 It's time for the Lawn Jean Chronoscope, a television journal of the important issues of the hour brought to you every Monday, Wednesday, and Friday. A presentation of the Lawn Jean Wittner Watch Company, maker of Lawn Jean, the world's most honored watch, and Wittner, distinguished companion to the world-honored Lawn Jean. Good evening. This is Frank Knight. May I introduce our co-editors for this edition of the Lawn Jean Chronoscope? Larry Lusser from the CBS television news staff, and August Heckscher, chief editorial writer for the New York Herald Tribune. Our distinguished guest for this evening is the honorable Samuel J. Urban, Jr., United States Senator from North Carolina. One of America's favorite indoor sports is, of course, politics and criticism of politicians. Now, politicians do get a lot of honors, but they also take a lot of abuse, and I'm afraid that sometimes we forget that they're under a tremendous strain as witnessed by the death of some of our most prominent senators and congressmen within recent weeks. Now, our guest tonight is one of the most recent additions to the Senate. He succeeded the late Senator Hoy. I'd like to ask him, Senator Urban, you've had a long, successful career as an attorney and as a judge in a comparatively small town in Morganton, North Carolina and, of course, in the state capitol of Raleigh. Do you find life in Washington more of a strain? Well, I think that servicing either the Senate or the House of Representatives in Washington is quite a strain, particularly if one worries about his actions. You haven't had very long to worry yet, though. Have you, Senator? No, I have not. I've just been there since 11th of this month. Well, can we ask you for a few personal questions about becoming a senator? What about the social life in Washington? Do you find it difficult to fit in or people very hospitable to you? Well, I have never been more graciously received by any group of people in my life than I have by the other members of the Senate. Well, what about the White House? Are you immediately invited in to see the chief executive? Are you taking to dinner at the White House when you arrive there as one of the 96 senators of the United States? I think that I would be more likely to receive an invitation to the White House if I were not a Democrat. I see. Senator, how did you feel that moment when you were sworn in on June 11th? Did you feel as if this was about the biggest thing that a man could have? Well, I don't know whether I was more thrilled by being appointed to the United States Senate than I was by being elected to state legislature in my home county. When was that? That was back in 1922, when I was about 26 years of age. Would your Senate appointment come to you as a surprise? It certainly did. I was a member of the state supreme court and had been, as most appellate judges are, living in an ivory tower for about six years. And I was not expecting to be appointed to the Senate. Now, Senator, you were appointed by the governor and this office that you hold will last for how long? This office on the governor's appointment will last until the general election in November. Then you have to run again? Yes, I'll have to run for an unexpired term of two years. And then you'll have to be nominated again in a primary and then re-elected if you should run again? Yes. And you're in it for keeps, are you? I'm in it until the folks tell me they don't want me any more. And when they tell me that, I'm going to take off a few days and go fishing and go back to practicing law and enjoy myself. Well, Senator Irving, what does a new senator do? Have you brought your family up to live in Washington with you and sort of settled down? Or are you waiting for this new election to come up? Well, I'm waiting until the Democratic Executive Committee nominates me for the unexpired term and until I get elected. Besides, my family for first North Carolina weather in the summertime to Washington weather. Well, now did you buy a house? How do you live in Washington? What does the senator do when he gets there? Well, most of them sort of live out of a suitcase. I stay in a hotel room. Senator Irving, have you been given any committee assignments yet? I've been appointed to the Government Operations Committee and the District of Columbia Committee. The Government Operations Committee? That's Senator McCarthy's committee. Yes, Senator McCarthy is the chairman of the committee. That's a very important post for a newcomer, isn't it? Well, they give a newcomer the things which are least desirable. Well, actually, I'd like to ask you this, Senator Irving. Don't you succeed to the committee appointments of the senator whom you succeeded, the late Senator Hoey? No, everything in the Senate, like things in harm, it goes by seniority. As someone has said, serving in the Senate is just waiting for dead men's shoes. I see. Well, now on the Senate Operations Committee, what do you deal with there? Well, the principal functions of that committee are twofold. One is investigating, and the other is in studying government reorganization. And I am on the subcommittee on government reorganization, which is headed by one of the most charming members of the Senate, Senator Margaret Chase Smith from Maine. A Republican. A Republican who could be admitted into the Democratic Party freely without requiring it to repent of the political sins and inequities. I was just going to say, you have a very fine chairman, I think. Well, of course, the United States Senate has been called the most exclusive men's club in the world, Senator Irving. Now, is this men's club hospitable? Do they accept you in? Are you invited out when you first arrived in town, as you did in the last few weeks? They are, as I said, they have received me most graciously. And our senators come and tell you, even the ones of the opposition, they say, no matter how much we may disagree on matters of politics, we are all personal friends. Senator, you come across from a great southern state, which is also a great tobacco state. Now, I've been wondering about this recent news about tobacco smoking, and disclosures about it. Has this affected the people in your state, your tobacco growers, to any extent at all? It has not yet, and I do not believe that it will. Well, there's been other news about farm programs and tobacco in the past several days. Are the tobacco growers affected by the stiffer controls that the administration is putting into effect? Well, I think that they'll not be affected to any great degree in North Carolina, because that's one of our principal crops, and we grow certain types of tobacco that cannot be grown elsewhere. Well, actually, has this news actually been upsetting to your tobacco growers? I don't say that North Carolina is a one-crop state, but it's certainly a very important crop, isn't it? Yes, it's a great money crop. I think most people go ahead and smoke, regardless of the talk about it, and the ones that don't smoke will chew. I see. Well, actually, is the situation regarding the smoking of tobacco likely to affect the finances of North Carolina or the standard of living of the people there? Well, it would considerably if there was a decrease in tobacco sales, because North Carolina's agriculture depends in large measure on tobacco. It's true we have many other crops such as cotton and peaches and truck farming, but tobacco is a major item. I think North Carolina is one of the most varied states, isn't it, for agricultural products? Yes. And tobacco, after all, it can only be grown on a comparatively small part. That is true. So each farmer tends to have his tobacco field and then other crops besides. That's right. Well, Senator, you'll be up again for election, I take it, in November then, after the presidential elections are... I hope to be. ...confirmed. Now, what do you think will be the election issues in your North Carolina state? Well, I don't know that anything much except what would be in the country generally. Well, what about this problem? Which refers to much about recently, of integration of the races in the schools. Well, that problem reminds me of the Baptist preacher that always preached on the doctrine of immersion. And his congregation got tired of hearing the same sermon every Sunday, so they told him they wanted to preach ex-Temperanians now on a text that would be given to him after he got in the pulpit. And so the committee of the following Sunday gave him the text. In the beginning, God created the heavens and the earth, and he read over the text, and after reading it over, he says, geography tells me that the earth is one fourth land and three fourths water, and that brings me to my subject, the doctrine of immersion. Now, the people of North Carolina, as a whole, both white and colored, before the integrated school system, the segregated school system, as it now exists. There are a few persons that prefer the Supreme Court ruling, but the majority of the people, both white and colored, are opposed to it. But is their own preference the determining factor, after all, if it's against the Constitution and the laws of the land to have segregated schools? Won't that be a force? Well, frankly, I have a little difficult to believe, and that's against the Constitution because the Constitution was the other way for 86 years. And I have a little difficult to give in mental assent to something that I don't think so. Well, nevertheless, would you follow out the precepts of some of the other states and possibly set up private schools for colored people? North Carolina has never considered going to private schools. North Carolina believes in public education, and North Carolina has perhaps done more than any other southern state to give both negros and whites equal facilities. Are the school districts segregated now along residential and geographic lines so that you'll have a segregated schooling no matter what you do? Well, it'd be impossible to gerrymander the districts because in the rural sections of the state, negros and white people live together on the same farms. In other words, you won't be able to do as is done in the north, of course, where the negros do tend to live in communities. It's the problem actually isn't as great as it might be in the south. That's true, but you won't be able to district your reasons down there at all? In the towns, you can district the towns in the country, rural sections, you cannot. I might say this, North Carolina employs more negros principles and more negros teachers in its public schools and New Jersey, New York, Pennsylvania, Ohio, Indiana, and Illinois all together. We have about 8,000 colored teachers in North Carolina who are paid the same as white people, white teachers. But can you give equal facilities on the higher level of education in the colleges and university, law schools? Well, North Carolina has two very fine state-supported negros institutions, North Carolina College for Negros at Durham, and the A&T College at Greensboro, and two very fine teacher colleges. And I think they have those North Carolina College for Negros, and the A&T College are equal to practically any other schools of that types in the United States. Senator, we don't expect any trouble at all then, but you will put this law into effect, this edict to the Supreme Court. Well, I can't say exactly what will happen, because our people are not used to integrated schools, and we have developed a pattern of segregation. Of course, North Carolina has always been a law abiding state. Well, I hope that everything will turn out very well, and in accordance with the Constitution of the United States. Thank you very much, Senator Irvin. It's a great pleasure to have you here tonight. Thank you. It's a pleasure to be here. The opinions expressed on the Laun Jean Chronoscope were those of the speakers. The editorial board for this edition of the Laun Jean Chronoscope was Larry Lisser and August Teccher. Our distinguished guest was the Honorable Samuel J. Irvin, Jr., United States Senator from North Carolina. They say everyone sees the watch on your wrist, and to be really well-dressed, every detail must conform, including your watch. Now, Laun Jean makes a watch to fill every need and to soothe every taste. The choice of models and styles is almost unlimited. For ladies, Laun Jean creates superb examples of the jewelers' art, explicit in taste and finish, and literally for every occasion. For men, Laun Jean produces watches for every requirement, watches for dress and sport, Laun Jean automatic watches, the most advanced in the world, waterproof and shock-resistant watches for rugged service. Laun Jean Chronograph watches for sportsmen and for scientists. And every Laun Jean watch, whether for a lady or for a gentleman, is made to the unique standards of excellence, which have won for Laun Jean 10 World Fair Grand Prizes, 28 gold medals, highest honors for accuracy in fields of precise timing. 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