellor who is sitting there is not taking the position of a person who is aware and knows it all. You and I know that you and I don't know everything, right. Our, our leading and guiding comes number one. I think we need to understand that from the Holy Spirit and secondly from the word of God. And what we are doing as a counsellor is to open up these avenues for a person. So that, that would mean to help them to discover these answers or discover the solutions that they may have for their problems. Okay. So counselling is not giving advice or answers to problems. Counselling is not being judgmental. What do I mean by being judgmental? And I think often we, we hear this word is not telling or not letting a person know that they are in the wrong or they are in the right. That's not what counselling is. This is not mentorship. This is counselling. So you're not in a place or counselling is not the, the ministry is not one where you're sitting as a judge and saying, hey, this is something that you're doing wrong. This is something that you may need to change your course of action into. This is not the place that we have as a counsellor. Okay. Next one. It's not you, counselling is not the counsellor attempting to sort out the problems of the client. You are not in a place where you're taking onus or responsibility for the problem of your client or your counselling. Right. The, the, the problem needs to be owned by your counselling. They need to come to a place of saying, okay, this is a problem I have. I want to sort this out myself by the assistance, by the help or the facilitation of a counsellor. All right. So it is not, it's not you as a counsellor taking on the problems of the client. Okay. Counselling is not expecting or encouraging a counsellor to behave in a way that you would have behaved if you were confronted with a similar problem in your life. Okay. Once again, counselling is not something you would do in your situation if you were faced with the same problem. Like for example, let's say in Susan's case, maybe you had a time in your marriage that you faced something similar. So it's not saying, you know, this is the way that I faced it and maybe that's the way that you go. It's not expecting or encouraging them to do the same. It is also, counselling is not also getting emotionally involved with the client. So much so that you are, are working harder than your counsellor in order to solve their problem. Right. Or you are stepping ahead of their progress in order to work things for your counsellor. It is having a sense of involvement but also a sense of healthy detachment from emotionally getting involved because you and I know when we get emotionally involved, we probably, you know, run on fourth gear. You know, we are actually really speeding and going really fast. So being careful not to be emotionally involved. And also, counselling is not looking at a counsellor's problem from your own perspective or based on your own value system. Okay. Yes, your perspective or the values that you hold are very strong, but you are looking at the person's problem independent from your perspectives or the kind of values that you hold. So then what is counselling? The most important, and I think some of you had written that in the chat, the most important thing of counselling is it is a purposeful conversation that you engage in with your counselling. And it is for the sole purpose of helping them help themselves. Okay. I'll repeat that. There are two important characteristics here. Counselling is a purposeful conversation. So a purposeful conversation happens when there are good questions, when there are ways to help your counsellor they reflect on their own situation, reflect on their own contribution, reflect on their own needs. So that's what that purposeful conversation comes to be. And what you are doing is helping your counsellor to help themselves. You're bringing them or you're equipping them to a stage where they will begin to help themselves. So as you will see here, as we move ahead in class, you will see that counselling is more a relationship. It is, like we say in the psychological terms, it's called a therapeutic relationship. It's a relationship that brings about change. It's a relationship that supports. So counselling is seen as a supportive relationship, which means you as a counsellor have a big role to play in the development of the change that the person is going to see. So your role as a counsellor is very crucial, very vital in bringing the person to some place of positive change. So in that relationship, what are you doing? You're enabling your counsellor counselling to focus on a couple of things, on their feelings, on their thoughts, on their experiences and on their behaviour. Once again, you are enabling your counsellor to focus on how they are feeling in a certain situation, in how they're thinking or reasoning in a certain situation, what they're experiencing or how they behave in a certain situation. So quickly, I think you're having inner wholeness as a class this time. I want you to remember that as we function as people, there are three parts of us. That is the body, the soul, as well as the spirit. So whenever we come to a certain problem, there are all of these components that interact with our problem. That is the body. For example, let's say you have a fight with somebody, you just feel so tired and drained, you have a headache, you feel dizzy, your body is interacting with the problem. Or your soul, you feel very distressed, you're not able to think, you're not able to concentrate, you're not able to make your decision and your spiritual side of it. Your spiritual relationship with God, that gets also affected when you are having certain problems. So remember that it's not just about giving answers, but being enabling the counselling to focus on these three specific areas. Counselling is a trustful relationship. So in your relationship with your counselling, the counselling needs to feel empowered that they can move from a place of understanding of their problem to a place of resolving their problem through some kind of action. And that happens when they are in a place of complete trust, when they know that they can trust the person that they're talking to and the person is going to help them move into understanding their problem, moving it into a place of action or empowering them to move into a place of action. I'm going to stop here for one minute just to quickly... Do you all have any questions at this point before I move on? If not, you can give me a thumbs up and let's dive right in. Unfortunately, I can't see any thumbs up, so no questions. Okay, great. All right, so I hope this has given you some bit of a basic foundation to really understand where you're at. Okay, now, this hour, I'd like to quickly move through certain core elements. When you're looking at biblical counselling, what are some of the core elements that we are going to be looking at? And in the next hour, I'd like to look at certain principles, okay? If you are following through on the book, I am at page three. Yes, I'm at page three if you'd like to just follow through it, okay? So when we're looking at biblical counselling, we know that counselling is a fundamental task or an activity that is seen even in church. It needs to be church-based, right? Because people... If we all... We are all humans and we all can... We are bound to have difficulties. We're bound to have problems. And we have the word. We have scripture. We have the Holy Spirit. We have God who guides us and helps us through, okay? So counselling is an activity that must be based on... On the different offices at church also, okay? So it's going to be scripturally. It's going to be sound scripturally. What we counsel comes straight from scripture, from the teaching of the Bible, from doctrines that are in the Bible, okay? It is also that there are other components that we use in the context of biblical counselling and that's what we would ensure that it takes place. Now, counselling often is something that is also a gifting to people just as much as it's a skill that you need to learn, all right? You may be gifted at talking and helping people, understanding what goes on, but it's also something that is a skill that one needs to learn. So let's look at... There are scripture portions that's given in your notes. I'm not going to go through each of them. You can take time to go back and read it at your own pace. So the first foremost thing we understand and we keep as the biggest element of biblical counselling is that God is at the centre of counselling. And we know that God is the God of the Bible, the God that we believe in. That is foundational to every issue, to every problem, to every counselling or to every suggestion, everything that happens within the framework of counselling, we see that God is foundational to that, that he speaks is foundational to that. So we also say that every discipline, every discipline that we are drawing from, so when you are into counselling, you're going to be drawing in from some kind of medical science, you're going to be drawing in from humanities, things like sociology, psychology, psychology, anthropology, there may be certain things that you are going to be drawing from as you are in this ministry of counselling. But we keep that as a core understanding that all these disciplines are under the authority of scripture and nothing supersedes what is written in scripture. So like, for example, we're even going to be looking at psychology, there are going to be certain theories or principles or things that may not be sound scripturally. So we do check and we do bring it all under the authority of scripture, under the discipline of scripture. So even when you're using maybe certain methods or techniques, excuse me, you would be ensuring that it comes under the authority or coming under the bracket, under the umbrella of what scripture teaches. The third one is as we look... I'm able to hear you ma'am. Am I audible? Yes. Okay. So when we look at problems, when we look at problems that counsellors do come by, we look at it as the primary concern or the primary problem is sin. And we know and we understand that there is total depravity that brings about a sinful nature. And that is essential for us to understand. So the sin nature of man is important for us to understand what the problem is or what the condition is that people are presenting with. So that's something that we keep alert to. That sin is the primary concern that needs to be dealt with. The fourth one, the most important one is we know that the gospel of Jesus Christ is the only answer for every problem, for every problem of the soul, for problem of the spirit, problem of the body. That is the fundamental need of every person. And we know because of the work of Jesus on the cross we know that there is freedom from every kind of struggle and problems that one may come with. Now these are what we believe in and these are certain elements that we hold on to. The fifth is to know when a person is going through a process of change it should be at a progressive satisfaction with something that comes in time. So the ultimate goal is to help a person or help a counselor to come to a place of Christ's likeness. And that's the fundamental of the biblical of a Christian counselor. To bring the focus of an individual is to bring them in likeness and to bring them into the likeness of Christ Jesus through the change process. And so we see that the change process is progressive may not be in all cases instantaneous it may not happen when a clash of a second within maybe one session may take some take couple of sessions some take maybe years some may you know drop off in between but we understand we aim at the fact that whatever the work that we're doing it is to bring them to a place where they are more Christ like in nature. I'm going to just bring take off some of those. So even as we've spoken about this I'm going to be looking at some of the basic tenets what are some of the basic tenets that we look in when we are talking about effective biblical counseling. So the first and foremost point that I'd like to bring up here is of the Holy Spirit's ministry as the counselor and conqueror. So for us believers that's something we stand by that it is the power of the Holy Spirit that gives us who are engaging in this ministry of counseling that's where we get our help and our every knowledge every wisdom from okay and that is our you know our example the ministry of the Holy Spirit is the biggest example for us because as a believer in many cases as we journey through life we know how the Holy Spirit gives us the wisdom at the right time gives us the comfort that we need at the right time gives us a revelation of his word at the right time maybe a step into the right direction at the right time. So those are our principles as we work through this and something that we encourage even our counselors to work with to tap into is to finally look at the power of the Holy Spirit as the ultimate counselor and we as people are just his spokesperson or being used by the Holy Spirit to work through this entire process of biblical counseling the second point is that the Bible is the soul and the sufficient authority in counseling and dealing with problems of people so we go back to scripture at all points of time so the goal of biblical counseling is to give instructions from scripture or for your counseling to be able to find those instructions so that they can finally live the purposes that God has called them for their lives okay so it is based on the instructions, the directions the understanding that is given through the word of God so it's almost it's like your it's like your textbook okay it is a textbook for life so it is the book of how you develop a relationship with him as well as with others so it is designed the scripture is designed to bring about change or it's to bring about an alteration in the life of the one who's a believer who's one with God okay because we know and we understand as scripture shows us that the word of God is the inspired infallible word of God so we know that scripture does it has truth in it it is all sufficient it has all authority that there is the standards are never do not change as a result of time or season or situation that is what we hold on to so we know that scripture brings about correction brings about rebuking brings about growth brings about guidance brings about every kind of need that we have alright so scripture is one thing that we we turn to so that is the authority for in biblical counseling the third thing is prayer prayer is extremely important and part of biblical helping because what we are doing is we are asking for the wisdom of God to help us through this even following a conversation asking the Lord to help us sustain through things that have been discussed or bring about new forms of understanding as we go through that process so something that we do as part of our counseling sessions is sorry just to give a little bit of an understanding here as part of APC we do have a counseling center which is called chrysalis and in this center we have both believers as well as non-believers who come in and over the last couple of years we've had many number of non-believers who come in for help okay so a lot of them do have know nothing about scripture know nothing about the Bible they've heard about Jesus that's about it but something you know we do fill up a form and in that we very clearly state what our basis is okay and at the end of it we also do invite the counseling to pray alongside with us at the end so that's something that we engage our counselors in to pray alongside with them because you know even if nothing has really clicked in that entire session I've so many times seen that the prayer in itself moves the people to you know to feel something very very supernatural we go back saying and I felt something very different as there was a prayer that was going on so we know that prayer is very effective in just calling down the power of God even to a heart that may be closed into really hearing of who he is and what he desires them to do so prayer is extremely integral part of it so like we had spoken about the goal of counseling is finally to ensure that there are disciples people are made disciples of Christ Jesus okay and to make him to make them like him so that is what we attempt to do the process of which again the process is very very different for different people however the goal continues to be the same some may go through the process for years some we are just putting in a seed some you know they may flourish and actually build a lot more but nevertheless there is a goal that there is in Christian biblical counseling the personal qualities of the counselor is not just academic it's not just being good at your skills and at your work but it is also what we say as what we should be spiritual that is the counselor themselves being having a vibrant relationship with God at a place where they are they have a strong knowledge of who they are in Christ of being able to also be in tune with what the Holy Spirit has for them so that is extremely important again it is to be integral about committing ourselves to building our relationship with God to building our knowledge of God's Word having his wisdom and also helping to apply it in practical ways in short being spiritually mature so that we can be effective towards the kind of work that God calls us to do so there may be one or two more points that you will probably find on your notes but that is something that you can probably get to reading as well I am going to stop here we have around 5 to 8 minutes I want to address any questions that you may have with regard to what we have spoken now questions what are some Holy Spirit giftings that a biblical counselor needs to nurture now I am going to talk about in my personal experience something that I really desire and keep praying for is to have wisdom and discernment the gift of wisdom and discernment because there may be many times even as you are talking to a lot of times they may not completely want to share everything that may be going on because you are a new person they are also trying to engage with you building a rapport but I do see that when there is a word of knowledge there is a wisdom that has been bought out in a way that they light up because for them to know how did this counselor understand something or was it something that I have not spoken about or I have kept aside that often brings about the question how did you know that was exactly what I have been struggling with and I see that as the greatest opening for us to bring about who we are relying on what is the power that we are working with it is not my own ability it is not my skill it is not my psychological understanding of the problem it is none of that it is not a model that I am using but it is something much more supernatural you know the word of knowledge is something that is extremely a gifting that we can pray and earn for desire for more and more as we thank you ma'am and also I just wanted to ask if of course these would be required the gift of encouragement of mercy yes absolutely I was talking about the gifts of the Holy Spirit among the nine gifts but yes encouragement showing compassion compassion is a huge part of counseling in fact if you look at secular theories a few of them we are going to be at maybe in our next few classes you will see how some of this are so you know have so much biblical principles in it the way that one needs to empathize and how we need to have compassion how we are non-judgmental how we are loving, how we are patient all of that comes in this entire gamut of counseling yeah any other questions okay either we have understood everything or we have understood nothing it has to be either one of this I have a question yes at a what point we will know that we are in need of counseling I mean since we are Christians we come back to faith we just feel like going back to God coming back but what is the spot of counseling I have never heard of it until I came to God and I was in Tamil Nadu I never heard of people going to counseling and I think we don't encourage also we never told someone to go have some counseling we just tell them to go read the Bible but I think this counseling is very important for someone who is really struggling so at what point someone is in need of counseling okay we couldn't hear you oh sorry can you hear me now so the way that we look at counseling to that point looking at it through a negative lens so counseling is not just for those who have a problem counseling can also work for those who want to better themselves or who want to develop in something actually when you look at a counseling base yes a lot of people come in for counseling with problems but there are a whole lot of people who come into counseling because they feel I am at this point I want to get better at the next 2-3 points so it's not that they are in a bad place but they want to just improve and develop themselves much faster or much greater so that is definitely a good way to say now since you asked me when is the point that one needs to come in for counseling I don't think there is a specific answer to that but nevertheless there are points of time maybe when we sense that the way that we are dealing with a certain situation or a certain circumstance is not optimally helping us the strategies the coping that we have used to deal with something is not adequately helping us and we may need the support of someone else where we can deliberate and talk and engage in a conversation with who will facilitate like I said a conversation that will help us think and understand more so if all of us have gone through issues and problems that you churn it in your own mind or the more that you think about it in your own mind over and over again you may often find that you are going into a certain loop over and over again you are thinking about the same thing but the fact that you have someone to talk to gives you a lot more clarity so at points of time that you feel stuck at points of time you feel that your emotions are welling up so much that you are not able to adequately think of something that is helping you or a point of time that your circumstance is stuck that's when it's a good time to go in for counseling but I would say even before you reach that point it's always good to seek help because if you are going to someone who is going to help you what do you say break down your complex thoughts and feelings about whatever you are going through it helps to bring a little bit more clarity so you are taking the complex and trying to make it simpler so I think that's a good place to do it be proactive and take the support and the help even before you are down in the dumps and finding it really hard to get up you should be actually taking help even before that so that is a quick answer to that thank you alright we are going to be taking a break we will take a 10 minute break and then we come back for our second lecture so you could go grab your coffee grab a couple of biscuits and I will see you all in 10 minutes it's 10.51 right now and we will be back at 11 o'clock