 We call this meeting to order. The first thing is to review and approve the agenda. I'm going to assume that we have no. Amendments to made. I do have a statement that I want to make. I'm going to make it during general business and appearances. So. I'm going to hold off. On that for right now. Any changes to the agenda. Not for me. Okay. Okay. Okay. Okay. So without objection, we'll consider the agenda approved. So general business and appearances. I'm going to take a little bit of privilege here and go first. Because I am certain that many of you are as distracted. And horrified as I am by the events of the afternoon. So for the last few weeks, I am going to look at the agenda. I'm going to look at the agenda. I'm going to look at the chapter of the capital building. It's nauseatingly despicable. It's just horrifying to witness a literal attack on democracy. And as a republic, We elected officials only get to govern because of the will of the people and for a few to seek to undermine that will. The people is inherently anti democratic. statement from Phil Scott in which he said President Trump should resign or be removed from office. In light of everything that's happened this afternoon and knowing that we were going into this meeting, I just want to come that actually it makes it feel like going into this meeting is just a little more sacred than it normally does because we are going into this meeting having been elected by the people of Montpelier. And just like Congress will the business of government will go on and we are a part of that. So having said that, anyone else like to make a statement address the council on any item otherwise not on our agenda? Lauren. Oh okay we'll go Lauren and then Stephen go ahead. Thank you. Yeah I just also wanted to send my thoughts to everyone in our nation's capital right now the Congress, the staff, law enforcement, the journalists that are braving being there so they can show the story to us all. At least one person has died. It continues to be actively stoked by our president. It's a stand on our democracy. I also can't help thinking about how this would all be playing out if this was a group of people of color and it would certainly be being handled differently I would guess and I'm just also like you said I'm deeply grateful to be here with you all this evening where we can debate and disagree even passionately but still listen and hear each other out and respect each other and you know no matter what each and every person in our community thinks or feels and has passions about an issue I'm just so grateful that we you know are here and want to hear each other out and do our best to to govern together so thank you. Thank you. Stephen go ahead. Yeah I would just caution about the use of terrorism. Vandalism in broken windows and disruption is different than terrorism that's a question for another day. I want to call to your attention and raise the issue of the preemptive ultra-virage with beyond authority commitment. I don't know with whose approval possibly Bill Frazier's possibly mayor for the police to have entered into a lease purchase agreement for hundreds of thousands of dollars in equipment premature and before the CVPSA needs assessment is completed and before decision is made on whether we are going to have a different plan but to preemptively falsely assert that the equipment is obsolete and hanging by a thread this guy is falling many police departments continue to use the MCC 5500 consoles that the power supplies are known to fail but they're easily replaceable with standard PC computers the power supplies there's a three console system available on ebay right now and another nine console place is a console setup is being preserved by a dispatch facility as a backup site so for our officials to have preemptively entered into a lease purchase presuming a budget that has not yet been approved by the city council or voted on by the public is outrageous is absolutely outrageous it should be a fireball offense I would I have sought and I graded the city manager and extension so that he could go on vacation on the condition that I get the records in time for tonight the city council meeting I did not get them in time I'm told I can have them in time for the budget meeting but I sense that there's going to be a sophisticated justification for this based on a three page unsigned undated assessment of the technology we're using which creates a disguise falling and it's absolute bogus so I have confirmed I've talked to Motorola dealers that the equipment is discontinued as by Motorola but it is not obsolete it's in service in function in many places it's still listed on dealer websites and it is supported so you're being lied to by our city employees and giving him the benefit of the doubt I believe our chief was misled in order to pursue this so I I would like y'all to uh take action and uh see because if if CVTSA does come back with a need assessment if more towns join we spend a regional site and a failover site uh we won't want to be kind of our Montpelier taxpayers committed to hundreds of thousands of dollars in equipment that was purchased without authority so I'm a bit outraged if you might have heard thank you thank you um I just want to um address one of the things you said there which is to say that I um have not approved of anything that you're describing myself nor would I have the authority to do that um so that's reassuring thank you yep and Bill do you want to address if you if you don't want to that's okay but no I'm happy to because I don't think he knows what he's talking about we haven't but we have money in the budget um for consoles and obviously depending on what plan is we can alter our plans but we've not bought or leased anything that I'm aware of and I just confirmed with the chief um we're trying to get quotes but we have a budget item but we have not committed to anything so I don't know it was announced that we had a meeting with the consultants that the consoles were being installed several weeks ago I don't know anyway but there's some investigation needed here by uh preferably the CVTSA delegates who have the technical knowledge to dig into it yeah and to be clear CVPSA has no operating authority over the popular police department if they were to decide I'm reporting to Donna and Dan Richardson sir uh may or may I make a statement my camera's not working right now oh yes absolutely go right ahead the only consoles I'm aware of that were installed within the PD were phone systems okay that's helpful and they're and it's again it's an operational issue it's nothing related to the CVPSA okay all right thank you um anyone else uh want to make a statement free to raise your hands or um put a thumbs up or physically wave may or I'm not seeing anyone okay all right well thank you um so we're going to move on to appointments to the conservation fund advisory committee uh which uh for which we have two applicants and I do not see either of them present here um so I don't think there's any introductions but actually I just to check just to check um wondering if um either of the applicants for this committee are here okay um now it was not totally clear to me how many seats are available I um Bill do you have a sense of it's two okay um all right so uh there's also an appointment to be made to the public art commission we have uh one person who applied and there are um three vacant seats for that for the public art commission but I don't see um Monica here either just to check Monica is is Monica here okay um all right is there a motion uh Jack go ahead Madam Mayor I usually would at this point make a motion to go into executive session since we I think we discussed the uh conservation fund uh applicants at a previous meeting and since we because there there was that confusion about what they're applying for but um I moved it without going into executive session we uh make the appoint the two members to the conservation fund advisory committee and the applicant to the public art commission I'll second that okay right there's a motion and a second um just to be clear uh out of John I don't see John Odom on I wonder if we need to have their names in the motion probably not I don't think we do I I I I think we could probably amend the motion or just simply say that it's Wayne Fawbush and Richard the tower the tower and uh for the conservation commission and Monica D Giovanni for the public art commission that's my understanding of the second yep great okay um there's been a motion and a second uh any further discussion they all in favor please say aye and post okay great um thank you thank you page please pass along our our thanks to them as well um grateful for their for their work um all right uh so on to the consent agenda um is there if you have comments we'll do it after the if there's a motion there's their motion on the consent agenda unless somebody would like to pull anything I'll make a motion to accept the consent the consent agenda as uh Warren second there we got a motion to second um comments adana yes I really don't want it to go by without recognizing how successful the homeless task force was and good Samaritan Haven by responding that I just wanted knowledge their work and Cameron who worked on this that in reading it it looks like a really good proposal and I'm looking forward to seeing its success and likewise net zero the whole RFP is just awesome and get really excited about that and the third thing and this is a really dense consent agenda was uh removing the right on red for Taylor street memorial that'll be so helpful to transit so a lot of good work here thanks everybody wonderful yeah we agree um any further comments can the members of the public say anything right now or now is great if you like go ahead hi everybody rick tangi list could Samaritan I wish I had said this earlier but um going along with the RFP the good news is we successfully operated a shelter at the Christ church and we're able to house 15 people in other locations and we had um it we had no one that needed it by the week of Christmas and um so I just I think that's extraordinary and talk about uh elected officials and um and the city the city government working well with with us it was just fantastic and um so thank you everybody and on that score and also thank you for your support with the um street worker RFP grant super thank you thank you for all the work that you do that's remarkable that um the shelter was effectively like not needed by did you say by by Christmas or we actually closed on Christmas Eve because we had been empty for several nights and it was it was our goal right along to get people into other settings whether that be our shelter in Barry or we have something in Montpelier or a motel room so um we were able to achieve that and um that's a lot better I mean folks were having to leave every morning at 8 o'clock in the morning and be outside all day long so it was better for them and it was better for the city of Montpelier so all together I quite pleased with the outcome yeah I agree Jack go ahead seeing Rick here reminded me that I should mention over over the New Year's Eve holiday or New Year's holiday I had I was contacted by someone who was on behalf of the relative who was without housing who had serious disabilities and she didn't even know where he was if he was out on the streets and Barry somewhere and so over the period of several hours I was communicating with this woman and with the with the people from with Rick and also with Ken Russell and other agencies and by doing going through a lot of effort to find this guy and make sure his needs were met these agencies got together and were able to make sure this person was was not out on the street overnight when when he was in danger of being met so so good work Rick and uh everyone else who wasn't who isn't here tonight yeah thank you um Elizabeth did you want to say something there we go uh yeah I just wanted to give you guys a quick update on my ride um uh so it launched on Monday and um the um every day we are working with the programmers to fix whatever glitches are there um I've written it a couple of well first of all let's start out with Ann started on Monday morning uh with her photo op uh going to the high school at 715 um and uh I don't know who among you have taken my ride but I've uh written it um three or four oh four times now um I found it really easy to um I've been using the app myself um one of my co-workers Laura has been using the call center just to test it out we've done some different things the first day it was almost like a taxi service where mostly people were going along single one one one but now the shared factor is working and so um I heard from Dan Courier from Beatrans that there were three people on his ride Laura came back uh from Berlin mall today with four people on her ride uh so it's actually kind of picking up there's been a concern about accessibility and um you know we've spent a lot of time uh out listening uh in the community at Montpelier housing authority locations Econolodge and um Hilltop and one of the things that we realized that would be a great accommodation would be what are called transit phones which have been around for you know decades and um so we've written a proposal uh that GMT now has and is reviewing to put in transit phones at some Montpelier housing authority locations at the transit center at Montpelier and Berlin Shaw's at CVMC and at the Berlin mall so that someone could go up to that phone just pick it up and automatically get the call center so that cuts out a lot of the issues about people who may have um challenges using the app or don't want to have a phone uh so I just thought I'd let you know that that accommodation is in the works now any questions about my ride yeah Connor I just want to say I uh took my ride on Monday there uh just down to the post office it probably came within like a minute or two of when I requested it it was fantastic the driver nick I had a great chat with yeah it was really good to see the driver he was really bought into the idea and it actually improved his quality of life too because you know rather than just riding all day um you know he was stationary he was able to take a few more breaks um so it's really phenomenal and when I got down to the post office you couldn't see a parking spot in sight so you know right right there mission accomplished and I know there'd be a few bumps on the road but you guys are doing a great job Elizabeth so just well I'm not looking for praise I'm looking actually for public comment right now I I'm one of my friends went to um Amaro Borough uh and got a sustainable MBA and their motto was make a lot of mistakes but make them early and learn from them so if there's anything you hear if there are any problems you hear of please reach out and tell us because I'm in touch with Jamie all the time they're meeting with Bea every morning they're fixing everything as soon as we hear about it and I have to say I've been so impressed with our residents because people sometimes call and they're kind of aggravated and I go great thank you for for doing this you're part of the process and then at the end you're like well I'll keep you informed I think it's exciting that we can make this better and so people are really buying in and having ownership so it's that's a wonderful experience there are some people who are still very reticent we're thinking about going to the Attorney General's office but you know let them go we're we're doing the accommodations that need to happen so over time we're building trust and that's also an exciting process so thank you Elizabeth and just so you're aware I'm counting all of this as a part of general business and appearances even though we are currently in a discussion about the consent agenda so but thank you I thought we were doing public comment well I'm so sorry okay with public comment on the consent agenda but oh I just ignore me I just it's it's good it's good to hear about no worries all right any any further comments about the consent agenda okay there's been a motion in a second um any further discussion all in favor please say aye aye aye and opposed okay so the consent agenda passes thank you again I know there's that consent agenda represents a lot of work and really grateful for everyone who contributed to that and and the work that's going to come out as a result of this consent agenda so thank you in advance for that as well okay so that is that leads us to really the the main focus of this meeting which is the budget workshop so as I understand it bill you have no new presentation necessarily to make um now I'm unless there are specific questions that people have I mean this is your chance to pick up where we left off we can always pull up that worksheet if necessary um but I know we do have I assume that's why Tim's here mdc I should have asked him first so I know we'd asked for them to be present and you know and then after that we've got department heads here to answer any questions you may have the normal process at this point would be for you to make whatever adjustments you want to make and then the council would adopt a preliminary budget tonight and then that's the budget we would take to the public hearings the next two weeks and then you adopt a final budget after the second public hearing and that's and it could be the same as this or not and then that's what goes on the ballot yep so just to clarify um not I mean I think you said it well Bill um but just to reiterate I guess um have the goal is that by the end of this time we as a council will come out with a vote on on the preliminary budget um jack go ahead and then uh tim I assume that you would like to address the council regarding the mdc if you don't that's okay too but um then I'll I'll give you the floor um after that if that's if that's okay actually and they bill Kaplan was going to be on to do a presentation or at least a few words for the group so okay now I'm here uh good okay oh great okay so I'm gonna let jack go first and then I'll I'll turn it over to you bill okay great okay the the only thing I was going to say was that uh for the for the uh our friends and neighbors out in television land it might be good for Bill to uh put the work worksheet up and uh so that people can see what we're talking about uh yeah and and so share a screen and do with that okay that's good idea so Cameron if you could just let me share the screen that'd be great you'd be able to okay thanks no still says it's disabled well before you go sharing the screen right now let's um let's hear from bill Kaplan um from the mdc hello it's working okay great um so uh thank you for taking the time and thank you for your work on all of this um during this difficult time and and additionally I think that you know listening to the um the meeting this morning I mean this earlier today when you started um you know it does take on a whole different meaning when um um when you see this in action and and functioning at a high level and and with the support of voters and the concern of voters in mind so thank you all um let's see I'm not sure what's on right now um I can start sharing okay okay I that's it's all right if it's up it's just it was all right um so I I want I think we sent a an update um but I I have a little presentation I had a deck um and I'm you know judging by how my day is going afternoon I I'm not confident that I'm gonna be able to flip through that and and be coherent so I'll just speak if we have some questions I have graphics that can support things or we can refer back to the report that we submitted um but I think it's important to start with um you know the vision and mission that that MDC came up with after it's formed in in 2015 at the request of the city council and um you know the vision for MDC is that Montclair um is a viable and dynamic place to live work and do business but I think the mission is what really gets to the heart of some of why MDC is um such a unique economic development organization in the sense that it says to support economic activity in a way that is in line with the community values retain and cultivate the jobs uh for this area support housing and business development and promote Montclair as a great place to live and work and I think that that's a that's a a if you look at that in its entirety and you had to sum it up in a word it's it's about balance and and and keeping um a dynamic community in balance and and um what we have if you go to the board the board is a committee group of over over subscribed people who really care and understand um you know their role is not to just promote something at all costs but it's to consider it in the context of what the city council is trying to do what people have done in the past and and what people are looking for in the future so you know I I could go through everybody on there I don't know if you're familiar with the folks on the council I mean on the on the on the board um but we have we have you know a bunch of we have a group who come out of our community who are thought leaders in um community support and development and it's not just community economic development it's about how to support the community um and we have kind of I I think um it's it's a it's a board that has functioned at a high level and and any any um town or municipality or city would be really lucky to have this group and you know um I I'd love to answer questions about that if people have them because we have you know we have business owners we have people grew up in Montpelier we have people who are from the um the banking world and and from um who have served on boards and served on the city council so we really have a wide array it adds to our conversations and and the perspective that we have um we now operate without any staff um which really kind of has a working board um but what it does is it allows us to be nimble and to be much more efficient I think everyone on the board um struggled with the idea that we had a full-time person and the the the the rhythms and and time frames of economic development are oftentimes not as steady as a full-time employment maybe so we move to a project manager base it's worked really well and um it's smoothed out a lot of the issues that we had at at the onset um when we tried to kind of have a more traditional um structure um I don't think I think everybody knows that it was started in 2015 it had a five-year commitment from uh from the city council at that time for a hundred thousand dollars a year uh I think that um we are in our fourth year this year we were rolled back um from 100 to to 75 the city committed to 75,000 this year um we you know I'll go over in in in some detail um what we did this year um but I think that more importantly what we'll be asking for it tonight and the purpose of this presentation is to garner a commitment from city council um not necessarily to fund us this in this in this budget um but to commit to fund uh I think now more than ever uh economic development is is needed I think forethought and and careful planning may turn what has been a crisis into into an opportunity you know and and I do think that we have a plan and a a way to to do that um but it isn't going to happen in the next eight months and it isn't going to happen uh in the next year it'll it'll be it requires a commitment from the city of in the same nature that the original um consultant said if you're going to do this you need to commit to five years and and let it um work out because economic development is is about planting seeds and trees take a long time to grow and so that's what this presentation will ask at the end it's for you to do that we have um through um I think really prudent uh and nimble fiscal management uh created a a reserve we can sell fund for a year if we know that at the end of that we will be you know it will be replenished and supported by the city council uh I don't think it makes sense to go forward without that commitment um because to start something that is a long-term program of recruitment and uh bringing Montpelier to light and view around um areas that are already coming to Montpelier um would would leave that program and the and the and the credibility of Montpelier in the eyes of outsiders at risk in the sense that if if we start this program of promoting and saying here's who we are here's what we do and then 11 months from now someone and you know put this in their Rolodex when their lease came up in in in City X that I'm going to look into Montpelier as a place to to move our business and they call and they say oh you know what um NBC isn't there anymore that isn't something that our board really wants to start without the ability to follow through uh so I've hinted at what we'd like to do um but first I want to tell you what we did this year um with the 75 um with the $75,000 commitment we spent uh a little less than um $34,000 um what was it 36 I I'm on the wrong screen but somewhere less than $37,000 we spent um and we uh direct benefited to the community in the form of Jack's actual cash delivery of over 200,000 to more than 50 businesses uh at the height of the COVID closures I think it was um our third kind of attempt at getting um support to uh community members in there we did uh we did give a grant to Montpelier live we offered other grants to other organizations to fund kind of instant um action relief when that didn't happen our board actually sprung into action and within three days we raised over $200,000 and within 30 days we had that that in the form of checks um we had formed partnerships with Montpelier live uh and the Montpelier foundation and had those checks in the hands of businesses you know that's what this group can do that's what we can do in an emergency we're not set up for emergencies we're set up for long-term planning and and um and big economic impact but I just think you have this group of people who are committed um and so we ask for city council's commitment um to to go forward so what I'd like to I think skip ahead and and talk about um is a program that is born you know a few case studies that we have have been a part of uh since our inception I think we look at Caledonia spirits we look at rabble rouser and we look at Greenbacker um all three of those um groups uh organizations were not in Montpelier um and then we supported the city we supported these organizations in and their efforts and and got them to relocate from Hardwick um Middlesex and um Portland, Portland, Maine together just those three have contributed more than a hundred good paying jobs into into Montpelier you know there are countless others where we have had um interventions and and and and contributions they continue to contribute we support um a lot of the city's activities on potential development um be it um you know uh savings pasture or or other areas they come up from the park and garage to um the hotel and and other areas I I think um I probably stopped there since I'm way off script and just scrolling through to see if I've missed anything oh so our spend was actually not 37 it was $31,000 um and we have so we started we had the city commitment of 75,000 this year uh we spent a total of $31,645.02 and we established a project reserve of $50,000 um $708.56 which um we've uh invested in a um interest-bearing instrument at Northfield Savings Bank so with that all of that we also brought $200,000 more than $200,000 of direct relief uh in that initial 30-day period so you know I've given a few examples I've um talked a little bit about what our plans are our plan for to to turn crisis into opportunity is to target areas where people are already coming from uh we've we've seen people moving to Montpelier from Oregon, Brooklyn um some from um other places and we think that we can target those areas and bring in businesses and if you look at the rewards that we've gotten out of the three businesses that we mentioned of over 100 jobs with just three you know that all started with with three conversations um you know I I think that this is this is well spent money by the city and this year we prove our our fiscal um nimble and nimbleness and prudence by being able to kind of skate for a year while we wait for things to settle out and we ask only for the long-term commitment to you know for the city council to re-up its commitment I think that's it okay thank you uh all right so thoughts or comments so um yeah okay go ahead Connor and I'll apologize I don't think I got over email to record you know what data was sent they I just haven't seen it I think I think it was sent on the fourth okay I might have it did not come in I don't know Bill would know it would have come from um Catherine um I also did not receive it I I'll check right now I don't remember seeing it but I will check nope I didn't get anything and I just had a quick question Bill um I think if there was any thought like you said like you said you've had tremendous success bringing some of the bigger businesses in um just read in lately about Vermont law school's potential move to Burlington I don't know if it would be worth a conversation between NBC and some of the administration over there you know especially with necky moving out especially with some open spaces you know up at the uh up at the college on the hill too um you know I just feel like that might be an opportunity to at least give it a shot and a sell job in the city that we could be a good college down for them uh Supreme Court more lawyers per capita than any town we talked about I actually had long conversations with their um with their dean uh the previous team um about that and uh there was a great deal of interest um and we we have well we when I was at Vermont College of Fine Arts uh there were plans and and proposals um so I don't know I would happily jump in on that um I don't know where it's at a lot of times when you hear about something like that in the in the news it's it's a fated complete but maybe not and um are they teaming up with um with UVM I I'm sorry I'm not informed on that partnerships with UVM and there's been talk about UVM devouring them but I think where they're at right now is it's pretty preliminary discussions and they want to keep their independent status so we're a custom design for them yeah yeah well I I you know that's something that MBC could certainly um participate in I I'm gonna you may have heard a repeating theme um we'd like a commitment so that like something like that doesn't happen in a week doesn't happen in a month you know it's a that um relocation has been under consideration for at least eight years so you know that's the kind of economic development that I think we're talking about it's a really important piece and and without having long-term commitments you know I can make a call but if MBC isn't here in a year it's a it's a it's those are those conversations need to be able to persist over over long periods of time because these are kind of the slow sands of of development happen and decision-making so I don't have any report in okay well I apologize for that um I was I I was under the understanding that it went it will it will go out I I have a copy of it I I um will make sure that that's the right copy and it will be sent out tomorrow morning you know it has a lot of the numbers and things I was just looking at I I had was flipping back and forth between that report and the um and the um and the deck that I had that I was gonna go great other other thoughts or comments so uh I I guess oh go ahead Jack um I was glad you go first but that's fine yeah I uh I I'm I'm with the Bill and Connor I didn't see that either I think what I think I don't think it went out is the conclusion I've come to yeah I think that that some way you've accomplished has has really been great and and I think everyone on the council really appreciates how fast you were able to to recruit funds to to help people and they were really desperate in the early months of the the pandemic I I do really appreciate that um um one of the things that always comes up in in a discussion of this kind is whether the council has the ability to come to your councils and you know it's obviously we take action that that has effects go beyond uh our our term in uh in office you know one example we we approve tax stabilization agreements that go out for years and and they don't get the reconsidered just because there's been a change in the personnel of the council but uh but I do have to say that it's hard to at least gives me some real hesitation to say we should we should do that even as someone who strongly believes in the in the mission of the corporation and so I think where I come down is that I don't think this is likely a decision that we uh or that I would feel comfortable making tonight for one thing we get to have the report and discuss it but but for another thing I think that uh I would be interested in in seeing what the plan is for the coming coming five years and part of that I imagine I was not on the council when the initial five-year commitment was made but or I would be interested in what other sources of funds would be available to also support the corporation and supplement what what the city is is being us to commit yeah well so I think there I guess there are three parts to that one is I completely understand without that report and and again I apologize for you're not having that I'm it's completed it was completed uh we were supposed to have it on the fourth and I thought that it had been sent so that's on me that's on the board on our on our board we'll get that to you I think that on the the ability of a of a council to commit future councils in our in our third year um no I guess in our fourth year the board did not or the city council did not honor the original council's commitment to a hundred thousand dollars for five years uh we did not make um we did not believe nor did we attempt to hold that board to that commitment we think that uh you know we that the city council has a lot of discretion and knows what's best so we actually twice two consecutive years we've offered to give all of our funds over to the city council um and when the funds were cut back we said makes sense this year there's no funding we've continued to work um we've come up with a plan for a year ahead of how we might be able to self fund um through our prudence all based on the fact that that first commitment was an understanding that every board member made to five years and that uh that the council the city in general made uh and whether it happens exactly as prescribed or not we understand but it means a lot it it meant a lot to the board it meant a lot to future city councils to have that original board vote and think that this was a good idea I think the third point is that um many cities have this as a internal position so with that internal position you would fund it at whatever number for salary plus benefits and you'd get one person unsupported in that role uh I don't you know on but for that budget I mean for the same dollars for the $75,000 that we got this year um you know you would get I think it's probably one I don't know Bill can talk much more urgently about that but it's about an FTE maybe 1.2 FTE something I don't know um but the idea is here you get committed experience experts who work on behalf of the city and put all funding so you get all the plus and minus some of the behind the original mention in the FTE both the city decides and how they want to deal with economic development we've discussed this as a board we will comply I just think that um Bill it seems like you're kind of cutting out there a little bit um I'm not sure if you can still hear us um Donna is that what you were gonna say well that was part and I also wanted to say something when you get a chance next person okay um well well I guess we'll wait until um Bill is back uh so I think I'm back all right yeah um oh you're back okay yeah yeah so we lost I think probably the last 30 seconds of whatever it was you were saying what was the last thing you heard and I'll say the rest were beta my swear you just stopped finished talking about the yeah so a full time so instead of that you get a you get a board of committed professionals who are who are really wet to the town's success and balance and the future and that relates back to what how I started this presentation about you know the mission and vision this group came up with that it isn't to have enormous impact it's to actually just do more of the same in a better more efficient way and create more opportunities in a better living community for everyone so that's so that's I think that's the rationale you know um four or five year commitment and I don't think I could you know I don't think it I don't think that the board would have that same enthusiasm if if this council doesn't support you know a five we're helping everybody on the board understand that these things don't happen overnight it takes long time you know to to do that and so it would be nice to know that the current city council understood and believed in that and that's I think that's what that would represent it's not it's not a financial commitment this year um but it is a commitment that we would look to future councils to honor um thank you uh Tim go ahead and then Donna just quick about the backup bill and just and Jack asked the question about future funding and how it could be arranged and and one thing I thought about it many times since this started Eleanor Bacon's on our board Eleanor that's experienced creating development in Washington DC and was on their development corp there and so she brings a lot to our board and one thing that's interesting discussing with her and other development corps is often when they're set up the municipality this has not has an asset or assets that they entrust with the development corporation to to create opportunities for the community and and to make something happen in a place where the community wants something to happen and if you're looking at possible future vehicles if the city of Montclair has assets that might be something you want to have something happen on um our board would be great to take over that asset make it happen for you and also if it's done properly um the way the assets handle it can create an income stream that can support the future of the organization so that's a model other places use um I don't know what the city is for assets you're thinking of a project on in foreseeable future you know I think it's a lot up on 12 main depending on what happens with conversations on that you can decide that it needs to be um at least part of it have a viable building on it that might be something we could help with and if you're wanting to be a part that's the rest of the conversation but uh and you know so just wanted to throw that out as a thought jack for maybe as you think through how to keep things going that's one option thanks thank you yeah i've done it go ahead um I tend to agree with you most the time jack but I don't agree about this aspect of councils not committing future councils we do it all the time and I don't see making a commitment five years to the develop core any different than a capital plan or a change to the ordinance I do think sometimes circumstances may create a change that's for future councils to do it it's not as written like a loan is written and that commitment is absolutely firm but I would like to put something in the budget this year and then they can save it for next year because to reinstate all of it next year I think too much I'd rather see like 25 000 this year and 25 next because I do think of it as staff when Bill was talking about one full-time person and I was thinking 12 Main Street that Tim brought up I was also thinking our our tiffs you know there's things out there that we have ideas for and maybe you know there are ways in which they can even look and help us be creative with our department maybe there's a private partner out there that could help us so I would be I don't hesitate to say 25 000 for the next five years but we're not asking for that I would rather put something in there now and then add a little something next year than to try to put 50 next year that's all so just so we're clear we're asking for 500 000 over five years and none of it next year so it would be you know effectively 125 000 for the next four years it's I don't think that it has to come all from the city budget but I do think that without staff and without funding for development or or or other resources that it would be there may be grants and other or other things that the city could apply for it would fund this endeavor but I do think that you know when we look at what we've done and and what we've spent we may have become more efficient but I also think that there are big projects you know that are on the horizon that would need more funding and so that's the I don't I don't think that the initial amount was wrong I don't think it needs to be increased but I do think that it that that was about the right amount so Connor and then Dan and then I'm going to jump in go ahead Connor not saying this is the way I would want to go necessarily but would it be a preference by MDC to have a full-time position under city government and have MDC and there's sort of an advisory board for that position like you're saying some other municipalities though because to me that would like sort of in a way guarantee no that isn't I don't know if that structure that isn't what I was suggesting okay yeah I mean that that was my understanding was one of the reasons why the MDC exists is so it could be a bit more nimble than a sort of public entity that it would take advantage of some of the some of the efficiencies that a private nonprofit can have Bill I want to maybe I don't want to necessarily go into the the depths of the you know how much do we commit how much are we committing our future selves or our future successors because I think I think that's an argument that's both both sides are right on and both sides you know the fact is is that today's today's council cannot obligate tomorrow's council in certain ways which is if a new council comes in and says we don't like this they can change it but but the reality is is that you know to do any type of multi-year planning which is the reality in a lot of these larger municipalities you have to you have to commit you know it's just it would be like a business that could not commit or a household that couldn't commit to future expenses I mean it's just it's just an impart the reality but but Bill I guess what I'm curious about understanding is you know it does Catherine's report have sort of an outline for these future plans that you're you're asking for this money and and and detail that you know when you talk about going after these these entities because I think to and just as sorry to keep talking but I think the thing to that I'm curious about in asking these questions is you know how how realistic are these plans are these sort of moonshot projects where we're hoping to make something uh as a big ambitious goal or are these sort of low hanging fruit type projects that you know we think you you think with a great deal of confidence you can score some easy victories yeah it's a great question now so the we did not include our draft planned for that one of one program that's only one aspect of what MDC would do we would not shrink down and become singular in our focus we would continue to to work with existing businesses and and the city on projects new and and existing you know there there are ongoing long-term projects that we've been talking to to the city and the state about I think that there is it is I don't believe it's a moonshot it's that's my opinion it's based in example at the at the college we took and focused on several areas where we were seeing some some kind of hot beds of activity for potential students we went with directed marketing we went with social media marketing not not great expense but high quality work that was very articulate and speaking to that particular audience and it was it was very effective and so you know that's the that's the kind of thing that we would do we think that we have the budget in we have it you know you've seen our the dollars there and that we have a sunk fund there of $50,000 I think that with that money we could get that launched we could continue our existing operations but we would need to know that there's you know light at the end of the tunnel and that there's a commitment from the from this council or a hefty vote of confidence that this is what the city wants to do so that's the I think that is I think that answers your question but I'm happy to fill in any holes yeah I mean obviously the the greater amount of detail for that helps us evaluate the you know the the benefit I mean you know and making the ultimate sort of decision about this about the the benefit to it which is you know and I I think part of you know I I understand the purpose of the MDC's formation and I certainly support it I mean I think for a broader view of where we're headed as a city we need and you know either the MDC or something like it to help us attract businesses to you know think about these different ways in which the city can continue to sort of grow and strengthen and they've been and you point out some some examples you know such as Ravel Rouser and other businesses that have come into the city in part because of the work that MDC has done but you know it's it's in part trying to figure out you know what what what are the specifics because I think that can be a little bit of them and I use the word moonshot but only because I think it's you know there are some of these type of projects that you know are bigger stretches and obviously we're not going to be like some some large municipalities willing Amazon or something like that no um nor would we want to I think that's the beauty of what Montpelier is is that the scale and the and the and the function and the size and the character attracts you know like-minded businesses you know I if you look at if you look at one conversation you know and this is why I think you just need to get there will be I will state a few of my foundational beliefs that the and the board's foundational beliefs that there will be organizations in the next five years moving to Vermont from these locations and we do not we do not believe there are many if any better places for those businesses to land than Montpelier if you say that there are going to be 30 and we take one for example we we look at Greenbackers which is based in New York City they're they're a renewable energy fund they were they had their operations center in Portland Maine with one conversation they were interested in Montpelier they then moved here with with one employee really with the plan to have three they quickly went to six and they now have 21 they had no investment in the state of Vermont they are now the largest renewable energy owner and producer private in the in the state of Vermont so I mean that's the power of this type of program so yes it's a moonshot but to get one of those 30 businesses to come here is not an unrealistic I would I would hope that we could do better than that I think that Montpelier is a is a situation where given enough information the right decision makes itself and that decision is Montpelier you know and I and I really think that we have project managers we have board members and experience to to really benefit and and I think that you know when we look at what that total funding is for that um you know it's it's about probably 78 I think I'm going by memory but I think it's around $78,000 over three years that we would spend to likely get two three businesses here and in that money are our grants that we would promote then and direct grant to those to those businesses and other businesses so you know I think that it's a it's it's a reasonable outlay it's in line with Donna's $25,000 a year that program um that said I don't think that Montpelier would be a singular focus we wouldn't go down to being a program administrative board we we'd maintain the wide scope because other issues exist and will come up that NBC can play a role in that would benefit um the city um thank you um so uh just so you I mean you and I have I've chatted about this a little bit um but uh just so so you know where my head is at with all of this um just for the purposes of of this year uh when we formed the MDC uh it came out of meal rooms and alcohol tax money which was designated to go towards infrastructure and economic development which obviously this year has been decimated uh and so it makes sense that okay so the one of the logical steps there is like okay we're not going to um put money towards the MDC this year particularly since the fund that um it's supposed to come from is not there um you know when I think about all the the projects moving on to the future I mean it feels like there's lots of exciting potential um and I certainly want us to um be able to to do those things I I you know I want to see how the how the um the uh meal rooms and alcohol tax recovers which I want to recognize is a little bit like um you know when times are good you put money towards it and if times are bad we're just we're just not going to um but uh that so that's that's one lens that we can look at it through is how how does the um how does that fund recover um so that's that's one question that's sort of outstanding um and you know like I I see the MDC continuing and that's great and with that I I could picture um I would I just want to put out there that I would love to see us have greater collaboration if that makes any sense especially as at least in the present form we're the sole funder um then there's there's I mean even like Connor was doing it like hey here's an idea um so what are the what are the mechanisms that we have for communication about you know when when we hear about projects how are we getting that to you and likewise how are we getting you feedback as to you know what's what's working for us and so I just want to put out there that um that that's something that I that I'm thinking about um now all that is also to say that um you know in in asking for like a five-year commitment you know and you know Dan brought up like is debating like what that what the amount is right now that that feels like um a separate conversation particularly from the the budget question now um because like it let let's say we were to vote to you know make equipment for another five years it probably wouldn't be tonight it would probably be another time and particularly without um without that report um you know it'd be nice to have all all the information yeah so um well this what we're proposing does not have budget budget impact so it isn't tied to the work you're doing right now in the sense that uh that's it it's much more about you know kind of getting programs going we were we are I think that the the the zero funding was while not um unreasonable at all I think it's a message and we want to interpret that message and we want to understand whether it's it's it's a it's a pause or it's a it's a change of course because if it's a change of course then we have you know kind of serve the five years and we can wrap it up you know so those are the those are the I think it is it it is a decision point obviously not tonight and and the the only time pressure on it is that I think that there's I think that we kind of um swim in a circle for a little while until the council has the the information and the and the ability to take the time and and make this the decision but that would be that would be the request I mean and it's we're here because it's budget because we've been a part of the budget because this has impact on future councils and future budgets but it's not tied to the calendar like the budget right well I just also want to recognize that I mean I think we have all we all the same goal of wanting Montpelier to thrive it's really just a question of what is the best way to get there and I think when we um I'll just put it out there I picture having this conversation again potentially sometime soon but to uh together with that have a robust conversation about what what are our options and what are we deciding for or what are we leaving um and that that's a yeah um that's a bigger bigger discussion um and one worth having even though we've sort of started started that um here um so any other thoughts comments about this yeah uh Lauren go ahead man can you hear me okay my yes I know okay great um I guess I I think the way I'm thinking about it it it really builds on what you are laying out and I mean to me I think you know we're gonna be coming to you know through this pandemic and economic upheaval and so I think the mission is going to be more important than ever and I think we all agree with the mission and I think the way I'm I'm thinking about it is that kind of collaboration and flexibility and transparency and like to me I think I think it's it's a two-way street of us you know if we're going to say we we want to commit to this over a longer term you know maybe there needs to be more clarity from us on you know what kind of um what do we need to be seeing that we feel confident that that's the kind of investment we're going to make of taxpayer dollars over the longer term I feel like I you know I wasn't here for the origination of it and so it's been less clear to me I think of what what the goals and what the outcomes have been um and and you know but I think like we're gonna we're gonna need to be doing this work and so if if we can work together and get to the place where there's confidence that you know this this group of folks that are you know wonderful you know committing all this volunteer time to try to think about this for our community and then the funding in it so you know I would love to have the conversation of how you know what would we need to see that we would feel like yeah that's the kind of thing we would anticipate investing taxpayer dollars when we know it's up against other really important community needs as well um so I guess that's just where um where my head is at and I think you know what I tried to do with that with that one example of this year where the city committed to 75,000 we spent 31,000 some odd dollars we put away 50,000 dollars in a rainy day fund and we have um contributed in one in one effort one of our aspects not all of them there are many others that you know we haven't kind of talked about here but the but in one um program we put 200,000 dollars back into the community so for 75 you end up with a 50,000 dollar rainy day fund and 200,000 dollars of direct support to to downtown businesses and I think I didn't say before but we talked about rooms and meals tax or it was brought up I think that the idea that this community supported those those places and and um through Montelier alive uh their work their great work a lot of people's work you know we um we gave the initiation and and and founding funding for the the COVID navigator um who's been supporting businesses all through this you know there's a lot of little things that that we don't do all of but we initiate and and push along and fund so you know it's um one of the early conversations that that this board had was you know do we we're in this political arena right we take political money we take money and there's going to want to be answers and there's going to want to be you know what'd you get for the money how'd you do it and everyone on the board to a T said we don't need the credit you know and I think it's both helps us work with other organizations but at the same time it leaves us a little bit in a situation here where you say well what do we get for our money and and so there's a lot of little pieces that we contribute here and there um that that add to that so I understand the issues I think um I feel comfortable that this has been a good conversation about the issues it doesn't have to be decided now um you know I I think we can we can kind of tread water and and wait to hear um you know when would be a good time to to finish the conversation and and flesh out the the best path for the city you know no one on the board is is going to be offended or upset if this goes in-house or if this goes somewhere else you know the the goal is to do what's best for the city and again you know that that came through every time that there was a question or a need we've offered the funds up again um you know so we can we can you know no one's gonna no one's gonna stop rooting for Moctelia if if MDC goes away so you know we fully support the process here wherever you go thank you um Bill go ahead yeah just briefly you know I think we should recognize that we do need resources for economic development we've talked about this for a long time and and you know I've obviously talked with Bill Kaplan a lot so you know how that's structured um you know there's a lot of ways for for the newer folks in the council when MDC was formed there was an economic development strategic plan and I think at that point it MDC's you know mission so to speak was to implement that plan and the presumption was that you know there was a year one year two and that they would report to us how they you know sort of where they where the efforts were with regard to that plan and for a lot of reasons things went astray and now you know recently and you know some of the staffing on their end now they've had they had some bad luck getting started um frankly with some good people um you know but having funds in reserve whether they're city funds or MDC funds not only for rainy day fund as Bill mentioned but you know you never know when there's an opportunity we might need you know ideally that perhaps MDC could put money down on a property at least a down payment to hold you know hold an option or something like that it is a third party so so I think there's a lot of things you know with regard to committing future councils I think you know many people are right if we just say hey we're going to get you know we're going to appropriate this much money over a period of time that is subject to the annual budget review if uh if a contract or or you know we you know I see Tim I'm not thinking of Tim but you know we have a lease with Tim's family so that that is a commitment over a period of time future councils have committed to that we went through the process and we've signed a lease and that is stronger than just an annual appropriation um so you know maybe an idea would be to distract some sort of agreement where we talk about what are the deliverables what are the risk things and obviously understanding that they can't guarantee so much on the grand list or anything like that but you know resources to do certain things um and make clear you know about what you know if the city's spending money on something you know is that something they could be doing or could we have access to that funds I mean through them obviously um you know so maybe we can think about you know a smaller group of us maybe Bill and I or Tim and the mayor or something you know sitting down and kicking some of these ideas and maybe what the outcome of this meeting should be is that we come back with a proposal you know a recommendation of the council on how this might look and how funding might look and what that funding may be for because they're you know there's advantages to having an in-house person there's also advantages as we know to having it be a non-city entity because they can do things that the city can't do and um you know it would be ashamed to lose some of that flexibility too but if we are the funder we need to make sure we're we're uh you know we know what we're getting even if it's just a service not necessarily a result so right two cents um Dan did you have something okay go ahead no I I just want to pick up on on what Bill said um because I think that's the point I was sort of driving to earlier which is I really like the idea of having a defined and whether whether it's an MOU a memorandum of understanding or something similar um I like that idea of defining you know what what our relationship is between the city and the MBC and and the expectations and you know it understanding that you know if we had done that at the beginning of this process we would have had to revise it because of the the various issues that the MBC you know encountered along the way at the same time I think that's a really good process to go through um because it does you know it does cause us to sort of check in to see what the mission is of the MBC what's it's what is it delivering and that way we don't have this sort of periodic where question of well are you what are you expecting to do or even having the MBC you think you know um now I've got to sort of justify why we're doing this I think it helps it helps define the mission for the board and makes makes their job easier and then it gives the city council some degree of of certainty um that you know we are making this investment for a particular purpose um so I I really support Bill's uh thinking along this and it mirrors the direction that I'm headed as well great thank you um any further comments about this about the the MBC because it this feels to me like the the beginning of the conversation um and so hope to have you back uh sometime soon yeah great so to be continued um any any further comments from anyone thanks thanks for the presentation bill and him and for your work sure thank you all very much for what you're doing uh and and that report will go out tomorrow morning super thank you okay thanks take care you too all right um so on to uh the budget more generally um there so think the way to uh proceed at this point is are there any um changes that folks would like to propose to the current version of the budget um uh Connor go ahead um I was thinking a bit since um we got that request from sustainable Montpelier uh to put them on the ballot um for $20,000 to um continue the the CAN program and you know I gave it a lot of thought and I I don't I don't think necessarily it's a good idea to honor that request and put them on the ballot I think it opens up the floodgates a bit um I think it has the potential to get a bit out of control but I was thinking you know over the course of the pandemic one of the things that I think has impressed me the most um about a responsiveness to the needs of residents has been the implementation of the CAN network uh that you set up there mayor um you know I live right in the Wayne shop area here so the Wayne shops are my neighbors and a lot of the folks just on the streets you know they don't have access to internet necessarily uh when I was talking to a fella he was like I wouldn't even touch a cell phone like so haven't CAN go out there uh disperse flyers um do real sort of like grassroots organizing I consider grassroots organizing um and setting up these different chapters where they think about 20 different local leaders um to me that was extremely effective and it's something I would not want to see um disappear in the coming year um especially not until we're through the pandemic so I realize like you know it kind of relates to the last conversation too because I also don't really want to get in the habit of just you know having a line item for a particular organization that asks for it um so what I was thinking was I want to see the CAN network continue and I think that warrants $20,000 on the budget um whether it's sustainable Montpelier I would imagine they would be the ones who would continue doing it um but maybe it's not a free ride maybe it's an RFP process where they would bid and you open it up and just as like Dan Bill you guys are talking about the last one you have a very specific set of deliverables for the next year so that's what that's what I was thinking I told them or I asked Dan Jones if you could put the other bit of a list and I think you sent it out to the council just of what CAN has achieved over the last year there and uh definitely definitely syncs up to what what I've seen them do so you know that would be my proposal to put $20,000 in addition on the budget for the CAN network uh that could be managed by an outside entity but would be in control of the state on how we set or for the city on how we set that up so um I just want to voice that I think that is um probably a good way to go I I appreciate the RFP process it does feel like a city service um and I also would like to see it continue um but uh having some kind of like as Dan was saying previously having an either an MOU or a contract um so that there's expectations on both sides and again so that like feedback can be given like this is going well this is not this other part is not going well or whatever um I think that's that's really um important and that would give us uh space to to do that so I just want to put that out there that is um something I I'm also interested in um other thoughts though uh Lauren go ahead yeah I I like this proposal um I mean I definitely like the idea of again parking to our conversation we're just having clarity of you know what is it that is a service to the community and laying that out and being really clear with expectations um it's my only question is you know is there is there a core difference between this and the things that we fund through and I'm spacing on the name through through our uh where we fund non-profit the community fund um you know is that a place where you know should we be encouraging them to apply to that or would or allocate money this year but for the future um that that would be a more appropriate way to do this or is this such a core function of um you know we're basically asking them to do services directly for the city that is what this RFP would be and so that's why going this route makes more sense um well so that's a great question um I think it does come down to just what you're saying is what is the idea of a capital area neighborhood network a function of the city of the municipality and um I I feel comfortable saying yes because it actually originally was a function of the city not that long ago which kind of fell by the wayside and but I think it had value then and I think it has value now and in part I I see it as relating to democracy actually in terms of making sure that people get information that they are heard um so particularly for those who you know may you know are not as digitally connected that that kind of thing so um anyway that's my answer to that but others have my others may have other other thoughts I saw Donna then Jay go ahead my comment is I feel can has been able to do what they did because they're also out there in the community with microtransit and now with my ride I mean they're really multifaceted in the community and otherwise I don't think they could do what they do for twenty thousand dollars and so I'm really hesitant for this next year to make it an RFP I feel we can build on this base they have a better assessment than maybe definitely it'd be helpful to have an MOU of some sort and I just as we have it in the budget as to go in the ballot so I would tend to put it in the budget but I wouldn't go through the RFP process this year just a jump in sorry I would be okay with that just as there's some level of accountability I think so you know MOU something like that yeah because on the one hand it's really just a question of are we setting aside money for it and then the process of how we go about go about paying it you know whether it's through an RFP or we say you know no it's definitely just this organization we can still we can yet have that conversation um yeah go ahead um yeah just to follow up on that I think that um I agree with Lauren that sort of making sure that we have clear expectations obviously this would be funding a program with Ian Sustainable Montpelier Coalition it's one of many things that they do but acknowledging that the CAN program is is important specifically to the city but having an agreement on what um what that return on investment is and what expectations are um knowing that this is in a budget that it's a follow-up on that's what I think the next level is knowing that this is in a budget that starts on July 1st um not tomorrow um that what does the CAN program look like in July 1st as you know things are changing and as we as um you know certainly around the pandemic what is what if we were to invest with my Sustainable Montpelier Coalition and I'm all for it I mean I think they've proven their their value on a project like this um what would they if we did fund it then starting on July 1st what does that CAN program look like and then how do we partner with them through that through that next fiscal year to to um make sure we're getting most of our from our investment yeah yeah that that makes a lot of sense particularly as um you know as the vaccines roll out as slow as they may be you know one hopes that um you know their role may may change it may look different um or but but so beyond the VEX beyond COVID does capillary neighborhoods still have value um and I think it does I mean yeah I would argue that absolutely it does it it may look a little bit different than it does now and what it has over this past year but um uh I think it definitely has value as we look at you know developing communities um or community and within neighborhoods in Montpelier absolutely yeah fair enough other thoughts on this okay uh Donna go ahead so do we actually make a motion to put it into the budget before we close this hearing I think we would we don't necessarily have to do it right now but um I mean do you have to wait we have 13th I mean I'm just asking so you're gonna have to make a motion on a budget tonight so you can either go as you consider each item to vote whether add and then vote on the final budget or you can just I can add it in as a draft number but I suppose it would be good to get a sense of the majority wants it in as the draft number before you take a final vote I guess yeah sorry um yeah I guess my my thought would be that like let's um see if anyone else has other things that they want to bring to the table and then we can you know consider them all together does that seem reasonable okay um Jack oh gosh three hands um so Jack and then Dan and then Lauren go ahead um I I think I'm interested yeah I think that what they've done has been of real value to the city what I'm interested in and not really seeing is what the $20,000 is going to pay for is it for staffing is it for you know what what materials what exactly and I think that that is what I'm interested in it's a good question um Dan go ahead yeah I I share that concern which I think you know we've we've all been voicing in it similar to the MDC proposition the other part that I guess I wouldn't want to necessarily add it tonight only in the sense that I I think when there's two choices we have to make with some of these additional what I'm deep dub is where these um uh is whether we want to add them to the budget or whether we want to put them sort of as separate allocations to the voters to approve and in the sense of you know the argument that could be made for and I support the work the can is doing and and I support its addition into the into the budget um but my one concern is that I think a number of these very good programs you know that are worthy of consideration may also be something that we want to put before the voters rather than giving them sort of a single up or down on the budget as a whole some of these additional features you know it may be a benefit for the voters to be able to review them separately um and and make those judgments on their own um I think that's that's a consideration that we can probably make it once once we have them all consolidated together um those particular requests but I I put that out there that I don't necessarily see every one of these being an in-budget um type of allocation I would certainly support some of these being put separate sort of petition items just to clarify Dan when you say some of these things are you are you what other things are you referring to oh I'm just I I I'm really only thinking of the can which is the only thing before us but it's but we do find these quote unquote worthy's you know that that which is to say things that we we believe have merit um that have benefit to the city and the citizens but um you know I think that we wanted just it's a balancing of that consideration which is to say you know these programs may be great but if we add them all to a single Christmas tree um people may want that option and I know we we've made certain statements to say you know we're trying to keep the budget as close to level as possible and and I think that's sort of splitting that halfway is to say you know we have these additional items um and I should say I'm not not on the I just want to simply offer this as a general idea rather than for specifically for can but under the category of the worthy's um that that we may want to give the opportunity or option um to have those have the voters make that decision whether it's important enough for them to approve it separately um as opposed to simply I approve the budget because I I voted on the budget in general if that answers the yeah yeah I think that answers it um I have more thoughts on that but they're still percolating um so we're gonna go Lord and then Jay yeah I I was just curious about and I don't know for those who I haven't had a chance to to talk with any of the folks bringing this idea forward um from from the group like are people envisioning this as a long-term commitment like would this be the start of a you know asking annually for $20,000 to keep this program up and running are there some upfront costs that make an investment now they're getting some infrastructure in place um you know buying things that will last a while or is it is it you know are we committing to something longer term that we should be aware of and I don't know if those folks who conquer or and or anyone might um have some answers to that um go ahead Connor no like I think the way I I see it is they're still kind of finding their footing and uh what can looks like you know post-covid might be very different than what it looks like in the next you know 12 uh you know 16 months here um I uh you know I didn't jump in much on the last conversation but I really don't believe in committing another council to a future appropriation so if I made this motion um it's it's for next it's for this coming year um I don't you know we might say it's um element that's used after COVID I don't think that's going to be the case um just having seen the work that they've done so far um especially seeing Laura on the ground there but um yeah maybe it goes away so I I don't see this necessarily is committing into a multi-year funding source um Jay and then Donna yeah sorry just a quick point and this is to follow up to Dan's thoughts on you know what we like bake into the budget versus what we put on as a valid item I do think it's important to remember maybe this is you know for our next meeting or or a conversation um in the coming weeks but I do think it's important that if we are breaking them out and asking these organizations to um uh ask for funding as valid items and we're also asking them to commit resources to support those valid items in the community um and so for a small nonprofit and um you know who's looking for you know funding for like a small for like a project like can um if if we put it on as as valid item then then that you know there there's a responsibility to try to get the vote out and support you know for the community to support support and vote yes for that um hopefully the the community would see that value but I do think it's um as we're looking and making these types of decisions I think that seeing how the those those organizations would need to allocate resources to make them successful programs I think is important yeah any other thoughts on the can item oh yes Donna right I'm sorry go ahead I just was in reading what Dan Jones sent us as the scope of work it's all about as Ann said information information and there's some flyers and there's some kiosks in the neighborhoods so people could gather and read information but it's really people power that I see all their events it's all about one year they don't talk about or list anything that would involve money for ongoing years it just seems very specific to events and passing on information and all the different ways that people especially those who aren't on social media would need so I feel very comfortable that it's not promising anything for multi years I'm also not as optimistic as you all I see next year being very difficult financially is going to get worse before it gets better and so I think you know 2023 they might be a different need but I'm afraid this next year people are going to need it more in the same way they've been doing things that's all yeah I'm going to jump in here and then Jack but getting back to Lauren's question about like is this long term I I'm going to go ahead and say that because I see this as a function of government because I I see this as promoting participation and you know outreach to our to our residents I I see this as a long term thing I mean it was a part it was a like I said it was a function of government previously and I I would like to see it continue that is of course subject to the decisions of future councils but but I also see that as as this money is tied to the idea of neighborhood scale networks and outreach and and whether that's SMC whether that's a Vista you know hired by the city whether there's some other entity that's able to do that whatever that's fine but it's but that is a function that I that I see is is important to municipal functioning so yeah that's a kind of a long longish answer don't go ahead yeah I'm just so glad you brought that up because as far as can is concerned I'm with you 100 I think eventually it'll probably come in-house but I was just thinking as far as this particular designation to sustainable Montpellier as not necessarily being an ongoing promise or building up sure right but I'm really glad you brought up can itself I think it was really sad that it got disband yeah I think it has a lot of good uses I think social justice committee could tie into it amazingly so as we work in the future to bring in communication and community involvement with social awareness it's actually it's all just building off of that I that's one reason anyway why I would support it being in the budget and not separate because because I see it as a function rather than as like a gift to a particular organization it's there's a there's a I see the money is tied to a mission rather than an org but you know that's yeah yeah to be told uh Dan go ahead yeah no I I I agree as well and you know I guess I I analogize can a little bit too it's almost like a communications infrastructure yeah for the for the city whether it be for the social and economic justice components for some of the homelessness task force work for COVID relief I mean I think we've we've seen again and again the the work that they can and are able to do and so I I certainly support it I you know I just don't want to be clear that I'm suggesting separate valid items I think really as a conceptual idea rather than for this one and I'm only bringing it up because this is maybe the first of of one of these type of projects or type of funding that you know we're breaking a little bit of new ground with it or picking up where we have it in the past and I think we do have to just be careful how we balance that out with the overall budget yeah that's fair um sorry jack yeah thank you I apologize I I I think there is value to this I think that this ties into the conversation that we had last at our last meeting of how do we manage in this year of the pandemic when the state has not suspended the signature requirement for items to be placed on the ballot how do we manage requests coming from outside organizations to be placed into the ballot and we didn't make a firm decision last time but one of the concepts that we talked about last time was that we might choose to only suspend the signature requirement and place outside organizations on the ballot if they had previously petitioned to be on the ballot and been funded by the voters as a separate item and by and then be asking for no more this year than they did in the previous year and so that for instance is justification for putting home health and hospice on the ballot which I think we all strongly supported that makes me think and if we were to vary from that I'm concerned that every other organization that does valuable work could decide oh well a city council isn't requiring petitions I'll show up next time and and put our request in to be added to the ballot too and I'm not sure that that's a direction that we want to go in um granted that the fact that we did it for one organization does not strictly bind us to do it for another organization but we potentially look bad to to the community and to the people coming to us asking that if we don't have a principled rationale for why we're doing it for one organization and not for another um taking that together with and and there are other things that come under the policies and relationships and community enhancement section of the worksheet that Bill has up in front of us that could come within that that same scope and putting that together with uh what I'm hearing from Ann and uh some other members uh Donna at least that this really seems like um at least instrumental to city functions if not a core city function makes me think that if we're going to do this I would say that it should be within the budget rather than a than a separate item when I came into as I was thinking about our meeting tonight what I was thinking was that I'm basically happy with where we left things at our last meeting and I didn't have an agenda to either add anything to the budget or cut anything out of the budget from what we had on the on the worksheet last time um I am okay with uh with putting in the money for uh for can for this but as I say if we do what I would prefer that it be part of city budget rather than uh outside agency request enough um thank you uh Bill and then Lauren um so first of all obviously this is your policy choice a couple things to think about with regard to to those last comments which is um you know I I I'd have to support or or agree with you as far as uh agency funding uh you know cvh each got their request in at the very beginning of the budget cycle and there was lots of time for them to petition even in a pandemic between then and the deadline of of january 21st um this request came in you know there isn't really even if we wanted to it'd be very difficult for the 600 signatures basically in two weeks um and so it is a different thing um but there's another distinction that could be made and I'm not trying to urge you to do this or not but just to help you think about it which is you know we have reduced a lot of funding and held our core functions of government down we've cut our capital plan and and many other things if we went up the list this is something that's new and expanded so you know it's one thing to say we're putting this on as funding to if you were to choose to put on the ballot it's one thing to say we're putting this on as funding to an agency because they asked us to it's another thing to say we've we're giving you a bare bones budget and this is a new add on service that we'd like to add and um you know this is our ask not sustainable popular coalition you know this is a service we'd like to deliver with a discussion later of how we're going to do that so so if you wanted to do a ballot thing you I think you could make a differentiation as well as anything you could say other things even from the budget you know we think these are essential these are things we've always funded but we want to give them to the voters I typically don't support that I think that's what you all get elected for to make those decisions but you know there are there are a lot of people and organizations and even our own departments that are taking taking cuts and restrictions so I think the other question ask yourself simply from a policy perspective is you know if there were 20 000 is this where the next 20 000 would go versus anything else on the list that we've sort of already resolved but you know when we put 20 000 more in the housing trust fund or would we 20 000 more in the capital plan or you know wherever I'm not advocating for any of those but I think that's that's the important consideration here as we try to reach the end game all right back to you all well lord go ahead uh yeah just a couple thoughts um I mean for one thing I I do really think that can and through the um the sustainable coalition has really stepped up and provided a lot of value without the city investing in it to this point I think um you know so I I feel really good about trying to do this investment if we can make it happen um I was pulling up the um social and economic justice advisory committee matrix that they presented a couple weeks ago to think through you know where where would money go and all that good work that crew had done um and you know you can go through different groups of people and I I think for for that kind of lens and value set um I I think this kind of investment does perform well you know of course as as bill pointed out there's lots of hard decisions in this budget um but I it did you know you can kind of go through that matrix and you know how we're um the kind of value and who who can benefit from these kinds of community connections um and I guess just lastly I just I mean my head keeps getting pulled into what's happening in our nation's capital right now and just the importance of fostering community and connections and knowing your neighbors and not letting you know online rhetoric and other things dictate what might happen here I think just the the importance of that kind of investment I think is really underscored for me uh in this moment thanks great yeah thank you any further comments about either this potential 20 000 or can okay um moving on are there any other um changes that anyone might like to uh propose okay so not seeing um any um anyone else uh just to check in there's not a lot of members of the public here but um any members of the public want to weigh in just want to make sure allows some space for that and Cameron you're not seeing anyone no ma'am okay great um okay so um we have this one potential uh change to the budget um but um Lauren mentioned the that tool that the social economic justice um committee brought to us and before we have any motions I guess I would just love to run through those questions as a council um so I'm going to just find that document and I have it's sideways for me so I'm going to turn my head so first question who is impacted by um it says this budget decision but who is who is impacted um by this budget um maybe this is sort of an exercise in um it feels a little academic but would you know do we want to offer like who's who's impacted who do you feel like is impacted feels like everyone I suppose um moving on um what a potential positive impacts um I'm going to just go ahead and say that um I'm really pleased that we included uh we continued to have some funding for the housing trust fund I think that that was a good move um I am pleased that we are still funding the homelessness task force um and that we um and I'm hopeful that we're that we'll put money towards um towards the can neighborhoods any other thoughts on who this is positive for are you talking about the budget as a whole or simply an addition yeah I guess I'm talking about the budget as a whole unless people want to talk about different parts particularly uh Jay go ahead well I just think adding quickly that we've kept the community fund whole I think is um uh because that's very far reaching it's not just one particular organization that's multiple that that touch our city in a lot of important who have impact in our city a lot of a lot of great ways so I think that that's a positive yeah I agree um any other thoughts on that uh Connor go ahead I mean no layoffs is not insignificant um to have cut the budget to this degree um and just have city employees you know they're sure that they're not going to lose their job you know for lack of funding hopefully um barring an unforeseen uh economic downturn but no I think hats off to city staff who put this budget together and uh you know in this difficult time you know people still be able to put food on the table no other thoughts okay um so the next question is um what are the potential negative impacts um I know that can always be kind of a hard question to ask I mean even just with the conversation that we had a little earlier today you know how is how is this budget affecting um businesses I mean we we did zero out the molecular development corporation for this year but we did keep in funding for um Pealier Live um which has also been uh instrumental in helping businesses along um this during this time but any other thoughts on who this negatively impacts uh Donna go ahead and then I would say a bit of our city staff because they're definitely asked to do the same with less and our and ultimately our infrastructure you know that that people who use it our services our streets um they're they're impacted yeah go ahead Dan Donna hit the exact points that I was going to hit um but as well I think we have to keep in mind that this is you know built as a bridge year um to get on the other side of what we hope is um economic recovery post COVID um and so that you know this does take into account um you know this isn't I think I think this is a budget as Bill said at the beginning you know it's not one that's sustainable in that if we replicate it next year we're we're causing some serious um issues but that it gets us across what's going to be as Connor identified a really hard year um and I think this you know so there are there is infrastructure there is you know some limitation to this from prior year budgets but it's we know it going in into it and it's really one in which we're trying to make up this this gap and it's not a it's different than making a cut that we see as permanent I guess yeah and that or any other thoughts on on this particular question um I think some of the comments have been made I think also get towards the next question uh which is um what is the potential strategy for mitigating unintended consequences um you know it's always hard to anticipate unintended consequences but we know that we know that there are consequences and you know as Dan was just saying um you know we are going to have to put things back uh into the budget for another year if we expect there to be you know to not have longer term effects on city infrastructure um that sort of thing um Lauren go ahead yeah I mean I I think the way this has been structured with I really appreciate that it's very kind of human centered with for our staff and you know totally agree with Donna that it's going to be you know hard asking more of fewer people but knowing that the goal is to re-staff up um as soon as we can um but I think with the kind of the infrastructure being the place that we're holding off on but also seeing you know I mean it's hard to say what could be coming out of the Capitol uh with what's happening at this moment but I think you know everything we're hearing is that a big infrastructure package is what you know we're hoping to see and so it seems like a reasonable place to say you know let's be ready to jump on opportunities if when that comes in that seems like a you know as good a bet as any when you're trying to plan with such you know unknowns um the world we're living in right now um so I think that seems like a smart way to be positioned that that's where we could you know dump in so to me that is a you know a consequence of the budget that we know is going to be problematic um but that it seems like there's there's thoughts on how we could get to the other side of it without you know in various ways so I think the staff has been really thoughtful about that yeah um I want to recognize this is a slightly off topic comment but um I've been thinking a lot in the last couple days about the bifurcation of the economy um which is to say that like you know there are some folks it came up because I was listening to this podcast about um housing the housing market and how how is it possible that during a pandemic the housing market can be experiencing such an incredible boom and that that was basically the answer was that you know there there are those who can stay home and work from home um for whom you know they're still employed and location no longer matters so they can move and then and then there is the you know people in um in situations where you know they're essential workers or they they can't work from home and they they really were on the edge before and they are you know some of them maybe even be falling off the edge you know at at this point um um and so you know thinking about this this budget I mean we I I appreciate that we really tried to hold down the budget numbers with with that section of the you know the economy that that population in mind um want to acknowledge that there are probably people in Montpelier who are fine who could withstand you know and sort of a what would be considered like a normal tax increase um and you know and so I I don't I'm not proposing that we be going higher but I just want to acknowledge that I think there are just two very different portions of the population right now in in terms of what they're experiencing and I know we have Circuit Breaker and um income income sensitivity to protect uh those people who are you know in in a lower income um but I would be curious to see how like sort of just like where where we're at like how how is how is the pandemic affecting um folks who would otherwise um you know get the benefit of Circuit Breaker or income sensitivity like is is that percentage of our population increasing I I don't know um so again this is I'm not making any proposed changes to what I to you know what we're saying about the budget um I just think that would be really interesting to know um so yeah anyway um Donna and then Jack well there is some data I mean the state does have income sensitivity when it comes to property tax right I'm not I don't understand clearly there is something there for renters but I mean that is really a God sent to many many people and they would have the data and they could tell you how many households are already getting it just to have a clue of where people are you know that would be really that'll be really interesting I'll see if I can get it yeah if you do find that easily accessible through the tax department website they have an annual property tax report in fact it usually comes out in January for the prior year so it should be out shortly and it will tell you by city how many people receive the money what the total amount of money was paid to the city you know it's so you can calculate what the average it has both the renter rebate and the circuit breaker and the um the income sensitivities you can see how much aid comes into the community people got it and uh did they break that out by by municipality yes okay Bill have you kept track of it do you have a sense like a pause of what percentage it's been pretty steady but um you know we actually I usually present those numbers in the budget presentation uh the public hearing so hopefully I'll have that but it's you know it's more people than you'd think more households than you'd think in the city that get it well I'm certainly blessed by it I'll tell you um Jack and then Connor go ahead yeah what I think we're going to see is that as of now there's no change because it's annual based on people's annual income uh as reported on their uh income tax returns however the tax returns that people are going to be filing early this year it'll be due April 15th we'll we'll be able to see how many people in Montpelier had enough of a reduction in their income that they either qualify for income sensitivity where they didn't in previous years or I don't know if we'd be able to tell also if the amount of income sensitivity they qualify for went up because their income went down and of course there's all kinds of reasons for that including you know people retire get new jobs but that's probably pretty steady year after year whereas if there's a big drop or a big increase in the income sensitivity it's a reasonable guess that at least a substantial share of that is because the economic activity in the city was worse this year than previous years yeah I'd also you know I I feel like I should know this but it'd be interesting to see our like Montpelier specific um unemployment rates if that exists I'm not sure if that exists but you know it's interesting because Jack's right that you know the income tax will have a hit but really that won't shop until the 22 tax report because it'll be the taxes that can file this spring that bases this year's sensitivity we'll we'll find out what people got last year but we won't necessarily know what they're getting for this coming year. Connor go ahead. I just kind of going back to your sort of original question there and you know something I struggle with this budget is we sort of assess the pain on members of the community based on somebody owns a you know $228,000 house right well like almost 40% of our residents I believe are renters you know and a very very high percentage of that population works in the service industry in Montpelier so you know if you're someone who maybe you're not unemployed but you're definitely underemployed lately um and the rent has not gone down you know you're not going to evicted necessarily but the rent has stayed pretty high so I think you know just as we've looked at the budget that's something personally I've struggled with is how are we helping those people out and I do have a bit of optimism I think with the new cares and the new administration and everything that you know unemployment gets extended a little bit but still it's really hard to assess people in the service industry apples to apples with everybody else we're talking about here um so I hope nobody's really farmed for the cracks in this budget on this I'm not sure what the initial question was about the uh oh good yeah I think that's a little off topic but um cool thank you um any other thoughts on that tool um the questions who's the benefit um you know who's it negatively impact strategies for mitigating negative effects um okay um all right so uh at this point um we should probably uh consider some some motions uh Connor go ahead I'm going to include the $20,000 for for tan a second motion a second any further discussion on that particular piece okay um uh all in favor uh say aye hi hi hi and opposed no and um uh jack you voted no is that right sorry okay so I think we just got to do a roll call so I'm just going to call on you in the order that you appear on my screen so it's going to be a little bit of a surprise um uh Donna hi jack no Connor hi dan hi Lauren hi and j hi okay so the motion passes so that um it's a part of the overall budget for consideration and um so and just to check uh bill um what we are looking at now includes uh the 20,000 yep does um so that puts us at 0.6 percent uh increase is that correct yes okay um all right so um less than one percent fair enough um is there a motion regarding uh the budget uh Dan sure I'll make a motion that we approve the fiscal year 22 budget um as as presented and amended tonight a second okay we've got a couple seconds there um so any further discussion on um um budget as proposed and amended okay um any oh I think I just said that further discussion all right so um all in favor please say aye hi hi and opposed okay so the budget passes and so this is what we'll take into the public hearing and we will still have the opportunity to amend it um at both of those meetings um I think that is it and I uh actually no other um uh okay I think that that concludes uh our business regular business for the evening um so I think we are on to council reports and I'm going to go in the order as if we were in the horseshoe um unless of course Donna I always feel bad that I pick on you first because that's all right I get I get done with it so I always like to make three points about the central mont public safety authority is that it set up a committee to interview the two bidders we had and it's going to be giving the board its report tomorrow night at 6 30 with its right specialized meeting and at that meeting we're also going to talk about that we have an at-large open slot Doug Hoyt's three-year at-large expires march this 2021 and Doug is interested in the city looking at appointing him to represent them on the council it would be a two-year term versus the at-large he was not interested in going for three-year term but he is still interested in being on the board and would like the council to consider him for the other slot that Montpelier has and we'll be advertising for the at-large okay um what's the timeline uh you said it was um march no uh yeah the term starts on march 21 as far as the appointment the at-large needs to put their name in the same as any candidate to go in the ballot okay all right um great uh thank you Connor well just want to thank uh you and and Lauren for your comments at the beginning it's you know I think all of us are probably looking at Twitter and different news sources as this meeting goes on it's uh easy to get distracted it's it's really despicable and um you know it's uh you're sad to see like a bus of romontos go down without masks and hang out down there and come back um that they're hanging out all day so um just hope everybody's safe and the best for everybody um uh now they just thought you know I've seen a lot of like negativity in our community too I think maybe it's just front porch forums and you know I think online stuff you know tone can be misinterpreted and it might pick up the it might make the worst out of all of us you know participating in those types of conversations but you know like these are tough times I think everybody's going through a really hard time right now and you know fair enough we ran for a elected office and I look around and everybody's got a pretty fixed in here uh but some of the volunteers on our boards they take a lot of time out of their lives to do this work and you know some of the talking points around this you know just the talking about corruption and things like that these are like real people in your neighbors and everything so I would just ask that if we could tone it down be a little less snarly you know you know this is a public great public forum where people can come express their opinions I think all of us are pretty successful to have a bit of a chat there um but let's try to hang together a little better than we are as a community if anybody's listening um yeah I just end with that thank you uh Jay well um I think Connor said what was on my mind as well um I would also just encourage all of us to um be proactive in trying to find opportunities to have those communications in places other than front porch forum and and otherwise I know it's not so easy these days where we can't you know run into somebody necessarily at a coffee shop or a bar or a restaurant but the um I think the more we are showing a proactive stance and trying to explain to people and and get ahead of the conversation about what we're doing and decisions that we're making and what's going on I think it'll just better not just serve us I'm not worried about that but just better have an engaged community um and and like Connor said have more I think uh uh adult and positive conversations around we're on where we're headed so thanks yeah thank you Dan thanks um I'm gonna probably echo everybody else's comments because I think that's where all our heads are tonight and and thank you know both you and Lauren for your comments at the beginning I think they were very eloquent and and well stated um you know some of the and I ideal in conflict as a profession um as a lawyer um but you know I think this has been a really trying time for a lot of people and it has pushed a lot of us to the brink of patience and civility and it's hard it really is hard um but I you know part of I think what can be the most frustrating is to blame or to get angry at in it and um in in another hat that I I wear um I'm on the board for the the Boy Scouts and the complaint that's always there from the local troops are counsel because the statewide organization is known as a council uh spelled the same way as us tonight um but everybody always blames counsel no I can't believe counsel did this or counsel did that and I had an executive director who used to say who's counsel I I don't know anyone named counsel it's it's issues with things that you know you can make change if you can talk to people and you can have conversations and if you can build constructive ideas um you know so that if people have an issue and from court form a number of people certainly did um with some of the new signage you know there's the signs are there um but we can have constructive conversations about prospective or um you know what can we do to come together as a community and I think any type of dialogue and engagement with that because there is no counsel here you have six people and a mayor and a city manager and an entire staff that provides service either volunteer or professionally and we're here to talk with people we're here to work with everyone we're here to serve I mean this is servant leadership at its best I think we have a really great group of people that are always willing to listen um but the worst way to engage somebody is to start yelling and blaming um a general group or to blame something because I think that it depowers yourself and that makes you a less active player because it becomes less about you making a difference and more about a general grievance yeah fair enough um jack thank you three three things most at least one of which will be quick um the the question arose about the unemployment rate and whether it's possible to find it by Montpelier the Department of Labor does have a publication on unemployment and it's it's broken down by county and also by labor market area so we're in the very Montpelier labor market area I don't I'm not aware of any finer distinction within the city of Montpelier barrier and whatnot um but they do publish publish that information every year and maybe maybe weekly or monthly uh to online um two is uh I want to mention an event that's coming up um the Vermont Center for Independent Living is uh holding an event on uh Martin Luther King Day Monday January 18th from four to five p.m. it is uh a film and uh discussion about the uh civil rights movement Martin Luther King's legacy and disability rights and of course it's a zoom event but uh I don't know what the best way to share it is I'll put it on my own facebook page and uh and maybe pass it along to to the city to build to I don't know publicize so people can know about it um thanks and uh and in keeping with the the events in the day which are just so disheartening and with which other people have said I'm looking at the uh headline in the New York Times right now and the headline is mob incited by Trump's storms capital and I just think what would we think if the headline were mob incited by Putin or mob incited by Duterte or mob incited by Meludo storms capital that's that's all thank you um Lauren uh yeah just a couple quick updates I don't think I had mentioned this last time but wanted to let you all know that the um social and economic justice advisory committee has been doing fundraising to supplement the $10,000 allocation and they have so far raised um from the Vermont Community Foundation got a spark grant for $3,000 and the Ben and Jerry's Foundation a $2,000 grant so we've been bringing in some some funding um I think we can kind of do more of the work in the uh with the contractor that we've hired um that we're aiming for so I know the the volunteers have been working really hard um on that piece and continue to to do more fundraising so I wanted to acknowledge that and let you all know um and that process continues to move forward and there's going to be some I think really informative community conversations with various stakeholder groups in our community um in the next uh you know six to eight weeks or so um so that should be great I'm really really grateful that's continuing to happen um and lastly just didn't mention earlier but was in our very packed consent agenda Donna had mentioned it so I didn't bother but I am really excited to see the net zero move forward and some really great proposals came in and the one that you've been able to move forward with I think it's it's really exciting and just you know in this moment of such you know upheaval that kind of forward-looking vision that we're still keeping our eye on as a community of how we rebuild you know in better ways I think is really critical to you know a more sustainable and resilient community so I'm really excited that that is continuing and the the opportunities in there thanks yeah um yeah I guess just to start I um Dan something I heard you say was that people are really stressed out now and I I just want to acknowledge I want to highlight that I feel like people are really um there's a lot of anxiety uh in the community right now especially today but even before today I think there's been a lot of uh just latent um stress and anxiety in the community and I think that expresses itself in lots of different ways and so in as much as we all can I think it is more important than normal to um just have grace for each other um you know when somebody expresses something in a way that you're like oh I don't really want to hear that like to breathe through it to see the human that that is that's stressed out and um and that it might be um related to any number of things and uh yeah to to treat each other with with grace I think is really key especially right now um so besides that separate topic um I know we talked about it at the beginning with uh the my ride the GMT but I want to come back to it again because I am super excited about it and if you have not yet downloaded the app for it I would highly encourage you to do that and try it out um I mean it's free it is uh you know it's it's I think it's going to be a game changer for a lot of people in Montpelier so um I would encourage you all to try it uh and if you need a ride from anywhere within that zone oh jack's got it awesome if you need help if you're having glitches um just I mean you can let me know you can let um anyone from GMT you know there's there's people to call if there's any issues with it um so anyway highly encourage you all to to do that uh okay I guess that is oh but so that's also to say I've taken it to work every day this week and it's been great I'm gonna take it again tomorrow um take it at home from work it's it's been fabulous so all right that's um that is I oh there's actually have one more thing um which is that um this is the the time of year when we do uh the city manager review and so I so I'm going to be um sending out the uh survey bill turns the cameras off um I'll I'll be sending you out a survey um hopefully with by the end of the week uh and if you could be filling that out that'd be great I think we have on the agenda tentatively um when is it bill like first meeting and first meeting somewhere yeah to um have an executive session about that um and I did bill did we determine like I think this is this also a year I didn't check but I think okay this is also um a year we thank um in which we need to renegotiate um bill salary uh the contract and so just put that on your radar as well um that that is coming up and should that process should be completed before town meeting day um yep so just to know about that um Jack did I see you have a had a hand did I imagine that no okay just make sure okay um great um I think that is it for me um John is John on I don't see John Odom so maybe he doesn't have a report well bill to take the minutes for today I believe okay just because it was fair no budget workshop right okay um and uh Bill yeah I just so I don't have much I appreciate everyone's kind words about um being stressed you know I think certainly the city employees have felt that um not only worried about the budget process but the pandemic and the pressures are them um so I think those I'd like to thank you all for you know so far a very smooth budget process and understanding what we're trying to get of course again thank our whole team for they did getting a good budget and uh looks like 2021 is off to a banging start I guess so uh all right well um with that um stay safe and healthy everyone and uh I'm gonna declare this meeting adjourned hey yesterday I told Lauren we'd be done by 30 here we go nine pretty good we're close it's better than 10 have a good night everyone night