 I just want to welcome everybody and say hi on behalf of the small farms team for NDSU extension And welcome to the local meats production for a farm to market webinar series. This is our first Series on getting livestock ready for harvest. I'm just a couple things. I wanted to mention Is one again, I just wanted to mention that pre-survey. There is a link in the group chat And I'll mention it probably in a little bit here, too If you can go in there and click on that and take that that would be I'm greatly appreciated I just wanted to mention a couple other things the small farms team with NDSU is a fairly new team within the last four or five years and So one of the things that we just created I know this is a different topic, but we just created a publication Called beginners guide to raising chicken So I just wanted to put that out there just to give you guys that information And then also keep in mind if you are a grant writer I am working on putting together a workshop for For you guys. So basically it's a two-day grant writing one day and it'll probably be in like September and then another day like Four weeks later, maybe three to four weeks will be the second day and on that first day You basically you take your proposal you create that outline You get all the resources you need to expand on that outline and then on the second day You basically take your proposal look at it from the real from the role of a reviewer We'll give you some strategies for funding and provide you with on the opportunity to Finalize that to actually be able to submit it. So just keep an eye out for that Because that is something that hopefully will be coming out this fall Um The recording link yes My goal is to have this to you by the end of the week as a recording and it will be up online So you should be getting that by the end of the week as well. All right, so with that. Thank you very much I know we have a couple polls Travis So just as a reminder whenever you want to do that, but I will just send it back to you to introduce who you got in your panel and Take it over Thank you very much Lindy and in fact She's been a lynch pin and making sure that this happens and this is the first of our five-part webinar series And so Lindy, I'm just gonna provide a little bit of introduction And what better way to have that poll is at the same time of what I'm talking because we don't want to interrupt our Talented presenters that we've invited to join us. And so one of the quick things that When we describe What impact let's see here that we have We can have On our livestock and our production is I put together one main slide And so hopefully you guys can see this of just how do animals grow and in big picture, I guess Again as we kind of evaluate and where we're at at North Dakota State University extension is that it's not about lecturing Anyway, and hopefully it's about discussion and interaction So this is gonna be the max of my slides that we put together But I think it tells the best story that we can and this as we look at the bottom of our x-axis of this quick graph we have live weight and That can be in any unit that we so aspire to do and in fact I think one of the things that that I'll take ownership in and Allow us to as we talked through these series is that it is impactful that we're talking about beef cattle that we're talking about swine That we're talking about sheep and and we're talking about goats And in fact if we have some of our more variety species We can at least reach out to people and see how we can be able to provide Something else as well. So we have tissue weight going on the top and the best way that I describe this and in fact again We're at animals, but even as we think about it from a young person of as you continue from age Three to four to five to seven or whatever that is is that you're going to grow and the bones are growing And we know that in fact, of course, we've got CJ on here And so in fact his his bones grew quicker or faster than mine did because he certainly made it taller or more vertical than a than I did but genetics is gonna allow you to a point of when those bones are going to stop growing and as we think about it from that standpoint Additionally, you follow the yellow line and as we think about it, you know And as you move from grade school to middle school to high school And certainly there's more muscle and as we think about it from a beef antler or a pig or whatever that may be is that for the Most part that's going to literally increase The difference is is that last one that is fat and adipose tissue That's our green line and when in fact as we look at that green line We think about it from growth plateauing So there's going to be a time when those bones and you reach or the cows or the pigs or the sheep or the goats Reach mature frame size and there's going to be a time when we decrease or plateau in terms of that muscularity Now as we continue in terms of providing energy and providing protein and those feed resources We should be well aware that it's the fat that continues to move on. Okay, and so we have those as options that that we have in our Supply chain of animals and Lindy do they have access to our Pole Just to give you a little bit of heads up before we kind of move on is of course We have this evening so with May 3rd And then we will have May 10 May 17 May 24 and 31 as you see from Farmers markets approach and then retail meats and then consumer relationships and then poultry just to give you guys an idea of Things that are going we'll share this back at the end of ours and I will stop sharing and offer that poll Okay, and so How many people are watching with you and what would you consider today's level of experience? For today's topic, okay And so you can give us just a little bit of an idea of how many people are there and what your experience level is a Couple of people that we have that are that are here and that are joining us Okay, and Lindy gave that quick introduction and we have CJ and Callie Thorn that have joined us as well and Can give a little bit of a background Lisa Peterson works for NDSU extension And also has served as our beef quality assurance Coordinator in fact in a previous life I got to work with her in that role and now enjoy the opportunity of having her as a colleague Mr. Darryl lease Darryl lease is joining us particularly to provide some of his ideas and input From a direct marketing of our swine industry Of course, my name is dr. Travis Hoffman and serve as your extension sheep specialist for NDSU And the University of Minnesota And in fact, we've also They're on the video We've asked Adam and April mobby to to potentially give some ideas of what happens on their operation of garden dwellers Ranch as well And so first off, I guess when we think about this of getting livestock ready for for harvest is that I would like each of our panelists to provide just a little bit of input On on who you are what your story is before we kind of move into the deeper portions. And so Callie and CJ I'm going to open with you. What's your story? Hey, you guys, thanks for having us on here tonight So our story, right? How much do we share? We're actually on my home place This is where I originally grew up and stuff and we've been on this place for this is our family 75 years now We've always been a cow calf operation and and did more farming even when I was younger But I think uh relating to this really kicked off. What's it been two years since COVID hit and um Kids got kicked out of school like everybody else is And I remember I was homeschooling things were getting crossed off on my calendar all the work that I was doing And uh CJ one night said to me that I think we should start selling beef And I kind of just laughed at him and I didn't even respond which was probably not nice But I realized then that he was serious And that's really kind of where it started prior to that I mean we'd sell an animal or here two or there but we knew that if we were going to really ramp up and I mean, that's the time that fats were getting backed up. There was no meat on the shelves Feedlots were getting backed up packers weren't buying, you know, it was just like the perfect storm and um And so within a week or two, I mean we had all our paperwork submitted and stuff And so that's kind of how we got rolling into this and um have been sprinkling it in with everything else we do Here we we do have a cow calf operation still a background in feedlot Cell beef run some yearlings. I mean we really kind of pivot with the industry is kind of how it works at our place And um, so we'll we'll share more after a bit then Lisa would you provide a little bit of a background and what it's your story lisa? My story so um, lisa peterson an extension livestock specialist at central grasslands research extension center near streeter most of the state's beef quality specialist and You know, I joined india issue 23 years ago In that role of being a beef quality assurance person Grew up on a very diversified livestock operation in southwest colorado My granddad was one of the first cattle feeders in colorado. In fact, he sold the first load of fat cattle Through the Denver stockyards and the last load And so I've had kind of a long history in the beef industry But I really liked the meats business and you know on the local side during covet I would get a lot of calls about people buying local meat. It just wasn't very good And what could I do about it? And you know, it really brought to my attention that we needed to maybe go back and help producers remember how to Or learn. Maybe they never knew How to produce finished cattle In particular and we had done that training 20 some years ago at india issue and maybe We actually need to bring that back. I think that's something for us to think about doing so That's a little bit of my background. I'm very passionate about this business and you know This local stuff's pretty exciting to me. And so that's who I am and we ranch in south dakota So I have a dakota's mixed marriage and live in north dakota during the week So my husband kind of tolerates me on the weekend. So Thank you, Lisa. Mr. Darrell lease What's your story? Oh boy, what's my story on travis? Well, I grew up on A crop and livestock a very diversified farm We had we grew small grains sunflowers A little bit of corn back when it wasn't popular to grow corn up in our area But we had a lot of hogs my whole life a lot of beef cattle and a lot of sheep currently right now We still have the family farm that I grew up on My oldest daughter Her husband and my granddaughter just moved back and actually live at the farm now And we continue a diversified livestock farm slash ranch For a lot of years going back probably 10 15 years. I've had a desire to Be in the retail slash wholesale meat business I always wanted to do a self integration vertical integration, I guess and so About two years ago We had the opportunity to buy a little slaughter plant along with five of the producers And started to really expand that we did some for several years prior to that on a pretty small scale And right now we are just trying to manage our growth because Some things have become a little bit overwhelming Uh on as the growth side of things and managing that has probably become the biggest challenge for us and Right now our main focus is still the hogs But uh our beef and lamb production is also gaining Actually considerable ground on our on our hog production Thank you Daryl and in fact Adam and april would you guys uh give a a little bit of an update and of course When daryl talked about farm and ranch at least we You got to make the designation because you go and and sell yours Based on garden dwellers ranch go ahead adam and april if you want to unmute and tell a little bit about your story Yeah, so My parents had a culinary herb farm for about 20 years In 2019 I kind of branched out and wanted to get into the meat aspect of things They'd been raising sheep for about three years prior Kind of building my flock building up everything Genetics wise and meat wise kept sampling my own So in 2019, I started selling officially under garden dwellers ranch and was doing pasture raised sheep as well as pasture chickens On 2020 my wife april and I Married and we kind of just Compounded everything that we had individually Now that we're together So we doubled our market pretty much as far as sheep sales and The pastured chicken Been doing it since then and now we're actually combined with selling Herbs as well trying to sell a more complete package with the meat as well Thank you Okay, so our first formal question goes to uh to cj and cally And uh, I think when we talk about it and again you you raise Certainly some of your cattle, but some of those also get incorporated into your operation And so cj if you want to lead or cally of the description of what are the cattle that fit kind of your program And what are the visual evaluators so that you can look at? Okay, well We would have some of our own that we'd finish and the majority probably have been purchased Um, whether they're short loads from guys that have cattle finished that don't fit um with some contacts we have but I guess it would start with their you know finished weight and then frame size that if it can carry that way but Generally it's that brisket look how deep they are in the brisket and if they're finished It's it's definitely hard when you finish you're going to try to hit that target weight and that Date and slot that you have picked way out, but uh So it's a visual and you know almost be like the body condition score, but for a fat cattle not on the cow side, but um I don't know It's it's really hard to get those those weights and the butcher dates I guess where our end would be we have Uh, a guy that has a usd facility that has some high and lows and he we communicate with each other and And he can say hey, I probably would have some time for you guys in a couple weeks So then I Will start making some phone calls and feelers or some guys have some cattle locally Program would be obviously they're not they're not Anabiotic free like as a calf, you know if some guys have some all naturals they get kicked out. They're still good healthy cattle But they don't fit the all natural program. So I when people call us Just they're corn fed You know with roughage whether it be a corn roughage silage or or hay Um, you know people like, oh, are they all natural? No, I cannot tell you that they're all natural They'll definitely be if they had any antibiotic beyond that with for all withdrawal date by a long ways um In the hormones and stuff like that. I guess we We generally don't implant any of our steers, but it's not a deal breaker. I guess but even when we think of those I'd like to just kind of reiterate one of the things that that is we think about this from a local meat production And in fact, we'll talk about That more so in two weeks of some of our our retail meat and our inventory management But one of the things and and I know as I work with producers and several of us That are on here do and several of you are obviously those producers as well um But like you said in terms of weight and so when we think about it I I do recall even as uh in my previous world in beef quality assurance is that If I was ever Going to bet on one thing I would say that the hot carcass weight of beef cattle will go up every year You know, I would be like 18 out of 20 probably it feels like And so those carcass weights continue to increase and that part of that's from efficiencies of size, right? But I think that we need to keep things into consideration From a meat animal standpoint, hopefully on beef cattle We need at least four tenths of back fat and we'll allow Lisa to show us some pictures as well Maybe five tenths of back fat If we can get to six tenths That's okay Once we get past point eight On back fat Then we're probably getting a little wasteier than we prefer and at least we'll be able to show us some of those And there's some differences and some give and takes and some antagonistic traits, right? And so and we think about it from a beef cattle standpoint Is that when we increase that back fat thickness We also as they're looking at days on feed is that we're increasing the Percent of marbling which increases our quality grade Which increases our consumer satisfaction? And so there's uh one thing that's very very important there from a cattle standpoint and the cj Touched on putting that calendar and working with people and in fact, I believe that Truthfully that could be a theme of any one of our five Webinars is because if you don't have a processor that is willing to work with you You don't have a local branded beef program, right? And because you need to have some flexibility and you need to have some Availability to to get those animals in and it's tough, right cj of Identifying if we have ten head to get those into the process of planting whether the ones that currently weigh You know, even if they're long yearlings or something then i'm trying to figure out when they're going to weigh 1350 On whatever those weights are that that so work for you Lisa Do you have anything on that particular cj that you want to follow up or we're going to move to lisa if that's okay Oh follow up um No, I I've had call made a call and like we can get you in this and then I do the math and like Those cattle be way overdone. I cannot you know, then then you got to go back to the drawing board or you can't You can't buy those cattle if they're weighing 11 or something, you know, so you're You're targeting weights. It's some math and some guessing but Uh, I didn't really finish that out very well, but it's very hard to do That's okay. And the other thing is is like as you described that In terms of weights of saying hey, they're they're 11 Is that an advantage that we can have as we continue to pull our animals together is not only work on You know the visual evaluation of muscle and fat just like I showed in that initial graph but uh, but then also knowing of if you have access to A scale so that you can know what those weights are and in fact You can know if whether you decide to weigh them once every two weeks Or more or less so that you know that you know what my pen of steers are gaining 3.6 pounds And so in another month, then they are going to be 118 pounds heavier Okay from where they're at and so you have a little bit of an idea there from a scale The other thing that I would say here before we push into some of that live evaluation that Lisa's going to talk about is that breed composition And frame size and truthfully muscularity are all certainly things that you would want to keep into Consideration and as we think about it from cattle, there's differences on breed composition of when those are going to finish We know CJ and Callie the the the angus and the red angus, you know, even if they're more moderate in their frame Might finish it a little bit earlier than some that are either larger frame Or more european and continental such as our limousine or charlay or galvy cross cattle in comparison to meeting those end points We'll let daryl talk about Some of the the swine breeds, but in fact from the sheet breeds. We have the whole spectrum Okay And so that makes it even tougher as we think about just from breeds and frame size Lisa I want to give you the floor to describe some of the things that you would look at and evaluate From from beef cattle when you're making that decision of are these ready for market or are these not ready lisa So thanks travis i'm going to try to master technology here and we'll see if I can do this So i'm going to show you two pictures and the first one is going to be of What I would consider not to be slaughter ready cattle. Can you all see that or maybe do I need to turn my phone here? Oh, that's very good for me Okay, so it works for you. Thank you so What I have learned in my life Not only being married to a rancher but working with ranchers is that we tend to think of a bread heifer which is The picture of the the cattle on the bottom here is being fat cattle and the reason why is because on most ranches those are the fattest things we ever see right is a bread heifer and so what I kind of and I knew this and I don't know why I Probably didn't remember it or you know somehow stumbled over the fact that I did know this But one of the things that I recall during covid was That many of the cattle that were going to local slaughter were probably something Less in condition than a bread heifer and so therefore they weren't meeting What consumers would consider to be a good eating experience and Um, so I thought maybe we should show some pictures of really what fat cattle look like the the steer up here at the top He's what we would call is being pretty green. You know, he's a calf that would probably just be going into a feed yard Um, I do believe that during some of that covid stuff when there were no meat when there wasn't very much meat on the shelves There was probably some of those type of cattle that were going into slaughter and you know, I only ascertain that because when Consumers would send me pictures of the meat that they received back They were very small in terms of rib eye size very little fat And in fact, the color is what The the meat cut color was very light and that also indicated to me that they were pretty Young in age and so I'll try to Show another picture here. We'll see if I'm smart enough to do this I am pretty old so repression technology boundary So this is a photo of two fat cattle to what we would consider harvest ready cattle I think the top one there has about 4600 of an inch of back fat when I looked over his carcass data The one in the bottom I think is probably a little bit heavier But you can see the differences in their amount of cover Especially as CJ said down here in the brisket and carries that into the flank and when you get behind these Cattle that are harvest ready oftentimes. They're starting to lay fat over their tail head And then down into their twist And that's the area between their hind legs And you can see this calf down here in the bottom the steer down here in the bottom He's got some more condition. You can see that pretty plainly over his fore rib and down into his brisket He's looking pretty blocky And you know, I guess Travis if you want to go back and talk about, you know, those fat thicknesses I personally in Our current North Dakota setting would be more concerned about people not getting Cattle fat enough than getting them too fat. That would be my my concern. So That's a little bit of what I have. I hope I described them well. Is that what you're kind of thinking here, Travis It's very good. Lisa if you want to just, you know, even leave that up as we look at those Uh descriptors, I thought you did a great job that top steer here on our our market ready ones You know, like you said, it's that one's pretty big and and full and it's brisket and and we don't even see the one that's lower on your subset of calves We don't even see the rest of its body But as you can see through it's just its neck and its shoulder and its fore rib And in fact when you see that one kind of turn it's uh, it's head to the right They're in the in the fore rib, Lisa. Uh, those folds are not its ribs. Are they, Lisa? Uh, those folds are Yeah, those those are When I turn my body like that, I get those same ripples of fat There you go. So so that's where you know, they'll fill that up there in that fore rib and that Center part of his body and and when I think about it and again We want to make this not particularly species specific But uh, when I describe either of those in probably less on beef animals is they're so big but even when we think about it from a pork Uh, a pork carcass or even a lamb or a goat is that I like to describe Uh, they're those that are trimmer are going to have a more shapely carcass. And so there's indentations Uh, they're behind that shoulder and in the fore rib And so when we think about just for me in terms of the lamb carcass is that there's shape And so it's more like the coke bottle and the different uh, where you can see the muscle that fills in With fat and so that will fill in with fat And what we can determine is more of a boat like shape and so meaning that it's widest in the middle And uh narrower on both ends and all of those animals would kind of do that as well and kind of fill in in the middle portion and so We have some I think it's a little bit important to remind people that Um, you know, I I think people who go into this direct marketing stuff is a rule not always but is a rule They go into it thinking that The consumer wants to buy a niche product which Maybe at the end of the day they do But the first and foremost thing the consumer wants to pay for is something that tastes good And is tender and is something pretty similar to what they're used to buying in a grocery store And I know that that's probably not what most direct marketers want to be But you will also have to remember that this is what people are used to eating and so they want something pretty similar and you know, I I get to work with some folks in the grass fed world and um almost always The people who think that they want to have grass fed and i'm not picking on the grass fed world But they have this vision that they can have a steer like one of these two that typically Is going to be grass fed and the reality is that those typically are not one in the same And I find it interesting that the people that I help in the world of grass fed they usually start in the ground beef market and That's kind of their niche in that grass fed Market until they move on and so the take home message I guess I would say is Is that except for in sheep and goat maybe Fat tastes good and people like to taste of fat in cattle and in hogs And so especially in cattle here in the north. I wouldn't be too concerned about getting them too fat now That may come back to haunt me travis, but um, I that's just my perception You're you're perfectly fine. And in fact, there's plenty of under finished ones And you know, we all have a neighbor that uh, even whether that was a heifer that didn't breed and they said, okay Well, she's gonna go to town And the difference is and that's fine or even if it's a steer that you know what? Corn is expensive and oats and their concentrates are expensive And so when we're evaluating it at eight dollar and plus bushel corn is that you have to Make that decision intentionally make that decision That you're going to feed those animals just a little bit longer. And so that makes it a little bit tougher We do have Yeah, and we and I totally agree that there you can be on both sides of that platform of of where that logistics is on growth of bone and muscle and fat But we're aiming for that target and in fact again We we want to make sure that we can look at what we can do from a grain finished diets But also adam and april before we move to our swan I'd like to just get your a little bit guys's idea because uh, you do provide a grass finished product And so those are a little bit different because certainly as a smaller room in it with the the sheet We don't have to take them to 1300 pounds right adam So, uh, at least we have some option there But I want you to just provide a little bit of your ideas is when when is your animal? You know potentially ready to go to to slaughter and we'll shift it back and and lisa you can Quit with your screen sharing and allow adam and april to to have a little bit of the floor here. Thanks Yeah, kind of to back up a little bit and talk about that the breed and frame size um I've got I started from we started from a very small flock three Cotaden So hair sheep we picked them because the fat flavor is not as pungent as a wool breed So we were going for the the market of trying to get more people introduced to it on on a less Pungent or or a little more tolerable a little more palatable meat source and even within the three that I started with Um, you can have variations. I've got one strain one Line that is much more fatty finished on grass than Another one, but they all came from the same original flock So that's something we've kind of learned from being a little smaller and trying to to sample Each one directly is learning that even within the same breed standards. There are variations there to kind of pay attention to And with pasture how we raise them on the pasture It may seem like a little bit more work into finding the right mix of grasses and forages Um and green material to get a good marbling still on them and get them done in an appropriate amount of time A lot of research has been done to show that finishing on grass versus a grainer grain diet Takes a little longer and you may not see all the fat content out of there But kind of like I had mentioned it depends on how the breed and how you're selecting with your animals Also knowing your market. I kind of want to bring that up With sheep and goats. There's a lot more of an ethnic market out there beef chicken general public kind of Eat that up in their daily weekly diets Where with the sheep and goats we really kind of had to branch out a little bit to To fulfill all the orders of of lambs that we had But then we found that the ethnic market markets wanted Longer finish. I had some people that wanted a two year old weather They they were hoping for an animal of a certain standard that they were used to that I Was not Understanding at all it kind of took me a little while to grasp on but once I was able to raise that animal to the standards that they liked I had constant buyers then off of that Super well, thank you very much. And in fact, like you described, you know, you can put together finishing strategies That that help and work for you. And so, you know, like you said And some people even as we think about it from an ethnic market and think of sheep and goats They're just in generalities is that some people prefer weathers and some use and some intact males and some young and some old and so Absolutely, particularly more as you know your consumer And we'll talk about those in later webinars But again, thanks for thanks for sharing there. And the other thing is is that as we describe it from flavor profile And Lisa did all right and their beef and that's why we do National beef quality audits that that Lisa and I have been a part of for for a long long time Like 20 years now. Okay. And so and in fact in when we did it on the lamb quality audit Is that the reason that people consume lamb is because of flavor? And adam and april the reason that people don't consume lamb is because of flavor, right? And so knowing what your demographics are and if they get too big of a You know a stronger flavor and in fact from a research standpoint, we're not going to cover it today But we have the research capability to sort lamb flavor and goat flavor Just like we would coffee of mild medium and bold and so the information is there The difference is is that we don't have particular valuations Who's going to say one is more correct or deserves a different value? And so like you said and I appreciate there it's it's knowing your consumer knowing the the customers that you have To be able to to provide that ideas Okay, so again cj and calli get to tell their story on on some of their beef cattle All right, lisa gave us some examples of when those are ready adam and april gave us an alternative approach on You know some of the things that go into their decisions. And so i've i've done the best i can But we can unmute daryl lisa's mic sees and so the advantage is i said that people enjoy flavor and and enjoy taste and so you got the bonus Because we're first off going to allow you to talk about pork, you know ingredient meat of choice. All right It's always pork and beans or sausage and eggs I mean you might not make center the plate like lamb, but at least you're the ingredient meat of choice daryl What are the decisions on on the swine production to to get them ready for harvest first off? Well first off, I got to say bacon makes everything better. So I mean there's Right, I mean if you want to make anything else better you put bacon in it And if you want a real salad you have a majority bacon with a piece of lettuce. So There is that out there. Um, so you know, it's it's been interesting. I grew up raising hogs That was my focus all the way through high school. That was my ffa project in high school and you know developing That eating quality experience has been been my focus across all the species that we do Number one the number one thing I hear is tenderness If it's tender They will make allowances for a lot of other things lacking And so that that one comes to mind and and that that one gets to be tough sometimes in hogs Um, it it's very spree breed specific Um, you know, we raise show pigs as a major part of our enterprise on our hogs And believe it or not, there's people that say well, you don't want to eat one of them show pigs, but a show pig fed right Uh, can be very palatable. In fact, I have people that will not buy from me if it is not one of my show line genetics Vice versa. I have people that won't buy from me if it isn't one of my Berkshire meat line genetics um, the Berkshire I tell people and compare it. It's kind of the Angus in the pig world You know, you'll you'll get more marbling in in a Berkshire The thing that we run into, uh The most is Is balancing that across the whole carcass on a hog You want you want that fat cover to make that pork chop tender and juicy However, too much fat cover gives you bacon that is mostly fat with no meat and There's not a lot of the old school You know the older generation out there that that's what they grew up with The generations that we're selling to grew up with a very lean product So there was a lot of meat in that bacon And so we do a lot of crossbreeding with our Berkshires to meet that demand But it gets back to what the mobbies said there. You have to know your customer We have customers on all ends of the spectrum Uh, not just in the hogs, but the other species too. You have them on all ends of the spectrum So you have to know your customer and get to learn your customer And then you finish those animals for those customers now That's that's when we're selling halves or holds We do a lot of package sales You know by the package That becomes a little more difficult because obviously You're taking a group You're slaughtering them you're processing them And you're combining packaging So you'll end up with some variation. So to eliminate that variation Is to try and keep as tight of a Genetic line as you can at least on your sire side is what we do We have quite a bit of variation on our south side, but we try and You know tighten that up with our sire side and keep our sire population very tight genetic wise It works for the most part But you know, there's always things that don't click, but that's probably our biggest challenge um Is just when you go to the per package sales or by the package sales Is to keep that quality consistency. It's easy for me if John orders a pig and I know john likes, you know a leaner pig That's easy for me to supply him with that or if Susan orders one and Susan likes a fatter pig That's easy for me to pick that specifically But when I'm taking a group in that might have some of those variations throughout them Then I have to start picking and choosing what pig I do what products out of Um, of course, I do bacon out of every pig because you cannot make enough bacon for the market out there If I could breed a pig that's 90% bacon You know what I would retire and just sell the technology because Bacon right now is the number one seller when it comes to uh any any kind of product and it's expensive Yeah, it is expensive Darrell I have a question for you. So if you look at a litter of pigs, you know six eight pigs out of a litter how Similar in time will they finish at weight and how similar will their cuts be if you know, some people are looking at this Um looking at the hog opportunities that are available and they take a litter of pigs What can they expect expect at the end of the day? I mean, they're all full sips, but genetically they're not full sips, right? Right, there's uh, there can be quite a bit of genetic variation, especially when you start talking more of the heritage breeds like the barks hires um the spots the herford's Uh, you get a little more variation in that because they haven't been The streamlined breeding for the the larger commercial Facilities that the york the dirac and the hamshire have been And so your your consistency for growth curve and finishing capabilities will be A little bit buried within the litter even more so than Some of those real tight genetic lines Which is which brings me back to the reason we try and keep at least the sire side as tight as we can and Keep as little variation on the sire side of the genetics That way that can increase our consistency From one litter to the next just because of the sires um But you still have that variation with your sows that creates A little bit of a challenge on putting a consistent Uh package out, you know, we're small scale and most local Producers that are selling local are small scale so to put 15 pork chops in a package that someone might want And make them all look like like they can in the grocery store that's picking from thousands of head That went through the processing facility that they it gets tougher to do But I think if the eating experience is there That consumer is willing like I said that consumer is willing to forgive that One pork chop is bigger than the other one or you know Has a little different look than the other one as long as that tenderness and that eating experience is there We've been able to overcome that So do you think For example in your berk lines of pigs Is there a two week difference and when they're From one to the other earliest to last Market ready a month. What do you think to help some folks out and think about this? Um, you'll you'll have about a two to three week variation um from your top end performers in your litter to your Uh bottom end performers in your litter Your top end performers will generally be a little fatter They just tend quicker. They tend to be more efficient Uh a little bit more cover. They'll have a little bit more genetic makeup of having a little more fat content Generally will finish quicker than ones that are just a little bit leaner Okay Thank you We've requested some if you have some questions That you would like answered. In fact, we have some that were submitted earlier But I know that we've got a talented group of attendees That that would be willing to ask some questions But one of the things here and in fact, I'll probably point this one just a little bit at you lisa Back as it said What is what is your thoughts in terms of age? Of beef animals and so we we already talked about probably Making sure that we get enough finish and not too much in terms of fat But there's differences in terms of age. Do you have any thoughts and I can provide some as well? But go ahead lisa go ahead Well, you know, we would typically Say that a calf should probably be somewhere in the 14 months of age um, you know on a commercial feed yard Where they're being fed pretty hard and those would be calf feds Uh to go to slaughter. So, you know, as a rural Travis, I think I would say 14 to 16 months here um You know in a smaller operation Um on the bottom side and you know, I'll be really honest with you I think probably some of our better beef comes out of what I would call a heifer at some of these Heifers that we targeted to be a bred heifer, but she didn't get pregnant And so we send her on to the feed yard. It seems that with that little bit of maturity Um, they really lay on some fat mice and they marvel really nice and You know, if I personally were looking to maybe start into the local type market That's a place that I might start now. I'll back that up If you are into an usda inspected sometimes they'll throw the red flag because they'll Mature out to look like they're old animals and not young But is a rule that hasn't been a huge issue But I think that they provide a nice opportunity and then you balance that out Travis, you know, based upon Um, CJ said kind of the the type and frame So, you know, we look at if you're wanting to do this on a pretty regular basis You're going to probably need to figure out how to get some cattle into the market in the fall And you know, that's the challenge in our beef industry today on a the national scale is that we have out I don't know 75 80 of our cow herd in the spring in this country And so we're always looking for a balanced um fat cattle supply and if I imagine that's a challenge for CJ And uh Cali to be honest with you is balancing out their fat cattle supply for a year round harvest And so, you know, you're maybe going to have to look at some of that yearling market and You know kind of spread them out and so of course you're going to get into a little older cattle, but Uh, historically speaking those cattle tend to marvel a little better um, so Um, I guess the short story of your question, which I made really long is you know on the bottom side I would say somewhere around in that 16 month range To probably you know two years or so on the top end maybe a little less 18 months Somewhere in that realm Thank you, Lisa. And in fact, uh, what what I think is also important particularly on beef cattle. I know a lot of our Cache receipts and just in generalities a lot of the decisions that we make are still beef cattle centric Um, but one of the things that we don't want to go over is 30 months of age Lisa. Um, and so Those that are over 30 months of age Are considered old when they are at that harvest facility And if you are at a Well at an inspected if it's custom exempt then Then you are you own that animal as it comes in and you own that beef when it comes out and it says not for sale And we mean that uh, if it's a state inspected plant Then it can be sold within the state and if it's usda inspected, of course You can sell across the borders with those inspection Is that if it's over 30 months based on dentition or on bone Is that a lot of times is that you're not going to want to Even market bone and t-bones and so so they would do boneless strips and tatterlings But truthfully changes your whole retail inventory, uh, which is in two weeks For our main presentation that we'll talk to you about cj and cow you heard it Hold on my Travis. I think that there is one place That maybe we can target in some older cattle And that place is in the ground beef market and You know, I I a little bit hesitate to say that because we're generally going to need some trim some fat trim To go in with those cattle. They're typically far too lean to be Um processed back out and in fact the folks who have tried to Um work with the school lunch program here in the state have learned that kind of the hard way that You know this ultra lean product doesn't always sell very well and so um One place that if you can set up your niche to be a ground beef provider and make that work I think that's great. I work with a uh producer in florida. That's all he does is he sells ground beef and You know, he has figured out that niche and his clientele and I think it's a pretty cool deal that they do that And so that might be a niche for somebody But if you are going to sell whole muscle cuts and especially if you're going to sell steaks They need to be out of young animals to offer the best eating experience whether that's grass fed or whatever else You know grass fed grain finished. It does not matter They're going to need to be out of young animals. So sorry Travis. I just wanted to add in that Little piece. Thank you. Thank you, Lisa and uh that trim that lean trim provides is an option in fact if it wasn't for older cows and or bulls We wouldn't have a trim enough product to make 93 lean ground beef But I'm going to segue there and see jane callie if you're paying attention and I know you were You heard the question So you've had a little bit of time to to think through it and so truthfully In one word, uh lisa's question was seasonality All right, and so we know and in fact on our sheep producers I know that we've got some and they say, you know, our product is available from july to october And if you want to contact me in february, I apologize And there's plenty of options to do out of season breeding in our small remnants of sheep and goats And of course the the swine can spread it out a lot more but the the cattle That's something you have to keep in consideration. What's the thoughts that go into your ideas and decision-making see jane callie based on seasonality Uh seasonality my answer for that is Ours is a walk-in freezer. I guess So to control that flow Um The other thing was like I talked to some nds you guys and like I don't think we should be finishing cattle in north dakota in february either Efficiently without maybe a monoswalt barn It's they put weight on but versus fall that november december weight gain and the weight gain we get right now is There's no difference. I mean february There's a day they eat and barely drink water when it's 20 below. I mean they eat good. I shouldn't say that But the intakes are down on water and so you know the gain isn't there either so If you can control Your sales through your freezer So then you can book some butcher dates in control or else a waiting list if you only sell a certain time of year but Um, I don't have the answer for feeding them. You know, I I think the most efficient time is spring and fall in the summer and winter can be hard to finish cattle but Well, at least I challenged you in the correct answer With that one cj is I also knew it was a question and so I built my own answer, right? Uh, and it was the walk-in freezer. So that's perfectly fine when you discuss it and in fact, it's probably Even more correct one of the things, you know, as I describe it and you know All of our proteins and I think of it at the grocery store is that People want to know that they have a fresh product there, right? Um, but when we decide that we want to provide a local food product um and a local meat is that there can be some acceptability is that When we tell that story like adam and april what is that? You know, if you want a lamb then these are the times and particularly Right adam and april on the chickens that we'll talk about in in five weeks or on the last week There is that those aren't available all the time, right? And as we think about that, um, just in terms of inventory inventory We've done some work at at ndsu in fact on on some of our lamb and for the most part, uh, you know, there's there's negligible differences, right? so And when you can do that and have an impact certainly when we know Of how that growth curve is changing see jay and callie that we don't want them to to not get enough fat And we don't want them to be too fat And so knowing that we can just get them harvested at the appropriate time Allows us that flexibility Okay, and so again, that's at least an option daryl. We have uh, again, we're aiming for that market pig But do you ever uh from even uh from a coal sows standpoint? Is that something that you keep into consideration or do you pass those onto the commercial system? No, we are we are using our coal sows now also. Um, the only thing we don't use As of yet, we're experimenting is our coal bores. Um And where we're experimenting is to make a pepperoni product that You know people can buy and easily use and Let's face it if you eat pepperoni pizza, that's what you're eating you're eating Uh coal bores and and maybe some sows mixed in there because of the demand for it, but That's predominantly where the coal bores go, but we do use our coal sows. We put them on feed Um, we try and get a finish on them We don't just take them off of just weaning a litter Uh, we make sure that they go on feed they go on the same feed regiment that we would put our uh Normal age barrows or gills that we're finishing out for for market And We don't use the cuts we use them in sausage products um Very very good quality for sausage products And and it's a way for us to use and not have to go to the sale barn with virtually anything from here and it's uh You know, it's now there's certain instances where we wouldn't um I got a little bit higher standards and a lot of people when it comes to their butcher animals maybe that some people You know, you hear the story of uh people You know butchering just basically anything that was limping around the yard instead of the premium one while I like to eat the premium one. So I like to provide the premium ones for my customers also and You know, but there's there's premium Abilities from some of these cull type animals. It's just you use them in different ways Um, we don't sell pork chops out of them Unless it's a smoked pork chop. We'll do it. We'll do a smoked pork chop special once in a while If it's a younger cell, um, maybe first litter things didn't work out So we're gonna color We put her on feed and we'll we'll do smoked pork chops out of her which Very good quality Um tender yet. We can get them again No, uh, no taint no coarseness in the meat of what an older cell would have of for coarseness. So There's there's times we can And and upsell that carcass, but there's times that we just focus and use that And and use that across our other species too We'll make lamb brats and sausages. We'll use our colesaus as the pork base for that sometimes You know, we'll make mixed beef sticks We'll use some pork and beef mixed together to make some mixed beef sticks. We'll use some of that there Um, so I think there's there's opportunity there To look across the whole board But again, you you have to have the market for that you have to have people that are Wanting to buy those products readily Because now you're getting away from the ability to sell a half or a whole When you start using those cull animals, you're pretty much pushing them one direction for specialty products And that's that that becomes a challenge to build that whole another market above and beyond the retail cut market Absolutely. Thank you Daryl um and again, I'd like to uh Let you guys know if you kindly would of putting in either your question in the chat box or in fact um, we with our our setting that we have we can You can push unmute or we can allow you to if you want to ask that question Verbally to any of our panelists But feel free to to provide those and hopefully our our colleagues and panelists is to provide some thought so that you can Identify some inspiring questions adam and in april there when when we talk about uh Seasonality in fact a question i'm going to lead that in with as well that you kind of at or at least touched on uh, is that I received a Question in there in relation to age on sheep and so we talked about it more so we we challenged Daryl with The age on the slide and and truthfully allows you to repurpose them Um, and then also on the beef cattle we address that of at least getting them You know up to 14 to 18 months, but truthfully not over 30 at the very standpoint again from a flavor profile Um, we have an advantage in both sheep and goats and and Daryl is absolutely correct from a consumer standpoint That tenderness is the first thing and one of the descriptions that just to To echo what Daryl said is that if you ever go to the Gersh store even out of your own and you get an eye of round steak All right, so cj and cal you know what the eye of round looks like at least it can be visually Confused with the tenderloin, which would be absolutely wrong All right, and so if you decide that you're going to make an eye of round steak It doesn't matter how great the beef flavor was okay because it's going to be tough And it's going to provide a challenge in terms of your eating experience and so That the tenderness is important when we think about it again My question was actually posed to me as is age of lambs and we did some research Just in comparison of age and in fact age is one of those contributors and one of the reasons that Age becomes a factor from a meat science approach is that there's Greater cross-linking of muscle fibers and there's increases in collagen Which is way too much of a meat sciences approach to say older animals get tougher All right, and so that's going to happen across the board the difference is is that There is also from a flavor profile standpoint most commonly in an intensity of flavor And particularly as daryl said on sows the answer is yes and on boars. It's absolutely On cows and bulls not maybe as much But then in sheep and goats Adam and april we can know that the older those get the more stronger the flavor is and so Adam and april they're just in terms of the the age of Again sheep and goats But primarily the reason that you want those older ones or the consumer does is because that's what they're expecting Would that be an appropriate answer adam when we describe when is that animal ready for harvest? yeah, um, so in Sheep industry anything over a year all of a sudden gets classified as mutton normally and and years ago mutton carried with it a very strong flavor profile and an idea that mutton was going to be very tough had to be slow cooked And would be very strong in the household spelling it and in the flavor so we try To keep it under that 12 months, but really tickling that 11 months finishing age just to still be For the consumer's knowledge as a lamb but as Full of a meat product as possible chops are In the picture, I believe Travis you had at the very beginning that looked like a lamb to me They were very small two bites and you're done with the chop and On that note as well finding the processors that Are us when we do select cuts and package cuts Making sure that the the chops are all uniform and the same Because sometimes we can have a blade chop Be in line with a regular chop lamb chop But the appearance of it when the customer opens it up It's a little more butterfly laid out got a little extra fat here and there in it And that may be off-putting to them So making sure that you have that uniform Cut and size when you when you are doing that direct consumer and select cuts Is a bigger issue We do like I mentioned, we do have some customers that specifically asked for a larger frame Longer older animal They they weren't afraid of The flavor profile as much had been experienced more mutton flavors and everything and We're looking for that product So Trying to to balance do I I hold it over for another year? Am I feeding it and am I finishing it on grass in the spring? When when am I going to lamb to have that 11 month old ready to go to butcher product? And at what time will it be going in cj touched on it walk in freezer or freezers When I started in 2019 I must have had a dozen producers tell me invest in freezers in freezer space Just to be able to have that right product ready to go When the customer wants it Travis you had mentioned some producers only have lamb from june to october And that's fine But if you're looking to spread it out throughout a year and rather than rush it in Knowing you've got the space to hold it the good quality product and it's all uniform I'm standing. Thank you for that That information. Well, we had a question come in as well And I think this one's a great one to touch on Again, we could talk about this at later webinars if we wish but the question comes in on usda quality grading And in fact, uh, you know, truthfully it's it's usda yield grading as well and says can someone sell their beef? Um as as choice For example, and so big picture right now And I'm going to dig through at least all four of our species there And I'm going to start with pork is that truthfully pork is not quality graded. All right, and so daryl What uh, and this is this is going to the back end But if I'm going to purchase a pork chop and I have a choice between them I'm always picking since I know that there's some meat scientists on here as well I'm always picking the darkest colored one That also has some marbling with it because that darker color provides an increase in water holding capacity and so hopefully it's juicier as well But that's that's what I use is quality grading system when we think about it from goats Most of the goat separation from a meat science standpoint is lean to bone There's not much difference in terms of eating satisfaction. And so it's which ones have more muscle From a lamb standpoint Most lamb carcasses are either prime and choice of which case 93 to 95 percent of those are choice And there's not a value differentiation and there's very little difference in eating satisfaction So that brought me back to the um the long way around to talk about beef cattle yield and quality grading and yield grading Is simply the amount of retail cuts and so it's cutability of lean to fat ratio the amount of Meat that we're going to have on that plate in relation to the amount of fat and or bone Let's dig into back to quality grading. And so the top of that quality grading of usda is prime Okay, and so of there. There's low average and high prime Below that there is a choice and there is high choice average choice and low choice To give you an evaluation is that the average choice and high choice would be ones that in generalities Are what it requires to be certified angus beef If you see just the choice most commonly it would be the low choice and then below that is usda select So there's high select and low select and truthfully below the select It's not going to get a label. Okay, it's going to be standard or utility or coal. Okay, and so Or utility or commercial, excuse me But those are going to be in the in the retail store choice You know upper two-thirds choice or prime That was a long way to say is that an option for The the packing plans usda inspection and this is an important segregation usda inspection or state inspection Is something that you can have which is different like we said than custom exempt. Okay, and so those are provided by the state or by the usda in order to have usda quality and yield grading Is that that processing plant has to pay for those services? Okay, and so Like I guess a closer in terms of a commercial plant is that there's of course a beef cattle plant in Aberdeen, south dakota That harvests enough that That they have they pay for the usda graders to be there most commonly Uh in north dakota, uh, we wouldn't want to pay or don't pay the usda for a yield or quality grade designation Because we don't really use it as marketing uh in my standpoint what I would suggest Uh from for those individuals that want to have that as a designation Is that you can purchase marbling cards, okay? And so there are usda marbling cards that are available from the american meat science association Um that and they can find those and then you can have those visual images on the card And you can put it next to it and say well this one would have been If it was a young animal select or choice or high choice Um and and we can have that as an option The other thing is is that even when we think about it from marbling Is that now and I tonight's not the night to dig out at a hundred percent But there's more people that are Using wagyu semen, okay, or aqa ushi semen and getting highest end. All right and cj and cally We thought we were raising the highest ones. Well, there's some people That are that are even living on the edge now when you do that You go most commonly from a quality graded standpoint higher than some of our usda prime designations But a lot of the times and in fact, I saw a bunch of those cattle this winter Those don't make it to harvest it until 24 26 28 months 30 months of age And so there's a huge loss in terms of efficiencies of our product to get to that standpoint So I am unaware of any particular plants In the state of North Dakota that utilizes usda yield and quality grading for cattle Unless mr. Lease tells me any different daryl. Are you aware of anybody that uses usda yield and quality grading for cattle? so there is not A quality now there's there's a couple people that are qualified in the state to do it But there is no one On a plant side of things Or a marketer such as we are That are like you said willing to pay for it at this point um it's Those things become not cheap to do uh I don't know that they're necessary to do When you're talking a local product when you're talking a You're making a one-to-one contact with a restaurant um Or whatever it might be They're gonna test your product They're gonna like it or they're not gonna like it Um And and they're gonna say yes that meets our standards And and again i'll stress again the number one thing that they look at That we have in this situation When I take a product in for a new restaurant or steakhouse to try Is is it tender? And if it passes the tenderness They Will generally make a deal if you can come to terms on price Based on that tenderness. They don't really care if it's a prime. They don't really care if it's a choice Quite honestly, they don't care if it's a select if you can meet the tenderness part of it Because 99 of those places The consumer doesn't see it till it's cooked That's right and therefore It you only have to appeal To the one in charge of buying Or the chef that's in charge of cooking whatever it may be And and so to go through that expense We've talked about it in our plant. I've talked about it with our manager He goes, yeah, we can do it But do you want the added expense and then you have you have added Labeling responsibilities then too I might add Everything that you put on your label now you become liable for And so you want to keep your label as clean as you possibly can To reduce your responsibilities for your label at the same time Absolutely, and it's consistency of our products, right? And so Darrell touched on on tenderness and and as a meat scientist there Darrell you only forgot Choose unison flavor. So it's a you know a three-pronged crown, but that's okay Again, I echo that the tenderness is first CJ and Callie, what are your thoughts on that? That's just one question here or one statement and I think this plays back a little bit to the covid times, but I still see it coming Somebody'll advertise on facebook that they are selling This product or this product out of this animal and they have a picture of a beautiful usda prime steak and I can't help but oftentimes think that that is false advertising And so I think that that's how people get Duped into these bad eating experiences You know is that they think they're getting this but they really get this And I'm not saying that marbling is the end all be all But in the beef industry Um marbling forgives a lot of other sins. It's a great halo effect Um attribute because it provides some juiciness and it provides flavor and Halos into that tenderness thing and so I would really encourage those who are getting started in this to think about that advertising You don't want to be that person that said oh, we are going to get this beautiful well marbled steak And we ended up with this thing that looks like an eye around out of an old bull, right? I mean You don't want to be that guy and so sorry. I didn't mean to interrupt you but I think there's some of this um Quality grade discussion merits a little bit of that as well Sure and truth in terms of uh retail labeling and as daryl said consistency of our product and and cj Again, this isn't everything that we're going to accomplish in terms of labeling but go ahead cj and cali I think yeah, you would price your your profit out of your product if you had to hire An individual inspector to come up and label unless you were getting a very good premium super specific but I guess I could round this about like when you're finishing and feeding cattle We were looking at I mean the first year we did 120 and we were averaging a good 40 something the last two years And you're looking at these bigger cattle and they're coming in overdone, especially during covet and then And nobody had one complaint. They love the meat probably buying a little extra fat, but they like the marbling Um sent a steer pretty similar to the county fair my daughter showed a steer and uh We we won the rate again pretty proud of that one But when we went to the steer married in the carcass data We got dinged for you know some back fat which lower Our yield grade, you know, so then on the cab certified angus beef. You lost 20 bucks 100 and this and that so um, it was kind of a fine line of of You thought you were doing a good thing customers liked it, but in this certain parameter you didn't fit and you lost money, but The guy that we get our cattle killed through they send weigu and Yeah, they're fed for 300 days plus hard And I asked him like is that very efficient, you know, I thought they were a carcass that Marbled faster not just it takes longer and they marble huge amounts, but And he said, I don't know I'm making money, but I don't know what the farmers, you know They buy them On Nebraska and then kill them up here But they have to debone them because they're pushing that 30 months age before they send them overseas So Absolutely and just on that. I mean I I got to to judge the waggles at the at the national wester stature this past year And so those that the that were there were 26 months of age And they said well, they got a little bit of time, but I also said CJ's that I said I probably can't afford to purchase your steer cannot And they said that their steer once it makes it to the retail case was worth about 13,000 So somebody's making some money But you know, they're they're way past the prime standpoint and like you said CJ to summarize that question quickly Is that the USDA quality grade takes some to do it and it's not something that we particularly do within our operation Or our our programs here in North Dakota And so one of the things that I would say then and in fact, uh, you know I can can echo kind of what what adam and april said in terms of just uh, the local That's importance as well But adam do you have anything that you'd like to add to the discussion and then we're going to wrap up today's session It's really as far as I've seen with the sheep maintaining the quality cuts In a consistent year after year of basis making sure I'm finishing Same way or similar or or better I always sample from the animal pound of ground in a cut just to do my own personal inspection I haven't been privy to being in the processors facility yet to see them but Making sure you're maintaining Your quality I guess along the lines Great great. Thank you and uh, I appreciate i'm gonna Lisa of peterson of joining us through ndsu extension adam and april mobby garden dwellers ranch and and daryl lisa of talking about First off his swine operation and and his expertise that he has In the supply chain in our meat industry and and cj and callie thorn and talking about their meats Programs as well. And so I really really appreciate that. We do have another poll That i'm going to put up here and then hopefully i'm going to summarize Just a little bit of our Let's go ahead So while this pulls up would all the other speakers like to talk a little bit about where their operations are I don't know that anybody said that or maybe I they did and I missed it Um, we're in western north dakota lopford city north of dickinson an hour and a half Mainly cow calf operations out here. I would say Okay, thank you Darryl where's home base So we're at douglas, uh, we are 35 miles southwest of minot is where we're at And travis if I could add on the one thing lisa brought up there. She brought up the picture thing Do not use anyone else's picture unless you want to pay about a 10 to 20,000 or fine Because I know of some direct sales folks in this state that have been sued And have lost by using other people's pictures. So not only are you maybe misrepresenting what your product actually is You are violating someone else's Not necessarily a trademark on the picture But if you go to someone else's website and take it off that the website doesn't specifically say you are free to utilize You may get a phone call from their attorney going. Um, now you're gonna pay us So the just just though It goes into that whole label and truth and lie thing That you can get yourself in trouble in a hurry Well, we're going to talk about truth and labeling uh at a different standpoint and appreciate you daryl at least providing that guidance and Appreciate cj and callie again for for making meat for our consumers. And I know cj and callie they're Like you just said as we got past corona virus 19 You know, everybody had already loaded up on toilet paper and everybody had beef that they wanted to purchase from the store But not everybody had a freezer to put it in okay? And so that's a changed as well a little bit and just from a supply chain adam Thanks, and where's home base for you adam and april We're up in the bot no area. Um, so north or rugby east of mind out a little bit Good good. Thank you and I appreciate all of our panelists a couple things here as we just kind of pull this Portion together as again, we will be hosting these Each tuesday for the month of may and in fact our next one We will look more so at direct to farmers markets and to schools But I want to summarize a couple things that seem to be trends as well and first off That's eating satisfaction and when we do this uh in terms of local foods and providing that Eating satisfaction of tenderness juiciness and flavor is of utmost importance because that's what gets our consumers To come back the other thing is is that when we talked about getting livestock ready for harvest of which today's seminar or webinar was based on is that Consistency is extremely important. Okay, and if we're going to provide a consistent product That's going to allow us the chance to market that either directly to consumers through retail Are at a farmer's market or even working with a grocery chain Or to make that connection with our restaurant tours and food services. So consistency Is also extremely important and then identifying our target and whatever that target is Big picture of whether that target is weight driven Of what weights uh suit where we need to be as you saw on our initial graph That had bone muscle and fat whether that target is based on muscularity Or if it's based on finish and of course, uh, again, uh big picture there not just in generalities and and Daryl knows this but pork fat good. All right beef fat good lamb fat Not good. Okay goat fat probably not good as well. Okay, and so making those decisions is that trim muscular Lambs and goats is a little bit different than an end product on our beef cattle And importantly then a balance of bacon and lean retail yield. And so it's a big switch and transition from combining meat yield and quality But those are both of the decisions. So when it's about weight And then when it's about yield and when it's about quality All of those are decisions that have an impact on providing and getting our livestock Ready for harvest and so again, thank you to our panelists And thank you to those of us that joined This is a small part of north dakota state university extension And our small farms team of pulling the together a webinar on local meat production And our farm to market webinar series. So this is the first of five within our webinar series here in may of 2022 So thanks so much again for everyone joining us and have a glorious tuesday evening here And as we get to may north dakota, you know spring is either here right around the corner and Summer will be here and we can always wish for some green grass and just a little bit of sun to To dry out at least some of those corners, but looking for moisture as well So it's certainly a balance as it is in raising local foods. Thanks so much and enjoy your evening