 Since seven o'clock, I'll call the meeting to order it's a regular schedule meeting in the town of Berlin development of new board We have three applications before us tonight I'm Bob Wernick. I'm the chair on my left is Carla Weasel. She's vice chair On the screen. We have with us two other board members Paulie Muir-Bertie and John Feverich and We also have our recording secretary Carla Preston and Arizona administrator Tom Bedowski And with that I'm gonna ask people who are in room and starting on my left and introduce themselves John. That's you start with me Yes, my name is John Petrosky. I work for Trudel consulting engineers, and I'm here representing the applicant for the Brad Slate and civilization Matthew Maybear I'm the purchaser of the the subdivided lot Good See louder I'm here on the subdivision for the slain's law I miss about your name. I'm sorry I'll take the thing Very good So what I'm gonna do before we start is that we have three applications before us tonight One of one do swear in everybody that tends to give testimony on either one of the applications Please raise your right hand No, you're not doing this only here you tend to give testimony Swear to tell the truth not the truth imagine before the sport tonight on the penalties of poetry. I did it So our first application is By bratch laden for sketch plan and final plan review of a minor two-lot subdivision Mr. Chair, this is right the continuation. Yeah, thank you. It's a continuation of a former hearing the applicant has gone back and revised plans And we're discussing revised plans in light of this testimony even last time Who's gonna take the lead here? I can give a quick overview if you want. Yeah, so Trudel consulting engineers did both the survey work and the septic design So I'll start with the septic system since I'm a sanitary engineer the project proposes a drilled well for water supply and I was actually on site doing the soil testing and we found a small Conventional area for in-ground septic. It's it's a sandy sandy soil up there And the home is being placed in between the Velco lines and the GMP lines It's approximately a four and a half acre lot 4.64 to be exact and then the remaining land will be about 30 acres For the subdivision Some of the changes to the plans that you last saw was we upgraded the easement from Junction Road Actually all the way up to lot two with a 50 foot right away Didn't need to go that far it needed to at least go to the intersection, but if Some day in the future they ever further subdivide it just made sense to take care of the right away now So we show a 50 foot right away all the way up to the lot to boundary line There's access to the cemetery There is some road widening proposed We did on the septic plan start to switch back and forth we did expand the topo There was questions about drainage and grades and how how the driveway would work so the site is is Existing the roads mostly existed heavily vegetated well-established and I believe you had represented to me the widening will probably just be three feet on each side Yeah, you're not gonna be wide at six feet So we keep the crown on the road and just widen on each shoulder There's already a shoulder there. So I don't know exactly. I think the requirement is 20 Feet or 22 feet 22 feet 22 feet. Yeah, how standard so we'll widen on each side That will help minimize the impact of any existing vegetation It will allow us to maintain the roadside ditches and culverts. We're not proposing any Changes to the current drainage system Where the water's flowing it will continue to flow. Did you prepare cross-section at all what you propose? No Not yet. I Don't think it's on my details. It'll be I didn't see the details. Yeah, it'll be you know 12 inches of gravel and probably six inches of pressure run With road fabric If I see those we'll we'll match that but it's it's gonna be It's gonna be widening. So I guess we'll have to evaluate Whether there's adequate sub base in the existing section. We might have to raise it up to meet those standards Don't don't know until we dig it up But that's something if it's important to verify we could as a condition of approval we could Have me certify that the road met the standards when we're done. That's typically what we have I got to do that for the septic anyway So I think for this board, you probably don't need to provide a design of the road But for the psych board who's going to be adopting The town roads they'll need to see that. Yeah, well, we'll uh, so ultimately gonna prepare I'll probably use your detail and just add it mine to match it and then we'll have to have some notes that just say we've got a Adjust as needed to for example, if there's only Eight inches of gravel out there. We have to add more What is the substrate knows it ledger is it? Decent grade well-brained soil, what is it? Yeah It's good. There's a good pull-off there right off of Junction Road So there's a lot of space to you know for bigger trucks to stage and then come up the road and That first Y is almost like a hammerhead. So it gives trucks the ability to turn around And then the remaining run to Matt's lot would just be Probably 12-foot wide or 14-foot wide drive. Yeah, 14 is what And it exists now. It's currently in already. Yeah. Yeah, it was we walked up at the day you started the project and it was it was overgrown and It's been opened up now and stone Stone gravel base put in so you can drive all the way up in there now Okay I Don't have a lot more to add. I really want to answer questions if there is any additional questions Oh, I think the other piece of evidence is that Matt dropped off the the road maintenance road maintenance agreement So that will have to be established When he enters into the final purchase Yeah, I'm sorry, I'm sorry, I just wanted to verify who we're speaking John Petrosky with Trudell consulting engineers Okay, thank you John. You're welcome The only thing I I want to add one more thing is the water wastewater permit that we need from the state Yeah, we haven't applied for that yet because Matt hasn't made the final purchase yet. So once he buys it We'll submit the plans. I mean Last time he was not going to apply for until he had Property in hand. Yeah, yeah, and which is okay because we'll probably simply condition our permit on your satisfactory receiving permit from the state So that May not be necessary with this permit because you could subdivide raw land, but any building permit It would be a requirement Yeah, and we will need a building perfect before that so yeah, it's not a question for building permits of course for Korean yes The We had questions about the right way you provide us with a building elbow It's probably larger than it needed to be well We show the town setbacks and that's the SB dashed line around the interior of the lot But from a practical standpoint the building envelope is the shaded area yeah, because we can't build under the power line easements and And then the other question we had was about right away us There was a question about whether our green round power had a right away on this road We did the deed research and I don't believe we know to right away I thought it was discussion that they come in and manage your lines from some other Some other point do you know more on that Matt I've talked to them Velco had a right of has a right of way On the existing road on there. Well, no From the portals. Yeah, Velco has a right of way through here. Yeah. Yeah, I've got about the road the road here Green Mountain power used it to access theirs, but there's no written We didn't find a rhythm right away. All right. Well, that's not in common. I you know We've received up on three amount power others using roads with permission. Yeah Sometimes not always I would imagine that there wouldn't be any issue with them using this road You're not aware of any easements. No, and we have no stake in that I just yeah, just the documents did not talk about it. So no, I was surprised, but we didn't we didn't see any And the right of 50 foot right of way all the way to the property number two a lot number two correct The the town road standards really only need to be met to where you have suddenly less than three Lots served said to the junction with a drive to The property to Blanchette You don't need to make those improvements except for we talked about last time that you may want it in the future to make for the Subvision yeah, and that's that's why we propose the the 50 foot right of way all the way up here It's good. It's not sure you've got it road standards only be met need to be met to the Road construction standards, right? Town road status portion it needs to be a meet the town road status only needs to go to the Blanchette Drive Although again, you may want to think I had I did notice that the grades probably exceed 15% up through there Am I right about that? They're close to the 10% I think the final run up After you cross into a lot to it's like it's there's a steep section under under the Green Mountain Power lines after that curve where it kind of straightens out It gets a little steeper right there might be closer to the 12 those two-foot contours, right? These are two-footers and I pulled in LiDAR so we topoed all of this and this is LiDAR So what if I scale that off you're scaling 14% I've driven the to the junction point is in 14% No, that's a junction point beyond that. Oh, I'm that doesn't surprise me. Yeah, okay Yeah, the judge reports relatively level is it not? Yes. Yeah, that's what I'm excuse me, John For sake of people here, can you just explain what LiDAR is? So? We we Conducted topographic survey and we take spot shots and elevations and develop contour maps and areas that we don't shoot The topo maybe it's not as critical We'll take information from the state grid and they do you know shots from above and they develop Contours that are less accurate, but reasonable. We found that they actually matched in pretty good and we refer to that as LiDAR It's a public platform where where you can get information This is minus 10 feet. I don't know what it's plus it matched in pretty good. So yeah, you know We tie every job we do now we tie into the state grid. So we tie into the natural resource maps We know if there's mapped endangered species or wetlands, which there isn't here in the development zone, but We are tied into the state grid on this project I'm just reviewing our minutes of the last meeting quickly That's lost anything here anybody from board have questions No, I think so Did you have anything no, I just said I will I received the road maintenance agreement today I'll send that out to the to the rest of the borell electronically. You'll have it There's a separate agreement. Is this a Chance look at this. This is part of a deed or was a It's just because it's it's supposed to be a private road at this point Right, but it's just a part of the deeds or is this going this agreement will be part of the deeds Or is it going to be just an agreement that property on the sign? It's just going to be an agreement that the property owners are all Assigning agreeing on you should have that recorded here than at the time. Okay, you may think about provisions for other members of this association and then you you've made the easement 50 foot To facilitate any future subdivisions. I would think that they would then join this as well Does the town want to join? No town cemetery I Noticed that it's I don't think there's much activity ever there though No, Brad Brad said once or twice a year somebody might come up, but that's rare. Yeah. Yeah, it's a very old cemetery Like you're not a name you suggest the name for the road actually Don came up with that name and Don recommended the Owner of the lot above recommended it be called Colby road because the cemetery is Colby Cemetery and Makes perfect sense. So it goes Co ldy. Yeah, are you requested from the site already? No, no, that's that's after all this Okay If there are no other questions anybody have anybody here Ifs in this application have questions for us For our recording sector just announce who you are I just want to make sure Richard, could you tell me where that spring is approximately? Richard come up here We don't know where your house is that I didn't get I didn't get your last name. So I was just trying to figure out You want to these lots you want to put that down so there you go This one And where do you think the spring is? Just on the other side of the palace Okay 145 feet Okay, so I saw a scale here. Can't borrow your scale for a sec So that's outside of our yeah, I believe it's outside of you Yeah I'm more worried about the waste water, but it looks like it so your You're in excess of 500 feet from the septic system. So you meet the setbacks We'll probably add that to our plans Because the wastewater permit was supposed to show Surrounding springs and wells, but it's if he's outside of 500 foot radius, which he is I just measured it It's not it's not in the shield Actually Brad gave me one years ago, and I can't find out what it's in there. Okay. Yeah 1963 we need to date the plat to reflect that. Absolutely. That's how he was just This is a extra copy. This is my coffee, but they have it in here I can make a copy for you. Yeah. Okay, great. So yeah, we I think we should absolutely add that to the plan But it's not it's not within the corner influence. Do you need that? This motive that it was on Brad's land and Thank you Anything else there are no other questions by board members or zoning administrator There was several conditions that was discussed before they leave. I think Well conditions are that they receive approval from the site board for the private road That'll be condition of this permit Also water and wastewater from it from the state will be condition this permit Forget anything record the road maintenance agreement They're gonna help date the this plat with mr. Tato's. Yes like Third-party certification that the road was constructed to town standards. Do you say that I did not say that That's that is yeah Which won't happen till spring so can I just clarify because you said the wastewater I didn't have to be for the subdivision and now you're saying Yeah, I can't forget it. It does not have to be for the subdivision. I Suggest we make it a condition that prior to Issuing ability permit that they will either receive It's not it won't hurt us if you have it as a condition because we're absolutely get that I'm standing over here Everybody got solution Update plat so I have five any else Polly No, John John you mentioned five I have four can you raise your Receive approval from the select board for the road record the road maintenance agreement get a ww permit Certify to the road standards and update the plat with the spring. Yeah Okay, yeah Very good if there is nothing else that that's understand that I entertain a motion to close the one horses hearing some old second made Like Carlos seconded by John Is your discussion that motion? All those in favor of that motion, please signify by saying I or raising your hands. I I And we will be there Close hearing. Thank you. Thank you. You guys will deliberate later. We'll deliberate afterwards And then I think those are deliberations will be forthcoming in our findings Least of them in writing. Thank you Yep Thank you Oh You get the estate Yes You want to testify anything for tonight Yeah Okay, why don't you tell us what we're looking at it? We got two separate applications, right? The first one is for the state of Henry A. Would you junior? this is part of Our father is a state and we did this lot for subdivision memory about a year ago a little over a year ago And now this is what we're doing now is a slot to Listed here is where Benedictine well-drilling company they own the building. They've leased the land for forever and As you've had an agreement as basically decide or my father at the time or now We as a family Sell then we would offer them that lot So we're just it has it has been treated as a separate lot by the state has actually 50 and Waste water permitting already so now we just have to do the Good town part of it. So this is a transaction to go from a lease to a sale. Yes Also, it's not actually in the town subdivider Correct. Okay Are there any changes being made to this no no nothing out all this is the original That's all been on there forever. We just never did went through the actual Transaction of doing the subdivision. They're adding the line, of course, right? They're adding the line that would Segregate it from the larger parts. Oh, yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, just a little just that check Yeah, but I think everything else will say all the same. It's just an entrance way here I don't know. No, it's just a stripper grass. It's yeah, it's No Okay, so access is breakly to one a road Yes, yes, they entered the driveways right here. That was there for yeah. Yeah, it just was how the land was Okay, you're not proposing any changes just you're just basically Changing this from right a lot to a yes take it so we can get that off and and they can purchase it to keep Does anything feel compelled to go through the subdivision standards for this no Is she a negative I see a negative No Not making changes. I don't know that I want to go through Lots of mentions building envelopes and all that. I just seems to be academic There's no construction required in connection with this so And the question by board members comments by this goni administrator Mr. Parties Hearing none If there are no questions, do you have any further comments to know? Okay, okay motion to close this Second by probably motion by garland close the one forces hearing And also for the motion, please say five percent. Hi. Hi. Hi All right, we're now dealing with application 2207 at six There's a lot of our town What would you do here? Basically the same thing sort of So what we're doing is adding this line Shown on the map here from a granite bound that goes down To the corner of Joseph max land and basically turning What's the quarry on the South side of the line Into its own parcel and then the other side of the line is the mobile home park is exist now and then the other land there so No, I mean potential interest in maybe doing some other things there, but no no plans on doing anything now other than Eventually have to have these as two separate pieces. They've always been considered one piece But if if anything ever wants to be done with them We have to they have to be separated obviously You know the mobile home park has its own rules through the state and and everything But that's why we decided just to to split them in half now because it was gonna have to at some point and We aren't building anything or adding anything to either to either parcel right now. We're just making them into two separate ones So the quarry those is up and we should get the boundary there. Anyway, you got Benjamin Falls, Brooke Which was a little bit of a natural boundary So gosh, it's too easy Chip, were there any Cuz it's the manufactured home park and that's state regulated. Do they have any Have you talked to? We're doing Chase and chase are doing we have to get wastewater For that, you know, we have everything It's all town sure, you know town city right now, but we have to get that that's in the process of Being done, so we couldn't change anything down here right now without doing that. Anyway, what are you doing there? I'm not we just have to it now this it's it's a separate entity. It has to have wastewater You're not changing ownership, but there's no no Right, right, so right, but at some point if that was going to happen We have to have all that so they're in the process of moving in that direction what you're doing or making it bigger Yeah But that's so did it pre-date wastewater permitting that there's no wastewater permit now or I Would assume no that was what the 70s Yeah, I'd have to I'd have to look it up But but like I said Chris has been a drink off has been in touch with them in there first level homes were put there in 1971 yeah, it's pretty early, so I was living in that part. Yeah. Yeah, I heard that story But it is serviced by municipal water in this way, yes It's just gonna be an ownership thing really Yes, you expand it, right? Yeah, so we have to we have to get it if we're gonna do it at some point in time then I figured now's the time to do it you get it done and Then that way we'll have miss two separate two separate sections. That's all state permitting. Yeah So we'd like to worry about issues of the lines or anything like that because we probably use existing lines Yeah, yeah, that you can Again, nothing's been proposed with either one of these lots per se correct. Yeah, you know it to be changed So I don't know that we need to go through the criteria. Does anybody feel compelled to go through the criteria on this? No, I just have a question. Please volume. So what would the access to lot one be? Where does that come from? Hersey Road Then on to Caledonia Drive which used to be what Green Mountain Drive before the Truckers get stuck up. Yeah, so coming up from behind the wayside sort of dollars. Okay. Okay. Yeah. Yeah, those are all the town roads Okay, thanks Yes, I'm sorry, would you need anything on the criteria for findings? I don't think so I think I think I think probably no impact Okay on each of the findings I that's what where we look at it just look at it real quickly And I mean it calls for a building building envelope So we we could possibly say we need a building envelope here. Yeah, it's on Well, that's yeah, but the envelope building envelope is is not supposed to be the entire parcel It's supposed to be the part of the portion of the parcel Building envelopes for lots two acres in or less aside, but for lots for lots more than two acres Limit to not more than one acre. See What is that here building envelope their ship? I am that be that building building envelope would be a lot more than one acre Yeah What's that? Yeah, there's no building on it You know Condition that that they show a building envelope. Well, I think if billions were proposed in the future They're gonna have to deal with that through the zoning process Subdivisions are for building Yeah, yeah, it has to be There has to be something eventually. I mean if it's not buildable then we can't subdivise I Talked either Chris or you Then you say there was a like a What scale or shack down there? I've got a well, it's a movable office trailer But we don't have a you don't have an actual foundation building Remember a conversation I thought you're gonna to use that as That's the lower one I guess I guess you didn't have that and we could definitely we could definitely put that in it's a It's a it's a little blip That's right right actually here Is where the office trailer is but yeah, it's but it's a it's a It's a movable office. I think that's why maybe why I didn't put it in but we could certainly add that Says yeah I'm not sure this is germane, but if we go by the letter of the law Right, it's certainly buildable. We're just not proposing to build anything Lots more than two acre size ability both these are lots of more than two sides of the building envelope generally must be limited to not more than one acre Or not more than two acres of multiple dwellings are proposed But the reality is if you expand the mobile home lot, you're gonna have more than two more lots There are separate regulations from yeah, man factor home parties, which probably supersede some of this and What's what's existing there is? His grandfather and I don't think chip is saying that they're gonna do any expansion as part of what they're talking about right We would have to do if we were to which We've never needed or had want for would be to do it You know like said a foundational building that we're putting something on there. There's just There's no need or you know, I just don't have any desire for one or you So we're just not planning on building anything but I said Right, right, so be able to do these deal with them separately just sub-divide into I think it's on the quarry lot. I think it's easy to put An acre on it or building up. Yeah, it's it's easy enough to do It's just an exercise It is You do have to ask that question because not all sub-divisions are necessarily intended for the purpose of building buildings Right sub-divisions are intended for a lot of different uses through the air culture That's that's a simple. I mean it seems when I read this it seems as though the intent is to identify buildable land Yeah Yeah And it's that because it says we can adjust these standards and because it says one or more building Emblems on each lot not intense for conservation purposes So it just seems as though it's really identifying where it's buildable more than saying this is where we're gonna build limited size to Well, well, no because it says I agree if you Carly that doesn't say that this is where it's gonna be It just says that it's available, but I thought it was limited No, well it says must be limited to but then it says the development review board made just these standards as deemed appropriate Given the specific characteristics of the subject property and proposed subdivision So I think I mean if you want to identify buildable land that would be well He has done that that by virtue of identifying the setbacks And they are they are noted on both drawings I Don't I don't feel I need any more than that Okay, well that but I agree with Carla is basically to identify what what is buildable land because there might not be immediate Plans, but eventually somewhere down the line. Somebody may want to build something, but if if it shows what's buildable, that's fine Yeah, I Would just suggest putting an acre buildable Building envelope on it on the plan to satisfy the regulatory requirements Easy enough to do. Yeah Did you say that it was basically is the whole lot buildable if it is why can't we just use the setback Well, it's buildable in what I've not been on the property a long time, but it's it's a quarry Yeah, it's it's actually a book before I guess you could I guess you could build in the middle of if you don't want to get hit From the blastings going it's not a good place to be I think it's not particularly freeable to this if you want to handle it is fine Tom with me Bob whichever would you say I don't think that that's an applicable criteria in this case I understand what you're saying in terms of it there, and if you want to put something on there, and I Wouldn't accept this way this okay Polly I'm Yeah, it's not a ruling on the value of it. Yeah I think Right here Just on the on the manufactured home part that they'll Apply for and we'll record a wastewater permit They need a wastewater. Yes. Yes, we're doing that now. Yeah, well It would they would for any either one but then again That's that'd be a part of the building permit not a part of the subdivision as you pointed out earlier So but there are state regulations on manufacturing Manufactured home parts that We're not addressing here now. Oh, I'm right. He's saying he's going for a yeah waste water permit I'm just saying put a condition that that that gets recorded with the town It's easy subdivision will be predicated on that Why I mean they've got a permit now We don't know that he doesn't know He's that may predate that's why I asked is there is there a wastewater permit now I didn't hear it. I didn't hear it I don't know I do not know if there is I don't believe so but right so to do the so if we did nothing We'd never have to get one if we don't change anything down there We didn't do the subject or whatever but do it to do the subdivision. We've already applied. Yeah, you are you going to have to Yeah, you make that transaction the public transaction and record it. Yeah. Oh, yeah Oh, yeah, you're gonna have to record with it One doesn't this doesn't exist. You don't have to get one right? And that's what he's gotta believe one exists. I can't believe. Yeah. Yeah, I'll check again. I haven't found it yet But doesn't mean that there is yeah Well, you know, it's got a public sewer line or the house, so but he's going through the process. That's all I'm so Yeah, oh, yeah, so we should make that a condition. Yeah Okay, I still thought it's going through the road standards or anything else like that Both occur to serve by roads affect the block one I got the right correct number. Yeah, it's already served by town road. Yes Hershey roads a town road. What about the other roads? Yes. Yes Bennington and Addison are all down Very good. I Would entertain a motion to close in one portion of this hearing Second Oh That's your Christmas gift from Carl All that favorite all those in favor of that motion, please see if I'm saying aye. Aye. Aye. The motion is carry Thank you, Jim. Thank you very much. I appreciate it. Thank you gentlemen. Happy holiday. Oops. Yes Hey, how are you good? Your daughter going in there Good We get a small definitely and I think three days until the entire The boot the boutique reek is open You guys are only 15 Big Mac Just remind everyone I did send out the first half of 2023 Calendar Yeah, I don't think we'll have the I Think the first meeting in January will be canceled I Suggest we go deliver session. Yeah Minutes or not Let's do the minutes first a good point And then we'll do a little recession We do have the minutes of the meeting of the 15th of November the first month it is To review and approve I Thought they looked good I did too. You're gonna make that motion probably I move that we approve them the minutes of November 15th 2022 Most of it made the second approve the minutes as prepared for 1115 22 I seconded discussion on motion Hearing none all those in favor of that motion, please see if I'm saying aye. Aye. Aye. Aye Thank you We've approved the minutes of 1115 22 So I Think just for clarity of how the Minutes will read The findings will read with regard to these Applications are you going to deliver a session? I would suggest we go deliver session. Yeah I'll well now. Yeah, I'll move that we go into deliberative session eight or seven 47 I'll second most of it made and seconded to go to the session. Is there a discussion on motion? Hearing none all those in favor of that motion, please signify by saying aye. Aye Aye