 on this episode of Skeptico. How our power and control issues keep us from finding the damn truth. Here's a famous movie clip with today's guest in it. But someday, somewhere, someone may find out the damn truth. We better, we better, we might just as well build ourselves another government. Patriot must always be ready to defend his country. Stop right there. We're watching the famous movie JFK and there is Sean Stone. He's just a kid, of course. He's sitting in the courtroom. He doesn't say much, but he's in the film. Sean has been in and around this conspiracy stuff. JFK, probably one of the most famous conspiratorial movies of all time. Well, Sean's been around that all his life. And he has a new documentary series that chronicles some of the interviews that he's done over the years around the parapolitical conspiratorial world that we live in if you scratch right beneath the surface. And we're gonna certainly talk about that. We're gonna talk about his book. But I think where Sean Stone really shines is when you talk about some of the deeper stuff, the deep spirituality stuff. It's about the power and control issues that we all have. And that's what you said, Sean. This is rehashing what you said. Hey, I got power and control issues. I look at my family. I look at my wife. I have power and control issues. I look at my children. I got power and control issues. I want them to be a certain way. Is it really so hard for us to understand how that extends to people who have just enormous power? I mean, like Bill Gates is a tragic figure. He'd be in some Shakespearean play, look into his eyes. I mean, it just, that's not a good soul there. It's like I had this conversation recently, by the way, about Gates with this guy that said, oh, I like Gates. He does business with him or whatnot. And I say, okay, what's he about? Why is he trying to control your body? Oh, he's not trying to control your body. He's trying to help the planet. He's done more for the planet than anybody. So sticking a needle in everybody is really gonna help. Is he actually looking to raise the center of living in Africa? Even that response is switching over again into the material world, right? Because when you switch into the spiritual realm, why would I think that it is my job to do anything other than to bring this light forward? Hey, I'm supposed to fill the hole with light. So in that sense, I don't worry about Gates. He's a pathetic kind of doesn't look like he's, it looks like his hole is not filled with light to me kind of thing. No, no, he's not filled with light. And there are very few that are. And this is the nature of our reality that we have right now. But I think that the revolution and the transformation comes from the masses. It comes from the millions of people waking up and taking their power back. So this is a good one. There's a couple of really interesting little tidbits in there in true skeptical fashion. There's a little bit of pushback on a couple of points, but all in all, it was really cool to connect with a guy I think is underappreciated in terms of what he's contributed to this important, important body of knowledge that often gets overlooked if you just look at it from a kind of Hollywood perspective, which unfortunately is the way that people normally look at Shawn Stone. So this is a good one. Hope you enjoy it. Stick around for my interview with Shawn Stone. Welcome to Skeptico, where we explore controversial science and spirituality with leading researchers, thinkers, and their critics. I'm your host, Alex Cares. And today we welcome Shawn Stone to Skeptico. Now, it's kind of tough to do a bio on Shawn Stone, because no matter what angle you take, you're gonna leave out all these other angles and people are gonna wonder why you did that. So let me read from Shawnstone.info.com, if you will. I don't usually read bios, but this is kind of succinct and multifaceted in the way that I'd like to be about it. Shawn Stone is a filmmaker, media host, author, actor, poet, speaker, and above all, truth seeker. And then he had to throw in spiritual activist in there at the end, which I love. As I said in the intro to this show, that's what we're all about. He has a documentary series, Best Kept Secret. It's fantastic. I've watched it on Vimeo. You can watch it download the whole thing for five bucks on Vimeo. It's terrific. He also has a book out that I wasn't aware of. It's been out for a few years now, but it's really excellent. It's titled New World Order, A Strategy of Imperialism. It's terrific, interesting origin story on that as well. The guy's at Princeton. I mean, he started at Oxford, graduated from Princeton. This is like his thesis at Princeton, and it's this amazing book. Richard Grove writes like a hundred page forward to it or something like that, and that's all terrific. So we'll talk about that too. A number of different things we can talk about, but it's just terrific having you here, Shawn. Thanks so much for joining me on the show. Hey, thanks for having me on. So I guess, you know, the natural place to start might be with this series, Best Kept Secret, and I kind of hinted that I wanted to talk about the origin story, and I think that's a big part of it. So let's jump in there and talk about what that show is about, what that series, six-part series is about. Sure, sure. The series is, like the name says, what is the best kept secret? And to me, the secret has always been humans are enslaved. That's, there's physical enslavement, which we know still exists. In fact, there's arguably more slaves in the world than ever before in history with human trafficking and, you know, upward of 25 million that are human trafficked, being trafficked, you know, into various jobs, including prostitution, and that includes children. So there's debt slavery, which a lot of us have come to understand is the nature of the system of sort of Federal Reserve issuing of currencies that they control, you know, they control the flow of the currency, then it's always issued against the governments, basically putting governments into debt that they can never get out of, because once you lend the government money after the Federal Reserve, there's always interest owed from the very first dollar that's loaned out. And then you've got spiritual enslavement, which we move towards later in the series. This notion of basically various forms of hypnosis that go on, mental mind control, you know, the ancient issue of archons, things talked about in the Bible, those, you know, those powers and principalities you can call them demons, Satan, you know, forces like this that have people basically beholden at different levels of mind and spirit to these forces. So I think that's really what the story was about, was evolving this understanding of how humans are controlled at different levels from political to spiritual, psychological, and then moving into the transhuman dimension, which is where the elites have been focused for some time since the days of, not just since the days of the Nazis, I try older than that, but this eugenics war basically first, it was the issue of genetics trying to get hold of breeding. This is not a Nazi idea. It came out of the Anglo-American Empire, actually. The Brits and Americans were hosting the first eugenics conferences. So this whole thing about breeding and the idea then evolved into understanding the genome to try to then splice the genome, cut, play Dr. Frankenstein in terms of editing the human genome. And then beyond that, this interest in the human being as sort of a biocomputer, that's something that can be hacked, that can be mutated, turned into a genetically modified organism, let's say, which we've done obviously with our crops and obviously and also our various pesticides and things like this that are put into our food supply and our water supply. So yeah, this is what the series is sort of about. In preparing for this, I was looking through so much of your old stuff and some of your new stuff. You're still putting out some great interviews on your Patreon channel and on other places, but I was particularly drawn back to the Buzzsaw interviews that you did because I really remember back in the day, seeing those, let me pull them up here. And before I go too far down this path, is this still an okay? Yeah, that's a Buzzsaw. Buzzsaw still is intact. My personal YouTube channel, Johnstone was taken down by YouTube censored, but this channel entered the Buzzsaw is still there. So what's interesting about this enter the Buzzsaw thing, it's just mind blowing. But what I kept coming back to you in preparing for this interview is what you must gonna be going through, what must be going through your head in this conspiracy culture, out in the open kind of world that we live in, pandemic where we're kind of, like the conspiracy behind the pandemic is like being debated in Congress. It's like front page news. It's like everything. And you're doing these interviews like the one that I always remember is with Douglas Dietrich. And it was just one, it was about the Presidio thing. And he also interviewed Michael Aquino, you know, unbelievable, all the Satanism stuff. And it was mind blowing to me. It was paradigm shifting. It was all the things that I now see in other people where their paradigm is completely stripped away and they really are left scrambling with what to do. Do I take that in? It seemed real. And then they check it out and it is real. And then they're like, oh my God, what does this mean for everything I know? And I'm just thinking, what is it like for you to say, yeah, I did that six years ago? Yeah, I mean, I've been much been aware of this stuff since I was a little kid. I mean, it's just, it's, to me, it's always, it's always confounding how humans like suffer so much, the cognitive dissonance and just sort of, for me, even more than cognitive dissonance like the lack of curiosity. I was just bored by mundane conversations. People sit around and talk about, I don't know, your sister is doing this. So-and-so bought a new car. So-and-so hasn't repaired their house in a long time. It's starting to fall apart. Just a conversation that was just so mundane or gossip. And I was always interested by things that were bigger, like, okay, you know, you look in an event like Kennedy's assassination, which obviously my dad made the film JFK when I was about six years old and I was in that film. And it's like, that's like an epic story to start to investigate unravel, even if you don't get to the bottom of who did it. All right, even if you start to just figure out, okay, what the story that was told to us was a cover story. It was not real. There is no way that this guy goes to Russia, defects, gives up his passport, marries a Russian woman who's the daughter of a Russian Soviet general all the time, comes back to America, just gets his passport back, brings his Soviet bride, isn't being watched by the CIA, isn't being monitored at any level, goes and actively supports both communists, Castro, and then he goes to tries to go against Castro. And he's like, basically, he's working next, and he's working in the same building as Guy Bannas or the former FBI, one of the heads of the FBI. I mean, it's just like, yeah, and then this guy just picks up, he orders a gun, mail order gun, he could have gone into a store and bought one, he orders it to this shipping, to this PO box, so you can go and get it. And then he goes and he's like, and then he takes a shot at a general and then he goes, of course, and kills Kennedy with three amazing shots, the first of which is the easiest to pull off, but misses completely the car. I mean, it's just like, I'm just sitting here going, what does it take for people to wake up? You kind of answered that in an interview, I just saw that you just published recently and you said, you know what? People wanna feel protected. They wanna feel protected and they wanna feel like someone is in control. So even if they have to do this crazy dance around this obvious information, ultimately they're trying to get their meds and that of like, tell me it's all gonna be okay, daddy. Tell me the bad people aren't gonna come from me, daddy. I mean, right, that's what I heard you say. That's right, that's right. That's exactly, it's a child in us that's scared of stepping into our adult, you know, king and queen ship, let's say, right? And stepping into that level of responsibility. And so what I was getting at with the Kennedy thing, it's like, is this consciousness, basically like this collective consciousness, experiencing deception and manipulation to basically as barometers of saying, okay, are you ready yet? Are you ready to actually see the truth? Are you ready to really face it, to face the shadow, to actually realize that the shadow is empty and it's just whatever fear you wanna project into it, including your own face, until you ultimately come to this realization that there is only oneness and everything that's cast is just, and you say, every shadow that's cast is just a blockage of the light, basically, of the light of, let's say the light of truth and everything that, every shadow that's cast is just a blockage in this journey of ultimately discovering that there is nothing but ourselves and that is the I am, the collective I am. Totally into that. And I think the non-dual approach totally has to fit in here in a really fundamental way. At the same time, and I think this is what your work is about in a way, is that's not exactly where we live on a day-to-day basis. And the nesting dolls do have to be taken apart one by one. It's like when people wanna reduce all this horrible evil that's being perpetrated on the population as shadow work and it's like, we all have our shadow and it's like, well, that may be true but isn't part of our spiritual journey to not let that shadow play out in terms of trafficking little kids and performing satanic rituals with three-year-olds. It's a complex question because it's a transmutation process fundamentally whereby first you have to be willing to look at something and consciousness is finally getting to that place of actually starting to look at things and actually acknowledge things. That's what they called the Great Awakening in 2020. It was like, all of a sudden people were talking about human trafficking and it wasn't, how do you say? It wasn't just hush it up because that's really what I would hear a lot. It's like I would go to places or interview people or talk to people and it's always that sort of like, well, we just don't talk about it. It's just not polite. It's just, you don't, you speak of it. You don't wanna speak of the devil because it's bad juju, it's bad energy. And I understand that perspective. But you can't, it's also what they call in the spiritual world is spiritual bypassing, right? It's like just good vibes. Let's just be on the positive. Well, the ultimate positive is to transmute that which is lower density, lower frequency to work through it and to bring that energy into a higher space of love. And I've experienced that first hand because I've actually gone into very dense places where Satan has worshiped like in abandoned mental hospitals where people either died, we're possessed, we're plagued, we're tortured, we're humiliated, we're hurt, right? Violated and the energy is so low. It's like, it's a complete albatross and you gotta basically walk through that and either you go to that level and you go crazy. And this is my first movie, Grey Stone was about this. You either start to, you start to crack up and it don't know what's real anymore because it scatters you. That energy is very low frequency and it scatters you and it brings up madness in you, right? It gets reflected with madness, paranoia, things like this hysteria. Or, but the ultimate journey through that is either you go mad, you become curts, apocalypse now or you have to overcome that low frequency and ideally transmute it and having walked those places and actually gone to that end of actually transmuting into a state of pure love and like holding a holy, a holy, whole frequency, a whole different frequency that was holy and actually seeing those places actually destroyed as a result, like after that, literally taken down. You realize this can be done and this is what we're here to do. We are literally here to transmute, to take that whole, that frequency and transform it with a state of seeing it, engaging it, loving, putting love for, especially for the victims and for those that have been harmed and raising the vibration. To totally get that, I would suggest that there's multiple ways to transmute, you know? And truth seeking, truth telling, which is a big part of what you're all about is a way of doing that. Waking people up or making it possible for people to wake up in a certain way is a way of transmuting. You know, we both had a chance to interview Annika Lucas, who I think is quite an amazing person. Just remind everyone, you know, sold into a satanic cult at six years old by her mother. So just full stop, process that. What does that mean? You know, is taken to these mansions where as a young child, that young is in this room where one after another of these rich, I hate the term elites, but these people that she later identifies as being very, very high level political people of various countries in Europe, come in and rape this girl. And what you mentioned to me, and you can tell me about your interview with her, is looking into their eyes and seeing the little child in there, seeing the little boy. And she says, she wasn't even like aware of it, like on a conscious level, but she was aware of it. She was aware of, I think this is what you're getting at, you know, their pain, their connection. But she still is a truth teller of the horror that went on. And then she goes on and is now doing yoga therapy for women who are imprisoned in New York, which is her way of kind of bringing that light about. So talk for a minute about the balancing between, you know, the hard process of truth telling. A lot of people don't want to hear on a story, don't want to hear about the duetro thing. You know, they killed how many people over that duetro case. They like murdered anyone who was even close to it. And then, you know, getting on with life is best you can in doing it. I mean, there's a lot there to unpack, but tell me what your thoughts are. Yeah, that's one of the darkest episodes is, I didn't interview Anika Lucas. I used her interviews with Sean Atwood and also her TED Talk interviews as, within the docu series, The Best Kept Secret. So to help illuminate that story and how, again, to give people an understanding of how dark this world is, the duetro case probably connects to her story. You know, it would be a similar network that would connect to duetro because he basically was the fall guy for these very high level pedophiles that were, you know, and also murdering, you know, raping and murdering kids as well. So, you know, they needed someone to take a fall for it and duetro was the guy. So as far as what you're saying is looking at these things and storytelling, this is why I've always been interested by storytelling as a spiritual, it's always called like a psychospiritual warfare, right? If you really want to transform, you have to be transformed. If you want to transform these things, you have to be transformed. You have to go, you have to start, you can't start a story at the same place that you ended, right? That's what I love about storytelling. It's like you begin a story with a certain understanding and you have to go through the process and you have to deepen and you have to realize like, exactly, there is this, you know, this dance of shadow and light and there's an ability to deepen and hold empathy, you know, and this is why the greatest stories, you can understand at least the villain, right? You can at least under, maybe at least get a sense, even a sociopath, you can perhaps understand where they're coming from, what their intentions are, what their goals are, what's blocking them. Ultimately, what we get in terms of, you know, Satanism, it's like people oftentimes just, Satanism becomes a block in their mind. It's like either, oh, that's laughable, it's silly, or it's, you know, oh, you know, these people are, you know, whatever vision you have or illustration you have. But I try to say, look, materialism is static. If you worship the material realm, if you are stuck in ego, if your only ambition is acquisition, right, and gain, right? And ultimately, it's like they're up tilling brain at the root that for so long has been stuck in this pattern of fear, acquisition. I'm afraid I need to gobble something up. I need to strike first, you know, right, Cobra Kai. Strike first, strike hard, no mercy. The reptilian brain that is just looking to basically satiate itself and protect itself and can't have this deeper faith in what? What? The spirit thing has brought this into existence that carries us through this, the darkest of times as well as the best of times, that trusting in that spirit, right? This is the fundamental battle and it doesn't matter what religion you wanna be called or what, you know, what your faith is, it's just, do you have it or not? And this is always what's interested me. This is why I've oftentimes pushed against, you know, religious doctrines and dogmas because I realize people are oftentimes just as brainwashed within their religion as, you know, people are now brainwashed by the science. It's like, this is the way, this is the only way. And it's like, no, it's not the only way. The way is faith. Do you actually have faith? Are you actually here with faith and trust in this higher power that's guiding this process and are you willing to go through this journey and experience it and actually feel it and actually see and look in the face of those things that are evil and dark? And can you actually find forgiveness? Because that is the Christed spirit. Can you actually hold even the most evil beings? And actually, but if we could all just look at them and this is what's so interesting, if we could all just look at the Klaus Schwab of the world and put, everyone put their attention and their eyeballs on the Klaus Schwab and actually said, look it, what's going on with you? We wanna actually have a session. This would be a shamanic experience. This is actually how you start to solve real world problems. You have to get back to shamanic tribal conceptions of holding space simultaneously, putting pressure, even just energetically on people, saying we're looking at you now or Bill Gates or whoever, you know? What is going on with you? What's going on in your reality? What are you trying to achieve? What's your emotional state like? Starting to actually get this guy to open up and realize, man, you're traumatized, you're trying to control others because you're in trauma yourself. Let's have a giant session here, group session of global importance on these so-called elites, self-proclaimed elites who wanna say they have power over others and say, okay, first of all, can you actually, first of all, have a session where the planet is looking at you and you're gonna open up about who you are and what your fears are and what your goals are. You can't be a leader from the shadows. You can't be a leader from, you know, who's trying to manipulate others and tell us what to do. Who are you? Who are you? Who is this person that we put in power? Who is Justin Trudeau? Who is Biden? No one knows, this is the problem with our planet. We are giving away power to people. We don't even know who they are. And you start to get stories coming out and you start to realize, man, these people have probably done some pretty horrendous things. But we are surrendering power to people. We don't even know who they are. Would you let, in your own home, would you let your, if you had a father, you didn't even know what, you know, you didn't know your father. Would you let him run your home? No. Why do we give our power to people to run our lives and even know the first thing about them? This is our insanity. This is our collective insanity. I'm with you on so many of those points, but there's so many different angles to look at it and so many different jumping off points. You know, one of the things also I just heard in this interview recently and it really was excellent. And it was kind of a quirky interview, but it's about the power and control issues that we all have. And that's what you said, Sean. I'm just, this is rehashing what you said. And you brought it down to just a really personal level that we can all relate to is like, hey, I got power and control issues. I look at my family. I look at my wife. I have power and control issues. I look at my children. I got power and control issues. I want them to be a certain way. Is it really so hard for us to understand how that extends to people who have, just enormous, enormous power and how our culture is telling them they're supposed to enact that power? I mean, like Bill Gates is a tragic figure. I mean, you just look at him and he's just a tragic figure. He'd be in some Shakespearean play. Look into his eyes. I mean, it just, that's not a good soul there, but what has his life been, which is kind of what you're alluding to, but also from a power standpoint, he had more money than he could ever spend when he was 23 years old and he was a self-made man too, he could say, even though he came from a nice family. He'd be any more, obviously, but it's like every step of the way he makes more. And the question, you know, it's like I had this conversation recently, by the way about Gates, with this guy that said, oh, I like Gates. You know, he does business with him or whatnot. And I say, okay, what's he about? Why is he trying to control your body? Oh, he's not trying to control everybody. He's trying to help the planet. You know, he's done more for the planet than anybody. So, uh-huh. So sticking a needle in everybody is really gonna help. Is that really what's gonna help people who are dealing with, you name it, irrigation issues, farm, you know, standards of living, the lack of energy and clean, you know, not just clean water, but lack of energy to actually power a normal, a modern, let's say a modern middle-class standard of living. Is he actually looking to raise the standard of living in Africa? It's like, what are they talking about? You can just- But Sean, even that response is switching over again into the material world, right? Cause when you switch into the spiritual realm, like you talk about so many times, you're like, why would I think that it is, that is somehow my job to do anything other than to bring this light forward? You know, like it doesn't take much to get to an understanding of spirituality. Like, hey, I'm supposed to fill the hole with light, wherever I find the hole, I'm supposed to fill it with light. And I'm gonna run across a lot of these people who, they got the hole and the only way they found to fill it is with darkness, that's tragic, that's too bad, I can try and help you, but I'm trying to help everybody, cause I'm just about the light kind of thing. So in that sense, I don't worry about Gates, you know, and what his, it's just that he's a pathetic kind of doesn't look like he's, it looks like his hole is not filled with light to me kind of thing. No, no, it's not filled with light. And there are very few that are. Well, this is the nature of our reality that we have right now. It's that we, how do you say? Most people are just in it for themselves. Doesn't matter, left, right, center. I mean, you really look at the quality of leadership. It's not the people that, there are a few people that are out there that are actually holding an anchor of faith. Hey, I'm here with a faith and a higher power. This is not about me. This is about what I'm here to serve, right? It's very few like that, but I think that the revolution and the transformation comes from the masses. It comes from the millions of people waking up and taking their power back. I think that's really, we don't, so in a sense, we become the leaders. Those of us that survive this transition phase become the leaders. And it's more of a collective leadership because it's reciprocity based. So it's no longer about power. I always said in the old, since I was young, I said, Machiavelli's wrong. It's not fear. Power is not in fear. Power's in love because the moment, if someone fears you, the moment you're weak, you end up like Harvey Weinstein, right? Everyone stabs you. The moment you're weak, they turn on you. They drop you. Caesar. When you're, well, Caesar, whether or not he was weak, that's a different, I think that was just, that was a mass conspiracy, but the point is that love is power because when you're weak, people comfort you. That's where power is. And that's why power is about love. It's about reciprocity. Because I know, listen, hey, if I've got all this wealth, like gates and people are sucking at my kneecaps and I can do whatever I want as long as that wealth is there, right? If the guy didn't have that wealth, who would be there? He'd be naked. So that's the true emperors with no clothes, you see. It's the people that are literally just naked except for their wealth. Oh, okay, so we're gonna pretend we like you. We don't like you naked. We only like you with all your royal robes and things. If they love the emperor, he'd be walking naked, they would love him anyway. And that's why the future is gonna be power based in connection. If you love someone, hey, today the money's here, tomorrow it's not here. But guess what? If you have friends and allies, there's always an opportunity to make money. Or make money, let's say, but make something. Make something to create money. Because money itself doesn't mean anything. It's what you're creating, right? You're growing something, you're building a company, you're employing people, you're engaging people. Like that's wealth, right? That brings wealth. Money itself doesn't mean anything. So a couple of things that have kind of driven, amplified my kind of spiritual quest is some science parts of it, near death experience science. I find very compelling reincarnation science. You know, the guys at University of Virginia, all that stuff, very compelling. I've heard you touch on the reincarnation thing. How are you processing that in your worldview right now? What does that mean to you? Which part? Reincarnation. Because if you think about it, it just throws everything. I mean, I think a lot of people haven't kind of fully internalized what that means. You know, they get it hung up on race issues. Well, you're just here now in this. Or they get hung up on privilege issues. I've heard you talk about privilege. It's like, hey man, I don't know why you were thrown in this situation. That this is a situation, it's not a privilege. It's just where you wound up. And the next time around, again, I'm a science guy. Science would suggest that you will experience multiple ones of these little actor things and they won't all look the same to you. What does that mean? And near death experience science suggests that you will be the judge of your deeds. You will feel like, gosh, I could have done more you know, kind of thing. Or I should, you get where I'm going. I'm very interested by the idea that consciousness is actually growing and expanding. I'm really interested by the idea that there there are limitations of consciousness that people have experienced. And we are approaching a different, how do you say? We know, for example, like, you know this, the brain inhibits our experience. That's why when people take certain psychedelic drugs it actually starts to shut, I say shut the brain down, but actually like it basically- Inhibits the filters, yeah. Exactly, inhibits the filters, it turns off those blocks. And all of a sudden we start to realize, oh my God, I'm connected to everything. So our consciousness is limited. There's no way you can tell me that our consciousness is not limited. But the question of how limited it is is a very interesting thing. I actually wonder that human history is the design of the expansion of consciousness. And as the consciousness expands through human history you actually get these manifestations of it in the physical form, like, you know, the ability now to have instant communication with people across the planet, right? These are all expressions, these are physical expressions of the spiritual nature of consciousness expanding. So our consciousness, how do you say? Whatever I am is that sliver of consciousness that comes through this form. And yes, it is connected to a soul. The soul is not necessarily connected to a race. But there are greater, I think, racial implications to soul groups. I do tend to see certain qualities and certain tendencies, right? Be some certain lineages, but... Well, hold on, before you say something that I don't follow up on, how do you understand that? How do you understand that? Because races come from different areas, right? If we're looking at, okay, I look at it like this. I look at the human race as one race. So race is maybe not the right word. But there are different groups, right? There's different groups. And the question is where we star seeded, which I tend to believe that if we're star seeded, that's why you have these differences of why, why is there white, black, yellow, Asian, so-called, more like the so-called red men. But I think maybe the Asians moving through the land bridge to the Americas, but still having these different, the Polynesians having these different groups, are we just evolved from one being, or are we seeded from different iterations? Because I don't believe in Darwinian evolution. I don't tend to believe that the monkey became conscious in the form of a human, or some kind of evolution of consciousness. I believe that there was something that connected us in a divine way, kind of like the Michelangelo painting that allowed us to have this consciousness, right, at a different level than any other animal on the planet. So when I see that we have different racial groups, let's say, of the human race, then you can say that we come from different, potentially different, different star systems or seedings, and we obviously matriculate from different parts of the planet, right? So it leads, it lends itself to different conditions, the same way that you would argue between like, why are the Mediterranean qualities different than the Nordic? People have been saying this for centuries, for decades, not for centuries, right, that the Mediterranean peoples tend to be warmer, they tend to be a bit more expressive and free, and the Nordic peoples, as we know, tend to be a little bit more stiff, a little bit like stiffer, colder, right? They get out there and shovel that snow, kind of thing. They'd be a little bit more warlike compared to the Mediterranean cultures. So there's, you know, but that's not necessarily true. It just, there's this different quality. That's why I'm talking about like, there's different qualities based on lineages, perhaps based on locations, perhaps based on traditions, things like this. Sure, sure. You realize how that's gonna be construed as incredibly racist to a lot of people, but who cares, let's get beyond that to the level two and level three, because you're bringing up some other interesting stuff. The star seeding stuff gets into the whole UFO, ET contact, which I constantly think, if that's not on the table, then you're not really even talking about this stuff. One of the things I really appreciate again about your work is that's right there. That's right in the center of it too. It has to say, we have to factor that in, just like we have to factor in religion, and that's why we have to put quotes around satanic. It's not a Christian thing. It's a light versus dark thing. But I think the tricky thing about race is, again, I look at the science, you know, the near-death experience science, I think it's compelling stuff. The between lives stuff is compelling. Michael Newton does this. Michael Newton's story is really interesting. He's the guy who did the past life regressions. His story is interesting, because he's just a hypnotherapist, and he has somebody come in, and they're afraid of spiders, and he goes, okay, I want you to go back and remember, oh yeah, I was two years old. There was a spider crawling in my face. My mom got all freaked out. Okay, there you go. That's why you're afraid of spiders. Come out of the trance, you know, oh gosh, I'm not afraid of spiders anymore. So one day he's doing this, hypnosis session with somebody, and boom, the guy goes, I'm on a battlefield. I have a sword, you know? And he goes, okay. And he happens to be, Newton happens to be a history buff. So he starts, he said, that's a little bit outside of, you know, kind of professional ethics, but I go, what emblem is he wearing on his shoulder? All this kind of stuff, he gets all this details, and he traces it down and he finds the guy, and it sends him on this whole thing of this past life thing is real. And then what it sends him into is this stuff about between lives, and about being in a soul group and deciding where you go. And it would kind of fit with what you're saying, but there's always the outlier. There's the one from a different soul group that says, hey, I wanna jump into your stream over here, which would make a ton of sense. Why wouldn't it? And then that again, throws the whole racist thing out of it. It's like, yeah, you got your group here, and you're kind of marching along and evolving your consciousness, but that doesn't mean it's a very free flowing thing. You can bring in anyone from a different group, or from a different, as people talk about, from a different planet, from a different galaxy, and all the rest of that. And then the other thing that I think just blows away with our kind of concrete materialistic evidence is the 23 and me thing, right? So you have all these families that we're a prod, we're a bloodline, and then you find out the one kid there that always looked a little different. He doesn't exactly come from the same lineage, but no one knew that, that was a deep dark secret in the family, but we always treated him or her like that, and we treat it, you know what I mean? So it's just, I agree with what you're saying, I think it does make sense, but the larger picture is, it's just kind of more of a free for all in terms of how these souls travel through this huge infinite consciousness thing that we have. Do you have any thoughts on that whole thing? It's so big, it's so complex, right? I think the seeding of the human race, or the various groups, right? Because I mean, look, where does the R.H. negative come from? Isn't this one of the great mysteries that I'm sure you've looked at, all right, the negative Rhesus, where there's no Rhesus monkey in its lineage, and people with R.H. negative, they claim to have different abilities. Oftentimes they say they tend to be more like psychically attuned or things like this. And not, obviously there's psychically attuned people in all groups, but there is something odd about this R.H. negative thing. So, I don't, again, I mean, the rate, see, it's like the most racist thing to me is the focus on race, right? So when you get things like, you know, critical race theory, or you get various evolutions of modern racism where it's like everything is about what color your skin is, I find that more racist than just talking about, let's say, look, we have lineage, right? And so, you know, my lineage, as far as I can, you know, I can trace, you know, it goes back to certain parts, it's North Europe, it's, you know, France, it's partly, you know, Russian, Jewish, it's maybe Mongol, because we certainly, like when I did the 23 and me, we went, you know, we raised a lot with like people from like Turkmenistan and stuff like this. So, you know, so it's like, you know, that's just lineage. That's, you know, we know that our DNA is informed by ancestors, you know, they say we have genetic memory, you know, sorry, our memory can be influenced genetically at least seven generations or maybe up to 13 generations, I think. So the point is that it's not like, it's not a fallacy to talk about, you know, as to talk about lineages. It's just, I think people get simplified with this racial thing, you know, it's like Obama is a black man. I'm like, you know, he's half white. I mean, it's like, so we have the illusion. And very CIA. And that, oh, for sure, for sure. I mean, this guy was totally, you know, CIA, he was a total deep state creature. But the point is that like, you know, we have this illusion of color, right? And I think this is something we really gotta get past is like, just cause your color is pigmentation. I mean, they're, you know, as we know, they're albino, you know, like people who are albino, you know, who would look wider than me. It's like, so we gotta get past this notion of color. Lineage is important just to understand where we, you know, to understand, you know, certain, as much as we can, perhaps certain tendencies or certain, you know, certain things in our ancestral memory that's working through us, right? Traumas, pains, things like this. Spiritually, you can do a lot of work. I mean, my girlfriend teaches breath work but in her, she has a healing arts academy or spiritual and healing arts. And breath work is a very powerful tool for doing trauma work. People have memories of things. And yeah, I mean, people, white people can have memories of past lives as, you know, Native American or black and vice versa. I mean, why, this shouldn't be, this shouldn't be held as racist. Like just to say like, hey, I resonate, you know, with, you know, with this person. And I should be able to say that too. I've been called out racist for saying, I resonate with Malcolm X when he said, you know, he said this great quote about, you know, the media will make the oppressor look like the, the good guy and the oppressed look like the bad guy, right? They'll have you, you know, they'll have you mixing up who's the oppressor and who's the oppressed. And I'm like, I resonate with that. Oh, you can't say that. You're not black. It's like, I can resonate with it. I can resonate with a monkey if I resonate with a monkey. I mean, why can't we resonate? We are souls that are here to resonate. That's actually our point is to stop. See, they use the vision because the strongest power is, as we know, is connection. We're all, you know, love. It's connecting from, you know, no matter what your background is, it's love. We can love, we can love animals. We can love children. I mean, all these things, like they've perverted, pedophilia just means love of child. So they've turned that into this corrupt sexual thing when it should have just been, no, it's love of children. It should not be called, you know, we should get love out of that phrase. That should not be anywhere near what's happening when people are corrupting children. So you see their whole, the game is, and this is the dark side, the game is turn against, you know, identity politics. Identity politics becomes vaccine politics. You know, are you vaccinated? You can't be my friend if you're not vaccinated. You can't come in if you're not vaccinated. This is how they do it. It's just so simple because they know the power of connection and love is the most powerful force in existence. You know, there's a couple of other places I want to make sure we touch on. And you've touched on it a little bit, but I want to hit it again. And that's religion. And again, it's like you've lived so many lives, you know, you've gone through the whole thing. I mean, you went over to Iran and then you got, you know, all he's Muslim. That was the thing. You can still find that out there. Oh, I got to show you this because I don't know if this means anything or not. This could be totally meaningless. But when I go to Amazon, Sean Ollie Stone, I mean, I've never seen your name spelled out as Sean Ollie Stone again, but with all the stuff they tried to spin your openness to looking at, you know, other traditions, I got to believe there. And you're one, you're not even listed as the leading author on the thing, which the book, just look at the cover of the book. It's Sean Stone, New World Order. And then I'm Amazon. He's a more prolific author than I am. So I think, you know, it helps for promotional purposes, I suppose. No, I don't think so. It's that they're burying Sean Stone and they're saying Sean Ollie Stone, which sends you spinning and then you go look on Wikipedia and oh, we think he's a Muslim and all the rest is. Here's my point that I wanted you to talk about religion. It seems like such an obvious psi-op, such an obvious, why would anyone think that they need a spiritual intermediary? You know, I have some kind of experience with the divine. Why would I then immediately go, oh no, I can only understand it through this guy's book or somebody jumps in and says, no, I'm the only means by which you can interpret your spiritual experience. It seems like such a social engineering project from the beginning, why do we carry it around like an anchor on our ass and kind of even give it any, and I guess you have to, but I don't. I mean, I just don't give it any credence in the least. I think it had. We talked a little bit earlier about the level of consciousness and where consciousness is. And I think that it's served an important purpose the same way that any state, any government has served its purposes, right? There's certain levels of conduct that are put into, you name it, from the 10 commandments forward, right? Certain codes of conduct and religion has served in that way to help people find codes of conduct. So you could say, is it skeptical as far as like the goodness of humans? Does it look at humans as, you know, basically sort of these things that need to be ordered and controlled? To some extent, yes, social engineering has played a role, has played, it has had a purpose. Let's play like this. It has had a purpose, but there are junctures where you get the revolutionary juncture where consciousness is expanding, right? And the limitation of these ordering structures can no longer serve that. I think with these religious texts, what's always been interesting to me is that you do have these Gnostic traditions that are directly more called, you know, Gnosis is the concept of more direct knowledge of God, connection to source. That's within the Islamic realm. It's more known as Sufism. And there's obviously other sects, but Sufism is a very prominent one. Within Judaism, there's Kabbalah and things like this. Every religion essentially has that, that more Gnostic tradition. And the point being, yes, there's a lot of truth in these texts. There's a lot of truth in the biblical texts. There's a lot of truth in the writings of the New Testament, which we attribute to Christ. Where they really came from, they were written 80 years later. It's a little bit difficult to know. Sorry, it's 80 AD thereafter. So it's 50 years after the death, so-called. So it's a little difficult to know how real these things are, but there's still truth in them. Same with the Quran, many truths in them, many powerful expressions. So I've always been interested by the more Gnostic interpretations that doesn't mean that I discount the power and the tool of the teachers or the spiritual leaders that came forward. But ultimately, these are guides. And there are ways for you to then say, hey, there should be, as in Islam, they say there should be no compulsion in religion. So why is there compulsion? It's not the religion itself. It's the people using it. The same with any, look what's happening in our country right now. We have a constitution. Do people follow it? Are people acknowledging the constitution? Are they respecting it? So what are we gonna say? Oh, the founders were wrong to give us a constitution? No, it was a moment in time. And there were very important truths in it, thankfully that trend, I think that will stand the test of time, but people will abuse it. And that's just the danger of giving people authority over you in general. So it doesn't matter if it's religion, politics, going back to what I said earlier, why are we empowering people? Authority over us, we don't even know who these people are. At a deep level, at a spiritual level. Who is this person? Does this person come from the light? Are they actually, have they worked through their traumas and their issues of control? Are they on a healing journey or are they on a power trip? So you brought up the topic of politics and that's another thing that I wanted to talk about. I don't know how to process politics. To me, the lessons learned suggest that it's some kind of theatrical play that we don't even understand the beginnings of. I've heard you talk about Trump. I don't know how to process Trump. I mean, Trump is still saying, gee, the vaccine, the vaccine, he's leading. He's saying Joe Biden isn't sticking to the plan on the vaccine. Let me back in there so I can do it. I don't know how anything he could possibly say after that is credible. Obviously, they so blatantly rig the election, which is really kind of the story there. We know that their elections are rigged, but this one seemed to be so obviously rigged. But I come back to it. I don't want to digress. If Trump isn't going to come clean on Fauci, if he isn't going to come clean on the vaccine, then why would we go through another round of him claiming that he's just about ready to drain the swamp kind of thing? Does that have any credibility to you? I think when Trump said that he was in favor of the vaccine, there's two factors at work. One, he's that generation. My father, most, a lot of these boomers I know, they all, they believe in the vaccines. That's their belief. They know, and it's like, you can't argue this. You can't argue them away from it. That's just they've bought in. They've bought in since the days of the polio vaccine, which gave people SR 40. This disease, monkey disease, but hey, it's saved lives, so-called. So on that level, Trump's going to believe in the vaccinations. I don't think that Trump ever would have said mandated. I don't see why he would. I don't see that as his ideology or as politics. So when he said he's in favor of it, what it actually did was it took away the media, which is really the ones working in conjunction with Fauci's NIH, working with Bill Gates, basically backed by Bill Gates, let's be honest. Gates is the major player in a lot of the scheme. The media's ability to attack him. If he said he was against the vaccines, do you think that would actually change the Republicans' position? No, but it would make it such that anyone who says I'm against the vaccines becomes an immediate Trump supporter. So he saved a lot of us from that like, oh, you must believe it because Trump said it. Now look at the statistics. Who are the most people getting the vaccines? Democrats, by far. Republicans, it's split. So I don't think that Trump really is the difference between people getting a vax or not, but it takes away, that's why politics is literally, WWE entertainment, like there is a level of like, hey, you know, the media can't turn Trump into the bad guy on the vaccine issue, which, and also anyone who's against the vaccines would become a bad guy because we're pro-Trump. It's like, so they've already labeled us anti-vaxxers, but now, you know, don't muddle the water by saying that, you know, Trump's in favor of it, so you must be following Trump on this. I think that was fine as far as I'm concerned because it doesn't really matter. What matters is why did they rig the election? Why do they need them out? Because they couldn't have pushed this crazy, insane policy that they're doing, and people I think are waking up. They're looking around going, what the hell? You open the borders, you're flooding us. You know, COVID cases have completely gotten worse since the vaccine rollout. People are still getting it and dying. I mean, everything that you could talk about as far as the Afghan withdrawal, the potential war with Ukraine, the inflation, the supply chain issues, you can't look here and go, this is a great, this is a good presidency. And this is like, things are more divisive since these guys who came in, just like Trudeau, you know, coming in, promising unity, and becoming more divisive. So actually, I think, hey, they kind of played their hand with this election thing and actually have turned more people against them in a way. Maybe, you know, to me, that just seems like a standard, standard, right playbook, open the playbook, that's the first page is divide and rule, you know, divide, divide, divide, matter how it looks if it's divisive, it's good. But here's, I guess, the rub I have and this is where we'll kind of maybe wrap it up. You're very generous with your time. As a truth seeker, don't we run the risk of playing that WWE game in a way that we shouldn't play it? Isn't it really just about saying, you know, like, I love what you just said about Trump being of a different generation and you can kind of understand it as you kind of understand your dad and, you know, you get together at Thanksgiving and you're like, man, I'm not going there. You know, we've gone there 100 times, I'm just not going to do it again. I get that. But when we enter the realm of that guy being the leader that you talked about, then don't we just have to say, no, that's just bullshit. You just can't, you can't do that. You got to own, you got to own Fauci as a liar. You got to own that it's a bio weapon. You got to own all that stuff or I just can't go forward with it. And that doesn't mean I have any other option because I don't, but I can't go forward because I can only go forward with the truth. I would never expect a homeless man to give me a hundred dollars. I don't expect people to give me what they can't give or do what they can't, what they're not able to do. When Trump came in, what I loved was that it was, it was a sign that the system was collapsing and essentially that this was the King Kong element of bring this thing down. That's what this is about. This is about devolution. The beginning of the year I said, listen, we got to bring the power back what was given to us in the constitution. This, the rights not given enumerated directly for the federal government are reserved to the people, the states and the people they're in. That's the Bill of Rights, 10th Amendment. That's what we need. Bring the power back to us. I don't care about the federal, the federal level you're playing too many, there's too many interests, there's too much money involved. It's a rigged game. You know, like Juan O'Sadda said, you can't fix DC. You can't, you can't fix DC because it is fixed. It's a fix, okay? You're talking about corporations. It's a corporate, it's a freaking corporation. It's not even, it's literally it's a corporate state that they established this District of Columbia, a corporate state that they've set up and they're occupying us with it. We need to bring the power back to the people. We need to bring that power back to the states first so the counties to the level of what is closest to us. This is our path. This is our bringing power to ourselves. That's the path forward. Trump is great because he's there to inspire, to basically rally, to shake people up, but no, it's up to us to do the work. We can't sit there and say anyone else is gonna do it. We each are of us and trusting, you know, again, it's not like we have to go out there and have a revolution. We gotta trust the spirit. We gotta trust the spirit that's working through this time period that's elucidating things and will continue to elucidate things for us and just as things delucidated, it's our consciousness transforms and we realize new potentialities that are formed, new realities that we can step into. It's a process. It's not an overnight thing. This takes time. Consciousness needs to crack. It's like breaking that dam. You know, it's like you create enough pressure and it's like slowly there starts, you know, cracks start to, you know, start to give and the next thing you know, it's like, it will ultimately break, but you know, it's just every crack, you know, like that's what Lenny Cohen said, right? Every crack, that's how the light gets in. Every crack matters. From your lips to God's ears, as they say. Hey, Sean, what are you working on nowadays? What's the next big thing? As I mentioned a minute ago, you know, you continue to put out some great, great interviews. I mean, again, it's cause you have this background. You know, you just are so tuned in to all these kinds of things. I just saw the interview you did about the RFK Junior book, you know, number one book in the country for six weeks. And no, you know, to the media, where they can just pretend it doesn't exist. The media can pretend that the truck drivers aren't rolling down the streets of Canada and that there aren't millions of protesters on the streets in Europe and all the rest of that stuff. So you're still doing work. Where are you going to channel that? How is that going to come out? You know, I'm in between projects. So we'll see what that next, what, you know, what God wants, I would say, you know, essentially it's like, you can't force the universe. The universe is going to bring through what is needed next. So for now I do the portray on stuff because that's a good place to just do interviews, conversations that are interesting to me and let people have a listen. I'm also offering like meditations there and also even private sessions that people want to do like, you know, coaching, guidance, feedback, divination, offer it. You know, in listening to some of your meditations, they're really nice. They're very, very open-hearted. You can tell it's completely sincere. How are you understanding your connection to ET? And I know that's super complicated and we could spend a lot of time on that. But again, I think it's central to this. I don't know for myself, I'll offer, I don't quite understand it. I don't quite understand the, it seems like a reality but it's just beyond my realm of understanding how all that fits in, star seeding, abduction, which clearly seems like it's definitely just, it's happening, you know, genetic engineering, even the people who are in those communities who are, you know, have the most different opinions. I remember even viewing Dr. David Jacobs and Mary Rodbaugh, both who have done hypnotic sessions with hundreds and hundreds of people and they're disagreeing left and right on all this stuff. And then David Jacobs goes, well, it's a program, you know? And then I go, well, Mary, what is, what do you say about that? David says it's a program and she pauses for a minute because she's all about the love and light E.T. And she goes, well, yeah, it's definitely a program. I don't know, it's a program. I mean, isn't that the lead story on it? So how are you processing the E.T. thing in your personal spirituality? To whatever extent you feel comfortable talking about that? Again, I trust in creator, you know, in the creator, let's say the highest levels of creation working through from like the angelic realm and everything in this universe is birthed from, to me, from that source. So everything that we experience exists within the realms of the infinitude of potentiality. But all that we can know is this moment. Everything outside of this moment, it's basically, it's a belief, it's a memory, it's an idea, it's an imagining, it's a- It's a WWE. It's a reduction, right? It's a reduction. What's now is this experience as we feel it and the truth is we don't fully feel even this moment. We don't fully experience even this moment. So really what is there to say? We're here to debate, we're here to discuss, we're here to experience, we're here to feel and have the contrast and all these different polarities as we, the I am, comes to know itself better. Yeah, that's beautiful, Sean, it's, yeah. I think that's pretty solid ground there. So again, for people to follow you, you think Patreon is the best place or- It's a great place that they can, you know, they can support and get new content. Obviously I put stuff on social media on Instagram and rumble and such, but I really think Patreon's a good place where I feel like I can put out these interviews without being censored by YouTube. Well, fantastic. Thanks again so much for coming on. I appreciate it. All right, brother, thank you. Bye. Thanks again to Sean Stone for joining me today on Skeptico. The one question I tee up from this interview is, what do you think power and control issues, personal power and control issues might have to do with the craziness that we see in the world? It's kind of a funny question to contemplate because we all understand our own power and control issues. We just can't imagine what they'd be like if they were amped up 10, 20, 100 times. Let me know your thoughts on that. Of course, I got some really good ones coming up. Do stay with me for all of that. Until next time, take care and bye for now.