 We are calling the Tuesday, January 23rd, Middlesex Select Board special meeting to order at 5.05. First order of business is to approve the minutes of January 16th, the regular select board meeting, action likely. So we were all here, right? Three of us? Everybody was here. Okay, is there any discussion about the approving of the minutes? Is there a motion? Is there a motion to approve the minutes of January 16th, 2020, the regular select board meeting? Okay, is there a second board? Okay. All those in favor of approving the minutes? Say aye. Aye. Okay. And now we're going to approve the agenda. And do we have amendments for it, Sarah, for January 23rd, which is now today? I just added an amendment at the bottom when we approved the warning to set a date for an informational meeting for Article 7. If you guys decide to go with that, because it's a public question, we have to have an informational meeting before it's completed. Read the excavator, like buying an excavator? Yeah. Okay. Okay, so is there a motion to approve this amended agenda? I'll make the motion that we approve the amended agenda for January 23rd, 2024, special select board meeting? Is there a second? Second. Alrighty. We have a first and a second, and all those in favor say aye. Okay, so Sophie, you are up. This is 505. We're considering renewal of higher collectives indoor cultivator tier one small cultivator license at 75 Gilmette Road operated by Sam Antrim and Sophie Bowen are action likely. So Sophie, you have the floor to just tell us a little bit about this. And I guess at this point there's no paperwork, but we just have to give you either a verbal approval or not, right? Is that what you understand? Yeah, I think that's what they need. So we're tier one cannabis business. We aren't, we're on the same property but a different building. We're up for our renewal. We got licensed on February 16th, I think it was last year. And as Sarah was saying, this is a new thing that they're requesting. So I'm not sure quite any other, what else do you need? I don't think, I think that we just need to hear that you're looking to renew this license as everything's going fine with the business. Everything's fine. We're just working really hard to keep up. And yeah, we're using- Are the neighbors, any complaints from the neighbors or anything like that? We have 30 acres there. So we don't even see our neighbors from our shop, the spot or on our property, so. And you said you're indoor culture. So you're growing in a greenhouse or something? We're growing on, well, we've got our whole property 75, but it was, we bought a section, a different section from the McGraths a long time ago. 51, I think was their address. So it's in a different structure from our house. And we're not using right now the amount of square foot that we're actually legally allowed to. Okay. And do you know it's just a yearly license that we renew? Yeah. All right. Does anyone have any questions for Sophie? Nope. No, okay. So is there a motion to approve a renewal of higher collectives indoor cultivator to your one small cultivator license? We'll make that motion. All righty. Is there a second? Okay. All righty. All those in favor of approving the renewal of the license say aye. Aye. Okay. So Sophie, it looks like you can let your people know that we approved it and maybe you need to copy in the minutes for something like that. I'll just copy the minutes. Okay. So you'll get a copy of the minutes that show that we approved your license. Wonderful. Thank you. And so I should send it to the CCB board and you had mentioned you would send it but I'm happy to send it to. You know what, I'll just CC both of you. How about that Sophie? Okay. Sounds great. Sounds great. Thank you so much. You're welcome. Thank you. Have a great day. Have a good meeting. Bye bye. Okay. Highway report, do you have everything you need for starting slightly early on the highway report, Eric? Yeah. Okay. Why don't you give us a little update on what's happening on the town routes? Let's see. We have two trucks in operation. The third one is at the dealer and they have ordered the parts to repair it and they do not know how long that'll take. I talked to them this afternoon and it was ordered but he did not have a date on when the parts would actually be in to fix it. Oh, let's see. So two trucks does not mean one truck plus the grader. We have two trucks and one grader. Okay. And that's about where we're at. You took the international to. Oh, yes. They went to MacLeod's to have some suspension work done on it and that is back and back for safe operation. That was out for two and a half days or three days. We have weather tonight. And not snow less than an inch, they're callable. How's your gravel? For your sand? Sand. For the play sand. Yeah, play sand. Okay. Anyone have any questions for Eric about the roads? How did the signage situation go for shitty or all of those calls? I am acquiring some. We didn't have any calls. Any other questions? Questions, anyone? All righty. That's it. All right. Thank you very much. Wow, are we? Oh, sorry. Go right ahead. I'm sorry. Has anybody been in touch with Steve Martin? I talked to him earlier today. Is he feeling better? Yes. Yeah. I meant to call him today. Yeah, I called him this afternoon and he was working in his office and he would be in touch with us. That's what we said. All righty. Anything else? That's it. Good. Thank you, Eric. Jeff is on his way. He's not here with us. Okay. And we have Zara here. Zara, I'm assuming that Mark is coming too, right? For the budget. Like we're way ahead now. Yeah, and he likes to come when he's allotted to come. Yeah, I don't know. Yeah. I'm sure if we could shoot him an email just to see if he may be at home and he may be available and be happy to join. But are the other guys coming too? Like Elias and all that? Elias had a different meeting and I know that George was planning on being here online and I guess Randy's not there tonight. He was the only one I had not heard from. But if you wanted to start, I feel like Mark has done a pretty successful job. But let me, I'll send him an email right now. Actually, I'm gonna text him. Okay. Why don't you do that and we'll move forward. I'd like to wait for him. I don't wanna like jump ahead just because we have the time. Because there's other things that we can do that don't really require. Yeah. Don't we have to go to the fire department? Jeff's not here yet and he's the one with the report. Oh, was today the day we were supposed, nobody was supposed to go to Welch Park? That's my voice. Okay. Jeez. But wait a minute. I don't see anything about fire station here. No, I see five. I'm sorry. I skipped right over. I wrote all over it. Okay. All right. So yeah, Jeff's not here. Wait here any minute. Okay. So, you know what, Zara, just hold off unless you've already done it. I just texted him saying that they're ready for us now. You guys wanna do jump down to the liquor licenses? Yeah. Let's do the approving class one and two liquor license renewals for the local action possible. Is that like a piece of paper you have? You know, no longer. We just have to say. It's like a cannabis thing. Okay. They're online. All right. They will for them for their class one and five. Okay. And everybody knows what the local is. Okay. Is there a motion to approve class one and two liquor license renewals for the local? I saw a move. Okay. Second. Alrighty. All those in favor of those two liquor licenses, say aye. Aye. Aye. Okay. The select board report, we can look at that. Is that something you wrote, Sarah? Yeah. I sent it to you. I'll write it. I don't have a copy of it. Okay. I didn't bring my computer. I did. That's good. Thank you. I have a copy. Right here. Oh. Take that. Alrighty. Would I, should I read it aloud? No, because we want it to be a special when people read it. All I just want to know is if it passes and that's what you guys will put it in. Okay. That only happened this last year, the most expired apartment. That's how the year began. And then the ranking. You guys need any, you don't need a card. No, I'm reading this. This is like my Christmas letter, going over everything that happened during the year, so I can remember. It was a pretty crazy year. Does anyone get mail? Do you get mail, Jeff? I don't. I don't get mail. Something yesterday, but... I think we've got it like once a week now. That's why I put this thing on the warning about nailing out postcards and the nailing on the town reports soon. No, a committal answer from the post office about what they're going to deal with the situation. We're going to be swamped with it. We're already sending out presidential primary ballots and every single town is sending out presidential primary ballots, school ballots, town ballots, they're all separate. They're going to be absolutely overwhelmed. You don't know how they're going to function. So... I don't know. In the old days, we used to, but not anymore. Washington, the school district is sending everybody a town to the school ballot. So everybody's going to get it from Washington. Some towns are sending to the school and they don't have the board vote. They're all going to send to school and then how they get it. The career center has to be separate. Secretary of State's office wants the presidential primary ballots so separate that they gave a special envelope just for the presidential primary ballots. So we can't really send them out. I have to send out the presidential primary ballots within three days after getting a request. That's all going to be horrible and expensive and wasteful. And I don't see how the post office is going to keep up. Here's Jeff. Here comes Jeff. Okay. So I have read this. The only thing I would say is make sure that she's okay with you saying due to medical issues, because the whole town is going to read it. Okay, we've said it a million times on that. I know, but I'm just saying that more people read it than I hear it. That's all. Because you can have a daily use of phone call. I know. That's a good point. But across nine months. So we could, if you guys want to, move that we approve the... You want to read it? I said it's a job. I looked it over. I make the motion that we approve the select board report. Okay. Okay. All those in favor? Aye. Okay. Great. The ayes have it. You've been approved, Sarah. Okay. Okay. So now we are back to... Do we have everyone from the fire department? Is anyone joining online? Scott did. Oh, Scott did. Okay. Hi, Scott. Hi, Liz. I'm doing good. Good. Thanks for coming. All right. You guys are up with the monthly meeting of your updates to us. So take it away. Okay. So we finished up 2023 with 99 calls. We've had some so far, 11 in January, 14 for the reporting period, but certainly have an extra week. That's not unusual. We had two mutual aid outs, no mutual aid ins. Some of the interesting things, the max response was eight. The min response was three. Normally it's one. And our average members per call that come forward four and a half. So that's a big help. As far as the calls are there on the list, I do want to point out two. On the 11th of January, they happened within about 10 minutes of each other. One was to Worcester, and they only had one person that could respond. We responded to that with an engine. We had another one in Middlesex that we were able to send people to as well. So we're feeling a lot of calls and we're being able to make the calls and not have to call for help. As far as our training, we actually had two trainings. We had CPR on the 2nd of January, and then we went to all the two of us went to the Olympian Battery Awareness class that was put on by the Vermont Fire Academy over in Berry. I hope you don't park your car near your house. That's all I can say. Please. Boom! Work night, station cleanup. We did have to get a new tire on engine one. And we had a total of 16 calls so far for the fast squad. Again, that numbers up a little bit, but that's because there's an extra week in our reporting period. And the big thing is we have two new members. One was a junior, and the other one was somebody from Bordermen. So we're up to 13 people now. It's the right number. If you want to take a seat right now. That's all we have. What is CNX mean? Cancelled? Cancelled, okay. So we had like the BSPAN, you cancel this call before we could even get out of the door, which is always nice to have with us a headset like that. Okay. Especially when the weather's clear. And the new rescue's been out seven times this period. So we're using it quite a bit. What happened to the old one? We're going to try to sell it in the springtime. There's no point trying to sell it now. We picked everything off of it except for the generator. And we haven't taken lights off, but we wouldn't use those lights in it because they're old and they use up a lot of electricity. Yeah. LEDs are much nicer. Well, congratulations on getting two new members. That's great. Especially a young person that's less. Yes. And he lives in more counties in our catchment area. So it works out well. Um, do you have questions for the fact of our questions? I do have a topic I did want to bring up. It wasn't on this. I did go to Berlin because they're looking at combining the town like we did. They're different than what we were, but they wanted me to talk to see how things went. But one of the things I had mentioned about our stipends and how much we get paid and the response from their group is that even though your members aren't underneath the town, you really should look at doing minimum wage for everybody per hour only. So we're running some numbers to see where that goes. That may be something that we... How much do we get them now? It's $10.87 an hour apart from the price. And we used to give something ridiculous like $2.00. $2.50 I started 19 years ago. It went up to $5.00 and hung at $5.00 for a year. But like a stipend, a weird little stipend. And then it went to $10.00. And we... Because that was part of the buy loss, we had to change it every time. So what we did is we changed it to cost of living increase. Okay, Jeff, I did what you said. I think you said $10.87. So you get $10.87 and something or...? $10.87 an hour are part there. So if we go an hour and 10 minutes and it's $2.00. So that would be something for next year's budget. We would be looking at... Yeah, we're going to see... Run our numbers from like this... The reporting period for the end of December. And see where we sit. And then... And what we have budgeted to see how that's going to impact. The select board still will have to make and approve those changes. If you change it per hour, because you are now running into the town. But the members are not part of the town. Doesn't matter. Then if we're employees, then it should be automatic right now. If you're saying we're part of the town, then the town is not paying a spend of wage. So if you want to call that card... I'm not calling the card. I'm just telling you that the select board approves that part of it. The stipends are a part of our membership that's separate from the cap. What... The stipends are in the budget? They're in the budget. But it's paid to the members which aren't part of the town. So if you're going to say that we're part of the town, then you're violating the law by not paying minimum wage. So take your pick on what you want to do. Well, hold on, Jeff. This isn't about getting into a fight about it. This is like figuring out what we need to do. Right, and we're going to look at numbers to see if it's going to impact what we budgeted for. Right, so I think what you're saying is, and correct me if I'm wrong, let's just see, what is your stipend right now? Is it saying 97? No, I don't mean that. What is the budget like right now? Oh, 15,000. Okay, so you're saying you're going to look back and see how much we actually spend. Right. And then say, if we turn that into, and we assume that that would be the same more or less the same amount that we might spend this year, if that became $15 an hour, whatever minimum wage is. 13, that's it. Then you would say that multiplied by however many hours is actually 17,000. And so we don't have enough budgeted or it's actually 13,000. We have plenty of budgeted. Right, that's what we're going to look at. Okay, that's what you're doing. Okay, so I mean, I would venture to guess that more of the concern would be if we don't have the money, right? Not so much of whether or not we raise the minimum, we raise the stipend to a minimum wage. I don't know. Where did that come from? Is that just a carryover? Yeah, that's been, and it's been part of the budget ever since I started in 2004 and been part of the budget since then. And that's when it was 250 a column. And then we've slowly gotten it to be more. And then when we combine, that's why I brought up when we did this combination last year is that we're the people are not employees of the town. Right, people are separate. I think it's that what the fire department in Berlin is trying to say is that at the very least, your stipend should be the equivalent of minimum wage, not minimum wage. Like we're paying you a salary, like it should, the dollar value should equal the equivalent of the wage, which I think it's going to be $20 an hour. The other question that came up previously was that the select board approves all those, and that's how that's what I'm speaking to. It's not my call, so that's what I was told. The select board never approved our bankers. I think we know because you weren't part of it. You weren't part of the of our of the town. But then it was discussed when you became part of the town. That you guys, it's just like the anybody coming to the select board asking for an increase in something they approve all the wages. I know it's a stipend, but it's not a wage. So that's what I'm saying is the select board will need to weigh in on this is all I'm saying. Yeah, and Sarah, do we have like some agreement that we had with the with the fire department when we was there anything like formally written when they became. And if it's part of the budget, just remind you guys, the select board puts a budget out for the voters to approve, and they can be amended from the floor at town meeting. That's a good point. So you should figure out what that. Yeah, that's where it's just now really is and bring it up. Well, it may not even be an issue. It might not be an issue, right? Cause you haven't spent, if you haven't spent your whole statement, I get you. Yeah, okay. Well, that's good to know. And what other towns like ours, Sarah. Or have a fire department, you know, like the relationship. Sorry, I don't know. You don't know, but you're saying Berlin wants to become sort of like they've been working on it for a couple of years. Oh, I'm sorry, I just don't hesitate to say. No, I was just wondering, Sarah, I didn't quite hear that. I think I heard it. It's about the select board approves. So the select board, when you approve a budget, what you're saying is you're proving a budget to be to present to the town voters, right? And the town voters, if you're going to be, if you're going to put at that point, it's going to be on the ballot that voters have yes or no. But if when the budget goes to the floor of a town meeting, voters can say, they can modify the budget, they can stand up and say, I don't want to pay this for that, or, and they can vote on it. This, the Susan Clark stuff starts off with that grand number. And then it's supposed to be. Oh, don't like discuss. Jeff knows he has every single town meeting, right? Jeff. And, you know, back in the days when the board Carlson was around, he would, he would complain about 250 bucks spent on a brush to wipe off the greater. Remember that day. Yeah. So, I thought that's what you said. Yeah. Thank you. And we are having a person here at the school. Okay. Okay. Are there any other questions for the fire department? Thank you for your service. Congratulations on your new recruits. Okay, let's see it is now. We're a little early for the budget. Did we think allies was going to be said no right because our allies is not coming so you feel comfortable with the two of you here. And we'll be forward before 545. Okay. So, we are going to review and approve the fiscal year 2025 budget action. Anything new since when we last. So I think from the last meeting, which is the question of whether to increase the HSA, but then again, Sarah and subsequent email, I think may have changed that approach. Sarah, do you have anything to contribute. I think the email is having health insurance. There's really nothing we can do about it in the stage that this time of the year. So which means the budget is what it is. Yes, but duly noted for next year. Well, here's the problem. So. So the issue is that the open enrollment is in the middle of our fiscal year. Yeah. So the thing that we sent on Friday was just to show that the HSA can divide it all out. Actually, you can get this the town can even save a few bucks by going to a different health care. So there's really no impact on the budget at all. I think that is six of one and half dozen of an idea. My issue was that I wasn't gonna buy was losing $10,000 in compensation. I'm happy about it. Sarah has a question. I just wanted to, I just wanted to say thank you for looking that up and say that I looked at everything and I don't see why we wouldn't go for the goal. Plus plan, which is $12 more than the goal plan and, and makes people's budget the lowest it can be for not much more money. And you still have this agent, it's still a same HSA contribution. No, there's no HSA there's just a. I think the agent saying you divide it all out and spend it on premiums versus an agent that. But that's the thing we can't do right now. I don't personally. I don't think it has any impact on the budget that I don't think it has huge impact. Okay. When we revisit it in December, whenever the open enrollment is, and we are able to look at the things then, you know, we know that we probably have budgeted enough that we won't that switch. The whole certainly worth considering. Yeah, okay. All right. So, I guess, no, then I think that would be the only thing. There was as of last meeting. Yeah, unless there's something that's come up in between. Peter asked me to check to watch what the deal was as far as when somebody reached retirement age. It's a blue cross thing that an employer under 20 employees must go to Medicare. And then that becomes 1st, and then anything else is secondary. And they do offer secondary. So that was the answer to that. Okay, so, and that's full time for the one employees. Yeah, which we don't have 20. Okay. So, I know I talked with Randy today and he feels comfortable, even though there's only 3 of us voting on the budget. Like for us to fill without him. And Sarah, you said to Peter to Peter son that you said that Peter has given Google the other budget. Okay. Okay, so are there any more questions about the budget because this is now the time that 3 of us are going to either vote for it or and this is what we're presenting to the town. Or a floor discussion. So this could change. I just have better for worse. I just said one comment in the actual budget report. I didn't put the budget amount in. What. So we need to add it. Oh, right. So we need that final number. It will be 1,845,500. That is an 11.36% increase. And amend that to send that back to Sarah. And I just ask a question though. Okay. This leads us to into the next thing, but it's related to the budget. A town. 7, it's article seven. We're not going to pay for it. Is that right? We're not paying for it this year. No. Right. Is that what it is? So it's not in here. January 1. Okay. Yeah. Okay. Are you asking why that is probably changing. No. But the 200,000 isn't. Here because we're not going to spend it in this. But depending when you take out, you have a year from the time you take out the loan. Or to make your first payment. So I don't know when they're anticipating purchases. I think Eric City wanted to do that. So. I don't know. We're not going to buy it. Okay. I think it's July 1. That was, that was. That was the five. Previously after June. Yeah. July 1. What year. This year. So I guess this is what I don't understand. So if they take, if they buy it on July 2nd. Of 2024. Yeah. The first payment will be due. In July 2nd. That's all I had to ask. Okay. So is there any more discussion about. The fiscal year 2025 sound budget. Discussion. No. I think we. Discuss. I think we read it to death. But I just want to make sure because you haven't been here. For a double time that we've done this. I don't know if you were. Like the processor begins in October. And then it comes and presents their budget. And then the last few meetings where you've been at is when we're sort of hashing out the whole thing. So all those in favor. Of approving the fiscal year. No, I'm sorry. Is there a motion. To approve. Okay. All right. Is there a second? All right. All those in favor of the approval of the fiscal year 2025 budget. Okay. I'm going to make it clear that that is $1,845 $845,508. Correct. Yes. Yes. So we're going to put them in the motion. All those in favor say aye. Aye. The aides have it. Okay. Thank you. Budget committee for all of your work on this. I know it's a lot of work. And I know you've spent some time. Your own personal time. I appreciate it. And I would also ask you if Zara and. Mark and maybe Elias. Plan to be at town meetings. I think it would be helpful if there were questions that the board. Felt like maybe better. Answered. Or if we have a question that you guys would be available to help us answer the question. Are you going to be at the town? Okay. So it just would be helpful to have. You available to help answer questions. I don't know if Peter is going to be here. I don't. I kind of think he won't, but I don't know. Yes. I'm unfortunately going to miss town meeting this year because. I'll be traveling. Okay. Great. Well, thank you for letting us know. But Mark, it sounds like you will be there. I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. Barring any unforeseen. Roadblocks. Okay. All right. So we are still ahead of schedule. So we can review approved. I don't know. Okay. Here it comes. We can review approve and sign the March 5th, 2024 town meeting morning. Action likely and 78 date within 10 days of Martin. Okay. So we're in informational meeting on article seven. Or the article about the excavator action likely. Okay. So here is our. Morning. We need an article six to put the budget amount, Sarah. I just put it in. Okay, great. And. So this is your, this is your morning. So this is your chance to chime in. Yes, I know. Okay. Do you want to explain about article seven? Since Eric's not here. Yes, please explain our article seven. And then I have to make one more comment about article eight. Okay. So Eric pointed out that. They need a new excavator. And the reason why an article like this goes on the ballot is because the indebtedness is more than five years. So the. It can just be voted from the floor. We did that once we had to redo it with a fire truck. So Eric thinks that it won't be at 200,000, but it. So that's why we boarded it to now to exceed $200,000 to be financed over a period not to exceed 15 years. So I talked to Dorenda last week and she mentioned something like thanks for working at 10 years, but whatever this gives you the this gives you the flexibility to borrow money for an exit. Provided it has. And then the other thing I want to ask you guys is so looking at the bottom. And I wanted to add it a. Something about bike. I use this for you. This is for instance, straight out of deal. I think it's a great opportunity. About. A lot of people notice by no, no, by postcard versus mailing the town reports mailing is getting very expensive. And I just think that people just toss these town reports. And we'll have stacks of them in, in the office and we'll have stacks from the school and we'll have stacks of them at the town meeting. So if it's okay with you, I would really like to have that freedom not to do that next year. Yes. So it's okay. But you see how the mail is going to be so screwed up. Wait, but. So, so you did have to mail it this year. Well, yeah, that doesn't get us out of to 20. Okay. It's out of 2020. Okay. I think that's a good article. I'm probably not even going to get mine. Neither chef. I don't get mail anymore. We might. Not really great for voting. Okay, so that's fine. Any questions for anyone about article seven? No. So article eight, the only thing that I wanted to say was, I believe my, when I look back on my notes that I took with the meeting with BIA, they said on the safe side, we should probably ask for 65,000. 65? Yeah. Because of the price of things having gone up. So what I'm suggesting is we'd say not to exceed or up to 65,000 and say 55,000 and 10,000. You guys still feel the same way about the construction manager? Well, you know, I would welcome you, Jeff, to weigh in on it. I mean, I think if it's, I mean, I don't know enough about construction. I don't know enough about construction management to say whether or not, I just don't know what the alternative is. Like who, how does the job get done without a construction manager? So question first, that we're asking the taxpayers to bless up to 65,000 theoretically for the exploratory phase of this thing, or I as a resident wasn't necessarily aware that we were contemplating spending two million and change on a renovation of this building. So should that be discussed as well? And this $55,000 ask is ahead of maybe on $2.1 million renovating the structure. So we have a Q&A that Sandy has put together that she's going to be posting on her porch forum that we're going to get the word out, put it on the website that explains like it's a frequently asked questions thing about this town hall renovation so that people feel that they have some sort of understanding of it. Unfortunately, and I just remember this from my experience as a new person to middle sex. If I didn't do my research, I couldn't just like start asking questions. Like, what's this all about? Right? It's like, I either know what I'm voting for or I don't. And so I don't want to put any like other numbers on here for like a potential, I mean, I would say a potential middle sex town hall renovation. Like a potential future kind of thing because people may think we're already doing a renovation. Okay. Well, it may not like me not know anything about it. Right. Yeah. I just want to make sure that this is a floor discussion. This is not a vote. I mean, I'm just going to ask for another $2 million later. We spent $65 on exploring and designing. Right. And like the 2.1 in front of them and people say, no. That's the whole point of this. Yeah. But it should be clear that we're asking for this. Yes. To that. Yes. Somebody might say, sure. Go ahead and look into it. And then they realize it's $100 million later and say, yeah. Okay. So this is a floor discussion. This is not a vote. People aren't checking off a box. So people are going to hear about it. So this, we have this one pager. And that people will also, I think we plan to give it out at town meeting, like have it be on people's chairs so that they have a, they can look at it, but there will be discussion. I'm sure there'll be a lively discussion about it. And the purpose of this is if people don't have a stomach for it, then we know there's no point in putting a bond out if they're not going to. If they don't want to take this next phase, which really gives a comprehensive cost analysis of what this is going to entail. So that's really where this came from. So, but can you say potential renovation on that? I don't see why not. Yeah. Yeah, and make it 55 so that's a total of 65. So what if we break in that broken down or don't even break it down, break it down. To allocate up to 65,000. Okay. And I would say up to 65 because it may not cost a 65 question. So I was just going to give a small piece of construction advice. Don't hire somebody for a construction manager position just because that's their job title. I've worked in more buildings than I can count where the construction manager had no idea about electrical code. Building code in general, they just designed the building. They were assigned to oversee it. And projects go a year, year and a half, two years, and then double their budget. And because they just don't have the actual construction experience to what actually takes to build a building. They just know how to design it. And then their title is construction manager or superintendent or whatever. Good to know. I think the, we have recommendations from the architect and, and they're, and there are actually very sort of there's not that many, I think that would actually respond to this bid and there's a couple that do municipal building so I think that's sort of where, you know, we're headed in that direction of being advised of, you know, we would have to put out a bid anyway, but he advised of the ones and Dave knows some of them to who work on smaller projects like this. One other question we have access to the final the final drawings that they submit if we can move forward with this. Oh yeah, like all of that is becomes public it gets put on their websites. So yes, for sure. Yeah. Yeah, I mean, I would echo everything he just said, dealing with big projects from a, you know, not a hands on process side of the house but paying for it with these construction managers are often in a way. They don't necessarily do much as far as sourcing and solving problems and GC if it's a big construction company. They don't really care about this person they've got a project manager on it. To me if we were to high break somebody in a sizable contractor they would bring their own personal that you know granted one of us will have to interface on to solve all the little problems that come up through the project like that but That was just on the, it was just on the design. Yeah, I don't remember what it was Jeff what the percentages I think I heard 20 something. I mean, you know, and, you know, the comments to me and I can ask her again I can ask the idea again, like, you know what the alternative would would look like. I sort of made it out that like this day and age like it's behooves you to have a construction manager because of the sourcing and because of the time and the lack of workers and all that stuff and when they can bundle things with other projects. You would have a better chance of like getting the work done that actually needs to get done and getting the costs that down to how you want it. I just don't think that you'll see an independent. Yeah, I'm not much forward to contract. It's a material sharing this that they're going to necessarily want somebody running around rounding up like, you know, like a window. Yeah. Well, so what I would say Sarah is just just if you can say maybe. Yeah, what does it say shall the town allocate up to $65,000 to pay for the design phase of the potential middle-sec town hall renovation. Yes. And then we can talk about. And you can talk about the photo. Yeah, now we don't want to spend that much money or we want to move the town hall or. Yeah, we want to build new whatever at least that's how we get a feeling for. Yeah, that sounds good. Do you mind me just explain to Jeff that we've the board was at one time looking at just allocating this money and then they came into this discussion like, well, should we go out for a bond and then take this money out of the bond to pay for this. But the bond was a big separate bond but it was also not going to be timely for whatever plans we needed because we've got this municipal energy resilience program. So these these brand thin lines breathing down, but this was a way of testing the water. So to speak. Yeah. And then people said, no, we don't want to spend $65,000. We sure as hell don't want to spend $2 million. Right. We're done. Right. I'm going to go down to the other print out. Okay. Thanks, sir. So are there any more. Questions about the warning. Comments. So. On that. Yep. Who's going to answer the question. Are you the one are you going to answer the questions. I guess I am. I'm going to do my best. I mean, I. And no, David's going to be there too. David is going to be there to help. Sandy will be there too. Sandy will be there too. Sandy Levine. Only 850% from my council on aging. Sorry. Oh, I'm thinking so for my home health and hospice. Nevermind. Okay, there's the library again. Yep. Waterbury senior center. Is there a month, yeah, 4,000 for the Montpelier senior center. Youth first mandatory. North branch already the old. Okay. I'm going to go like this. I didn't rip it up. Okay, so is there a motion. To approve the warning for the annual town meeting. For March 5th, 2024. I will make the motion. Thank you. Yay. Your first motion. All those in favor of the morning. For middle six town meetings. Say aye. Aye. The eyes have it. Now you all have now we need to sign. Thank you. So pass it down. So thank you. Did I rip up my agenda? No, I didn't. Here it is. Alrighty. Oh, we are still in the middle six town meeting. Okay. Did I rip up my agenda? No, I didn't. Here it is. Alrighty. Oh, we are still ahead of schedule. Thank you, Mark. Okay. 615 treasure report. You ready to give it to us in advance? Yeah. Dear treasurer. We have to approve the bat children. Yeah. To prove that. I have. We received finally issued our first female money. Oh, $5,000 and $63. That's for the trash. Okay. I thought we already got that. No, no. She began our first $5,000. I'm the dancer. So. Yeah. So, yeah, that was. That's that. That was that. I do have two small corrections on. The audit report on, but it's nothing to do with numbers or anything. They just, they call the. Well, Kelly fund, the Welch Park. Okay. And they, there was another one in there that I got written down. So. Fine. But those were two corrections. Other than that. I didn't see anything else. Okay. Good. Yeah. So did everyone get a chance to. Peruse through the audit. The really fascinating. Literature. Bedtime literature. I did too. I asked. Darynda a few questions because I. Have challenged challenges reading that. Report. I mean, it's hard. You don't know what you're reading. But during it was very helpful. So. If there's no questions. Is there an emotion to approve the fiscal 23 audit of town finance is conducted by that shoulder associates. So. All right. Is there a second? Okay. All those in favor of passing. The approval of the audit, say I. I. All right. Is there anything else you want to. All righty. So we have gone to other business and looks like we're not approving the 2024 certificate of highway mileage. So. Let me ask you something. As of February 10th of 2024. So if possible, we might be able to squeeze both park in there and make it a class three highway. I stay chinching to get money. So we're kind of holding on. Well, if we can. Maybe if you have a public hearing on the six and people are like, yeah, we don't want both parts arrived. We don't have a class three town road. We don't have a class three town road. But there's no. You might as well see if we can squeeze them. Okay. Hold on. I don't think we set a date. Oh yeah. We didn't do that. So it's got to be. They feel T. I don't remember last time the statue is very, it's very wonky, but feel CT and clarified. Informate because we've got a couple of questions on the Australian ballot. You have to have an informational meeting. And it's got to be within 10 days. Okay. March 5th. You have a meeting on February 6th, February 10th to be kind of a slow time. You might want to move your second meeting toward the end of February. So let's just look at the calendar. Yeah. Are normally where the first and third. Which we still are remitting it in the Welch Park on the fifth. I mean at five o'clock on the six. The 20th. So wait, what are you proposing? I'm sorry. I'm sorry. It's not even been 10 days. Okay. So isn't that 10 days? I don't know. I gotta go use my calendar. Yeah. It's 10 days before the fifth. We can do it on the 20th. Okay. Great. So we could have our public meeting be on the 20th. Awesome. All right. Great. We don't have to vote on that. Do we? No. Okay. Okay. So the orders. Do we have orders? We do. Okay. Okay. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. April come through. I looked at that. They did a lot of overtime. Those boys. We must have had some snow storms. What's there any, there's no concern about someone working. Legally. Fortune hours a day. I thought they would work for two hours a day. That's fine. That's fine. Okay. Is there a cap on the number of days? I'm thinking with the CDL license, right? I can't have over 70 hours. Okay. Okay. Okay. Okay. Okay. I mean, it didn't look like there was, well, there was never, um, no one had 70 hours, but, um, I just didn't know if there was something around like how many hours. And I thought we had something where we make people stop clowning at a certain time, like nine o'clock or 10 o'clock. I think that's our, that's our, uh, that you're getting that from our, our highway policy with policy. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. Okay. Okay. Okay. Okay. So these are the orders guys. If you want to start looking at them and then, um, so, uh, correspondence. Um, we've received the email from you. You know, you know, you know, you know, you know, you know, you know, you know, you know, you know, you know, you know, you know, you know, you know, you know, you know, you know, you know, you know, you know, you know, you know, you know, you, I think was the answer. And then from this, um, we received the email from you, Samantha with the videos that was it only correspondence? I received anything. Um, Although we did also receive a correspondence. Was that this this time from. Um, Zach's partner? of correspondence. I can't remember when she did that a couple weeks ago maybe. So I, did you get that video from Samantha? Okay, I personally couldn't see anything, I'll be honest. I looked at it and I mean I saw him like put his foot on the snow and a little snowball fell in the road. And I saw your video of like some snow on the side of the road. And I personally, I mean I'm not, I don't live there but I didn't, I mean I see snow on the road all the time. I'm a driveway everywhere. So I guess I didn't, and I see, I could not literally see in the video like any actions that were happening. Maybe it was so small. Good to see him come out of, out of the driveway and kick the snow. I'm sorry just standing there like touched a snowball and it kind of rolled. But you're, you know, I don't mean any offense, I'm not any offense or any, I mean I'm walking on pins and needles here because I don't want to get accused of not being sensitive to your, to your cross. But from what I got, from what I saw, you're basically what you're saying is you don't, anything that's in that 50 foot right away. No, no, no road, the road. So what my concern is not the right way. It's a roadway. So if it's in obstruction in the roadway, that's my concern. And it was bigger than a snowball. It was actually an ice chunk. So if it was a snowball, it would have fell apart like when it kicked it and pulled it into the road. And it might be hard to see if you're like watching it on a computer. But if you watch it on a phone, you can kind of zoom in and see that, you know, we, we've always plowed the road. So we take care of the road, which is fine. But for us to take care of the road and then for him to go and pull ice chunks into the road. Yeah, I guess I just didn't see that. And I tried zooming in, but it would zoom in only to the left of the video. And so like, and I found nothing. So like, I, I mean, you're welcome to show me. I, I, but I literally could not. It was so hard to see. I was, I was looking at the one that worked. I think it's you sitting in the car coming down the road. Coming home. Yeah. So that same day, just showing coming home. And I didn't, I didn't see a lot. I mean, I saw, I guess I saw it, I talked, but I didn't see it like obstructing the road in a way that you could drive pot that you can drive by it. But like, I could drive by it. So I could drive by it. But according to the letter from the town lawyer, he's not to be placing anything in the road way. And what's up with this? I have to ask, what, what do you mean he's hoisting down the road? He's taking water and spraying the road. Yeah, I couldn't see that. So first he kicks it and then kicks it into the road. It's just not necessary. Like, to me, that makes it clear. He's intentionally putting things in the road after this has been an issue for over a year. Yeah. See, I guess I just interpreted it as, you know, he looks like a kid laying around with a snow. Oh, frankly, but I mean, I, you know, I don't live there. So then so coming home and maybe this is more for fit. Yeah. See, we had just cloud the road. Like, so I mean, this is just us driving home. So it's, that's definitely not 50 feet. That's, that's what you're talking about. Yes. Okay. And like you said, you can get by it. Yeah, I can get by it. And it's the same thing with the rock. You know, we could, we could definitely drive straight along the road and go around it. But to me, it's clear in the letter from the lawyer. It's clear. Don't put obstructions in the road. Yeah. You know, what was that letter said, Sarah? Like what? What letter? The letter from the lawyer. And then December? I think December, yeah. Answer your question. So this is on December 29th, watering the road. So what does water do in the winter? We didn't snow the very next day. So that's just creating icy conditions in the roadway for no reason. It looks like he's doing the watering can. Well, the water can? Yeah. It looks like he's, can you stretch him? Yeah. Back up. All right. All right. It looks like he's doing it though, not in the roadway on the. That's the roadway. And I mean, that's the, like, that's the traveled portion. That's not even the 22 feet that you guys define. That's way within the. Did he plant something? It's December 29th, it was freezing. We got snow the next day. So it's just making the roads icy for no reason, other than to make the table. But it's not in the water right in there. So the concern is where he's pouring the water because of the illegal alterations that he's made to the roadway. The road slants from his side to our side. So that water followed the natural path of gravity across the entire width of the road. The town has. Oh, does it go up like this? It's, he built his side of the road. That was part of the issues with the road, with the traveled portion of the road. And so when he watered his side of the road, it went downhill across the width of the roadway. Yeah. So the town was supposed to come out and redefine and grade the road and never get around to it and then the flood. So the road is not crowned properly. So it's from him building it up on his side. But wouldn't the water go down this way? You're saying it's crowned up so that it's going into the road? It's higher. Yeah. So if you were looking at a road, it's higher on his side. And I mean, I have another video. I see. So when he poured that water, it would stream into the road. Right. And then that is the drivable path of the road. Yeah. Okay. You know, like well within the 22 feet that was defined. Yeah. To me, you know, these issues have been going on for over a year. The town lawyers sent a cease and desist. Don't put obstructions in the road. Don't alter the road. And so for him to come behind us and kick ice chunks in the road, I just, I really cannot see a reason for it. Yeah. And then after the letter, what did the letters say what would happen if he didn't follow the rules? Fine. Fine. Okay. So I guess, I don't, I guess I would like to hear from other board members their thoughts on this. I'm at a little loss for words. You know, so I'm not sure that your videos are enough for us to say, okay, we're going to find him for like, the videos don't show me that what that, that, that ice came to the road. Maybe you'd be able to see it if you went down there. Those ice chunks are just not enough for me to start finding someone. This isn't like putting a little rock in the middle of the road or, you know, a law. I mean, I, what I see it as are these little maybe, I don't even know, unconscious and passive aggressive. I don't know. Yes, Steve. So if I just went on center road in Middlesex and the plow truck for the town goes by, plows the road. And I go behind the plow truck and just start putting ice chunks back in the road. You'd find that totally acceptable and just the child. They're big enough they would damage your vehicle if you hit them there or big enough. Yeah. Okay. And I guess in that video, it looks like it's not in the middle of the road. It looks like it's right next to the snow bank in my mind pouring water on travel portion of the roadway creates an intentional hazardous situation for drivers. But just to bring it back to all the issues. It wasn't just an issue. So there's nothing in the policy or there's no rules that say we're only worried about the center of the road. Right. So it's, it's the roadway. You know, there's no reason and honestly, if this was a one time thing and this hadn't been going on for over a year, wouldn't have brought it up. We would just fix it and keep going. You know, and if I actually thought this would be a one time thing and it wouldn't continue, I went to brought it to you. But reading the letter from the lawyer, knowing this is just repeating itself, like there's no reason. I cannot think of any reason for someone to put obstructions in a roadway. Well, I mean, board, what do you think? Should we find Mr. French? I would say that you should call Mr. French in and give him an opportunity to talk to the select warden to explain why he's doing these kind of things and what it is. And if he doesn't show up, we'll then find it. Jeff, any thoughts on that? I do. Two questions, Sarah. One, can you send me the letter from the attorney that was sent to him? If it's and I don't want to make this tick all night is I'm coming in this first time her head. I saw the email. Okay, next to what the speck of your ear you said, August. So this happened August 6, 2022 was when it first started. And August 16, 2022 is when I came to the select warden and meeting and first brought up the alterations to the road. Back story wise, I assume before you brought it to select warden, that's, you know, conversations with him. Yeah. Stand walk. So there's a lot of issues, personal issues with the neighbor and those escalated. And not to get into too much detail about that. I feel like, you know, instead of doing the things he was doing, he shifted to doing things to the road instead of my property for me. Some intentional. Yeah. Yeah. So I have no stocking order against him. So it's just, to me, this is like more ways of harassing me. You know, so when he first put the speed bump in the road in August, I asked him about it to see why, you know, and he said he wanted a waterbar. You know, so I bought my property in 2014. We've never needed these alterations. You know, he moved here from Massachusetts in 2015. And I didn't have any issues until like the personal issues escalated. And then it's shifted to the roadway, you know, so I, and then he's blocked the road, you know, right at the end of my driveway where I actually had to call the police and they had called them and he removed it. But they were the ones that were like, you need to go to your select board. Same thing. I talked to the Secretary of State. They said it's the select board's responsibility. This is a class four road. Yeah. I don't know. Yeah. Thank you for that. Okay. Ask him to come in and then talk about it. What could it hurt, then? According to Peter, we do. I think we do. I think collecting on it gets a little bit more difficult. It's the escalation after a fine and no payment. Right. Yeah. I don't know the answer to it. We'd have to look at the, I mean, I don't think it's like, I don't think it's a police matter. I think it's like a legal matter. Like we're, you know, Yeah. I'm surprised that they actually respond on the state police. Yeah. They reached out to him to have them removed because he can't, can't be blocking the vote. Sarah, do you want me to reach out to him and ask if he can come to do it? Yeah. I'll talk to that one. I'm going to say kind of February 6th meeting and talk about the ice in the road. I'd like him there. Is there a screening order here? Yeah. Yesterday. Could he show up on Zoom? Yeah. He can go to the same room as you, correct? He has to be carried away from me when I'm off my property. That wouldn't work. He has to be 300 feet away from me when I'm off my residential property. Would you mind if he was on Zoom or would you rather have him lying? Yeah. Okay. Would you mind asking, I mean, Adam, do we have time for the February, for this next meeting, the February 6th for the agenda? Okay. Does that work for you guys? So like, I would like to hear from him before we just go and find him. Yes, Sarah. I know I have no right to talk, but just my suggestion would be that he shows up in person and she stays at home for this next one. Doing that via Zoom, like having that conversation, that's just my two cents. Yeah. What do you think about that? Yeah. I think your rights are, I prefer to have them here. Okay. Any other matters? Let me come before the board. Is there anything else you folks, our only guests, our one and only guests are MJ? I don't know who MJ is on the Zoom. Do you, sir? No. Michael Jackson. Do you want to know? Michael Jackson. Because they're a guest? They don't have to unless they speak. They don't have to unless they speak. Okay. MJ was here. Thank you. MJ first. Alrighty. So if there isn't any other thing that comes before the board, I am adjourning this meeting at 6, 17. Okay, next one. Yay!