 Good morning and welcome. My name is Lisa Grande and I'm the head of the United States Institute of Peace which was established by the U.S. Congress in 1984 as a non-partisan public national institution dedicated to helping prevent, mitigate, and resolve violent conflict abroad. We're very pleased to have this opportunity this morning to focus on the role of democratic institutions and democratic action in Ukraine. And to help ensure that that democratic action and those institutions secure stable governance when the war is terminated. And we're also here to discuss how the international community can support Ukraine in these efforts. It's an honor to co-host this special event with the International Foundation for Electoral Systems and to welcome Tony Manbury, the President of IFAS, and a colleague from the days that we share together in the United Nations. We are also very pleased that Ambassadors Bill Taylor and Masha Yavanovich, the First Secretary at Ukraine's Embassy in Washington, Katarina Smagli, and the IFAS Global Principal Advisor and Senior Country Director in Ukraine, Peter Urban are here with us for the panel discussion. It's been incredible and deeply inspirational to witness the Ukrainian people's commitment to democracy and international democratic norms in the face of Russia's unprovoked war of aggression. Many of us understand that democracy and the democratic values that shape international peace, security and prosperity, including territorial sovereignty and the right of people to choose their own leaders through transparent, free and fair elections are on the line in this war. President Zelensky said it best in his speech before the U.S. Congress last December when he declared that this war will define whether it will be a democracy for Ukrainians and for Americans, you may recall he then paused, and then he said a democracy for all. What we hope to do today is to talk about the role of the international community and everyone who supports Ukraine in assisting Ukraine to strengthen its democracy and to help rebuild its institution when the war is terminated. Tony, with your permission, may we invite you to the floor for your remarks. Good morning, everyone, and thank you so much, Liz. It's nice to see you and congratulations on your assumption as president of this August institution. It's wonderful to be here. Good morning again, everyone. I want to say how pleased I am to be here addressing an issue that is at the very top of the world's agenda, not only because we care so deeply about Ukraine and the Ukrainian struggle, but because we all care so deeply about freedom and democracy. It's a pleasure to be here with Katiana Smugly from the Ukrainian Embassy, but also very much sharing this event with Ambassador Bill Taylor and Masha Ivanovich. I had the pleasure of meeting both of them in Ukraine around the time of the 2019 elections, and if you were asked to write a description of a paragon of civil service, you could do no better than trying to describe what Bill and Masha have done for the United States and the causes we all care about. In the toughest of circumstances, Ukrainians have shown us their commitment to live in a free and democratic society, and it's precisely this commitment that has given them the fortitude to persevere in the face of such awful challenges. President Zelensky said just today in London that freedom will win and Russia will lose, and I believe that absolutely is going to be the case. In the meantime, there needs to be a lot of support for the people of Ukraine with military equipment and there needs to be a military victory, and that's of primary importance now, but the greatest strength that Ukrainians have will not be any weapons that allies of theirs send to them, but rather their commitment to live in a free and democratic society. And even while this victory is being pursued, the strength of their democratic institutions need to be nurtured. And I'd like to just mention a few really important issues to keep our eye on and support Ukrainians on as they pursue their military victory. Post-war elections, perhaps Peter will talk about this later, we have to ensure that following victory elections will be free, fair, inclusive, and accessible to all. There will be lots of complications around that and Ukrainians will need to work through them with our support. The role of civil society, it has played such an important role during the conflict and voice of civil society will need to be nurtured, supported, and allowed to flourish in a post-war Ukraine. Part of that civil society youth, the role of youth, they have played such an important role in the struggle, in the war, on the battlefield, they need to be supported in a post-war Ukraine. And let me just emphasize for a second that point on youth, they need to be empowered and inspired. Investment in young people, I think we all know from work we've done around the world, is critical to the future of any society. To prevent a society from going backwards, the young of a country need to be supported. And since Ukraine's independence, we've all been inspired I think by young people across Ukrainian society who have demonstrated their commitment to freedom, democracy in the face of such difficult circumstances. IFIS has prioritized the work with youth during our, well we've been in Ukraine for many years, and Peter will talk about this perhaps, but one of the things that I'm very proud of is our work across more than 46 universities in Ukraine supporting the future leaders of that country. We've supported a group of graduates who have formed an alumni association and a civil society organization to increase young people's awareness and resilience to external circumstances. They just gathered as a group in a basement to watch a documentary about Ukrainian rock and roll and how it helped undermine support for the former Soviet Union in Ukraine. So things like that are certainly inspiring to me and our harbinger of what the youth of Ukraine represent for the future. Another alumni of that civic education program in these universities is now an intern with the National Anti-Corruption and Prevention Agency. And obviously we all know how important anti-corruption is, the work in Ukraine. And just a few months ago in Herzog, a group of students from this civic education program were helping older adults and people with disabilities get medicine under occupation as part of their civic education project for the courses they were studying. So Ukraine is filled with stories like this that are so inspiring. We'll hear perhaps some of them now from our other speakers. It is really a great honor for IFAS to be here at USIP and participating in this event. It's even more of an honor to be side by side supporting the people of Ukraine in their fight for democracy that we all know will be inevitably a victorious one. So, Slava Ukraine, thank you very much and over to you. Soon we will be joined by a third panelist. We can already see Masha Ivanovich right here, but you will see her shortly. I'm convinced. I'm assured that there she is. So, Lise, thank you. Tony, thank you very much for the introductions. It's an honor for me to be here with you and with Ambassador Ivanovich on the screen. This is an important discussion. This is a really important discussion, and we've got great people to do this. So Katya Smogli, First Secretary at the Embassy, representing Ambassador Makarov, who couldn't be here today. Katya is more than adequate to be able to tell this story. Ambassador Makarov, we probably all saw last night. President Biden recognized her at the State of the Union. There was an unusual bipartisan, overwhelming standing ovation for Ambassador Makarov. Demonstrates the bipartisan support that Ukraine has for this war. So Katya and I worked together in Kiev earlier on. She's now a leading official at the Embassy right over here on M Street. So it's great to have you, Katya. Peter Urban, a legend. So Tony didn't quite go into the level and the depth and the extent of Peter's work. We all have, many of us have seen Peter's work in Afghanistan, in Iraq. Named the difficult elections around the world, and he's either organized or overseen. He's actually run a couple of elections for nations. Nations have gotten Peter Urban to actually run their election because he knows how to do this, and he does it well. He is the head of the IFAS office and overall program in the region and lives in Kiev. Lives in Kiev. His family will come back when the time is right. So we're honored, Peter, to have you here. The reason I say this is so important, and we'll get to our conversation, is that exactly as Tony said, Ukraine needs to win this war. In order to get to the democratic issues that we're going to be talking about, in order to get to the elections, in order to get to the civil society that Makarov will talk about, Ukraine has to win. And in order to win, there needs to be unity. There needs to be unity within Ukraine, and I'm going to Katya ask you about this, because this is going to be a challenge. And that unity will then lead to what Tony also said, and that is the outside support. If Ukraine can maintain its unity, which it is. 95, 98% united behind President Zelensky against the Russian invasion for the government. That's unified. That's unified. And the question is, can that be maintained? Unity among us, among the sponsors, the allies of Ukraine, so that they can win. That's going to be important in order to get to this point. Katya, let me start with you. As I say, unity is important. The challenges of unity during war time, in particular the challenges for democratic practices. All nations when they're at war have to do things to maintain security. There have to be limits on some of the things that we normally look to for democracy. Wide open press, well, there's a focus of press. Elections are going to be a challenge, and Peter's going to talk about this as well. Human rights is still important as it always is. How has your government been able to thread this needle to find this balance between respect for democratic practices and the necessary things they have to do during the war? Good morning, everyone. Good morning, Ambassador. Thank you very much for your very kind words and your kind introduction. It is a true honor for me to be here in this audience and speaking with two people, two ambassadors whom I consider my professional mentors. Ambassador Taylor said that I used to work under his leadership in Kiev, but my first boss actually was Ambassador Masha Ivanovich, who at that time was deputy chief of mission working with Ambassador Karlas Pascual. That's the year when I joined the embassy in 2013. There you go. Very good question, very important question. The last 350 days since the time Putin started this unprovoked aggression against Ukraine has truly been a crash test for Ukraine. And I think that we successfully and very ably passed this crash test, both at the local levels and at the national level. I'm afraid that many people in the West, and of course in Russia, has preconceived notions that Ukraine is a weak, corrupt state with very weak government that will fall and that will not be able to protect the resilience of its governmental institutions. But all of those preconceived notions prove to be false. Although in his pseudo-historical essay President Putin wrote that Ukraine is not a real country and Ukrainians are not really a nation, Ukrainians have demonstrated that in fact we are a very real country and we are very real people. And in retrospect, I mean you ask about unity and how we survive and what ensures progress. I mean if you really study Ukrainian history you will understand that through centuries we have had so many crash tests that this most recent crash test is not really such a significant challenge that we have to overcome. Think about all the losses that Ukraine has had during the Second World War. It was really the bloodlines as historian Timothy Snyder has said. Think about the Halladomor when millions of people died as a result of Stalin's horrific policies. Think about all the dissidents who died in the Gulag just defending what they believed in, the freedoms that they tried to achieve for Ukraine. So Ukrainians have been survivors for many years and I think the memory about our historical past and all the sacrifices that our nation has already been carrying gives us a lot of encouragement and ensures that we will stay on the right course. Our unity depends on four key factors and of course the key factor in my opinion is leadership of President Zelensky who has demonstrated incredible courage and has inspired not only the entire world but primarily he inspired Ukrainians. Our unity is 100% depends on the strengths and ability of our very capable armed forces and our army generals and we believe that thanks to their efforts, thanks to their sacrifice and selfless service Ukrainians will win this war. But by the end of the day as we all know, wars are won not because of the leadership of one man or very able generals. Wars are won because millions of people are ready to sacrifice their lives and stand in defense of their country and that again what Ukrainians demonstrate right now. So we are united because of our very strong civil society, because of our volunteers, because of our home front who is doing all the necessary work to support this war effort. And finally the fourth factor is of course the unity of the West and the leadership of the Biden administration that helps Ukraine militarily, financially, providing humanitarian assistance. And we are very thankful to President Biden who during his State of the Nation address yesterday again looking at our ambassador once again underscored that America is united in our support for your country and we will stand with you as long as it takes. So as President Zelensky I believe himself said, the biggest reform that Ukraine has achieved in the last 350 years is the reform of the European Union in itself, in its understanding that it has to be united and it has once again answered the questions, the fundamental questions which President Biden asked yesterday. Would we stand for the most basic principles? Would we stand for sovereignty? Would we stand for the right of people to live free from tyranny? Would we stand for the defense of democracy? One year later we know the answer. Yes we would and we did, we did on this court. And of course the fifth factor is our desire to become a truly European country. As you remember, Ukrainians have tried and demonstrated their focus on achieving EU membership for so many times since they declared independence in 1991. Remember the Orange Revolution, huge aspirations, democratic reforms, some setbacks. But then again the revolution of dignity of 2013-2014, three months during winter times people standing on the streets defending democracy. Again huge aspiration, another war, another effort on behalf of the civil society to protect our democracy. And then now this kind of full fledged invasion and again the country is united in defense of the dreams and values that we try to defend. So the argument and the point that I want to make that democracy truly doesn't come overnight. That you maybe sometimes have to do several revolutions and through very consistent effort with some challenges, with some problems. But it's like a water drop that makes a steady fall and sooner or later it will break the stone and will achieve the result that this country aspires. And finally I believe the very important element that keeps us all together is the perspective of EU membership that finally become real. I believe it was a remarkable sign of brevity and courage and even Hutzpah as they would say for President Zelensky to officially only four days after Putin started his full fledged war against Ukraine to submit the application for EU membership. Very bold state, very bold step but very symbolic step which demonstrated to everyone in Ukraine and outside of Ukraine that Ukraine will not change its course. Nothing will make us change the past, the dreams that we have chosen for ourselves. And with all the reforms that Ukraine is now doing, of course it's very challenging act to fight the war and to do some reforms internally. Ukrainians are steadily working on all the reforms that are necessary for us to achieve EU membership. Interestingly I just look at some opinion polls. You probably know the name New Europe, think tank. It's a very prominent analytical center that studies public attitudes towards European integration within Ukraine. And recent polls has demonstrated that 73% of Ukrainians fully support conditionalities that have been imposed on Ukraine to achieve this membership. And all Ukrainians understand that there is certain homework that should be done by the society and by the government to fully meet all the criteria that has been presented. I am very positive about the future of Ukraine. I know that we will become prosperous, fully democratic, successful European country. And we see that even despite the war, Kiev, Ukraine's capital, is a must destination for many European and American politicians. It's a must visit place and it's truly a very vibrant and happy place to be. And I hope that all of you will be in Kiev if not soon but after we win for sure. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. You've mentioned a couple things that we're going to come back to. Ambassador Yovanovich, I'm going to ask you the next question. And everyone in this room and everybody online knows Masha Yovanovich. What you may not know is she's now a senior advisor for us here at the Institute of Peace. And we could not be prouder to have some of Masha's time. We share her with the Carnegie Endowment and Georgetown University. But she's been a great advisor for us, a great addition to this team. So Masha, again, welcome. Let me ask you about a couple of the things that both Katya and Tony said about civil society. I mean, we've talked about the government. We've talked about the military, how important it is for the military to proceed, win, success on the battlefield. Civil society in particular in Ukraine, as you know better than anyone, has been a force for good, for democracy, for freedom. What's the role now in the wartime situation, Masha? Well, thank you for welcoming me so warmly, Bill. It's great to be participating in this conversation with you, with Peter, and especially with my dear friend Katya. It's just wonderful to be here. And I want to note just straight out that as you are so fond of saying winning the war is the most important thing for Ukraine. But there's also a very important corollary, which is that winning the peace is also essential. And I think that Ukraine needs to lay the groundwork now. Katya started talking about some of that. It's not too soon. In fact, you know, FDR, when he was thinking about what would happen after World War II, he started thinking about that two years before the war was ended. And I think that for Ukraine, as perhaps in the U.S. in 1945 and, you know, parts of Europe in 1945, civil society was the key. And it will be the key in Ukraine. You know, we may not hear as much about civil society as you pointed out. As we hear about the government, certainly, you know, the overwhelming presence and force and inspiration of President Zelensky and the brave and competent fighting force of Ukraine. But civil society is right in there as well. And when I was in Ukraine in September with you and with others, I was really struck by how this is a completely mobilized society. I mean, when we think of civil society, we often think of, you know, formal NGOs and everything else. But, you know, what I saw was, you know, just people and, you know, we see this in the news as well, people who see a task that needs to be done and take it up. And they organize a food kitchen. They organize, you know, training on first aid care. They do whatever needs to be done. It doesn't have to come from the mayor to say, you need to do X, Y and Z. People see something and they take a responsibility on themselves and they do the work. And that has been Ukraine's strength all along. Katya, you know, talked about that in her remarks over, you know, the span of Ukraine's independent history since 1991. And it's been the strength and the suker and it will continue to be. I think it will be absolutely pivotal because there is, I think, a, you know, the Ukrainian people and Ukrainian civil society has always wanted to realize its Western aspirations. I mean, we could see that in two revolutions and multiple elections and in two wars, basically. And now they are fighting for that in a way that is more critical, more existential than ever before. And so, you know, the Ukrainian people are not fighting to recreate the Ukraine of the early 1990s. They are fighting for to create a country where there is the rule of law, where government meets the needs of the people, where it's not, you know, the people are there for the government. It's the other way around. The government is there for the people. I mean, Peter was going to talk, I'm sure, about elections in Ukraine and the ability of any democracy. And Ukraine has demonstrated this where you can vote for your candidate. If you think somebody else can do, somebody can do a good job and you can vote them out if you think that they can't do a good job. All of this is part of, I think, the mobilization of civil society. And I think that civil society is very active right now and it will continue to be active in the post-war period. But to come back to, you know, kind of the essential point about, you know, winning the war, it's also important to win the piece. We need to lay the groundwork now. Ukrainian civil society working with the Ukrainian government is doing that and it is a hard slog. I mean, there's no magic bullet, unfortunately. It's just a hard slog. But they are doing the work and hopefully they will continue to do the work because it is absolutely essential for Ukraine's future. This is the new social compact that Ukraine is a Western country that lives by Western values. And, you know, I think we in the West will continue to support that as the Ukrainian people will as well. Masha, thank you. Thank you very much. And again, anybody in this room or online who wants to hear more of what Masha has been doing and saying, she's got a book. Lessons from the Edge. I recommend, we were just talking about this before you were on, Masha, and it's a great education for us all. So thank you for that. Thank you for those comments. Again, we're going to come back to those as well. But first, Peter, elections. You've already been introduced a couple of times as probably saying something about elections. And I suspect you will. And Katya mentioned, Tony mentioned as well that Ukraine is on track, is now on a membership track for the European Union. And Katya mentioned that President Zelensky bold step asking for that and the EU responded in June. And put Ukraine and Moldova on this track. And they listed a bunch of things, seven things in particular that Ukraine has to do in order to move forward on that membership track. And they are what you would expect. They are governance and they're anti-corruption, they're anti-Oligarch, there's anti-money laundering. There are a lot of things that the Ukrainian Rada and administration has to put in place in order to achieve this membership. What about elections? I mean, Mascha talked about elections. I've seen you do elections in really hard places. And there are going to be elections sometime soon. How does that all fit, Peter? How does the election piece fit into EU membership and into prosecuting this war? First and foremost let me thank you for this opportunity. I'm deeply grateful to USIP, to you, Bill, to my fellow speakers that we have a chance to come here in this beautiful place and talk about something that is really important to IFAS. I'm fortunate to be in Kiev. This is where I live. And as you said, my family will soon return too after victory. And IFAS in Kiev plays a pivotal role in coordinating all issues of how we deal with democracy in general and elections in particular. And we were indeed deeply involved in discussions around what should be these priorities that would be mentioned in relation to the ascension to the EU. I think it's really important to understand that elections and democracy are integrated into these seven points already. Judicial, media, anti-corruption reform are pivotal in order to further improving elections and democratic governance in Ukraine. They are not different than. It's an incredibly important part of it. But we also have to recognize if we look across all reforms that Ukraine has actually done very well on electoral reform since 2014. Elections have gotten better year by year. International observers have shown that, documented it in their continuous reports. Together with, for example, decentralization, elections offer a fantastic opportunity again for Ukraine to show the rest of the world what can be done in terms of strengthening democracy. This is yet another thing that I think Ukraine can be proud of. But it's not the end. There's lot still to be done. Elections will be absolutely pivotal to winning the war, winning the peace, sorry. There'll be a torrent of elections when peace comes. The Constitution is crystal clear on this. And in the years after victory, we will see elections to the presidency, to parliament, and very important to local councils and mayorships all over Ukraine. Immensely important, especially with decentralization reform in mind. These elections carry great potential, but they also carry risk of disrupting essential focus on good governance and rebuilding. So while elections must take place, they're not necessarily a great way in which to get politicians to do their job. And therefore, every effort must be sure that we get the best possible electoral processes. And in fact, trusted outcomes, politicians that can govern effectively. This will in itself be an insurance against the damage that elections can do and do all over the world if they are not well conducted. We do have a lot of tasks that must be done now. So while I entirely agree with that we must first and foremost work towards victory and everything that entails, there's a lot of groundwork that can be done and I'm really happy that Marsha mentioned that great victories have involved prep work before victory came and that you recognize this is something that is a challenge and must be met already now. In order for there to be elections for new trusted government to be established in Ukraine, we still need to finish the electoral code, the entire legal framework that governs elections in general. We had a number of things that still needed to be done when the war broke out, but the war has added significant challenges to this. There are many, but most prominently millions of Ukrainians are now displaced by this war. Inside Ukraine as internally displaced persons and abroad, some as refugees, some taking shelter in other countries. And the Ukrainian tradition for elections does not really cater for millions coming to an embassy on election day voting. New methods must be developed, be they postal voting or distributed in-person voting with polling stations all over Europe for Ukrainians to go to and let there will be heard. There are also other things that needs to be achieved and that we can work on right now. The ruling elites when they came into power recognized that political parties still have a long way to go in terms of institutionalizing themselves and have long recognized that Ukraine needs a modern political party legal framework and that this would be an immense improvement on democracy forward for Ukraine. This law has already drafted and is largely agreed upon. It's even been reviewed by the Venice Commission and adjusted accordingly. It's another example of something that we can work on right now. A strong electoral democracy is exactly what the soldiers are fighting for. They're fighting for freedom, but they're also fighting for the right to elect their leaders. And it's pivotal that these elections, the democratic processes will offer an even better society for Ukrainians. And I should here say that my wife is Ukrainian and my children are Danish-Ukrainian. So I see their future also in Ukraine. And I also want them to be at home there in the best possible democracy that Ukraine can offer for them. The ascension to EU is indeed pivotal. I do think for economic prosperity and many other reasons it must happen. And it is also true that there's a lot still to be done. But I think Ukraine's opportunity goes beyond that. I actually do think that Ukraine has the potential to be a role model, to be a beacon for democracies throughout the neighborhood of which there are several nations that we would still want to inspire to become democracies. Ukraine has that potential to be that shining beacon. And actually, if we look at the rest of the world, it also needs a little bit of inspiration. And maybe this can also come out of this war. Ukraine showing the way for some of the nations that are backsliding now. And we can get back on a positive trajectory when it comes to strengthening democracy worldwide. Peter, thank you. Ukraine has inspired this country as you observe and as we can all see. It has inspired the world, including here. Let me just follow up on a question on elections. Katya and Masha, you will have thoughts on this as well. But let me start with Peter. So you've conducted elections in war zones, in countries that are in conflict. Ukraine has had elections in conflict. Ukraine in 2019 had both presidential and parliamentary elections in the middle of conflict before this latest invasion, but during the war with Russia. And we talked about unity. And we talked about how important unity is. And it must be difficult for opposition parties to make, to operate, to oppose in a war scenario. Both in wartime, and we hope that this war will be ended this year, before next year's elections. We hope. And that can happen. We can talk about that. I'd love to talk about that. But if it doesn't, there are elections during war. Opposition has to both support the war and the prosecution of that war. But they also are running for office. As Masha said, Ukrainians as well as other people going to the polls can decide if the current leaders are doing a good job. And if not, they vote for someone else. This is tricky. So both during the war and then, as you just said, after the victory, presumably some of these constraints that are imposed right now for obvious reasons, for a country at war, could be, should be, will be lifted to be able to go back to full opposition, full press freedom. All of these things. Talk a little bit about your experiences, both in general, but in particular as you see what the challenges for Ukrainian opposition, civil society and government might be. Now, I think it's very important first to recognize that Ukraine is dramatically different than many of the other development contexts that we have worked in. In that, it does have a functioning central state. And many of the functions of society are working well, including the ability to hold elections. In fact, I believe that Ukraine has one of the better, if not best, election commissions in the neighborhood and even in Europe. You've had something to do with that. You have something to do with that. We would like to think that we made a small contribution. You made an enormous contribution. Also, so Ukraine is well equipped to hold elections. And I have great confidence that Ukraine, on its own, with its formidable election commission, will be able to hold elections even under very difficult circumstances. It doesn't change the fact, though, that the challenge now is very different than it was in, say, 2015, because the war is much more all-encompassing. And it is absolutely true that to win a war as it is now, a certain level of centralization, of power, of communication, is absolutely necessary. So I don't think anyone on the democracy side are blaming the current political elites for making sure that they can lead as well as they can. We all know that from wars gone by that this is important. I am convinced that there is a strong will to return to democratic practices once the war is won. I think that the current elites, the president, is committed to that Ukraine will be the best democracy it can be. And therefore, of course, power will have to be handed back. At the local level, we have to see civil military administrations handed back to elected councils. And all the way up to the president who will submit himself to an election relatively shortly after victory. I'm convinced it will happen, but it is true. It is absolutely pivotal for Ukraine to deliver to its people, to honor the sacrifice by the people and especially by the soldiers, because they fought for exactly these principles. That's not going to be easy. It's always difficult to make that transition. And I think we, Ukraine's international friends, must be there to assist the best we can. But I'm definitely convinced that Ukraine as such will be able to hold these elections. And that even during wartime, we will be able to take some of the small steps towards having the best possible environment for the reinstatement of full democracy. I'm also sure that the opposition as it currently exists and what I think will be new opposition after this war as it will emerge will remind the powers now that they would want to have the opportunity to use the media, to campaign, to say their opinion, to compete. And I have every reason to believe that just like Ukrainians have come out several times fighting for that principle in revolutions, the entire Ukrainian community will come together and acknowledge that everyone should have a say, everyone should have the right to run for office, and everyone should have the right to vote. Peter, thank you. Masha, I'm going to ask you in one second if you've got thoughts on this very question. So this is the responsibility of this government. As Peter said, there have been some perfectly understandable, legitimate, even mandatory centralizations of authorities' powers. And there will be an expectation that after the victory that the decentralization will happen. Again, as Peter just said, thoughts from your government on this question. Well, I believe that this is extremely important issue. And since we find ourselves at the U.S. Institute for Peace, which has such a strong record, I mean 30 years of history, right, since you've been established and you've seen so many societies which lived through wars and you know the problems that they face after the war is over. And the issues that we talk about right now at the core of these issues because it's truly challenging to transform your country from this war effort and all the rhetoric and all the passion that the Army demonstrates right now to bring the country back, to return our sovereignty back, and to come to normal, peaceful life. So truly it will be extremely important for the government to return the authority back at the local level. But let me add two more important, I believe, issues in addition to what Peter has mentioned. You remember that one of the key problems that Ukraine has faced through years was the role of the oligarchs and the strong role that they played also in the electoral process, buying not only politicians, buying ministers and government, funding the whole parties, also taking money from a neighbor state to support the parties which were not kind of playing in Ukraine's national interest, but in the interest of the states which funded those countries and funded those parties. And I believe that this war is a wonderful opportunity for the president and he already demonstrated to fight with the oligarchs. And the deregarchization law which he approved and the Rada adopted shortly before the war, which was a little bit controversial, let me say, because there was a lot of criticism that this may be kind of selective justice. You know, you will go after one oligarchs and leave others behind. Right now we see that this war really helped the government to clean up the stages, so to say. And we also cleaned up the parties which were not true political forces in the true sense of the word, but we are just very unconstructive forces that played not in the interest of this country. So to a certain extent this war will also help us clean and do the homework that is necessary to ensure that we will come to peace in a normal way. And once again, let me repeat that Ukraine has a proven record of success when it comes to elections. We have, all our elections have been free and democratic and there had been no major criticism with regard to how elections have been conducted. All but one and that was redone. That was redone. That was fixed. Ukrainians have proven that they can defend the democratic choice and that they will continue doing so. Absolutely. Even if, hypothetically, in the future there will be some risk to protecting our democracy, I am confident that having made so many sacrifices already to protect Ukraine as an independent state, to ensure our sovereignty, Ukrainians themselves will never let corrupt politicians to steal their country from them. So they will continue working at all levels and the local level will be extremely important this regard. Thank you, Katya. Masha, I am going to ask you the same question, but if there are questions in the room or online, I think there is a way for you, yes, I think there is a way for Kirtika to harvest some of those questions and I am sure we will have time for this. But Masha, all this question of kind of the centralization during wartime, questions about democratic processes, the dilemmas of opposition parties. What is your sense about how this evolves over during the war and then after the victory? So this is a really important question. It is an important question for Ukraine's future. And I come back to that old Washington saying never waste a good crisis. So obviously Ukraine is in an existential crisis right now and it is about the war against Russia and geographical and other issues. But it is also about the war for Ukraine's future. What kind of a country is Ukraine going to be after the war? And as I've said before, as we've all said, I don't think that the war ends, there's victory and you snap your fingers and all of a sudden you go into peacetime mode. There is, I think, a continuum during the war and then the transition to peace. And I think, as I said before, Ukraine needs to start now. And Katya has laid out how the Zelensky government is starting some of the features of that process like going after the oligarchs and so forth. Peter has laid out other issues like political pluralism, the importance of that to a democracy. Getting the balance right, not only in the future, but right now so that there is, you know, you're laying the groundwork for that really, you know, that democratic peace. And I want to note that all democracies are struggling democracies, including our own. You know, democracy, if you can keep it, that very, very, or republic, if you can keep it, that, you know, kind of seminal quotation from our, our early days. I mean, that's true for all countries. We always have to kind of struggle and figure out the best way forward and balance between the important issues of security and the equally important issues of freedom is really, really important. But here's the thing to remember. Democracy is what the people of Ukraine want, and they've struggled for it for years, and now they're laying down their lives for it. And it's part of the reason, not the only reason, but it's part of the reason that there is such robust international support for, for Ukraine. And so I think it's important to, to start working on the promise of that future now and not wait for the war to be over and hope that, you know, magically a switch will be, will be turned because democracy is hard work. You know, freedom is not free, as they say. Thank you, Masha. Thank you. So questions from the room or from Kyrgyzstan? From, from, we're online. So, Kyrgyzstan, do you have any? Ah, Elizabeth. Are you coming, is there a question here? Oh, good. Yes, yes, excellent. Thank you, Elizabeth. So hi, I'm, I'm Eric Boyle. We're all inspired, of course, by the Ukrainians' resilience, and we're all united in our support for Ukraine. I'm just curious, Ukraine has also dealt with a torrent of misinformation and disinformation, especially around democratic issues, both before and also during the war. Are there any lessons for combating misinformation and disinformation that'll be important in terms of thinking about Ukraine after the war? Thank you. No, it's a, it's a good question. Katya, Peter, you both have thought a lot about the propaganda war, the misinformation, both leading up to in, even now, thoughts on Katya 1st, you and then Peter? No, thank you very much for the question, actually. Actually, I was the one who started the role of propaganda in DApps and published a paper years ago titled Hybrid Analytica in Europe, mostly, and in the United States. Well, I believe that this problem is finally being recognized, not only in Ukraine, you know, where there was a very huge impact and influence of Russian propaganda, but also in here, in the European Union, in the United States, we finally see all these outlets of Russian propaganda being closed, one after another in many European countries, and we finally recognize that this was a very strong factor, you know, that undermined our democracies from within. I don't know if Russia will continue its efforts to influence the minds and hearts of citizens of European democracies of the United States, but we see how successful they are right now within Russia. There is 100% propaganda from all Russian state-controlled TVs, which completely brainwashed the society, which now overwhelmingly supports the brutal, ruthless, crazy war that their leader had started, and we see the damage that propaganda can achieve and made for the future of these people. It will take centuries, maybe, to overdo the harm that had been caused to Russians, primarily, by the propaganda that has been funded from their own pocket. Crazy, incredible, you know, but it will take time. It will take time. Very good point. Peter, anything to add? This information has, unfortunately, become one of the most corrosive elements in the fabric of our societies, and especially in democracy and within elections. And there is a lot of work being done by international stakeholders and by Ukrainians to counter this. IFAS is part of that, and partners of ours such as NDI, IRI and others are involved in working against this disinformation. I believe one of the most important weapons we have is education. When we are combating this, it is to get a broader understanding for the nature of disinformation and a more critical consumption of information. And I think in Ukraine we've actually seen that tendency that people have increasingly become aware of, that they need to look twice at anything that they read. It's in the very important part of the curriculum of our civic education course that we have in universities all over Ukraine is more critical reading, more critical consumption of media. I also think that it's something that we suffer from throughout the world. It's not a Ukrainian thing, obviously. We focus on that because Russia has internally and towards Ukraine spent immense resources on using it, weaponizing information, in fact. But the reality of it, it happens everywhere, and it isn't always by foreign entities. It also happens within. Ukraine has a great tradition of significant political competition, and there's also disinformation in that, same as there is in the United States. So I do think that the one key is certainly identification of disinformation and better education on consumption of information, and I think that is taking place. Thank you, Peter. Thank you. Other questions, or Kirill, do you have, yes, online? Yes, I have an online question. So what international institutions can help Ukraine win the peace, such as the UN, OSCE, or the EU? International organizations can help Ukraine win the peace. Peter, you want to start there, as heading up? The answer is really all. I think everyone must engage the best they can and make the contribution they can. The important part of that is coordination, is to make sure that we work well together as an international community and that the significant cohort of friends of Ukraine continuously see to that we live different tasks well and often together. IFAS is the Secretariat of the International Coordination Group for Democracy Governance Issues, and we continuously work with all of our partners, all embassies, all donors, all international organizations to ensure that we have the best coordinated support that we can offer Ukraine as we go forward. I don't necessarily think that it's a matter about choosing between, for example, the UN and OSCE both have a significant role, and we see renewed efforts now in Ukraine. The UN has come back very strong, OSCE has opened a new mission, and IFAS has the honor of working together with all of these in direct support of the electoral and the democracy agenda. Is there a coordination mechanism among these various? There is formal coordination mechanisms on all the different reform areas, but specifically on democracy and governance, including elections. There is a group chaired by the US and Canada that continuously make sure that the international friends of Ukraine are well coordinated and deliver the best possible assistance. I think Masha wants to turn to you. You go? Yes, yes, Masha. I just like to, I mean, I completely agree with Peter. I think it takes a village, in this case a global village, to help Ukraine build its future. Coordination is key, and most importantly, coordination is key with the Ukrainians themselves, because I think that sometimes we, I mean, I think we all have, we love Ukraine, we have done a very important job in terms of supporting Ukraine. But Ukraine and Ukrainians are the biggest agents in determining their own future, and I think we shouldn't take that agency away. They are the ones who will determine what is going to happen next. You know, working with the international community, but it's important that we not overestimate our own role and frankly our own influence. It has to come from the Ukrainians themselves for it to be successful. Masha, excellent point, excellent point. So, I can see the clock here. There may be other questions that some of you in this room want to put to Peter and to Katya. It'll be hard to pose them to Masha, but outside this hall here, right outside, there will be light refreshments, if you would like to have an opportunity to talk to them. Let me, I'll thank Peter and Katya in a second, but the important of this conversation, it seems to me, is we've all said it. Tony, you said it, Elise said it. Ukraine needs to win this war in order for all this to happen. Ukraine needs to win this war, and for that to happen, we need to continue to provide the support, like President Biden said, as long as it takes, to victory. He should add that second phrase, and unity will be required within Ukraine, and that's a challenge, and unity will be required among its allies and friends and supporters around the world. And that's the challenge, and Masha points out that all of this has to happen now, starting now. The Democratic, the winning the peace can't wait for the victory. The victory will come, but then is the hard part, the decentralization that Peter talked about. So this is, as Masha said, an important conversation. Let me thank Peter, Katya, Masha, for your time. Please join me in thanking these panelists and join us outside with the other panel.