 application for 56 College Street. Come up, have a seat, and I think we all know you're Jeff next, so you don't need to introduce yourself. Go ahead and describe your project. Sure, so this is that old former headquarters of the New England Calling Institute, and back in 2004 I believe we renovated the old house and resurrected the old carriage barn and moved it and put on a new foundation and connected it with this vector wing here, which is where the elevator main entrance are, and we have second floor offices up above in that wing there. And at the time we really would have liked to put a dormer there, and discussions with the city never got to a hearing when we discussed with the city they were in favor of it as was the state because this was a historic renovation. Somebody in the federal office in Washington said no to the dormer, and we were unable to put the dormer on. Do they give you a reason? They just didn't like it. They said it wasn't in keeping with the historic character and we and Jay Ansel gave a number of photographs of similar buildings in Montilio with dormers, but it didn't seem to win them over. Beyond that time frame they also installed a dormer. They said they'll do it anyway. They said they'll eat it out. Yes, oh everything about the project is acceptable. At the time the one guy in Washington didn't like the dormer idea. Everybody up here did. And if you look at the floor, if you're in, if you've been up there, the floor plan just doesn't play out. We've got a very nice, you know, we've retended the building with Vermont Legal Aid and the National Wildlife Federation, but that second floor the way it lays out just doesn't make much sense as a standalone unit. And Necky made it work, but it's just, you know, the ceiling height and the on this side of the, I mean I'm sure your floor plan, but it's like seven feet until your shoulder hits the slope ceiling and just give us an extra two and a half feet make it very comfortable to lift the roof line up a little bit. So that's what we're hoping to let us do. So this is the same dormer that you proposed back then? You know, I don't know. Jay produced this for me, so I've forgotten what it was. Jay was kind of leading the charge back when we were doing it 2004, yeah. Yeah, I don't know why. Well, that's still on there from 2004. I guess you didn't take that off. Good question. There you windows on the dormer are a one over one as opposed to the six over one that are on the second floor of the main building and the ones that were on either side of the old garage and on the garage doors. Was there any reason for that? Well, Jay, because these two below are one over one, he chose that. That's what's there currently in the wing. We're happy to do whatever you would like, but that's the reason he did that. Okay, I was just asking questions. I think the six over one would be better. I don't think you actually, in the photograph, you don't see the one over one being hidden behind both the bush and the porch. And the porch. Like it reads more in the drawing, but I don't think you actually, going down the street, you will see these in relation to those a lot more than those. Yeah, I think the one over ones I know from my experience with working with the state and with Washington. When you have a new addition, they often want the new addition details to be a little different than the historic sections of the building. So you don't, I mean, it's, most people would never really think about this, but the new additions read a little different. You don't want to give what they call a false sense of history. So, you know, to make that look old when it's really not. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. That makes any sense. So you're suggesting the six over one? No, I'm suggesting keeping them the way they are there. Yeah. The one over ones, in my opinion. Okay. Now, the carriage house is original to the original building. Yes. Was that center section and filled was that? Yes. Catched. That was in film. The actual garage barn was probably, I think 10 feet this way. We lifted it up, put it on a new foundation, put it back down. Yeah. Okay. It's a tough call because I know it's a new infill, but it follows the, it follows the lines of the carriage house so close that it looks like it could, and that's the nice thing about it. Yeah. It's like it could have always been there. It's a nice, nicely done, I think, nicely designed. Sure. We always thought it looked a little odd, but it's just all, all roofline, you know, all the way across it. We always thought it would better breaking up the roofline, that massive roof there. With the door, I think we'll actually do that. Yeah. Yeah. I like the idea of the six over ones too, just because I think that you're not consistent with what we're gonna see as we look at the building. I understand what you're saying about this, but my own impression, I'd like to see six over ones. Just in terms of pure aesthetics, it looks like it has always been there, and frequently carriage houses were attached to older buildings by breezeways, open sheds, sort of in the nature of the old farmhouse where the barn was attached to the house with a shed or a garage or a wood shed or whatever. Right. And again, it was a new addition between the two, but it looks like, I mean, passing down the street and looking at it looks like it could have always been there. Right. Because it's not atypical. And again, I guess that's a, a mixed. Right. Yeah. And then again, we could give them the option of doing either which, whichever you think would look the best. Well, Jay and I batted around the six and the one over one and Jay went with the one over one because that was what was below it. So that's how we arrived at this. I think that the one over ones follow the Secretary of Interior's standards, which do say you shouldn't give a false, you know, false sense of history with your new additions. They should be compatible, but you don't want them to look like they've always been there necessarily. You want them to work and be sympathetic with what's historic. Yeah. So. And actually, if you use a insulated glass with an exterior screen on it, the darkness of the screen will help. If you look at some of the other windows that have that, that will help that blend in so that it's not going to be as conspicuous as it would just glass sitting there reflecting the morning sun, which hits that, that building morning and late morning. Right. The one over ones are probably a little cheaper, too. What are the windows? Are they marvins or what do you use? I've, that's been a while since we've, whatever we use on the molasses, we'll probably use again. Yeah, we'll pick a good one. It's like a wood window. I'm interested in the sort of rhythm between siding window, siding, double window, siding window, siding that they're unequal. And whether that is what the intention is. It almost looks like he matched. Oh, I see. He matched the bump out on the second story of the main building. You know, you have a single on the, on either side and then that double in the front. Well, also just that there's more than that. There's a lot more siding on the far side. No, okay. And it looks like the space is, the space between the two windows is unequal on the right and left. Oh, okay. Now, whether there is some intentionality that I don't understand. It might have to do with the floor plan. I would think, yeah. Yeah, but it may be that that we were hitting the floor plan. There's a, there's a wall here and we're going to move it here to make this right. Right. A little more generous. This office will be small. I'm guessing that wall is there. Right. I'm thinking that's what you do. I like the balance of that. I think it works fine. Yeah. Yeah. This is the existing floor plan. I'm certain there's good reasons for it. And I think we wanted to move this wall or cross out the existing wall. This wall here is going to be the new wall. And I'm guessing Jay married up the, the split in the window. Yes. With that wall. Yeah. Copy of that just for class? Yeah. Awesome. Thank you. I'm certain Jay is sensitive to what it looks like for me. Right. Yeah. Well, maybe we, the, the window on the, you know, it's funny that far right hand window as you're looking at the building. If you slid that over, that would make it more equal because it's long. Yeah. I see what you're saying. Rather than move the middle one is move this one that way. Right. Or if you move this one that way. Yeah. That makes sense. I think the middle one was lined up on that wall, but I think the two outer ones, we can make those equally distant if you'd like to. I feel like that would give it a little, everything else is pretty well proportioned and sort of stepped on the building. Right. Yeah. We'll make the windows equidistant. Yeah. As much as possible based on the floor. Yeah. It's a beautiful building. Yeah. Thanks. Yes. A little more painting to do up there and a little more roofing and painting and then the storm or it would be done. Yeah. I assume it'll, look, you've already redone this roof since this photograph. Yes. Yeah. And so this door will have an ascolchial roof to match whatever. To match. Yeah. It was just put it in as an option that you may position the windows equidistant spacing or aesthetic balance if it can be accomplished with a proposed interior floor plan. We'll do it. There are comments, questions, suggestions. Alternative depending on what the other windows are. Some mix of wood. I think on the front there would. They may be clad on the back, but I'm pretty sure they would. It just indicated that they wanted to replace some on the hand. I can go through the criteria unless anybody has anything else. Here's a set of criteria. You've been through this before. I'll just read quickly through that. Yeah. Evaluation criteria number one. Preservation of reconstruction of the appropriate historic style of the proposed projects in the historic district involves an historic structure. This addition of the adornment is acceptable. Harmony of exterior design with other properties in the district acceptable. Compatibility of proposed exterior materials with other properties in the district acceptable. Compatibility of proposed landscaping. None proposed in this application. Prevention of the use of incompatible designs, buildings, color schemes or exterior materials. Acceptable. Location and appearance of all utilities. No change in any lighting or other utilities. None the outside. Recognition of and respect for view quarters and significant visitors including gateway views of the city and state house. Acceptable. All in favor of the application is proposed. Raise your hand. Just signed that one right above my name. I'm a little out there. You have a pen. Okay, thank you. So did we go to go one over one or six over one? It's your option. I didn't write it down. I didn't write it. You have it listed as a one over one. Okay. Unless you want the option of doing a six over one. No, I think we're good with a one over one. Yeah. Okay. Again, I think the screens on the outside are usually dark enough that they'll make it more subtle whichever way you go. Yeah. Great. All right. Thanks everybody. Thank you. Okay. Thank you. Yep. Check and see if I pray for him. Okay. We'll talk amongst ourselves. Whoa. It's really good. It's a little bright. I'm hoping that the color is a little darker and a little more subtle, maybe a little gray in it or something to tone it down. Yeah, it's pretty bold. I already have a green one on the state street that takes your breath away. Oh, yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. That somehow didn't look. I just. It was represented. It'll probably fade over a couple of years. 20 years. It's too bad because there's a depth in certain colors that you try to achieve that makes a building look really rich and really, really nice. Someone didn't quite make it. No. No. I'm not sure. It's unfortunate. Yeah. I don't know. Some people see that. Some people don't. Some of the better designers are really good with colors. I think people don't realize really what it's going to look like until they get it out. I think it's pretty hard to go from a peas watch or a chip. Yeah. You have to do a big sample. Well, they painted samples on the side of the building and why they had people thinking that was the one that kept going myself. I wonder if she has an actual color swatch of the true color. I hope so because I don't think I can vote for that one. That one's really not an accurate federal blue. Right. Did they give you an actual color chip other than that? No. That and saying it's federal blue. You want an actual color? It's good that they're here. We'd like an actual color chip. Okay. Perfect. Professor, that's a bit bright. I'm not sure if that's what they were truly attempting. And again, that's a sample color. I'm an entirely different building. Yeah. No, I know. I'm not sure. What's the siting on the building now? Is that a wood siting? I don't think so. What's that aluminum to me? I don't know. Or is that aluminum? I think it's aluminum. I'm looking at the corners and there's not a corner board on there. But I also don't read the little aluminum caps in there either. There's no like, you know, like that or trim around the windows. I was also looking at the corners here. Yeah. And usually if it's wood. And the windows. Sometimes they will do a miter cut. But more often than not, they do a corner board. So what kind of siting? What color? Concurrent or color trim? An actual color chip. Some of the corners daily. Just before you go on the bridge. In state. In state, yeah. That's the gas station. Right. On the river side. Okay. Yeah, it's kind of an odd view. Has anybody had a chance to look at the minutes? On February the 4th? I did. And they looked good to me. Anybody have anything else to add or change? I was not present. Okay. I think it was good. No apology necessary. Do I hear a motion to approve the minutes? Okay. All in favor of approving minutes. Raise your hand. And it's far approved by four votes. Any other business other than the fact the next meeting's Monday, April Fool's Day. I have a question. Because I have obviously have too much time in my hands and I was reading all of our regulations. Why has the one more time sign not been removed from that's an abandoned sign? Probably because I have a backlog of sign enforcement that I haven't gotten to. You still have Lewinstein's address. Is there anybody? Is there anybody older? Yes, that's Lewinstein. It's not a Jacobs building. Not yet. Lewinstein wants to sell the building but it needs a lot of work. It's uninsulated and much of it. There's single pane windows. I'm not sure if the heating system is ever replaced. The heating system belongs in the Smithsonian. And he wanted, last time knew, they wanted 1.3 as is. I just caught my eye. So anyway, but you're right. Yeah, no, it needs to come down. There's other signs that have popped up around the city that have a couple of things that I need to follow up on. Do I hear a motion to adjourn? I move to adjourn. Second? I'll adjourn. All in favor of adjournment, raise your hand. Meeting is adjourned. That was quick. That was tough.