 Good evening and welcome back to the first time home by a show. I'm your host esti class and as you know We have absolutely amazing content coming to you live every night this week We have some and tongue walk umalo on your screens at 7 p.m With the private property podcast if you haven't seen that yet Please head on over to our Facebook page or YouTube and catch that Insightful information from Zama's show and of course in Bali with the farming and agriculture Podcasts every Tuesday and Thursday night at 8 p.m If you're ready to dip your fingers into farming and getting that land You need to watch Mbali at 8 p.m. Every Tuesday and Thursday last but not least is Chad Viveros with the home shopper show that's every Monday night and Friday at 8 p.m Chad travels around South Africa and views absolutely amazing properties Mansions apartments that are for sale if you're ready to buy and make that first investment This is a show you do not want to miss and without further ado I'm sitting with the absolutely amazing to ride jack Entrepreneurship author property mogul the list is endless. Good evening, TJ. How are you? Estia, how are you? I'm very well. Thanks and Welcome to everyone else who's watching us and greetings to your viewers. Thank you so much Like I said, you're no stranger. Yeah to the screens They've seen you on a few of our shows and I'm so happy that I finally get the opportunity to sit down Have the conversation with you and as our viewers can see you are an author Your property mogul property investor the list is endless. Tell us a little bit more about what you do well, I Like that so basically I in the property space I buy properties and out of that I rent them out So we've got a business that's called M5 property addicts, but I think the journey didn't start the ST Right now it might look like, you know, we're doing cool things We're in student accommodation Right now we had one of our buildings that we own we do affordable housing And we also do a bit of farming which is called aquaponics So I'm quite big around real estate real estate for me. It's a vehicle that I keep in terms of creating wealth for myself creating wealth for my family my partners that I that I work with and Creating legacy into the future, which is the generations that are yet to come Would you say real estate is a property like a vehicle for change? 100% 100% so I mean if you're to look at it from the beginning of times So there's a good book that I read very often and within that book we Land is always in and around everything that you do So number one you need land to to cultivate and put food on the table Number two, you need land for you to stay Number two three as it is now you now need the land to be operating and do business in so everything that we do really Around some form of land one or the other and if you actually don't have it you're missing out Right. Yeah, and I think Cuz I would jump straight into it and we spoke about but I want to I want to talk a little bit about what we spoke about before The show of camera and it was really about and I love this question. I usually end off with it. Yeah, but you spoke so proudly and so well and and and I love that you you punt this and that you emphasize on well-being and Well-being not only yourself, but it's mentally physically emotionally and I feel that M5 property addicts would not have been a thing if you weren't Sane in all aspects of your life So maybe with maybe we can you know educate the viewers and talk a little bit about what you do to Maintain and and keep pushing and keep what motivates you to keep on being resilient I've got a family. I'm married to a beautiful wife. We've got two kids my boy. He's 13 and my little one she's six Recently my big boy says to me he's tired of going to see African animals So he wants to see a different type of animals So I asked him what do you mean all animals are kind of like from Africa and he says no like like a white bear And I was like, yeah, but we've been to Johannesburg zoo. There is a white bear. He says no dad You don't understand. I'm talking about an alligator or something. I'm like, yeah, we do have clothes But here's the thing The real journey for me as did didn't really start off by just being pushing boundaries It started off by when I when I was born What would basically happen was that my my biological parents kind of like left me and With my biological parents being gone My political mother really dumped me and out of that I was looked after by foster parents and My foster parents, you know They were good parents. I didn't actually know that you know, these guys were my foster parents And out of that I started looking into my best certificate at one point and it really said father unknown So I'm like, okay, so you are Tarai Son of the unknown So where do you start from there when you are unknown because for some people They are coming through and starting off their journey and that journey already starts off with something that you're getting from someone else So the ability for you to scale from where you are is there The ability is there, but we don't we don't know it because it's every day for us But if you look at it from our parents They've got so much wealth that they have and that wealth can literally come in and it can help you to grow But we don't have that or we don't take it in So for me when we with my background like that one My parents literally say, you know, go to school get good grades and I was like, yeah, that's what I did And I started working in the corporate space. I was employed as a banker for most of my time and out of it, I I used to ask myself the question at that time. Let's just say I was any hundred thousand rent Pay it and I would ask the question How different am I from the guy who's any one million and That question kind of like said with me for a long time The one day STI was actually contracting and I was getting paid like 600 round an hour and then the invoice of my boss came in And she was getting paid one thousand four hundred Some like hold on. I'm doing all the work and she's getting paid double. What's the difference? So with those questions coming up all the time I wanted actually to now try to figure out what else can I do to improve me? Yeah, because that's where I realized I was the problem So I started reading and from reading I started exploring different things and Out of that, I started one business started doing well. I did another one. It felt dismally. I did another one It felt I did another one. It did great and And then I went into the chicken business and kind of like lost so much money around about five million and When you are married and you lose so much money The conversations at home are very different. Yeah It's a scary position You go through into frustration You go through even into denial that you know, this is not happening to me but then You start seeing other people that are winning and with that I started wanting to find out If I'm failing but how come they are winning and these are the same questions that I was asking myself when I was in the corporate place And out of that I started working with other people that were winning that really took me under their shoulders And these people are called mentors and coaches if you go online to see lots of lots of them But the one thing that I picked up from there ST was that for every area of your life where you think You are incapable of delivering the best Right, so it's not about hey, I saw TJ. He does five kilometers a day It's not about that. TJ is different You are your own different person now for me I started looking at guys that are doing well in business and I'm like I want to be like them So I reached out to the business guys in the business that I'm wanting to do And the one guy said, okay, great. You're going to pay me X amount of money. I will teach you I'll give you the secret sauce So I was like, okay, I'm out. I I'm in debt right now, but how can I do it and Because I had the drive I wanted that go and looked for the money ST The money came through and I started seeing little bit of successes But it's not just about business. Business is one aspect of life The other part of it was that what you asked which is from a mental perspective Because when you're down and out like that in five million, you actually don't want to talk to people You actually don't want to be on the phone Even though the banks will be going to call you every day, you don't want to talk to them You might even change numbers and things like that So you're going into your own cocoon because that's what the world Is all about, you know, when you have done something wrong, what do you do run away, right? But for me, I didn't run away. I actually put myself out there So when I started meeting people even in the business space out, I was very upfront I do not have money I But I can do a B.C.D. So I had something that I was putting on the table that I could do so mentally I think it's changed for me when I started seeing one or two opportunities coming up and The value that I was putting onto the table There's someone else coming in with money and that became a business Yeah, the mushroom gave me a little bit of imp. I'm like I can do this and that was coming from one project but then There's different aspects as you see of life you you can't be playing the rule games of Soca and applying them into rugby. Yeah, it's different Set of rules. So for me when I started not doing business. I was an employee So my rules of engagement was based what? On being an employee, right, but now you're doing business The rules are different. So what do I need to do to go and learn the rules of engagement in business? But with that it also comes in with a different aspect because in business when people are approaching you for whatever They have a motive So how do you play in the boardroom within those motives for it to work for you? How do you play within the contracts when they are saying so there's lots of aspects now that comes in That you now need to learn and all of that I then realized I don't know Coming back again to say how do you then? Stay ahead. Yeah. Well, if you know that you don't know now you can stay ahead, right? How do you do it? The basic part of it find someone else who's doing it and then you ask them How can I also do it like that if it is a mentor coach, whatever it is then you pay for those fees so I Exercise I didn't start off in life by exercising. I don't do bodybuilding to you know Yeah, I can't even lift up like a 10k something But I do exercise that fits Taorai, yeah Right. And so I wake up in the morning. I go for my run. It might be a two kilometer run But that's works for me because last year I wasn't even doing a two kilometers So not because I'm doing two kilometers next year. I can think of five kilometers because that's a different me And also the the thing about your mind is We all come from different neighborhoods We all come with difficult. I like to call them ho ho's Our heads are just designed in a particular way. Why is it designed in a particular way? It's about where we come from. It's about how we were raised. It's about what we were exposed to So your mind can only relate and think about What you have been exposed to so if you have never been to see or heard about the wall of China Your mind is blank to that So if you have never been exposed to the fact that you can write a book and you've never seen anyone else writing a book Your mind is is blank. So I'll give you an example Just before I started off my property journey the right way I had gone through to a conference And for the first time in my life, I met someone else who was presenting in front And that guy was a black guy and he was talking about buying units in a in a block of flats And because he was a black person, I'd never seen this before esteem Right. I had always just seen white people doing it. Yeah. So in my mind, it was a white people thing Right, and was I wrong? No, it was just my exposure. Exactly, right So I had also never thought about and and here's the thing. I was actually staying in a complex Right, and I had stayed in complexes throughout my life But I never actually thought I could buy in a complex I could own this entire complex Because I'd never seen it So in my mind, it was so far away But now here is I'm in a conference. I'm seeing this guy and I'm like How different is that guy from me? Exactly. He's like me. He talks like me. Yeah, so I can do it. Exactly. So I find Relatability but Within that I challenge myself So you gotta challenge yourself from time and again I challenge myself and I said to myself if he's buying units in a block of flats Why can't I buy the block? Exactly Right, right And it was a seed that came into my head And I started thinking hard around it So I started looking for people that buy blocks of flats I had a Jewish friend and I asked him how does this work and he told me how it works And I was like, oh, okay So let me go and find the areas where you can buy a block of flats and boom We've bought quite a few in the journeys that I've journeyed on within the last five years or so But it all comes back to number one Whatever you're hungry for Whatever you are putting Whatever you're putting Stuff in your head. Yeah, it can manifest And I really say this from a very From a very safe place It can manifest if you want it to manifest It's about you exactly, right? So Being out there so a lot of people they go out I'm sure you've been exposed to this ST growing up You go mates and you start going out So you become a click of going out, right? Right, right? So from time and again, you're going out So you're a click of going out. Yeah, that's what you do. That's what your click does How about changing the same click? Right, but this time around you're changing it for a business click, right? So you remember when you went to table mountain and it was unseen or unheard of you did it You remember when you guys went to the pub and you drank all night? You did it. You push boundaries, isn't it? Same thing in business You just need to find your click. Yeah, and you start running with that click And within that click you start doing radical things, right? But we only do it in the social space Right, we don't do it to improve ourselves. Yeah, so I have people ST that I met at a robot geosyche conference like 15 years ago I mean like five years ago And I have people that I met at Tony Robertson, right this and that And and I can see their growth And guess what? We started now having coffees. It's now your click and now yeah, that's that Then they start telling me about Other things that are happening that I didn't know about So if you take it into the social scene, it's like someone introducing Savannah to you for the first time They start telling you Black label actually tastes better. You taste it, right? And it's the same thing And I think it's so profound because you you talk a lot about what you feed your mind Can then manifest right and to the viewers I'd like to ask you Take a look at your life right now and ask yourself what are you currently feeding yourself? And I think what's so important is to read read read and Let's take a look at our clicks. Do we need to I don't think it's about changing your click No, I think it's about having a lot of different clicks where you can Find where you see growth, right? And I think it's so important because you spoke so much about The people you surround yourself with is Can help you achieve these goals and they teaching you different things on a daily basis, right? They know things you you had no idea we teaching them different things that they didn't know about Because we're playing in different fields and we can all teach each other something and there was something you said about When you did property, right? Yeah And in your book, um, you I think you talk a little bit about the hardships and the lessons That came just before so I like that you said when I did it, right? So let's go back to you spoke about businesses that failed dismally and How they were obviously there's obviously ups and downs in everything we do What was the maybe let's let's narrow it down the one time where something failed dismally And you were like no, I need to fix this Well, um, I think failing is part of the process Um, if you are afraid of failing Then you don't want to grow Right, um, it's like We we have all seen kids. I've got two They they come up they sprout They start crawling and out of crawling they they start walking Yeah, but how many times do they actually fall before they start walking? Many a time. Yeah, but we never say no no no no stop Right, we encourage them to do that so that they can grow and learn how to walk exactly But in business or in things that we are trying to do When we fail then we pull back And I think that's the wrong stance in life We only learn by failing And then fortunately, I think our educational systems help us To identify failure is something that is wrong bad. Yeah, it's not wrong. Yeah, so I I am extremely Extremely grateful for all my failures Because I am able to identify them And in hindsight, I'm able to stop and I'm like, what did I learn from that? And I've implemented that so one of my biggest failure is Estee when I lost the five million. Yeah It was a business that I was running on my own And I almost want to say at this point here Never if you're to go into business Never do it alone Because there are so many things that you don't know. Yeah, there's accounting Potentially you don't even know accounting There is the actual business. There is the technical of running the business So even though if you are maybe an engineer You can't go and build a block of flats on your own. You can't yeah There's a team of people that is needed around that And I then that's that's the one thing that I learned in my business or potentially It is one of the things that why I felt right and why I lost that five million And it's because I was not in a team and within that team People would be able to sell me or from a financial perspective If we continue like this, we're gonna lose money I didn't have that. I was only looking at my own figures. I'm like, okay. I'm doing good I can pull it this way. I can pull it that way But if it is someone else, they've got a different lens, right? They are looking at from outside the inside And they can tell you the hard truth whether you want to hear it or not, right? And there's an aspect of legal. There's a legal aspect to it. Not everybody is a lawyer I was just signing contracts left right center. Yeah, they come through say signing a mr. Jack signing and I signed But what did he mean? What is the implication around right? And all of this if I look at myself with where I am now in business ST for all of those things that I've spoken about and more I have a business partner Someone who understands that who runs with that and they tell me now that try This contract here if we sign it If this happens, we're gonna lose everything. Yeah, or if we signed this, this is what's going to happen And now I start to understand all of those things. So I suppose, you know, we The failures that we've got right can either propel us into the next step of where we want to go to or you can stay in that space of failing and How that you're growing or you're dying You decide because I mean after you lost that five million you could have stayed in that space. Oh, yeah Yeah, but you continue to you know, and like I think it's so important because on one of our episodes We talk about having a power team. Yeah, and we never I mean I've never heard a lot of Guests who talk about how they achieve this by themselves There's always people helping you guiding you And that could be anyone it could be family members. It's about having that support We always emphasize a support structure and having and you were talking about when you did lose the five million It didn't only affect you. Yeah There are people around you that it also affected. Yeah, I mean It affected my household. Yeah You know the conversations with my wife was different The conversations with my kids alone was different Um, I couldn't afford basic stuff. You know, my kids wants to go out for an ice cream. I couldn't yeah, right? So it affected them as well obviously, I Affected my in-laws my own parents and things like that Because now things that I could do for them. I can't do it So they say that you know from an African context if you had to give one many a job You're impacting around about 10 people. Yeah, so if there is a loss of five million, what is the ripple effect? Exactly. So the ripple effect is always greater But sometimes we don't touch it. We don't see it. So From that perspective because it's it's not something that you can touch it. It's not like in your face. Yeah, right Um, but the reality to offer to see at the end of the day losing a big chunk of that money is a lot But it wasn't my first time losing money. Yeah, um, I don't want to say that I've grown a thicker skin, but you know Shortly before I got married actually I lost a hundred thousand and That was almost 10 years ago now And basically a friend of mine stole that money from me. Yeah, you know, we're setting up a small business about computing And he said that he's going to china To buy computer parts and things like that and he went and never came back You know, so that was my real first time of losing money. So the five million was something else But then someone else could ask So tj when you lost a hundred thousand. Yeah, why didn't you stop? You can't stop. Yeah If if I did stop then this conversation wouldn't be happening, right? Um, but again from a culture perspective asd I was just about to get married at the time when I lost that a hundred thousand And and my family was I'd introduced my wife my wife. She's mixed Um And people were saying, you know, maybe the gods are not happy The ancestors are not happy that you're going that route. Yeah, uh, but here I am 10 years later on me I'm so married happily married having borrowed my life And the ancestors I'm not so sure but we continue We continue we move um, and I was I liked that you you brought it back to It's the first time you lost five million. It wasn't the first time you lost money Oh, no, and just the other day I was actually talking about how loss is so broad and I don't think that once you experience loss once you'll know how to Deal with it again Because your loss was different the one was a hundred thousand the one was five million So, of course, yes, it's a loss in general But it's a different type of loss and you're probably going to deal with it a different way hundred percent, um esti, I think Our conversations together with the viewers I'm a very transparent Authentic person. I want to give you the real truth. Yeah, and I want to give you The real stuff so that you can make a decision about your life or where you want to go to So I'll tell you what it is, right? um When it comes to losing Everyone who is married knows that they've either been Um either put on the bench by someone else Until by the time they got married For some people it's a one boyfriend or one girlfriend for some it's 55. Right But we didn't stop. Yeah, because it's love Right, okay Now what does that mean and why am I bringing that conversation in? In business or in anything that you're going to do You have to strike a balance, right? What is that balance? You are going to lose you are going to get hurt however If you are losing you just need to make sure that you are winning more than what you are losing, right? So when we are saying that hey, we're doing well in our business our business have done a bcd It doesn't mean that we didn't lose. You lose here. It just means that over and above this loss here We won x. Yeah And for that reason We are winning and for that reason when we lost What did we do? What did we learn to improve so that we don't lose? Yeah So at the moment I now factually understand if I am to Go into any business Right At the moment st I run the the company m5 property. I did It's a company that I co-founded with my business partner Reita But I don't own that company. Right Right, so I've I've got a trust and my trust is with my family They own that I work for them So in terms of risk mitigation if something ever goes wrong if I lose five million It's not on me as as as a person. Yeah It is my family But that is also giving me a little bit of yeah I'm like I should never get to a point where I can lose because this is for my family exactly and this is why I do what I do. That's the motivation because I don't want them to fail It's that ripple effect. We don't want it to ever get there And you talk a lot about family and This brings me to another question that I like asking my guest is about generational wealth. Yeah And in your situation just talking about your upbringing You're starting the legacy. You're the start of the generational wealth. Yeah What is tj doing To ensure That there is going to be a legacy left behind Oh dude, there's quite a lot We have time Oh lord, um, where do I start from? Um, so There's a great book that I like to read very often and within this book it says that If you had to leave a legacy your legacy should surpass The third generation from you, right? So where's the third generation? So I'm number one My my kids are number two Their kids is number three So what am I doing to ensure that the legacy surpassed them not touch them surpass right, so number one I Now that I'm in business I have structured things And when I say structure, I just didn't go out and buy a house. Yeah, right I've also ensured that when I'm buying my house Where is it sitting? Who owns that house? So esti? I don't own anything right My trust owns everything So the house stays within the trust So if ever I die Saz is never going to touch anything in my estate because it's in the trust So the trust is going to live for a longer time on the terms that I've put in Not on the terms that my kids have put in or they are kids But on my terms. Yeah, so I am crafting the generation. It's intentional. Yeah, that's number one Number two, I've got a business within this business I don't own anything. I control everything control his power And with that Everything again sits within my trust And whatever that is happening within the business When I die It's going to continue within the same path of that generation So when I started doing property the correct way, I then started doing I started researching What can I do? Which is that's intentional that can help me to get to my goal. What's my goal legacy? But how do you do it? What is the practical? How do you move from one step to the next and the next step? And you know when I talk about all these trustings whatnot A lot of people then want to go out there create the structures Ha ha ha five years. They've got the structures. Nothing has happened. I'm the reverse I actually started having structures not so long ago. Yeah So I'm a doer. So I'm like, let's do it So I started buying buying buying and then somewhere along the line my legal team was like You've got a problem. Yeah, you're talking about creating legacy But the way you're doing business it doesn't do you won't get there. Yeah What's going to happen is that if you die So as it's going to come in there's an estate. They're going to take x percentage. Is that what you want? I'm like, hell no But how can we do it? They educated me on how to do it And then I started implementing it whilst I'm in the game so we speak about people going back into go through for conferences go go read books and attend Whatever podcasts and you know get information to grow you I'm an auntie that Right. I preach it But I'm an auntie that as well. I might be saying tj, but you contradict yourself. Yeah Lim take action Okay Right, because if you're just learning you just in information junkie. That's what you are Now being information junkie. What are you gonna do at the bri? You are the guys who are like, you know You can do property like this. Okay. How many do you have nothing nothing? Yeah But you have all the information in the world, but you haven't applied any of that I've experienced it and I'm also all for real loved experiences How can you talk about something if you haven't experienced it yourself? 100% So from creating my legacy esteem, it's about putting the structures in place. It's about leaving them now whilst I'm still alive And over and above that Um Within our business that's called the m5 property Addicts we have actually created a school right which is called the m5 property varsity And within there I take time every quarter Whatever I've learned we put it in there as a course And anyone who's out there they will come in and they'll learn My view is that that won't die Maybe the processes might change But the foundation the principles of how you can buy a property the correct way and things like that that won't die So anyone else out there who's wanting to do it the correct way or the tj way They can go and learn and my view is that it's creating a greater legacy I've got a community and within that community people come in and we plug in And besides just creating a camaraderie We're always talking about property And the the other thing that I've done after it's in a book Yeah, there was actually one of my questions. Sorry to cut you off tj is about how are you giving back to the youth? And you just you just answered my question is that you keep you need to keep recycling knowledge Good evening guys. I am back as you know I am a stay class and the show is packed with so much information that we've decided to give you a part two So stay tuned next week again with to ride jack That is part two of to ride jack's journey into property investment into business into his life Everything there is to know but ladies and gentlemen, that is not all I have for you this evening I've got a special surprise for you Hello, everybody. My name is chatter. I'm yeah from the home shopper show So you've heard about what simon says. Well, this is all about what estay says So if you need a tuning to her show, you definitely must do that But also while you're there while you're watching a show make sure you tune into the home shopper show Which is every monday and friday at 8 p.m. So we're gonna see you there. Thank you so much and goodbye. Take care