 Welcome to the drum history podcast. I'm your host Bart van der Zee and today I am very honored to be joined by David Frengione the publisher of Modern Drummer magazine David. How are you? I'm doing great. Thank you, Bart. Great to be here everyone. Oh And it's and as I said that I was thinking you have a lot of different titles I mean you are an audio engineer you work in studios. You're an author You've got all sorts of cool stuff going on. You're a busy man Yes, you know a lot a lot of things happening and They all interconnect even though it may not look like it at the surface and I know that You know many of the things I do are full-time jobs for a lot of people But I've found a way to combine all of you know these different passions that I have into a career and And it's you know, it's amazing very very blessed very grateful. Yeah, I think um It's probably like cross guitar and bass, but I think musicians are really good about Making things work for them. Like if you like audio engineering and drumming you can kind of Put it together and find out find a way to make that work. Um, so Well in their hand and glove as well, right think about how much Audio engineering comes into play to be a part of what you do. I mean you're you know, you're an engineer and a drummer So you know that those are very very useful powerful musical tools to have you know from a technology and and audio engineering standpoint Yeah, and I think Now more than ever because we live in an era where you can't just say oh, I'm an engineer You can't just say I'm a tracking engineer. I'm a mixing engineer hire me you basically I think for a lot of people what makes them stick out is Oh, I'm also good in after effects or I'm also good with uh photo shop and it's like oh you stand out you have an extra Um little something so it's it's you know as a drummer it helps to know Ableton and to know pro tools So well, I agree with that part and I'd like to expand uh so that everybody can take away from this Time we're spending together some really valuable things that they can apply to their own life And one right now is You have to be a multitasker When we talked a minute ago about all the different types of careers I have and and and all the different Businesses etc. It all stemmed from Very early on like literally before I was a teenager I was starting to see Playing in the music business at such a young age as a drummer Having you know very big aspirations I was starting to see even that young 11 12 Playing in clubs and playing in bands that If you put all your eggs in one basket, it's not only very scary for making a living But it's also very limiting to how far That you can take your your goals your art So it's twofold We've got to be able to make a living to be pros in what we do And in order to do that you you know when a project comes along you have to be ready and able to do it I also believe you should be passionate about it. It shouldn't just be about having A career path to make money It should be about finding career paths that you're really passionate about and that are really important to you That you'd almost do for free if you could make a living otherwise um and That fulfill you and then when you combine some of those You know, you just really turn into a professional that has a lot to offer any project So if you just look at the example of a drummer engineer, um, which you know, if we go back to dave weckel You know to me one of the greatest drummers ever Will always be one of the greatest drummers ever and I followed his career From when he was in bridgeport, connecticut Commuting to new york city and starting to make noise In new york city with french toast um and And the whole way through and in my point in doing in following his career and understanding that is he was always Multitasking even though he was one of the world's greatest drummers Uh and becoming one at that time. He learned about electronics. He learned about sound He learned about the studio and all of these different talents that he didn't just Have an awareness of but he actually worked on it and and Expertise in them that really took it to even another level. So now you have one of the world's greatest drummers Gets a great sound understands the studio can collaborate with the team Live or in the studio on hey, you know, I think this week should do this or that to get a better drum sound And it's just such a powerful combination to launch and have a career from so that's what I I'd like to really encourage everyone Hearing us today. Take a look at where you're at if you're already doing two or three things Uh, and you and you love what they're what you know, what they are you may still have a long way to go in terms of Following the pursuit of them and growing your ability within them But the point is that you you know, if you're if you're good with what you're doing and where You know what the combination is then from there Don't stop grow learn put yourself in uncomfortable situations. So you can really grow even faster And if you don't do that if you're if you're someone right now listening to us and You're doing one thing Just be aware that You know, it's it's you're limiting yourself For no reason And uh, and you're and you're really in a position where you're not being conservative enough in A music related business or most businesses for that matter If something should go sideways Or a project should come along that you need to be able to do one more thing to get It'll be too late. So do it now And I think that's really important and I'll tell you guys a really Interesting story when I first started working with the band Aerosmith, which I've now been working with them since 1989 So it's about 31 years, I think and when it when I first started I was doing a lot of technology work And I remember The guy saying to me, you know, look, you know technology is really important to us We have a lot of need for what you're doing, but we also need, you know, other aspects of Of the of studio help, you know, you'll engineer on this day or um, you know Do this, you know work on the console this another day or, you know, fly samples another day whatever And um, and I remember thinking to myself And this was all like in a split second because it was a very it was a real-time conversation I remember thinking to myself I've got to push myself like they were describing some things that that I had I didn't have a lot of experience in at that time Some of the things I was already very very accomplished in other things I was learning and um, and I made the call to like really jump in it was scary as hell Because I'm working for my idols at that time. It was the biggest gig that I had I had some great credits prior to arosmith, but but not long-term credits They were just like, you know, I went worked with Elton John for a week, right then the project's over and You know, that was that But with arosmith it was ongoing. So it was very very scary to kind of look at this amazing Uh group heroes of mine this opportunity And um, it was you know, it was amazing. Yeah, I mean everything you're saying is so true and You know, you get faced with those moments where you think like it just makes you like Your heart drop you're like, I'm I don't know if I can do this like a new task comes But I always think that's like a benchmark of like After that you go, okay. Well It can't be as hard as that last, you know at that point monumental task So you really like I just think everything builds up like everything gets easier after you do those Your next mega thing that you're super nervous about whatever it is A big session that you're not that you're out of your element on you're alone You're doing you've always been an assistant. Now you're doing it alone Right. Everything's easier after those growth moments. Yes milestones check like checkpoints. I mean, it's just it's a huge thing so Everything is so right. You know what though Bart? In the moment The aftermath is what you're describing. It's it's huge. It's transformational. It's life changing but in the moment It's no less scary. No, right and it's almost there's almost an equation where the scarier it is The bigger the outcome will be and I think that uh, that's that's what you got to remember And it's so much easier to say than do but you you got to do it. You can't just think it and say it You got to do it. Um, it's the only way you grow We could use a million examples if we want to use a very simple one I think everybody gets it at this point But if we want to use a simple one you go to the gym, you you know You work your muscles and until you're sore and then you stop and then you recover and the whole process whether you realize that or not as you're breaking your muscles down and You're actually, you know, you're you're working them in that way It's the same thing in this case where you're you're actually breaking your your fear down Yeah Totally. I'm a big believer and uh, and I always think about this to myself. I'm like, man, if I started Let's just say like even, you know complain the drums, right? But if I started playing guitar like two years ago Imagine where I would be at now. I would be two years deep like no matter how old you are If you start now Yeah, fast forward two years, you're gonna be great But if you don't start then you'll be no further along and that's obvious But again, I always even with exercise or whatever you just got to start so Well, you're absolutely right and and starting is so easy to talk about but you know, there's a lot of people always have a reason Uh, and they don't even realize they have a reason, you know, I I see a lot of people that come to me for advice and I'll I'll concede, you know, one of my uh The things that I do is making a living is as a consultant and so people hire me to Um, you know, give them guidance advice and on many different levels for many different views Usually around music entertainment business almost exclusively, but nonetheless Um, the ideas are are very similar where Someone will come to me and and I'll do a deep dive and really start to unfold like what's going on and they won't even realize how They just let distractions Rule and they don't even see the distractions as distractions But they just get to the end of a day and they go Wow, you know, like I'm I'm not anywhere. I haven't started anything maybe I put my little foot in the in the in the pond, you know, but For five minutes, but I really haven't done anything and it's all these little distractions and all these little things that it's all fear Uh, just holding people back and it's disguised in many forms But you know, you really, you know, starting is underrated, you know, you really have to get out there and start So that's our advice now You and I are really aligned on Modern drummer, right the number one drum magazine in the world that I had the privilege of becoming publisher and CEO of Uh fairly recently and um, it is the drumming bible. It is established in 1977 Um, and here we are in this moment. I hope this, uh, you know, the stay home Uh goes away soon and people can get back to work and and be healthy and safe But if people are listening to this, especially during a stay home moment, uh, you know We just got a lot to share and bring value to their lives with today. I'm very excited bark Yeah, absolutely. So let's let's go way back and I and I do want to mention too Before we go back and talk about the beginning of modern drummer I saw you speak at the chicago drum show last year when I think was very close to your, you know, coming on board And uh, and it was great. So I was very impressed. It was it was really neat to see that Thank you. Yes, I came on as publisher then and then recently, uh added ceo to my role Well, congratulations. That's huge. I mean like you said, it's just it's The bible for drummers. I mean it is it is and it's earned that it's not like, uh, it just sort of happened I mean, it's been a long time. So, um You're the man in charge now Why don't you tell us a little bit about the history of the magazine going back into the 70s and uh, And how it started and and as as much as you can can lay on us Well, ron spagnardi God bless him. He and his wife isabel started Modern drummer magazine ron had the idea Uh, and you know the the early 70s for years He had this idea that he wanted to Create a drum magazine where Everybody could congregate in the drumming world. We didn't have anything like that. Yeah, and so on so many levels It's it's so necessary And He created it Out of their basement launched modern drummer. It was a 1977 was the first issue Buddy rich volume one number one, of course, buddy, of course How appropriate and the magazine just took off And it became an is today The top brand In what people know in the drumming world Literally, it was a question on jeopardy, you know, what magazine do drummers? read And modern drummer, you know, I mean it's unbelievable. So it's really It's really earned as you said Its reputation is the number one drum brand in the world of of what unifies and educates and informs and updates drummers When someone is in modern drummer or drummers either on the cover or feature It's like winning winning an academy award And you know, we're 43 years into modern drummer, you know, that's that's almost half a century and that's We are the only drumming resource that's completely neutral That's been around that long That is this trusted and has so many different tentacles to every Issue that we publish all of the digital that we curate Where it's unbiased and it's versatile So in one issue of modern drummer, you read about your favorite drummers or drummers that will become your favorite drummers Or you read about your peers You read about what guys are up to you read about the current and hottest gear you read about the current and hottest products and As well as like, you know cd streaming music that's out and video that's out Yeah, drummers online percussionists drum core jazz rock metal latin you name it and You get a lot of education, you know So there's a lot of exercises and a lot of really great insight So one issue takes you weeks to really get through Uh, we've priced it so that literally one trip to starbucks And you have an entire month of modern drummer online all 43 years in the archive As well as the current issue. I mean it's 695 a month for all access It's you know, we made it insanely affordable Because we want to continue to grow and have all drummers Be a part of this because that's how the magazine's got to the point. It's at now. It's the drumming community Once and needs and respects the fact that there is a voice for their community There is one place that they can trust And that they know that what they see and what they learn is valid You can't say that about any any place else, especially the internet There's a lot of theories and a lot of ideas out there, but what you get a modern drummer is the real deal and um, and If you were to go out on the internet You would spend way more time than seven bucks a month no matter who you are what you're doing To put together Everything that we hand to to a drummer in one issue We already go through the process of okay. What's the newest gear? What are the newest releases who are the hottest drummers who are the drummers that are icons but are doing new things right now Who's come on to the scene who's left the world and we need to acknowledge Uh, you know, who's you know playing in the studio or about to do some cool gigs Who's releasing signature series product, you know an on and on and on to curate that takes a team One of the best teams in the world Of season pros at modern drummer full-time work for us on a staff So one person going out there and trying to do that on their own would be you know A big waste of time because we already do it for you and we do it really well And I think that's how the magazine has got to the point where both in print and digital It is still number one in the world by far and the interesting thing is And when I was at nam recently Um, you know, this was a fact that a lot of people were surprised about it then paused and realized Oh, yeah, that makes a lot of sense and that is our print product is bigger than ever Drummers love to hold modern drummer magazine You would think instinctively because the news print world has become so commoditized And just the general infrastructure for obtaining print product News stands and bookstores and all that are just going away as fast as you can blink But modern drummer print is bigger than ever. It's amazing Of course, most of the those people are through subscriptions, right? So they don't have to why would you go to a news stand when you you know for virtually a buck? You can get it delivered to your house And it's uh, it's amazing. It's how strong that is and and when I was at nam and I was sharing that At first a lot of people were like, well Wow, that that kind of bucks the trend and then I would ask them. Well, do you read modern drummer? Everybody said yes Thank you And and then I asked well, do you have your back issues or do you read it and throw it out? And I'm telling you not one person said they throw the magazine out and that was the aha moment like wow You know what I do I have a stack of modern drummers And I do use them as a as a resource and I do enjoy keeping them Some people put the covers on their wall. Some people, you know, take pictures of them. Some people use them for social media I mean, there's so many incredible things you can do with it. Of course holding a magazine And having the notation to be able to write on it And put it on a music stand or photocopy a page to use on a gig or in a practice room There's just it's endless. So yeah, really, it's really great how the magazine It's print product and of course all the things we're doing on digital Because the magazine started its life strictly print in 1977. That's all there was sure Ron innovated a lot of things You know, he innovated drum festivals the modern drummer festival was always a huge deal. We're going to bring those back Oh, awesome. That's huge digital. We've revamped our entire digital world where What we're covering and and all of it for subscribers, right? What we're covering what we're putting on our website what we're putting You know through all of our different channels. It's just incredibly helpful and insightful to drummers absolutely so Personally, I have a little like bin every year as a kid, you know, it would be a christmas present Here's your modern drummer subscription for this year. Here it is for this year So I have years and years and years of them and what I do is I take like if I'm going on a trip or something I'll obviously have the new one that I've read but I'll take an old one because I loved just looking back in you know, 2001 in 2005 whenever and just seeing what was happening then and like you said nothing is ever Like out of date. Maybe the technology has changed but even then coming from my angle of the history of things You can look at it and go wow, that's changed a lot or that technology I didn't know that company existed then or are all these things so and another thing I think is cool is I think in a lot of a lot of Forms of media people don't like advertising to go. Oh, you know, you're watching hulu or whatever It's like here's another ad I enjoy looking at the drum ads to see who's endorsing what and I think that's a really rare thing with With drumming and it's even with the modern drummer podcast where I like hearing who's spot like like dream symbols There's always a sponsor. I like hearing that because uh It's it's art industry. It's like an industry Magazine, which is what it is. So so it's kind of cool to see like Okay, Vinny's playing uh, piste now. Whoa cool, you know, you you it keeps you in the loop even on that level So if you can have your advertising be something that I'm interested in I just think that's that's huge, you know Well, I couldn't agree with you more. Um, the fact is that the ads are as much of interest to drummers like you described As as the content in the magazine is they go hand in hand We drummers love to see who's playing what we love the creativity of the ads I mean think about how many ads Are so iconic, you know that buddy rich playing the tuba On uh, the zilgen ad, you know from the 70s and 80s if I couldn't play zilgen I'd switch instruments and buddy's sitting there with a tuba I love it. Yeah, there's just so many iconic ads and and I'm you know, I really truly I I really truly hope that that comes back bigger and stronger than ever And I I hope that as as the manufacturers You know have see changes inside of their organizations And younger people or different people come into their organizations Who may not have the the history To see to have seen those ads and know what we're talking about and how cool and impactful they are I hope that that catches up and I hope that that you know on all sides of it It it comes back in a modern way, right? We don't want to see the same ads No from the 70s and 80s. Nobody thinks that but the same the same emotion when you you know when you A lot of companies really get what we're talking about and then there's a few out there that really don't get it they don't they don't understand that When a drummer sees You know Mike Portnoy behind this amazing one-of-a-kind drum kit And he's and they see you know, tama the strongest name in drums And you know that that has a huge impact that if they don't see another ad Or they see another ad and it's just a picture of a drum kit or it's a picture of us, you know Something is something really simple and basic and kind of gear like There's no comparison in the emotion and what that's going to do to the drummer's decision Man, I've never thought about that. That is so true. Well, I mean the endorsement in drumming is so important of oh, I love that drummer He plays dw now I want to grow up and buy dw set I remember seeing the drummer from system of a down when I was like 13 and he was playing tama star classics And then my first real kit that I bought was a star classic kit So it just is like We're impressionable. I mean, you know because drummers come up especially when you're 12 or 13 big time and we we like a gear So, um, we do and we love and dw is a great, you know, just happens to be one of the the best Drum drums in the world and yeah, what a what an incredible Incredible incredible company Uh, but it's but you're right. They you know, we drummers love this. We love seeing Who's not only who but how and what? um, and uh, you know And what modern drummers been focusing on and we've ratcheted it up considerably during stay home right now is Bringing content that's applicable To right now. So i'll give you an example I'm personally doing a 15 day series one A day for 15 days That's basically like a minute or two long and it's an exercise Each day is a different exercise out of a really really well-known book either master studies or new breed or darmfamilaros that you remove and um, and i'm Focusing on a specific exercise or set of basic exercises where I demonstrate them it's all video and notation based I tell you exactly what book we're working out of what page I show you the transcription on screen and I play it and and describe it This is what you do. This is what it's supposed to sound like and these are incredible chop builders that in one to two minutes You can understand The exercise and then go practice it all day as long as you want whenever you have time or want to make time And then the next day there'll be something new for 15 days and And we're going to keep them up of course online so people can go back and do the 15 days or any any one of the Days whenever they want but this is something so relevant and important to drummers right now Because it's going to have a huge benefit for them. They're playing is going to improve very quickly For the least amount of time and a zero investment. They don't want to buy the book. They don't need to I put exactly what they need on the screen And there it is and those are the kind of initiatives that we're really passionate about because we want All things to all drummers to be available all the time And of course our subscribers are going to get incredible benefits Because of how much we're curating the content and and the print product and the proprietary digital products on our website That are only for subscribers the vip contests that we do for our subscribers give the drummer some vip You know where you meet John Bon Jovi on a Mediterranean cruise or you Meet Alice Gonzalez from the now on stage at the la forum and Can't you a snare drum and a cymbal? And then you watch the show from the front row. I mean these are things you can't buy And our subscribers Uh can get them just for entering by being a subscriber for free and we sponsor them. They're not underwritten So it's really you know, that's that world But if you're not a subscriber we still want to bring a lot of content and uh and value to you and um And so that's one of the things like we're doing the 15 day Uh stay home exercises. That's for everybody. It's free online part of martin drummer Um, we're gonna do with mike dawson And michael melinda a digital editor. We're going to do a uh and myself A some streaming Uh famous drummer, uh, not they won't be live streams in the sense that they're literally literally live at that moment But they're going to be premiered streaming events. Um, it's just much better for drummers to have You know to have an edited product for how we want to deliver it And then we'll do q and a's and that kind of thing It works better for how we envision what we're doing than trying to do it live and it's a little more limiting And then that will stay Online, you know forever and that will be free to everybody. Uh who's interested so It's really this balance of You know, if you're in the club, you know, you have this endless amount of content and value and if you're not Then you know, you still have an amazing amount of content and value where you can learn about things Learn how to play better for for Only the investment of time which you need to put in any way and um And of course, you know Hear about what drummers and and drums are you know are up to right now. It's pretty exciting time That is I mean, so you guys are The goliath in the drum world, obviously. So I think there's a lot of responsibility there on how to handle These times that are you know, people are at home and and giving them things to work on so I think you're You know with great power comes great responsibility And I think you're handling it well of saying this isn't a time to be like, well, man Dangle the carrot and be like if you want this, you got to pay for it. No, no, not at all The opposite this is what you're absolutely right part. This is the time where we have to We have to be all things to all people. Uh, there's going to be people that um, you know, don't don't have a need Uh for subscribing for whatever reason Um, and we still want to bring value, you know It's about bringing value to drummers and it's really almost like a better and best If you want best you subscribe and with it comes all of these extra things But if you just want better and is good enough for what your needs are then you just go on our socials And uh, and they're free and they're amazing what we're delivering So it's yeah, it's it's not about like trying to convince anybody to to do anything or to spend money It's about being a central resource for Um, you know for drummers and drumming All styles all ages all types Internationally domestically just every aspect of drumming we cover and we do it, uh, you know For free basically on our socials as as kind of the better product and then best to subscribe Yeah, and and I don't think it should be glossed over speaking of free that um I personally I know a lot of the people listening are huge fans of the modern drummer podcast and I would definitely give them Mike and Mike Mike Mike my credit for Being a massive inspiration for me to even start this. I mean, I've heard every episode and that's like 235 hours of it Love it. Thank you. Yeah, they're great. They're great. I mean we we love what they're doing It's it's in a very specific niche and they do such a great job. They're very passionate Of course, they're incredibly talented um one of a kind both those guys and um It's great. It's great podcast and we're going to be looking to do another podcast product That's totally different from what they're doing Uh in the near future, you know, so it's it's really about covering all the different bases Uh because everybody has you know, I don't want to do a bad drum pun and say different strokes for different folks but the fact is that um You get it like full stroke half stroke. Anyway, the fact is That you know that that there's so many the great thing about drumming and the and the drummer's world is that there's so many different lanes to it And every one of them is a lifelong pursuit And every one of them is incredibly fulfilling and brings a lot of joy to people's lives It's just people in drum core that'll never play a bass drum with their foot You know on a trap kit and um, and they couldn't be happier and they'll they'll be the rest of their life Going up and down the field and loving it When they get too old to to hold the drum and do it themselves They'll get out front and teach the next generation. They love drum core And you got guys that'll only play jazz guys that only play metal Uh, you know, et cetera, et cetera, et cetera and and so all of those types You know, we want to fill, you know, their needs with with everything they need They need the relevant product reviews for what they're into Uh, they need to know who the drummers and inspirations are for what they're into What releases affect them that they want to check out and it will help them of course all the education So so all of these placeholders Actually have many different lanes within them So it's endless amounts of content that we're producing for people because there's endless endless amounts of consumption that they that helps them Yeah, one thing that I have Personally been working on with my show is is I'll get messages from people saying hey, I'd like to hear something about more Like marching or more military drumming and I did not come from that background I came from playing in rock bands and doing studio stuff So I need to like get out of my own what I like world and try and cater to people who I'm just Beyond honored they're listening to the show and give them something that they want to hear and I think Obviously modern drummer does a great job of that. So I kind of look at that as an inspiration of okay, you know Little bit of everything for for everyone is is what's best Well, thank you, you know, we uh, we absolutely, um, we try, you know, we we definitely put a lot of emphasis on versatility covering all the different bases um and Really making sure that there's something for everyone But but with meat on the bone, you know, like not just a little You know nothing just for the sake of you know, like a headline, you know, okay, this is for uh, you know a percussionist and this is for Somebody who strictly plays orchestra or no, no this if we're going there, we're get we're going deep on it We're giving you substance That really Helps, uh, you know your goals and and your life Yeah, and if people don't know from this conversation yet that it is a great magazine and people should should absolutely check it out And I want to switch gears now because we were talking before about the stay home Uh, sort of mindset. Um, and if if you're listening to this 10 years down the road, we are currently in the middle of the covid 19 coronavirus Pandemic where literally it's it's sweeping the world and people are forced to stay home I mean Odds are you're listening to this in a couple weeks and you're right there with us and we're all we're all together But I do think there's one cool thing and I've been talking with a friend in new zealand Andrew Rooney who has the new zealand drummers podcast the nz drummers podcast And he's talking about the problems. He's having as a drummer. I mean, he's literally halfway across the world We are all in this together. I mean, we are all being affected and even I do like video and audio freelance stuff I have been wiped out as a freelancer and i'm sure everyone is in the same boat with with gigging so um I think people would like to hear from you will affectionately call you the boss because you're the boss of modern drummer What do you what do you say about all this like what people are out of their gigs right now? Like what's maybe give them some some words of hope well Here's the thing um you You have to use this time to get real on a couple of different levels The first is You have to take a look at what you're doing. This is one of those moments in time That will not only forever change the world at large But will will and should change our world your world And so in order to do that you have to first take a look At what am I doing right now? Am I do I like what i'm doing because this is the time to change You got if you ever heard the saying you got all the time in the world This is literally you have all the time in the world and you probably will and let's hope You never have this amount of time again in your lifetime So this is the moment where you do have all the time in the world and with that the first step is Get real. Do you like where you are? Do you like what you're doing? The answer is no Find what you do like Once you do that and for the people whose answer is yes The second step is You have to take right now to grow and improve consciously Get online and take courses refresh courses new courses practice Start your online business if that's part of what your passion is and that fits into your goals if you're a drummer Get to the pad get to the kit And this is the time where you really Explosively grow and the people that come out of this with huge evolution Are going to be the people that always look back at this moment and say that was the moment that not only changed Our lives but changed my life And I know this is heavy stuff And and it is and it should be and it needs to be Because that's what it is And this is your life. It doesn't get any bigger or heavier than that This doesn't have to overwhelm you It just has to consume you in a manner that you really take it seriously and you take decisive action So the decisive part is step one Where am I? Uh and choosing where you want to go, right? So if it's where you are now great step two Is now i'm going to actually take the steps to improve And i'm going to practice and i'm really going to take it to the next level and step three Is get a mentor make sure you're not asking your boyfriend or girlfriend or mother or father How you sound or how you look or how your business is going because the chances are they'll say great and that won't be the case You need right now a mentor. You need guidance. You need someone or or some Group that will say to you, you know, look. No, that's not really that's not really how it is That's like, no, you're you're you don't you don't sound as good as you think or you know Doesn't groove or it doesn't you know or it doesn't feel like there's a feel like that So you can go back to step two And keep fine-tuning it and that's how you're really going to accelerate your growth And then with those three steps when this is over and you have to get back to the real world And no longer will you have all the time in the world? You will have had Explosive transformation and that's what I wish for everybody man Very well said and and I think just jumping off that last point of uh It's a slippery slope of working in isolation like you said because you you think that you may sound great But you don't want to go and practice the wrong thing For three months and then go. Oh boy. I practiced the wrong thing So having those check-ins where fortunately we live in a time now where You can connect with people for free via like Zoom or whatever the apps you want to use to video chat and uh, and I think people are Everyone's at home. That's the beauty and and I'm like I'm like cleaning up with interviews because everyone's at home and they can't escape me So I'm like, I'm right. I mean, well, that's you know, that's the way it should be You're doing you're doing exactly what is the best thing you could be doing is that that's one of your passions Is to have this podcast and through drum history podcast bring You know these various people and subjects to the world At no cost and um, and now the access that you have is grown substantially And so you're taking advantage of it And that's you know, that's in every one scenario I mean it's easy to understand in your case because you would have been At home or in a studio and isolated anyway, right? But you're you're multiplying it because you see that now's a time Where people are you know available to talk and it's easier to schedule etc But the fact is that everybody in every field has a similar opportunity You may have to go a little deeper to find it and you may have to think a little harder Maybe even go outside the box But you got to do it Because this is you know, this is a one and done Time period and uh, and I'd like to see everybody make the most of it I also did an instagram post for anybody that wants You know a little more explanation on this on my uh at david frangione instagram And um and talk exactly about what you just asked me which is you know, what should people do right now in the stay home? Yeah, I saw it was great and you know, it'll that's how people will grow I think it's cool too and it's it's really across, um Industries, but I like how right now people are like like On like online lessons like the one that comes to mind as I know Dan Bailey who's a great very, you know predominant drummer Is releasing his like master course. I think he was like 66 off or something because it's like everyone's at home Use the content don't you know, it's like a let's bring down the price let people actually buy it Um, which I think is very noble now that being said I do see like nike doing it and stuff Which you know that might not be that might be more like buy shoes It's not as like You know pure as a drummer doing it but I think everyone has good intentions and is just trying to build each other up and and I always say but the drumming community is very special where Be it. You're a jazz drummer or a metal drummer. We we all really want to help each other So I think we're we're lucky to have to not be Alone we're all together through social 100 percent. Um, yeah I mean the drumming community is is so connected and and such a brotherhood and sisterhood. It's it's amazing. Um, and You know, that's another thing that that I've always thought was so important about modern drummers that You've it's it's it's as vital to the drumming community as as anything could ever be because That's what you're only a community when you're acting in a in the manner of a community And in order to have that central place where everybody Has what which really kind of dictates the community? It can't just be drummer scattered all over the world who love drums It all has to be centralized to actually turn into the community We're referring to and that's where modern drummer comes in. So I think You know between what everybody has to do at stay home and In that central place of modern drummer listening to resources such as your podcast And really taking a good hard look at what they're doing and how they can improve This will turn into a moment in time that will change Your life Yeah, absolutely. And I do think it's important to stay to say for people like, you know, it's hard to do it but Really staying home and I don't want to get political or anything at all because I'm not a political guy but staying home really is very important because That's the only way to stop. I mean people are Dying so it's really a very effective way. You you literally like everyone keeps saying it But you just have to stay home. There's no there's it's it's relatively easy Just stay home and don't go out and don't see a bunch of people. So Well, and I think I see most people doing that. Um, but yeah, of course. I mean, that's 100 right Now as we kind of get closer to the end here, I think it would be really neat You yourself have a very interesting background So you wrote the book crash, which is features tons of really cool drum sets. You've worked with major bands So why don't you um, take a few minutes and just let people kind of meet the new, you know ceo and publisher of modern drummer and tell us about you well David Frangione My world actually started before I was born because my parents Who met right after my dad get out of world war two Their dream and goal was to have a family and they ended up not being able to have children For over 15 years of their their beginning of their from the beginning of their marriage on For no reason the the doctors couldn't tell them why so they literally just kept trying to have kids and uh And you know just we're kind of accepting the fact that as I got older and older that they may never have this family That they dreamt of then they had my brother john who's three years older than me And he was like a miracle kid to them like wow The doctors couldn't explain why they couldn't have kids and they couldn't explain why they finally did have a kid So this was like all just a big mystery And then they had me Uh and that that's my family my mom and dad who were no longer with us uh my brother and myself um and When I was two I got diagnosed with retinoblastoma, which is cancer of the eye And they weren't sure if I was going to live so this whole idea Of the family that they dreamt of was now being challenged that they could lose The younger son to cancer at age two. So it was riveting very traumatic as you could imagine Uh, I think losing a child in at any age and under any circumstances is Beyond comprehension in terms of sadness and trauma for for any parent. Yeah, and uh, they were no different and I ended up Having to have my right eye removed. So I've been blind in my right eye ever since so I only really know and remember what it's like to see out of one eye And that really formed my life from then on I found drumming literally at that age at the time, of course I had no idea Even as I got a little older I always said I started playing the drums around seven or eight years old But then I then I found pictures Lit when my mom passed away in 2004. She was my best friend and closest Person to me ever And my inspiration And really the reason we're on this podcast right now with with credits and and any kind of success Um, and when she passed away I was going through photos that I had never seen before and I was drumming at 18 19 months and two years old The photos were dated. It was unbelievable right before my cancer and then of course right after So I've been playing the drums literally my whole life in one form or another at eight years old I started taking lessons. We couldn't afford a drum kit. So I was taking drum set lessons every week from a local public drummer first in school and then from a guy at a music store Mr. Woolly and I was playing on phone books and pots and pans and tables to emulate a drum kit And uh, eventually I got to use drum kit my parents saved up for a couple years And I played the heck out of that thing and started playing in bands Started looking at how can I be the world's greatest drummer? I wanted to do something bigger in life than what surrounded me in my neighborhood in my environment It was a very limiting environment very very blue collar people kind of stayed in the town and just you know, kind of Kind of we're almost resigned in that area to like, okay Well, this is this is what it is and I was such a rebel against that. I was like no way I'm going to do big things if it kills me and um I worked really hard to accomplish that, you know, I didn't I didn't just dream it. I actually did it Which I still do to this day, uh, you know, 14 16 hour days on a regular basis because that's how much time it takes to do it you know and so After 12 13 years old playing gigs um I was starting to lead a band and I started to learn about booking gigs and Start to learn about business, which I you know had no idea. I was really learning All I was trying to do was get my band into different venues clubs and whatever Uh, but of course with that comes agreements, you know, how much are we going to get? What's the set time? What's the load in what's the load out and all these things that I was just learning all these cool things that Had no idea would serve me for my entire life found technology Through drumming around 17 years old I uh was searching for great drum sounds Technology now we're in the early to mid 80s was starting to become very important to drumming So that's what my first explorations consisted of was like, okay. How do I trigger drums? How do I understand the basics of programming a drum machine? Ended up falling in love with technology as much or more as I did drumming And what I saw as my technology career was really taking off and it came very naturally to me Is I saw that you know, I became a consultant midi consultant Got a lot of clients and I saw that you know, wow like in this environment I can contribute to music and take everything I've learned about music and I can do it on a much bigger scale and a much more passionate and and An interesting scale then I could even as a drummer because a lot of the bands and artists that I would dream of working with Had a drummer, but they didn't have anybody helping them with technology. So, yeah, it was just kind of a hand in glove fit So I really pursued it then, you know had a very successful midi consulting business before I was 20 years old and again through a lot of hard work from starting at zero And then got the gig with arlesmith I was referred to them and I came in to do one project for a week and never left and then from there Started to work with a lot of other people get a lot of referrals have worked with a myriad of platinum record artists that have just made for an incredibly grateful career, you know from Shakira to the stones to elton to debbie gibson to ricky martin to You know sticks journey, of course we mentioned arlesmith ozzy osbourne brian adams Uh billy joel, you know, it just goes on and on the privileges I've had in terms of working with getting called to work with great artists and um and then I started a business called audio one because My consulting technology all those areas were really growing I was doing different projects drum sample cds with east west that were very successful And I had to form a company because I was getting asked to build a lot of studios Some people even credit me were building the first home studio, which I have no idea. That's true or not It's a great credit if it is pretty cool. Yeah, yeah, it'd be cool But um, I was getting a lot of calls to build studios and put systems together So I had to form a company. I had to scale it bigger than me So I started audio one which has been in business now for over 25 years uh turned into one of the top companies in the world for building recording studios home theaters and large-scale home automation systems And uh, then I started pro tools training.com Uh, which has been a very successful environment teaching people all around the world for uh pro tools and certification through avid And I started all access idea which is inspire and develop artists Uh, which is an artist development program. It's been very successful. We have a label through warner Um as well as a great artist development program Of course, I have modern drummer now and all of my side projects in addition to these companies um, and I have friend joni media, which is Uh, the consulting arm Where we consult We work on new product ideas. We do high level business consulting and an artist consulting We work on more commercial based projects where we'll do entire facilities And um, you know acoustic designs, etc. So all of this fits together And uh, you know, here I am With a career now that spanned well over 30 years And I've been fortunate enough to receive, you know over 70 golden platinum records and I have a lot of uh, You know a lot of artist relations that um, you know Just been an amazing amazing educational ride Wow is still going strong. Thank god. That's just the the case and point of just you know, it's it's an example of Don't do one thing. Obviously, you can do it do one thing great But do a bunch of stuff, you know and just and see what happens I'm sure I would be surprised if you hadn't had some things that you tried that maybe didn't succeed and you you say I learned from that and then moved on everyone does. Well, that's without a doubt Bart I mean, you know, there's we're talking about the highlight reel of the things that have been great You know, we could have a whole another show on the failures. Maybe two shows And you also mentioned crash the world's greatest drum kit So in the middle of of these other projects, I also have authored three books All bestsellers the first one's Clint Eastwood icon Published in 2009. They've all been published by insight editions, which is a fantastic publishing company They do harry potter and batman and they're wonderful Uh, and then they published my second book Which is Clint Eastwood icon revised expanded edition in 2018 which is still out there doing great And then my third book crashed the world's greatest drum kit So the Clint Eastwood books are all about Clint's films his art. They were done in collaboration with Clint and um Anybody who's into action movies westerns or anything Clint Eastwood or anything movie posters of memorabilia pure collector You're gonna love Clint Eastwood icon. That book is coffee table book. It's amazing Crash is also for the collector or for anybody who loves drums as you mentioned There's all these pictures of iconic drum kits. It's part of my foundation Frangione foundation Text drums to 707070 and you can donate to Frangione foundation, which at all times we're helping musicians and kids Who need it most? And uh, Frangione foundation is you know, has this incredible drum museum where all these drums reside and the book Contains, you know, it's coffee table book contains pictures and stories Carmine apiece carl pome or neil pierre alex van halen Um, you know, just on buddy rich louis balsam Um, the list goes on and on and on of eric singer Um, you know iconic drums iconic drummers iconic drum kits If you love drums, and I would think most of the people on this podcast do We're listening. You got to get crashed to world's greatest drum kits. It's at amazon and uh, it's it's done really well And the feedback we've gotten has been extraordinary We did the first printing had a couple of Mistakes in it that you know, they weren't the end of the world, but they were still mistakes So we did a second printing Because the first one sold out so quick and we corrected those mistakes Uh, which were a couple of texts a couple of typo things Uh, and the book's just done really really well and I'm very proud of it And you know, I did it for drummers and drummers are coming back to me saying we love the book and that's what matters That is what matters. It's cool just to I just love that we can just look at pictures and read about drums from from our our heroes. Yeah Isn't that cool? I mean, it's just such a cool thing to be able to look through. Thank you. I agree You know Bart, I made the book all three books for that matter That I want to read And I figure I'm a pretty harsh critic of of myself and of just creativity in general I learned that from Steven Tyler, you know, he's pretty intense about getting things right And he was very nurturing in all those years We were in the studio together and that rubbed off on me in a big way between my mother and Steven that that was a really really prevailing mindset and Uh, these books are the books I would want to read they're books that I I would if I didn't write them I'd have them on my coffee table and I would enjoy Uh going through them as a fan of these subjects Yeah, and what you said about Steven Tyler and your mom it just goes to to show about that The importance of the not working in isolation and having a mentorship and taking people's feedback Not getting your feelings hurt grow from it expand and Do the best work possible. So I love it. You're absolutely right. Well said Awesome. Well, David, thank you so much for sharing all of this amazing information with us And I'm really excited about the future of modern drummer I just think it's so cool that it's been around for so long and it's It's got it's there's no end in sight I mean, it is just getting better and better and bigger and yeah, and I'm sure what you're going to do is just going to be amazing Well, thank you Bart. Uh, you know, we brought my drum teacher Don Femularo who's one of the most famous drum educators in the world We brought him on as head of global education for modern drummer Um, and I want to thank him for introducing the two of us Um, and also thank you for doing you know the contributions He's going to continue to make to modern drummer. Thank you for the support Thank you everybody listening for the support modern drummer.com as Bart said, you know, we're 43 years strong but the best is yet to come and uh, very grateful for all your support and everybody just stay home If we're past this when you listen, uh, Take the principles that we learned during stay home and apply them. They'll be applicable forever And I wish everybody the best Awesome. Thank you. David Frangione everyone. I really appreciate being on the show. Thank you If you like this podcast find me on social media at drum history and please share rate and leave a review And let me know topics that you would like to learn about in the future Until next time keep on learning This is a Gwyn sound podcast