 Every part is I've created a bidding war for and got them into deals worth seven fingers eight fingers. Guess what they're willing to listen to me because we're at the mercy of the ad platform. What's up? What's up? What's up? I'm Burnman Sean and I'm Corey. We are back with another episode of no labels necessary. Podcasts. You can catch us on every place you stream your podcast. We don't do every Tuesday and Thursday no more. So catch us when you catch us, you know, Spotify, YouTube, Apple music. This is the intersection of creativity and currency. And today we have a very special guest. She is the guru. This man does it. He's a digital marketer. He's broken artists over and over and over again. Yeah, it's always a pleasure to get up with brand man Sean and Corey. Yo, I really don't linger with a lot of marketers like that. You know, you hop on social media. You see everybody got a little page where they so called giving advice on how to help artists because you know, a lot of these guys they're not in the field. What are they doing? Brand man Sean and Corey. I know they actively do this. So it's always a pleasure. Whenever they say, yo, let's wake up. I'm here. I'm going to appreciate that, man. Appreciate that. And same to you, man. Like you've like just off of ads alone, that's your bag. So we got to talk about ads, right? Because you have blown artists up off of ads. And this is something that I know you've heard before. Ads don't work. Ads don't work, right? Yeah. So like, I want to get into the entrepreneurial side of your career and some of the other natures. But I feel like the best way to start so people can understand like the value that you bring and how to see things differently. Yeah. But what does it look like to how many artists have you like seen takeoff or solace that you got to give millions of streams just off of ads alone? Well, I say this, right? Since 2016, my agency on average, we break like at least one or two artists a year or whatever. Yeah. No, honestly, it's more like two or whatever. You feel me? Sometimes they spoke over the the next year, whatever. I average two artists every year, whatever. We've countless artists, millions of streams, whatever, millions of views, this and that, whatever. So when people say ads don't work, whatever, all they got to understand is this, ads is just an opportunity for somebody to see your content. You know what I mean? At the end of the day, there's so many different forms of marketing inside this business, different ways of skin and cat that gives you the attention that you need as artists, whatever. But what a lot of artists don't understand is your content still has to be high quality. It still has to be good, you feel me? So when they say ads don't work, okay, cool. These platforms are confusing. Sometimes it could be all about how you set up the campaigns because the platforms do put things in place to trick you, whatever, and make you do the wrong thing and spend more money, whatever, and not get the results you're looking for. That does happen, whatever. But on the same note, a lot of times artists don't have their content together the right way. The look is unbelievable. You know what I'm saying? This is about branding. This is about storytelling. I say all the time, branding equals trust. When people see you do these ads, they have to believe you. They have to believe you. They have to believe your story. You know what I mean? It has to be authentic, whatever. So a lot of people miss that part. You know what I'm saying? So ads do work. Lots of times it's either the way you approach the ads is it's not working, you know? Man, I ain't gonna lie, man. I heard it somewhere. I don't know if it's true or not. You can't find me with it now. But I heard you pop a card if you're up for ads. I had some hands and I ran some campaigns for her, whatever, around the time she was coming up, you know what I'm saying? But I wouldn't say that it was simply my work that built that up because at that time that she had she was making money off the action by my God, whatever. He was the one who had her sign, whatever. And when she was getting her bag, whatever, she invested a lot into radio advertising at that time, whatever. But also we got to know that Cardi B wasn't just coming from nowhere. She already she was already active on social media. She had her own platform, whatever. So I think it was a situation where people were sitting back waiting to see like, yo, oh, you know, is it for real? You said once it's all real, they all got behind it. But I did have a hand like running campaigns for her, whatever, early on in her career, whatever. Just saying, though. But there are a few acts that are actually major that I did have their hands on, my hands on. But sometimes we signed NDAs on that shit. So they don't want to be known that you know, they had ads bumping their shit. So a lot of these artists for the most part that you don't think you feel like they just came out of nowhere. Now they come out of nowhere. They have people like me or someone else working in things like six to eight months behind the scenes, whatever, you know what I'm saying? That's crazy that you mentioned that because there is times where there's multiple things going on and people don't know exactly where the impact is going from. So you might have a major artist. It could be smaller artists, too. But we've seen campaigns where it might have ads. You'll see some maybe a couple of influencer posts. The artist might be doing something organically, right? But the thing that's really moving them the needle is that or some campaigns, it might be the influencers. But like, it's crazy how it really could be one thing that's supposed to work. The rest of it's just a vision. But you know how, look at it though. Everything else is like, what's the word? It's like, it's a holistic approach. Everybody thinks it's one main thing, whatever, right? Because if I'm just running the ads and the artist isn't active on their platforms, whatever. They don't have other things going on, whatever. Lots of times it's not going to come together. You know what I mean? The dope thing about ads is automate your process. So it means that regardless what else you got going on, you know that wherever you're asleep or you're up, you're going to get your attention. People are seeing your content, whatever, you know what I'm saying? So it's a good backup for the most part, whatever. Sometimes it looks like it's leading the way, but it's a good backup to have. If you know that you're actively posting, whatever, you know that somebody engages with your profile, they engage with the post that you're running, whatever. You know that retarget is going to catch it back and you can follow up and tap back into that audience. So it's just a good thing to automate your whole process for the most part, you know? Yeah. Yeah, I like that, man. Because like, in so many ways, if you're just doing one of these things, you can blow up with almost every single part of marketing by itself, right? But whatever you do, but with it by itself, you can probably do like five, 10 times more if you're doing other things. It's just a big difference. I know I passed her in clients where it was just strictly me, my ads running the thing, whatever. And it got into a dope situation. And the deal was worth, it was like seven finger plus, eight finger plus situation, whatever. Just off of ads. Just off of ads, whatever, you know what I'm saying? But is it really just the ads, whatever, yo? Nah, it's also that artist, you know what I'm saying? You know, being active on the stories, whatever, knowing how to engage with the audience, knowing what they're talking to, having their vision, their story locked in. A lot of you artists, whatever, and it's okay because y'all still learning y'all coming up on, but a lot of you artists don't know who you're talking to. Y'all just throwing songs out there. You're throwing music out there and seeing what sticks. But when somebody knows what the hell they're talking about, let's say, and they know like how to move on camera, whatever. When I hit them ads behind it, they hit so much different, they weigh so much more, you know what I'm saying? So, my thing, by myself, I've been able to get people's situations, but also the best situation is when they got somebody who's gonna reach out to certain platforms, get them to interviews, you know what I'm saying? They got a real public, I'm not talking about the public, it's just that it gets you on a blog site or website that's not even active, you know what I'm saying? Some of the ones that create moments for you, they'll get you interviews with a brand man, they'll get you on a red carpet somewhere, you know what I'm saying? It's a holistic approach, whatever. So I never try to be like, I'm the main thing, whatever. It's been there some few times, whatever, but I know the power of everything moving and sinking. People be at lockdown, you know what I'm saying? You see so many campaigns and you always say, the content has to be dope. I can guarantee somebody sees it, but if it's not dope, it's not dope. What have you noticed in terms of the best content that you've seen really started to get results over the years? Yo, you know what's funny though? Here's the thing, right? I tell people all the time this, I keep on saying I'm sorry all the time today, there's multiple ways to skin a cat. You know what I'm saying? What I mean by that is this, I'm not the only way to blow up. I'm not the only way to get action going. I'm not the only way with a radio, but if somebody come to me, your content need to be compliant because we're at the mercy of the ad platforms. You feel me? Sometimes artists, every artist I've created a bidding war for and got them into deals with seven figures, eight figures plus with a radio. Guess what? They're willing to listen to me, right? Yo, I'm telling you, this intro needs to be chopped. Even though they've made a whole drawing out story in the intro, one minute, 30 seconds, yo. They know they want to get it. They'll chop that whole thing, whatever, you know what I'm saying? I tell them, yo, it has to be compliant. We got to remove certain things out the video to remove that. They'll have clean audio. A lot of artists who want, so many artists don't know what I do, but they're willing to make those changes with a radio. So what works the most is pretty much part compliant content with what I do. And then also, like, yo, just not even like crazy videos. It's simple. Like if the song is dope enough, the music is going to speak for itself, yo. The music is going to speak for itself, yo. So you know, you got to have all this craziness in the video. I've always seen like a simple video that looks authentic, though. It looks like the lifestyle. It looks like the message that you're saying, yo. You got to be congruent with what you're talking about, yo, you know what I'm saying? Like people got to see it. They got to believe it. They got to feel like this is real. So authentic content, yo. That's what works the most far as content, man. And if you're coming to me and you're running the ads, compliancy, you know what I'm saying? Why not have your thing compliant? Why? Well, you know we're at the mercy of the platform. Why are we going to do things to hinder our growth, whatever. The most terrible thing you can have is a campaign running for like six months. Millions of views at that point, yo. The labels are already checking you. Research A&Rs are already tapping in because they got a chart measure. They see your growth, whatever. And then your thing's going out here. And then Google catches it and out of nowhere, boom, it drops, whatever. Why would you want to do that to yourself, yo? You feel me? That's the real thing. It's always crazy when it's running. And then it stops. Running, yeah. I tell people, yo, sometimes people come to me because, oh, change, we see your videos. You've been able to get so many dirty content going. I'm like, yeah, we sometimes do that. And I always, but in my decks, when I'm marketing them, I'm like, yo, clean is predictable. We require you to run clean, whatever. Now don't get twisted. You come to us dirty content and you adamant about running for you, but you're at the mercy of a platform catching it and killing your whole buzz. Now you got people in a row sitting down talking, oh, this artist is it, yo, he about to be the next thing. We about to get like five million, this and that, building your whole career on. And then, yo, your whole buzz dropped. And the person that's trying to sell you to the people upstairs can't even sell you no more because your momentum is clipped, yo, you feel me? Yo, that's a huge thing. I don't think a lot of artists understand if you're not in that position and it sucks because when they're having those conversations, it really is based off of a real time. Like the constant, like I can say whatever I want to say, but the selling is they're looking at the numbers. Like the person that does it, that's not you, right? The other guy in the back that you're selling to, they don't care. They just see numbers. The moment that number look like it's slowing down. Oh, done, yo. It's funny, cause my, I'm pointing to Mary in the corner whatever shot that Tamara wanna, you know what I'm saying? She runs a lot of my campaigns now, like optimizing, making them go crazy, whatever, right? But it'd be funny sometimes when clients tell her, oh, it's not that dirty. You feel me? You know what I mean? We like, yo, like Jen's recommends it to be clean whatever before he touches it. Oh, it's not that dirty. Or what we see you run this and that. We seen Jen's get this going, this and that, blah, blah. And I'm like, I don't know what I'm telling you guys. Yeah, I ran mad campaigns. I got mad artists, but I'm telling you all the bidding war situations I've created has been with compliant content, yo. So who are y'all to still question me? You feel me? One question hurts. So, you know, people don't wanna let that go, I mean, I think it goes back to like, which maybe they don't know when they say, oh, I've seen some ads before that are like, they got crazy stuff in the video and it's running. But I don't think they, a lot of people understand what we just said that it could get cut off after it starts well. They miss stuff, but eventually. Eventually, yeah, they're gonna catch you. Yo, I've had artists, whatever, who I've actually got. It's funny, artists who I've sometimes, I've got the content to go dirty, you whatever, and they've got their deal situation, whatever, yo. They went into their record deal and they're like probably like, eight months after we done running the campaign, we'll get a notification with Google, like, oh, this is disapproved, but not, you know? So they eventually will catch you. No matter what it is. It's about like, but while I play that game and be at the mercy of the platform, you feel me? So, yeah, man, it's about like, honestly, yo, what I've seen over this year, over the years, this comes down to like comprehension. A lot of you guys, yo, did bad at reading comprehension in school, y'all probably were the bad students that like, yo, handed in like record essays, whatever. And because you didn't write it in blue pink, you got the F plus, whatever. It's about following directions and following the rules, whatever, to get what you want. And it's like, man, you know what I mean? Yeah. All right. So I want to give a reminder that being independent, it's not just about not being signed to a label. It's actually making money without being signed to a label, being able to have a sustainable career. And for those of y'all who actually want to be able to make money from your fan base, you're serious about figuring out how to monetize. I have a free video that you can check out. I don't need your email. I don't need your phone number. I don't need any information. All you have to do is go to www.nolabelsnecessary.com slash monetize. And I'm going to show you the lies that artists have been told that have been keeping them, probably you too, from monetizing your fan base and how shifting that perspective has allowed one artist we're working with to be on track to make over $500,000 this year. This is a different era. Don't fall for that trap saying artists can't make money. Artists do not have to be broke. So if you want to escape that trap, go to www.nolabelsnecessary.com slash monetize. You do have to make sure you put the www in the beginning when you type it in your URL and watch this free video again. You're not going to be asked to put in your email. You're not going to be asked for your phone number, but it won't be up forever. Check it out. It makes me think about one side is content to quality. The other side are the choices. Yeah. Right. And there's a lot of different choices we can get into. Let's just start here. All right. If somebody who knows how to run in that, you got the audience, the targeting and all that stuff. Just keeping it general because I know it's subjective for each artist. How do you feel about international versus domestic ass today? Let's talk about that, right, yo? Boom. Let's talk about that, right? I always said this from the beginning, right, yo? My business has never changed with this, whatever, right, yo? At the end of the year, when you see the Spotify wrap up, you never see an artist who blew up, oh, yeah, they blew straight from one country, yo. It's always like 93, 90, whatever, some country, whatever, right, yo? So you have to run international to pop, yo, to get the, you cannot make you with just USA alone, you feel me? Can't do it at all, yo. I've never seen that happen. It has to be, and guess what? When it should take off, whatever, it's always other countries involved in what's why. The thing about running international with ass is this, yo, you have to run relevant, yo. It's not about padding numbers, yo. It's not about, yo, we're gonna get 50 million cooked from Zimbabwe, this and that, whatever, you know what I'm saying? Now, if Zimbabwe had a way to monetize, you know what I'm saying, the music that you're presenting to them, whatever, yo, then cool, let's go to Zimbabwe. But no, we're gonna run the places that can actually, like, yo, support our music through streams, whatever, you know what I'm saying? Can support our number, and it can matter, you know what I'm saying? So when I run international, I run relevant. Obviously, USA and Canada, North America has to be the number one thing with that, cause you got, you got, you get a list of all the countries that you run to, whatever, you know what I'm saying? So a good sign to me is when we, before even optimization, and before optimization, when we start like checking those numbers, whatever, and we see that off rip, USA and Canada are like the number two countries, whatever, off rip, whatever, and then everything else could follow, whatever, so it's about basically running relevant, make sure a home is tapped, then whatever, you know what I'm saying? Yo, yo, it's good to hear that, man, cause I mean, people only look at international asses, like spammy, stuff like that. Yeah, but those people, yeah, but those people not really, they're not really doing it, they don't understand. Yeah, yeah, yeah. When somebody come to me, yo, when somebody come to me, yo, and they be like, yo, I run a USA, Canada, I'm like, you clearly know more than me, customer's always right, so I'll forgive you, but if you want me to do it, how I do it, yo, how it turns things up, whatever, yo, you gonna let me mix that in, you know what I'm saying? It's a global village, man, it's a whole global village. And it depends on what you're trying to accomplish and where you wanna go, so it's like you'll see people talk about just doing one particular place or maybe just US, and they will have success, like some of them might have a success, but it's just like how big do you wanna be? But I'm saying, yo, it's also what you're trying to accomplish, too, though, right? If your whole thing, cause we have a situation where it's like, yo, okay, let's start in just the US for starting a certain region to get that artist so lit in that region, it's all about strategy, there's no one way to go inside this thing, that's why, like, yo, we don't have cookie cutter things, whatever, yo, as cookie cutters, this is the most cookie cutter our campaigns go, right, yo? When we start off, yo, we start for all this fuck, whatever, yo, and then after we run it for a while, then we wind all shit down, then we optimize, whatever, but there's no cookie cutter way to move this shit, whatever, it's about strategy, like, yo, do you wanna go from the response, or do you wanna go from the standpoint of starting from local and then blowing up, or do you wanna just, I think it's better, anyways, just start while this fuck, whatever, and then cut back down, whatever, you from me as opposed to the other way, whatever, but it's strategy when it comes to this thing, come in. Baw, what's up, it's Brandman Sean, and if you like this clip, you can listen to the full episode on Spotify, Apple, or wherever you stream your podcast, but if you wanna keep watching, we've placed a video that will be so useful for you, conveniently above, go ahead and click that link.