 Live from Barcelona, Spain, it's theCUBE. Covering Cisco Live 2018. Brought to you by Cisco, Veeam, and theCUBE's ecosystem partners. Okay, welcome back everyone. It's live coverage here at theCUBE in Barcelona, Spain for Cisco Live 2018 Europe. I'm John Furrier, the co-host of theCUBE. It's Stu Miniman, analyst at wikibon.com and also CoastCube, many events. Our next guest, Adam Cowlesy, Cisco Spark developer relations at Cisco. Welcome to theCUBE. Thank you. Looking good today. Thanks. Love the Mojo this year. And again, we've been covering DevNet Create this past year. Cisco and developers really coming together and it's a real extension of a dominance that Cisco's had with network and the network side. Sure. A lot of alpha geeks, they know their stuff but as you guys are moving up the stack you guys are contributing more to application developers. So we're super excited to see that movement, some open source action. You got a lot of stuff. We're talking AI in the keynote, IoT. It's becoming software focused. It is. And everything from Cisco's traditional business core networking, enterprise networking, a lot of that stuff moving to software and becoming developed and run and managed by software. But then also seeing applications and in the application space and seeing everything from enterprise applications moving to a consumer space, moving to APIs, everything becoming open and no longer being an island and connected together and we're excited to be a big part of that. It's an engineering mindset in networking. Stu and I both have a networking background so we kind of know the culture. They can get stuff done and designing, architecture, engineering but now the DevNet has been a big story for Cisco. DevNet as a developer attraction, it's transforming the DNA of a Cisco stakeholder, MVP. It's not just networking, engineering, it's network ops, network dev ops, network software for applications. What specifically catalyzes that story for Cisco? Someone's like, hey, I'm seeing Cisco's got this whole DevNet vibe. What catalyzes that in the mind of the customer? Is it a specific product? Is it a approach? Is it spark? What product? What thing highlights Cisco's focus on developers? Well, so everything here in the DevNet zone obviously we've got a lot of in the collaboration space, a lot of things becoming developer focused and developer friendly and even being products that are being developed with a developer first mindset. We build it for the developer and then work backward from there rather than trying to tack a developer interface onto an existing product later. And so we've got everything from the networking and software defined networking and all of our ability to automate network deployment and services deployment to collaboration and communications and allowing people to communicate inside their existing apps. What's the big thing impact the customers? Now Cisco's moving up the stack, I get that love Cisco have Cisco. What's in it for me? I'm the customer. Right. So the big value to you as the customer is that now developers can bring in the applications that you're using every day into the products that you're using every day to communicate, to run your network, to do anything. The idea is eliminate those islands and those silos of applications where I used to have to go here to get one thing done and then I'd move over to this other thing, bring them together and either bring those products into Cisco products or bring the Cisco technologies into those other products and start blurring that line. Yeah, it's interesting, Stu and I were talking yesterday about the impact of cloud, cloud native and certainly DevOps, certainly on-premises and in the cloud as people start doing hybrid and start thinking multi-cloud. It's, there's two kind of schools of thoughts. Replatform everything or incrementally build on top of what you got. So I'd love to get your reaction to that because we don't, we see replatforming is good for certain things. We just want to throw away the old and bring in the new kind of lift and shift or just kind of, just change. But some cases you don't. I mean, you don't really want to replatform the network. You don't want to replatform a lot of systems. You got to build on top of it, learn new things. What's your reaction to that? And how would you advise customers and stuff? Oh, just replatform the whole thing. We actually run into that a lot with Spark because companies have massive investments in their communications infrastructure. And they've spent all of this money building out this communications infrastructure. And then you come in and you go, okay, now we've got all this cloud service. And they're, you know, we're not going to throw away our communications infrastructure to go to the cloud. And so that's why our hybrid model and our hybrid strategy is so effective because you can use all of those things that are inside and those investments that you've already taken to speed up voice traffic and video traffic in your network. But then also get the take advantage of the cloud where you've got the rapid deployment and the rapid evolution and the upgrade cycles. And I'm not having to go and upgrade everybody's machine every six months and, you know, being able to keep that investment and take advantage of that investment while moving to the cloud. That's pretty core though. I mean, that's like fundamental to that. Yes, absolutely. Adam, some of my friends, some of the hardcore networking people come to the show every year. You're pretty excited about the DevNet stuff. They're just like, not just getting my certification, learning about new things. It's like, I can like learn to code. Yes. And they're getting pretty excited, which is, I know I was glad to hear, take us inside a little bit, you know, what's happening, you know, you've been right here near theCUBE, you know, all week so far. What kind of people are coming? What kind of activities do they get to do? So we've got a lot of, there's a gamut. So we're seeing a lot of traditional network engineers, people that have no background in programming, highly technical people, but have never written code before coming and starting to learn to code. I was talking to somebody yesterday. He's very excited. He's taking a certification that requires coding. And he says, I didn't know how to code three months ago. And I've started figuring this out, and it's so awesome, I get to do this. But then we're also seeing a shift toward people that are developers first, now coming to Cisco events, coming to Cisco Live, and we're running into them here. We're, when we first started doing this, so I've been with Cisco almost three years now. And when I first started coming to doing these DevNet events, we had to start at very basic levels. Here's code 101, and this is an introduction to APIs. Now we're able to get much deeper and start diving a lot deeper, both because the audience that's, the traditional Cisco audience is learning so much, but also because we're now attracting an audience that isn't looking at it and saying, oh, well Cisco's just a networking company. They're realizing. You're attracting two major constituencies. Absolutely. I mean, I think the network API stuff is really interesting to me. We were talking yesterday with Susie, we who's the vice president and CTO of the group, but it makes total sense that if you look at micro services and the Kubernetes doing, it's really changing the game and opening up the aperture of what developers can do with programmable infrastructure. Right, so it's always been kind of like, oh yeah, I could program some config stuff, but getting down to the network level and doing policy, it's pretty interesting. What's the impact of that? Because this is kind of like a new dynamic that's happening with DevOps where you've got pure programmable networking capability. Where are some people using this? Where do you see this evolving? What's the sequence? What's the order of evolution, if you will, with net DevOps, networking DevOps? You know, it's, I think the biggest evolution, the most interesting evolution is on the human side. So how this is changing the job role and how the engineer is having to change their mindset from I'm installing and racking equipment and my job is picking up this big, heavy box and putting it in here and plugging cables in to my job is thinking more logically about how the network needs to work and plugging those things into it. So they're slinging APIs rather than slinging cable. Absolutely, absolutely. It's also an interesting impact on Cisco's business here. We're such a channel-focused company, we've got all these partners that are out there selling things and resellers. As more things move to software and move to the cloud, how their business has to change. Now, I no longer make money by buying this box and selling it to you. I now make money by actually adding value and creating a lot of value there. Yeah. Adam, I wonder if you could take us inside the collaboration space. John and I a little bit old on some of this stuff. Remember it kind of, you know, enterprise 2.0 wave that come, you know, I worked when Jive was like helping, you know, internal companies. We've been heavy in social. Where's kind of the UC collaboration? You know, where does all of that fit in the kind of Cisco's position in that market? Sure, so we see a big move to messaging, obviously. So both in the consumer space, you know, Facebook Messenger or WhatsApp or SMS and text messaging. And that's really starting to move into enterprise as well where it's not just messaging where I'm going to send you a quick IM to ask you a question, but my daily job is happening in messaging. Moving a lot, you know, everybody's promised to kill email for 20 years and for a product that everybody wants to kill it sure seems to have survived a long time. But with messaging and the rise of messaging and integrated messaging and voice and video and conferencing and meeting applications, we actually are now seeing a reduction in email usage among people that are using this. What about chatbots has been something that we've been talking about, kind of combination of, you know, machine learning with kind of the collaboration, you know, lots of companies using Slack these days as one of the pieces. Where do you see that fitting into it? So chatbots are growing in usage, in business in general. We're seeing a ton of usage in the enterprise. In fact, to the point where almost every single customer of Spark has a significant deployment of chatbots, either things they've built internally or things that are working with other products that they've downloaded. We've got our kind of our app store called Spark Depot where people can go and download and install different bots into their Spark platform. And we're seeing that those being used so much across every enterprise. One of the things that's interesting that we're in a unique position to take advantage of that a lot of companies aren't is we are completely enterprise focused. We are top down when somebody installs Spark in the network, it's the entire enterprise gets Spark. The entire company gets Spark. So now it's not these little silos of hey, this group is using this platform so for an application developer, I can go build an application once and know that my target is every company in the world. That as we start taking and becoming a more ubiquitous across enterprise that your bot then has a deployment target of that same footprint. Final question for me is what's the hottest DevNet zone area this week? What's getting the most love and attention and interest from you guys? You know, anything that is talking APIs. So we're walking around and seeing all of the classroom sessions, anything that we're talking about APIs and programmability specifically on web services, rest type APIs, crowds of people around the table, not big enough spaces for them. The classrooms are too small for to hold the amount of interest that's there. And what's interesting, I think you guys just to kind of give you some props here, I think this net DevOps concept is like groundbreaking. I think it's new to new to kind of, I think mainstream won't figure it out. Certainly I see people there, like some alpha engineers there, but like that's pretty big. I mean, that's really going to be, we see Kubernetes really opening up a whole new level of Cisco. Absolutely. That's going to change the games. Really congratulations to the team. That's really, not just visionary, it's conceptually relevant right now. So I think that's going to, you are skating through where the puck is coming. You're there, so congratulations. Thanks. Okay, we're here inside the DevNet zone, talking DevNet developers at Cisco, changing environment, the evolution of the networking personas now becoming software-driven and it's been popular here at Cisco Live. I'm Joe for Stu Miniman, live coverage from Barcelona at theCUBE. Right back with more after this short break.