 Live from the Mandalay Convention Center in Las Vegas, Nevada, it's theCUBE at IBM Insight 2014. Here are your hosts, John Furrier and Dave Vellante. Okay, welcome back everyone. Live here in Las Vegas for IBM Insight, this is theCUBE. I'm John Furrier with Dave Vellante and we're here with industry analysts, principal analysts and chairman of the constellation of Ray Wang, CUBE alumni always on to break it down. Ray, great to see you again. Back here in your wheelhouse, IBM. We are back in Mandalay Bay. I think this is my ninth year here, I think. You guys probably more on your end? I don't know, it's a fun show. So I got to ask you, we saw each other at Oracle Open World, I mean, this is the year of software and Dave and I were talking about. In for? In for, I mean this is all happening. So we were talking on the intro, I want to get your take on this. The software is where the margins are, right? And cloud is where the leverage is. So you're seeing that shift happening and inflection point kind of at the same time. What has to happen for the big guys like the IBMs, like the HPs, they're misunderstood right now in the marketplace. Wall Street to customers, and certainly customers are getting the prospects, but Wall Street certainly not getting it. They don't have to carry boxes, softwares at the center of the value proposition. What are people missing in the IBM story? What's your take on that? And what is IBM getting right and what do they need to work on? Oh, I think what's interesting here, I mean, this is the future of where IBM's going to be. And what I like about this is the fact that you can watch them go through these transitions. Every 20 years, IBM goes through a transition, right? You guys have seen it, they're shedding off hardware now, doubling down on software, moving heavily into Watts and other related services. You see the IBM and Apple deal going on. That's the future of what's happening. So this is all happening while they've got to shed the older businesses and build new businesses at the same time. The street never gets that. The street's always confused. They want things that are sure, they want earnings that make sense. That doesn't make sense in this world. They're following the shift that's about to happen. Software's hot, especially given what's happened with cloud, but if you compare West Coast versus East Coast companies, that's a big shift. West Coast companies are designed to completely run the model, completely go against total, total addressable market, try to drive profits. So grow profits, grow revenue, but not necessarily run a profitable business, which is a very interesting thing. On the East Coast, you're trying to work it out. Sure, it's pretty profitable. I mean, you've got some of these, the cloud companies Tableau, you've got Splunk, I mean, this new land. Actually, they're not profitable. None of them are profitable. No, because they're pouring their profits into building out GAPX for the- I'm standing correctly. Right? No, you don't have to say it. No, they could be profitable. They could be profitable. But they're growing. Frank Slubin says we could be highly profitable, but we choose to put it into growth. Everyone says that, from Amazon all the way down to, you know, Salesforce. Workday. And workday. It's like, we're going to just keep you piling in, and that's the issue, right? You've got IBM, which is running profitable business. You've got Microsoft running a profitable business, and they're being hammered by the street, right? For running a profitable business, which baffles everybody else's minds in the real world. And when we go back and say, oh, but they're not growing fast enough. Well, you know, they could just run an unprofitable business, right? So that's the shift that's actually happening. Okay, so I want to get you, I want to go down the list here, because we have limited time with you, so I want to try to extract as much value and content for the audience. One, evaluate IBM's leadership. Are they in position? I mean, it's the classic leadership, go-to-market innovation engine, technology leadership, and confidence and a value proposition. Those are the kind of the key things we've been looking at. So let's go down the list, leadership. Leadership. They've got lots of folks that are in place. Massive experience from Steve Mills down. If you're looking at on this end, if you're thinking about what's going on with Watson, you've got Mike Rodin on the other end. These folks are seasoned players. They know the game. Steve is one of the folks that are probably one of three or four master chessmen in the enterprise software business. Larry Ellison being on the other end. They know the game. They see exactly how it's being played. And you get new players in. He's awesome, kicking ass and taking names. A lot of young leadership, new talent along the way. How about Ginny? What's your assessment? I think Ginny was dealt the bad card. I think she's making the best of what it is. And I think that's really important. Bad card being what? Overreliance on services. Overreliance on an older business model. Older business model. I think what she has now is opportunities to create more IBM Apple like partnerships. There's a lot going on. We surveyed 100 companies. We said, what are you building next? Who are you buying from? What's happening? None of them said we're buying from a legacy vendor. They all said, we're partnering. We're co-innovating. We're co-creating. We need to build something that doesn't exist. We're at that point, like where we were just at the beginning of SOA. And we're seeing some IBM rumors going on, there's a big announcement coming out on Wednesday. But we don't really have any information to report at this time, but we think it's going to be a big move. I'm sure you might know under the FDA. I don't know anything. But let's talk about the innovation engine. Every company that's doing a turnaround and or an inflection point needs an innovation engine. What is IBM's innovation engine? The innovation here is really building stuff against analytics, taking that service business and the multidisciplinary pieces they have on industries. What about the technology leadership? Where are they strong? Where do they need to work on their game? I think they have a strong R&D base. Look at design, look at what they have in the labs. I think those are all key assets. The challenge is, how do they align themselves to work together? Now you started seeing that when they moved to the smarter planet messaging. Things started shedding. Different groups started falling apart. Brands that were acquired suddenly had one type of mission. I think they've got to take that to the next level as we get to what's next, right? Is it cognitive computing? Probably. Is it moving to a next set of services that actually work in partnership with customers more deeply? Maybe. Is it deeper into industries? Is it whatever the big announcement is on Wednesday? Maybe. What about the Apple deal? You referenced that before. Obviously it makes a lot of sense for Apple. What's it mean for IBM? Is it getting hot products into the enterprise? Filling up the bag with hot products? Well, we heard some interesting stats this morning, right? You know, 90%, 99% of all Fortune 500s have iOS running, right? Two times market share in the enterprise versus consumer. I think those are very interesting trends. If you talk to Apple, they're deep in the enterprise, but they've had challenges figuring out how to service the enterprise. It's not like you buy a Dell box and the guy shows up and helps you with it, services it comes every week, picks it up, you know, it does the swap outs. There's nothing like that. You go to the Apple store, it's a genius bar, and you're like, oh, okay, I'm waiting in line, maybe a VIP treatment somewhere. Having that level, that's only one of it. I think what's interesting is the stuff being built on Swift, the applications that are showing up around analytics and mobility in the enterprise, that IBM's co-building with Apple. You're seeing a lot of that in cloud. OpenStack, a lot of consolidation. The big boys are moving in there. You see cloud found you, player stuff coming together. So that's interesting for IBM. So I want to get your take on something outside of IBM. If you look at the players, you've been doing the world win. You're doing a ton of survey work with customers. You got a lot of research out there in their space. What's the consistent theme across the landscape of all the companies in this business? Is it consolidation? Is it growth? You've mentioned reinvestment for service now and those other guys putting more money in. What's the big mega trend that you're seeing that common thread amongst all the different companies? I think the mega trend is what they're trying to do is keep themselves from becoming an old-lined industry. Think about the shift to hardware and what happened to the hardware vendors. Massive consolidation, very little innovation. Then they had to do a lot of acquisitions to keep the innovation pipe. They bought product to be in pipe and then they tried to build the revenue based on acquisitions and then that all fall apart and then the workforce shifted. All the good people left and they're completely hallowed out. That's almost every hardware vendor and the ones that are left are still facing that challenge. Pharma went through the same thing with pharmaceuticals, right? Pharma folks, great new blockbuster drugs, away patent protection, away everyone good left and formed a biotech company. Software's in that same mix right now. Every company's facing the same thing. Do we invest more in R&D and get innovation? Do we acquire that innovation? Do we acquire the pipeline of IP? Do we acquire pipeline of revenue? We're at this little inflection point where systems of transaction are moving towards systems of engagement. People don't know how to build architect against that and we're also moving towards this digital age which is shifting exactly what happens between the consumer and the enterprise. And that's chaos right now. You would consider that pretty chaos. So are we going to see a renaissance in software companies guys like Workday, Salesforce, others? Or are we going to see more consolidation there and somebody emerge from the systems of engagement? We're definitely going to see a consolidation. What we're seeing is app dev is hot, right? Look at dev ops. You guys have been covering this area. It's pretty extremely hot. People are building the next generation of software in-house right now and the stuff that's actually going to go out package is going to come from tools vendors. The tools vendors have to figure out how to get this to package mainstream and the package apps vendors in the cloud have to figure out how to bring this out. So it's interesting what you were saying about, you talked to, I think you said a hundred of your clients and you said they're building something that doesn't exist. What are they building that on? What does that stack look like? What's the modern stack? You know they're building on anything they can, right? Whether it's the core that they have abstracting the layer around creating new verbs, right? Create, read, update, delete. That's old school, right? How do we abstract, share, publish, take that information, mix it, bring out insights, serve it up to someone else? So the speed came up, right? So Dave, I think what we're seeing and what it raised hitting onto your question is speed. Whoever can deliver the speed and that land and expand formula of I got to deliver value fast, they'll take whatever tool and they could use. It's not just speed too, it's a question of how do you bring all these different types of data together? You're seeing right now, maybe it's happening in visualization but it's more than that. I've got to mix and match different sets of data sets so that I can get to context and back to the context conversation, right? Back by role, relationship, process, thinking about time, location, sentiment, even predicting intent. Once I get there, now I can do something with it. That's context computing in IBM's world, which makes a lot of sense today. So I got spinning off that cognitive fantasy and it's certainly good messaging. I mean, I mean, come on. I mean, IBM's good job on the messaging with cognitive but is it real? Are you seeing any reality there? I am actually. We spend a lot of time with the Watson team looking at not just the launch at 51 Astor Place but what was interesting about it was the fact that people are building new business models, right? That's the interesting thing. So you're seeing specific deliverable solutions on Watson that are cognitive too. The guy that founded Kayak is like thinking about how do we plan travel, right? Have you seen the Watson cookbook? Yes, I did. That was pretty awesome, right? There's things in there like weird flavor combinations that they've mapped out. Oh yes, I did see that. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Really, would you put Watson chefs in there, right? So Watson chef is like an example of one of that. You're also seeing that with the medical research, right? They're ingesting huge corpus of data, trying to find patterns. We were upstairs in the innovation lab earlier. It was kind of some cool stuff, right? Imagine you're doing a debate and you're trying, you're doing a legal argument. Ingest all these data, all these journals, all this information and they're creating pros and cons, right? Literally sorting based on sentiment. Here's a pro debate, here's a con debate. Start looking at them and build out your complete argument. So what's the holdup with Watson? Why are we waiting? I mean, I was just talking to the guys last night and they got a great demo. I'm like, I want that right now for CrowdChat and for our Wikibon and SiliconANGLE. They're like, we'll stand in the line and go, I want to cut the line. I'm like, yeah, right. So that they're- How much money you got? No, but this comes down. Are they installing the nuclear weapon that they got behind just waiting for it to release or is it more of a go-to-market initiative where they really want us and let the use cases develop? I think for nine months of putting this go-to-market it's been pretty fast, right? So it's a comprehensive, it's a big project. It's been fast, but I think what it was finding the right set of partners, right? When you're going to want something like this, you've got to make sure the industries are right, the partners are right, they're committed. So I think that's taken a little bit more time. Plus, I think they've learned a lot about Watson. It's gone from that big-ass box to, you know, really small things. They're operationalizing the product for mainstream. That's a hard task. That's not easy. Okay, so that's about engagement. Obviously, you're the leading analyst in engagement social, engagement social data, but it also has that engagement systems of record, engagement records, it's more of a data warehouse. How is the word engagement changing and how does that affect the social business aspect? I think what we're starting to understand is that engagement and social is really different than systems of transaction, right? These were the new verbs I'm talking about. You're taking the data, you're mixing it, you're interacting it, it's built into business process. People are creating new verbs, right? And we're extracting the transactional record and we're doing something else with it. I mean, take crowd chat, that's a great example, right? Taking that data, pulling it, tying it back and then what do we do with it? You take additional sets of action against that, right? If you take what's happening inside any social business system, you're collaborating, right? I watch my 10-year-old, it's hilarious. They're on Google Docs at 6 p.m. They're on Google Docs and they can finish an article by 6.45. Six kids get on Google Docs at the same time, they go at it. I mean, they just go at it. That's great, yeah. That's crazy, by 6.45 they're done. You look at it, they cut each other off, they wrote something, they changed the structure, they capitalized it, they format it and then they're done. We don't work like that. We've never lived in a way. We sit back and we build out our arguments, we put it in an outline, then we go to a meeting and you know what's the first thing we do? We defend the crap out of it. Like, that's my idea. I'm going to win. How dare you go after it? Don't change that sentence. So something's happening. The collaboration is key. I mean, that's the social fabric of the internet of things where people are things. So what do you see? Be critical of IBM now. Identify the areas you need to work on. What do you think that they need to sharpen the pencil on and get the business faster on? What do you think they need to work on? Well, I think a lot of it is we've got to figure out which are going to be their future clients. Like, who are the folks going to take them for? Who are the star accounts, the lead accounts that are going to say, let's go co-innovate and co-create. And when they do that, you're going to see a long tail happen, right? So if they went out and said, this is not true and so I don't know if it's true or not. Let's say they took a company like Tesla and decided to co-innovate and co-create with them or Emirates and said, let's go co-innovate and co-create something. These are brand leaders, right? And when they move, everybody else moves with them. And so it's finding that niche of customers that want to do the co-innovation, co-creation with IBM and understanding that it's not the same IBM that's in the back end. They're willing to go out and partner in ways they've never done before. And we see that with some of our clients. What's the coolest thing that you've seen the past couple of weeks, obviously through the events? I mean, you've seen all the demos, you've seen all the sizzling, the sizzle, the steak and all the demos, talking to customers. Where's the reality? Where's the rubber hitting the road from the vendor standpoint and the customers? And what's the coolest thing you've seen? Well, let's take the customer point of view. I think the coolest thing is that old line businesses are transforming themselves to become digital businesses, right? You see that with the Phillips. You saw it with the Pratt and Whitney this morning. What I love about Pratt and Whitney, like what you don't see on the back end is like, where's all that data, right? Where's all that data coming? And I think I heard, and I'm not sure if this is NDA or not, but I'll say it this way, that if you can predict 18 months of data, even though they have 24 months of data and you can predict the next six months of that data, that's pretty darn cool, filling those blanks. So what about, we were talking about the stacks before, what about those stacks within, whether it's manufacturing or automotive or retail, finance, insurance, those have to break down for those old line companies to transform themselves. And there's going to be a spectrum, right? Some are going to do it, some are. What are you seeing in your client base? Well, the top three companies in every industry command anywhere from 40 to 70% market share. So it's a winner-take-all market right now. And the companies that aren't moving fast enough realize either they don't move or they're going to get merged and acquired. We have a stat that looks at 52% of the Fortune 500 have been merged, acquired, gone bankrupt or fallen off the list since 2000. American Enterprise Institute has a number that says 88% of the Fortune 500 have turned since inception. Most of that happened post 2000, right? And it's because new business models are emerging. Yeah, YouTube wasn't around then, YouTube came into the scene. You look at all the historic change, it's really been the fastest. Uber, Amazon, I mean, everything. Like the iPhone pretty much literally obliterated, do you need a flashlight? Do you need a compass? Do you really need a watch? Yeah, I'm going to buy another one from Apple. But you know what I'm saying? It's that kind of stuff that's going on. So one of the things that we're teasing out at every CUBE event, Dave and I try to pick a concept and play with it and ask our guests kind of what they think of it. And one of the things that coming out of this one being big data is the whole storytelling meme. We've been there, it's not this new concept but like we're looking at the upward reporting to executives and executives want real-time dashboards. They don't want another dashboard they want. They want storytelling. So Dave and I have been riffing on this concept around it's basically the content business internally. So you know the executives from P&G, we had a P&G guy on earlier who was a veteran there in data analytics saying hey they all want the same reports and so they have to content up, market up to the executives. So you're seeing this connection between user content and sharing and what we do for a business which is develop content and share with audiences. So that's bringing a whole another level of engagement. I want to get your thoughts on that about this long tail distribution of engagement. As people start looking at the different audiences, how do you look for the data points within the audiences to know where to look and explore? And 10 years ago they would throw out those data points. They would and what's actually interesting is the cost of data and the cost of storage. Massive amounts of data production, dropping cost of storage, what does that mean? I've got to mine all this data really quickly. And so this is the context piece that becomes important. I've got to build probabilistic data models. Probabilistic data models to figure out what's going on. Probabilistic business processes. So it becomes choose your own adventure like processes. You might start in point A and end point B. You might start in point C and end point D. I might start in point D and end point A. I've got to be able to support that kind of interaction because these aren't like force fit business processes from the world of systems of transaction. Something's changed and I think that's what we have to start with. The other piece that you're talking about around the storytelling, what's really interesting is it is bottom up and top down. If you look at what's going on in board reporting, the way they get the numbers, the things that people are getting an iPad now with the whole story of what's happening. They're swiping, they're drilling in to figure out what happened in the quarter. They're getting to that level of detail. That's the stuff we've been dreaming about for a while. And what's exciting about that is it's happening right now. Yeah, and then on the presentation this morning, they talked about engagement with the crowd and going to live events. And so this is the web scale era coming back in. It's the yahoo's, it's the Googles, it's the classic long tail. So the analytics is not just one area. It's a whole spectrum of data. And that's, I think, one of the things we're seeing that's interesting on this show is that people are looking outside the box, if you will, from the normal suspects into these random skew data points to explore. But what's fun about the show is the data vis actually had analytics behind it, right? That's actually very different than just pure data vis. When you go to data vis show it's like, there's reporting, here's where it is. I can manipulate the data. But when you have the analytics behind it, you can then do what? Suggest the next set of best actions. And that servicing of patterns, testing out hypotheses, getting those insights in place, that's what makes it fun. Yeah, that's the holy grail. That's what everyone talks about. Better outcomes, better decision making. We were at Hadoop World last week. It's just interesting to juxtapose sort of the discourse there with the discourse here. Everything sparked and Hadoop, obviously, and yarn and all kinds of new innovations going on there. And here it's, listen, big data transcends Hadoop. So we had Goldmocker on our panel. It was interesting. And he was very outspoken when he was an analyst at Cowan about the oracles and the SAPs and how they're screwed. And I think he moderated that a little bit and basically has more of a darn, the keep getting richer scenario, right? But having said that- But he also talked about the East Coast, West Coast dynamic too. He did. Well, that's a separate conversation to fly over. I'll tell you about that in a second. But essentially what I wanted to ask you is you're seeing so much money raised, huge valuations. You know, will we see a billion dollar company emerged out of those new players? Or will guys like Oracle and IBM just gobble them up and just kind of maintain their large S? I want to know which startup actually has the balls. Actually has the balls to actually ride it out the long way. Because I don't see that right now in a lot of the startups. But if one of them does and decides to build a new stack, they'll make it. Now, there are companies that I see like that. What do you mean by that ride it out? Have the balls to ride it out? Not sell out. Not sell out. They want to win. They want to dominate. They want to take out the big guys. Company like Atlassian is on that list for me. I mean, I see it. You can see that they've got the fire. They're interested. They want to win. Well, that's very, very- So what's the makeup of that profile? If you were to identify that startup, that is what, founders are in place. They're making money. So it's not about just a quick flip. They have a sustainable value proposition. Anything else? A progressive developer community ecosystem. A leader that is not afraid of the market. What we call traditionally a class like a nerd. I don't know what's legal on this TV. Nerd A-hole. They typically are smart enough, but they don't care about it. Arrogant enough to go- Arrogant enough to go call it on their own. They want to win. I mean, that's different. We haven't seen a lot of those since Oracle. Since Google. You know, Google. Bezos. Bezos. I mean, that was like 10, 15 years ago. Right? I mean, the last, I mean, maybe, let's give it to Facebook. Yeah. Well, yeah, right. It's not going to sold out. Facebook is definitely, no, he didn't sell. No, he could have. He could have sold out. He didn't show me no run-on thing. That's right, that's not false. So is that going to come out of Cloudera, Hortonworks? I don't know. Mapbar. Well, certainly Cloudera postpones the IPO discussion with the Intel relationship. That gives it a lot. Do they have the balls, as Ray said? Well, I think they do. I mean, I talk to the founders all the time and Cloudera wants to go play the long game. How much is that? Is just them just flexing their narrative and how much is Intel driving it? It was still sick. I'm waiting to get heckled on University Avenue in about two days. This is going to be brutal. No, I think the stride of such a good, I mean, this is a big thing in Silicon Valley is this durable company conversation. Who's building a durable company? And it's a legitimate concern. I don't know, maybe Workday. Workday's going to go out for a long time. I don't think they want to sell. I don't think they want to sell. I think companies that are already public are. Dave has no interest in selling. He didn't want to sell. People saw us. That's a great example. Workday's one. Well, Salesforce sell out. Splunk is another one. Tableau, ServiceNow, all public. Well, Salesforce is a really interesting example. It could be the next one, right? That could be the next one. Salesforce could be the next one unless Mark ends up taking over Oracle. I mean, you've got to look at Salesforce. They're playing a win. I mean, the way they're running their business right now. They're playing a win. They're playing a win. There's no doubt about that. It's clear that. Well, Salesforce has a platform that's broad enough to sell. They never sell. I'm not sure Workday does. So we started with the big data companies. I don't see it in the big data companies, but I do see it in some of the older cloud companies. Well, the thing about that. Well, OpenStack and Big Data are interesting verticals. OpenStack is more kind of anemic right now, but Big Data's got a lot of juice in them because there's dollars there. And so it's still early. So who's going to rise out of that crowd from a startup standpoint? We just haven't seen it. And the big boys are coming in. So if you don't have the stack, you're either playing on top or around the stack. Do you agree with that? And can a startup establish a stack in this competitive environment? No, but they could orchestrate a rollup of stack companies to actually get there if they've got the balls. That's creativity. I think that they can do it. I think there's a lot of parts all lying around there that actually can be assembled to create that brand new stack. What was interesting for me is I walked out of the software AG conference, right? And they're really talking about a digital business stack. They've got three out of the eight pieces that you need, which is interesting. I think the creativity of the entrepreneurs out there, you never underestimate. To me, I think entrepreneurs see things that others don't. Dave and I talk about this all the time. You know, I mean, but we just need to get some of the killer instinct. And I think it's going to come from a young, the young guns are going to have to come up and just take the mantle away. Have blind ambition. God, man, I feel like the old man in the room. Again! How many cycles have you lived through? How many lines on your scar tissue you have? You've seen it all. So let's talk about that. Given your experience in our age, what's your take on what's going to happen? How far will this cycle go? Bubble conversation comes up every week, certainly in Silicon Valley. The financial results of the past couple of weeks have been kind of interesting on the stock market side, but the private markets are still booming. You've got companies worth billions of dollars on the private market. Is that bubble going to pop? Is there sustainability on the revenue side? I don't know. We have some interesting conversations with VCs over the last two months. Some of the VC firms may not make it in the next round. They're having trouble raising their next round. The established folks, let's say the top 12 VC firms, they're doing well, right? Money's still flowing in. They're raising the funds. So we're seeing a thinning out on the VC side, which means we may see a thin out on the stock market. How many of those survivors are not on the West Coast? I think the West Coast is going through some VC. Maybe some in New York. Maybe some in New York. Is it some in New York? I'm getting a sense from the VCs in California that the investment climate is dropping like a rock. It's California. The East Coast VCs have a rock solid plan to actually get to profitability. Yeah, well, it's a different game. Get a lot of flyers, consumer bubbles, definitely the bloom is off the consumer rose. Yeah, but outside of media in New York, well, I guess New York. No, we're getting integrated devices. It's the device market that's hot. I'm seeing a lot of investment. IoT sensors, devices, embedded software. That's hot. Again, in California though, who's going to own that? The smart money that I'm seeing in California is all born in the cloud. The smart outside of the consumer of paid space. Born in the cloud, born big data and now IoT. No, this is the new stack. It has to be an integrated suite and it has to be flexible enough for a freemium and or land and expand business model. They'll invest in that because there's a lot of leverage and risk reduction. And enough large vendors with an exit strategy for some of these startups. Look at a GE software. There's some cool stuff going there. Look at what Cisco, how they have on the back and look what Intel's doing. They're building funds to absorb those when they come out. And I think it's a great opportunity. If I'm a startup right now in the enterprise, the enterprise is hot, but it's really hard to do an enterprise startup. You can't just come out of school and say, hey, I'm going to go compete with IBM. It'd be great if my socks talked to my toothbrush. Let's go get them started. What, legacy data? I don't deal with that. Do I care about that? What's going on? Security, what's your take quick on security to wrap up the segment? Oh, I think this is going to be the biggest issue, getting security right. You already see some of the issues that companies are in the payments business phase. You see what's happening with data, trying to secure data at the right level is going to be important. This is going to continue to be a problem as we go digital, because our identity's at risk and our data and our company's IP. And it's going outside the four walls. I mean, that's, you know, it's totally- So final comment, Ray. Comment on IBM's health status for the investors out there and for folks who want to get inside the head bumper sticker IBM. Good, bad, ugly. Give us a quick summary in the segment. I think the way to look at IBM is over the next 18 to 24 months, they're going to need some breathing room. There's going to be a lot more investment in some of the new areas as they're trying to figure out what that right mix of investment is and revenue. I think people are going to look at IBM and say, hey look, do they have a long-term strategy? Problem is, most of the investors today are quarter to quarter. If you want to go long and think about a place, I think IBM's still a good place to be. Okay, Ray Wang, principal analyst at Constellation. He's also the chairman, founder of Constellation Research. You got an event coming up, put a plug in for your event. All right, catch us next year since we're already sold out, but this year's event, October 29th to 31st at the Half Moon Bay Ritz. It's our innovation summit focused on digital disruption. Next year, November 4th through 6th, same place, Half Moon Bay. Big names, share some names. Who didn't show up? Who should have been there? Didn't get there. Lots of folks are coming from David Pogue, who's out there, Rachel Botsman, resetting the sharing economy, talking about what collaborative economies are bigger than a startup trend. We've got Raj Chetty talking about the quality of opportunity from Harvard. John Hagel is speaking. He's talking about what's coming next. And then I think with lots of interesting companies. Awesome. Well congratulations, your firm's awesome. You've got great research. Your digital transformation thesis you have is really excellent. And again, enterprise, you've got your rock solid. Ray Wang here inside theCUBE. We'll be right back after this short break.