 Welcome to your Property Rights podcast proudly brought to you by Private Property. If you're looking for expert legal answers to all your property related questions, then stay tuned. Hello, and a very warm welcome. This is your Property Rights podcast. Lovely to be here and a very warm welcome to our first episode proudly brought to you in partnership with, of course, Private Property. Silna Stain is my guest. She joins us in studio. Silna is the MD of SSLR Incorporated Attorneys where she is an expert property lawyer with a specific focus on rentals and evictions. Nice to see you again. Silna. Hello. Hey, Paul. How are you doing? I'm doing fabulous. We're going to get our teeth into an awesome topic for our first episode. I'm so excited. I hope you've got your legal brain in gear because the way that the show works, this is the very first one that we are doing, of course. The way that it works is we've been trolling through all of the questions and comments that have been coming in across our private property platforms. There's a mouthful. And we've chosen some really interesting subject matter and some relevant questions. And the question that has come in for episode one really speaks to me, and I think this will speak to you as well, Silna, particularly with you being in the legal space. And the question is as follows. Hi, guys. I have been renting a granny flat on my landlord's property for almost two years. Recently, writes this person, my landlord has started asking me about my COVID-19 vaccination status. I was then informed, writes the listener, that my lease would be terminated if I do not show him proof of vaccination before the end of the month, as in quotes, the health and safety of his family is a priority. Close quotes. I have very little to no contact with anyone else on the property. And so I do feel like this is extremely unfair and prejudiced. That for me is a very interesting topic to kick off our podcast, episode one. I think it brings to mind a very simple question, Silna, and that is this. Can a landlord force you to disclose your vaccination status or, in fact, terminate your lease simply because you are unvaccinated? Please help. And yes, we are going to help. Sure, this is a heavy one to get things going, but I think it's relevant. I think it's so relevant, Paul, and I'm so glad this is our first question because I think this sets the tone perfectly for what we are going to be doing on this show, really getting down to the important real life issues that people are faced with every single day. So actually the answer to the start of the question is quite simple. No, a landlord can't, but I think we're going to have to place it out a little bit more. So the starting point in a question like this would be. What is the reason for the landlord demanding to either disclose vaccination status or demand that you have to be vaccinated? And the truth is there's no legislation in South Africa regulating the required or compulsory vaccine. I know there's a lot of talk about this on social media and everywhere else. And as with most things, a lot of people have a lot of opinions around it. But there isn't something in our law that makes vaccines compulsory. So specifically the COVID-19 vaccine, it's not a compulsory vaccination. So us as private citizens, between the two of us, we can't make something law or a legal requirement that isn't factually so in law. It's very similar to me walking into the studio and you asking me to prove that I've been fully vaccinated. Otherwise, you will not allow me into the stereo. That is not a requirement in law and not an enforceable thing in law at this stage. That would be personal preference and not law, which pertains to a relationship between a landlord and a tenant. 100 percent. And for that reason, at the inception of the lease agreement, remember a landlord and a tenant contracts around the terms of the agreement that they both feel comfortable with. There's a few things that you have to contract around. And this is called the essentialia of a lease agreement. So essentialia are the parts of an agreement that makes an agreement a specific type of agreement. So in a lease agreement or essentialia is only that the parties agree that the tenant will lease the property from the landlord, that the landlord will give the tenant undisturbed use and enjoyment of the premises and that this arrangement will be only temporary. Those are the essentialia of a lease agreement. If one of them are missing, it doesn't mean the contract is invalid, but it means it's not a lease agreement. OK, but you can hear required compulsory vaccination doesn't have a feature at all. And then we can contract around everything else, obviously with in legal limitations. So if the parties are specific, I want you to make sure, Mr. Landlord, that the property is painted green before I move in. This is not a requirement in law or anything, but the parties may agree to this and we then record that in a special condition, which now makes it part of our contract. So on inception of a lease when we negotiating lease terms, then a landlord may say, I want you to be vaccinated. The tenant then has full discretion to either accept or reject that term. That might mean that the parties aren't going to conclude a lease agreement because the landlord says this is a non-negotiable and the tenant says, well, for me too, and it then doesn't happen. That's not discrimination or anything. The parties are allowed. Remember, we have freedom of contract in South Africa. So the parties may contract around that, but you can't midterm in a lease agreement. Try to change the terms of the agreement. It's very interesting what you've mentioned there, Silna. You've mentioned that that is not discrimination. So let me just understand this as a layperson. I'm going into an agreement now with my landlord. I found a beautiful place I'd like to rent to ticks all the boxes. When I receive the contract, one of the conditions, not a legal requirement, but a condition set down by the landlord is, Mr. Otherham, you will be vaccinated. If vaccination, as it stands at the moment at the recording of this podcast, vaccination is not mandatory in South Africa. That is not a legal requirement. Surely to some extent that could be considered discrimination. It's not discrimination, but it is. For lack of a better word, a silly term to bring into a lease agreement. It's not illegal. It's not discriminatory in any way. Remember, to require somebody to be vaccinated in other contexts, for instance, some employment contracts, things like that. It could make a lot of sense for the employer or, for that matter, then any other contracting party to require somebody to be vaccinated. However, remember, the fact that that I say this doesn't mean the tenant doesn't have the right to go back to the landlord and say, Mr. Landlord, I don't like this term in the agreement. Similar to I don't like this term that you want me to water the garden five times a week. And if I don't, I'm in breach of contract and you're going to cancel the agreement. I can come to the landlord and say, Mr. Landlord, I really don't want to get vaccinated or I don't want to commit to it now. I'm not there yet where I know whether I want to get vaccinated or not. So I'm not going to enter into this contract with this term in the agreement. And this brings me back to the importance of reading the contract and negotiating around the terms that is not acceptable. And honestly, for a tenant where it's not acceptable and you do not want that term be the five times a week watering the garden or the vaccination clause, you can say, Mr. Landlord, you know what? I'm rather going to look for another property. As you would, if you can see the shower is leaking and the landlord said he had it fixed a million times and you know, I'm going to have to live with this. Similar to that, you can choose this is not the property for me. And you contract us another landlord. I think it really comes down to what's reasonable as well, because if I put my shoes, not my shoes, my feet in the shoes of someone who is listening now, thinking, sure, I am a rental type person. I don't want to purchase a property. I only want to rent. My advice, just as a layperson, would be that if at the very onset of discussions with your landlord, if you are already entering terrain that is uncomfortable, if on an agreement already, you're sensing that we're not really going to get along here. This is not somebody who I'd be inviting around to have a cup of tea with me. You're probably better off distancing yourself from that person. And I know landlord, tenant relationships can be difficult at best. But this is something that ultimately comes back to what is written on the agreement. And as I'm understanding today, Silne, you're saying that agreement can't be changed willy-nilly partway through the terms of the agreement at the beginning of that contract period. Those are binding following the termination of that agreement. Let's say I'm going to now renew my contract. Oh, I've had a lovely year here and I'd like to renew Mr. Landlord. Can I please renew at that point? Correct me if I'm wrong. New terms and conditions could be introduced by the landlord. 100 percent. And at that point, depending on how it was done, if the parties agreed that we're going to do a renewal at Denim on the same terms and conditions, once that agreement starts, the new one, it's by agreement based on the previous agreement. So if the parties agreed in writing that we're only going to do a renewal at Denim, so we're going to stick to the existing contract, even in a case like that, the landlord won't be able to change the terms unless he gave the tenant notice 40 to 80 business days prior to the impending termination date of the lease agreement. Of these material changes to his lease agreement, this is in terms of section 14 of the Consumer Protection Act. OK, so to answer your question, and I think that was a fantastic question for your property rights podcast, our very first episode proudly brought to you by Private Property. I think that's a fabulous question. Can a landlord force you to disclose your vaccination status or even terminate your lease simply because you are unvaccinated? The answer is no. And that concludes this episode. We'd love to hear your thoughts and views on this. Not that we want to take our property conversation into the world of vaccinations and covid, we're trying to get over that. But share your comments with us here on our private property socials. And we'd love for this to start a conversation and share your experiences. Have you perhaps dealt with a landlord who just like this person insisted that you go for a vaccine or perhaps insisted on something else that you felt was unreasonable? Because remember, there's a huge difference between what is legal and binding and somebody's personal opinion. So, Solna, thank you very much for joining us for this episode. We'll be looking forward to having you again in the next one. Only a pleasure. This one was fun. Join us again for episode two of your property rights podcast proudly brought to you by Private Property with myself, Paul Rotherham. Thanks for being here. Your property rights podcast is proudly brought to you by Private Property. Leave a comment or ask a question to join the conversation.