 Alright, we're back still having discussions regarding the 23 elections. I think it was quite a very, very intense one with our previous guests. Maybe the elections would be intense. Yes, indeed the conversation was intense. But we're looking next at the reports and observations by observers. So, sorry for the repetition. What did the international local observer groups notice during the election? Of course, some of them have given some reports, we have a couple of them that we can look at. If you check out the news and all that's been happening today, we hear that international observers are blaming INEC for the challenges identified as far as elections are concerned. In fact, what I just saw dropping is that the coalition of international election observers has blamed INEC for the lack of transparency in the conduct of the 2023 presidential and national assembly elections. This is called the Joint Election Observation Mission Jail, involving the International Republican Institute, the National Democratic Institute. We have the NDI led by Joyce Banda, who's a former president of Malawi, is what they are saying. So, we're just going to leave that for now and move over to some of the identified challenges. They identified, they said they observed the late opening of polling locations, logistical failures, created tensions, and secrecy of the ballot was compromised in some polling units, giving it over-crowding. They also noted that at the close of polls, challenges with electronic transfer of results and their upload to a public portal in a timely manner undermine the citizen confidence at a crucial moment in the process. They also say, quote, moreover, inadequate communication and lack of transparency by the Independent National Electrical Commission about their cause and extent, that's probably the upload failures, created confusion and eroded voter's trust in the process. They said the combined effect of these problems disenfranchised Nigerian voters in many areas, although the scope and scale are currently unknown. So, it's a bit of a balanced one there. According to Sir Movo, Esquire is a legal practitioner. He's also the coordinator of the People's Advocates. This is a civil society organization. They fight for the rights of people globally. And he was an observer with the Transition Monitoring Group and a few other coalitions right there in River State, rather. Good morning to you, Barista. Thank you very much for your time. Good morning, Kofi. It's a pleasure to be here. All right. Can you just run us through the organizations that you observed the elections alongside? Okay. We worked in collaboration with Transition Monitoring Group, a community initiative for enhanced peace and development, partnership initiative in Niger Delta, fondly known as PIND, Noprim, which is a network for police reform in Nigeria. And of course, we also had that collaboration with the police situation room. The challenge we had was that seamless access to INEC. Let's quickly get your thoughts on this. You, as an observer, would you quickly bring us up to speed with what your observations were as regards these elections? Okay. Basically, we had high expectations for these elections. We expected to have a free and fair election. We expected an independent INEC. We expected, you know, things to go well. However, what we saw on the scene was, you know, quite different. It was quite different. The initial issue was late arrival of materials. That was the initial issue. And, you know, we started making, you know, phone calls to the electoral officers. And then the reports we got from the electoral officer in the Obiyapo Local Government Area, especially, was that the police officials that were supposed to escort the materials to the polling units were not available to do so. So that was the initial reports we got and we escalated it. And, of course, that caused overcrowding because, you know, there are some polling units where you have 6,000 persons, you know, waiting and you could understand the tension that caused. And some areas like Woji in Obiyapo Local Government Area, when they started voting as at about 5 p.m. and voted till about 2 a.m. in the morning, you could imagine what could have transpired and the lots of voters that would have been disenfranchised. And then there was the issue of uploading of the results. Initially, it was the declaration of the results. We noticed that some polling units after the voters had voted did results we were not declared because thoughts came in and moved the materials. So one of our own conclusion was that there was a great battle in reverse states between political minds, the government of the day, with the collusion of INEC and the popular will of the people. That's one thing we noticed. So at the point where the results ordinarily would have been uploaded, we received feats that the presiding officers did not have the codes or the password to upload those results. That for us was a major issue because, you know, before now INEC and those press conference interviews and those people, the procedure that immediately after voting, the results would be transmitted via the electronic beavers machine and that was what the people expected and that we didn't get. So our position is that there is that failure of INEC apologetics and possible collusion of INEC in reverse states with the reverse state government to circumvent the will of the people. Coffee? Be, I mean, like what you said as an observer, but when you say collusion with the government of reverse state, that's a very grave allegation. What evidence do you have that the government of reverse state is involved in colluding with INEC to rig the elections? It's a very serious allegation that you need to have, I'm sure your lawyer, you know, some evidence to back that up. Yeah, coffee, you know, we were discussing, you know, consistently with the INEC officials who were getting information from them, we were talking to them and, you know, at the point where we noticed that the beavers were now at the local government area and those beavers, you know, were there till the next morning. So we had looked at it and felt like, oh, there's likelihood of compromise because, ordinarily, the codes were supposed to be given to the EOs and the EOs send the code to the supervising officers who are supposed to send the same codes down to the presiding officers. So that was not done and it raised the issue of suspicion majorly and when we talk about, you know, this collusion, we had pulling units in Rume pre-con, Rume as is close to the governor's house, where we had thugs, security personnel, and then the presiding officers moving materials to unknown destination. In the Queere local government area, we had the same thing. In Akukutoro, we had a local government, I think local government chairman, unofficial of government, move the entire results with the results sheets and everything out of the local government area. What more do we need? So there has been that compromise and, you know, in our own opinion, INEC has failed the people. This is a reflection of what happened in the entire states of the federation. Most likely, most likely, basically, we can, you know, we can speak for river states because we were on ground. Why were we patrolling in a particular ward 9, unit 16, unit 45, the people there flagged us down and said that security defaults. Courage, if you can hear us, I think that we seem to have some connection issues, but you probably would have to connect with us and would like to show your thoughts more as to if, you know, what happened in... Okay, so courage, I'm glad to have you back or glad to have you back. Can you hear us? Well, thank you, I can hear you clearly now. Can you hear me? Yes, so my question to you before all of that distortion was that do you think that what happened or what transpired from your observation in river state is a reflection of what happened in the 36 states of the federation, including the FCT? Can you hear me? I think we have a... Where did the network come from? Yes, you know, it's what we call it again. You know, for me, I still want courage to give us some sort of evidence to back up his claim that the river state government was working hand in hand with INEC officials to scuttle the election. Are you there, courage? I'm back, I'm back. So my question, I mean, just before we get back to, you know, Kofi, you probably didn't answer the other question. But just before we get back to that point now, I'm asking, if you think that what happened in, I mean, according to your observation, what happened in river state, it's the same thing that happened in the 36 states of the federation, including the FCT. The fact that materials arrived late, like you have mentioned, the issue of beavers and the fact that the police officers were not sufficient or available, you know, to escort these materials and, you know, the officials. I'd like you to share your thoughts briefly on that. OK, I cannot categorically say that it's the same thing that happened in the entire, you know, states of the federation. However, we also received reports from Biosha states of late arrival of materials. In fact, there were some pulling units where materials never arrived and I think they have, you know, re-election in those areas. So I cannot, although persons in Lagos have, you know, shared their opinion and said, this is what happened in legal states, but for me to state categorically that it's the same thing that happened in the entire states of the federation. I'm not very close to say so because the trackers we had on the field were in river states and then a few others, we are in Biosha that could give us feeds, but not from the federation. Thank you. OK, back to the river state issue. I don't know, maybe we need to, you may need to retract that because I don't know what evidence you have to say that the government of river state colluded with INEC to rig the elections because we don't want to smear anyone's character here. And even the reports of the governor going from place to place to, you know, pulling units to tell them not to use the beavers has been countered, it's been rejected, those reports have been rejected by the river state commissioner of information saying it's not true. Where you have officials of the government of river states carrying thoughts, going to pulling units to stop them from declaring the results, cutting away with materials, that's I am, materials for the election. What would you call that? Did you see him personally moving around with dogs? We received reports of dogs from our trackers in the field. Was there any any pictorial or video evidence to support that? Perhaps I'll look into our archive and send you some if we have. OK, I'm looking at a typical result from river state. This is sent to me by a very trusted source who was a party, not a party agent, but one of the support groups. They had to follow the motorcade of the ionic officials and screwed up with this to the rock center, you know, after the thing left their pulling unit. They've come up with this result and I've asked for the, this seems to be a certified true copy. I've asked for a copy from the agent because I mean, if you're showing me the, an altered result, the official form EC8A, OK, at least you can show me the one that was signed by all the agents present to show me what it was before it was altered so we can compare. But this one is from river state. Local government will be at the registration area, that's RA. So the rock is the registration area center. That's Oroigwe, I don't know if that was where you were. And it's the pulling unit is RumorLogy Open Space 2. RumorLogy Open Space 2, there's a code there, I can't see the code quite well. Number of voters, 1,208. Number of accredited voters, 277. Number of ballot papers issued, 594. I'm not going to go to all that, but the thing is this, the figures for different parties have been altered. You can see that with Penn, they wrote 17 for APC and then that 17, they put a 2 in front to make it 217. And for LP they wrote 227 and they cancelled the 2 to make it 0, so it now became 27. It is something that you have seen to be the case across the state and from the other states that you have access to in terms of your network with other CSOs and observers. What I can categorically say that raised suspicion is the fact that as at about 10 AM, 12 AM on the election day, we had cases and reports of over 28 polling units and also in Ward 4 of Falgar where the from E8 were missing. So that again raised suspicion of likelihood of manipulation of results because standard procedure is that the presiding officer comes to the polling unit with all the sensitive materials and non-sensitive materials and at the close of voting, the record is declared or the votes are declared and then imputed into form E8. But the very fact that from E8 was missing in most polling units, over 28 polling units, as our reports show, raised suspicion that there is that likelihood that those results will be rewritten or will be written or manipulated and all they needed. And our suspicion is that the reason they did not allow those results to be declared at the polling unit is so that people will not have a record of the results. So all they need to do is to have the number of accredited voters and then they can write whatever results they want to write. So as for alterations, I am not aware, but this is the scenario we have that is likely or that creates the likelihood of manipulation. So are you saying that your organization or yourself did not observe or see these alterations or mutilation like I like to call them, all of the cancellations on the papers because there are a lot of results, not just in reverse states that has these mutilations on them. So was this also not part of your observation? OK, this was not part of our observations, although pictures like this came on the platform. However, this is not something we're really looking to. Observation is pre-election, election day, and post-election. So these are like your post-election observations. OK, you are part from being an observer in this election. You are a lawyer and a very good one at that, because I know. We've seen what's played out at the National Collision Center. What do you remedy do you think the parties have? Because you see such a unit, this one polling unit, whether the number of votes can add up or subtract from any of the candidates. Do you think that the relevant laws allow the parties to be attended to in their concerns we looked into at that national level, as per polling unit by polling unit? Thank you, Kofi. You see, Section 65 of the Electoral Act talks about returning officers declaring the results and the fact that those results they declare are final. However, there is a proviso that says that the commission, that's INEC, can review those results within seven days from the declaration of those results. And that is what we have put out there for political parties to take advantage of that section of the Electoral Act 2022 as amended. And petition INEC to review the results in polling units where they feel that the results declared is not a reflection of what happened at the various polling units. As of yesterday, we received reports from one of the political parties that while they were at the Collation Center that some people noted out to the government of the day came and moved the entire collation process to another venue. So these are the kind of irregularities that they can raise to justify their claims. And you see, the problem they have, which is why we are calling out INEC, is the fact that in most of the polling units, the presiding officers did not declare the results. So that's a major challenge because if results have been declared in polling units and from E-8 given to the various party agents after they had signed it, then that can be the basis for them to raise questions when they see a contrary result from the returning officer. However, in the polling unit where that was properly done, I think they may also raise that question. Then on grounds of irregularity, INEC or INEC officials or ad hoc staff not following the due process as outlined in the guideline for the electoral process, they can raise objections to that even calling for either cancellation or for re-election in such polling units. But let me ask you, we are in this system you are very conversant with it. Do you see any compliance? Do you see any obedience to some of these observations and some of the things that you have suggested I mean in consonance with the electoral art? Like I said yesterday in an interview, the law does not invoke itself. The law does not invoke itself. It takes the people or the affected persons to invoke the provision of the law. Nobody gives you what you don't ask for. Freedom is not given freely. Neither are rights given freely. So that provision of the law is there. It's a new law. It should be tested. That simply means that petitions can be raised by the political parties sent to the commission talking about INEC and we are hopeful that INEC should have given also, you know, tits to that law by having a sort of commission of inquiry or a panel that can look into such grievances. So it is when it is tested that we will talk about compliance. The results are still coming out. So we still have about six days for them to take advantage of this provision because the commission has the rights to obtain the results or the declaration of the returning officer if there is any illegality found, if there is any irregularity found or if it is found that he did not declare the results voluntarily because there are circumstances where result is declared by duress. That's the mischief behind that law and that is why we have that law. So they can take advantage of that window. It settles some matters within a short period of time because focusing on the courts and the tribunal will take a longer period of time for them to fight, you know, to recover their mandates. All right, you talked about, according to this removal, we talked about some of the things observed and one of the things we mentioned was that the results are not declared at the various polling units, you know, and I'm sure they, from E8 or EC8A was not signed or handed over to the party agents. This is impossible for this to happen because the Electoral Act stipulates this and the regulations and guidelines for the conduct of elections in Nigeria actually is by an act in 2022, June, 4th of June, 2022, it's clear. And that upon signing this upon the conduct of the polls, the results have to be announced but before they announced, they have to be signed by all the party agents where available, where available. And then copies given to the police officer on duty and to the party agents as well. Then the results should be announced for everyone who is there and the copy should be pasted at that polling unit. So it's clear, we can look at section 61, even 62 of the, no, section 60, 60 of Electoral Act. And if you don't mind, I'll just read it. This is signed Electoral Act. It says that the subsection one says the presiding officer shall, after counting the votes of the polling unit, enter the votes scored by each candidate in a form to be prescribed by the commission as the case may be. Subsection two says the form shall be signed by and stamped by the presiding officer and counter-signed, signed and stamped by the presiding officer and counter-signed by the candidates of their polling agents where available at the polling units. Of course, you know where available at most of these polling units. And number three, it says the presiding officer shall give to the polling agents and the police officer where available a copy each of the completed forms that it has been newly signed as provided on a subsection two. Subsection four says the presiding officer shall count and announce the results at the polling unit. Yeah, we saw some of the videos of people we know counting along with the presiding officer. And it says the presiding officer shall transfer the results including a total number of accredited voters and the results of the ballot in a manner prescribed by the commission. Of course, that's in the regulations and guidelines which you can look at if time permits. So if all of this is not done, at least announce the results and displayed, then it means that the results cannot hold. So why are we even having an argument? Okay, copy one of the two red sections 65 and see the grants where INEC can review the results. Just read that section 65. Let's see those provide. So where INEC can review the results. Read it out to the public. What, maybe we'll probably just join you. That's because we're being prompted to take a break to join the newsroom at nine o'clock, fourth and news break. Thank you so much for being with us. We'll definitely come to you in no time. We'll see you in a minute.