 Fuck no way you know why did you click the water? Wait, how many episodes are gonna be rings of power season one, isn't that nine? Can we have a long nine episode? Cuz I don't know Everything's so short now shows used to be like 24 episodes a season yeah But we're gonna cry for requests Like for complaining about that because dear devil's gonna be like pain for 18 episodes or whatever the hell That's right. Yeah, like why couldn't this have ended after six? I'm guessing those will be like 15 minutes each as well ranks of power Lang presume actually it's I don't see a list on Wikipedia of like yeah me neither That's why I was oh wait I think I remember reading something like that because of the COVID stuff that ended up being like nine episodes for the first season I'm sure I read that somewhere. Hmm. I wish I could read Yeah, reading is really cool. Yeah, we can sort that out for you at some point. Oh shit, really No, we nifty rags, you know some people who can read right? I Yeah, I do I do and they tell me it's worth it Exciting really neat just like ratings pretty cool man. I can What things it finally does stand what's happening in this weird box when I stream like just moves these things up And I think people are trying to say something to me But I'm just and who's right fault is that? Definitely chat's fault. Oh, so we're live chats up. We're on screen. Everything is beautiful Even chat You bring a I was like, I'll sleep and then I was like, I was just rolling about and I was like not sleeping It's not working. I was like, maybe maybe if I just torch myself by recording more and then I did what yourself Torch myself yet. That's it. And I got another two hours done I'm getting so close which isn't in any way revealing at okay I'm still on the recording at least in part for this new video. I'm trying to put out the fucking giant annoying thing But it'll get done gonna be nice Hogland, yeah, the one metal said no the yeah the pogs people like pogs remember Alf. He's back cool And that is is more than enough to bring joy and cheer to all of the people's Village of this of this script because it gets worked on in like pieces simultaneously. Okay, and I have like No, let me have a look put it on screen right now my screen But nobody at home can see it because what got the the e-fap thing up if I didn't they'd know exactly what the video is right now Well, yeah, three thousand five hundred words left to record Which is like, you know, I could do that in you know time. So it's not bad Yes, yeah You could always spoil it. I've been half tempted I really have even though it kind of already is spoiled. I think if you've kept an eye on me now I have streams the past week plus Yeah, and every time I'm trying to hey, you want to hang out like no I'm streamed myself It's like no need to sleep. I think I meant I meant to stream the part to stray. I never got around to it Yeah, I guess I'll keep trying at some point because people won't see me play a cat game, you know And I can't I can't just I can't just not Well, what'll happen? So I know it's one of those times we're just working a video It's like hey when I hang out like no, I've been up for like eight days. I should sleep now. It's like, okay Pretty much where I was going with this. I was like so then I finished the recording I was like sorting some stuff out and I was like e-fap is in two hours. Well, it's time to go to sleep So I'm super energetic right now hundred percent ready to go. How's everyone else? I'm fine Don't know righty. I had normal sleep I had normal sleep as well. No, I sleep is normal completely a typical. It's not even worth discussing. Yeah, not really even with Discussing there even a thing that can qualify as that on e-fap even with disgust Well, there might be a few things that are worth discussing. Oh, I thought you're gonna No, that was like a like I was setting you up. I got nothing Okay, well, I guess I see her when it's week except pray speaking of next week That's what we're covering as far as I know. I'm already seeing contention Online about how good it is which is good news I thought it was just gonna be a pile of shit, but I've seen loads people say like whoa Whoa, it's not as good as the original of course, but it might be the best one other than the originalness like whoa My goodness from what I hear hey, maybe Jay of house long bone believes that it is Banger or baller she was one of those words which either way. That's a good. That's a high high bar then you got a Few other people I've been seeing and comments from different people's and and then drinker drink drinker said Lies and deceptions not a good film So You know, we'll see it. We're looking to try and view this film to To the morrow and who knows what it'll be like and then we'll we'll cover it next week So here's your warning people in the chat or I go see it before then if you want to have the the whole thing spoiled I guess because who knows who knows what we're dealing with exactly, but the fact that not everybody's just universally shitting on it is Good news, I guess Yeah What else is there what events happen in life these days? I would bullet train. That's how was how was the bullet bullet train? Bullet train. Yeah, the new Brad Pitt action-tism It's pretty fun very silly and probably doesn't make any sense at all, but you know, it was fun to watch It was very entertaining movie. It knew what it was doing. So I Give it an a okay If you want to know more, what's what's the premise? I think I know what it is from the trailer But why don't you tell us to tempt people to watch it? Maybe? Basely basically. Yeah, basically not basically basically like Anyway, like a lot of basil on it. Yeah. Yeah, I was I was going there where I thought I wouldn't but then you So I'm proud of you. I'm proud of you So Brad Pitt newest one. He's basically an assassin man. He just came back from I don't know I don't remember like vacation or just took a Took a leave of absence to find himself and He gets like his first mission back and it's just a we go go retrieve this case from this bullet train It's just go grab it and get out of there But obviously that doesn't happen and then all kinds of shenanigans go down and action scenes and a lot of Plot stuff happens that I'm not sure works out But yeah over the top action scenes love explosions a lot of go gory action here and there and Yeah, it goes it goes crazy, but I found it to be very entertaining entertaining action movie Well, it's nice to know Brad Pitt still around still still making stuff, you know, he still looks the same Isn't he like almost 70 now or something? I don't know something I don't know when his deal with the devil runs out, but I'm pretty sure it's public record. We can go look it up Brad Pitt. Oh 58. I In Brad Pitt deal with Devil like oh, it's only three three fifty. That's famously Hollywood movie star Brad Pitt made a deal with Satan He's 58 he looks still pretty good. It's pretty impressive I think he's Benjamin Button in real life I will say I think he's gotten older in the past 30 years That is that is a true that is a true. Yeah, I may be a tiny button explain this Couple wrinkles in the past 40 years But just a couple and here's the biggest shocker. It actually had some some stuff and some some puns and jokes in there That made me laugh That doesn't happen too often with modern stuff, so I was very very pleased not not belly laughing Funny, but it's like yeah, it was pretty funny. Oh, you know what it is You were in the cinema and you laughed and you were like you're like scared didn't know what that was as an experience Cry the other doing it too. It's like you guys, okay. Did you did that happen to you do? Oh my god, man, are you okay? And you're like no You guys been watching Marvel 2 and they're like What's wrong with Marvel one? Yeah Actually a lot I Think I think to throw in a Simpsons reference for the sake of ringing here It's like what mr. Burns is hot slightly beats or whatever. It's like a horrible screwed up black like a little piece of fruit It's like a prune. Yeah I kind of remember the context for that I just remember that image because it was funny as fuck So yeah The last week we saw you all you wonderful folk in chat. We talked about What surprises Marvel had for us for phase five? It was so exciting It was like, oh, you love this and now you're gonna love this or else How did how did you guys like all all them trailers because you did that before you and then you did it for the efforts Well, how did you did you like the trailers? Were they amazing? Did we like any of them? I don't remember. I think we said that the Wakanda forever trailer looked the most like promising I got like Promising I suppose or that any effort had been put into it or artistry had been put into it Yeah, but The others were I mean and or looked expensive Most of the others Well, Andrew looks more expensive than the other Disney shows we've seen was like the point, right? Even though that wasn't one of the trailers we just decided to talk about it And you know, there's well, there's a new handle trailer, but we could watch today. Actually, yeah, well, no No If you really we can if you want I don't actually I don't I don't mind I just don't really care I believe you mind from what you just said you have a mind upon this subject Have thoughts and feelings and that is okay. Disney Disney just lies to me. Disney is They are Disney or liars In that case how about today instead of watching anything to do with disney and marvel we watch other people talking about disney and marvel Oh, you know somehow one more degree of separation seems better. Hmm well because um You see We on we on EFAP we're saying some stuff about the state of what I guess you could call it phase four I think Loki did it in for us I'm trying to think of the timeline because it was like three strikes, right? So Like one division and what Falcon and soldier very very bad And so the world is gone and several characters have all been fucking knifed in the back but Um, we were still in it. There was still a couple things left and then Loki I think we were like, all right, that's it then it's fucked. Yeah, it's done. It's over now Um, but a lot of other people state in the game They're like nah, man This is actually not only are you wrong about them three because they both they're all really good, but that we're on for great things But ever since I think MOM and Thor Love and Thunder and Moon Knight that that little era fucking L. It has changed the sentiment Uh, yeah, anyone's been paying attention to it. Jeez. I think Moon Knight might have been Yeah, I think Moon Knight multiverse of madness were the two that people were expecting more from and then they were just The same sludge as everything else and that was like the realization. Oh, shit. Like it's never gonna be It's never gonna be different I feel like I've watched like a million years of phase four and then I still realize oh, I watched probably only half of it And only I think last week or something I I get to know about this fucking titan that's sticking out of earth now because I never see the tunnels That's like, how did I not know about this? How has houses never come up before? I lost my shit when someone told me about like you crazy. You're fucking with me, right? Like this is not real And then they sent me a picture and I was like, what how is this they sent me a what? The picture of this titan sticking out of earth is like, what the fuck is going on, dude They send you a picture of a fucking scene from a movie to be like no seriously Look, this doesn't exist. Someone made this they don't lie to you. You know like, oh my god I couldn't believe it because no one mentioned it ever It's just oh What is this? sanity moller kind moller kindly invited me on to this to talk about it Phase four and I was like, yeah, sure And then I researched it and I was like, oh shit I've barely seen any of this because I in my head The line where phase four begins was drawn farther back. I thought it was But I guess endgame is where it kind of cuts off and phase four starts and I was just like fuck But to be fair Even I couldn't have I was struggling to say where phase four began I eventually was like, so it's one division then but I was like, wasn't there a movie? Was there a movie? Was it all was the tv shows thing at the horrible nightmare that doesn't count or is it real? It's like, no, it's very real Yeah, very real I guess phase four is when they started integrating all the The series that they're doing Right like phase three. It wasn't really a thing Yeah Yeah, right one division was their first one, right? Yes Yeah And it was the one that tricked us the longest Yeah for two episodes Those early episodes are the ones that the the the worst were saved even though they're the best ones Yeah, and I think it makes us angry The first two episodes were worse the worst received out of wander vision how the fucking marvel fans were like boo I want to see interesting. It's like no Oh, man I really enjoyed the beginning of that show. I thought it's shaking it up It's trying to do something different and I I like that kind of old television like Like it's trying to do like I love lucy kind of thing and I just thought it was I thought it was great And they they have like, you know, they would lift up props on strings and stuff I'm like, I like this. They're not even trying to like do Or anything like Dude in the pilot like had me go in the most was the dinner scene where they like It's like they're glitching out almost and yeah It's just like, oh my god. What is happening? What does it all mean? Yeah Works now that we understand what was actually going on Yeah You know like I don't I don't know that's kind of the problem But even then it's just kind of weird that the more sludge like it became the more people liked it I don't understand and it unmanded it go sludge mode another planet. Oh, yeah How do you guys like this? Holly was super duper sludge that last episode we got the two different fights of two different people firing lasers at each other Walk in the center. It's like, fuck That's one of like the biggest signals of sludge. I think is that kind of battle They shot your lasers and she shot your lasers and then they shot your laser But one person's laser was stronger than the other laser And one of them was red and the other one was purple and then it was and then the good girl one And then there was magic and I like that the other ugly would be like we set it up Remember the rudeness we set it up. Are you like no? All right, what do you think setup means? What happened to go you said that they exist She somehow figured them out because agatha explained the mechanics to her is like, okay A giant ruin someone explains to me a language a new language yesterday, and I start speaking it fluently today. That's not a setup Yes, it is Because yeah, uh, he has a he has that fight in multi-phase madness with evil strange, doesn't he they do a they do a We are doing our powers against each other But then I would like why I would shut up. I went because I am the protagonist He's like no, but I'm like, but I'm you isn't I mean, I'm nobody's like no Um Anyway, the I've seen more and more video essays now popping up about how hey guys Hey, you didn't know this but phase four was actually bad And I'm wondering because we didn't notice wondering about some of these channels that have been like Are you the same people that would have been like, oh my god Yeah, it's coming out. Oh, this was the greatest show. Oh phase four is like the greatest first so um What I'm interested in Is seeing what their reasoning is and comparing it to us and seeing because we agree with them Right on the surface, but perhaps there is more Perhaps if you dig into the details we discover some discussion Um The people saying this are the same people who love the first three mcu shows. Yeah, that's my theory uh on a lot of this We were there for the hype. We were there for being the controversy ones being like, oh, yeah, you guys here We like some of it We want it to like more of it How can the winter soldier did that last even an episode? I think we got annoyed after one didn't we? Um, we didn't like it, but it was episode. We didn't like it from ever But I think it was episode three that got us angry enough to where we said, all right We're doing a knee-fap on it. Oh, because originally we were just gonna let it go Episode four was the one that um four. Okay. Yeah, because that was the one A little shield in them. Yeah, that's right. Oh, I pissed me right off a whole show pissed me right off And uh, Loki was gone in 10 minutes It's like three two one they shoot the gun go and it just slams onto the ground face first. Yeah, pretty much Something that you'll notice is and something that we noticed was like the sheer depths of the dialogue It was so like apparent and Loki like it was really bad from the get go Yeah, the first episode hit you like a brick wall. Well, yeah We have to contrast avengers Loki with this Loki because they're the same person So it's like a direct comparison and it's just like, yeah Well, I remember the the moment I stopped watching Loki is when they had all the infinity stones in a drawer What the fuck is this? That's a fair enough place to just stop It's not when nuts about that and rightfully so is like what the fuck is this and it's like ain't it funny? It's like, oh my Yeah Yeah, you know what michael waldrin people aren't really happy that like you've got the thing that Natasha sacrificed her life for just sitting in a drawer. Yeah That's not funny really. It's really undercuts like a really important moment, but I'm sure that was a bad idea that every thought was really funny in the writer's room Yeah, we're done with the infinity saga. It's like these things. They're just paperweights who cares And yeah about Loki by the way, it's to For continuity if you want to see this a loki's phase like you need to watch, you know Thor then avengers and then this and you'll be following directly and it is a fucking you go from joss weed and loki to Michael waldrin loki, which is, you know It's similar Um What even what else happened? I'm trying to remember now because I was just like the because that's where we were like, uh-oh um Because we haven't been keeping up with uh with everything lately, which is okay. All right We recommend everyone else not keep up with everything marvel, but I do know Was there a film next? Oh, um After loki black. Oh black widow was first up. Yeah. Oh my god Are you oh fuck I could have been convinced black widow was phase three for a second there Oh, that happens, right Yep, that's the one that was a really good movie Were people saying that was great, I don't think so, right? Um, I don't I'm not sure I can't remember But if anybody was saying it was good, they moved on pretty quick We did cover someone who said Good, right? I think I think probably I think um Because then yeah, because when shang chi comes out, it's like this weird middle of the phase where you're just like Well, wow remember shang chi got pretty good responses Um, but that's another case of like the half life on these projects because nobody talks about it anymore Nobody will nobody we would have said it back then now it will be true Nobody will remember the plotline for that film. Well, it's been it's been a year since that film came out And I can yeah, I can imagine that nobody could tell you anything and plus I mean, we even saw on twitter, right? Like people getting Posting like the scene the fight scene at the end like oh the action's so great and getting eviscerated everybody's not accepting that Because like the tide is really turning on a it seems at the moment like the general sentiment is starting to sour Yeah, um, have you seen the the meme where it's like, you know I don't know if you guys have seen it. It's all over fucking twitter The deep is is renounced to be a part of the The seven in season three of the boys And it's this meme of him He's got his back to the camera and he reveals himself and walks on stage Like I'm really awesome sort of thing and people are using that imagery to say like Oh, you have moon night fans saying my character was hard done by and then it'll say Taskmaster fans and it'll show that clip like Basically that, you know, you there are ways to have it way worse Um, and it's just funny because it goes all the way back to remember death dealer Does anyone remember that that Death dealer. No, I don't remember death Oh, he was the dude the guy who was the really cool bad guy and shag she just got fucking killed By spooky little ghost demon. It just sucked his spirit out. He was dead One of the most bizarre fucking things that's ever happened in all of marvel I don't know why they did that Just throw away this really cool character for like, I guess a joke. I like I don't know That's a good question because I'm not sure why they did that because you had um Was he called razor fist the other henchman guy? I think they let him live. It's like, why didn't you? Why I just don't understand Remember they had the old archer bad. He just got casually killed by one of the spooky demon ghost big things as well Just remember the fact that that was what happened in that film Like that there was demons from another dimension in like a mystical forest Like they they pick you up and suck something out of you and then you're dead and it's just like, oh my god What does that? What does that mean? What did they do? Is that was that his soul? Do we have soul the canonical like in the marvel considering um the undead spooky dudes in In multi-visit madness are they connected to that at all? It's just like look I'm asking we forgot about it. So you better forget about it too. Okay, it's we we are Phase four is not interested in cohesive world building at all. Everybody's doing their own thing Under the illusion of interconnectedness because occasionally wong or abomination will show up okay, I feel it's it's it's kind of um I think that what what people liked about the mc was Conceptually was that you could tell stories that were much longer than you would traditionally see in films Because you know every film is connected and there's like a couple of films a year and then you can build up these really big stories Um, but now it's just character show up. That's the extent of the world building Hey, you might see somebody you recognize they might pop up to hang out for an episode or like Show up for five minutes to remind you that they exist. It's not really world building Yeah, and then Kevin it's not really around And then Kevin fight comes and I'll say oh by the way this face. This is over. Uh, we call it the multiverse saga Okay, phase four five now. Oh That was wow. Yeah They've definitely got it short But they haven't done anything we haven't concluded to anything we just told of stories I guess and now we just do the next I mean it's You look back at the now technically phase two ended with ant-man and technically phase three ended with five from home But they all end with like avengers films Because there's some plot that leads up to there and then phase two kind of wasn't a good example of that But then phase three was much more clearly building up to something Here it's like by the end of phase four. What are we really going to have accomplished? Other than the destruction of several characters You know the introduction of not great replacements Yeah, because we thought that kang is going to be like this overarching thing. He's gonna he is appear here in there Yeah, 2024 or 2025 exactly gang popcorn Yeah, I want to but Your promotional popcorn pins sit down in your seat and buy all the things So we it seems it seems to me one of the biggest issues with this phase is it's now They're now relying too much on audiences watching the disney television series Uh to understand like what's coming down the line in the films Like kang the conqueror for instance Like I think one of the first of the two avengers movies that are coming I guess revolves around kang and as I understand I didn't watch this far into loki But it's loki that kind of sets him up. That's like true But I don't even know that you'll I don't what do we have to say about he's like he's kind of just this eccentric weirdo When you see him next he's probably not going to be the guy that we met in locally the same person Yeah, okay, I I think that they're almost and and and then you look at another example If you didn't watch one division you might actually be better off in terms of like Especially if you direct one of the films I would argue you're correct on that because of pale vision Yes, because because if you know who if you know about pale vision and everything to do with that You're just going to be confused as to and also you're just going to be confused about us Like I thought wonder vision resolved on like wonder trying to be a good person Um, yeah, but then but then we changed our minds Because it's so incoherent. I don't know that you benefit at all from like watching the shows I don't know that you benefit from knowing more because I mean look at meadow saying like, oh, wait, there's like a dead celestial Yeah You're better off not knowing that You know, I think that and like even if all the television shows were great. It's too much So like I don't want to watch all the television series like eight 10 12 episodes of this show that show that show to understand where the movies are going like Marvel Marvel would really like you to because that means that you're going to be a lot more invested in like the disney ecosystem well, yeah I think it's as simple as like they were successful because they had pretty well written and endearing characters played by charming actors That was like the main main thing Because it doesn't matter. A lot of plots. A lot of their plots and we're building. We're kind of Feel like we are If we dealt with that Same, you know positive in all these shows and movies I think maybe we'd be like a bit ridiculous. We're going to watch all these shows But at the same time if we were enjoying them, would we really be complaining that much or we're like, well I mean The good shows They're good. Um people are going to enjoy something that's good even if there's a lot of it But it's not Yeah, because this is what I don't get about the whole like phase four sucks now crowd Like when you guys like fucking singing the praises of some of like the for example the character work in falcon winter soldier They would talk forever about how amazing bucky's journey was when we were like, wow, they skipped over most of it Mm-hmm Yeah, like remember when they were they were having their group therapy session and like bucky in episode two Bucky just like declares the art that he needs to resolve Yeah, like he just states what his inner conflict is I would definitely watch more I would watch more of the shows if they were all good for sure But like in like the breaking bad universe for example if like breaking bad was the thing But our call saw was the thing and mike ermenshaw had his own show and And kubi had his own show and howard had his own show I've like, you know what? I'll maybe watch a few of these and just kind of Try and fill in the blanks on my own like You joke, right? And everyone's like, haha. Yeah, but yeah, but look at aga's get her own show Yeah Echo a character the it's nobody knows from a show nobody watched I obviously this she's more of a somebody in the comics, I suppose But like I just mean in reference to the people who are to pay attention only to the Movies and shows. It's just funny to be like rags. Are you excited for the echo show? And she's like What no is that even marveled? It's like It's Yeah, no idea It's it's like they're um, I don't know they made an echo show like you guys will watch this right? It's marvel. It's got marvel on it. We put star work. I mean we put marvel on it. You'll watch it Because they announced the agatha show right after one vision happened right? I was like, oh, oh, oh interested interested and now it's like it's like it was a joke and now it's like No, they committed to the joke They're really going through with it. Uh, I guess I signed something somewhere Um Last week we talked about dc Um, and they're sorry state of affairs uh, what did we did we? Remind me because I my brain is uh melted cheese What you know the whole like dc cancelling everything that hadn't happened when we were talking last week, right? It was like a few days ago when they had this whole list they that that went out We should probably talk about that because people This is going to be some people have no idea and then some people just want to know what we think about that. Um You want to think james did they cancel more than just back girl? Yeah, hang on. I'll get to list They cancelled other films, but in terms of dc films they cancelled that was just back girl Was flash one of them or is that so good? No, that's no Is that the one yeah Flash is still gonna come out some year This is a list of things that have been like, yeah cancelled and and stopped But I guess the the relevant ones are Uh back girl and scoob holiday hunt Haunts were the ones that got cancelled this week for like Holiday hunt. All right. That sounds appropriately scooby-dooby Um And and presumably a lot of the stuff that was on the cw has been Uh cancelled as well as much part of these measures There was there was also that uh, I think Warner Brothers is is also now scaling back animation kids programming as well um And and uh, the that they want to merge hbo max and discovery plus into a new streaming service Oh, and I guess they asked joker to like properly and officially. Yeah with lady gaga's as uh Yeah, I'm scared. Holy queen I'm interested I will happily say I am scared because this could be good I Oh, it's gonna be good. Please don't be good. Oh, I guess in the sense that if it's bad, I'll be like, no You had a chance meanwhile when they have something new in phase four. It's like, does it have a chance really? It's Just go back in it's okay Okay um But I guess it as it pertains to dc. The announcement was that they what they're they're developing a 10-year plan And that they want to do it more like the mcu like Overly stated that that's their goal which I guess um And and also that like I think that dc's like spinning off into a new studio or something Um, and that there'll be like new leadership I think the current guy is um, I think the current guy may or may not be leaving walter Hamat hamada. I think is his name. I think he uh From what I understand he almost left like straight away after that girl was cancelled Um, but that might not be the case anymore So yeah, lots of changes going on to dc because yeah, it's not not really anything going on right now Is there and the public discourse around it has been pretty cringe Everyone's like, uh A lot of people are upset public discourse has been well, I mean I A lot of people seem to be so It probably be important to I I can understand being like really sympathetic to you guys worked on a film and like nobody even gets to see it Like that's really lame Especially when you were totally under the belief that it was going to be seen you went into production You worked on it. Um, like that's lame I do feel for the cast and crew just for that. Yeah, like they pour all that time and effort into it You know, but like as for where people really like excited and looking forward to back girl in the numbers that you would seem to see on twitter That's more so I well, I think I think it's just you've been told that you can't see it So now like That said though, I towards the back girl Yeah Well, I do I do wonder if maybe they were ultimately doing the actors a favor by not putting this film out Maybe it really was that terrible. Well, I mean the problem is that when we're talking about Because sentiment that's that I've seen Is like oh, but the last few years have just scattershot dc films has yielded good results That the two that I would that you would point to as being like really worthwhile are not part of the dceu They're like totally separate. So I don't even know if I'd count those and people include in that grouping like aquaman aquaman is shit Yeah, that was Aquaman fucking sucks like it's really bad I don't agree, but it was funny Yeah, I laughed quite a bit watching that Yeah, sure, but people people say like oh that movie's fun, but it's only fun ironically It's not fun like for what it tries to be the jokes it tries to tell a bad You laugh at it because of how stupid it is I don't disagree with that at all Or should master and then they played the music like Well, yeah, so the reason why I wanted to bring that up as well was you got patrick willows's tweet Which is partially what freeman's referencing there I assume at least in part um probably an unpopular take But I liked warner brothers not having a plan for dc the past four years of I don't know who cares if they're connected Let's try shit has been way more interesting than the Intricately planned marvel stuff made during that time The fact he thinks that marvel stuff is intricately planned is fucking hilarious Aside from that. Yeah, I'm inclined to agree go ahead for you. Sorry well, so part of the problem in this discussion is that So why why are these decisions being made by warner brothers, you know as part of the merger? It's like probably because they're not making any money um Warner brothers can't like infinitely indefinitely just keep losing money Just because you find the project's interesting, you know, like at some point they got to start making money on these films And most of them haven't made money Or like not made a lot of money aquaman is this weird exception But birds of prey lost money shazam made like a modest profit the suicide squad lost money Um, did it really joker? Uh, yeah, unfortunately it did. Yeah I mean joker was like a big success, but that's another one like it's it's um, it's probably unsustainable and like it can't I don't know that these things persist with like, um We're just like, oh, but I find it fun. It's like sure. But a lot of people like aren't showing up It's kind of like the problem. Yeah DC seems to have at the moment is just a lot of people aren't showing up anymore um As opposed to marvel where they seem to at least be able to consistently get people through the door They get them in the first weekend They get them in the first weekend. That's that that's true. They get them in the first weekend because like Dr. Strange probably could have made a billion and Thor making less than ragnarok. Like that's not a good sign Um, gotta get those butts in those seats at the very least right like um, yeah, um, well, I guess it's just um I I yeah, I don't like That that a film can be made and then just nobody gets to see it forever because you want to write it off Like that's I don't like that. Um as for like any changes to the Uh, well, yeah, but I get but this is dceu. Like what does that even mean? You know Like most of the films are awful. Um, how bad could it have really been by comparison to like One woman Was like a huge disaster as well. I forgot about that one I I watched our efat movies on that uh yesterday. Um, just while I was doing stuff and man that film is That film's terrible. No What's the I watched our batman vs. Superman video and our wonder woman 84 video and It really reminded me how bad the zack snider stuff was firstly, but also how absolutely awful the uh um The wonder woman 84 was Fucking horrific Yeah, well part of um, what I was referring to when I said uh cringey takes was that people were like This is revealed that it turns out a lot of these superhero movies are made with more so like a monetary thing in mind Like that was a surprise Yeah All of them. What do you mean? Yeah all of them are made You don't spend like a hundred million dollars on a film that you are like, I'm not sure if this one will make money You just got to throw it out there like You don't do that Sometimes you want these people to have that kind of money to invest in a movie just to see What they then you know do and say and and like The idea you just throw all that money in and be like, yeah, fuck it. Whatever if it flops is fine It's like, no, they that's not how it works. They're like, no, I want to sound invest It's not how it works for a publicly traded company. That's for sure Like that you could just keep losing money Yeah, I was just like man, this is not the people just like man You know this Martin Scorsese was right, which I like as a beam But I was like wait, but that if his point was just Movies these days get it more and more soulless. I'd be like, oh fuck. Yeah, dude But but he said they got cinema, which is a different thing And that's what I don't know what that means. That's the problem in it Is this cinema? I don't know. I'm in a cinema watching it. I guess I think I think Because there was a there was an image that went around it was from there the the Warner Brothers like The earnings call or investor meeting whichever event it was that all of this stuff came out And there was this picture that just had like brands, you know franchises, which There's they listed 90 day fiance is like a big franchise up there with like, you know DC and and Game of Thrones Um, and I remember I saw people thought that that was laughable But then I found out that like 90 day fiance was actually like There's like 50 television shows based on that franchise And it just reminds you that in the Warner Brothers discovery merger discovery Is actually like the big player In the sense that they're the ones that are in charge Because David Zasloff was the CEO of discovery And now he's in charge And so all that indicates to me is that um I think that depending on which circles you're in in terms of your discussions about media It can give you a little bit of tunnel vision Where you don't see the bigger picture the bigger picture in this case being That like There are actually yeah, like there's there's a lot of money that gets made in media and like These types of projects, you know, like reality television and stuff like that is a it's still a big, you know That's a big thing um And I don't know how much that fact is into streaming, but it may well And it probably does And so it's like, yeah in the totality in the grand scheme of things Um, how well is Warner Brothers doing? Considering how much how well you think that they would be doing with all of these sort of recognizable franchises that they have as well as like all of the talent That's you know in the studios that are within Warner Brothers Um, I guess the concern is that you see a picture like that. Oh, these are our brands Like these are our franchises that we need to make money on our streaming service It's like that gets you worried. It's like man. It really is all about like ip's and streaming services, isn't it? Hey I don't like that, especially when we're talking about stuff that I do like I like dc I don't like the films right now, but I like dc. I really like looney tunes fucking love looney tunes A lot of the stuff on cartoon network when I was a kid. It's like Yeah, they they have a lot of stuff that I like and I get a bit nervous about what the future looks like for that company Yeah, their animated stuff looks all so flat now like everything else like, you know, that kind of uh Style are you not excited for dc's league of super pets? Is that not Not really The dc super pets universe and coinciding with the black atom dc universe. What a weird statement. I don't get that What a weird pair of videos Warner Brothers used to be great with animation You know like the the old looney tunes stuff and batman and animaniacs that how it was all like 2d traditionally hand drawn And had so much life in it in the way it was drawn, but it's so So flat now in dull And it looks like there's going to be less animation though going forward which um I mean that's I don't like that actually like that's I don't especially what it's grouped in because I said animation and kids content. It's like You know, like animation is like just a method of making like films and television shows, right like animation is I've been watching the dc animated things uh with meme on metals forge I think we watch like four or five now And they've all been pretty good like way better than everything else I've seen from dc movie stuff Uh So I don't know I don't know why they just drop that shit or just make it Last I guess they put all their eggs in the Zack Snyder basket. Okay, and it worked out real well I guess But yeah, the animated shows like we watched mask of the phantasm For last week's porch. That was really good That was pretty good Those are like things where I was like, oh these could have used like 15 more minutes to Make it a little bit better because there's some Contrivance and stuff in there. You could have eased out with a little bit more time Uh, but they're mostly like they're really good like very good. Yeah uh On the thought of I just reminded myself. I was on uh, it's on the old twitter making mistakes as per usual What were you doing on there? No good story begins with so I was on twitter It was like 5 000 likes On a pretty new tweet and it was it was going he was going up there and I was like, what was this do with doob, but man, and it's like uh, Wonder Woman's intro and bamfist Superman was one of the greatest fucking moments in like movie history or some shit And I was like, what was it again? Because I've forgotten I press play and you know, it's batman is in his little car and he's like, oh man my car It's all oh no, and then doomsday. It's like I'm gonna shoot you with my face laser Which was always very funny Uh, then wonder woman, you know, she just appears from the sky and slams down and blocks it with little Bam braces and then she hits them together and doomsday goes. Whoa That is it mechanically no Stripping away all of the like party What? The party where wonder woman shows up. Oh, no. Yeah, sorry. I meant. Yeah. I meant when she shows up As Wonder Woman, I guess what they were saying as opposed to Does she have an alter ego? Is that something she does Diana Prince? No, I know that's her name. I meant like does she do that? The the two lives thing I can't remember anymore. Yeah, she yeah, yeah, okay. She's not very good at hiding I think later. She she works at like the archaeology Uh Anyway I was just thinking to myself like, oh such lizard brain shit like like, you know The power to have written this scene batman's about to die, but then she's there That's it It's just like oh one of the greatest scenes in all time of movie fucking history But then I left I left it to play because I was you know, I was feeling a bit cynical and I was just kind of whatever fine You know, they like And if you remember doomsday gets hit back and then they you can see in the background like a sonic boom from Superman's coming in I don't know if he was in space or something Fucking hits doomsday and doomsday just flings into this building in the background. This is enormous explosion It's just like oh this is the superman I've always known from sax nine every time I was just like he's been on screen for seconds in this clip that I don't even remember what happens And there it is a giant fucking explosion because that's what it always is So it's seen the superman in the dc animated shows was like a fucking culture shock It's like this is supposed to be so this is way better. He's not killing everyone. It was this is great Look if you need him killing everybody, can you at least Knock him saying but also he's awesome and super bad Like oh, look he looks out for the civilians and stuff. He makes sure that they don't get killed Like oh, look they go somewhere else because there's people here. It's like, oh, that's smart I think that was his first day. Shut the fuck up I could legit think that like every time he shows up in that universe, you're sort of like Yeah The villain you're like, yeah, then he throws him into a skyscraper. You're like, no, no, no, no, no, no It's like, oh no a villain. Oh no, it's superman get out of here The villain's like, oh, I'm sorry. I didn't mean to I'll protect you citizens from supermen So you may as well get started that's enough that's enough talking about it Now let's let's see what people have to say about it Uh Which which would you like to see first out of these two? But not necessarily going to see them both though if we start one of them is shorter than the other So I think we should actually think about it. Yeah, we should probably just start with a longer one because Oh, it'll either make for a whole episode Or uh, or it won't as opposed to it definitely being janky with with the 10 minute one. So Where is the invite here? Uh Uh There you go. There's the invite Click. All right. We have ourselves We can watch the videos Yeah, really really cool fucking feature. We're just like syncs up Or watch it. Oh, wow. Oh This is uh, this is by a youtube video assayist named typho typho typho. I think it's typho typho Oh, yeah, wait, I made up a h or flip them No, the h is at the end. It's typoh Typho If you heard I said I flipped them. So I would have made up the h After the p to say typho and it wasn't one there if you flip it. Do you make it up? I thought making up is like you added it. I guess I've still made up a weird. It's not actually the h I just got it was typo spelled wrong. I get it Ironically, we're we are talking about the spelling of someone whose name is typho. So my brain made a typho That's incredible She's crazy. Oh, this video is called MCU phase four kinder sucks a lot a lot, which is like, okay I agree with what hang on. It kinder sucks a lot. I mean, yeah, it definitely sucks huge nuts. It's terrible It just sucks a little bit. Yeah I guess we'll have to see what he has to say because it's it's yeah, you know, that could mean a lot of things Um, and it looks like everybody's in here. So Let us begin Oh, the Marvel Cinematic Universe has been in pop culture for so long That it's hard to remember a time when it's mark on the film industry wasn't blatantly obvious I find that very Funny as someone who's not even that old because I'm like, what do you mean? Yeah, I do and I was like, oh Wait a minute How old is this guy? I was born in 2003 and I was People were born in this century. It's it's such a moment of like, what do you think about isn't it? Like, what do you mean? Fucking hard to remember times? Oh, you're five. You're five Forget inexorably Actually need to remind yourself sometimes like, oh people were born after me. Yeah, right People are going there are people on youtube right now making video essays. He were born in the 21st century Yeah, terrifying to say the least but and it's funny because like on real bvc The memes are always about how I'm I'm a young and but like I genuinely start when I'm listening to this stuff I'm just like, uh Gotta get my pills Stay awake to watch this video My body My muscles so they don't add trophy Oh, I'm not strong enough to take all the pills I have to take every day I'll crush them down First entry to be expensive franchise released and ignited the spark that would later build into one Hey, man, I would say the the editing's a little bit erratic for my tastes, but it's strong. You know, there's one. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah There's like an adobe drag-and-drop preset for every single cut, but uh, I thought I thought it was well put together I I appreciate grabbing up them clips to match, you know Yeah, good job And see a franchise released and ignited the spark that would later build into one interconnected timeline It's never been done. It's because they they slide up and down. They don't they don't uh, it's a little They've got a moving slide to them and it's really quick. Yeah, I was wondering if it's Me being old or all it was it was something because I was just like, oh, it's a little bit too fast for me. Oh, jesus Transitions it's how they transition you have like you have one They they slide up and down or whatnot So you can have sort of two on the screen at the same time And that takes a certain amount of time for the transition to happen and as fast as they're transitioning It adds to like a busy-ness Hmm. Yeah It reminded me of uh, zero punctuation I felt a little like bombarded by it on the first watch but uh, I had to watch it a few times to kind of absorb everything but like And fast in like an unironic way like zero punctuation kind of leans into that. It's part of the joke Oradonically fast Now it's a spark that would later build into one interconnected timeline. It's never been done before Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah the first one there's a spin and then they slide from different directions. It's not consistent That's what it is. That's what catches you off guard. Presumably. That's what he's going for in that one Oh, yeah, you can't accidentally do that. That's why I guess you could you could put on random presets Yeah, yeah, there's all kinds of things you can do in these, uh Well, I guess if you put if you purposefully set it to a random thing it's not It's really It's not like you could purposefully do that Right, so then if it comes out the way it is Could you say saying if you chose random it doesn't count as random? No, I mean like to say that he didn't really because you you would approve it at the end, right, hopefully Like when you edit it and went through and like I'll I'll take whatever the randomness did or I won't Well, so when I say Sorry, go ahead when I was saying what I think I assume is intentional is that he's like I maybe I'm maybe I'm being really too good faith here But like the idea of you got several Sort of different but similar elements and then they combine into the avengers being the that's why you use different transitions for each one to be like There's up for this down for this spin for this and they all came together But yeah, maybe it could be could could also just be but he Maybe he did choose random and then he saw the end of variety is the spice of life Maybe I didn't know you could do random. That's interesting. So like the software decides what transition to apply right before the export or something like that Well, it's called a few trans setting Even if you couldn't choose like a like say for example, there was like left right up down and random There were your actual options even if there was no random option You can still just you know, click ran not necessarily randomly But you sort of click quick through a selection. You guys you guys never done that with fonts, for example I've done that with fonts. No, I haven't where I scan with the the arrow keys Oh, yeah, I'd use the mouse wheel. Yeah, but yeah That too, yeah To have all these characters with their own standalone movies come together on one climatic event It was a feeling that's hard to come across now that you're witnessing the birth of something special that could never again Be replicated with the same residents remember Nick fury. Whatever happened to him Uh, he's in space. Yeah All right, uh Damn jackson said i'm too fucking old. I'm staying home What I think being touched on there. There's a super important element that's gone now is the novelty You don't get that anymore as a benefit We are almost at the point where people seeing people show up is now a negative And not because of the concept alone just because of how they're executing it But that once upon a time was seen as a fucking mind-blowing thing to be like what you were on the same screen as you Yeah, now it's just like oh man I wonder who's going to be in this one this time that I haven't seen in two movies. It's mr. Fanta. Oh, there he goes Uh, he's the smartest man and oh Maybe he's not that that's smart. Yeah, thank you. Yeah, it's all relative. Okay, everyone's Thank you like to me when you're smarter than a beatle Yeah, I don't know maybe People wouldn't say hey if you step on me I'll tell you That'll be the legacy of that by the way, that's what's so great about it Avengers was the first film in the mcy I ever saw and at the time it blew my mind an explosion of spectacle action and cool character dynamics The result of all these various worlds clashing in the one I'm from there. It is I will admit it is distracting A little bit like I said erratic feels like the word Yeah, it does feel erratic is a bit much. I'm trying to focus on the words he's saying it's My I might need to close my eyes Keep going and going may sound stupid But some of my most standout memories to do with going to the cinema closely associated to films in this franchise Avengers Guardians of the galaxy 1 and 2 the winter soldier in both infinity war and endgame the climax to Man, there's so much effort in the editing. I really appreciate that, but it's um, it's creating a kind of bad It's yeah, it's more isn't better. We just went through like three soundtracks. I don't think that's cool that uh I mean he synced them up in a such a way that like they don't slam into each other, but at the same time it's like wow Calm down Just a little bit. Just a little bit. I don't know. I don't really I am impressed It would be better if it was just the cuts like no transitions. Yeah, there's a Way too much going on visually here Um Guys Avengers Guardians of the galaxy 1 and 2 the winter soldier in both infinity war and endgame The climax to this universe spanning a decade and over 20 films filled to the brim with the very things I fell in love with in the first avengers I think what i'm starting to realize is it might just be that I think the reason why it's difficult to focus on What he's saying is because the music and the sound effects are a bit loud Certainly in that portion um I legit was about to have to go back because I Got distracted by listening to the the sound of the sword strikes and then I was like fuck. I'm supposed to be listening to what he's saying Endgame the climax to this universe spanning a decade and over 20 films filled to the brim with the very things I fell in love with in the first avengers amazing spectacle creative action and an incredible focus on characters and the Relationships that drive every aspect of these movies. We got to see these characters lowest points and their highest highs We got to see resolutions to plot lines and Well, I'll allow If we count the hits and ignore all the misses Um Best faith version of this I can assume that we would agree with is that Their stories had endings. It's like Yes Like yeah that that angle with They had an idea. There was a purpose to this whether or not it was well done. It's a different thing Hey, uh, does watch together let you turn on closed captions I might because I was about to say it's he's really mumbly very he's slurring a lot of his words together There's not a lot of clarity in the way that he speaks. Well at that point. I wonder if closed captions are gonna help because Unless they were well, you tubes were fairly accurate Um, but I don't know if the youtube functionality carries over to this website. Yes, some real funny words for youtube Like marge said it's an ending that's enough. I don't even remember when you said What's the context for that one? Does anyone remember? I like to try and remember my simpsons quotes. Oh I can't remember neither can I the character expanding years all ending in a way that closed the book on these characters Journeys are more broadly and arguably an end to a universe that had we through all these different works um I don't know if this is like a I don't know what kind of take this is but to me I was just like I mean endgame is never gonna be the end with this many characters who have this many unsolved Unresolved things going on I mean the big one of the big points I made in the endgame video is that it wasn't the end It never was the end like it wasn't even trying to be I'm not even trying to do it from like a cynical angle though I I just mean Why wouldn't this this plenty more story to tell if you wanna? Oh, sure I guess um because because it would be a little bit odd to look at endgame and go Well, Tony and Steve got their resolution. So that's it, right? When it's like what about all the other characters that we've introduced like yeah, they're the ones that you care about the most But that should tell you more about the quality of of the films More so than that this is like the end of the story because a few of the the most important characters in that universe had their endings I think we all And and yeah, like it doesn't even because comic books have been going for like, you know You've had comic books running for like 80 years consecutively at this point um Like why yeah, like you I don't know why you would necessarily assume that it ought to be the end um Well, because a lot of people are doing the thing right where they're like, I I stopped watching after endgame That was the end of the story for me and it's like you wouldn't be saying that though if these were good, right? You wouldn't be saying any game wasn't good. So Yeah, I mean I I definitely story should end But um the mc I guess I was like a You could you can like the mcu was something that you can always refresh with new stories and new characters The important part is making sure that like plot threads You know important plot beats wrap up or characters have their stories come to an end Rather than just sort of lurching forward forever with no clear direction or end point because um In a way stories, we're ending in the mcu still, uh, it's just that you know the story of the mcu as a whole We yeah, that's never gonna Unless it stops making money Um, yeah, because they'll never even want to draw that to an ending. I don't think but like, you know, there's still I think a It's it's a little like I'm fine with the eye the the deer and concept theoretically that we have it So the the endings you're looking for I was just going to be character journeys specifically because People have starts middles and ends but But you know that guy remember that guy over there. He's still going you want to go see what he's doing It's like, yeah, you can if you want you also can't if you don't want to I guess Yeah, I don't know. I just uh, it's it's interesting There's a whole angle to phase four and end game and how it all worked together In an alternate universe where everything was really well written And everyone's just excited and talking about how much they can't wait for them to do this that and the other And nobody's talking about how I wish it had ended at end game right Solutions to plot lines and character are expanding years all ending in a way that closed the book on these characters journeys are more broadly And arguably an end to a universe that had we through all these different works But nothing ever truly ends the mcu is the largest film franchise on the planet star was got decked in the fucking mouth By marvel a million times over It's hard to it. Let's legit pay attention. I'm gonna have to I'm gonna have to not look at the screen if I'm gonna pay attention to his words I mean, I'm able to I just The sound effects who also need to be mixed a bit lower as well. Yeah, I think that's right before uh Star Wars getting decked in the mouth by marvel. It's like um You wouldn't be saying that I think it's just that those the star wars was just like shit right out of the gate when it came back Well, yeah, I guess people don't Because Shows and shows and okay, it's just clawing its way back through doing marvel's strategy of phase four pretty much I did get a laugh out of this meme marvel bunching stars in the face But I wouldn't say marvel is quite in the high position that the meme is suggesting That's that's kind of I think where I was thinking I was like is it is it angling from like a box office viability sort of thing? And it's like well, I guess so but star wars have been too scared to release a movie now for a while It's not that it would guarantee fail It's that they really don't know what a safe project is anymore Meanwhile marvel are like if a Thor movie fails Well, you know, we can still try a black panther one, right? And it's like if that fails like well We got spider-man. Let's try him. He's like, oh spider-man's working fine. We'll just put out more spider-man That's sort of thing while star wars is like solo Yeah, but yeah, this is why it's like, uh, they decked star wars like I'd be in the same way that I guess marvel have decked everyone I guess you could say I don't know Everything's decking more like um, it's just you need to accept this formula. We've got Kind of I mean Since star wars is getting molded into marvel's formula. Yeah, it is The formula marvel have managed to transition successfully in terms of viability to the new Age of the streaming world all they had to do really was just spam fucking tv shows apparently Well, if they want that for star wars, you would think that they would put More like competent narrative development staff like on star wars like they I don't know that the eddie Eddie studio is ever going to invest in writing at this point. I don't know what the fuck's going on Instead of just like locking jj abram's in a fucking room with a whiteboard and then forcing 500 million dollars And being like go jj make us money Oh, it's been three years once you got for us. Uh, yeah You guys remember a new hope I like to do hope you guys you guys like to too, right? It's like let's make that Please tell me you liked it. What about new hope? But again, like actually we hate a new hope that movie sucked We don't want anything like that. You know Man Then we blow up Five planets. Ooh I can't believe how things have progressed though because we would have you know He would have taken a load of time to make a full script and redraft it with another writer That was a ripoff of new hope and we're all like boo for that and it's filled with like contradictions and stuff Um, if anyone doesn't know I got a couple videos about that, you know, they're like 10 minutes It's all right Um, you got so that's the reality But then you fast forward and now we're at the point where scripts aren't even being written before they Film like fuck it sort of thing I hate how much writer's disrespected as a uh report component. It sucks really annoying Really really annoying And it's like, why do our projects keep coming out like shit? It's like, oh, I don't know Just don't know in the fucking mouth by marvel a million times over every film gardening profit a passionate fan base in a practically Unlimited stream of newt. How did the tunnels and didn't black widow not go on a profit? Uh, I think it might not. Uh, well, it depends how you Wasn't they like in a we got it like officially though through the quarterly reports or whatever I remember that being a thing where it was like it was like proof that black widow did not make a profit That might be the case because I know that it's because the disney plus like release Yeah, the box office one. Yeah, she sued them. That was the whole thing Oh Wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no What's supposed to happen comes around like sorry about this. This was never supposed to oh my wallets on the floor Ah, dammit anyway. Uh, thank you so much for your contributions to the MCU. Please stop saying mean things about us. Okay Yeah, it was in theaters exclusively briefly, right? And then it went to streaming very quickly or was the one that did the premium release on Disney Plus? Like if you pay 20 bucks. Oh, so it was a 20 bucks. Was it simultaneous, like streaming in theaters? Yeah, yeah. Yeah, but it wasn't like, because the Suicide Squad was the cinnamon's and you could watch on HBO Max as part of your subscription. But if you were subscribed to Disney Plus, you had to pay to watch before. But still, but then they didn't do that. Everything else I think had like a 45 or 60 day like exclusive theatrical. Right. That was a yeah, and that was a bit of God complete with the Black Widow, because I think they thought they could float anything, especially after Captain Marvel. They managed to make that movie make a billion dollars. It's like, holy shit, you guys are just do anything. But a post phase re-ending, I guess. It's like, hmm. And I think MOM and Thor Love and Thunder, it's like, wait, shouldn't have made more than that. And it's like, yeah. Yeah, I guess I imagine that there probably was an expectation that Black Widow could have made a billion dollars and it didn't come close. Shang-Chi probably could have. I think the floor you would presume would have been Ant-Man and the Wasp, which made like 650 million. Then like that's as low as it gets. But I think Shang-Chi and Eternal was made like 400 million. For Shang-Chi, that was probably all right. For Eternal, that probably wasn't all right. No, they're making a sequel. So I guess it was good enough for them. Dude, they're making an actor. Yeah, that's true. Well, I guess it's because even if the films don't make money, if they're good for buffing up the streaming service, if that's like more of a reason to stay subscribed to Disney Plus, then it doesn't even need to make you lots of money through box office numbers. Do you remember that? I remember that Black Widow release now, because I remember seeing on like whatever it was, HBO, Disney, the price of it, like 20, 30, some $20. Yeah, I was like, fuck that. I'm supposed to pay that to watch it at home on my fucking phone or TV. And it's less like half that to go to the theater? Yeah. That's really weird. I think it's because they're crying to me. Well, they did that with Milan. With Milan was like $30. I do not fucking understand that. I think the pricing is because they know that families are going to watch it. And families, in terms of the money you'd make in the cinema, compared to one ticket, I think that's why they did it like that. That makes sense. Too bad. Well, lonely and sad. Yeah. Consider that. Lonely and sad. Still outrageous, though, I think. Like, no way. Oh, sure. I agree. It's outrageous they made that movie. Ha ha ha. Burning profit, a passionate fan base and a practically unlimited stream of new content. Oh, we're a passionate fan base. You can bet it. Yes, we are. We really need it. Money speaks louder than anything else. Disney had a streaming service to push. Actors use these sound effects to keep standing on. So the people. Yeah, it's such an interesting choice, isn't it? He's really making sure that those make it in. And some of them, I think, are a decent idea. Some of them less so. Some of them are like matching the clips like he's made sure to crank, like, for example, shooting the web there. But some of them are just like, huh? The little clanky drum things, whatever that was. But the new content. Money speaks louder than anything else. Disney had a streaming service to push. Actors utilize characters to keep expanding on. So the people who say the MCU should have ended after end game. I agree, but you're stupid. It should have ended after end game. I agree, but you're stupid. Well, it depends on how. Yeah, OK. I shouldn't have paused him to be honest. So the people who say the MCU should have ended after end game. I agree, but you're stupid. These movies make more money than any other film in the industry. And the MCU has more characters than the ones there. Yeah, OK. He's being a bit tongue and cheek there. Well, to defend the unwashed masses, whenever anyone says they should have ended at end game, what you can guarantee is they're not saying they should end it because it won't make money anymore. Yeah, I think that's. I don't think anybody has ever made that claim. So that was just kind of pointless. Right. Why would anyone know that Disney wants to make money? He's like, no, oh, I didn't know that. Wow. Whoa. I mean, they're usually saying it in response to the concept that it's made loads of money. Because it's usually about like it's doing really bad, but I guess it'll have to keep going because people are still watching it. Yeah. Women with the Fishers alongside Toa for Grace and Bullseye's baseball coach. The well has admittedly dried up for people like Captain America. He's had his story. His or. Oh, wow. OK, no, that's just because Chris Evans was done with the role. As someone who hasn't even read the comics, I'm pretty sure there's like a billion stories left to tell for all of these characters. The fact that Iron Man didn't even get to fight the Mandarin. You understand how much of a like, yeah, like, well, you know, there's stories that kind of came to their head. You worry. Oh, like that is like I said, I'm someone who hasn't even read the comics. And wow, that's wrong. There's there's plenty more you're allowed to do. For people like Captain America, he's had his story, his origin, his lows, his loss, his conflict. And at the end, his story comes full circle. Yeah. Boy, I I disagree. We did disgusting way, maybe. I story to come in full circle. No, no, I could see how it would have been seen that way by people including us, I think, at first. And then you're like, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, think about it. Perhaps ending is horrible in time to live a full life with his long lost love. Thus abandoning the present to deal with anymore. The man at a time went back in time. Don't worry about it. Yeah, no, I don't know. Just most people at this point agree. Cap would never have done this. Thought what is ending should have been. Definitely characters like Spider-Man and the Guardian still have stories to tell in places to go. I'm sorry. What defines whether or not someone has a story to tell in places to go? Yeah, that would have been my question as well. Seems a little bit out of character. Because now I guess you can't even say because they died anymore because there's going to be some magic bullshit that'll bring them back to life for some time. Travel shenanigans like Loki's story was finished. And look what they did to him. They resurrected his. Oh, yes. But maybe maybe I'm going a little bit weird with this because like I actually agree with you that in Loki's case, that story is done. And it's like, why is like, well, he's dead. So like this story is complete and it all lined up. Meanwhile, because someone could be like, you could have told more stories for Loki. It's like, no, you can't now. But like, oh, you know, Cap, his story didn't have to be over. Even when he's old, it doesn't have to be over. They have literally a fucking de-aging device in Endgame. An old man's crap is still something you can do stories with. This is the thing. I'm actually against old people, prejudice. When people are like, why would you want to tell a story when they're like fucking 80 or something? It's like, that would be interesting. But that's fine. Don't worry about it. Exactly. But to be like, you know, Guardians still have their stories left. It's like, well, what if, I don't know, what if Guardians 2, they all just went, you know what, we've done lots of good stuff. Let's retire now and chill out and play chess or something. Would you then be like, see this story's over? It's like, just because someone essentially told you, narratively speaking, that this story's over? They decided, yeah. It's really where they use Cap as an example of being old, but still having stories to tell. And then we remember that he was mysteriously absent in Falcon and the Winter Soldier for reasons that they legitimately never begin to explain or touch on. Plus another, I do love how much access we have to meta-reformation, including they're not limited to. They didn't tell us if we were allowed to have Cap or not. They didn't tell us if he was dead or not. They just said, don't like talk about it. Just like, oh, okay. He's really, really, really important to this story. We're talking about him like he's in the room, but we're whispering and we're not allowed to mention him. Like, like, how could you give us this restriction? This is insane. Or because they still rigged Chris Evans once per year, like, so, how's your career doing? Do you feel like maybe you want to come back and do a little Cap, a little bit of multi-versal Cap? How about that? You could be a Cap who's, like, shaved his whole head, or you could be, like, a Cap who's got a shield that's all purple or something. Yeah. Get it? Like, what if? What if? What if it was a purple shield? Come on. He's hung up the phone, like, two minutes ago. You're being kind of quiet. I guess that means you're really giving this some thought. That's good. We like that. We like that. I'll call you next week. He's busy making the gray man of which I've only seen people be negative about. I watched it and thought it was a gray man. Yeah, it's like an action movie. The Russo's made it, you know? Oh, I don't know. That doesn't mean anything. I don't mean that doesn't mean much of anything that consists of this boy. I don't know what it means. It's just like Spider-Man and the Guardians still have stories to tell and places to go. The MCU continuing life was inevitable and I wouldn't be so ignorant to say that it could never go forward and move past the story that was told prior to Endgame. But as of right now, the MCU has no story. No story? I mean, in the sense that there's no cohesive over-arching over-arching story. Yeah. It's because they made it that way, not because it needs to be that way. Right, because if... Take 411 Thunder, for example. If it was a film that started and ended with Gore being introduced and then Gore dying, but it was really, really good and we had loads of those in Phase 4 and someone said, there's no real overall story, though. I'd be like, that's okay. That's okay. As long as it respects... You can have essentially... The other things are happening. Like, there's no contradictions like that will-building-wise and it's a phase where there's lots of individual stories. That is absolutely fine. That's not what we've got, though. And yeah, them not having a plan about how anything fucking comes together is one of many problems right now. Yeah. This recent slate of films and TV shows making up Phase 4 has been a jumbled mess of ideas and storylines. The cinematic universe equivalent of a headless chicken running around without any clear sense of direction. Black Widow, Shang-Chi, WonderVision, Loki, What If, Falcon and the Winter Soldier, Eternal, Spider-Man No Way Home, Hawkeye, Moon Knight and Doctor Strange in the multiverse of Madness. Oral projects that are a part of this new direction that the Marvel Cinematic Universe has been following and I don't fuck with it. You don't fuck with it? You don't like it, that's what that means. Oh, okay. I'm inclined to agree. Let's see what you think, sir. Which is by no means a debatable statement or hot take. There seems to be a growing sentiment that Marvel's recent releases have been a downgrade. It was a hot take. It was exactly. I hate this. We know. I was there a thousand shows ago. It really isn't fair. Every fucking time, dude. We come out with the correct opinion in real time. We get shadowed all over for it and everyone's like, you fap, they just hate art and they can't let anybody. And then sure enough, everyone else, they start singing our tune and everyone loves them. Yeah, because it's like this growing sentiment that Phase 4 isn't very good. It's like, where were you? We were already saying that for like fucking ages. Like I told you, I think Loki was our point of saying like it's done. We were going. I think that was over. Like, yeah. The quality of the writing was never going to be like good. But they do this thing where they're like, oh, I loved it. But then I look back and I was like, mmm, actually. And then they look back at the whole thing like, mmm, actually. That does make sense. It was really good at the time. But now it's like they liked the trees, but they hated the forest. Like, yeah. What? How could you hate all the trees but like the forest? How does it even... Like things are only bad in retrospect once the entire phase is released. And it's like, well, why wasn't it bad then? It makes me think... Once they've already gotten your money. So, you know... What are you expecting? Like the next thing is going to come out and somehow redeem the earlier thing? I think it's that whole... Unfortunately, because humans are a little bit lizard-brained or maybe... I don't know what brain they go with on this one, but the whole, oh man, do I love a new thing coming out and we all love that. I don't even care what Wandavision is. I just love that, where we're all on forums and we're all talking about, oh, this is so good. And then make a little... Yeah, yeah. And once that's all gone for that project, all that's left is the project. It's like, so what do you think of that? 10 years later, you're like, what even was it? I don't know. Too busy thinking about Multiverse of Madness 12. Yeah, because it's the community. And everyone's going, ooh, so cool. Sam Raimian. Oh. So yeah, and then, you know, it dies out again and they look back like, ah, actually. Yeah, the fun seems to come from that hype culture almost. Yeah. From stuff that preceded it. Taking quality out of the equation, the interest for certain properties has definitely died down. Nobody is really talking about the MCU that much anymore. I don't... So that's just blatantly false. Obviously not true. I would go as far as saying it's the most talked about thing in the movie industry type stuff. Everyone's talking about everything that comes out. The only thing about it that's interesting is that they switch topics so quickly that you forget what was even discussed like yesterday. Yeah. I don't even know. It's so weird for him to be like so right and then just so wrong. It is weird now. People aren't feeling obligated to go see these movies and TV shows for a myriad of reasons. It feels nowadays that the MCU is running on fumes instead of the nuclear generator used to have go for it during its peak. You missed the opportunity for a nice little reference. For nuclear generator? Yeah. Why didn't you say arc reactor? Yeah. I think that. Yeah, I agree. I think that would have been neat. As for the whole... It seems like it's running on fumes. I guess I agree. I don't know. I think it's boasting Mario on the name Marvel Studios. That's really helping it. Yeah. If you would have white people's understanding and familiarity with Marvel and you just released a lot of these projects as their own things, they probably wouldn't make as much money. Do you say white people's? No. Wipe. Wipe. Remove their memories. Okay. I think the question is where the fumes are coming from and I would pin that on the writing. I think there's plenty still to mine characters. I was going to say I guess I agree. Why? Because would I agree at all if it were well written and maybe that's the problem with fumes? Because the fumes implies we've got no stories to tell much of anymore so we're just relying on I don't know... Running on fumes is when you're running on barely anything that's left or the remnants of something that used to be running on essentially. Which I would take to mean for the MCU if someone said the MCU's running on fumes I'd say it isn't good anymore it's just relying on everything that came before it in terms of its quality and setup it's not generating anything it doesn't have anything to run on. In that case you would agree with the sentiment then would you? Running on fumes from that sense What I was going to say I think my brain is heading more so toward running on fumes being that they had nothing of substance left to offer and they're just relying on references or like that would be the equivalent Meanwhile I think Phase 4 has like infinite shit to offer they're just really bad at executing all of it we've got plenty of characters left plenty of really interesting conflicts to go through tons of new stuff I agree yeah Because the idea is so bizarre again it's like I've suddenly started reading comics or something I'm just like the fucking wealth of potential they've got from their source material and this is what they have to show for it like oh well we've done Iron Man Cap and fucking Ant-Man so I guess it's over now How long have these characters and stories been going on in the comics like at least 50 years and then like the Marvel movies exist for what like 10 years at least and then it's like now we're done Spiderman recently celebrated the 60th anniversary it's like 60 years and nobody's done with Spiderman I understand the movies and comics are not the same thing and thus when a character gets a trilogy it's like well they're done they don't need to be done like Thor's got his fourth movie now and yeah you might call that running on fumes but that's again not the case Gore could have been really fucking cool He's looking fucking James Bond Running on fumes That's a great example and that's just one character that's all we can do and there's enough to even get from the MCU itself like you have this whole end game and the snap scenario and whatnot there's so much things you could tell like so many stories like things that happen like resource management I don't know there's so much things you can go off of Not every Bond movie is great I could see one person arguing that Octopus is running on fumes Bond always manages to bounce back you know because they find some new material oh we can do something with this we haven't explored this with this character yet let's go this route I mean Star Trek the original series of Star Trek they had six movies I think and then the crossover with Generations so there's plenty of movies you could make if you got a cast of characters people care about it man you can just keep pumping out movies you can do it as long as they're good no one will complain if they're all good no they really won't these videos would not be the same if they were just good even though the arguments would technically be unaltered for a couple of them at least a couple of the arguments Iron Man Guardians of the Galaxy 1 and 2 Thor Ragnarok the Winter Soldier and Civil War all helped to generate hype not just because they were great setups for future movies they were great combinations of years of continuity but because they were just generally great movies not generally not a great script either this is very they're great because they were great and they were great and they were great I can't speak for everyone we're not qualifying anything yet I don't feel like I got much there in terms of why that phase was good for me my interest in the MCU and its content is motivated now from a place of obligation like hey I can agree with them on that yeah oh well that's our life I can't wait for andor yay oh there's a new Marvel movie coming out I'll watch it so I'm not behind or missing out on a good 30 minutes of conversation with somebody which lets be real as kind of business as usual for these movies I'm not gonna say so he doesn't miss out with 30 minutes of conversation with someone I guess the reasons you watch it are the thing is the following comment implies that he had a visual from Iron Man was that Iron Man 1 or 2 when he picks up the partial shield because the implication there is like well that's how it's always been I suppose and it's like I don't know man I think some of these movies used to last a lot longer in the cultural side Iron Man is talked about to this day as a fucking fantastic foundational movie for the MCU like do you really think that's gonna happen for Shang-Chi he's like no people already forget that existed no way people can remember the plotline I'm saying it I'd put money on it your average big fan of Shang-Chi would be like what was the plotline what was the plotline fucking chaos is what it was give it a few weeks no one will remember what the fuck happened in Love and Thunder I think we're there already but I agree you hear an act like me watching 4-2 where Iron Man and the Wasp was motivated by anything other than obligation you've picked the two most forgettable ones in the past set for MCU we're in a new era of forgetting what the fuck happened because people have low passion the plotlines are confusing and weird and the movies themselves are just fucking crap so it's hard to remember anything anyway but I don't disagree that these these two were very forgettable me thinking that it was gonna be important for the wider story of this universe and that's just it Marvel has no plan anymore it has no direction its story concluded and its grand finale came to an end game to the end game well so the funny thing is we've just found out that it does have a direction that is going it's just you know like the multiverse stuff but like stubbornly forwards yeah like how do I put it like it's like it's there in all of the superficial ways a plan can be there it's like what doesn't matter who cares if they have a plan if it's all just this poorly executed right kind of yeah the difference between no plan and a horrifically executed plan can sometimes be just you might not even recognize them I mean for instance right the DCEU up to Justice League had a plan and I went home and I didn't go home yeah because he planned out Justice League 2 and 3 right and it's weird because if you would have came to me and said yeah Zack Snyder was making him up one by one as he went I'd be like yeah I believe you yeah of course it must have been that way then the fake concept of trying to build on top of these characters we've come to know and love on using the same old bag of sorry did you say fake concept or did I miss hear that plan anymore it has no direction its story concluded and its grand finale came to an end with no end game to the end game other than the fake concept of trying to build on top of these characters we've come to know and love faint the faint concept okay meaning it's like weak or weak yeah that's what I would say well I mean it's weird to pick this one specifically because the story is about how does he deal with the events of end game like it doesn't really add end game like you can't really take the film off it anywhere else kind of needs to be after end game and then I'm thinking like what else is there and it's like well you know Bucky dealing with shit after like I don't like Falcon the Soldier but there's lots of potential there I wouldn't call it a faint character but you know it's like this stuff plenty of people but it insists on using the same old bag of tricks it's been using since it first dipped its tone of the idea of an expanded symbiotic cinematic universe but you said it was like a powerhouse back in the day that's so the issue now is that it's too much like it was before or that it's trying to be what it was before maybe this isn't the point that he's making but I would agree that like you think about the whole you know post-credits scenes back in phase one it's like that's kind of exciting because at the time it was such a novel concept of oh you're gonna like lead into that film oh that's gonna connect to that one like that's really cool whereas now when it happens it's not really like what is it other than I guess just trying to fuel speculation and hype for like the potential of a character interacting with another character when that as like a gimmick is kind of diminished I think that's what he's trying to say okay I'll roll him back leaning into the hmm it's the first dipped its tone of the idea of an expanded symbiotic cinematic universe those being to stay in the box to keep the stories generic short and simple not take risks and to use each project as an okay now I'm baffled because he fucking he said like the first set of movies did he say Iron Man was like amazing or whatever or maybe say like he said he said he described it like a nuclear fucking generator I thought it well I mean I remember him saying that the films were generally great remember now it's like that was a pretty yeah that was pretty scathing right there I was like the formula was that they're simplistic and because probably the formula is you want to make films that can be watched on their own without the other films but you want enough to make people want to go watch the other films yeah that's the formula yeah that is the formula I think he was talking about like the hype and storytelling engine that powered the first three phases you know not that it's good I'm not sure alright well I'm not sure he thinks let's see if he elucidates being to stay in the box to keep the stories generic short and simple not take risks and to use each project as an advertiser because I think Guardians was a risk I like to I like to think of that as Marvel risks go to the Avengers is a risk it really is like it was at first if you could pin the riskiest decision they've ever made one of the might be fucking Agatha stupid fucking risk I would say but yeah but yeah we all remember a lot of these are risks but I think a lot like the whole the low key stuff and all these things these are huge risks by doing this stuff but I think just now people don't care if stuff is necessarily risky or they don't understand what a storytelling risk necessarily might be oh I just say that the projects aren't risky anymore because Marvel Studios is a name attached to it ensures that it floats everything but back in the day there was no like recognition in Marvel Studios I like Iron Man was a risk Avengers was a risk we look back and see how much money it made but that wasn't like a guaranteed thing really yeah Iron Man saved the studio right Blade saved the studio Iron Man was the first one Iron Man was the first one that Marvel Studios financed I believe because that was like the first one that they did as opposed to like you know licensing it out to Fox or Sony didn't they need it to be successful that wasn't something they could just oh yeah they spent a lot of money they spent a lot of money on that film yeah like if it failed that would have been really bad for them I wouldn't say Avengers is as much of a risk as like the likes of Guardians of the Galaxy because they're putting all these characters together and I think it's fairly safe to say that people are going to show up to watch that like Iron Man and Thor and whoever in the same movie it's like wow I've got to see this Guardians I think is kind of a nutball decision and I remember just being like what tree raccoon what and it's like yep yeah I agree that was a risk I remember when the trailer came out for the first movie and I was just like what is this and a lot of I think a lot of other people were saying the same thing like what where did this come from I remember what I got announced I was like Guardians of the okay like yeah sure I guess and then it was bad that I had Ultron it was like oh yeah the trailer itself was very odd and like the music it was using well that hooked on a feeling track it just stood out distinctly from all the other stuff what I think was so impressive too was that they kind of speed ran what was achieved in Avengers they brought in a whole like we got individuals and then we brought them as a team in one movie it was like nice good job yeah right all brand new characters well for I mean for the films yeah not take risks and to use each project and advertisement for the next even though my tone may sound negative and that's because well it is for the most part I don't think Marvel Studios was making a wrong decision in taking this direction early in its life okay fair enough that was just processing that I needed to pause okay it's fast many franchises have come and gone due to doing too much too fast but Marvel had an advantage over the rest of them in having a grand architect to steer the ship in the right direction and make sure that everything was up to code what's interesting about that is Marvel did do something too fast still I think if they knew they were going to be successful we could have planned out like a shit ton oh yeah as we've already said like Iron Man 1, 2, 3 that was done real quick and we've we're pretty much just done with Iron Man entirely like Iron Heart will eventually pop in but Tony Stark is just like yeah man there's a metric ton of stories I just don't get told now and even if you were to argue it was like yeah well we don't have Robert Downey Jr forever it's like yeah but you can still make plans to try and make use of the best stories and the most detailed ones as opposed to just being like because if I remember correctly it was just Shane Black's ideas of what Iron Man 3 was it wasn't that Kevin Vaggy was like oh we need to make sure we hit the you know the Iron Monger the Whiplash and the Extremis storylines like no that's just like you just ended up it's almost like fucking roulette wheel at that point I think that they get a lot more credit than they probably should for the planning it feels like bare bones planning even in phase 1, 2 and 3 it just kind of worked out yeah I'd say so yeah it's like calling him a grand architect I'm just like come on I don't remember Kevin Vaggy knew that having a strategy and taking it slow is what would pay dividends in the long term but the thing is if all of Snyder's works were good that would have been fine like if they were good a grand hypothetical but people would have been down for it I think Guardians proved it we could have had the team up movie the fucking first it could have been Justice League is the one that starts it all off you just get the three characters you know the first act we get all three of them doing their thing and then they team up and beat some bad guy if it's all really well executed people be like alright I want to see what it's like Guardians was, Guardians is the proof that the thing is if the thing's good and if all the characters are well written you don't necessarily have to give them a whole bunch of time if you come up with a plot that has them all interacting and bonding yeah but you know at least with this it's like if three of our dominoes fall out of our five at least we still have two you know yeah hedging bets sort of thing so the idea was formed that sets of movies would be organized into phases highlighting a specific arc and purpose to the overall story they were telling phase one was Iron Man the Hulk Iron Man 2, 4, Captain America and the Avengers with the overall goal and story arc being to create the building blocks for an interconnected cinematic universe phase two featured Iron Man 3, Thor the Dark World Guardians of the Galaxy, Ant-Man the Winter Soldier and Age of Ultron with the primary idea being to build the pond building blocks that were established in phase one placing a large focus on the world building establishing its politics I guess you could say they did that. You could say that it does those things I guess I'm sorry having the president show up doesn't mean you've established like a world building in politics that's not at all what that means the sycovia accords told us they are not ready to deal with the politics fucking Falcon and Winter Soldier Jesus Christ I've told this story before but like I remember phase two I was I was down on the MCU I was like fuck the world building is so bad at this point like these films just don't care that they exist how fucking wrong I was in terms of thinking that was like a low point for world building you know the days of Thor the Dark World yes but tell me like oh you know they were focusing on that and this is like no they would hey you make the movie hey you make the movie luckily we're early enough in a timeline that you guys can literally make your own movies and you don't contradict each other we're past that at this point we're very very far these would have looked like these days seen past and expanding the MCU's scope towards the weird cosmic side of the universe also your mileage may vary because this was a separate division for Marvel Studios but around this time you got to see the rollout of Marvel TV within this universe daredevil jessica jones agents of shield and agent carter all coming out to make the universe broader and fill in the gaps the movies didn't have time for but the gaps the movies didn't have time for that was definitely telling its own story but i guess he might be talking about the other ones i feel like all of them would probably argue they're telling their own shit they might have like fun bits do you remember because there was that um this was the last episode of jessica jones i watched it was when he's like fighting the couple who are superhero serial killers or whatever um and they talked about the chitari the green guy yeah and yeah like like the idea that you'd call that filling the gaps when it's more so just being like ooh i know that because i watched the avengers movie that's all that felt like to me we'll get into that agents of shield as people are saying that's probably the fair argument to make for that show i could see that show definitely being like we all fill in the gaps for the parts in between and stuff more detail later down the road phase 3 was when they got experimental dr strange guardians of the galaxy volume 2 civil war spider-man homecoming thor ragnarok black panther infinity war and endgame this is when they got comfortable playing around wait didn't he he just missed after marvel how dare you another film everybody you gotta you gotta assume he missed those two because he legit forgot i don't even know i think so though and with this universe prior to this point a big meme was that all this ended the world shit was going down but despite referencing the events of previous movies and other characters rarely would you see an actual crossover outside of the big team ups like the avengers but in phase 3 you had all these different characters crossing over talking to each other yeah so i actually agree phase 3 i started to feel like okay we are now behaving as though we were in having dr strange turn up when he's like who the fuck you and loki are fucking around what are you doing i remember being like oh that's great good thank you same for uh you know civil war be like it's a captive american movie but it has every what it is like oh okay this is better fighting each other some new players were established dr strange could show up in thor for two minutes iron man spider man could share the screen and it would all feel natural and not alienating the universe was even more fleshed out as it started to shed its more grounded foundations for more out there in comic booky sensibilities thor went to space dr strange dealt with wizards and other dimensions the cosmic side of the universe was better explored i think i agree with all this phase three felt like yeah i do expanding being being kind of neat looking back already now i'm like phase three is probably my favorite i guess um i have a risk that's the phase one though i think that's the phase where it felt most like the comic books yeah where like they're they're being put out with this level of confidence where you know you you see other characters from other worlds coming in to contribute something like i think that's what you i think that's what they were really aiming for the whole time is like how can we do this comic book thing but do it in the theater right and yeah i think snow yeah civil war like the fact that it had all of these characters who were relevant in like showing up when you think with a movie like this it's like no you can't get all these people in and then have all of their story yeah like it's it's when the universe felt most interconnected yeah and you start to see a slight variation in styles between projects before phase three marvel was very wait what i thought he was talking about phase three why do you show wind a soldier i think it might have just been a visual that wasn't really wisely placed in the timeline perhaps fair enough Thor went to space Doctor strange dealt with wizards and other dimensions the cosmic side of the universe was better explored and you start to see a slight variation in styles between projects before phase three marvel was very committed to making everything feel homogeneous with one another okay every movie looked the same tones never really varied and was a massive point of criticism that was mostly unaddressed by marvel during that time which makes it sound like they fixed it later but i'd be a liar if i said phase three okay i'm getting lost because i'm seeing clips from phase four a lot and it just makes me not talk about specifically just to clarify he's saying that phase one and two had of being too homogenous phase three broadened it and let creators do more with their own styles right that's that's what he said yeah okay i think so first because i was curious if he meant phase one two and three were two homogenous and phase four is expanding but i'm pretty sure he said three i think was whatever point he's making at the moment he'll he'll grab an image from anything okay it doesn't matter feels a little bit yeah fast and loose with the relevance of the visuals and a lot of senses i use them as um as guiding hand sometimes and maybe that's a mistake i'd driven or that each movie was distinct because no they weren't they reach very obviously marvel movies mostly directed by people hired to get the job done and collect their paycheck but some color got injected into them they weren't all gray and boring looking colors popped locations varied and some directors were say cuz i can't remember off the top of my head i'm honestly lost on what eras we're comparing exactly is he saying because he was like oh it's still kind of boring because people are all like hired gun directors but it was still colorful and it popped and stuff so i'm just like uh i know the guy who directed guardians of the galaxy was a hired gun director uh which is we got jokes this episode funny too because he's probably the like the one that you'd say like well phase two yeah ironically as it is yeah phase two had him in it and he was phase two is not all homogenous but uh i'm just gonna let it play because i'm a i'm a little lost on exactly what he's saying but i'm pretty sure i agree forwarded the opportunity to incorporate more style guardians of the galaxy volume two feels like a james gun movie likewise thor agnirok felt like a taekwititi movie and injected new life into one of the most boring and one note of the mcu's main cast oh boy how that statement has aged we need to stop doing that we need to stop saying that now i'm just saying after recent event this film this video probably was made before he saw Thor love and thunder so it's just like uh how bad we must feel now i deviated quite a way what's funny as well as i've come to appreciate older Thor a lot more over time um i used to kind of think he was stale but uh after all of the childishness it's kind of like i don't know man i guess i kind of like that he's he's the one in the team is pretty stalwart and uh you know civil and respectful with a little twinge of comedy that was nice when it came up yeah i agree i thought the first Thor was pretty dull but i think as i understand that actor uh chris hemsworth injected a lot of his own kind of wit into the role as the movies went along and they just brought a lot more humor into that character that i think was much needed and then they cranked that was a good decision cranked it too far okay that does seem to i haven't seen love and thunder yet but that does seem don't do it yeah they just don't do it run scare yourself well i'm actually i was quite interested because i wanted to see christian bail doing that role as gore like i'm kind of fascinated by that i'm curious how christian did that like he performed that i was going to make a joke about how he plays multiple characters and i realized you wouldn't get it so i just because because you'd be like huh so i'm gonna try but there you go now i've technically made the joke by describing what the joke would have been wait i didn't end up a good joke mauler i'm glad you made it yeah i didn't end up going because i asked my friend like hey you want to go see thor and he's like thor is his favorite character and even he was just like oh no that's i won't i won't go then whatever whatever felt like a taika watiti movie and injected new life into one of the most boring and one note of the mcu's main cast i don't even fit to see one i'm just gonna let it go whatever just move on i deviated quite a way away from talking about marvel's phases there so to briefly circle back around phase 3's main focus was to combine most of the elements they had learned throughout their tenure multi-movie spanning storytelling more comfort in playing with the universe and tying everything altogether for their finale now i'm not aware of the inner intricacies of marvel studios and the comings and goings of their operation but if i were to hazard a guess post finale they were consulting the sacred chart and working their way through that a dozen ah calm down these edit yeah it's legitimately difficult for me to the noise that i don't know it's weird because i'm like a big gamer and everything and my my gamer brain is having difficulty focusing i don't know where to dodge to the shame because he's clearly putting a lot of work and so he's working too hard but yeah so much effort is going into something that's ultimately harming his video i just yeah because like what he's talking about i want to listen to it but let's say it's such intense visuals sounds like ah things and goings of their operation but if i were to hazard a guess post finale they were consulting the sacred chart and working their way through about a dozen chickens because phase 4 currently has no other way through a dozen chickens before the hatch author is referencing his headless chicken thing or it could be that yeah because you mentioned the headless chicken earlier i think they both work incidentally like they marvel thought they had a they they were counting their chickens or they hatched they're counting their characters before they paid off um there you go there's something to discuss it was fun things and goings of their by the way i still am not a hundred cent clear on what he says in the sequence i need to focus on what he's saying keep failing to do that operation but if i were to hazard a guess post finale they were asking the sacred chart and working their way through about a dozen chickens because phase 4 currently has no overarching goal or major storyline to build towards the closest thing you can point to is this whole multiverse thing the idea that there is an infinite amount of universes all running parallel to the one we see you've all seen spider verse you get the idea but the 11 entries and that was good and i i not to cut him off before he gets there theoretically but i wouldn't i wouldn't want to be assuming here that it's a bad phase because they don't have an overall goal of where they're going because i'm starting to think maybe i should push back on the whole thing is it really that impressive that when they were making phase 3 they were like Thanos is going to attack at some point um probably when we have enough films out that we feel like it about works when it matches a couple of contracts drying up it's not like it was this it was laddered up perfectly with all these other movies it's just sort of like well you remember that Ragnarok ends it's just like Thanos is attacking now it's like oh shit well there we go i guess he had attacked sometime so and if anything i remember you know like civil war ends and then Thanos attacks it's like man that's probably not the best time we had plenty of stories to tell but now we just don't what was it like when you had two avengers teams running at the same time one of them was a vigilante teams like you won't find out you don't get to know yeah that's all we found out in the black video what do you mean and there was no secret avengers like that's the story that's not yeah and then probably won't and so if someone said like oh it's so good how they meticulously planned to compete a phase 4 it's like they didn't really they just drop Thanos on the fucking worlds at some point in this they're gonna drop a big multi-versal plot line at some point the problem is really not that we're going somewhere in particular um it's it's that the individual components are all fucking garbage like did we all think that phase 2 was adding up to age of Ultron it's like no nobody thought that in only three of them actually explored that concept the spider-man, doctor strange and Loki almost had nothing to do with each other except that they all share a vaguely similar story concept I guess again I just want to repeat that that's fine you could have done it that way and it could have been good that would have been okay the fact that they have all three of them explore different elements of how the multi-verse works could have been a thing that works and then you combine them all into a big ensemble thing at the end that's a way to do it so you could argue that because Loki broke open the multi-verse that's the catalyst for the green goblin and Eddie Brock breaking through into the main universe but there's no TVA and no mention of reference to the events of that series and the how or the why all of this is happening yeah because they weren't made with people that care about each other me even still though even still you could probably have had all three of those projects be excellent and have barely any references to each other that's probably possible it's just the I keep trying to allude to the fact that it's rotten at the core as opposed to any like oh you see their problem was they didn't bind the multi-versal storyline together like it's not really I don't think that would have saved it when no way home ended and after Eddie Brock pissed off left his goop and Morbius met up with a vulture the post-credits scene showed a trailer for Doctor Strange and the multi-verse of madness which makes it look like the events of that movie would follow on from no way home that Doctor Strange cracking open the multi-verse to allow the Sinister Six and two other Spider-Man do you remember when we thought that it was that Wanda was gonna say you fucked up with Spider-Man and you seem to get away with it but I you know blah blah I thought that's what she was gonna be referencing but it wasn't It was as dumb as it ended up being Resulted in the multi-verse crashing in on itself adding more weight to the finale of Loki and what Kang said would happen but then I actually watched the movie and aside from exactly one exchange the plot of no way home is absolutely no bearing on the story of Doctor Strange it just ended up being correct and isn't the matter information that makes this interesting that they were gonna be released in reverse order at one point yeah I really go okay I don't know that which is interesting to think about because we imagine like from our perspective where instead of us coming off the relative high of no way home and then getting into multi-verse of madness we have the depths of despair that multi-verse of madness is and then we're like oh no way home actually was there was some good shit in there yeah that would have been weird that would have been about how Strange is lonely and the whole multi-verse angle is an incredibly minor part of its actual story and I have no problem with these films being isolated in fact I welcome it Oh part of why DC is doing so well right now is because they're more focused part of why DC is doing so well right now DC is not doing so well right now I wouldn't say DC is doing so well right now I mean they literally just like wipe their slate clean it was so bad yeah well I think they're certainly doing better now like since Justice League like with the Batman and I don't know if we're doing this in the context of discussing like the overall sort of health of the universe and IPs like this is this is why referencing the Batman or Joker is like a fool's errand is like why would you even bring them up they're not even yes they are DC IPs but they got nothing to do with rescuing your drowning franchise like in regard to the universe that they're trying to build they're not a part of the DCEU at least they haven't been integrated as far as I know and they don't have plans to do that either as far as I know I think you get the Reeves universe you'll probably get something like that you'll get a Batman one two and three and then they get an Penguin TV show so that's just going to be its own thing it's got nothing to do with DCEU as far as I know and to say that to say that that is why DC doing like Marvel is still doing better than that but I don't know like I agree with that DC is really envious of Marvel's success absolutely Marvel have found a way to fail and continue DC fail and then they have to scrap like a 10 project whatever they were doing they failed that hey Gary we're looking at someone tell us why phase 4 is bad it's been interesting so far we're not learning as much as we might have been able to but it's a journey yeah the reason they call it the extended universe other than just trying to differentiate itself from Marvel I think that's the only reason that's cool we're the extended universe not that pussy ordinary universe that Marvel did that ordinary universe is so shit and ordinary or special I think this is I don't think he would have made this section this way if he had known about what happens probably a week after he made this video part of why DC is doing so well right now is because they're more focused on standalone projects instead of being overly ambitious and setting up future projects and having their cinematic universes remain connected no they do want to set up all of this shit with the cinematic but it's just been fucking gutted by we've got two insane actors that have fucked everything up for them oh yeah this is hilarious why would you think of like because the Batman Joker did well we had peacemakers a TV show they're not focusing on the ensemble shit it's like no they want to get this shit out they want to make more of this but they keep getting fucked over you almost feel bad for I kind of do like I don't feel bad for Marvel at all but I kind of feel bad for DC a little bit with the actor part of it yeah like yeah they hired some psychos how could you have known because if everything had gone better they would have been pumping this shit out we would have seen it by now it is not a crazy to imagine alternate reality where the MCU is struggling and the DCEU is leading the charge I really wish in these ensemble movies they would stop doing these line-up of heroes shots understand that they're trying to reference the imagery of the cartoons and the comics I hate when I see this why do you feel so strongly what is it about the line-up that you don't like because I don't mind the line-up at all I think it can be kind of neat it feels too staged like the blocking of it it's like they're orienting themselves for the camera frame and it's just like it's not really natural like people don't really do that they're not just incidentally sort of in the frame together it's like we're leaving the ship now everyone form a line yes Batman, have you got the smokebush aid active? it's very dramatic in this one isn't it it's super dramatic lighting I understand the comic book appeal of it so maybe I'm not picking just realized by the way, didn't Thor 11 Thunder and MOM and certainly Spider-Man make more than the Batman Thor hasn't made more money than the Batman but multi-person man this did and Spider-Man made more than the Batman did we're clearly not going by box office are we going by critical acclaim? yes we are because money-wise I find that fascinating because on one hand then you'll be like yes you got the Joker or Joker and the Batman for DC but then on the other they've literally just stopped a complete movie from coming out and their sighted reason is that it's too awful to release yeah maybe like still just thinking about this is insane yeah we'll be stunned but man this fucking garbage dude I'm just gonna write it off it's like damn but I guess he would argue like well all of Phase 4 is awful I assume that's the argument he's going to make at this point I don't know if he likes any of it they're creating a lot of different projects for different characters with radically different tones which is what Marvel should be doing right now that to me isn't at all the way that we fix Marvel they just need to make sure they grasp different tones as far as I'm concerned they probably are doing that yeah I mean you could have movies with multiple different tones and be bad I mean I would certainly it's weird because do you want to have your universe with a wide variety of tones especially in terms of if you're going to market it do you want to have it they're all sort of the same play it safe almost like a fast food franchise not necessarily in a bad way but you know what you're sort of getting when you go there and it's reliable well something that we've talked about is how how everybody wants to write their own story and doesn't give a shit it's kind of like the worst of both worlds there's no interest in any continuity from a writing standpoint but visually and you know in terms of like tone a lot of the films are chasing the exact same vibe it's like the worst whereas what you would want is that everybody is considerate of how their story slots in but they're pushing the boundaries of what they can do with the medium visually in terms of music yeah and tone as well like that would be ideal how different would be important right because what rags are saying is like yeah I think that's what they've been doing in phase one two and three and four to be honest with you but you don't want them doing literally like completely different things that you make you think of even in the same universe because it's interesting that he's like that's their problem they need to be having different tones when it's like well I mean the unified homogenous thing is literally what jump started and made successful made into the juggernaut it is today so arguably shouldn't they continue doing that maybe the problem isn't that it's the other part the script part I think it's the script part I agree even though some films and shows have some pizzazz now they didn't used to have the writing of each of these is still so samey there's no risk oh okay there you go so I guess he agrees with us oh yeah Marvel should be doing right now but even though some films and shows have some pizzazz now they didn't used to have the writing of each of these is still so samey there's no risk and no variation okay well he doesn't really agree that's not our problem that they say me it's that they're awful yeah yeah if they were all somewhat similar but well I guess okay but they're all awful right so I guess in that sense it's samey yeah I don't think that's what he means no I know because it was in the context of like the homogeneity thing which we call it sludge right but because what we refer to in that does include that there's like a similarity in how bad everything is there's like clear mandates coming in from things but at the same time it's like they are it's not quite that they are the same that is the problem in the manner in which they are the same in ways that aren't surface level say what you will about the netflix mcu shows and their fluctuation oh we will at the very least they all felt different Luke Cage was a show focused on black American issues and incorporated that into its style and writing Jessica Jones was a light noir detective show and Daredevil was an action crime drama each one has very I like how he didn't mention iron fist was that one too bad it didn't make the cut I guess coming out now iron fists probably not the worst this is the way he just did that description wise have you seen the meme where someone has on the left it's like a bunch of Marvel movies on the right it'll have like loads of some of the a lot of the best movies ever from one like director and it'll describe the Marvel movies and it'll be like again action thriller thing action thriller thing action they're all the same that's the idea with the director they'll be like it'll be named you know with much more specific genre subgenre titles and it'll the implication being of course the you know one of them makes art the other one is just making sludge pipe stuff and then someone flipped the meme where they were like winter soldier a you know noir style having to know what words I'm trying to come up with I used to know this what do people consider with the soldiers like espionage right espionage usually whatever that kind of approach to naming all of them even doctor strange I think it was in there and it was given like this much more complicated and then it would show yeah political thriller is a lot of what people say with the soldiers as well but then they would show the genre talk is what happens when you talk about kind of like genres and styles it can be as tough to say what a thing really is on the other side they then had like casino godfather good fellas and a bunch of them and they were just like generic gangster mob movie generic gangster mob movie like as if to imply you can do this with everything that move that that meme got fucking hated people were like outraged that they would even try and make it when I was just like oh I thought you was just making a commentary on how genre works I don't know yeah you can be a and that's what I feel is happening here he's like you know these shows were so different because and then like plucks I don't know elements when I think you could do that with all the phase four shit doing moon night you could be like it's like an Indiana Jones type adventure through Egypt and discovering through multiple personalities and like these like oh that sounds so yeah world-ending threat and save yeah yeah that that and then it's like what is Falcon and Winter Soldier's like oh well that that is a political thriller once again a globe trotting and it's like see those two are completely different so I don't know I feel like you're being very nice to these Netflix shows that outside of Daredevil is shit on a decent amount by a lot of people I guess I'll give a pass to Jessica Jones people like that a lot too but uh yeah Luke Cage and Iron Fist were both shit on a lot the one of the points that this guy makes that I'm really inclined to agree with is that Disney at some point became far too obsessed with the interconnectedness of everything and like the broad multi-year plan rather than focusing on films individually and making sure they're like integral and the stories are working and the characters are working like Scorsese at least I think that the director did as much blame for that as the as Disney does I feel like I could argue the opposite Phase 4 is all these people are making their own shit and they don't care about how they fit in with anything else but they're also really bad at their jobs like that's just sure fair enough um but I was just thinking like if Scorsese had like Scorsese con where he was like on a stage and he was like showing his 10 year plan for all his movies like Casino and Goodfellas are up there and Wolf of Wall Street and it's like this is gonna come after this and this is gonna be a cliffhanger that feeds into this thing and it's like Scorsese doesn't do that I mean what I like about him is like you can argue like a lot of his films are similar in that they're all like crime kind of gangster themed but he at least takes on projects one at a time and he makes sure the script is good and it's working and he casts carefully I think and it's like releases one film at a time, polishes it and it's like there that's good moving on to the next project and then and only then will he do that you know and Disney is sort of obsessed with just like what's good what's our what's our plan and not focusing so much individually on on each film that that I think is I agree with they definitely something about and I don't think they care like the lack of plan and lack of cohesion and lack of care that they even recognize that each other exists is definitely there but I just I don't know that that I don't even know that would be that much of a problem if the films themselves were individually very very good we would be pointing out it's like wait but this doesn't make sense with this in the other movie but most people wouldn't give a fuck at all they should be like whatever sure I mean if they did that broad plan thing and the films were good I agree I would have no problem with that well then we'd be golden but they are they are so they are so fixated on the interconnectedness and the broad scheme of everything that they are neglecting the quality of the individual films so they're they're far on one side of it they just take all the random people they can find to write their stuff or direct their stuff there were like multiple things where people got like lead of these production they're like one writing I'm missing the word here one writing a fuck I'm missing a word help me out help I don't know what it is if they've only written one thing they had only one writing thing on their resume yeah like an inexperienced director yeah yeah yeah so it's just directors that have like one writing credit that's the one that's what I was looking for like one writing credit or direction credit or whatever and they were trying to say multi-million projects they have to lead and stuff I thought you were trying to say a person with one thing having done is a person who is I was just like I was just brain melt but then again even if they give it to people that have more writing credit I mean look at fucking Thor Love and Thunder we had kind of higher hopes for that movie to be at least decent with character stuff but that fucking shit the bad I didn't want to forget but once upon a time we were like that'll be a good one there was like the one that was like even if the story is going to be I think the characters and funnies would be good but god damn how wrong I was I tend not to look at the amount of previous writing work to determine if somebody's script is going to be good because I think I've seen writers come out the gate with their first feature and it's like well it's not a guarantee but it's surely indicative you can use it as like a predictive point to some degree of like what might you might expect from that person I'm gonna watch everything Mike Flanagan writes pretty much because I have confidence in his work but that would change if he made like five bad things in a row I'd just be like alright I'm fine yeah right based on some writing sensibilities and sure some suck but others are okay to incredible pieces of television that stand on their own I can't say the same for any of the shows that were officially produced and overseen by Marvel Studios with the exception of Moon Knight each show seems more committed to being an advertisement for future projects I don't know if that's fair to the other shows actually it would be almost even I feel like that's sort of what they begin as anyway the idea that Moon Knight stands out on all the TV shows is one that wasn't looking to advertise for something else like if so if you're gonna say one division clearly advertising for Multiverse of Madness how come into soldier advertising for Captain America for Loki advertising for Loki season 2 I don't know but I don't know if that's fair I'd just be like isn't Moon Knight advertising for whatever Moon Knight ends up in next they all have their own stories to tell they're just really badly done I definitely prefer it if there's like a justifiable reason for like a character from another like not timeline but like like all these different characters have their own branches and like say in No Way Home where you have Daredevil show up to be Peter Parker's lawyer that makes a lot of sense because he like needs a lawyer in that situation and it's like why not have Daredevil come in but then in other cases if you just shove in a character for like no reason and it's just cheap in the sense that it's just for like this guy is saying advertising the next thing I'm not a fan of that People are saying Loki advertise for Kang being Kang Dynasty but the thing is Loki season 2 is coming out before that so I'm just trying to think of what would Loki be the thing that's what does that season push you into and so I guess it's season 2 for now that'll push you into the Avengers movie probably with brief flourishes and minor trippy visuals to allude to having more style than they actually have when WandaVision was coming out people were interested in how the show would function as a metaphor and exploration of grief the sitcom set up at the show works as an expression of nostalgia for a life you no longer have and the loved ones you no longer get to spend time with as well as the desire to cling on to a potential future you cannot obtain due to their loss if the show scaled back their ambition and focused purely on its characters and their journey it would have been a much stronger show I agree with this totally but you also need to I totally agree that's the focus that is correct but also just talent you need you still need them to be able to write it which I'm not sure that they could have but yep they went nuts by the end they made it a crazy nonsense thing it's just episode of that show it's just like incomprehensible stupid nonsense it's madness it wasn't lasers it was magic no it was lasers I'm talking about the visions oh the visions were lasers it's hard to keep it all straight just make it a short small scale story set in this world about an otherwise disposable character I guess are they all disposable I don't know what we ended up getting was a show that convoluted itself with evil government groups witches and setting up future projects remember that really weird moment in the last episode when the scroll from Captain Marvel showed up to set up the marvels coming out in 2024 fuck yeah that did happen I don't remember that I legitimately do not remember that yeah uh Rambo she just goes and talks to a scroll it's like wait what it's for a movie later on it's like okay yeah oh man that's so true yeah he's uh oof well yep free or when Wanda had her peaceful little college in the forest with her astral form menacingly studying the necronomicon that was as clear as day a thing of like this is gonna keep going somewhere else you'll be excited I swear it won't be cringe set up Dr. Strange in the multiverse of madness releasing in May of 2022 Loki and the Falcon show had the same issue where both felt like ads for the next few films filling in the blanks that would otherwise go unexplored see I don't know that I I wouldn't give them more credit they had their own stories they were just really bad yeah they were definitely trying they were very I'd say they're very proud of the their stories are trying it's kind of like the um it's like the Kenobi show and everything like that like they're very proud of these horrifically crap stories that they want to tell because like I'm not going to deny all of it is like an ad for the next thing we've been saying that for ages the whole like get ready for next thing and stuff but it's like but they all still do like have a start middle end thing going on just oftentimes it's like really really bad very bad yeah Loki opened up the multiverse since up a new villain in Kang who will be returning an Ant-Man the Wasp, Quantum Mania coming 2023 and the other one transition Falcon into Captain America and set up a bunch of other eventual characters movies and storylines that will be expanded upon in later MCU ventures okay but couldn't I make this argument for literally all of the MCU at this point though like that was phase one two and three as well be like Iron Man set up fucking Iron War Machine you know like it's like an ad for the next movie that's gonna have him and it's like yeah they ran stories as well this is the thing I'd rather just I feel like we're shifting focus away from the fact that it's just really badly written and their their script sort of respect has plummeted we've got plenty of references now to know how they treat script writing the writers will like admit to what their standards were in like a funny haha this is the thing that awkward that I wrote it while we were filming he he is just like yeah that is that's more than awkward actually mm-hmm which I think is more so where we should be being like there's the problem right there yes you yeah this isn't how movies should be made as I said the overarching storyline for phase four seems to be multiverse but we got a bunch of other threads on top of that the multiverse feels like something that's thrown in to be an excuse to shove in other characters or variants of things we know Andrew Garfield Spider-Man Patrick Stewart Professor Rex Ben Affleck Daredevil but there are other stories at play as well in addition to the multiverse you also have the thunderbolts who so far consist of John Walker from Falcon and the Winter Soldier black widow sister and as far as I know that's it so far initially I thought they'd be used for an upcoming Avengers thing but recently it was announced that a movie centering around them will be released so the whole concept reads as throwing shit at the wall to see what sticks um yeah I think it might have that I think because I think when things are of really bad quality consistently it can give that impression that they're just trying crap you know but it's hard to tell because it's all just bad who knows exactly what thunderbolts will end up having in terms of their casting but are we really actually suggesting for a second that's like well if we don't know more than two members what's the point it's like Guardians is right there man it's a matter of how good it is obviously yeah we went in knowing none of the characters so I um again I'm just as easily as I go they're throwing shit at the wall and see what sticks like that's I guess true but I mean you know we can do that when trying to make good stuff too it can happen like Guardians was clearly a like well let's see if this works test yeah you also have the Celestials set up in the Eternals and will maybe leak over to the Guardians films and there was also that weird tease with the sword and blade at the end of that movie it's all a big mess and I don't necessarily have an issue with having small storylines within one big story in fact I'd prefer it I want smaller contained stories but every one of these can't help the impulse to try and shove in some kind of teaser crap the films in phases one to three uh I agree with him but yeah and I paused there because I was about to say like surely the counter to that would be they've been doing this the whole time so I'm gonna have to see how if he accounts for that some kind of teaser crap the films in phases one to three did the same thing but those movies had a defined end going a big bad to build up to keep saying that but I don't agree I'm sorry I feel like we kind of rose tinted this shit Thanos is like got a quick cameo at the by the time you hit the end of phase one and then he has a second quick cameo by the end of phase two being like ah this is incredible build up it's like not really he's here he's doing a thing not much development in those cliffhangers except that he gets the infinity gauntlet in the second one I guess the whole thing that shocked everybody was that he was really interesting in infinity war do you remember there was discussions about who cares about Thanos being the enemy in infinity war he's just this fucking huge thug guy who's just gonna be like ah weevil but then people watched the movie like oh that was that wasn't him just being lame yeah I thought he was great at least he was in guardians yeah he had a scene in guardians that character has such a presence that it's easy to overlook the fact that josh brolin was even in that movie and how could a job he did you know he looked strange up until they gave him all of the money yeah but yeah that's fair I did forget for a second he had he was like Ronin oh yeah two scenes in guardians I think actually okay he was on a monitor for one of them yeah so I don't know because it's like yeah Thanos is on the way therefore it's bound as a series of phases and I'm like so is that all phase 4 is missing then being like Kang is on the way even though we have done that that is there so I don't know I feel like in terms of the secret sauce I think it's more than that not it like yeah 4.2 was a disposable nothing movie but it showed off and established a reality stone that gets used in infinity war and that was pretty why so you know like I don't know if they didn't I forgot that they did that in Thornton I had a feeling because I'm a normal person I pledge people wouldn't have fucking known that's what would they say like oh where is the the reality stone and they're like it's it's in nowhere because that's where there's an after credit scene I think in Thor 2 where a syph and one of the other warriors 3 delivers the stone to the collector and it's like oh okay yeah I'm following I'm following but like the idea that that is what bound the phases together and made them worthwhile like fuck no one remembers that shit that's the shit that I remember because I obsessive a bit with this I'm not sure if you've mentioned this but what was cool about phase 3 in particular was how it leveraged a lot of the broader character arcs to culminate into something meaningful like meaningful conflicts and meaningful resolution that's the cool thing well that's the meaningful part so compared to well there was a post-credits scene where it showed them talking to this guy like that's you know that's cool I guess but really like the promises long-term building of characters um well so this section is him basically saying like the reason phase 1, 2 and 3 were working better is because they all built toward Thanos and he's arguing like even the Thor 2 built towards Thanos and that's why like component wise is a good thing when I just feel like as if to imply phase 4's problem is it's not building toward Kang which it is it is building towards Kang it's built more towards Kang than phase 1 is built towards Thanos well Thanos was only revealed right at the end of the cameo exactly and so I don't like that we're ignoring the reality that it's like no it's just a matter of these stories being fucking interesting and well written that's like clearly what the main component is the idea that if these were as good as they are and they have the exact same level of components that involve Kang we could be arguing like ooo Kang oh it's gonna be interesting ooo Kang ooo there's no reason for Kang to not be potentially as exciting as Thanos there's no reason that shouldn't be interesting I was saying as well like people were pretty pessimistic about Thanos before they saw Infinity War I hope we don't rewrite history on that one it's not like everyone was super excited for the big purple guy to show up people were like hey it'll be a movie where they have to beat up a big guy okay people were excited for Ultron look at how that turned out yeah I don't know if I'm missing something is there a property out of all the phase 4 stuff that is building up to Kang rather than Loki because I can't it seems to be building up to Kang if we're supposed to believe that Kang is in some ways puppeting all of the multiversal events you could argue that that's in some way Kang is the ultimate puppet master even Bob Thanos it was him everything it was me and Bond I was the author of all your pain that's so fucking great important Dr. Strange was a pretty mid-film but it had the time stone in it established its rules and implemented a character I don't like this I think this is unfair these movies have a lot more to offer than that even Thor 2 has more to offer than that but Dr. Strange man there's a lot going on in that movie beyond the fucking time stone it's like it's part of I would argue it's all the foundational shit for why I really hate Multiverse of Madness it's shits on this film it wasted Dr. Strange it doesn't even yeah like a mortal man god damn like he was a person he was a person he was really important to Dr. Strange and then we just discard him because Michael Waldron wanted to have Wanda as the villain and like everybody seems to forget when Dr. Strange came out everyone was fucking cooming all over the visuals but now everyone looks back at it's a part of the phase of shitty visuals Honeymoon period was short for that well I think it's just I don't know I feel bad for Scott Derrickson he had a story he wanted to tell with Multiverse of Madness that he wasn't he left because of creative differences so there was a story he wanted to tell as a creative that he didn't get and nobody gave a fuck like nobody gave a shit as soon as he got replaced by Sam Raimi like nobody cared that he had a story he wanted to tell who cares about this shit we want to go a different way and make a shit movie sorry all that information can be found and confirmed but nobody gives a shit it's like oh well bye Scott don't care about you because they'll even say nice things about it but it's like there's no fucking way he's happy with where you took it compared to what I assumed was his intentions because he obviously was going to make more of a significant component and you fucking booped him out you almost you would have killed him if they had kept the scene in you would have gotten rid of being able to use I will butcher his name as I always do Chewettle Edgy no I almost got it right Chewettle Edgy 4 I screwed it up you had him you have him in a role that you can leverage him and you nearly got rid of him why would you do that and yeah just so in case in case anyone in chat is not talking about there was going to be a scene where Scarlet Witch revealed Mordo's head to Doctor Strange in Camotage like above the when they were talking up there as a sort of threat and the idea was going to be that she killed him when he tried to kill her for having power he would have just been knocked out of the fucking franchise just like that it's pretty clear that he's supposed to be like an incredibly important and meaningful personal enemy to Doctor Strange it's amazing how much they just didn't give a shit but yeah I think it's well that's phase 4 it's amazing how much they didn't give a shit yeah what I find especially alarming is like Doctor Strange is probably the last movie in the MCU that did the whole like he is a character here are his traits he goes through this conflict and now he has to make a choice and it involves having powers and you know he chooses the right thing in here might be right Homecoming would be the last no wait no I guess we exclude the Spider-Man films right well I was going to say I wouldn't count Homecoming because that's like a Doctor Strange 2 where he's already he's developing as opposed to beginning I hesitate to say Origin Story but I just mean Origin Story something like that yeah like it's just Origin Movie I think I know what you're talking about let me start to think about a lot of the recent films haven't really demanded that the characters make a meaningful choice like you think about Captain Marvel's was about realising how great she was I guess I guess Black Panthers was about to Charla realising how to be a king in his own way I guess one of the big resolutions and that was the whole taking responsibility for the lies that his father ran but there was never any reason for those lies in the first place the whole like getting rid of Killmonger thing but I guess it would be that despite the flaws of the actual plot itself it's a decision that he makes that I guess is meaningful to him well maybe that's the key factor that we haven't had one that like matters in some way well I suppose I don't know it would be nice if we had more stories where like you do the standard thing character has X traits the story challenges or character has X beliefs story challenges X beliefs character develops Y beliefs or something they change or maybe you were wrong X plus 1 sort of thing which is what I thought that's what Multiverse of Madness was going to try and do because it did the whole you guys remember Doctor Strange in the first movie says I took an oath in the Hippocratic Oath and he's like but I have just killed a man and it's like oh shit yeah I've never even thought about what does that mean to you as a person and the more we follow him the more he's clearly willing to fucking kill people so what happened what is that and then you have spider memories like in the grand calculus of the Multiverse there's a fucking drop in the bucket compared to like everyone you're like oh okay so he's gone like full utilitarian I understand and I'm not against that logic especially in that situation he's a complicated one then you have Multiverse of Madness where he repeats that line but he's killed during saying it and I remember despite already thinking that scene was shit that's right at the beginning I was like okay so clearly the film's going to be trying to make a point about him having said the whole grand calculus thing and if you remember Scarlet Witch then kind of says the same thing to him in the spooky Caelid scene she's like one life compared to the whole Multiverse her logic is dangerous for America to have that power you know so I should just kill her because one does a fucking more but like it's fine we'll run with that and then if you remember Strange says to her that's the kind of logic villains use and it's like oh I see what you're doing movie you've just had Doctor Strange criticize himself without realizing it oh how very clever I can't wait to see where this goes exactly it's like oh alright so we I've got my foundation that's near the beginning of the movie how are we going to develop this and it's like pretty much nothing right up until the end where he's like you know he's like Strange take her power like you got a killer to save the Multiverse and he comes to his choice and he goes no I'll just tell her to believe in herself you know what no that is a good plan and yeah and it works and we never address the whole grand calculus thing that and I was just like was there a plan to do it and they dropped it or was it just written by Michael Hall? I can believe that I think that he thought that he did that as well as other themes because of how well written that script is like look at all these multiple themes I wrap up I practically feel tricked watching it because I was just like you're clearly about to tell me why it is that sacrificing one person for everyone else is a bad decision or at least hasn't a counter argument give me something but no they just go nah nah I don't like it a counter argument that you could present as like but what does this say about you what does this do to you you know all of these individual compromises what are they amount to in the end there's so many things you can say about it that might be a bit too interesting yeah they never did anything with it and so I don't even know what Doctor Strange's position is now has he decided the grand calculus thing is bullshit now or is he still following it I don't know because if you remember this is something we pointed out in our discussion on it he was more than willing for the other universe Wanda to be killed to save the multiverse just not America he gets booped across the room America's like oh I'll go save her he's like no no no no no don't do that I'd see how this pans out and this is the thing oh it's written by such a fucking baby because it's like if you're gonna argue to me that it's not worth saving the multiverse to kill one person does that count for Wanda as well so when you like kick her ass so it's okay to say it's a killed Wanda to save the universe then right I don't know you may think like well that's different because she's evil I'm like well are you gonna talk about that is it about the intention the motivation of why you're in the position you're in and what it means like there's so much for you to cover but you just go like they just win don't worry about it so uh yeah you don't like multiverse Amanda's to you kind of it and you might even say I'm like an expert on it at this point I'm not sure how that happened it was the only Marvel movie that made me mad in the theater it's interesting to say that Jay said that the only film that's made him mad was Thor Loven Thunder that like legit infuriated Jay really seems like everyone was picking different points and they just thought he'd get angry what was it about making you mad John out of curiosity uh right off the bat it felt kind of lazy because like this girl comes out of nowhere and just says like oh yeah I have these powers I can jump to wherever I need to like immediately and none of it's explained and uh I thought Scarlet Witch's character was kind of butchered like yeah you could say that yeah and then the ending was stupid with the zombie Doctor Strange no that's cool you're not allowed to think that was kind of weird I just I just like like the ending was stupid it's like yeah the ending yeah I didn't even get like a Sam Raimi vibe from it which is one of the reasons I was curious about it like I guess like some shots find like some Dutch angles whatever the fuck um but like but by the time they were had that musical note fight in the castle or whatever I'm just like what is going on they're clever though dude when I saw people like being like oh fucking musical fight was so cool I was like you're not going to say that a day from now you're not going to get it it never happened musical fight like a fight with notes on a page that you pull off the magic system ignites like the way that humans have developed like music as a concept right and a lot of the performances felt wooden benedicts but I don't really because I know he's good I blame it on the material you know there were a couple of moments in the film where I thought he did some good acting he was good yeah he was there there's flourishes on like particular deliveries that made me think like oh because if only if maybe you were bad as well I would just be like yeah whatever this is all shit but it's like oh no because benedict combat is a really really really good actor he goes all out on most of his roles no matter how cringe that's the sign of a good actor folks and they're like you know what this could be terrible that's okay because I didn't pay to do a job I didn't understand what was so special about that girl like her portals or like blue stars this is instead of all like the golden circles or whatever well if you remember in the first film they say that you can use rings to travel the multiverse but then that changed their mind because her power is she can travel through the multiverse no one else down and she's the only one who can do it this was linked on the mohler subreddit that's why I saw this there was a thread in the marvel studio subreddit of that reference being like you know the sling ring can travel all the way through the multiverse sorcerers use it as an incredibly important tool blah blah blah so why would that make her special at all the fucking top comment was like watch doctor strange when they say multiverse they are referring to dimensions in multiverse of madness the multiverse refers to universes low keys refers to timelines pay attention jeez what what it is so fucking baffling that you could just go like wait one plus one equals two right you go I said it equals three you just make up your own definition and everything is fine um and crawl into that igloo and then close the door and just be like leave me alone leave me the fuck alone how am I supposed to make a certain sense of realms, worlds, dimensions, realities, timelines like what is all of this this is like also the gap junction the space between space the answer is it's universes and they just forgot that's the answer that's absolutely the answer they wish they didn't have a line that said sling rings could go through the multiverse they fucking wish they didn't have it but it's there because they've established rules that are really like terrible I think they're very restrictive yeah like the only person can travel the multiverse and the only other way is using a magic evil book that doesn't exist anymore why would you limit yourself like that why would you just invent things on the spot so it's not really even limiting themselves right but but like if you wanted to stick to your rules traveling the multiverse now entirely hinges on one character rather than other people being able to do it in their own different ways I don't even know what it would he just shows how important America's Chavez is isn't she just the greatest she's super the greatest and she's gonna have more powers by the time we see her next she might even be sorceress supreme you know she opens a portal to let's say that other wonder universe right the portal do you remember the portal's rules as they were first stated was you have to picture the thing you're looking at I think it was no way home that added you can do it via thinking of a person individually but I'm not sure if that's true there's a couple of things I'd have to check in the other movies to see if that was kind of it doesn't matter my point is that if you opened up that star portal does it then mean that he could picture that and thus open the portal or would he be like can't do it as a different universe not working I don't know what their logic would be for that exactly and then if he stood in that universe can he just not use the sling ring at all you know what I mean is the sling ring attached to the universe it was created in and I know the very fact if I said this to Michael Waldron he would glaze over you got paid money you got paid money for this Michael can you please make sense of it to me it gets used in infinity war and that was pretty important Doctor Strange was a pretty mid-film but it had the time stone in it established its rules and implemented a character that would serve a major role in future movies wouldn't that be the value of the film not the fucking time stone be like is this guy the first one I don't care about as much the second one I care about immensely this guy we know his full history we know what he values we know what he went through and now when we see him and Tony on the same fucking screen we're like oh shit what would they say to each other these two characters that are so fucking ego driven that believe they are the individual protector and leader of Earth what would they do when they have to make decisions and I think Infinity War paid that off really well yep yeah especially in the fucking two minutes it had to do it but this multiverse free line seems very ill-defined and doesn't really seem to be building to anything other than it may be bringing the X-Men or completely reboot the franchise oh yeah remember that remember Ralph Boda fuck they make so many bad decisions the same goes for all the other things going on the marvels and secret invasion are apparently going to be showing off the development of a scroll invasion in the Marvel Universe and I can't see how that will have anything to do with anything or why I mean I don't think it'll have anything to do with anything because it's really badly written but the idea of scrolls being in and throughout all of Earth it's like yeah that could have everything to do with everything yeah just because even if we had a free line it doesn't mean other things stop happening like a lot of the ideas are not bad conceptually I really think this guy's whole issue is the Phase 4 is badly written and he's tried to pin it on this particular idea but I just don't think it works the whole like Phase 4 is without a plan it's building towards something that nobody really even sees the components for and that's the problem that's not really the problem nobody would give a fuck if they were really good exactly that's what a lot of this is no one would care if it was all really good and be no superhero fatigue if it was all good content Garren's fucking to you people would be talking about how much of an incredibly good idea it was to go from Phase 3 this glorious over the top super spectacle to Phase 4 a calm exploration of individual stories dealing with individual problems and then we're going to build back up again that was a genius move by the MCU but instead we're going to build where they badly wrote everything so now we're saying like you know what the problem is they didn't build up to something they're not unified that's the problem or really have any place in this universe other than being an excuse to have all these characters crossover again which I'm completely over at this point I'm not completely over if it's well written give me more of the crossovers if you do it well fuck it Mac universes have now become something that's almost expected in the modern franchise landscape you got the MCU the SSU the Sony Spider-Man universe which is sort of an MCU but not really it's called Venom's alternate Dr Michael Morbius in it DC has the DCEU which is their main continuity it's kind of a clusterfuck I like talking about the DC's fucking continuity it seems funny at least Marvel pretends that it's in the same universe sometimes I had no plan but there's some good stuff in there the Matt Reeves Batman universe which will have tie-in spin-off TV shows to accompany each movie Star Wars is trying its hand at a big connected TV universe which is where Star Wars was always like one continuity hence why I put I was like hang on Star Wars has had novels and video games like in its universe was Star Wars ever not a huge interconnected series like that's just what Star Wars was like it's just always been a big thing I guess it's always I guess something has changed now and that they're trying to emulate the really structuring and I guess like the format of the MCU but it's always been the thing that they try to get like Mando and stuff together I assume he's referencing that but the thing is he mentioned like a bunch of other franchises trying to go the way of the universe Star Wars was a universe before it was even you know before like Disney all of the extended stuff like I feel like yeah Star Wars if you said to Star Wars like look at you trying to copy Marvel they'd be like well maybe in releasing TV shows we're not copying them by having a universe the fuck we're the old man universe we've been here for ages well then again I guess Star Wars would have copied the comic universe it keeps going back it gives its own video in it of itself it's exhausting at this point I don't know about all of you but for me I'm getting a little tired of the constant cameos and references that are being expected to sell tickets to go see these movies again yeah you gotta keep pushing that it's the quality argument that seems to be sort of missing from his video it's quality is such a huge part of all of us you're eating really bad fries and then burgers and then fucking sausages whatever all these different foods at McDonald's and then you go man I'm just I think I'm just tired of McDonald's they keep giving you really shitty those is more so the problem like if you had a really good sausage a really good burger really good fries you wouldn't be tired of McDonald's as a whole and we talked about before different quality from different McDonald's I just think that they've been giving you lots of shit recently and so you're just like what are the core components of this shit that go beyond writing quality it's like you don't need to go beyond writing quality that's all it is that's the big problem everything else will build up from it because again like isn't it kind of funny that no way home is basically the most praised of phase four when a lot of people need you want to call it like that's a key jangly one it obviously does toby maguire spider-man in it and it's like yeah yeah it does have that I guess it's just good or something it must be things in it yeah it must be that they execute that well because they're pretty well handled yeah being like oh do you know who's going to show up in secret wars like who and you're like fucking tom cruise ironman okay and you're like if it were like a really really good and well-executed thing a pretty fucking cool I'm here for it yeah absolutely I like it I don't understand I don't think this guy or anyone else would see that and be like oh for fuck's sake tom cruise fuck we didn't have some plan or didn't have some vision or some director thing I don't I don't believe I think it's much more about expecting it to be shitty which we shouldn't we feel like not could be good which I wish we didn't have to expect it to be but yeah let's be real the vast majority didn't go to watch the multiverse of madness because they love the character of dr. steven strain wow but you just said in your qualification for why dr. strange was good was that it established that he's a neat character also that is why I went actually you're right yeah but first he said dr. strange was mid and then he said but at least it established the time stone which then moves into you know having dr. strange and the time stone as part of infinity one it's like so why would you mention him if he wasn't a neat character I like I really did like dr. strange a lot what I liked about dr. strange the most was him dr. the titular dr. strain he had the um he's an arrogant piece of shit asshole but he was often correct and really smart and really talented and so it's like this is a fucking interesting dynamic let's uh let's test that against like you know him entering this whole world he knows nothing about and then and then you know he's like terrified of the all the shit he doesn't understand about sorcery and then gradually starts getting into it and then starts excelling to the point of impressing and worrying everyone else our villain is a character who got over zealous and overpowered and like ran off with it sort of things like you could argue a shadow self of a dr. strange to a degree his best friend is someone who eventually turns to like a third party would like becomes a third party by the end of it his mentor ends up dying in the film after explaining to him like how much he just doesn't fucking understand about any of this um I don't know there's so much going on for him and then infinity war begins the downfall where he starts making some strange like it's the it's the last decision he makes in that movie that you're like hmm yeah up until that point his interactions with Tony is really great it's like a good clashing of egos when his fight with Thanos is fucking great as well uh it was cool let's just share me forgot about all those abilities when he was fighting wonder I thought exactly the same thing when I first watched this video I'm just I went to see dr. strange have always liked this character even before Benedict was playing him like I liked him in the cartoons and some of the comics that are read and uh he's just like I guess this guy doesn't like dr. strange but you know speak for yourself because part of the craziest thing about it is if you when I went to see multi-visa matters after everything I knew I didn't even knew some of the leaks would be like so you go into see professor x and read richards and fucking captain Carter I'm like yeah no not really I'm also I'm hoping I'll be able to see not only some decent acting for Benedict to come about but maybe something that explores his character that'd be nice something admittedly I was curious about those elements but that was sure I was curious about how the whole thing was going to come together excited it was going to be a disaster and then it was a disaster but uh it was a disaster you know um I've he's been ruined several times over in several movies and that just stands to reason that his his draw as a character is quite powerful that I can keep being like sad that he gets ruined yeah yeah and this shot that you're paused on here reminds me of one of the other reasons I didn't like this movie was because I thought the the multiverses that we see were just surface level augmented I don't think they're very I don't think they're a very imaginative it's just like here's a universe where everything's covered in foliage and wearing everybody's wearing fedoras and it's like well yeah but that is very why the cool the cool thing to do with with multiverses is just it's so funny you've got a show that none of us really watched that is like what you know what if this happened it's like that's all you need to do to come up with interesting premises like an easy one we talked about what if the Chitari defeated the Avengers in 2012 what if a Loki won and like Earth falls under his domain and then they enter into a universe where they have to account for that and yet well like yeah if what if I mean I guess we're doing the really boring ones like what if I don't well they're a little bit boring I guess not imagine what if Ultron won and like took over this particular planet and then like put them in places where it's not just this is a slightly more utopian Earth and this is an Earth where everything is floating around like also red means green the mouth yeah that's wow that's like the laziest changes to like the world and it's you know all of the cool universe we saw in the montage all of the interesting places that we could have explored were in the montage like what if they went to a universe where everything was paint and they had to try and actually navigate a world where everything was paint what if they ended up in a dinosaur planet where they had to create Tyrannosaurus Rex and like Bronsosaurus and all of these these creatures what if they ended up in a universe evolved yeah I mean the laziness of it is hilarious almost on like a Rick and Morty level like I just remember like a universe where people are couches exactly the gag with the pizzas and the couches ordering people like like that was a great way of like embodying this idea of like the lack of intelligent design and all these different multiverses you have a universe where everyone's doing this fucking stupid thing for no reason and then you have a universe where everyone's doing this thing for no reason it is hilarious that a writer who worked on Rick and Morty produced such a thoroughly boring multiverse story when Rick and Morty is like super entertaining as a multiverse story for all of these crazy dimensions they go to yeah and then the icing on this shit cake sorry one last thing with this particular universe that he's in this fucking memory lane store that he walked past he just the store is called Memory Lane which on its own is just so lazy it's the laziest device I've ever seen incorporated flashback yeah and they use it twice in a row yeah he walks onto a pad outside the store and he triggers like a memory to manifest and it's like how does the store work is he being charged to his fucking like Amazon account or something wirelessly like it's on the streets of taste but if you buy the real if you buy your memory plus subscription it'll be a lot better just the fact that if they walked out a different street we wouldn't have received two plot critical flashbacks that explain one of the central arcs that Doctor Strange is going through and America's origin story it's so cringe dude I fucking hate it so much this was a reshoot I wouldn't be surprised if this was a reshoot this whole scene like feels like they're not where they're supposed to be I don't know but you know yeah I mean to turn down whoever that other prospective director was they turned him away in order to do their own thing like the idea that they turned him away to do this instead and it's called multiverse of madness you think like you want to invest a lot of imagination in the universes that he's traveling to but they're just the laziest shit here's the thing though John something that people will say when you talk about wanting more breadth to the multiverses oh yeah you just want to see like cameos and stuff but the reality is that you can substantively explore the multiverse and it really has nothing to do with cameos I don't need to see we could go to that Loki universe where the Chitari won and we don't even need to see Loki we could just see the Chitari and have that be a thing that they have to account for but the reason why it's interesting to have them account for it is what does Doctor Strange do in very unfamiliar territory when he doesn't know who the key players are what forces you know he has to account for what does it look like when Doctor Strange is thrown completely out of his comfort zone we don't get to see that very well no when you didn't see a multiverse of madness yeah well it's because they probably were going to do something more compelling when it was originally that but then they changed their mind and they were like yeah but the title sounds kind of cool so we're going to keep it and they're right it did sound kind of cool in terms of just oh that's kind of campy and weird let's see what they go with it and they were like oh it's a horror movie yep the hype in the trailer I thought that was all well done and then the movie came out and then it came out what are we going to do in this multiverse oh no worries this is like our own universe I know exactly where we need to go oh okay that's interesting yeah like wouldn't it be cool if you went to universe where there was no sanctum is like yeah go that oh shit right yeah oh this is just a fucking pizza store here what is happening what's going on in in preparation for this podcast I watched a couple episodes of what if and that does a much better job I think of like this idea of like exploring these other universes where people made different choices and a whole different world kind of manifested from that like it's not just surface level like everyone's wearing a stupid fucking hat all of a sudden you know what if they were zombies what if they're what what if Peggy Carter was you know super instead like at least there's a lot more imagination in yeah the changes are much more substantive I wish the writing was better in that as well because I was about to say that I agree with that yes yeah I was about to say like oh well it's in the premise they focus on I was like well so is this this is just shit yeah I think I think what what I actually when I look through the list of the premises that they came up with for what if I I think they could have done better I think they could have asked more I think I think the Peggy one's fine I think that one's okay but like what if what if Doctor Strange lost his heart instead of his hands it's like what is that like why can't we why can't we do something a little bit more interesting than that I did I did find the writing for it was lacking but it bothered me less than the other stuff because it was just trying to be like a fun kid's cartoon and I was just like whatever like kids will probably get a kick out of this I don't think a lot of adults are watching the show anyway you know like I mean I'm not saying that kids shows can't have good writing but I just wasn't it it's I find it really funny though that did because I'm pretty sure what if which are the have the Emmys haven't happened yet but like because Arcane was nominated for like best like Outstanding Animated Program but so was what if I swear to God there is an obvious winner there okay let's let's be reasonable if you take it to look at the lit hold on I just we can continue I'll I'll find it Angel wanted to see Sam Raimi's return to the superhero genre they went to see it because they thought they'd get to see Dr. Michael Morbius Professor Charles Xavier and Blackie Gar Boltigan I don't even know how many people knew that was happening in the general audience I don't think yeah I bet the second of all I just fucking that's not even relevant if you said to my like any of my fucking extended family are you excited to see Black and Gar Boltigan they would look at me like I'm speaking a different fucking language what do you mean Welsh what do you mean I would ask you I would have asked me I would have asked me what I'm talking about until I saw this I was like what was Black and Gar but it's like black balls and what's that it's from the show in humans that they popped up say back to what's that I never even knew that was a thing I missed it in humans was that a marvel thing in humans I almost forgot about that so the story of in humans is interesting because from what I understand because they didn't have access to X-Men for films the comics really pushed the inhumans as like a replacement for the mutants for a while then they got the rights back for the film so then they just gave up was that before they acquired 20th Century Fox yeah because of course the comics have always had X-Men but I think the comics at this point kind of follow the films in terms of in terms of you know like I think Fantastic Four were like relegated to the sidelines for a while and then when they got the film rights back it's like all of a sudden Fantastic Four gets a show off again that would be so lame if you're like reading comics and your favorite character gets pushed away because of fucking contracts that really annoyed me with Spider-Man back in the day when Sony still had the film rights I'm just like fuck man I really want to see what Marvel does with this Sony does have the film rights but they've reached some kind of partnership the funny thing is though people look at the upcoming Marvel movie so shit it's like yes because the MCU is the high watermark or the set of high bar for quality right now Sony, Marvel, DC nobody's on top in terms of what flavor of crap do you want in terms of a box office you can pick one but I guess if you were to from the stew be like you get to have one new one which one would be the best out of Marvel DC Sony giving you one which one would you gun for which one would I gun for like right now do you mean or in general yeah no right now like with how the studios are working it's a mystery project you're going to get one from each of them which would you think is going to be the best I think I think I'd go with DC I think I might take a chance on Sony I might feel like fuck I don't know because there's some stuff with Sony here and there like Spider-Verse everybody forgets that it doesn't exist without Sony and think about how Into the Spider-Verse has now pushed a lot of animation studios to be more experimental with 3D animation styles like look at what DreamWorks is doing now that doesn't exist without Into the Spider-Verse I don't think maybe not with Spider-Man right now they own Spider-Man all of the associated characters which is a lot of characters all the villains all of the like anti-hero spin-off characters because they're making a madame web film also yeah I probably would go with DC thinking about it actually because you got Joker and the Batman were pretty you know what I do like about what DC is doing right now is that their production workflow is less centralized than Marvel's is where they don't like storyboard everything meticulously that's not a lot that's not lasting now they're gonna change that no since they've come up with this 10 year plan I suppose that's going to the wayside now but here's the thing the problem is like I wish I could be like yeah it's been fun the scattershot approach but I don't like it I don't like that um maybe I'd like it more if all the films were great but they're not and so like what we have is this universe that's lurching forth where it's like yeah I because I really like the Batman I also like the idea of Batman in like a more wacky comic book world where we get to see like Mr. Freeze or Poison Ivy or um or like Killer Croc were not not the one that we saw in the Suicide Squad but like you know more of the um it would be cool to see Batman interacting in a world that you see more often in like animation in the comics than we've seen in the films it would be cool to have Superman films with like a really you know like the good guy Superman like the altruistic yeah that one is awesome um and it's just yeah but the problem is that because it's been lurching forth with this like weird half and half committal to like we want to do new things but also we exist in the same universe as films that we don't like to talk about anymore it's um uh did you forget Batman or Robin no I could never forget Batman or Robin what I'm saying who could forget that movie a miracle I'm saying it would be more cool to have that again in a broader universe where he can like you know it's it's something we don't get to talk about a lot but like Batman and Superman you know Bruce and Clark are meant to be best friends we've never got yeah that we've never seen that um it's it's um it's lame it'd be cool if we got to see that and then we have more action films anyway yeah I think because this sentiment is like oh you get your Aquaman boots of prey fucking this that the Snyder one is like isn't it nice that it's kind of more of a flurry and we don't actually have to have it all be connected up and it's like would you really be complaining if all of these things were good and connected up I don't think you would be look at how disconnected that is and how confusing it was to everybody yeah everybody's like wait you can fly she can't fly dude when um I can't remember if we covered it on eFab I think we did but just so pointing out Wonder Woman is fucking annihilating people in the Snyder cut when she's established in 84 to be like she would never hit someone that is not how she solves problems it's like so those two things are incongruent and then fucking people on Twitter will like uh no they're not that's two different directors two different ideas oh fuck off it's like but yeah that's what we that's what you just saved my thing again that's the same continuity it's like they're not the same continuity they're different movies it's like oh I got that argument recently um the uh like I'm responding to the he was I was because we were talking about the how lightsabers um in the Kenobi show seemed really really anemic and weak and Kenobi has to hit yeah he has to hit stormtroopers like they're baseball bats and it bounces off and we talked about how it used to slice up droids and chop off limbs and stuff like that and they were serious business and the response from him was well that's just directors in their own that's just directors in their vision and you can't fault you know them for having their own little each director having their own if you're gonna make that argument could I not make the argument scene by scene like this was the direction and vision in this scene and now this scene they have a different direction and vision therefore it doesn't have my chance yeah one direction and in this shot they had another one when this was shot he wasn't even there so it was probably the interns vision I don't know you get benefits and trade-offs from doing sequels and you don't get to pick and choose them no yeah you have to commit you can leverage the story that existed before to enhance your own the detriment is you have to be consistent and then with the story that came before you can't just do whatever you want it's the fuck up they always make they're like we want Kenobi because he's really cool and you're like alright here he is and here's all the stuff that comes with him nah I don't want that stuff nah I don't want that one I just want a character oh you have to take these courageous with you and you're like nah fuck that no he isn't I watched the movie I hadn't heard about that directors vision thing in regard to the lightsabers and that's pretty bullshit I mean because they're just gonna if they're gonna bounce off anything why don't they just make them like swords cutting through droids but bouncing off storm troopers exactly that's part of my argument if they're slicing effortlessly through metal robots then man your ass are going through a person even easier nah but we can't have limbs disassembling that would be we can't do that even though we want to present our story as mature and like a slow character study but we can't have people getting chopped up even if they went with one slice and it makes a big old mark down them and they fall down I'll take it that's something it's like in return of the Jedi Luke's going around and hitting people but there ain't no limbs flying off or anything but he hits them once and they're done yep I'm fine with that get to see Dr. Michael Morbius oh yeah I want to roll him back a little bit further because I think he said someone else that triggered me go see these movies let's be real the vast majority didn't go to watch the multiverse of madness because they love the character of Dr. Stephen strange or you say Sam Raimi's return to the superhero genre they went to see it a lot of people were saying the Sam Raimi thing that was it marketing man it was they totally did so all of the people are going to see this and you go what are the total reasons like most commonly this is like a game show what are the most commonly voted upon reasons to go see it like for the character of Dr. Strange that's going to be a lot of people because this is in the MCU that's probably the biggest reason is there's a good chance for these cameos that I swear to fuck most normal people didn't even know this was happening most people even if they did like if they knew that there would be these cameos they wouldn't they'd just be like you know what I mean like what would they say oh black bolt I know so much about you yeah and then what else we got it's like uh I guess progressing the overall story it's like no I don't even know if anybody's there for that I don't know maybe yeah I just I don't believe at all that it's like no they're in it for the cameos like I got that that'll be how they try to sell the next thing and that's a lot of people on like twitter but you like mainstay movie audience I think they're still going off the fact that this is the MCU yeah that's lovely but hey that might die gradually if you're not careful I thought they'd get to see Dr. Michael Morbius, Professor Charles Xavier it would have been cool to see Morbius I don't disagree with that I choose to interpret that edit as that he thought that was shit too which that's the correct opinion yeah I have a seething hatred for the line hit a guy, hit a there whatever the fuck that is it's weird how mean they are to him I don't like it amazing visual flair from Sam Raimi what you're left with in Dr. Strange and the multiverse of madness is a pretty dull and forgettable story and experience I don't even why does this always happen where you get this insane nonsense crap film and someone goes oh it's so dull I don't know that it was dull the movie was not dull I was never bored watching multiverse of madness I would say it's break neck with the fucking pacing this film is insane we go from she first establishes the offer of you will give America to me in like 24 hours or whatever or I will there will be consequences fast forward like 7 minutes and we're traveling through the multiverse because the whole battle is already done 8 action scenes in that film I'm pretty sure and there's the gargantuan and then there's the kamatage and that's act 1 that's the first 30 minute reaction it feels fucking wild dude I would actually say that I found that film dull and by the time I was in the third act I was just waiting for it to end but it wasn't for a lack of action it's because I wasn't invested in anything I was invested in the characters or the situations and that's the thing I don't think it's invalid to describe anything especially because it's your own experience as dull it's just that if the reasoning is going to be that I wasn't invested then at that point it's just like oh well then it's not because it was dull it's because you weren't invested so I would try and categorize dull to be a meaningful description of anything is usually to describe that it's very mundane nothing's happening at all that's of any interest or difference I had a dull experience I suppose yeah I think that's the difference saying that it felt very dull to you is kind of different than saying it is dull because it really doesn't imply that there's not much going on in this film and I'd be like this is one of the most insane fucking MCU movies that there are right the question isn't particularly rooted in anything meaningful the protagonist is really blind and his arc is mostly forgettable see I have completely different issues he has like five arcs at once and they're all nonsense it's not that there's like nothing going on and I think there's work done to really pinpoint that they are trying to do some arc stuff but there's just such disjointed and cut pieces all over the place that it just doesn't match like the whole are you happy thing he must have noticed all of the characters keep fucking asking are you happy it's like hmm I wonder why that is at the end the vlog is just like yeah I am alright then I'm completely ding ding ding exactly I think they're crap but they are there like uh they're just really really badly done that's really awful given the way the MCU is attempting to elevate some of its properties now you can't help but reflect on Martin Scorsese Martin I remember when he made the film about the wolf straight guy who said fuck and beat his wife good times a couple of years ago the Marvel fanboy in film side of the internet lost their collective shit over Martin the wolf hey don't forget to highlight that the other side lost their shit too everyone lost their shit Scorsese saying in an interview that Marvel movies are not cinema and you're gonna contextualize it to mean something completely different on you I'm sure it'll be really insightful here we go which is definitely a loaded statement to make that I don't really care to debate it's just wrong I don't know why people have trouble with this if what you want to say is the films are shit go for it I would agree with you saying they're not cinema it reminds me of when people say like fuck it Ryan Johnson is not an artist I'm sorry he is he is I'm sorry if you're putting images to film you are making cinema and that can be bad or good exactly however again if you really want to run with your own personal definition and cinema means film that is good and meaningful fine that's just not the word fiction and literature thing isn't it yeah but it's just not at all how it's used colloquially and I just don't know why you're doing this if not to piss everyone off why don't we just be a little bit more precise in what we're saying it's shit it's fine if Monscoz says he said that shit then it'd be like yeah totally agree dude fuck it everybody but this one is just like wait what exactly what do you mean I suspect what he's getting at is like integrity, consistency and self-containment when it comes to the production and release of these films but he's using the wrong word to encapsulate all that he shouldn't be using the word cinema I don't think which is definitely a loaded statement to make that I don't really care to debate when taken at surface level what Scorsese was actually trying to pause it is that Marvel movies here's what he's actually trying to say they all do it but that's fine even though he clearly clarified you know multiple times he clarified and obviously his clarification was arguably worse when we covered it this is what he really means Scorsese is just an old man he doesn't know what he's saying remember the guy we said who was like when it gets to a point of being a franchise we're like what the fuck are you talking about no that's not at all what he was no fundamentally do not provide the same experience as your typical view of what a movie is using the metaphor of theme park rides each film essentially functions as its own attraction providing brief bursts of dopamine essentially when you go and see an Avengers film you're not going for the sake of getting an emotional and cinematic experience here we are again everybody welcome back we have completely changed everything I made it I was thinking about this the other day I found it interesting that you know Martin Scorsese would describe the Marvel movies disparagingly as a theme park ride but I would say that's an accurate descriptor for the Wolf of Wall Street which is quite a shallow and bloated movie but I don't dislike that movie it's shallow and bloated by design because it's actually thematically relevant like it's part of the theme of that movie that he lives this really shallow and excessive lifestyle and that kind of manifests itself in the way the movies actually made but given that I don't think he should be tossing that term around disparagingly to something like Marvel it's like well you've kind of done the same thing like would you say Wolf of Wall Street isn't cinema? did he go as far as saying like superhero movies in general or was it just Marvel? probably superhero movies in general because I was going to say now with the Batman having come out do you really think it's fair even though the Joker was already out let's use a different example like Richard Donner's Superman I doubt he has that perspective on that film I doubt he has this perspective on a lot of blockbuster films like you probably would do about Jaws or Jurassic Park or ET yeah and I doubt the guy who made this video would agree that those should all qualify either which is why it's such a it screams to me that same smug energy that Jay Bowman had when he was like Todd Phillips he's not a real filmmaker like oh f**k off didn't say that about Nolan's Batman films he probably wouldn't say it about Raimi's Spider-Man films either I appreciate that so at that point it's like so we're not really talking about super what I think if we were doing best faith is almost that like these are projects where you don't think that the filmmakers are at the helm of the filmmaking and you think that there's a compromise there problem is how do you account for guardians where like a vision does shine through despite being a you know despite being a marvel cinematic universe big old budget production and so yeah the end of the day it's s**t and maybe because we would agree on this as well we don't like the process that is used to make these films which I don't I really don't like the we start with the project and we find the people who are gonna make it and then we make it and we need to get it out at this quarterly we need to get it out you know for the second quarter of the fiscal year and we gotta get it on the streaming service like yeah I don't like that s**t either but he didn't say that he said that they weren't cinema it's a very different thing they are they just suck I don't like that dismissive like disparaging characterization of Todd Phillips either just because he made a few missteps with the hangover series I think he had a lot of hangover one's a good movie I agree it's great I think he I think he screwed up quite a bit with the second and third ones but I think with Joker he finally found his footing like there was an alignment with what he wanted to do and what the studio wanted and I think before that there was like they were butting heads you know like he wanted to clearly made the distinction between the two I've got to find the quote because this happened last time we talked about it where people were telling us that the quote was different than what it was hold on second place in Mario Kart not bad what someone said his point is aging his point is aging very well it's like it can't age well it doesn't matter how bad the superhero movies get yeah he said in superhero this is so he wrote a new york times op-ed where he clarified it and it was titled I said Marvel movies aren't cinema let me explain and the subtitle the tagline is cinema is an art form that brings you the unexpected in superhero movies nothing is at risk that's a very broad statement it's not true it's not true it's not true well I guess this is the point right I mean I'm not going to read the whole the whole op-ed the thing why we're forced into defending it it's just like you understand guys you've been listening to us complain about this non-stop and it's just like so you you do understand we're not biased in favor of the fucking phase four I just think it's ridiculous that we're at the point of being like oh no it's not cinema at all it's like oh come on yes quite yeah we occupy this space where it's like we're not on the Marvel guy's side in terms of extolling the wonder of like the Marvel cinematic universe artistically but at the same time we're not going to pretend that it isn't art it is it's just bad art it's so much simpler the world is easier to understand it's so much simpler when it's all art and you just decide whether it's good or bad rather than it is sufficiently bad that it's no longer artistic expression when it all is brief burst of dopamine essentially when you go and see an Avengers film you're not going for the sake of getting an emotional and cinematic experience you're going because it's an attraction because you want to see who will turn out what will happen the big I don't tell me what I want I'm trying desperately not to just I just let him go because I disagree so fucking hard on this but it's okay the favorite moments that everybody cites in superhero movies are actually a lot of the time the big important like how many people in Logan like when they talk about Logan when they talk about their favorite parts of that film how many of them are going to be like yeah it was so cool when X23 like showed up that he was in the film like how many people are going to say that versus citing like the final scene in that film any emotional moments in that movie what does it say about Infinity War that one of the first things my head goes to for best scenes is just Thor talking about how much he's lost it's like oh yeah that's just an attraction you're just there for the roller coaster everybody's favorite of emotions the conversation he has with May like a lot of the most a lot of the best moments that people cite in these films are what you're getting in a lot of films where it's conversations between two people that you care about the emotional catharsis of like a situation right where dead able to punish her talking on the rooftop every time that scene he's talking at the cemetery and if we had the go next spider-man movies coming out and it's going to deal with the fact that he's starting to believe that he needs to open up again that he's been isolated because of what happened after No Way Home and this is the movie that starts to challenge really is that the best way forward that I'm like ah I'm sold and if they go also the lizard is going to be in it I'd be like okay that's fine alright sure yeah sure let's see what they do with him I suppose this guy the way that he's explaining this it sounds like it should be the reverse for me where they go he's going to be dealing with blah blah blah blah yeah yeah yeah who's in it who's in it Lizard ooh aww sweet okay Lizard yeah what else what we got Doc Ock come on give me Doc Ock I hope it'll be as good as Spider-Man 3 when we find out like Doc Ock and Green Goblin were in No Way Home the first thought we all have is like oh shit please don't fuck them up yeah and what are we referring to when we say that character writing because that's why we are here obviously not everyone is there for the same reason to stop telling me I don't turn up for the meaningful stuff that I'm only there to go oooooh look at the cool colors dude have you guys seen Mask of the Phantasm the animated from 1993 has seen the Phantom that's so long I don't remember it well Batman one is the reason I watched that has like a scene in it when he's just talking not even he's not even talking to a person he's talking to the graves of his parents and it's like a conflict in his interest and it's fucking amazing I think it has the best reputation of all animated movies for Batman right and I see why I see why it's really good it's really good no are they for those technical Joker is in it look at Batman he's running around it's funny as well because we were talking earlier about how like what division fell the fuck apart what we had what he's describing here the fucking laser people attacking all the witches are firing the spells at each other oooooh there's some ruins on the sky the dome is falling apart it doesn't have spells in it meanwhile we were like the most interesting part was the dinner table where they were saying things kind of weird and off and it was clearly noticeable that this is not right proud please it's your favorite mask it's a big purple asshole it's actually pretty meaningful that he can pick up me on there but why should I even bother at this point it's fine bear in mind this is Marty's opinion and not mine the statement of them will not be wait hang on that's not even Marty's opinion you made all that up that's not what he said isn't it fucking hilarious that they like I know what Martin meant it is hilarious I know he's just an old man doesn't know what he's talking about especially when it comes to movies I'll let you know what he really means cinema and instead the theme park rides is a little bit of an over simplification information and aesthetic are metrics for what makes cinema the wire films like guardians of the galaxy lumped in with this theme park idea because I like Marvel movies he's almost there so he just went like ok if I'm to believe you're correct Marty we can't include guardians too because that's really good it's like no we can't include any of them it's not fair just because you like guardians too a lot it's very well shot or very unique compared to the rest that doesn't make it cinema with the rest aren't it's a movie where and it's emotion and characters come before anything else see it's a I'm very disappointed that you you almost have this close yeah so close like I said what isn't isn't cinema is a pointless debate that comes down to subjectivity and how it wouldn't be pointless if we had better definitions of what we're even fucking talking about would it like if we're just like objectively we had a definition it could be much better off because everyone's just shouting at each other at this point pretentious you are but digging past the surface level of what Marty the ace Scorsese was getting at is a sentiment I agree with and is apparent now that's what he was getting at what was he truly getting at using words I just think people what have you seen is agree with Scorsese because he's one of the most legendary directors of all time like you would you would want to be like if if if maybe he'd made five bad bad movies in a row maybe people like maybe he's wrong actually you know it's fine to disagree with someone it really is even if they're very important I mean every every scientist can can bite the bullet on the fact that Isaac Newton was also an alchemist right it's fine it's okay bringing you an alchemist I can't remember um we don't you know you can ask me about that on a different day I guess I'm too tired I'm too tired to give you the scripted answer wait did I say that once uh-oh oh my goodness gracious alchemist confirm they just said good points but someone in chat said y'all mad so you're wrong damn it well that's it for tonight goodbye watching most of these shows and movies because they're looking for art that will satisfy your challenge a world viewer desire plenty are just empty spectacle of a paper thin story to service the action sure plenty are some art I mean you could even if they were mostly thin like there's only a speck of kind of like oh there's something interesting there isn't that enough as long as you have something the story have to be before being cinema as soon as the the fact that we were bringing up the whole ground calculus thing in dark strange it doesn't deal with it it doesn't talk about it but there's something in there that I can now discuss does that count or does it not I don't know factory filmmaking is a real thing and if there's one thing Martin Scorsese factory filmmakers a real thing is like not shocking at all he's right about is that it's an incredibly damaging precedent for the industry as a whole when referring to the current bad I was gonna say like it wouldn't be that way if they were really well executed movies yeah quality is king I mean you could say all film studios are factories but like what he's implying that like it's like soulless filmmaking sometimes it is sometimes it isn't I don't know that you could have a soulless film that is still cinema because to be fair what does soulless truly be I'm not exactly sure we're all kind of abigot something vague on the line of they made it without thinking about anything really hot and soul in there you guys know that soul versus soulless meme verse like something with better graphics and slightly worse graphics and it's like like if something has better graphics it immediately is soulless yeah like the term gets thrown around a lot very loosely Mulan was soulless how that was how do you that was hilarious that movie was called Mulan that's interesting over saturation of the superhero genre Martin Scorsese said in many places around this country and around the world franchise films are now your primary choice if you want to see something on the big screen you're going to tell me that it's simply a matter of supply and demand and giving the people what they want I'm going to disagree it's a chicken and egg issue if people are only given one kind of thing and endlessly sold only one kind of thing wouldn't it have been proven already by the fact that some make more money than others that people are coming to see some and not others it's not just that they're there absolutely I mean it's there are all kinds of movies and they're all quite easy to access supply and demand it really answers this question because the fact that DC are like fuck what sells and what doesn't drop the stuff is not selling no one ever says all these MCU movies nobody wants those stop making them we it's not chicken and egg because we can point to a time when superhero films weren't dominant at the box office and then we can slowly see the transition into superhero films becoming dominant in the box office like we look now at you know the cinema that has 40 screenings for multiverse of madness and while there's only one screen like the Northman that's now art and the market just told the cinema is what they want which is broadly franchise films people want to see Fast and Furious they want to see Marvel movies they want to see I guess I don't want to see Harry Potter anymore they want to see Star Wars to some extent and I I am a firm believer that you have those hundreds of thousands of Twitter accounts who are like the Northman art great blah blah blah blah blah they all went and saw Doctor Strange they didn't go to see the Northman the thing I remember most distinctly from no way home like one of my definitely one of my top favorite scenes is when all the Spider-Man convene on the rooftop and they're all kind of broken in their own ways and they all kind of find they kind of repair their emotional states through sharing their grief with one another and they realize how much they have in common with what they've lost and it's all really well acted I think and stuff like that that's the stuff that like I see that in a movie I'm just like fuck that was great like I'm always good even if the rest of the movie is shit even if the rest of the movie is shit like I'm always going to remember that scene for like the rest of my life yeah that's what we call key jangling that's not cinema I'm afraid you're just key jangling people called it key jangling and I was just like it's substantive they're literally talking about what makes them who they are what do you mean yeah this quote that's being read as something that Scorsese said verbatim and I find it interesting because it doesn't put a lot of faith into the audience to more clearly understand what it is they because it's what he's kind of saying is you don't actually want this you think you want it but like I don't know if that's true I think people do want like what I think they want it and it's it's weird to almost say like nah you've been bamboozled the studio has told you this is what you want but it's not really what you want you want to watch films that just people aren't going to see as much I think more grim there's gotta be a more grim realization which is that just think about it transformers made like hundreds of millions of dollars like that used to be what we would cite as like the shit blockbuster that makes so much money despite being absolutely meritless and they keep making them because they they put it out and then they go what was the profit on one of our assets it was huge what was it it's like transformers what is that and it's like make another one whatever it is and then next year they're like so how did that one do like yeah asset two even more money this time they're like fuck it all really what is this transformers thing and then like it's just some thing about robots I don't even know yeah make a whole bunch of them fuck it that's how the idea that they're like we shall put out transformers again and again and they will fucking buy it or come into their house with gun and make sure like come on we know that we know that it's much more forced by the the fact that people are actually going to see this shit because we this films failing right now when they come out it has to be to do with that but at the same time I'll happily grant there is still like a another another element to it that still exists like captain marvel was definitely an example of a movie that they put out everyone was just like sure let's do it like I'll like this and then it like worked out but there's lots of other factors that go into that the idea that it's just like this is a problem because like I don't know marvel studios just get to dictate now what everyone's tastes are going to be like we're already the fact that phase four is not making as much money as they would like it to already and they've been putting out shit that's crap like I don't know I just I don't I don't buy this I don't think that we'll be here forever it's weird that school says evil people would say this when he would be more than aware of all the phases of Hollywood's gone through all the genre is getting popular and less popular we shall see everyone's talking about how this is the end of the superhero timeline in terms of its popularity in the industry that we're seeing like one of the you know phases of it dying out now we'll see well we're still getting zombie shit and that that was the phase before the superhero craze well to be fair we're still getting westerns but they just you know they died down they're not the king yeah they weren't like last stream we're talking about bonanza gun smoke little house in prairie all the ones that aren't coming to the top of my head dozens of seasons can you call zombies a genre like western is a genre if we're calling superheroes a genre we can call zombies a genre yeah sure but but then I would apply the same thing to superheroes in west dude I'm with you I've been saying that forever we don't know the superheroes as a genre we'll have the same trajectory as something like a western because western seemed a lot more locked down compared to superheroes that can literally be fucking anything yeah you can make a west number of superhero movies exactly you can make an anything with superhero movies just make any movie you've ever seen make one of the characters unfortunately no cinema anymore sorry oh heck it's a chicken and egg issue if people are only given one kind of thing and endlessly sold only one kind of thing I guess that's what's amusing about it right it's like they're not sold one kind of thing they're sold lots of things everything everywhere all at once was a different kind of thing and it managed to actually the prize in terms of its success maverick was a different kind of thing and look how fucking well that did right well you'll have seen that one it's funny how cynical I usually am and I'm like no down with your cynicism boo it's a chicken and egg issue if people are only given one kind of thing and endlessly sold only one kind of thing of course they're going to want more of that one kind of thing and I tend to agree it's too much it's unhealthy for the industry and it's unhealthy for our minds what? I don't know about that like I'm okay don't worry about me I'll be fine yeah I'm good I'll check out some of the movies I find I think it's more than healthy for us to watch them and then talk about them and how badly all well they're doing I'm going to be fine alright as for unhealthy for the industry I don't know man the industry is basically dictated by the consumers so is it not healthy I don't know I'm not on board with this idea either that superhero movies are destroying cinema in the same way that I don't think comic books are destroying literature you know it's like people want what they want there's a demand for comic books and great books were still written alongside comic books I mean and great movies are still coming up like I get like there's always a superhero movie on like the Marquis when you go to a theater but like I don't really see that as an issue I just you wouldn't want to be that guy when your group of friends go to see you'll go ah that was terrible yeah that was bad the one friend goes this is unhealthy um you know come on Jerry like we can we can watch a movie and riff what he's like no you need to stop encouraging we're going to the hospital right now wait what alright I didn't realize this was fine I'm by no means immune either I went to see doctor strange because I didn't want to be left behind with the rest of the world and because I was interested it's not a whole different thing though yeah but that's all that's gone that's just to do with social stuff that's just talking to people you want to be in on the new topic hang on isn't this the guy that said nobody's talking about the MCU anymore and then he said the whole reason I got to see this stuff is to be able to talk about it with people yeah I think you're right yeah make sure it's a re-draft it's a great thing if you catch these little things I'm never going to get tired of good movies with superhero elements of them like I'm still not tired of good westerns just because they're not on top yeah it's fine I'm just a big fan of good stuff hell yeah yeah unbelievable I'm sorry you're the person okay yeah you're a massive hypocrite then shut the fuck up are you a hypocrite if you say the thing you're doing is bad but you know you're doing it that is still hypocrite alright if you're a critical of any behavior but then you do the thing and it's like well you need to qualify this seriously I think that was so blatant that it passed my hypocritical senses because I was just like wait well here's a question because I'm pretty sure I said explicitly last week I'll probably watch the show because of Daredevil what do you make of that well I would defend you as saying I doubt you're watching it because you enjoy Daredevil you want to see the damage he's actually a character you have investment in it's the same reason why we watch all of this stuff is because we're doing it for our job I already told you guys there's plenty of these things I wouldn't have seen by now if it went for what we do I was almost done with the MCU in phase 2 Civil War is what dragged me back into the MCU I was like fine if you're really going to try and take this more seriously fine and then Infinity War I was like fuck me I'm really invested again this is going great you guys know the rest you lived it I would wait to see the execution of incorporating Daredevil into the show missing it as a cheap tactic I've seen the images he's got his yellow and red costume we see it the other angle there as well is that you might be hypocritical I think you'd probably just be like yeah I got a weakness on that one or something like that I could understand you saying that and that would be fine I think this guy by I mean he must acknowledge this right I'm part of the problem I assume that's coming next I don't know because the thing that people accuse us every once in a while is like aren't you guys paying for tickets and thus fueling the thing and talking about it making more awareness just like pretty sure we cost them more tickets than we'll ever get for them overall and we're constantly trying to be critical of their work to direct and advise on what we believe would be the better thing and the second they make any good stuff or even good scenes good moments we try to highlight them to be fair because we're invested in what is the greatest in the sense of most people watching the greatest show being put on ever in terms of a story in our world right now culturally and we love storytelling here that's Efebs foundation yes we do it's good stuff yeah like I would go over all the different components for involved for why we're watching this stuff despite saying that people probably shouldn't be watching this stuff because of how shitty it is and I was going to say another element that proves I think that we're doing this more so for the work is the fact that we miss out on loads of it because we don't have to watch it all even for the work right like we don't even you know like I'm not going to see echo when that comes out I didn't even want Hawkeye yeah hopefully I don't have to I just realized by the way like 10 minutes ago that I totally forgotten about Hawkeye's existence yeah like I realized because I think there was footage from Hawkeye it's like dude that was like a show like that's part of this phase out of all the shows that was definitely one of them that was definitely one of them oh people are saying he's in chat guy who made this let me know if you would like to jump on and have a chat with us you found your video interesting oh that'd be great certainly interesting Hawkeye show looks really lame and kind of bad but I'll see it just because I want to see Daredevil show up so many of these movies sell their appeal on that promise of somebody significant or somebody who will be significant showing up I mean it did get him to watch She-Hulk so he's going to watch She-Hulk because of it so that is true does it count for nothing because Daredevil is a cameo but to be fair he was literally in Spider-Man for what like 10 seconds but like tell me why Spider-Man for example if someone said that's just a cameo I'd be like I feel like you're underselling what they managed to do with that I want to make sure of a distinction between a cameo and just the character being part of the story suppose you could define it as a cameo but it's an integration in this movie makes a lot of sense it's really well executed if that's what everything was going to be going forward alright even this freeze frame sort of shows how they're both like it's coming through the window Daredevil's raising his arm to catch it Peter's got his hand up to catch it I mean they're both kind of on that same wavelength superhero wise oh yeah that was a good beat I like that I liked it too yep I think a lot of the things Martin Scorsese said about Marvel is kind of misinformed and hyperbolic but honestly the metaphor comparing the MCU to a theme park is a perfect analogy no it's not theme parks are good theme parks give me joy and happiness I don't know what to say they give me delicious funnel cakes I saw someone in chat say like that what this was another example I think of informing what you know trying to compensate for what Martin Scorsese actually said but like that superhero no because that's not good enough either you need to be more specific saying superhero films like fast food it's like no just the bad ones maybe like if you want to so it's not superhero it's just bad content like a bad film, bad television shows yeah how does that work analogy wise with like tasty fast food though what is that exactly like I don't I just I find these distinctions we don't need to make additional categories to distinguish between what we would consider to be good and bad in that medium we can just say it's all art it's all cinema it's all television it's all everything it's just good or bad that's the metric that matters he said in chat I'm aware this is a very flawed video on a script level and I'm not going to get up in arms over people talking about it not going to lie I just found this interesting well yeah I mean if you want to jump on though yeah I'm assuming that's him saying he doesn't want to but totally up to you man what I would say is that I was just linked this video at some point and I listened to a portion of it and then I was like alright I think this is a great little vehicle for discussing broader topics about the MCU I've agreed with you on a bunch of stuff I just also disagree with you on a bunch of stuff that's all it's a video alright I'm not sure if it's I think that in the case of this video I think it's the conclusions that are being drawn are like lining up kind of but I think it's that we disagree on how we go I think our workings are different well yeah our answer is much more boring I think which is that it's just badly written yeah because your title is Phase 4 kind of sucks a lot I agree I don't think I agree on the reasoning but then again I'm not sure that you disagree with our reasoning either I imagine if we are because at the end of the day it's all that it's bad right like that's the most important part that it's bad stories if it was good maybe you'd have a different opinion like maybe it would change how much the homogeneity or the process that's being used to make the films or the saturation in the industry maybe that would change how important you think that is wait someone just said okay Fringy if 90% of superhero content is bad how important is it to stress that it's the work and not the genre you all mentioned that the Star of Phase 4 was bad but you liked knowing home you just highlighted why it's important yeah you've highlighted exactly why it's important I don't want to shit on bad things because I'm too lazy to make a distinction between what I'm talking about why would I do that yeah like if 90% of the things are bad well so we say it's label X and we hit 100% of things or we say it's this other label we hit accurately 90% of the things that are actually bad well we'll go for the more accurate label won't we so let's say this film is bad because X attribute well no this film has X attribute and it's good sounds like X attribute kind of has nothing to do with it sounds like we need to identify a more accurate attribute that explains why we have this opinion like that's all this is so in this case it's not that they're saying superhero films are bad pretty strongly implies that it's something to do with the genre that they are or like something that is inextricable from superhero films as a medium but that's not true because they're great superhero films it's like oh so what is the actual real underlying explanation and the explanation is it's not well written it's not telling a good story and has nothing to do with being a superhero story so we can just be more accurate with our with our labels I don't want to throw good stuff in with like the bad just because I don't want to clarify or find a more accurate explanation behind it I agree I don't know if you guys have seen it but I recently watched the movie called the innocence it's a Norwegian film about kids who have superpowers and these four kids kind of convene on like the social housing complex and they find out that they all have powers it's not really explained how they got the powers but whatever you just kind of go along with it they have powers and they learn about each other's powers and they interact in really interesting ways like one has is like severely autistic intent and can't talk but with the powers of another kid who can read minds she can speak through the autistic girl and speak fluent English and like the other there's one kid that can move things with his mind and like there's a scene where it's like one kid holds up a stick and it's like try to break the stick and he does it and it's just snaps in half and she's the girl who's holding the stick is laughing but and it's just like it plays with that tension because like sooner or later that's going to be somebody's leg or arm that gets broken and and there's like one at one moment the kid who moves stuff with his mind he like throws a rock at his mind with his mind really fast and another kid and the kid kind of ducks out of the way the tension of that like I don't know if any of you guys have had like a rock the size of a baseball thrown at you but like holy shit you you dodge that thing like it's a bullet you know and it's like you're kind of paralyzed with fear because it feels in that moment that any direction you run you're going to run in in the wrong direction and the rock is going to hit you and like it plays with that tension really well and it's it's the most grounded approach to people with superpowers that I've ever seen in a film I think like to the point where it's almost a horror movie and that can be you can call that a superhero genre film and I thought it was so great like really like unique and simple in its execution very little CGI a lot of it's practical using like like off-camera fans to create ripples in the water to give the impression that there's like force fields being shot at shot and generated at other people and I highly recommend it it's called The Innocence people in chat are asking but I really enjoyed that but yeah superhero film that was great and it wasn't bad just because it was a superhero film like you can do really interesting shit with it. It just reminds me of Chronicle that did a very good job with that as well. Chronicle was interesting as well yeah Chronicle's not art though I genuinely think that the guy who made this and even Martin would probably be like well no no no that is and you'd be like god damn it. Yeah Chronicle was doing the found footage thing and it's like yeah. Well I think they would almost see it as intuitive while we're like no it's not though that's the whole point it's not intuitive at all as to what is it is in Cinnabar When making this video I went back to see a couple of older MC releases chief amongst them being Iron Man won the first Avengers film and then game which was I don't know I think you would be the only one who catch that. Yeah The reason why is because I've just I've been trying to they come and go so quick. I'm pretty sure I heard Halo music briefly but I'm not sure that sounds like There's all kinds of music used in this I hear the source of that work What else? Hotline Miami Yeah. There's a lot of different tracks. He's quite good with his music selection like the hotline Miami music was specifically over top the part where peacemakers like killing people with a shotgun or something. Dude the guy the good editor. Yeah taking that away. He said about modern misinformed and hyperbolic but honestly the metaphor comparing the MCU to a theme park is a perfect analogy when making this video I went back to see a couple of older MC releases chief amongst them being Iron Man won the first Avengers film and Avengers Endgame which are an interesting selection because it shows a massive divide between Marvel and their beginnings to Marvel at the peak of success Marvel had taken a massive risk in starting this whole cinematic venture initially the company was in debt and unless their name was Spider-Man or Wolverine nobody gave a shit about giving some obscure comic book character a chance in their own movie so Iron Man was a very risky film. Nobody cared about the character it was coming out. Because we made a big thing about how Iron Man was a risk in response to him saying otherwise right I'm pretty sure he said small self-contained safe stories. Yeah which we were like well Iron Man wasn't safe it was the first one it was just yeah. At a time of steep competition and had lofty aspirations to be much bigger than it's one movie. And that's the thing he's making the argument for us now. It was like yep true. A risk that was worth $525 million in the entire Marvel catalogue. So what you're left with is a movie that feels bizarrely out of place when contrasted with the rest of the MCU's content. It didn't sell itself on its IP. Its lead actor was someone who had a spot... I think you can say this for a couple of the movies that they really are themselves it's not really much about this. Because he's saying it for this I think because of the fact that they really didn't have avengers in the horizon when they were making this. They were more like let's just make this work but yeah I feel like that senses in a lot of the movies in the earlier phases. I think so. Even the bad movies have it. It's okay. I imagine it was in the back of their mind but they probably treated the first Iron Man film kind of like a pilot for a series where they're just like let's see how this does. Build on top of that yeah. Reputation wasn't well known by the general public. It didn't sell itself on cameos and Easter eggs because they knew nobody would care about showing off Nick Fury or Shield. You say that as if they didn't have the potential for it but if the trailer had like he's like I'm gonna need help on this mission. I know a guy. He's Parker. You're gonna bring Peter Parker from a Sparrow baby universe. There was originally going to be a reference in the Incredible Hulk which was created with the same sort of like you know it's not it's two years later right so it's and it was by Oh fuck I always mix that up because those two were both made by a different there was like a different to them they were for the rest of the movies right so the first one was paramount so Iron Man was paramount and Incredible Hulk was universal yeah and then I think back to paramount again with the rest of phase one and then it was Disney for Avengers right I think because Disney Marvel in 2009 after a lot of the deals that already been sort of set in stone if I remember correctly I'd have to google it I'm pretty sure originally they were going to have Iron Man's cameo with Ross at the end of Incredible Hulk he was gonna say like oh man your project didn't go so well huh with your little experiment with the abomination stuff and he's like no and he's like you know I can relate I fucking gave a guy some metal arms over in a different city and he fucking ran them up as if to imply the Raimiverse is connected to the MCU that was something that was gonna be in there but they took it out Oh okay cause that post credit scene is still in there when he talks to Ross yeah I'm pretty sure you can go find this because I remember reading it and being like no way they were gonna do that huh interesting that is interesting it was a movie that wanted to be a big summer blockbuster that would attract a general audience and leave a lasting impression even today the movie has a lot of stuff in it that is sorely missed in its future entries the actual Iron Man suit still looks amazing also yeah this is the point that everyone should agree on if they don't they're wrong Iron Man looked his fucking best and baller pretty much in the first movie and by the time yeah it's the best a lot of people say like oh he just looks the worst the more you go on I still think he looks the worst in Age of Ultron I really don't like the way he looks in the second half of that film but yeah up until Avengers like the first Avengers movie suit looks amazing gorgeous I would go as far as saying I don't know what happened still one of my top favorites I think my favorite Marvel movies are still Infinity War Homecoming and the first Iron Man film sorry what was that for you yeah I love that first movie man solid they really captured the vibe of just being on his level like following him through his journey and just when he gets to this point you just like fuck he's built himself all the way up to here and he just annihilates them and they work their way up to this because this is like an hour into the movie that this scene it might even be a little bit more than an hour into the movie that this scene happens and what's really cool is that even though they follow up this scene of him absolutely annihilating these guys they then have the dog fight when he's kind of like out of his element because in the dog fight he's like really struggling yeah yeah hello oh hey man awesome oh shit hold on let me close the stream sorry hey what up we're watching a new video on the YouTubes I know I got a cool little message on Twitter I was like what the fuck I hope it was friendly we talk about Marvel every once in a while here and there and I find it interesting that we are a section of the internet that have I guess a particular point of view and it's funny when we end up agreeing with people it's often for very different reasons and I suppose since you're here may as well ask you a couple questions if you're interested out there your perspective on the old MCU we basically theorize that it's all just gone down the tubes because of really really poor writing practices I don't know if you know but like Black Widow was said to have been written in 13 days Doctor Strange was originally supposed to be written in 3 weeks then it was 2 weeks then it got thrown out and it was written as it was filmed the new Doctor Strange as far as I know yeah a lot of it is built they put the tracks down as the trains running now that doesn't mean you can't have a fucking awesome film as a result it's possible I think the example people go with is Mission Impossible Fallout and it's not even to be fair to Fallout like well the strategy with those is that the action scenes are crafted and then the script is crafted after right that's kind of how it goes so they have to it's still a challenge but I just think that there is no respect for the script writing process anymore and we're starting to see everything collapsing on itself now with the more stresses of time I think Covid didn't help either because the first production line for Multiverse Matters got cancelled because of that so they just restart that's what we think the problem is but I think you're highlighting a lot of things in your video that I consider superfluous almost like are they building up to a grander storyline and does that make it a worse phase as a result like possibly but I don't think it comes close to just the fact that the individual components are really badly put together yeah I know this kind of comes across as very like I guess kind of cowardly but if I were to go back in time there is a lot about that video I would definitely rephrase I think the whole thing about the phase being planned sorry a lot of shit about I talked about involving like the phases plan I'm not really sure I stand by I think it's more just like the execution of it I have a problem with I didn't think I highlighted many of the key aspects that I should have I don't think it's cowardly I think it's maybe you've changed your mind or maybe with more clarity understand what the like that you had the feeling about you know the problems and then it's over time you've managed to hone in more somewhat the problem because I mean I would say that I think it's execution yeah like that's what I think the problem is I think that I don't people being talking about superhero fatigue and stuff like that and I don't think it would exist if everything that had come out was great I think that everybody would be like really keen on more superhero stories like the investment doesn't go away as long as it's good mm-hmm yeah I think there are rare exceptions where like scripts are written on the fly like during shooting and it comes out good like Die Hard is an example of that the first one where Steven D'Souza I think his name is the screenwriter he's he was writing pages and then they would shoot it the next day while he was like writing the next chunk of the script and it turns turned out to be one of the greatest action movies ever right and maybe there was something too that the that way of doing things that injected a certain energy into that script that made it work I don't know but like for that films production it's like Silver Joel Silver of Silver Productions they got that tower and it's like we know we're gonna make a movie with this tower and we know we're gonna rig the roof with explosives and we're gonna blow it up and it's like Steven make us write a story around these facts right and that's what he did and it turned out good but I would say like as a rule of thumb get the script done first make sure it's up to stuff and then shoot it if you can do that you know that's interesting that you bring it up because something we've talked about is how a lot of Marvel films will pre-visualize action scenes well before a script exists and so like the job of the writer is to basically justify these action scenes like Black Widow before they had a script they knew that she would be like fighting while parachuting like falling from somewhere high and then what's the consequence oh we put the red room in the sky for some reason we're just fucking absurd hey it's hidden okay cause it keeps moving that's how it's hidden no one ever noticed Ultron and no one noticed I don't know that we've I don't know that we've gotten it from the video yet if you what would you say it's typo right I'm not misspeaking what do you are think of like the strongest and the weakest Facebook projects I think the strongest so far has probably been no way home and that's correct choice as for as for weaker oh boy um I don't know I can't really there's not really anything that pops into my head is like oh that was exceptionally bad there's stuff I would put that on Eternals personally go sorry go ahead yeah I don't know Eternals is just weird I really I really didn't like Moon Knight I didn't really like fucking the witness soldier at all and fucking what's even come out I don't know I didn't really like Ghost of Strange that much it's it's a war isn't it I think myself rags metal I'm assuming all of us for MOM is the worst in Phase 4 Multiverse of madness followed in close second by Loki and then third is Thor Love and Thunder I think it probably is I forgot about that I forgot about the most recent one yeah absolutely and those three together absolute catastrophe it sucks that it's gotten this hideously bad and what was interesting about Thor Love and Thunder especially is that it seemed like the whole internet agreed on that one it was like whoa what a stinker that was awful and it's um every reason for people to be in favor of it because people love Taika Waititi people enjoy good comedy it was all tongue in cheek had plenty of fun things in it but like man the jokes were so badly put together and the story was absolute nonsense you even had Christian Bale trying he tried his ass off dude he was uh that's the case with a lot of the actors though it's really not the force of the actors they've got great talent and they've got great talent on the production standpoint with like set design and props and things like that the visual effects people if they had more time it could really show off like you know what like I don't mean we've seen their work right with Thanos and Rocket like everybody's working it's the writing like it's just I don't know what it is like well I do a shit but like I don't know what happened I don't know what what wrong well yeah because uh I guess one of the other questions going to have for you as well is um would the information recently about DC have switched your mind on exactly who's sort of winning in the overall oh yeah that's that's a part in the video that is aged exceptionally poorly and also I think I didn't phrase right um when I said like part of the reason DC is winning right now like obviously it's fucking not even at the time like it's it was a clusterfuck it was a mess I just meant like I really like the suicide squad I really like peacemaker I really like the Batman and I love I thought maybe you were referring to um the critical claim aspect because like if you go from 2019 onward we get Joker the Batman I'll even give you a peacemaker and uh the suicide squad versus what does Marvel have in terms of what we would genuinely consider to be well written stuff or even partially well written it's like no way home is it um and so it's like yeah so in that sense I suppose DC is winning but yeah overall I was just like I mean DC unfortunately the Batman um it didn't make anywhere near as much money they probably wanted it to compared to like like no way home fucking clue the box office beat it not just strain like more money than Batman uh the suicide squad didn't it flop unfortunately yeah I did so like yeah uh you know Marvel is like laughing all the way to the bank I suppose while DC is just like fuck what are we supposed to do like what is happening that's that's why we would say it our coverage like we kind of feel bad for DC because they're just it's a circus for them right now yeah I just think you've been marketing it horribly and like the thing I commended them for which is like they really encourage or seem to encourage a lot of creative expression with individual projects and now they fucking they don't want to do that anymore yeah but no they're not interested in that though I guess um it looks like the Batman will persist because that was specifically cited as one of the films that the CEO likes and wants more of yeah so that would be nice if that can sort of continue to exist in its own little corner well and if the second one is anywhere near as good as the first one it should be able to get a stained legacy in like a good way like it should be the mainstay then and DC will have a bit more maybe respect and stability also greatly benefits that they don't have any uh I don't know world ending scenarios at the moment at DC at the moment yeah at the moment I say that Mr. Freeze what my Adam's gonna be about Mr. Freeze is gonna freeze the whole world I still I've seen that trailer like a million times every time I went to the cinema for one of the movies it's like I still don't know what the fuck this movie is gonna be about really black Adam is so generic looking yeah what no no what's so interesting about him is that you know like how heroes will not kill people but they do even though as we have we have footage on on stream right now the first action scene it is too touching a dude so hard that he goes flying into a wall this is quite a good screenshot for that conversation yeah yeah I'm different than someone like I'm not your dad's iron man I'm not your black Adam the black Adam DC universe what is he killed so many people guys you wouldn't believe it um any any additional thoughts on the whole Martin Scorsese thing I'm curious what uh is anything else on that because we've come across it several times we believe the Chad fucking response to it all is come on Marty it is cinema it's just bad and that's it um I don't remember how I phrase this specifically but um I don't agree with that like obviously it is like of merit and it is like it's most of what I watch like I nowadays like I completely just gorge myself on popcorn shit um wait do you see maybe the I don't know it felt a bit weird to have like a whole video talking about how bad that is to be like that's what I'm doing well it's like I didn't the point I guess whether or not I expressed it right um I don't know I definitely didn't um the point I was getting at more there the thing I bring them up for is just kind of the theme park act aspect of it like I felt that a lot with um watching shit like multiverse of madness where it's like a lot of the time I feel like most people are like ah I'm going to go see this one because blank shows up like I think if you were to go back a few years back I'd completely disagree with the theme park thing but now I'm starting to be like ha that's kind of like what a lot of marvel is selling itself on like I even remember when Moon Knight was coming out like every week somebody was being like oh my god the Hulk's going to be in the next episode guys no I remember I remember Shang-Chi people were like I can't wait to see what's going on in the next episode I remember that being a thing I was like are you fucking kidding me like who cares he's just going to show up and scream the big thing with she-hulk is daredevil that's like a huge selling point for that show that's what a lot of people's investment in watching it comes from well I think it's just yeah I love the controversy for that is like that's getting overshadowed by the controversy for shit the CGI looks like people are much more excited about what they're going to do with that character I think in terms of the Martin Scorsese thing I think all you did was what a lot of people did which is where you try to make better a quote that just is pretty like silly I found it fascinating that you felt the need to say like Guardians 2 shouldn't count along this and it really felt to me that you had found meaning in Guardians 2 where I believe and I just I'm going to say like I think it's fair for people to find meaning in something like the room people enjoy it out through the characters and they can just be like this is this is what I got from it this is boa if that's all that we require to then elevate something from theme park ride like shallow and stuff too meaningful I think it's easy to do with every every installment for the MCU well that was like a part where I was I wasn't agreeing with Martin there I'm Martin I wasn't agreeing with Scorsese there I think that was more so me just bringing up that I think the whole like superhero movies or not cinema like I how I think that's a little bit bullshit yeah well because you do that yeah you do said that you disagree with him it's just that um it was a real thing it was that to that well what I was highlight was just like it shouldn't be that you go like Guardians 2 as an example of how it breaks this sort of they just be like all of them are they all of them are honestly like if you I don't I like I famously hate Iron Man 3 but there's plenty I could say for what Iron Man 3 does for like character work and stuff but if we fast forward to phase four I could do it for Doctor Strange I think you said like part of what you didn't like about Multiverse of Madness was there was no there was no arc for Doctor Strange was that right I think it was there he had a dull arc yeah well because like the first thing that we all I say we all I think me and Franey talked about this when we first seen it we were baffled by the fact that they ran about three to four arcs for him at once in that movie it was all these components that were running they had um whether or not it's like right for him to take one life in exchange for everybody's it's the does being a superhero make him a happy person it's the having the control to make the biggest decisions in the world holding the knife is like a part of his personality to the point where it ruins his own reputation relationships with people and how is he going to reconcile that like they were running all of these things at once but none of them had any kind of satisfying coherency or answer and some of the characters like Christine were just dragged into it and forced to sort of comport to it despite the fact that she has her own life um she never talks as though she has her own life she only talks in regard to him uh so like what I'm suggesting is that I was actually quite interested in all of the crap they were doing to try and come across as an actual story this is this is why I'm still kind of interested in the MCU in some ways is um I find the incompetence of this storytelling fascinating sometimes yeah absolutely it's yeah it's like a like watching a train wreck so like give you an example one of the biggest like fucking mind blow this is why we consider what most of this man is probably the worst like there's about a bazillion arguments but when they establish that uh by being in the wrong universe you gradually create the chance for an incursion like it's an inevitability and you need to get out of the universe I can't believe they established that and then no character tells that to wonder whose whole goal is to go to a different universe and be with their children all you need to tell her is oh mechanically you'll destroy the universe if you do that so uh don't but like this thing when the when they wrote these things they just they're doing everything scene by scene in the moment they're not they don't care about how any of it matches anything else and um it's just destroying everything you know whether or not they're building to the multiverse or Kang or whatever else hmm that's our take we're much more positive about it as you can see I think there's plenty of action movies not just superhero movies that are cheap unsubstantive thrills which I think is the definition that Scorsese is applying to theme parks when he uses that term but to apply that to the entire subgenre is just lazy like well the thinking about it I think capital opinions was in chat earlier saying like part of this you have to keep in mind is that he's like he admitted to like not having watched basically any of them as well right yeah hmm he's like yeah he's probably not gonna have a reason to think they're better than a sort of cynical view if he's not even checking them out um but yeah uh well was there anything you wanted to ask us or um sorry I'm a little flustered as you could probably tell no bro I guess just like because I've come in extremely halfway um what was like the general thought about so far you've got close to impeccable editing um I'm very impressed we've watched about a bazillion videos on eFap in our time and you've got some of the best editing we've seen though I will say in terms of the technical aspects yeah it's I would use the word erratic in terms of there are some sequences in this that I'm almost it's the equivalent of eating too much cake where I'm just like I think it's massively over edited hmm I think it would be um lots of noises that are too loud constant transition if you dial it back just a little bit it uh because I think that occasionally it can kind of like off you skate the points that you're making like it just becomes a little bit difficult to focus in on exactly what you're saying so I think as if you dial it back like the clarity will increase like substantially because you already you already have like a clear level of competency can I make a guess I've I've spotted Dr. skipper's talking in chat are you part of the commentary community um I am very much not but I am a friend of his yeah well because I was just gonna say you're editing now I'm thinking about it reminds me of a lot of the way commentary community people edit their videos um I used to talk to a lot of people in that community but I really do not fuck with it I don't want any oh yeah no worries because it's a you know any community on youtube is fucking cursed whole at this point I was just gonna say that that could explain where you may have learned it because it does feel a little bit unique competitively because video assayists they tend to have a different you guys know what I'm talking about when I say this right like there's a commonality between like brown table high top and a bunch of the others yeah they're not they're not quite like this they're not quite like this this is a different beast but still of a level that I think is much better than a lot of people we cover yeah well I used to make videos before like I was typo I had like another thing and it really it didn't go anywhere and I tried to like fix a lot of the mistakes and the reason for the editing is for two reasons one like it helps me avoid copyright if like the music is constantly changing and the clips are constantly changing doesn't really get picked up for claims and I think it's more fun to do and also I think it helps watch time like me personally I'm always more engaged if the frame is moving and changing and it's like there's it's some kind of it's dynamic then it's kind of static I my brain starts to sizzle a little bit if I watch um like video assays that kind of like stay on one thing or use the same music too much so I kind of wanted to avoid that fair enough that's a good point yeah so we well so the overall thing is that we we agree with your conclusion we just disagree with a lot of the ways you come to figure it out ie what you've stated are like the bigger problems that the mcs fourth phase is facing I think I covered it when you first came in but just like broadly speaking like oh they don't even have an overall plan that's clearly like hampering them we believe pretty much that if all of the films were really well-executed individually but contradicted each other I think it would still be fine people would would be fine with it that's kind of weird that I don't know that this thing turned up there but it's not in this though blah blah blah because that was kind of what phase two was to the public I would say the movies on their own people really loved them but when you actually look at their will building it doesn't match very well I think something that looking back I think I kind of went off course with my original intent because something I really wanted to drive home and I'm not entirely sure I did very well was that I don't really want like the big interconnected university anymore I don't really care about it I'd much rather prefer smaller individual things but my main issue with phase four is that it's trying to have its cake needed to like it's I've gotten so many comments on my video about like oh it's another phase one it's trying to set up new things but it's constant it's constantly putting in like setups for future things there's shit tons of people all over the place everywhere in this it's not I wouldn't compare to phase one at all I wouldn't because you look at like an Iron Man one like that's very centralized of its main character and then like it's telling their story and then you look at like a Shang Shi or something and it's going all over the place there's a bunch of different other MCU characters in there that I feel kind of hampers the story they're trying to tell I think it even makes the cinematic universe less cool that's another thing I kind of like about DSC no sorry someone needs to take charge someone needs to take charge I was just going to say I wonder if something that I think I said before while we were watching the video is I think that phase four is the worst of both worlds in that it everybody wants to do whatever they want with their story with no regard for the broader universe that it connects into so you've got something that's incredibly incoherent yet at the same time none of the films are that distinct in terms of the types of stories they want to tell or or editing yeah I think Moon Knight could have been such a fucking cool show if they are just like if they disregarded the Marvel formula and the Marvel presentation but they didn't were you hyped for Moon Knight before it came out not really because there's a different story for it I haven't really been hyped for anything other than No Way Home I guess with Moon Knight it was more morbid curiosity because I was hearing during the build up like odd's going to be gritty we're bringing back the gritty side of the MCU it's going to be street level and then it's just the complete opposite you lied to me I still like more of the source material stuff and I was like oh my god this is so cool and then I watched Mr. Robot and I was like this is kind of what I wanted from the Moon Knight show right well I mean yeah we're going to compare Moon Knight to Mr. Robot it's not a particularly favorable comparison that's for sure they did the same thing with Moon Knight that happened with WandaVision and it happens with a lot of this shit by the time you hit the last episode when you see the two kaiju's fighting you're like what the hell was this show I thought this was I thought Moon Knight was going to be a street level detective mixed with like this guy who has to deal with these alternate personalities and the history of his his own history is like shrouded in mystery and he doesn't understand it but instead yeah we got to have a big end of the world climactic like showdown with yeah the big kaiju fight between the crocodile and the skeleton bird yeah what made me interested in Moon Knight was Oscar Isaac because I think that guy's terrific whatever he is and he was terrific in that show yeah but I watched episode one and I went okay I thought he did a great job but I just I didn't even think it was bad but I wasn't enticed to watch the rest of it we were fine with it yeah you were interested to see more I wanted to see more after the first episode I had a cautious optimism and then it very quickly evaporated 2 was really bad 3 was really bad 4 was really bad 5 was like oh 5 was weird it was weird I didn't really like 5 that much that hence my choice of oh because there's stuff in there that's like okay you're trying to draw it because like I was actually really surprised that Marvel displayed like a a child getting abused to the point of them developing a second personality it's just like that's a little bit ballsy of you okay cool but I still don't think that especially that last episode just looking back on Moon Knight as a whole it's kind of funny because I'm trying to almost try and give it a bit of credit to it when I realize Moon Knight is seemingly with Thor 11 Thunder and MOM crashing people's view of the phase 4 we would have thought Loki should have done it but loads of people really loved Loki so you never know but at the same time it seems like every single thing comes and goes like Miss Marvel was a thing and it just came and went nobody talks about it Thor 11 Thunder you forgot that that was the most recent film everything comes and goes so quickly the half life is like you all on these projects nobody cares about Thor guy anymore nobody cares about Eternals that was a funny part of I can't remember when it was in this video but you were summarizing you summarized phase 1 you did all the projects phase 2 all the projects phase 3 you skipped out Captain Marvel and was it Captain Marvel and Ant-Man? yeah like we figured you just must have forgotten those two like we did honestly yeah yeah the awkward middle children if I may provide some input on the video you made Typo I mean if you're looking for it yeah no I watched it and you made a great argument about like keeping all the clips brief to avoid any copyright issues but I would suggest if you're going to maintain that brevity for each clip maybe dial back on the transitions a bit I did find that it was overwhelming like the speed of the information being conveyed as well as the amount of sounds because like you put so much work into the sound effects and like your music selection but I think you just got to mix the sounds and the music a little lower or is it necessarily better sounded like he was making it for a more erratic audience this is the kind of thing that can be shared on tiktok I assume is I don't know if we're old or not I always have to wonder yeah we are old same point in the previous century in regard to the arguments you were making I was largely inclined to agree with you I mean I think the only point you made that I really disagreed with was a point you made about going to see Doctor Strange just for the cameos in Multiverse of Madness like where I think we kind of agreed on this podcast that we went because we really like that character and Benedict's portrayal of him and you know it's like oh maybe there's going to be a good story here but I largely agree with your point about Marvel being too focused on the interconnectedness of everything and like the broad plan as opposed to ensuring the quality of the films on an individual level but the information was coming at me so fast and the visuals were so quick and the sound effects were quite loud I found myself rewinding a lot and turning on closed captions to like absorb the information better so really I mean it's an easy fix I think to make it more to have it better absorbed by people I would just say cut back on the transitions or just keep it to simply cuts just simple cuts without even putting anything on them I think you can do the same thing where you have like the rapid cuts between different shots and then you have the sound effects that punctuate that and I think that even if you did it with cuts it would achieve the same thing but like the moving of the frame is like a little extra bit of you know visual information it sounds nitpicky but because like the style in general like you're quite good at editing I think I guess that's the hope better than me I don't even know how to do some of those things okay so that's just my thoughts on it yeah for sure I think a lot of my because I know I'm very aware like was it like every two minutes there's like a little transition I do most of the time it's just because I think it would be fun to put it in but like there was one I remember specifically it was like when Thanos naps his finger that was because I had like an audio f**k up I think and I wanted to distract him I think that's probably what I love I like that it's honestly because I think one where I'm like it's like the green goblin like smashing the helmet with a rock and then he does that weird transition Iron Man 3 and that was because I realized that the audio didn't flow very well if you just go from that to like cut immediate cut I think a lot of it's probably a scripting issue I could definitely there's a lot I could definitely fix with my scripting or even just my voice recording to circumvent a lot of that when we were talking about your editing I brought up zero punctuation as an example of something that moves very fast and it's like throwing a lot of information at you at once but what what I think works about that is that the visuals are very simplistic like they're still images there's not a lot to like soak in in regards to visuals and the cuts are very simple no transitions just cuts it's almost like stick figures in very kind of very easy to absorb to what he's saying in a very very direct way yeah so you can almost like you listen to what he's saying and even though it's very fast you you can focus on them and just kind of stare at the visuals which are more peripheral you know it's easier to soak in like if that had complicated animated visuals and stuff that would be a lot harder to process hmm given the volume of arguments like being made and the speed at which like I don't even know if he like speeds up his voice in post production maybe he does I think he does maybe yeah I'm not sure we are well we have a couple what's your you have to leave anytime soon Mr. Typo because you we've heard which over to the other video that regards the same topic but as much shorter and you could maybe join us to see if we agree or disagree with the video or us who knows um I think I got about like an hour left until I gotta well that should be enough I think yeah yeah sweet in that case as you can see in our little that's the link I assume you've used watch together before but I can't be sure never in my fucking life wow see this new generation don't even know about watch together eyes can you believe that is we're living in another world oh my god that's my chicken my little south part chicken um so yeah the way it works is just it's like a youtube video but all of us are in this and all of us can pause and play whenever we want but your volume is yours and well that's about it I think so much else for you to use use the um use the arrow at the bottom left to start and stop if you click on the screen it just oh yeah yeah I don't know why they click on the screen will pause it for like two seconds and then it automatically plays again that seems to be what it does every time I've ever used it and I don't know what the point of that is yeah not sure now the second video we were planning on looking at and I suppose are now it's from nerd now if you remember we have covered him once before and I believe the video we covered from him before was about how the problem oh fuck was it the problem with superhero fights is that they're always in the air or something like that you remember this I can't help you I can't remember oh it was it was a bizarre argument so remember the main references was Shazam Steel and um I think even Chronicle someone's gonna have to help me out in chat with what the argument was but it was very strange like the big problem right now is that they fight in the air or something oh that one so if they're shooting lasers at each other but their feet are planted on the ground it's fine yeah it's very exciting to watch yeah now that you say that it's all coming back to me yeah he has a yeah and Sandberg agreed with the video it was fucking weird I assume it was just because it was like a friendly thing all of that was on my channel we did that oh we definitely covered it on eFap because I remember I think I told you explicitly like this needs to be seen on eFap the fact that chat know about it as well um I think you were the one that made me aware of it okay you you you send these takes to me sometimes anyway he's got this video and it's called the unfortunate problems with Marvel's phase four so let's go for a different perspective on what it is that is tanking the fourth phase in Marvel's cinematic universe the idea was to bring together a group of remarkable people see if they could become something more the MCU has taken superheroes from being the laughing stock of Hollywood to the most financially successful genre and were they ever I don't think that's fair at all how did Sam Raimi how the fuck is this the MCU that did this by the way Batman and Robin clips yeah it's a everyone loved it and everyone to this day loves it and thinks it's a masterpiece okay I'll hear nothing different on a serious note when did when did Blade come out again 1998 I think when did Batman and Robin come out 1997 okay well so Blade was a little campy I'll give it to you but that's that's internet toward and then you get the Spider-Man movies and the X-Men movies which yeah like you can't deny the saying that you know the MCU has made it not a laughing stock and financially like safe thing to do is just like I don't know man three Spider-Man movies do you see how many X-Men movies they made I don't know feel like we're skipping over some of the components yeah but that's fine revisionist history global media and yet now with super producer Kevin Feige at full command of everything Marvel you'd expect things to be chugging along swimmingly and they are on one level however a closer look reveals a significant problem with Marvel's phase four the MCU started in 2008 with the release of the Robert Downey junior vehicle iron that that that mouse clicky noise yeah it's always every time I hear it I'm like man and just what a fucking killer person don't you that's how much is kind of do I kind of hear that someone yeah I know I have a murderous rampage inside of me that I'm hiding back with this smile and friendliness but wait how do I enable the bell how do I subscribe all the mouse okay right oh I use them out and then do I do I do anything when I oh okay oh I press this button here I think it's like it moves I do wonder sometimes where they get it from is it just like a YouTube video the screen except for that part and you download it and you just crop it out and then you I put it in one of my in one of my highlights like on my stream highlights just it's just it's just a transparent thing you can download it's like millions of them online so they come with the clicky it out they come with a clicky clack would you have to make it yourself no you have to make the sounds it's just Giffenheimers out there you can get you rescued the gif with the Giffenheimers Giffenheimers Iron Man the first film in an interconnected web of feature films spanning multiple studios characters and franchises in case you're unfamiliar the eras of the Marvel Cinematic Universe are divided up into what mega producer Feige and company have he remembered Captain Marvel termed phases phase one is six films Iron Man 2 Avengers phase two is six films Iron Man 3 to Ant-Man and phase 3 acting as the climactic third act of the initial movement of the universe is 11 films Captain America Civil War to Spider-Man Far From Home these 23 films act as a complete story more or less they have a beginning a middle and an end millions of people from across the globe have yeah a lot of this is just yeah I mean well yeah I can't disagree with any of this this is all establishing the rules the ground yeah it's a summary I suppose you'll be making arguments feel he is accurate so far let us I'm very curious where he's going to go real to the exploits and triumphs and failures of the iconic Marvel Super Heroes all of these films lead up to the crescendo of the twin capstones to the story Avengers Infinity War and Avengers Endgame these two films directed by the Russo brothers hold in close to 5.5 billion dollars wait wait wait I think I have 200 dollars which is fucking hot food in the universe they are an achievement in the craft and business of filmmaking that has never been paralleled they were a definitive into the story that was jump-started all those years ago in 2008 and then you gotta move on Marvel and the rest of the world had to move on Marvel's hotly anticipated Phase 4 promised new characters new twists and turns in the ongoing plot and even more exciting yeah I mean because I think we talked about it briefly when covering the first video it's just like there are places to go you know that's hope I think we talked about this all the way back when we were like yeah you know this could be good still and now with a new element thrown into the mix Kevin Feige would be overseeing TV projects for Phase 4 meaning not only would Phase 4 include numerous films you know this like disembodied Huber did this void that displays especially when it's him you know it's like this guy wandered in to this title screen he's in the logo of this he's in the logo cinematic logo verse please let me out of here no you have to do more it does seem that he's spread quite thin it's like give him some help throwing another guy throwing another just a chair throw another producer into the portal no no no we only want to pay one person Kevin you do everything films but it would also include 8 TV show projects each roughly 10 episodes well it would have been more but they changed their minds last week here's where we get to the problem with Phase 4 simply put it's not learning the lessons it needs from the comics it's overly convoluted requires literal homework from the audience and has major structural issues on a storytelling level um so those just sound like things that are bad in general as opposed to I assume the argument there is that that's what the comics went through therefore they should have been I think he's saying that they're making the same mistake which is that it can be very difficult to get maybe not that specifically but it's often said it's very difficult to get into comics where do you start but the thing is like if I broaden that out it could be like yeah but those comics didn't learn from the people before them who wrote stories and had the same problems you know what I mean like it's it's not quite because like I think it would be more applicable if the person who wrote Iron Man's first comic and made mistakes then wrote the movie and made the exact same mistakes who'd be like how did you how did you not learn from the bubble like um I'm partially convinced especially in fucking phase four these writers aren't even they haven't even read the source material do I don't even know that they're where they exist I mean they won't watch the shows that proceed their films so I know like John Favreau um maybe even Shane Black I don't know I know Joss Whedon read the comics like they used to hire people who are very nerdy as well as creators yeah but now there's like a new phase of nerd where it's like yeah I've seen all of the newest Iron Man movies I'm not repulsed by the concept of superheroes I am a nerd I am still invested in seeing all of product hell yeah I am very cool she recast Pietro there's been a lot of chatter online about how certain people in the Marvel fandom are frustrated by the fact that there isn't enough forward movement happening on the core story of the MCU they feel that the MCU is just treading water and has a pacing problem compared to the breakneck speed that phases one and two have like this isn't even close to touching upon what I think the problem is in phase four what we're gonna do is we might well it'll be the same thing when we say well but is it good like the idea that it's the pacing that's really what people have been talking about is the problem like again I still think Multiverse of Matter is one of the highest like non-stop paced movies that we've ever had it's just really bad yeah cause I don't think it's a matter of pacing it's rudderless where are we going we're going very fast nowhere you know it's like we're getting pulled in ten different directions and so we end up staying still cause we have no idea where it's all leading to we're charging into the fucking IP void universe we're just appearing every time like remember that ad for when they were first like showing off what phase four would be and they just go boom boom boom into your screen it's essentially just that that's what it has been this whole time we don't know what's going on it's just stuff coming out of it on the overly convoluted front the film side of things has become so linked to the TV side that there are massive story beats happening behind a paywall on an app that the general public may or may not have be fair well I mean it doesn't have a paywall exactly and doesn't disney plus have like a hundred ten million subscribers and oh man I actually hate to make this argument I really do but why couldn't you've said this about phase three you gotta go watch Dr. Strange to know why he's in Ragnarok who's this guy you know like you can say that if someone said you can't do it from home you gotta go to the fucking theater or you have to buy the DVDs and it's the only way of course to watch movies if someone said the idea that I'm fine though because that's sequels versus a different like format or something I should be like I don't know I feel that way and it's a little bit arbitrary the idea that a paywall only applies to television as opposed to like a box office is seems silly when it's I'd say it's less applicable because one paywall is done and then you get access to all the shows as it's already been played as well you're better off not doing your homework on Marvel films because you might learn that it makes even less sense. You'll go mad you'll go insane. At this point I really do feel like the best and possibly only example of this fuck up actually coming to a head is the Multiverse of Manus one where there are people who have made significant points online about how it's absurd that the characters believe that Wanda is going to destroy the Multiverse they have no reason to think that and it's like you didn't watch WandaVision did you because like that's where they got it from and it's like that's Michael Waldron's fucking mistake he needed to be specific when he had Wong talking about it you've got to do that because like you can't really and I think this has been throughout all the phases if ever you you know you go oh here is Doctor Strange it's like well for those who didn't watch Doctor Strange just make sure they understand he's a fucking sorcerer he's aware of things and he's just keeping an eye on stuff you know nothing that's too complicated so they don't understand what's going on and I think they've done that that example in Multiverse of Manus one of the first times I was like oh fuck yeah you screwed that up because it if you don't watch WandaVision it's just like Wanda's like I wish to have my children and then Strange is like please don't destroy the Multiverse like wait what what? I don't understand people even got to the point of being like yeah it's just really hard that's how a mother who just cares about her children is treated it's like no wait you're confused so um yeah I throw this theory out too I think if all these individual projects were good and yet still relied on like I don't know tertiary information on other ones nobody would really care that much have access to I like your plan except it sucks so let me do the plan and that way it might be really good sure the first three phases of the MCU were a lot to keep straight but it was 23 movies it was a linear story if you showed up to the theater you got the narrative now you have to juggle the feature films and the vital continuity in the TV shows well so that's just about framing I could have just said that in a way more complicated way I could have been like you have to keep track of all the different IPs that encompass within this timeline you have to go check online or at least have some friend who's familiar with even knowing what Doctor Strange is and how it compares to something like Black Adam is that in the MCU no it's not okay what about the inhumans TV show should I be watching that what about the Netflix Netflix show should I be watching that and I'm sure he would say like well no those weren't necessary and he's like yeah well you know that's the thing right like how are people supposed to know you got to find that out you can't just assume right so yeah I don't know I feel like this is I'm almost defending phase four here and I don't like it does Doctor Strange 2 make any sense if you haven't seen WandaVision not really I think it makes more sense if you didn't watch it I honestly do because Wanda just says she she checked the dark hold and she's got children in an alternate universe and that's what she wants that's what she says the Multiverse of Man is you can find out the mechanics for why that happened in WandaVision unfortunately if you do that you'll find out a bunch of other things that then fuck with the Multiverse of Man is completely so I don't know man well I didn't see WandaVision and said it didn't make any sense so there you go it makes no sense no matter what last time we saw Wanda on the big screen she was reeling from the death of vision and now she's a villain talking about children she says it in I'm sorry but it is as clear in Multiverse of Man as it is in WandaVision she made up the kids and she wants them because they're real in a different universe they say all of this in Multiverse of Man is yeah they do Doctor Strange is like you made them up they're magical and then she's like every mother makes them with magic and later on he's like bitch seriously you made them up and then she's like yeah but they're real in a different universe I don't know that she's a villain with children now I love that it made her endearing if you haven't seen the Disney Plus show we're out of luck nah nothing makes sense here man the only thing that doesn't make sense is that nothing makes sense that's just Marvel Cinematic Universe Phase 4 that's a good summary it's a boon to him then for choosing that nice have always plagued the MCU whether their offerings are deemed as too formulaic or struggling with pacing there always seems to be some common flaws with the different phases of the MCU for phase 4 one of the common complaints is that the shows bottom out during the middle of the series everything tends to grind to a halt on a plot level look at Moon Knight yes the best episode of the series takes place in the middle with Mark running around an Egyptian temple that's not the best episode at all we need a didn't he just say the opposite of did he say they bottom out in the middle isn't that what he said that he just said we'll take Moon Knight but Moon Knight's best episode is in the middle according to him which by the way that episode was they're all mostly pissed that was particularly painful so this is the true take on the Marvel shows this is how they work episode one episode one is usually it ends on some big hook or some big reveal something that is like ooh we got to entice you to want to watch this like in Falcon and Winter Soldier it was that it ends on Walker as Captain America Loki ended on him joining the TVA to go on adventures or did it end with Sylvie getting teased or was she in episode two it ends on some hook I remember that much you're right anyway because we got WandaVision was they realized they're being watched the show is being watched Moon Knight ended with him getting in his costume talking face to face with Mark Hawkeye I remember in episode one ended basically with Hawkeye teaming up with Kate Bishop like them meeting each other they always end on some big hook that is to entice you to watch it the show then just deteriorates over the next few episodes episode four always ends with some big huge moment Loki dies gets sent to Aliothland in episode four Walker with the shield in episode four I think episode four of WandaVision has that's when Monica gets blasted out of the world this is episode four for Moon Knight right Moon Knight he dies in episode four it's so reliable episode five is the big penultimate the penultimate episode is always some big revelation filled episode because in WandaVision the penultimate episode was the flashbacks Loki it was him with all of the other Loki's trying to introspect and learn things about himself Moon Knight was the big episode with his backstory and then the finale they finally get their comic accurate costume and everybody's super happy and there's some big huge bullshit fight a big bullshit fight and then it's over and then there's the hook that's every single one with minor tweaks it is incredible how reliably they've used it it's really weird that he's like we all know the problem they bought him out in the middle that's the first time I've ever even heard this theory about the TV shows having that that sounds bizarre to me I think you can imply that more broadly too Halo did the same thing episode five is the big fight scene you gotta have that big mid-season hook where there's a bunch of things blowing up well Halo is there was someone on Twitter say this and I so agree with it Halo learned a lot of the bad lessons from that implies so Breaking Bad is a great show and a lot of what people will point to when Breaking Bad are the big moments I am the one who knocks the prison the prison like assassinations the you know Gus's death like they'll always point to these really climactic moments when they talk about that show but the reason why those sequences work so well is because of the slower quieter you could even say more mundane storytelling where like you're building these things up and so a lot of people seem to have pulled it from that we need big moments that's what it means to be real television is big moments big epic moments those scenes that people talk about so Halo is just filled with big epic moments but it's all supported by bullshit you know there's no substance behind any of it so it's worthless yeah but then the ensuing three episodes are just extended scenes of Oscar Isaac talking to him these six episodes in total I need to hear this again because it felt to me that he just like he said you know of all the five numbers two of them are pretty excellent four okay but three of them oof you're like wait I'm trying to decipher your madness how could you do this to me yes the best episode of the series takes place in the middle with Mark running around an Egyptian temple but then the ensuing three episodes are just extended wasn't the temple episode episode four? no the temple was four so there's two episodes left there was only one episode where he talks to himself so he goes he's like in the middle we hit the fourth of six episodes which is already like wait and then he says and then the next three are bad like there's two when his broad point is that it's bad in the middle yeah what the fuck very confused I don't know what's gone wrong you cannot maths this is not I very confused it's scenes of Oscar Isaac talking to himself how is this possible? I think that's a really redundant way to talk about a show that I'm not even that fond of he just talks to himself you mean reductive right oh what did I say redundant yeah I mean reductive reductive I am getting a little I got the energy levels they're not great okay I'm okay maybe I'll grab some form of drink that will spice me up that could be a plan I don't know Loki and Falcon and the Winter Soldier suffered from similar issues as well it's a lot to ask of a viewing public to not only sit through all these shows in order to understand a movie the script structure can fascinate me sometimes so he was like okay I'm gonna make the argument that the big thing these shows have as a problem is the middle drops out the middle part that's the bad part alright that's definitely the problem for all of them okay let's start with Moon Knight alright establish middle episode fuck okay so that was a good episode well the rest of it yeah episodes five and six of six are the bad ones right I've done my argument for Moon Knight now to move on to Loki and WandaVision I'll just say they have the same thing moving on bro you haven't done proven anything yet usually the structure would be claim, evidence, conclusion I feel like I feel like he set out to prove the point claim, different point there we go alright next he set out to prove the point, realized he was wrong they all have this problem whatever prove the point by saying this is the best episode or not okay next thing but I don't know what you mean movie but it's even more to ask when they're not up to the standards the movies have set another reason there is bad as each other let's not get things confused there is bad as each other Moon Knight just ain't as good as Thor 11 Thunder okay you guys need to get over it and it's so funny to say watch all these shows when they're 6 episodes when the average network television show is like 22-24 episodes a season and a lot of the time those episodes for these shows are shorter than 43 minutes or like 45 minutes the average length of a show it's actually not that much material at all probably by design because it's too expensive to make anymore you gotta pay the actors too much it costs too much to shoot it it's not that much material compared to the average television show it's amazing how long TV show seasons used to be like 24 hours that's a huge production thing what's happened is that Sopranos and stuff like that breaking bad with 13 episodes and a lot of British television is 6 episodes so it's like right the less episodes the better we are it's like well the better the fighting there was a correlation obviously less episodes you need to write more time per script but Marvel doesn't really the time is they're all made very quickly so it doesn't even matter that people are upset at phase 4 is something comic book fans are very familiar with but the general public might not be as much narrative de-escalation after a crossover event big arc or a significant creative teams run comes to an end the book typically goes back to basics it's a way of refreshing the status quo after Dan Slott's fighty run ended you get Nick Spencer taking over amazing in the literal title of his I have no idea what he's about to say the problem is the movie side I genuinely have no clue I would guess that we don't really do small basic stuff again after the end game but just go right into the multiverse stuff and that's a mistake is that we should be doing grounded stuff again because I agree actually with that absolutely but that wouldn't be learning from the comics mistakes at that point would it well it would be that comics have yeah it wouldn't be from the mistakes it would be unless he's citing the comics that made that mistake that it's a better understanding I mean it's one of the biggest points of criticism for how difficult it is to get into comics is where do you start where do you begin but if you have a comic that says amazing spider-man back to basics it's like oh well shit that's probably a good place to start like you can jump in there let's see what his point is first arc being back to basics it's a tried and true tradition in comics you tell your story you take the toys out of the play area and then you reset everything and start building something new that's what phase 4 really is 6 phase it's not though no it's not it is the opposite let us go through this one by one right one division you could maybe argue that that's really low stakes but the fact is she's literally the kidnapped a thousand people and she's at risk of expanding further and further I think that when you compared to the low stakes of like you know in Daredevil it's only dealing with the implications in one neighborhood of New York you know yeah and it's worth highlighting like there's the complications of vision what is essentially this huge weapon being you know with the government what are they doing with that alright that's probably lower-ish fine low-key okay we just blew it that's the biggest stakes you could possibly have that's dealing with all of the multi-verse so it's like okay what's next Falcon the Winter Soldier is like well that's geopolitics so like that's pretty big I think it's um I mean the end the end battle is about like the lives of some pretty important senators you know like the whole season is geopolitics I don't see how we could possibly argue that's and of course low-key is all time so that is not back to basics in fact stakes can't really get much higher well they do get higher but the risk of that ghoulish creepy monster dragon if it gets free it'll destroy earth so like it'll suck up all of humanity's soul of course black widow is about taking over earth yeah they're enacting they are literally finally enacting the black widow plan which is to just take over all of earth with all of the Eternals was the destruction of earth destruction of blowing up so it's the last deal no way home was about all of the multi-verse like bleeding in I guess Hawkeye was low stakes was it oh okay yeah okay yeah there we go maybe that's what he's talking about specifically and then Moon Knight is all of earth getting taken over and all of the souls of everybody are getting their souls sucked out multi-verse of manus the one that people forget about is the one with basic stakes multi-verse of manus is all of the multi-verse again all of everything and all of the universe with gods you know I wouldn't want to understate if you kill all of the gods that's going to have hideous fucking consequences for loads of different cultures and planets and stuff like not just in the sense that they're worshiping but is the only reason they're alive whatever mechanics are in place and looking to the future Wong says in the She-Hawk trailer our world is on the edge of a precipice which would never not be funny to me so I guess we could assume that there might be some big consequences in that show too to say Black Panther is probably going to be a big deal too because it's like a war between an underwater kingdom and one of the most powerful countries in the world I believe his references are pointing to the opposite conclusion is what you could say yeah it's bizarre that he thinks this is this is his base you compare it to phase one Iron Man was specifically about like this guy taking over the company to do evil things it's pretty low stakes relatively speaking I guess incredible hope was kind of high stakes because it was abomination running rampant in New York but even then compared to what we do now it's probably pretty low stakes Iron Man 2 was a guy who was doing evil things in one place so pretty low stakes relatively speaking Thor was a big deal that was a whole realm the Frost Giants and Captain America was about that was a big deal that was several cities it's just funny we're more than halfway through the video so I think this is the big point it's just wrong not true it's the opposite something new that's what phase 4 really is it's a back to basics phase I wish it was which isn't as fun as the grand scale of the climatic events oh dude you've gone so awry back to basics low stakes just not as fun as big epic showdowns I agree I can't put into words how awry that is it is awry it's incredibly awry it's just wrong quite awry it doesn't matter if they have the end of the world with a team of people trying to stop it oh well it didn't have the fucking name it's going to be another Avengers film in like three years now because it's not far away 2025 wait is it 2025 or is it yeah it's 2025 yes it is this movie anytime soon they're focusing on these smaller characters and universe building these narrative tropes aren't as apparent to filmgoers what if the universe building involves the destruction of the universe though it's the opposite of universe building yeah I just just literally saw a moon night does he not remember what the ending of moon night is a giant alligator was going to suck the souls out of everyone on the planet just be clear but also it was our planet it's not just one far away it's a very important one these narrative tropes aren't as apparent to filmgoers as comic book readers so some people have false expectations of what phase 4 is going to be you really think that's the problem like the people are like wait where's my big avengers fight you really think that's it here's the thing even if we would have subscribed to all of this those false expectations have in part been fueled by marvel's marketing people thought multiverse and madness would be a big deal and it is but it's also not you know like it's a big deal and that the actual stakes of the story are insane people looking for like some big epic shit like in that film you're kind of missing it like it's not really a multiverse of madness at all so it's kind of again it's the worst of both and that's if we agree with this which I don't think this it's just I don't think that people like end of the world stories that's just not how it works in terms of investment I don't think investment stems from end of the world it stems from characters yeah I can't fathom into the world even more I just can't do it everything being decided for daredevil returning and coming back why do you think that is it's not because they want to see daredevil flying through the multiverse fighting a bunch of aliens or something they want to just see daredevil do a normal daredevil street level stuff how do you count these things what happens won't happen these back to basic storylines are important for the life blood of a comic book universe it's how you establish new characters I fucking wish they did this in the mp but they did not do this new threats are the stories being presented in shang chi moon night and the other standalone projects the most impactful or mind blowing no are you kidding me what are you talking about the biggest stakes that could possibly ever be made in that universe is done in the show Loki establishes and the destruction of free will in the marvel cinematic universe in shit like that and this guy's like well if that wasn't enough rags in the same fucking phase we've got the destruction of the entire multiverse and multiverse and madness exactly yes how is this bigger than that you can't make bigger stakes how is this not bigger than that is actually the correct question I don't understand this at all but if executed correctly they have the potential of increasing the texture of the universe and endearing the audience to the characters only issue being it's kind of hit and miss currently the MCU are we about to highlight the actual problem it's a complete miss what is happening the actual problem being that they're not good stories this always fucking happens yeah because it's like you know the big problem is we didn't go back to basics but I mean even if we did the stories haven't been very well written so man just waste my time why did you say all the first bit who isn't learning the right lessons from the comics they're in a back to basics era but they're pitching themselves as still being in full blown crossover mode such a silly act what I don't even understand what we're saying anymore they're in back to basics but they're pitching themselves as in like team up mode wait is he trying to go around now are they and says like this should be the back to basic one but that's actually not what they're doing I thought yeah I thought the whole point I'm just trying to figure this out I thought the whole point he was making was that we got the comics did it and that's why the MCU is doing it too the following suit that the consumers just don't get it yeah that's what I thought too which is leading to audience dissatisfaction and pacing issues Marvel Comics went through similar issues in the late 1990s the most infamous example of this is the clone saga this story involved Peter Parker maybe or maybe not being a clone it ran across all four Spidey titles from October 1994 to December of 1996 and was predominantly featured in literally 160 comics can you imagine trying to read 160 comic books to try and understand if Peter Parker was a clone none of these decisions what does that have to do with literally anything in the MCU like I'm I yeah I'm kind of curious what the point of that was what have anything to do with the best way to present a story their business choices and because of that they make story pacing really hard to make satisfying kind of sounds similar to how Disney issue horning all the MCU shows on no not even close I don't even 160 issues to discover whether or not one character is a clone does not sound like what we've got going right now in the MCU yeah I need you to make a connection between what we have and what you described is happening because I do not see it I am what we that's a long drawn out story that's character focused which means we are absolutely not going to have the MCU let's be very clear is he about is he about to say they're shoe horning all their content on to Disney plus like it just seems like a weird like of course they're gonna put it all on Disney plus it's their properties like I mean service platform and having pacing issues doesn't it trying to keep you from tearing the adventures apart and that's how you get some fans saying that phase 4 feels disjointed and clunky and that it's not going to be the reason why they're saying it's disjointed and clunky is because it's really badly written yeah you can't just be that it's badly written kind of it has to be this really interesting kooky thing that you didn't think about it's just shit just they made they making crap so it feels like crap what I find interesting is that everyone was fucking praising the shit out of all these things when they came out so what are you talking about lies deception lies these are lies and deception even though it's obviously leading towards secret wars secret wars obviously obviously obviously that's why it's everything is shit they're doing the secret wars I love the idea that we will be watching this shit and we're just like no I can I can see the connections though think about it multiverse of madness black widow secret wars you can see secret wars yeah I suspect it for years now but that's that's it yeah and loosely based on the original crossover by Jim Shooter and Mike Zek features multi-versal drama on a Shakespearean scale in the book and in Shakespearean scale the fact that you just said Shakespearean scale with an image of what looks to be the cosmos I don't know the Shakespeare regularly wrote many of his plays most of Shakespeare's plays revolved around the fate of the cosmos and the multiverse and really just all of reality in and of itself it wasn't two teenagers who loved each other too much I am familiar with those stories does Shakespeare have a scale I don't really think that applies I think it's I think his work is really good high quality I don't know if that's that's what he's using scale in the right sense Shakespearean describes certain attributes of Shakespeare stories but rarely is it epic I guess how archetypal they are I suppose is what he's getting at well I mean a lot of the time a person another person and then a surrounding cast you know it'll be a Hamlet or an Othello or of course a Romeo and Juliet the scale isn't that big it's not like these are look again these are meant to be plays that you could perform on a stage the scales will not be cosmic and multiversal these are not the stories back then were written with that kind of scale because so much of it was stage plays yeah Romeo and Cthulhu Romeo and Cthulhu I love Cthulhu I don't care I've now pictured Cthulhu like they're on a walk-in coming over the table nervously you know just sitting there nervously tapping his fingers every Shakespeare plays things in the universe every Shakespeare play the stakes increase the Hamlet one you destroy the universe what Hamlet's gonna snap I was gonna get all the infinity stones all of the Monte Hughes will be dead the drum on the Shakespearean scale in the book and in Hickman's Avengers Run the Illuminati uncover the fact that the multiverse is collapsing dimensions are colliding into each other killing all of the inhabitants yeah doesn't this sound so like I don't care yeah the whole multiverse is collapsing wow that's so grand aren't you man like I just really like when Daredevil had his life on Ravel and he had to like just way back up from that across the multiverse right no just across like New York I guess he had to travel through the universe in order to discover the secret wish-making feature at the center cause Born Again ends with like Iron Man and Captain America actually showing up which was like a big deal at the time that's just so funny how low stakes that is now all of the universes are colliding together in our heroes band together in order to stop these tragedies referred to as incursions that word the multiverse collapses with only Dr. Doom able to save shards from different realities on a dimensional plane called Battle World they're all cool that's what you call it Battle World aww come on cool it cool it Google Google Gal I would accept Google Google Gal over Battle World I don't know I prefer Evilville personally I would take that especially if it was Dr. Doom's place Welcome to my Evil Palace in Evil Land this city of Evilville what was the name of Skeletor's Castle a skull wait it's um Castle Brace Skull wasn't it not bad not bad it throws the temp to band together in order to defeat Doom and establish a world that doesn't have zombie Thanos running around Secret Wars is arguably the best mainstream crossover of the past 30 years I don't know how you just described it I'll take your word for it for the sake of moving forwards the fact that Marvel is obviously building towards it means their eye is on the prize all of the clumsiness and strange pacing of Phase 4 will be forgotten once we get to Secret that's not what absolutely not nobody remembers these films it won't be forgotten in the sense that we will be talking about Phase 5 then in fact we will say Phase 4 was shite but Phase 5 will be a different conversation dude look at the Celestial right there there's no one noticed that's a thing man so at the end of Eternals is that on the earth now yeah it's just sticking out of the earth yeah so the plot is oh fuck yeah so the plot of Eternals was the Celestials put little celestial eggs in like planets and then those planets have intelligent life that is protected from deviance which the Celestial is created by the Eternals and once the planet gets enough people on it something called Emergence happens which is where a Celestial just pops out of the planet like crawls out and is like yeah I'm alive and now and the planet blows up I thought that shot was hilarious in Eternals where earth blows up and there's just a giant guy there's a giant guy standing in the middle it looks so slow I love that now I've got to imagine that a giant like god entity just crawling his way out of earth even partly like part way it's over it's fucked Earth cannot function he's a big boy isn't he and if you've moved his whole body up by that much then that's just a lot of matter that's displaced yeah yeah yeah that's what I thought as well wouldn't the earth be pushed out don't worry about it no it's okay it's not like adding a whole bunch of mass to earth would like destroy it anyway yeah it's a little bit of a bumpy ride but we'll get a little bit of a bumpy ride it'll all be worth it if we just hear doom on the why even he's already decided it'll worth it once we get to this point that is definitely going to happen in the future what could possibly in the future and I don't really mean this as a rhetorical question but what could possibly happen in a future Avengers movie that will excuse this pile of shit I think we will simply say oh that thing was good in spite of how bad phase four was I feel like the introduction of the time stone has just kind of ruined everything cause it's just like you know eventually they're going to pull well you know what I mean right where it's just like whatever they whatever happens if it's bad eventually they're just going to rewind time and fix it I mean a lack of commitment well yeah yeah it just feels like you can do anything now and then just reverse it I love how they took the steps to be like alright the stones are out you can't use them well you can if you get to a different timeline dimension or reality well these are all different things of course as described in detail in their individual movies in which they were mentioned I was about to say as well it wouldn't even matter because they have a time machine I think there's no fucking time stone with any big screen I actually I forgot that the stones were destroyed in endgame like I just said it doesn't matter they can get them all anyway with the time machine oh yeah cause of that mobius strip or whatever yeah whatever that was Tony Stark figures out time travel in five minutes oh shit I did it so there you go it's implied that it was surprising he didn't mean for that to happen so quick but it did untrue okay that didn't really make sense but you know what I'm trying to say phase four is already the size of phases one and two combined in terms of watch hours there's a sense of urgency with some people where they want the payoffs now don't you dare no don't dare say like oh you see it's pretty impatient you just want payoffs they're taking their time don't do that they're not taking their time they've ruined everything they're not taking their time destroying it all they could they could every character put them on these crazy nonsense journeys that destroy them morally intelligently why would why just how successful infinity war and endgame were the payoffs and conclusions in that film were unlike anything else completed in is he just gonna say yeah but because it was built on phases one two and three so you gotta wait okay and you'll have your nice little endgame again what a strange video mainstream cinema before because of that there's a hunger to experience those feelings again but what so many refuse to acknowledge is that setting up an ending takes time yeah he's legit saying like look I know you think this is shit right now but so was phase one two and three until we got to endgame okay it's not true at all Iron Man is a great film Avengers was a really great like that in itself right people were satisfied with Avengers like Avengers one as a conclusion and you don't need that much to support that story you got a few films ahead of that like people like those film why are we pretending that they don't what are you like this is what I mean so many interesting theories today as to why the fifth fourth phase of the 35,000 likes I don't understand apparently people agree with this I think it's baffling and crazy like the fact that he said we've returned to basics in terms of the stakes you have to be joking we've been at higher stakes than ever and that's his main argument Typo your video is better than this one thanks man it really was it was better I don't know where he got this argument from like what were you watching when you saw the whole multiverse falling apart how did you go back to basics back to basics finally fuck it hell well that was weird that was annoying it's so funny though isn't it oh yeah you agree with nerd stylejik there that there's unfortunate problems with Marvel's phase four you'd be like yeah maybe he doesn't even define them as problems he's saying like no it's working you're wrong yeah you'll get over it basically once it's incorrect give it time it's all around wild ride like I said just you don't even need to make it longer than a minute the video can just be they've been writing some shit man real shit writing that's it see you next time for more delightful videos explain the inner workings of the phase four of the biggest storytelling franchise in history anyway that's it because now we'll see what chat has been saying better do it sure that's chat normally a lot of them have been asking me to gadelb to experience scale it's been a while I probably should have told you this earlier chat I have bad news you're not gonna like this the thing is I wasn't too fond of making the last gadelb not because I don't think they're very fun and all of the good reasons you could imagine but because I had a thought and that was that when I started making those I was trying to point out how shit video essays have gone and upon making the fourth and fifth one it really felt I was just trying to make them what everyone expects them to be which at this point means they've moved out of being commentary and they've also moved into just being thing I'm supposed to make because it's that time of the year there was a year where I made the parody of just right I really enjoyed making that ripping off the style and changing the script and trying to sort of do the voice which by the way to this day people still comments like oh that American accent is so bad Canadian I say a boot several times like the I think just right I'm pretty sure he's Canadian anyway I hope he is anyway the point is that I'm not averse to making April Fool's videos where I do something a little bit wacky but I decided I talked to Dust Bullshit about this because he's been super helpful in making gadelb as fucking excellent as they turn out to be that I was not feeling it with the fifth one to the point where I was forcing myself to make it as opposed to making it because I was very passionate about getting a particular set of jokes or commentary out and so what I'm saying is gadelb is being shelved for now you're not going to be seeing any more episodes unless I feel like there's a way I can incorporate it in such a way that I think it has something newer and more interesting to say as opposed to a collection of silly things that people said on EFAP that year which by the way I could totally understand why you were would still like it for that and so would I but the passion is not quite there and so I would rather stop making them instead of forcing them to be made if that makes sense I understand that man a while ago I started this new series called Professional Reviews where I kind of play a character like reviewing games and I only made one episode of it and I was the subject was Resident Evil 2 the remake but it wasn't really about that it was satirically making fun of the modern state of like gaming journalism about how it's so much about like political messaging but I did one episode and I'm just like I got all my jokes out I thought this was going to be a more consistent thing but I'm just I'm actually done with this now and people were like where's the next one I'm just like I don't really want to do a nice one it was supposed to be a series but it's just like whatever if I get an idea down the line I mean I'll do something but I don't like you're saying I don't want to do it just because people are like expecting it or like to just do it for the sake of doing it I started to worry with the fifth one that my lack of passion was going to start to come through and I really don't want that to happen so you know it seemed like people liked it and I was like okay I think we'll leave it there because you guys must have noticed by now we've had a whole more than half a year of EFAP and I haven't written down any Godel notes because I basically stopped though we've had plenty of amazing quotes and I was realizing as he said that the cosmos scale was Shakespearean everyone was like that has to go in Godel and I was like fuck you guys are not going to take no for that or that but yeah people give me ideas for like RB and the chief episodes as well where it's just like someone who was recently was just like hey did you know Sony bought Bungie you should make an episode about that that's funny and it is funny but it's just like well I got to figure out a thing I can't just work with that like it's like sure Sony bought Bungie and then chief is like freaks out about it but then what happens then what happens I got to figure out that and I just don't have any ideas for that yet like nothing has come to me so I don't want to just start developing something that I'm not really compelled to because I don't have a I haven't figured out an arc yet that's the key to it because if someone said like you know review multi-faceted madness or review Thor Leaven Thunder or review I don't know Moon Knight I was like Moon Knight I've already like forgotten and want to leave forever and I don't even really want to rewatch it if we do cover it it'll probably be an eFap and as soon as I do eFap coverage of something I often feel like it's like not much point and I guess that applies to Thor Leaven Thunder and MOM still but you know basically what I'm going to get at is like there are individual reasons why I wouldn't want to cover these things but there are also some projects where I'm like oh I've got a strong passion for this one I'm not even 100% sure why so I'm going to fucking charge into it whether or not you know the people would generally looking for it to be made because I just feel like that's where the best work comes out I think that's a better way I mean what is the point of like doing essentially your own work pretty much independently if not to pursue the projects that you personally find interesting and I guess just hope that the audience is as interested in them as you are you know it's kind of all new anyway like it's hard to know what anybody is really going to respond to you presume kind of yeah there's things that can inform it like you can reasonably I guess think what people like or not like but it's always going to be hard to say with absolute certainty I am so appreciative of my audience in that regard where it's just like they're cool with me doing whatever it is I'm creatively inclined to do because they know like that's where the quality is going to be and I know if I start doing things just for the sake of making it it's not going to be as good well yeah if the content suffers because of the the approach yeah yeah and I hope people were interested in seeing my stuff because they liked the stuff not because they were like some guy is covering Star Wars go hopefully he keeps covering Star Wars you know and I'm just like oh but if which is funny because like you know I could have probably done a bigger video breaking down some of the newer Star Wars things that came out but like once we did them on the minis or whatever else just feels like that's done I don't really want to even though you know we'll be right there when they release a Star Wars movie again if they ever have the balls to we'll see one day if I ever have the balls to I think that's a fun way to frame it the scared the scared what the audience are going to say oh no but yeah we are probably now going to start up doing some super chats which I feel like are you going to play Mario Kart? I don't think I'm going to play anything actually I'm just going to I know, crazy but I just want to give a chance for anyone and by anyone I specifically mean John, Metal or Typo if you guys would like to jump out it's probably a good little interim to do so if you wish how are you feeling? I'm in baby I'm super glued to my chair I'm not going anywhere wow they're going to have to pull my corpse out of my chair me Mel what did you say? I'm just chilling I'm going to be tired yet Typo how about you? oh shit I'm not going to lie I kind of disassociated I'm a lie well yeah I was saying that because we're now going to just answer the messages that have been sent in so I was going to say if you want to jump out now or not it's completely up to you not that you were held here against your will or anything I'm just saying we don't want to interrupt your association I ain't got a hop out now those could be annoying well yeah thanks for joining us that was great hearing from you man thanks man see ya well well alrighty then I shall start reading let's check out the new rock stars video 10 times can change the mcu timeline in phase 4 no I don't even there wouldn't be much substance to that would there 10 times can change the mcu timeline probably just be speculation that's like unsubstantiated so no thanks it's 10 times that things didn't go the way that he planned for that or I don't even know things no I'm not interested in that at all it's stupid let's not do that what do rock stars do oh I'm sorry new rock stars is the channel that do like not rock star games the guys who make yeah new rock stars is the channel on youtube oh okay today's animal of the day is the frilled lizard well come on get them up let's see this little fella let's see here frill lizard oh is that boy hang on I got you got you a little picture Rooney here it's so exciting what's gonna happen a copy image oh nice there's the boy oh look at him look at him oh god he's a dinosaur yeah he spits the goo on you I don't know about that yeah I was in Jurassic Park yeah it's a movie miniature version of the one that spits on Wayne Knight of uh what's his relation to Bruce Wayne father it's Barber even the barbers of the Bruce Wayne household become it become Wayne Wayne Knight Dark Knight, Wayne Knight wait why is there one the Wayne Knight um I'm confused that's okay this is an Australian one I'm pretty sure I'm pretty sure it is yeah this is one of those uh iconic lizards I believe even though I totally forgot I usually blue tongue lizard is the one that's easier to remember because it's like he's a lizard but he's got a blue tongue and he just roams around in the desert like a good boy just roaming around with his blue tongue well I do today I don't know probably bask on this rock for a while and then maybe I'll leave it lizards do have a comfy life it seems they don't have to worry about the MC a lot of reptiles they do a lot of hanging around they do well I mean a lot of animals do a lot of hanging around I think that's one of those like weird misconceptions that we have about animals is like a lot of animals are just inert lots of the time chilling out not wasting energy uh wings quote of the day the reason I stopped doing walking 365 is because I was only making four to five hundred a month made me feel unappreciated okay walking does it sound like a program? yeah walking 365 is he saying he stopped doing walks because he wasn't making enough money was he making money walking and become confused I don't know I don't know if that's a game or something any chance of covering the Sandman Charles dances in it also efap movies what Mel's already recommended that don't you worry as for Sandman what have I recommended ah ah ah yes watch that that's a really fun movie oh yeah so Sandman when's that out is it out it's out now came out I think two days ago how much I've managed to retain about this thing is that a movie or a TV show it's a serious show um have you seen have you seen people recommending or anything I haven't heard anything about it to be honest I hear people say that the comic is really good that it's based on um Neil Gaiman but otherwise I haven't heard much about the show yet alrighty well Neil Gaiman I've heard that before yeah he uh is he the one who wrote the squid and the whale and that kind of stuff I don't know it's a movie I know that American Gods that was him oh yeah like in book that he wrote and uh good omen one or that yeah that's something he did too I like that movie yeah he's good one more please read the pokedex entries for mega glali mega glali I'm on it what horror is white mega glal glal I don't know how to type that e-l-a-l-i-e mega glali pokey dex entry did we have that one before maybe we just saw the picture before I don't know let me get you the boy this one was a shitty screenshot I'm sorry this time I actually hit the right thing so this is the boy I remember him is he related to geodude in any way I think he must be right oh hang on that's glaly oh let me oh my god ok wait so this is the mega version I don't know if they have different pokedex entries it doesn't look like it so seems to be the mega evil version I don't know it's mega just special process faster discard there you go so what's his lore let's see here he looks hangry pokey dex entries there's a lot of them what the hell generation 3 doesn't say which one because there's a lot of them that doesn't specify you ok let's see it's gonna go through glaly has a body made of rock which it hardens with an armor of ice to be able to freeze moisture in the atmosphere into any shape it desires well that's just whatever he looks like he's ready to munch on some food he's in the mood to munch on food can instantly freeze it's foe solid after mobilizing it's foe in ice this pokemon enjoys eating it leisurely fashion ok that's nice you can eat it munch no fringy not this one nom nom nom it can instantly freeze moisture in the atmosphere it uses the power to freeze his foes I like the permanent scowl great you never know if he's happy or angry because he always looks angry well I guess the part was immobilizing it's prey and then enjoys eating it in a leisurely fashion probably yeah not great oh wait here's the mega ones let's see maybe there's some crazy shit the excess energy from mega evolution spilled over from its mouth breaking its jaw it spills endless blizzards holy shit it spills endless blizzards how come all the world isn't just some blizzard the world is a they all live in the cold areas oh yeah they just happen to spew blizzards in places where it's already really inhospitable it envelops prey in its mouth freezing them instantly but it's jaws dislocated so it's unable to eat them well that's a shame the opposite strategy of snakes that dislocate their jaws to just eat more things yeah the entire area around it gets whited out okay well there you go beautiful there's some very horrifying pokemans out there they were so nice and normal in the first generation when I was a little boy child look there's a dog, there's a bug there's a little mushroom little dragon tree child look he's got four arms isn't that interesting now it's like no endless in the turtle winter being consumed while alive when you look at this pokeman it gets sad and breaks its neck it's like oh come on do you remember that yeah that weird monster that he somehow killed with the chain he somehow strangled hard that he went flying into the air but I guess it didn't break any bones or rocks or any organs I can't imagine being given so much force in one hit that it just lifts you up from the air and throw like you going from a not moving state to moving the air up oh I can't imagine the damage that do hammers aren't weapons no so I'm assuming the moon night Hawkeye and Miss Marvel e-faps are just never gonna happen Hawkeye is the best of the Disney plus shows by far I don't think so I don't know Miss Marvel were even on the cards really no the thing about it is like in many ways we don't have the time we don't give a flying flume face and also that it does take a lot of work to do a full tv show breakdown in e-fap style and I would rather go for stuff that we're gonna be like at least partially invested in and there's no way we're covering everything that Marvel puts out at this point for example I guarantee we'd cover something like Guardians 3 but will we cover fucking Agatha I don't think so we don't think so I watched the first couple episodes of Hawkeye and I didn't think it was that bad but I don't think it's really remarkable in any way either I thought episode one unraveled personally I thought like once the action and the plot kicked in it was like oh shit we're in trouble already okay well so the big thing was Kate who is a big fan of Hawkeye and actually got personally saved by Hawkeye in 2012 like in the New York stuff she is at a place where she happens upon an auction of the Ronan suit Ronan who is not known to be Hawkeye but just so happens to be Hawkeye and then steals the Ronan suit and gets into a fight with a bunch of mafia guys while coincidentally Hawkeye is in New York and able to meet up with her it's insane and that was episode one and that was the end of my experience with Hawkeye so it may well be the best one but like that's pretty stupid but maybe I mean again we compare that to the damage that's done by the other shows it probably is the best one EFAP out of context rags peach pits are poisonous to dogs don't give it to him oh there you go is that true is that true about the peach pits yeah well that's good to know I don't know I also don't know why you would normally you don't consume the peach pits normally you throw that away because it's like a rock in the middle of a fruit but hello I know this may fall under the argument of adaptation but in addition simply being tired of the Joker in Batman movies I also miss when Joker had fun with clown theming to his crimes yeah I think that's fair it is like yeah it wouldn't mean that any individual adaptation is bad because he's not doing enough clowny things but I could see that just as much as you miss Superman caring about people that would be nice to see Joker needed more pies in the face yeah we Lord of the Rings fans are about to fight Amazon like where the third monkey boarding Noah's Ark and son it's about to rain I know that quote and yeah next month where it begins yeah it begins I can't fucking wait well there's your obligatory Simpsons quote it's kind of worthless as well because I'm just miming not miming it's the opposite of miming I'm making noises to try and illustrate what was happening in that episode did you guys see that leak from the rings of power show where someone gets thrown with a sword yeah TV spot I think yeah that was so bad horrible I linked it the show cost $500 like yeah was it like a clip on a late night show I'll just link it here I think it was an ad for the show no one will watch it again I'll watch it again but yes continuing without chat adventures oh during EFAP 85 you joked that TFA part 4 would be out August 2021 lull only off by half a year also check out the Viper dogfish smile or nice smile Viper dogfish Viper dogfish oh my eww well come on don't be let's see I'm working on it it's eww looks like a dead fish that one is dead oh damn I want to see it what's the first one the first one a dead one hang on where's oh boy look at him go look at him go stationary on a table that is a nice smile he's happy he's like I get to so he's just a zero wharf and there's some fucked up shit down there down at the bottom of the ocean mistakes were made down there or maybe not I like that there's actually a comparison here with the zeno morse yeah that doesn't surprise me yeah Viper shark they are like aliens or like you know the creatures and even the marvel movies where the children of Thanos or I don't know if that's the right you know all the creatures they fight at the end of infinity war with the giant teeth yeah whatever they are it reminds me of that a little bit you got a lot of inspiration for aliens in the ocean I think what god creates this grotesque we used ward okay this one I'll make it so ugly it's gonna go all the way on the bottom of the sea yeah I don't want anyone to see these three thousand five hundred words left until mollus iron man three unbridled praises released get hyped boys he's been promoting this on Twitter since Briggy's face reveal you know I think all of this is lies and I'm gonna put it in the lies and deceptions category we've had plenty of entries in there today you mean in the lie box since the box where all the lies go to be uh compacted don't forget the deceptions they go in there too decepticons mm-hmm I'll be here in 18 months when you massives finally read this got you read it already yeah loser hi rag hi molly water let me rib it to you molly water odd cool um I'll just separate the word out just to make sure I'm extra safe they said rib it to you free and then they put another thing on it it's like the word you're not allowed to say but they put FR on it so it makes it okay right it gets passed all of the Gary YouTube senses you never know FR and then the N word so anyway I need moving on they're saying they need a fringy plush ASAP please play the friday five nights of freddy songs again is easter eggs hi germ old this is an adventure of super chat isn't it lots of going on there that's for a fringy plush a fringy plush that does seem like a really good idea that would be a good idea yeah like a really really good idea watch brown table I asked this before but what are the prerequisites for getting a plushie made do you need to hit a certain amount of like oh okay I can't have one made then I'm just not cool enough you just wanted to have them make one of you just for you he's like maybe the old equipment I'd buy an obvious cheap one you might get in trouble with microsoft just just maybe I'm just like I figure like you must have to have like X amount of subscribers in order for like them to justify the investment it's the amount of people who buy into it because they really just make a prototype and then there's a marketing campaign and you have to secure a number of buys before it officially gets made in there oh kind of like a Kickstarter kind of thing yeah essentially it like proves that it's viable and so then those will just get fulfilled but if you don't clear it then I guess it was a Quintin Quintin bought the rest of his right or yeah Quintin bought potentially hundreds of his own plush hey man you know it happens it is one of the saddest things I've ever seen in my life that's a shame he's got plenty of gifts to give out and then he corny ends up going to they'll be like nah they'll be like oh man this fell out of the bin let me go put it back uh watch brown table videos slowly turn on phase 4 watch everybody's videos slowly turn on phase 4 that does video s yeah did Brad Pebble make a video shitting on Thor? he did no no wait no that was high I don't know if brown tables don't know oh was it? am I mixing them up guys why would you confuse those two well they both I'm pretty short turned because everybody turned on Thor okay so it's called Thor, Love and Thunder and Ty for what it is and the thumbnail has why would you do this that's a good question why would you do this why would you do this that's so nice that's when people say you shouldn't have apparently Andor is going to be a scurrilous scurrilous scurrilous I have not ever used that word before scurrilous take on the trumpian world these absolute psychos just cannot let it go I don't even why would you think that would help advertise the show at this point instead of just saying nothing let the trailers speak for it how is that going to help you hey what's Andor going to do this will make half the people in the country give them an extra reason to not see it and the other half won't care because they were maybe they were going to watch it anyway so yeah they were either going to watch it anyway and I doubt this will not be the tipping point for any person who is on the fence about I don't really want to watch Andor I was like oh but they say it might have something something trumpian parallel oh now I really should see it yeah if you want to see writers with their hands tied then you should see the ridiculous mandates on the IDW Sonic comic Sega implemented some highlights include Sonic can't cry shadow must remain an edgy loner main characters can't wear pants to be fair I have the same stipulations in my comics I like the idea that they had those two on a piece of paper you read them out you laugh and then they look at you like why are you you're like oh nothing nothing at all IDW Sonic guidelines I just like that they specify as as specifically as he must be an edgy loner with a gun with a yeah it's a good oozy right he holds like a a pistol is a different I don't know if there's a difference between a pistol and a gun but I can't remember what it is I found another one game characters cannot enter a relationship Amy must always be in love with just Sonic but they can't get together I knew about this one I think someone else told me about that as a rule as funny as fuck that is hilarious she has to simp after Sonic they can never get together make her look like an absolute lunatic apparent no react to Tee San Young's phase 4 video it's good well we're probably not going to check out any more phase 4 videos now I think that's probably it for now like I said next week we're going to talk about Prey which we're going to be watching today it's not right now I found the list by the way well if you find any funny ones let us know sure yeah can you imagine what the semi semi aborted Titan would do to the earth's gravitational fields whether patterns or hell even the rotation and orbit clearly Marvel put top men in their writing rooms top man dude they're hoping most people forget but that didn't happen don't you worry about it sorry this one caught me off guard game characters cannot have wardrobe changes unless approved we also have another one for Sonic must always win at the end even if he and his friends are in the losing end in an overarching story they must come out on top when it concludes this sucks I don't like this we also have yes male characters sans eggman can't wear pants which was also a thing in the post reboot albeit never explicitly stated the inverse is also also true female characters have to have some form of lower covering you call it everything if they this is someone's this is just someone's sex thing that's all that's all it's this is my first live e-fab after catching up with all of them I started in November 2020 thank you for all the content whoa November 2020 and they just caught up I wonder if there's a sense of like fuck now I don't have like get more stuff out and we're like we're trying geez um non edgy pokedex entry of the day swa blue and ruby specifically so swa blue is the pokemon swa blue while you're looking that up I have another one um it has been stated that there is no money in sonics world in that anything that alludes to money such as the rings acting as currency is strictly forbidden oh really who's making up these rules sega I guess oh really these are sagas mandates for like comics and idw oh wow okay the name was swa blue swa blue so swa blue yeah swa blue because it's it sent me to a wah blue without an s wow what a shit website wah blue I'm playing sonic 2 right now and I just got all this chaos emeralds nice turn it to supersonic there's no swa blue there's a wah blue no s well what do you want me to say about all I don't know but this one looks pretty wholesome so I'm guessing that one is correct alrighty then read that one no first you get the picture look at this little guy I'm gonna do it look at him I'm gonna guess it's something with the weather his wings are like clouds I could just be like he calls us like thunderstorms or something ooh that's my guess when they're in a flock they can cause thunderstorms because they rub against each other ew the website isn't german oh that explains it why is it wah blue in german but swa blue in english why would you change that why cause there's a wah blue thing I think I don't know that explains everything but why did you no give me the english website I don't speak german anymore I gave up that life yeah it refuses me to give me the english one help please this rookie doesn't have a button wah blue that's the first one that only gives me german entries I don't know why alright which entry do they want us to read any in particular oh there you go now I found it there's a lot of them was it sun or something I just did a ruby one swa blue has light and fluffy wings they're like cottony clouds this pokemon is not frightened of people it lands on the heads of people and sits there like a cotton fluff head oh that's nice yeah that's neat it doesn't consume souls or lure people into an eternal darkness or consume you while you're alive it's just like a nice little creature you'd want to have around it's like a little critter that you're like oh hey swa blue what's up which at this point is unusual for pokemon but that's fine it doesn't even poison you or peck down into your brain or anything like that and plants its eggs in your skull or anything deep acid into the victim it grooms with spring water and loves to sit on heads oh me too I barely familiarized myself with any of the pokemon beyond the original 151 oh you're in you're in the same boat with us man some of these new ones I know some of the second gen ones because golden silver came out when I still played pokemon that was a game boy advance but yeah one of the new ones is like a set of keys like floating and I'm just like come on guys keys come on guys dude the chandelier one this evolved from like a candlestick I was like lol I imagine like there was like one employee left in like Nintendo or whatever and they're about to leave and they're jingling their car keys and then it's like no you can't leave until you come up with one more pokemon and he's just staring at the keys in his hand going hmm yeah you can do this there's so many because you're like what's the fucking ice cream pokemon it's literally an ice cream evolution is like three ice creams I wonder what was happening when they came up with that remember magnumite was like that in the original 150 and it always got made fun of it's three magnumite that fused together to make a magneton and it was like unique and special but people still have to have it yeah 151 had some bullshit ones as well granted yeah sure but there was but it was but I like them generally mm-hmm yeah me too I don't like when they're over designed like they look too robotic or mechanical somehow or they look like crazy yugioh monsters or yeah yeah I love that original art style that they had where it had an almost watercoloury kind of look let me get a picture to show what I mean and they were like creatures more so kind of object turned into a living thing yeah like a lot of them I could imagine oh I can go out to the to the woods and I can see a cat or pee or a metapod you know yes he was like oh look there's a weedle like that's cool that's just like a caterpillar your creature right especially the old trading cards they just had that art style to them here let me I used to collect those and battle at school we never battled because we didn't know the fucking rules we just collected them you're one of my big memories big shiz memories was playing a little bit of yugioh back and forth and not really understanding anything about how it worked but having a couple cool cards you had friends and they'd give you some cards maybe being in the last year of the grade school equivalent just sitting in one part of the the area for just filling out where am I looking for the recess or what is the place in which you have fun playground all that doesn't know what playgrounds are because he doesn't like fun baller never had fun as a kid he was lonely and he sat there with his pokemon cards that he gave him to go away crying waiting for someone to play with him we'll give you this weedle if you go away that's the idea school yard that's kind of what I was aiming for you think of that we were just sitting down doing a thing I think a comment we were talking about didn't matter there was a kid who's in several years lower who had heard about a card I had in my deck that he really wanted to beat I guess I don't really know the context I just remember he walked up and he grabs his deck and lifts his hand up and pointed at me and went I challenge you to a duel in front of all my friends and I was like oh alright and then he got beaten up why is this happening it was an experience I used to play Yu-Gi-Oh and that game was the shit I was always curious about it but I never played it the problem now is that Yu-Gi-Oh is um it's not what it used to be I liked it when it kind of started out in its early years but the power creep on Yu-Gi-Oh is fucking nuts if you look at the stuff they make the more recent stuff it's just insane cards that used to be powerful are just never used or they're worthless that sort of thing like they're dwarfed by new powerful cards kind of thing yeah yeah there was a string of time where I was just randomly seemingly just for whatever reason I would watch some Yu-Gi-Oh channels um and they would they'd have segments I wish I could remember them it was like three or four guys and they would just play Yu-Gi-Oh and they had a channel around it and they would talk about old school versus new school Yu-Gi-Oh and they'd like make decks to try and you know just compare cards and power levels and there were many of these videos that people have done on the power creep of Yu-Gi-Oh and it's just like man I remember I remember that card and how good it was and I remember that card and how good it was and that card's just not even viable anymore because it's just been superseded by the insane shit that they've come up with right it's not about Yu-Gi-Oh used to be these kind of these potentially long drawn out this is early slug fests but these long games where you tried to wear your opponent's life points down from I think 8000 to 0 and now there's so much text and card finding and special doodads and knickknacks that it's all about like you don't even play against the other person you just try to get your combos done as fast as humanly possible and it seems really fucking lame hmm uh and Altaria are some of the best designs gen 3 goat right fine I'll allow it in watching best moments of EFAP I lost it over the animated skittle discussion video the pipeman blesseth that's a good animation I like that one a lot react to baby day out please it's a better movie than Leia chase in Kenobi it's it predicted Harambe link it hates it and says it's unrealistic have you guys seen that movie baby day out yeah I have it's funny it's a funny watch that was it uh tazim 1 and 2 greater than phase 4 yeah tazim 1 and 2 better than phase 4 that's okay I'll allow it me yes I've heard people say they like black widow and Loki and I can't do anything but remember avengers and vomit at what's been lost I think people forget what uh what characters they were honestly unfortunate classic Yu-Gi-Oh card of the day frog the jam oh I think I know this one if I see the picture oh no I remember the pictures ooh I don't think I actually remember this one this is a two star normal monster good luck having normal monsters now in Yu-Gi-Oh attack 700 defense 500 yeah it's not good what's uh what's the deal frog the jam is he a jam or oh oh yeah let me let me get you a picture here sorry to copy image paste image what's the flavor some of the um a let me find a picture no tow does he does he reference a slime with the head of a frog it attacks by croaking terribly oh oh that's why it only has 700 attack and it's two stars because it thinks the croaking terribly is an offensive weapon fair enough uh I like that you could play five cards alongside each other or something and like make a super creature forget maybe it might it might have been just like one exodia uh maybe it was I don't remember the name I just remember like one card was like the arm the other car yeah that's exodia if you play as a whole set you just win the game it's just what you win that's it oh that was kind of neat I haven't watched no way home yet but I heard you guys say it has great character work in a different stream how would you compare it to the suicide squad this how would we compare it yeah uh I'd say it certainly relies more on meta knowledge um let's suppose it just becomes continuity at that point though doesn't it in terms of I like what how do you mean I'm assuming when you say meta knowledge you're referring to Sam Raimi Spider-Man yeah knowing Sam Raimi Spider-Man knowing the amazing Spider-Man knowing about those gives you a lot of true but is that would you call it meta knowledge to know if Iron Man 1 and 2 before 3 um not as much I mean yes technically but not as much because they're direct sequels but how do you how do you how do how does the multiverse work with that well I assume that once you've basically told us that they are you know canon within the world of the MCU at least as it stands as a multiverse and that is what it is you know is it like the thing about a multiverse becomes equals before once they say it's it's pretty much um that's kind of how it worked with splits it comes out way later and says that it's a movie in the universe of unbreakable and it's like oh well there you go everything that's in unbreakable is now in continuity with split even though with the multiverse you don't have to commit to anything because the world of the Sam Raimi universe doesn't have to actually affect the world of Tom Holland Spider-Man universe at all but yeah you know I'm not sure you know you just call that standard continuity at that point once they tell you that's the case I I guess it's almost like it's a new category it's like we can't say retroactive continuity because that's already kind of used for something else but it's similar in a different way if that makes sense like retroactively we're going to say that this thing is now that we've made is still you know within continuity the literal like yeah I guess it's how it is it's just not used in that way but I guess it is literally so I mean well it just depends on if people really interpret that negatively or not because if you said well that was a retcon and someone goes yeah yeah it's generally never used in a good way people don't say retcon in a good way not typically not yeah but as for how it compares similar in that there's loads of great character work but there's also disamy bits and then plot and will kind of all over the place so and I think because I did say on a different stream at some point that I think I would probably lower my no way home score from if I gave it a 5 to a 4 because I was thinking about it and the suicide squad if I gave that a 5 when it's problems for plot and will couldn't possibly compare to no way homes and got Doctor Strange was assassinated as well and this is out of 10 right yeah and you give no way home of 5 yeah okay I'm just wondering but like I said I think I'll give it a 4 at this point because of it'll be if a adjustment sort of thing yeah it's just you know you know how it is just inching things this that way and the other I enjoyed it but there was a lot of things that frustrated me as well I had a blast like on the subjective scale no way home was like insanely high for me it was like 8 plus for me it just totally worked it was front loaded with a lot of like jokey lines and like one liners like everyone is cracking jokes and there's some forced dialogue like doc ox wed like wedging in dialogue of like the power in the palm of my hand the thing I'm looking for like oh my god they're just like forcing that line from Spider-Man 2 into this that I found that off-putting but then once it became about like Peter Parker trying to like give these people a second chance and then like when the two other Spider-Man came in like that really improved it for me you're probably thinking of a different line because what he says the power of the son of my palm of my hand that's when he's holding the reactor that Electro stole from Iron Man while he sees the Spiderman is well I think he says it twice because he says it once on the bridge well in his first introduction oh I think you're right yeah he's he's talking to Peter as he's on the roof of the car and he's like where's the reactor and he's like I don't know what the fuck you're talking about dude and he's like the power of the son in the palm of my hand and it's like oh yeah I'll give you that yeah that's not as bad the second one works yeah it's just the first yes yes it's teaching oh fucking hell I've my TV's voice activated this is not recognized what are you talking about I didn't say anything it's not recognized we have a new character for the e-fab cinematic universe sorry who's we heard her for the first time whose voice is recognized sorry what do you want my TV's bullied me better lock your door tonight TV's coming for you that's some sky net shit that's true it's technological terror yeah now that we have an echo show we need Wade a Star Wars story hell yeah I'm on board with that Wade was a legendary character it's really surprising it's amazing that all he said he had one line it was short it was God what was it I have to go back but I think it was like one single short line was all that he had I'm on the way something like that yeah something like that it was really well delivered whatever it was it was at the beginning when they were making their incredibly intelligent plan that was definitely not doomed to fail but worked anyway because Kenobi is a if you're going to cover it's the work Kenobi sucks Kenobi is shit there you people who think that show is good are wrong I agree I think that's all that needs to be said Fringy and others have you tried multi versus yet not yet but I probably will at some stage I don't really care to try I don't know wow it doesn't care about you it said Fringy and the others fuck you no I said the game doesn't care about you how does that feel I thought that was the Nickelodeon thing but that's a different thing I think that's the Warner Brothers one what's multi versus who's in it funny superman rick and morty it's just Warner Brothers characters though right yeah that's right including LeBron James the Warner Brothers character LeBron James he is in it the Warner Brothers character just sounds funny there's something about Nintendo that Nintendo's roster that just works a lot better for that I think that multi versus works but I think yeah Nintendo's they're lucky yeah I don't know it's hard to say what it is exactly about Nintendo's characters that just functions better for that kind of game like when the PlayStation did their thing and it's like Nathan Drake versus fucking Crash Bandicoot hey that was a genius idea how could you write this for Rafa the Rafa Don you joke but I unironically want a he will show that's fair well he just be sitting in his apartment the whole time at the end of brick and bad yep doing his thing I watched moonfall rags was right perfect movie it is so it it is what it is is it cinema it is a flash point actually releases I'm not seeing it no reverse flash or Thomas Wayne Batman was already a deal breaker wait the new flash is like an adaptation of flash point paradox is it I think it's flash flash point right like the regular flash point unless some mixing up I don't know but yeah Thomas Wayne Batman is a cool thing to see yeah night shift is great I can get these live keep up the good work fellas well sure or DC to do it like the MCU they would need to go back in time several years and make individual character developing films for the hero they just make all the solo films now and it makes like the ensemble ones more meaningful retroactively just like that was an interesting strategy but it worked out could be this hi moobs I added you free and metal in a tweet about my latest Godzilla reviews because I mentioned you guys in it amongst others disappointingly the only person to like and retweet was movie Bob what nice you must have really impressed him these maybe they said bad things about us trap super chin just finished watching the boys season three really enjoyed it for the most part haven't seen season two e-fap discussion but was wondering y'all's thoughts on it on season two or three season three season three I've seen season three why I get just for clarification season two it's shit and we hate it yeah that was pretty bad so much that I don't care about season three at all I watched it and have concluded that bringing rags to metal you guys should not waste your time on season three everyone says season three this season three was really good up until the finale and they are incorrect season three was cringe threw out there's some stuff in there maybe I guess well there's a thing it's exactly the same season two where people were like oh it was the later episodes that really really sunk it's like the whole thing guys the way it works is you watch the earlier episodes and you have hope and then your hope is squandered and eat on urinated upon it just so happens with the time that happens is when you're watching the later episodes you blame the later episodes when it was all the episode not the pee yeah the pee yeah I've drifted in and out of it repeatedly and I have a hard time sticking with it but I don't dislike it I like the idea of like taking superheroes and making them kind of petty and vindictive and just like like recognizable negative human behaviors as opposed to like the stoic the stoicism that you usually see in the likes of Marvel and DC and all that but I haven't finished season three yet I just I think yeah two killed my interest like kind of completely now look at the boys and I just don't I think it's shallow satire and it's I don't think that it's exploring like superheroes and deconstructing them as meaningfully as it could right so yeah and that I don't know friend of mine watched the show like hey do you watch the boys like yeah season one and two don't care about three like oh what you think it's like just garbage it wasn't always it was always like oh hey why and it's like I think it looks like a couple of things and it's like yeah that's fair I think it's a throw that coast by on its premise alone happens every time it's funny satire superheroes and edgy and like that's enough that's enough to sell it the concept alone makes it worthwhile for a lot of people and not only worthwhile but like a merit when it doesn't do a whole lot to yeah deconstruct superheroes yeah I quite like homelander the idea of an emotionally unstable superman is quite a frightening idea and I like that I think though I've said a lot but at this point a Boy Scout Superman is unconventional by comparison to evil Superman so it's yeah hi I think I'm I'm happy to move back to that as a template not to say that there's nothing to pull from yeah like homelander right it's just yeah I don't know blame a lot of people are pointing to like invincible as well I guess that's what's in but we can't talk about invincible none of us none of us have seen it not seen it maybe someday there's like an offseason of media and then we can watch some that we haven't watched which isn't gonna happen or you can watch it and tell us if it's worthwhile and we'll trust you but you make me watch all the other batch I don't do nothing lies have you guys seen the Harley Quinn animated show I enjoyed it very much and can't wait to see season 2 when it comes out on Hulu no I haven't no I have no idea I didn't even know that was a thing I know it's a thing I just didn't care I don't care about Harley Quinn especially now where would that be does Warner Brothers have a service it's on HBO Max hello eFapman crying is good for the soul every once in a while what was the last media thing that made you cry what media was your hardest cry I don't know obviously not counting Pokemon 2000 let's see I don't know Tony man the ending of Lord of the Rings always gets me every single fucking time I know everything that's gonna happen before the movie does at this point and I'm just like ah it still gets me it's so well done yeah I think that's fair even the Barmeas death will get me get a Tia maybe even on rewatches everything everywhere all at once was up there I mean even the way home was really big in the feeling tisms yeah I think that's probably the newest one for me okay I said it that gets a Tia but I think we've done this before I've never what I would call cried from watching media yeah I've never cried I've gotten very teary-eyed but I've never cried I don't know when the last time I cried was inconsolable in the theater and the staff were just like come on you gotta go like I've experienced having an emotional bollat leave me yeah I legit do not know the last time I cried I think I'm pretty emotionally healthy but it's haven't cried in a long time last one that had like an emotional reaction was actually Mass Effect of Phantasm when I watched it for the Forge that has a really good scene with the same one I mentioned earlier actually I'm the same the last one that got me was everything everywhere but Fox in the Hound always gets me hits pretty hard when was it not even the father that came out before everything oh yeah that's the father's not even absolutely gobbie the fucking lost bit with him damn yeah that's rough what about you freeing um I don't know what the last thing would have been yeah don't I yeah sorry alright then for me sorry 3 was fucking brutal I didn't even bring this mask speaking of animation there's now a making of docuseries on arcane on youtube called bridging the rift from riot they spent 10 months on the pilot and almost scrapped a series give it a watch oh thank god they didn't I'm gonna wait until the episodes roll out and then probably watch it all at once because I think they're like 20 to 30 minutes each so it's like yeah I'll wait I don't want to apparently the fucking episodes have cliff hangers on them in terms of like you know then we had this challenge and this challenge dealing with that was difficult and it's like and then I said how do you draw feet I don't know I don't know a tragedy you should watch invincible it's a neat superhero show and it has villains called the molla twins also hi from Israel hello oh hi from the United States of America molla twins there's not even supposed to be more than just me how's it two more ridiculous it's only one molla exactly I just looked it up and I've watched the video I assume they're talking about the one we're covering we're covering but alright I just watched the first avengers with a co-worker who hasn't watched the MCU before and he was blown away by it oh first avengers pretty solid I think it's pretty great yeah lasers and rockets what does rags and images have in common rags and images have in common yeah I don't know there are images of me well they put JPG's JPG's like a JPEG but what is I don't know if that's a double meaning I I'm trying to think of what the other meaning is for it JPG man of steel is better than avengers I'm hurt oh no oh no you take that back alright then who said that, kick them they kicked themselves they kicked themselves hey crew for something neat in these tizmic times check out the pokedex entries for phalanx, I appreciate you all massively oh is it a big penis is it a penis cat is a phalanx phalanx pokeman pokey dex there's little pokeys and dexes phalanx oh look at that I don't even know I think my brain is starting to melt getting late yep there's the boy hey that's getting a little busy but yeah it is a bit busy but okay let's see pokey dex shleems five of them are troopers and one is the brass the brass orders are absolute oh it's multiple creatures I thought it was a caterpillar the six of them work together as one pokemon teamwork is also their battle strategy and they constantly change their formation as they fight oh that's cool I wasn't aware that's even a thing how the fuck does that work you just capture one and then the other ones just I assume it's a package deal and if they're like a part they get really sad or depressed or something like that so you might as well have all or nothing even the tizmic brother is like oh I'm a pokey bad too I guess I mean pokemon essentially it's basically animals and magic so it might as well Disney wait for ai to write movies yeah they may as well at this point we better off I've been seeing ads for that recently like ai services that write articles for you and I'm just like what the fuck is the point of that why even bother like if you're not if you don't have a human putting any thought into like an article it's just gonna be like total bullshit played witcher games cause of rags read the books cause of the games hate the show cause the books were great sigh his some money play sot sad fate sot sot sands of time sot what else that would be sea of thieves sea of thieves is great y'all should play sea of oh it's about to get another it's about to get the big captain sea update y'all should play that they made a whole bunch of changes to how you can customize your ships and everything good stuff sea of thieves is very cool if you can get some friends together and play it it's legitimately a blast I've had a very fun time playing the game with my friends cool I recently had a discussion with my roommate about internal consistency he claimed that a comic book movie is only good if it sticks to the source material and then perfectly outline Thor's Ark in Rad Ragnarok I guess and why it makes sense in universe to show why it's his favorite Marvel movie I eventually got him to separate well made movies for movies he likes well that's a lot of people won't take that so sounds like an interesting conversation I'd be curious to know that Ragnarok as a movie holds up because it's faithful I wouldn't I've not heard that before but it seems to me the obvious thing is is the source material good or better like sometimes changes are warranted not all the time probably most of the time no but there are exceptions hello Mola I'm doing some world building practice and have a bunch of Welsh names I'm trying to use can you read them we got EML Edwar Veth Ruwadeg Eldegadeg what do they translate to I don't fucking know google gonna have to tell you that what stops that's the best I could do even for pronunciation I'm not even that good at that fake fan who said I was a fan I'm a fan of the dragon Moller told me that oh shit I don't remember telling you oh shit no it's fine I don't know it sounds like something you would say I remember saying no it's fine I remember that oh ok sad caveat to old man recommend episode 3 the characters get kind of dumb people who should be experts suddenly suck at mind games and setting ok we don't like when characters become stupid when they're if a character's traits in particular are that they are intelligent then you've set a high bar for yourself that you need to pay attention to ye I finally made it to a live EFAP I really enjoy the podcast and been watching for previous ones up to while up to 46 now oh hey only got three years of EFAPs left good luck with that hurry up um what is this Moller your white male leads are finished keep munching all your food big lad we are replacing your masculine men and all you can do is cope and sieve what that is an unusual it's not super chat your white male leads are finished we just did two white male leads for Thor Love and Thunder and yeah they're finished alright this is what we get they're not representing the white race very well on the next meeting we're gonna have to really uh it's funny cause like a fire I'm fine with female leads just write them well that's all same for the men also yes I will continue to eat food I do like it you freak eating food and stuff uh watched Thor Love and Thunder with my mom she hated it she also hated DS mom mainly because of Wanda although she hated Wanda and called her a bitch cause of WandaVision anyway I haven't seen WandaVision myself but I'll take a word on it yes take a word on it she's got some good taste alright also play DDLC Dumbo's please maybe some century I will not play that game fuck you uh type os video would make a great temple template sorry for next year's gadel I wouldn't do that kind of editing I'd probably have to ask that's bullshit to figure it out in terms of just it's so wacky you know I really enjoy gadel so I hope you uh I hope you gain uh some incentive to make another one but not because not just because uh not just for the sake of it well yeah I would just be like guys go watch them on go watch them on a little playlist okay cause like yeah to be fair we've had some choice quotes this year uh and the whole shakesperia did the cosmos thing that would have been a pretty deep one hahahaha flashpoint was doomed long before Ezra six years of development hell and rewrites Ezra just uh final nail in the nail build coffin yeah no I think we all thought it was probably going to be a mess of a movie but we're talking more so about like the optics of it all and trying to release a movie to just standardly increase the the the hype for your franchise to move your franchise along like Warner Brothers they've been sitting on the flash now for fucking ages and they're probably still thinking like what is the best way we can do anything with this when they probably realize now had they rushed it out and released it straight away like as soon as possible that probably would have been the best thing to do did they like finish filming it a while ago and they've been sitting on it all this time yeah I think they delayed it a couple times now because I think they would kind of figure out when's the best time to release it when will Ezra stop committing crime for like yeah that's that's an amazing that they had that meeting that was just right the minutes of this meeting are when will Ezra stop committing the answer is never it will only escalate uh did you know that the goptics during the dark ages sealed agreements by eating grass tasting mud kissing each other on the lips then hacking a dog in half with a ceremonial sword evil evil what is with all the weirds like what what does it mean tasting mud like you give a little taste nice mud it's a bit dry but you know the cutting of the dog in half is definitely unacceptable I am against this faction I will not play them in an Age of Empires game hmm can they just do something can they just like enslave people based on race or something you know you gotta cut dogs in half yeah like you'd enslave women or whatever sacrifice virgins that would be normal they have to do the cutting dogs in half hi just started a channel and posted a vid that's gotten some non-constructive criticism when you first started how did you deal with this thanks uh hmm I guess you have to understand that you're on the internet and a lot of people are just gonna do and say things that you don't like there's nothing you could do about it the number one thing you could do is to carry on and be successful because that is the thing that pisses them off more than anything is the fact that you're successful it's something they could never like take away from you for the most part I suppose part of it you know just you gotta have to pass it out yourself so which comments do you want to respond to which ones do you think is it worth while telling someone that you think offered you absolutely nothing useful that towards like maybe I guess non-constructive intentionally or unintentionally is worth passing did somebody give you non-constructive criticism because they are incompetent at providing criticism that's workable or they just don't want to piss you off I guess it doesn't really matter right now the case you need and should be receptive to feedback that you can use anything that you can use to improve your process or improve your craft is worthwhile but yeah like if it's non-constructive then I should ignore it I guess would you rather see a Ben Affleck Batman film with Willem Dafoe as the Joker or a Henry Cavill Superman film with Brian Cranston as Lex Luthor I'd like Brian Cranston as Lex Luthor that'd be cool yeah I think I'm partial enough to that that I would like to see that plus I want to give Cavill another chance to be Superman proper yeah I'll go with the Superman Lex Luthor one I wasn't sure about that casting but I suppose he would bring a comedic element to it kind of like Gene Hackman did back in the day Brian Cranston maybe that would work like Brian Cranston would bring comedy to that role I just think he well because of his role in what is it Malcolm in the middle like I think he can do comedy really well I think it's kind of in him to be like an entertaining funny presence I mean not in every case this is like whenever Hugh Laurie is in something and people say oh yeah like when he played Stuart Little's dad yeah he really brings this familiar element to it cause yeah he can bring that but why like I wouldn't expect him to as Lex Luthor necessarily I think I find him funny and breaking bad sometimes sometimes he pulls faces you know that are like you know when he's looking at Jesse's artificial antenna that he builds with like on the cell phone and he's just like he contorts his face in a very funny way like he finds opportunities to inject comedy into that role it's very sparingly but I think it would be really neat to have a Boy Scout Superman played by Henry Cavill and a very serious like almost cynical but a shop businessman type played by and he can be witty and he can have that element to him but he's not like cause we already got Jesse Eisenberg and that's shit that was horrible, horrifying legitimately disgusting I wasn't a fan of that either it was horrible, never again in the comics Osborn was key in both Secret Invasion and the Thunderbolts leader these movies will be crap but imagine if they were good with more Willem Defoe who could have been a great main villain um, yeah I was gonna say like if everything were good then great, at this point I wouldn't want them to bring him Willem Defoe in Thunderbolts or some shit cause I'd just be like oh god we got so lucky with him not being destroyed in No Way Home please let's not risk it again yeah why can't we just get an X-Force movie in the style of the Expendables and Suicide Squad 2 something fun and bulls out I think they were gonna make an X-Force movie before all the fuck stuff changed that's why they got Josh Brolin cable but I guess it's probably not happening for a while now that's like Deadpool's thing right he makes like a spin off of the X-Men yeah X-Force is kind of like that was around that time same time as Deadpool he called it X-Force he makes his own team what was really funny was they make the team and it all goes wrong their first mission because it's really windy they parachute down but it's really windy so it all goes wrong one of them flies into like helicopter blades um and then like one of them crashes into a bus then one of the guys he flies into oh yeah that's right Vanisher and he hits the electricity wires and then you find out Brad Pitt was the vanisher and then one of the guys falls into a wood chipper he's like he's like jeez I can't remember his name he was the dude he was just like a regular guy and he comes to help him out he's like yeah no it's okay we're X-Force right yeah we're X-Force and his arm falls off he's bolted by the acid good times yeah I like Deadpool and Deadpool 2 I like those films don't wait for Deadpool 3 well hey look alright maybe it'll maybe is that even a thing yeah it's happening oh okay be afraid Lord Longbong of Mewepschlington Abbey is there any good chance of a Kong fap of Peter Jackson's long Kong when there's less going on you're movie fap for the ages P.S. hello wagsies good boy yeah I think there's a good chance that we'll probably have a little look at that movie the longest of Kongist I think it is the longest Kong movie of all time right that's a pretty cool little act way to have and you get a whole bunch of dinosaurs and big old spooky bugs one of the most disturbing ways to die ever in that movie happens that was quite a creepy scene that's the one thing I remember from that movie I really didn't like it because I like the character and I like Andy Serkis oh that was him you got a fucking horrible death that was brutal yeah I've seen so many people say now that Marvel is dying the DCEU is gonna shine you know the whole expression just because you blew out someone else's candle that doesn't make you both figures burning it comes to mind for some reason it's just there's like the Anakin corpse trying to crawl to the finish line as Marvel that just dies and then there's just this other corpse a few miles back like now's my time to shine I can still finish told us that they're smart enough to seek out some good writers in preparation for their 10 year plan I could see that happening but I don't know I'm pessimistic about this but sure maybe maybe maybe like if they suggested we're gonna literally copy Disney one to one starting this year and we're gonna release our equivalent of Iron Man and then we're gonna do blah blah blah I'd be like probably not actually you know because in 5 years they'll already be in a way better position if these things are actually well written like taking your time is just something they refuse to accept is an actual viability thing yeah no we must get to Justice League now calm down scrolls everywhere everything all at once everyone everywhere all at once yeah it's gonna be great when they tell us Iron Man was a scroll the whole time yeah they're gonna do some bullshit like that they're gonna think it's sooo clever and we're gonna hate it and no one's gonna like it that writer will be like yeah he just can't handle it because I'm so cool I've searched all of the arc for that so awesome aren't I cute my mom has the worst media takes the worst two takes are the first Suicide Squad is better than the first Avengers it's pretty bad tech don't worry you might be adopted yeah and Moon Knight is great even by the show's end it's still ambiguous whether it's all in Mark's head how clever yeah that's the sign of just the best movie ever so is there a way of trying to defend against how bullshit it all is because I always find it funny for that because when it's just like an interpretation on top of everything else like yeah whatever but when it's like how everything's nonsense like yeah but it could be in his head so oh okay mine that character's crazy so they can do whatever they want and my favorite superhero movie is still probably the Incredibles classic big band OST with lots of brass golden age comic art style and great characters excellent pick Incredibles is fantastic yep what was the most off-color decision made by a character you liked the act was cruel immoral dislikable oh there's probably quite a long what should we start with immoral dislikable the Black Widow example is a pretty good one yeah kill all those people it's a clean example as well because narratively speaking she is there's nothing compromised about her so she just does that and doesn't care because you know with Wanda it's a little bit complicated with Wanda because a lot of people are like it is corrupted by the dork it would be however we've got Doctor Strange and his lack of concern for destroying the book that he had a hand in that book getting destroyed if we're being definitive it's Wanda that is really responsible but well then again what do you think if I shoot you with this reminds me of the fucking Rise of Skywalker thing if I'm shooting at you rags with the machine gun going buh buh buh buh buh and then you lift up a little shield that reflects bullets and it goes buh buh buh buh buh buh back at me the thing I'm holding that allows people to be saved in the world is that my fault or your fault or both our fault it's my fault we're partially both to blame but is it my intention to hit the thing with that no you don't even know what it is oh then I don't well does the deflector have that ability to direct the ricochets yeah yeah rags knows that it does that and he's doing it because he doesn't want to die the guns fault because this reminds me of when when they were like see Rey didn't kill Palpatine because she deflected his lighting back at him it's like that is her killing him is it not I don't know I think it's both I think when you fired it and someone else deflects it back at you and it destroys something or whatever that seems to be both right on the part of you you wouldn't because this is the thing Wanda didn't even know what the book of Vishanti was but Strange did oh yeah that would rank pretty high what else we got you got lower end stuff like Falcon and Bucky ditching the two heroes that saved their lives dead that stuff like that pisses me off but I don't know if that compares to some of the grander things that happen in phase four we have Kenobi letting Vader go at the end yeah that was pretty bad that's pretty insane the moral cowardice on display there is legitimately fucking frustrating I don't think there's anything in Thor I think that films not got anything like level yeah I mean the black widow example is probably going to trump a lot of the ones we've just said yeah because it's so you can be able to understand and she knows you should know better evil if you watch it again Palpatine did stop shooting lightly near the end his hands were down but it's still just coming out of her please stop me it's not even my lightning anymore it's yours and she's like nah you're just evil lightning's evil I wouldn't do lightning lightning's evil that's not me well uh bringie look up peacock spider nah nah no way speaking of coward peacock spider offering is cute oh wow look at that that's pretty interesting yeah your prejudice to spiders is unacceptable it is actually oh that's neat the way that you behave is pretty bad look at him go man that's a colorful back how competent do you think the guy the do you think the b1s is b1 b1s is in the prequels b1s battle droids b1s and the question is how competent do you think the battle droids are if that's what the b1s are the guys with the the try shot and the upgrades from the battle droids the super battle droids wouldn't they just say super battle droids at that point yeah b1 I assume if it's 1 it's the first model right the original color the regular dudes not very at all they're really bad they're mass producible probably fairly cheap they're just meant to throw at the enemy I think that's even the stuff Lucas had said that they're incompetent they could be sliced down by Jedi like butter or something they could just tear through them I remember that shot oh it's like BTS he's talking to Spielberg if the question were like how well do they fit into the universe or how much do you like them or whatever that would be one thing but asking me how competent do I think they are it's like they're not not even close they're just terrible I don't think we ever see them achieve anything it's usually super battle droids I don't think they ever achieve anything either Mount damn nature you scary creature I have found for you is Lee Cockled Ridium I have no idea what's happening is that a thing are they trying to give binomial nomenclature there Green Bandit Brood Sack apparently what that is Green Bandit Green Bandit Brood Sack oh it's like a little oh that's an unusual looking snail yeah hope he's alright a sudden transformist discussion while I researched about events leading up to the film for a video was a coincidence that gave me a good spook good job Fringy oh wow about that Digimon of the day is Kabutterimon wait a second oh it's not the snail the green bandit brood sack those things that are fucking sticking out of its head those are the parasites that are in the snail oh oh that's not nice I don't like that boo yeah they like bro inside of it or some shit boo that's the pokeman by the way pokeman that's the Digimon boy oh right Digimon that's from the original series isn't it I remember that one I was going to say he looks a little less cringe than the others in terms of the way he's drawn I don't know that looks familiar yeah well look at him I don't like it I know he's scary but no it's too edgy and tryhardy you know I understand a guest it's been so long please stay for dinner ha ha ha first ever EFAB I've caught live and it's covering the most influential franchises of our generation thank you all for being a voice of reason for modern day blockbusters very nice thanks man I talked to someone who thought that Star Wars oh not Star Wars wait it says SW breaking out of the mirror dimension which okay is fine because of her power I said that it ruins the stakes and Waldron wrote himself into a corner he disagreed shake my head if her power is directly connected with something to do with the mirror dimension you have to fucking tell the audience that shit like how the hell does that make any sense at all how could anybody intuit that and then if it's something that we should just all know then how the fuck does Doctor Strange know doesn't he know I mean like he should know that he shouldn't be surprised that it doesn't work then should he so I don't know I'm not convinced I've heard the idea that she uses a particular kind of magic that is like particularly good against the mirror dimension which to me just sounds like a fucking cop out sure it is it's just really good against the mirror dimension oh shit yes I give it a bull and a sheep how is Fringy finding the new MK8DLX courses and what would you guys want to see oh wait well that'll be the second question so that's the first question how does the Mario Kart 8 new courses I like it better than the last round I'm not sure how I feel about the new map though there's something about it feels super rigid yeah I'm not sure how I feel about the new course like the brand new one but we'll always pinball having that back is cool I like the tour courses yeah it's okay alright and what would you guys want to see from the next Mario Kart game mechanics what's character's course ideas this seems like Fringy's question yeah I was going to say I wouldn't have an interesting answer for this because I haven't paid up I've said a lot that I think the next logical step is just Nintendo Kart have a bunch of Nintendo characters as the you know cast of characters that you can play as rather than just yeah rather than just Mario characters that's what I think Super Kart brothers yeah something like that uh Mutually I know you guys won't cover the boys season 3 fully but could you mention your favorite slash most hated part of season 3 sure I would say my favorite and most hated is probably soldier boy or things to do with him I think he's a really cool idea I think they got the greatest actor around to play him in terms of just seem to nail it maybe I'm hyperbolic there I just mean that they had everything they needed and they made his character fucking crap just like incredibly one note just an asshole I'm not even sure how much of his life span makes any sense in terms of if he just treated everybody that way how did he manage to get where he was in all these different ways sometimes he seems interesting sometimes there's little bits and bobs in terms of how he reacts or what he says this that and the other and so you know I was trying to enjoy him but then I just got annoyed I couldn't take how much he was just like he's so abrasive in every scene so what I love and what I hate is connected to him and that again I don't mind saying this because you guys wouldn't recommend watching it the big plan for the season is to get homelander to do that you got to detonate soldier boy on homelander if he detonates on him it'll take his powers away it'll burn the V out of him so just to give you an idea this is the setup you guys remember Ryan right? homelander's kid so you got homelander and Ryan are in the room soldier boy butcher with super powers and Maeve are in the room those three want to get homelander homelander's trying to appeal to soldier boy because he just found out that soldier boy is his dad technically because of the way the sport did spam stuff whatever okay and so they attack homelander they start preparing soldier boy to detonate and then Ryan knocks soldier boy out into a different room like he hits so many it's flung out of the room the thing is soldier boy is one of the strongest people ever I think he might even be more durable than homelander it's unclear but he's obviously pissed I think he's even lasered by Ryan actually and soldier boy is kind of an asshole but you understand the mechanics here so soldier boy hits Ryan to the point where he flings across the room as well I think he's knocked out so like I said I'm describing events here you following? you understanding where everyone is? what's happening? him doing that him hitting a kid is shocking but that is a kid who is a superman and he just lasered him yeah makes sense so like I'm going very slow motion here on purpose in that moment I'd be like ooh it's like you kind of hit a kid but at the same time you hit a kid that was killing you it's complicated but butcher and mave decide because soldier boy did that that they are now going to give up the chance to stop homelander to just beat up soldier boy oh and that was possibly the most frustrating thing in the entire season for me I was just like yeah soldier boy is a dick sure fine but homelander's threatened several times over to destroy the whole world so I don't think like yeah okay fine he hit fucking kill him later if you have to you know the only reason it happened was because they obviously don't want to lose homelander yet they're going to milk him for a few more seasons probably mm-hmm so yeah enjoyed a lot of stuff about soldier boy his history and his the active for him but a lot of stuff I didn't like about him and that part was super dumb icing on the cake mave should have died you know exactly what I'm talking about his surviving that was hilarious and stupid but yeah so to be fair the biggest flaws I guess are in the last episode so the people saying that the last one of the worst one they're probably right homelander is the show I think you're right at this point I think you're right all the memes about boy season three it's always to do with him it's a good character yeah I like him I wouldn't go that far no I just like the idea of a like I was saying before I think you were going to the bathroom or something but an emotionally unstable Superman is a is a very interesting idea and a terrifying one you know I like kind of having a show that revolves around somebody like that I think you're totally right I don't think he's execute well at all I think that he's running on that concept is why people even like him also the actor Anthony Stardos a great job mm-hmm months late with this I know but canonically why was multi-verse Peter played by different people but multi-verse wonder and strange etc weren't I rex hi roulette wheel it could be anything you never know what's going to happen I think you're allowed that benefit when you do in the multi-verse you can get to choose whatever you want really though you would still be like you know if I was about to open a portal randomly and it's like I hope this universe has this this this and then it does that would still be incredibly lucky it's not it's like like people who know who Peter Parker is or whatever getting drawn to the universe like I think what they gave us for that was a fair like election I don't think that was like a particularly lucky or unlucky selection you hear the Russos call the last of us to the greatest game ever made mm-hmm they really I didn't know that that would unironically tempt me to be like stick to movies guys and even then even then I wasn't a fan of the gray man I watched that recently yeah it's not it's it's super generic edge and precipice mean the same thing that's what I thought yeah that's why that line sticks out it's like where what edge of the precipice why are you talking Australia only exists because the emus allow it yeah I guess though typo is a crazy and kooky guy I think he was pretty normal and then there's Kang the Almighty is that from a comic some guests and those are like Kang's we're gonna be meeting eventually the conqueror this is a Kang the Almighty I don't know which one that is I don't know what he's gonna do blow something up probably the guy in Loki is he who remains who's some kind of variant of Kang the conqueror right I think that's it whatever like I don't really care I'm just I think that's what it is it's like yeah sure yeah okay whatever ripping pepperoni Godel man yeah kind of kick typo out he's ruining my mood oh wow really it's like a ute issue how much to get rid of typo I want him gone what's going on here kick typo he's shouting too much I'm this is a meme you're miming how could you I think he deserves major props for coming into the stream and hopping on and talking I like them I liked him too friendly Godel dawn but not forgotten hi rags hi Peter Jackson was asked to be a part of rings of power they asked me if I wanted to be involved and I said that's an impossible question to answer without seeing a script said Peter Jackson so they said we'll send them to you and the scripts never showed up man maybe they never had any there's like wait what do you mean the script well you know just let's let's wait and see you know let me take a look you know I fucking love the idea that he said I need to see a script that's probably like bizarre to them at this point like what do you mean why what's that got to do with anything you don't want to be involved automatically it's like well you know it'd be nice to know what I'm getting into why do you want a script look at all this money it's like yeah but I don't want to do poopy stuff versus match of the day who wins between Vader and Gandalf the White only allowed to refer to the OT prequels and the Jackson films Gandalf's power level is a bit of a mystery I'm my instinct is to go with Vader on that one I think so yeah I think the force is going to out do his magic in those films I think so yeah because yeah the magic in Lord of the Rings is really hard to really peg down you could make avalanches and create storms you can it's just it's not like immediately impactful in the same way that maybe just using the forces to lift objects on a whim what I will say when Gandalf fights the Balrog interesting references there for what people maybe useful against Vader maybe yeah like the bubble shield he's got yeah I don't know how much that's going to help when Vader's Vader's pretty overwhelming with the force and you know yeah my instinct is Vader but I think there's a possibility for either of them to win that one I suppose it would be up to the writer for a nice pokedex entry look up ultra moon and emerald entries for dragonite dragonite bulky man dragon night oh dragonite original 150 yeah mmm sorry which one's one of those look up dragonite for ultra moon and emerald dragonite's like the friendly kid version of Charizard it's like softer edges emerald I can circle the globe in just 16 hours it is a kind-hearted pokemon that leads lost and foundering ships in a storm to the safety of land oh that's nice that's a nice thing to do what a good pokemon and then we got ultra moon it flies over raging seas as if there were nothing observing there's a ships captain dub this pokemon the sea incarnate mmm really will you guys ever cover daredevil season 3 is one of my favorite pieces of media ever I think we'd all like to cover something good again hi Fringie hey doubtful probably not no good to know people aren't enjoying it still we'd still I'd still recommend it definitely at this point with with how everything's gone with everything else like why not go throw it on all that now that it's the Disney thing I don't know no no I think I would seriously doubt they would want to delete that people love it that would be a no I've heard things yeah Adam thinks he destroyed Mauler's consistency argument I don't want to spoil it but I have to say it's pretty bad please correct him maybe on eFap hey no what let Adam let Adam think that that's fine guys own show to run I'm sure he's got a really good argument if it comes up in passing you're in there you know well like we can have a little chat about it he has some interesting ideas when it comes to storytelling I Adam friended yeah that's the lad I think I think I blew his mind I was saying that I really only care about things making sense I think that blows everybody's minds until they understand I'm basically talking about everything they've ever thought to talk about anyway they think at first I think they think there's just like lame stuff you know nerdy stuff I heard you arguing with destiny about Star Wars on it's so funny I was laughing my ass off I was trying to help all the people in that call and they kept tanking it for me yeah oh but they made my hero all stanky it's like no that's not the argument more man Fringonator metallitarizer of doom ragamuffin oh interesting names guy I recognize but can't remember the name off I like you guys thanks for sharing your ideas have some money oh don't like over design Pokemon look up Eternatus that's already an over-designed name look Jesus whoa is he like you find him at the end of time or something so we got Eternatus like this fucker right here let's put it in chat so is he like a cursed polygon or something it's a gigantic Pokemon but apparently that's like it I don't know a mecha version of it eternal max Eternatus this fucker I don't know if there's an evolution or special thing like that thing goes crazy look at this this fucking spaceship man and this is supposed to be a Pokemon yeah apparently yeah what is this design what was a gigantic gigantic Pokemon it's too pointy no one to just see what the Pokedex entry says just stuff where's the Pokedex entry say even one oh there so as was this thing the coordinates chest absorbs energy emanating from the lands of the Galar region this energy is what allows Eternatus to stay active okay sure that's all in her that's what energy is it was inside a meteorite that fell 20,000 years ago there seems to be a connection between this Pokemon and the Dynamax phenomenon what the fuck is this what happened to Pokemon I still like phenomenons and shit where I'm like almost a thousand now infinite amounts of energy pour from this Pokemon's enlarged core warping the surrounding space time Jesus Christ get rid of this thing right now silly that's insanity greetings evap crew I have created an evap themed monopoly board I treated it to more or not discord let me know what you think you just want to know what the locations are most like the most expensive one oh boardwalk and park place of the evap world more lawfully I see oh oh oh the movies is what is what I see but like the bottom is captain Marvel then no win away well last yeah yeah yeah yeah you're on season 8 that's fair batwoman goes plus his man of steel captain Marvel they run in 2049 is that yeah I think so where am I find black hunter like pamphlet I see and doctor strange prestige so low down yeah I was gonna say what's going on there I miss possible fallout they're the orange tier I guess I feel like it's above aliens as it should be it should be you got the original trilogy you put above Lord of the Rings yeah that's not yeah you put you are you want a ball rings is better you put a new war above aliens maybe you don't and aliens maybe they've not and you know they're not thinking about it that way I don't know yeah we've got the suicide squad is above parasite and then fall out in the prestige orange it's the first orange yeah the prestige is the lowest of the good side when it really the fact that it's right next to dr. strange as well I appreciate the effort put a chest at alienism very good oh my god get the fuck out of here oh my god I can't we have a small though for memes yeah in the ER railroad your expectations can get subverted if you're not careful your expatient yeah let's see rhino milk our utilities we have rhino milk and spider milk spider milk yeah in our railroad short ER line tier terror then terravainia railroad and redder railroad what's the Patrick Wilms one say your watching we're subverted oh yeah where is that you're watching movies wrong oh you're watching movies wrong pay $100 I like it I like these little pieces they got there as well super chat super chat super chat good stuff just I got hacked as the jail use express VP idea I should have been Singapore surely or something like that yeah thanks for that's cool hi rags check out hi who's Ian grow life from who's Ian grow life and arcanine I guess who's Ian who's Ian who's Ian I'm not sure while you do that rags is spot-on about you go modern yg o is akin to solitaire your opponent car can win on turn one before you play a card games really go past game three right goat format early 2005 ban list plays like a real game back and forth yeah the the original you do it it really did have this back and forth component like you were actually fighting somebody and you had to very thoroughly engage with what they were doing you couldn't just try and get off these crazy combos and stuff okay here is the you're the other grow life's prefer the originals these look strange but they're not terrible but prefer the originals will you do an e-fap on the last of us part to with John just because he likes it does not mean we have to torture him with telling us telling him all of our points about how much we despise that game okay all right I would never assume you would do another episode on that because I know you've done one already and I've all got to listen to it I've been meaning to but you know how it is I've been busy doing shit but I'm eventually gonna listen to it the whole way through because I'm actually very interested well I think we did a couple I maintain I think oh oh you did okay yeah I'll listen to those two I maintain that I enjoyed it man and if I said otherwise I'd be lying so it I thought it played really well I enjoyed the thick bleak atmosphere last of us part two oh I yeah I fuck I enjoyed it I thought the climax was exciting it kind of felt like pulp fiction this whole thing in Santa Barbara the final act I like the reversal of Abby even though that was a I know that's the point that turned a lot of people off I understand I don't think you guys are wrong at all I think I'm probably overlooking a bunch of things in its execution even though I enjoyed themes but I I'm not going to make you guys repeat yourselves I've got to watch your videos to be informed on your warning there's a vitriolic fucking hatred for that game and I still kind of harbor it quite a bit I understand man but yeah mm-hmm oh my god please read the pokedex entry for magic hop from sword hashtag feels bad man oh boy magic or be like all this family drown like oh every time and that gets later and later and that's like more poke bad and then just get more depressed and you get scared that some Pokemon is gonna eat you while you sleep mm-hmm most of them yeah I mean I don't think I don't need to post much medicare for anyone right holy shit that is a lot of text here sorry which one was that sword sword that's so many pokedex entries oh my god Ruby some I saw it there oh no what oh no it's so mean it just says it is virtually worthless in terms of both power and speed it is the most weak and pathetic Pokemon in the world oh no you don't have to say that that does seem just mean it seems mean spirited imagine you imagine you go out on your little adventures like oh what's this Pokemon oh don't do that it was worthless all right also high rags and high to the German who's never won a souls born race that's so well when I wasn't doing a race yeah man I love all those soul games but I haven't been a single one because I suck at them so much I'm not good if you would lay less loss of us just playing that constantly yeah can't make any time for any other video games I'm really good I like how I forgot to name the last of us for like two sayings like shit shit that was fucked it up you know I'm very impatient like I don't want to have to maintain for 20 minutes like precise roles and all that I just like my mind tends to wander a lot and then I just and you do that once and then you fuck up and then your health fucking goes down rapidly and it's a shame because I'm missing out on all this cool lore and world design journalist mode sorry good okay did you guys see boogie call out Ethan Klein on Twitter for being fat love my ass off I did I did see this that is I saw that picture of Ethan and I'm like fucking hell geez yeah he's what was was that a recent one ways like in the I don't know recliner or something just like is is belly almost I thought it was shopped at first so it's just like man that's that belly's getting big damn but I don't know I yeah I don't know how he's you might he might just let himself go a bit you know happens just a bit too many beats doubled in size pass pizza rags you can only peg one but you can never do the others options are Henry Cavill Ben Affleck and Anthony star also they're in this super suits this would be perfect if it was rags is stream on his channel why she's always ask all the sex questions about fucking super here it's just a little pegging it's fine you're like I feel like it should be Henry Cavill though easily kind of I'm assuming he's looking them up fell asleep you know I've been a lot of chat saying Henry wait hello oh yeah hello just like okay that's weird I guess RTX just fucking quit all that was happening so you ain't saying yeah I'm not into I'm not into pegging so that doesn't even mean anything to me I never had never had an interest in it whatsoever why would I peg them why would they why would not we just do nor do they know what pegging is they might know I don't know why wouldn't you not them I mean you could I guess but that would be strange roundabout way of doing things all right y'all should check out these sorts of questions make Fringy comfortable uncomfortable so you know how he is about this sort of thing pegging specifically y'all should check reach and terminalists no idea how Bezos Corp let those two gems come out I'm gonna go ahead and guess that they're actually not that good at all but what was funny is I've heard terminalists is decent I asked I hear recommendations that's I think that's different I can imagine that it's entertaining but I don't expect it to be good for episode one it wasn't spectacular but it pretty straightforward but it was alright I thought it was okay drinker was singing its praises and then he was like why haven't you watched all of us are dead yet I told you to then I was like well why aren't you recommending terminalists then he was like I don't think you would like it like oh I assume what he says that that he means he enjoyed it but that it's got plot fleams in it you know maybe maybe it is me because it's Chris Pratt Amazon Prime and it people it's got bad critical reviews and favorable audience reviews I maybe I'm being unfair by attaching those two together people people said the tomorrow war was great and like oh god and then we watched it so I'm sure that this film is this TV show can't be that bad because it's like a normal action thing isn't it so like it doesn't have any of the crazy time travel stuff that that thing has I think it was a straightforward and less cliche version of Jack Ryan you know the John Kronzisky Amazon I watched Jack Ryan and I stopped partway because it was just like I don't know this isn't doing anything for me yeah well I thought the plotting in dialogue was eye-rollingly cliche in that and but terminalists was a bit of an improvement all right hi rags hey thanks for mentioning Josh Strife Hayes led me to his content and love it did you know he's watching Jay and Metal Star Trek podcast hope you guys have him on sometime yeah yeah absolutely if he wants to come on I'm sure there's plenty of things we could talk about me now I don't know why anyone would watch and I'll talk about start guys crazy guy I'm here this time you can't say that hey mom bouncing off the Wednesday discussion about Simpsons American dad family guy a few trauma etc it's fascinating how well they understand how to write jokes but also managed to be well-rounded shows as a whole of them I mean yeah you could almost take it for granted right cuz like I loved watching them and I was grown up and I'm sure I'd happily watch a bunch of them now the the more classic episodes for each of the shows but you know these days they struggle to string together a plot line that can do anything for a lot of other shows we've been watching but maybe that's that's harsh because I'm mainly talking about Disney set of like animated shows but then again you know I doubt family guy and future drama is not God's new episode out yet is it like are we still I recently watched the pandemic special and some of this episodes like South Park still good there's more stuff we got to watch streaming wars I think is the new one I'll watch part one and two yeah there's two parts they're both like saying like an hour each that there's Karen Randy like Randy with a current haircut yeah my I wasn't a fan of part one but part two got a few laughs out of me I thought that was okay all right look up try brigade Nerval it reminds me of Fringy you geocard oh I can see why this reminds you of free as it reminds you of me oh yeah it does yeah I can see I can see why yeah there is something in there that I think you could pick out yeah oh wow that's cool kind of like green goblin are those like bombs sure why not yeah it's one of those new cards that's just look at all the text on there it's one two three four six lines and they have to shorten graveyard to G why just so they could fit this shit in what's this Spanish tri brigade Nerval isn't it strange how Mario never ages but Donkey Kong has cranky Kong is OG DK that fought Mario in the arcade Donkey Kong Junior is the second DK and the current modern DK is the third Donkey Kong maybe he's the only creature in the Mushroom Kingdom that ages like for some reason everyone else cracked immortality molar of puppets and pulling your sleeves twisted your rags and smashing your fringes I know this great yes hi rags and hello to Fringy and John hi hello okay got recommended a cover band on YouTube check their social media and what do I see but a Fringy retweet turns out they follow a bunch of you guys nifty oh oh wow yeah how about it all good that's quite a coincidence kawinke ding not sure if covered before but have a look see it dex entry of Giganta Max Gengar both sword and shield I can't I want to give that a look see I'll read the next one while you it's just gonna be a huge fucking Gengar isn't it it I'm looking it up it's huge oh Giganta Max it's like a modifier right you can apply that to any Pokemon it's just big big Gengar large boy Gengar that is a big boy big big oh there's a Pokedex entry for that oh Gengar where's the max what is this I hate this it's too much Pokemon I'll keep reading let me know when you got it yeah I've heard rumors of a Marvel villains team up show or film is this true well if you think of Thunderbolts that's more of an anti-hero team or something right I want one sorry they're saying they've heard rumors of a Marvel villains team or show or film I think that is meant to be Thunderbolts but it's more like anti-heroes yeah Fringy what do you think of Bullseye's character um it's been a while since I watched season 3 I remember liking him but I couldn't hone in on anything specific at the moment so there's the Gengar and the sword one says rumor has it that it's gigantic mouth leads in leads not into its body filled with cursed energy but instead directly to the afterlife okay going there there's a doorway to the afterlife shield one it lays traps hoping to steal the lives of those that catches if you stand in front of its mouth you'll hear your loved ones voices calling out to you geez all right then yep that's about your point you gotta be 10 to be responsible enough to control yes I wonder if they ever retcon that if they were changed it if they ever realized that that was stupid you have to understand everybody in this universe is like a hundred when they reach 10 that's how that works okay you're like oh as a comparison just a normal Gengar entry for Pokemon red under a full moon this Pokemon likes to mimic the shadows of people and laugh at their fright oh we'll see that's not like that hurt or kill anybody so you're prank you know yeah sometimes you feel a sudden chill it might be trying to lay a curse on you but that's that's as bad as it gets for the for red blue and yellow all right not not gigantic and has a afterlife mouth Archie Sonic is the worst thing ever made where do I begin with this horrendous obnoxious over bloated over dramatic fresh fetishized Nazi driven and overall completely nonsensical soap opera well I'm not gonna bother by I used to collect that comic when I was a kid I started from issue 12 Archie Sonic that'll even know all right yes so Archie there's Archie comics and then Sonic was kind of a subdivision of that Archie Sonic comics oh how terrible would this be I mean it oh I mean it's you know our yeah Archie they have Sonic the Hedgehog and he's all broody and there's fire in the back I just I can't look at Sonic and take him seriously and imagine him with all these like robots and these these conflagrations behind him and these really I just can't do it you know yeah I know what you mean I know yeah let me like look I look at this and I'm like I can't take that seriously yeah this clearly sexual John it's a brave boy I respect it yes talking about your brave loss was to okay and you guys are good enough to keep having me on my dumb my my dumb stupid but we were paid to have you on to be fair but I still Neil Druckmann slipped you good stuff forget about Star Wars destiny said in an old interview that Lord of the Rings trilogy was bad and overhyped wow wrong again you guys have to understand that's what he and Adam and Sitch like they need to say these things otherwise it wouldn't make sense they got to have all the bad takes all right oh because otherwise they wouldn't just have like one or two bad takes they'd have all the bad things like a requisite for talking about politics is that you video takes just the cancerously bad because you I think it makes complete sense because all of the all the film people they're so high let's take Chris Duckman for example who's hyper aware that you're supposed to like Blade Runner to the point where he will force himself to like Blade Runner because if he hadn't he'd be socially ostracized you see that that's the format that's like the environment when you're a politics streamer and you randomly share like oh yeah I you know I thought that Indiana Jones was shit and everyone else is like what because you're not allowed to that they don't know so they stumble into these horrible takes because they haven't been shown the light yet and you know they don't have these conversations they don't know those those poor fuckers they don't know we'll save them one day day but now we let them frolic in the forest of being wrong I haven't frolic in a while look at this I don't want to you will you make me look at it you must that's Sonic the Hedgehog it says they're really big and top first issue look at him and his little his little look at what look how weird Tails looks they can't even draw Sonic as well as me I think they should have hired this true they can't they need to hire you my Sanix with best oh my god this is a blast from the past oh yeah I literally have a stack of these in my mom's basement I used to collect them religiously every week the Archie Sonic is all comics are these specific well that's what I mean back when specifically yes specifically Sonic the Hedgehog because I got Sonic 2 on Genesis and immediately I was a Sonic fan and I'm like I gotta get the comic I saw them on the rack when I would go out shopping with my parents I'm like I gotta get this stay up to date on my Sonic lore lads you drew you drew that epic Sonic on that guy I'm looking at all these comic with all shit I guess there's a huge fan base it just I guess I have to remind myself every once in a while there's a massive amount of people who fucking adore Sonic and I just do not get I've never had a friend who's fucking obsessed with Sonic back in the day and I was always just like little adored by the appeal of like old-school like 90s Sonic right I love Sonic 3 and knuckles I think that game games yeah I mean like the yeah like the Genesis ones like Sonic 2 Sonic and knuckles you know I'm not even a fan of Sonic 1 but I think Sonic 2 really improved the formula and then Sonic 3 and knuckles perfected it yeah cool and it's a fun little world but then so little about the beginning of the new year jungle adventure we're on boomerangs falling down the rabbit hole of Sonic comic books go go read them all rags go read them all in the fullback yeah which are the good sonics look they got a they're doing the I just I'm just look at all these there's so many here's so fucking many they got quite a lot out of that character in terms of comic book lore that's for sure they got a lot of Sonic in general yeah that's even makes it on to old Gothic phones am I right dude this is issue 12 this is my first ever Sonic comic did you see the pink furry bait on it you're like yeah I gotta get this it's not a fetish the comic I think this was just the issue that happened to be out the week that I got interested because I was so hyped on Sonic 2 for Genesis gotta get that Sonic comic yeah um we have read out all Superchats by the way and but before that John what are you up to what's happening tell everyone oh well I'm still doing my YouTube crap I've got I'm juggling a couple things at the moment I started a new review series and I'm also doing the finale of my RV in the chief season eight I'm working on that as well John Graham on YouTube if you want to subscribe yeah that's my thing yeah I mean they are pretty familiar with you at this point I think if they were gonna stop they probably would have but those who are holding out it's your loss you better or I'll find you wow Duma just threw in his little chat saying kick sit she's not even here I would have kicked him by now yeah but you've got long legs you can stretch them out find them I don't I don't think Stoats have very long limbs at all no more like and he's asking Mola to do it I'm saying that Mola can use as long leg well as you highlighted in what you were saying Bailey there's like you couldn't find him is like no I don't know where sitches what we do kick everything and just hope what I thought yeah Mel what are you up to where you going what's happening run away what what I'm doing still metals forge weekly I did one twice I did two whoa in one week I'm down yeah yeah those just trailers before you did so you basically copied me and I demand compensation but that's fine this is compensation right now oh cool thanks appreciate that wait how do you like Majora's mask metal do you like I liked it I actually like it better than Ocarina of Time right on was the first time I played it and I had a great time I was good stuff wow that's cool yeah I made it to play conforming the general opinion doing metals forge tomorrow probably the same if that time as today I'm going to be talking about bullet train because I watched that in the cinematisms and I'm going to talk about it because I found it to be pretty entertaining what would you give it out of 10 metal commit to a number right now I know four or five static in like a good way I mean basically better than most of the things I've seen this year it's ranking pretty high so go go go hungers there it's always a good time I'm on this unofficial DC a is it DC DC are you yeah arc with me we did massive to phantasm last week there was good stuff those are always long forges like they always go up to like four hours which I know short man bad shut up long enough for me there those are good good stuff go go check that out if you if you want to see me live I do streaming Ling Ling's on the twitcher rules as everyone is probably aware I'm a bit on a retro arc if you will I'm currently playing God hand on my PlayStation 2 so I'm playing all that stuff my original hardware just going back doing things I even got Silent Hill one as an original cover my PlayStation one so that's I have that prepared for for spooky month me though little teaser for that if you want but yeah yeah that's that's what's going on there you go rags springy what about you guys what about me in what way I don't know what do you mean so like are you working on anything you got the update oh sorry I was looking at these fucking weird Sonic comic covers it's a fucking rabbit hole of bizarre yeah I should have a video out not too long yeah I'm just working on stuff I'd like to have more to say right now but I don't hopefully I will soon I think last week I said I'll probably be able to say more this week and all I got to say this week is I'll probably be able to say more next week because not quite there but almost at a point of being able to this thing is big as long okay so yeah more info all right next week maybe I'll be inclined to say exactly what it is by next week I think before the fab next week you'll see I'll post I'll post the timeline in its completed form without visuals fully done so you can at least see that and I'll tell you how long it is at that point you say that every week Mola I only said it last week I was the only other week I said it you lying you're telling me lies deception once again told you this dream had a theme terrible so yeah stuff stuff on the way and as you guys know got the anniversary stream coming in 20 days from now oh my we're exciting day who knows what'll happen fun times ahead and we got we got another super sure it says kick them all and let the dawn sort them out some good good way to approach life I'd say good way that's solid solid yeah that's about that's about that I'd say we're gonna head off now thank you all for giving us a listen for hanging out those kind donations and the guests and mr. typo for jumping on as well that was a bit of fun yeah like I said and these are always fun thank you very much for having me on and thank you chat thanks for coming on dude and of course we're gonna watch pray and talk about it next week so if you guys want to be in on it and go watch yourselves or you can just listen to us summarize it we probably will probably than that thank you all so much and we'll see you next time yeah we'll see you guys here's guys