 All right, let's so go back and so with Jennifer Okay, um, I was arguing the other day with someone about I was saying that slavery and things like that in the past were wrong and he said well you can't judge by today's standard stuff people did back then but Reality is Objective and if no one question it at the time, how would you ever get to where you are now? Yeah, right? So? People have this attitude, but you never would have gotten to where we are if nobody ever said anything Yes, and and look knowledge is contextual So if they really didn't have the knowledge that the slaves were human beings Right, then you could then you can make an argument They they gained the knowledge and then they change but they did have the knowledge and the knowledge existed And they were anti-slavery advocates among the sleep among the funding for this and there were people making argument against slavery at the time This wasn't something that was completely Mysterious And indeed slavery had been a part of human life forever An argument was never slaves are subhuman The argument was who cares they lost the war. They're my slaves, right? I captured them my slaves But suddenly in the 18th century there's this concept of individual rights And that doesn't work anymore that idea that they have rights and and lock articulates that enough and our founders are taking these ideas seriously and in a sense you have to say they didn't really have an excuse now they make arguments about If we freed all the slaves today, they would be worse off or stuff like that But one gets a real sense that those are rationalizations Those are not there were a lot of laws designed to protect the rights of slaves before they emancipated them Yes, so You know, they could have protected them. They could have done things to protect them But I think they're more rationalizations than anything else. So I do think you have to judge the founders You know, you you have to judge it within the context of the time. Yes They were we couldn't have had a united states probably if they had fought over this They would have been you know, the the colleagues would have splendid and it's not clear that we would have gained independence from the british So it's a compromise that maybe they had to make but it would be nice if they'd been more sort of In clearly stating that this was a compromise. They were they were opposed to and So I think we when does and should Judge them but also in the context judge them given the time and judge them also uh, given their achievements that is yes, this was wrong, but You know, they did set in motion Everything that ultimately led to slavery You know going away so Yeah, wasn't there even greeks that wrote against slavery way back Back that probably I don't know but probably were yeah. Yeah, no, but but suddenly by the time of john lock there's an understanding of Individual is an individual and indeed The idea of enslaving white people It doesn't exist anymore, right and now it's just blacks now. It's just the other Uh, but it didn't you know, the idea of individual rights wasn't fully understood and didn't fully Integrate and what I mean women. I mean they treated women the same way, right women didn't have rights In the sense that men had rights didn't write to property for example so Right to life liberty and pursuit of happiness and property and pursuit of happiness was definitely Wasn't all it was all men created equal and it wasn't women and it was men white men and And I always thought I had that view of women. I mean I always thought I had an awful view of women so But I think by that point of time They probably could have done better and and one should evaluate that and I want you judge that and one should Make judgment. It doesn't mean that it eliminates or That wipes out their achievements and all the good that they did All right, I was just trying to point out how you get from there to hear Someone has to stand up and with a different idea and challenge it. Yeah, there's some of the founders already did and and it was And it evolves and then you've got this incredibly courageous movement, which was the abolitionist movement There was unbelievably courageous because they faced horrific odds and they they fought for for Individual rights for freedom and and they were successful reading about that is truly inspiring because there's the odds that they faced were truly horrific What we need today what I called a new intellectual would be any man or woman who is willing to think Meaning any man or woman who knows that man's life must be guided by reason By the intellect not by feelings wishes wins or mystic revelations Any man or woman who values his life? And who does not want to give in to today's scout of the spare? cynicism and impotence and does not intend to give up the world To the dark ages and to the role of the collectivist using the super chat and I noticed yesterday when I appealed For support for the show many of you step forward and actually Supported the show for the first time. So I'll do it again. Maybe we'll get some more today If you like what you're hearing if you appreciate what I'm doing Then I appreciate your support Those of you who don't yet support the show. Please take this opportunity. Go to iranbrookshow.com Slash support or go to subscribe star dot com you're on brook show and And make a kind of a monthly contribution to keep this to keep this going. I'm not sure when the next