 Kia ora tātou, na mai hari mai, greetings to you all and welcome to this session, it's a live session from EHF. Edmund Hillary Fellowship is a collective of entrepreneurs, scientists, storytellers, creatives and investor changemakers who want to make an impact globally from Aotearoa New Zealand. It's an informal session but it's an informative session so that you can leave here after 60 minutes and feel that you know the speakers and the content and that on a personal level so that you understand what their intentions are and that you can contact them directly afterwards. So this session we have Tessa and we have shifting my screens here, Cheryl and they are going to run through two separate presentations for you and then we're going to jump into some Q&A and hopefully we can just keep the ball rolling and have a really good conversation. So first up Tessa is going to tell us about the gift trust and she's also a fellow in cohort 7 but first I'll just do a quick intro of the bow so Tessa if you just do a quick intro and then I'll go to Cheryl and then you can do a quick one and then we'll go back into presentations. Thanks Michelle. So Kia ora koutou kō Tessa Tokwingala and I've been the engagement lead for the gift trust for the past six months. Over to you Cheryl. Kia ora koutou kō Cheryl Spain Aho. I'm the executive director of the gift trust so the gift trust is the umbrella entity that we're talking about today and we run two different initiatives. Tessa will talk about the gift trust and I'm going to talk about our other initiative called the gift collective. I've been running the gift trust for around about five years and that's me. I live here in Wellington. Thanks for having us. Thanks Cheryl. Good. Tessa if you want to share your screen. Great. Okay. Thank you. So welcome everyone. I'm here to talk about the gift trust. Our purpose is to simplify generosity to make good happen here in Aotearoa New Zealand and offshore. We connect donors to charitable organizations making a difference through personalized gift accounts. So it's a bit like having a bank account, but instead it's for the purpose of giving to charitable organizations. So today I'm going to provide a brief overview of the gift trust. And as Cheryl mentioned, that's sort of the umbrella body that we're talking about today. But an initiative and separate initiative underneath that is the gift collective which Cheryl as our executive director of the gift trust will discuss. But I thought I'd start by kind of taking a step back on why does the charitable sector matter in New Zealand and what impact is the charitable sector actually making. So I think people underestimate sometimes the value that the charitable sector drives here in New Zealand in particular. It's nearly 5% of our GDP, which largely a big chunk of that figure includes our volunteering community who are making a lot of good happen every day in our communities. And I've kind of identified three key areas that the charitable sector community sector more broadly is really effective at delivering. So firstly, a lot of the time government will pass over service delivery to the charitable sector. And this is especially common in the housing sector. And if you go to community housing, you can see all the different kind of housing initiatives that sit under that umbrella body here in New Zealand. Another really niche area that our charitable sector is good at is civic engagement. So we have organisations like Generation Zero and many others that actually advocate to government to create long lasting systems change. And Generation Zero pulled out there as an example because they were actually the first group responsible for the zero carbon bill that went through government about a year ago and has been a game changer in terms of our climate response as a country. The third really important area is creating community and cohesion. So our charitable sector responds to different interest groups, different community groups and creates a sense of belonging for many people. So for example, Inside Out is a charitable group for the LGBTQ community and they have been recognised for the amazing work they're doing to raise the profile and create a sense of belonging for that community. Also, finally, I thought I'd touch on COVID-19, which is fresh in our minds as we are in the midst of another lockdown here. Probably the most surprising lockdown for us all, but I find it really interesting that essential services tend to be in the charitable realm. So many charities are continuing working during this outbreak because they're considered essential. And I think that value of the charitable sector really needs to be appreciated and recognised. So the pictures here just for context are a couple of charities that have been part of my personal journey in this sector. Starting off on the top right is Ignite Consultants, which is a university group connecting students to community groups in Dunedin and Wellington through eight month projects. And that was sort of my first exposure to the sector and it exposed me to Camp Quality, which is a children's camp for children living with cancer on the bottom right. And then from there, I've been a trustee for Birthright, which is the image on the bottom left, and a trustee for Kaibosh, which is a food rescue charity. And then the logos to the left, I think, kind of underpin a lot of different organisations I've been a part of, but that kind of the infrastructure to make the charitable sector work. And so here we're talking about the gift trust as a really key piece of the infrastructure in encouraging people to give and encouraging, therefore, the charitable sector to thrive. So how does the gift trust work? What is the gift trust? As mentioned, it's a bit like having a bank account, but instead we call it a gift account. And people can open a gift account through the gift trust very easily through a form on our website. Accounts start with a minimum of 5,000, but you don't need to make donations straight away. You can pause and actually strategise with us on how you want to give and what priorities, giving priorities you have. And while you're pausing and considering where to give your funds, you can also be, you can also invest that money. So we have broadly three different investment options, and we offer kind of ethical investment options in particular through two different routes, and we help connect you to that investment opportunity. And finally, you decide when to give and what to give, and we help you with that process. So we provide due diligence as a basic step. We check whether the entity that you want to give to is managing their finances properly, and we do all of that kind of administrative background behind the scenes to ensure that donations can go through smoothly. But in addition, and I think the real value, a real key value of the gift trust is that our team, Cheryl in particular, is really connected with the charitable sector. So we can offer strategic guidance on where you might want to give and actually help direct your funds into something that can make a huge impact. So this slide just outlines the benefits of the gift trust, and these are wide ranging. So something I didn't mention before is that you get tax credits when you give to charitable organisations. And the rationale there is essentially that charitable groups are kind of often delivering equivalent or sometimes even more than what the government can contribute. So you can get your tax credit back for that. So we enabled and support that tax credit process. We also, as mentioned, provide research and we take the guesswork out of giving. So I kind of think that sometimes you sort of might walk down the street and see a bucket and pop a dollar in there. And that's actually not the most effective way to give to charities. It's worth taking the time to pause and actually be strategic about where you want to invest your money in the charitable sector. It's similar to the strategic thinking you do with your bank and your investment strategies on other funds that you might hold. We provide genuinely impartial advice. So if you're interested in giving to an organisation, we help you give to that organisation and we essentially provide impartial due diligence around that giving. And another key benefit particularly for New Zealanders who are sometimes a bit shyer than other cultures, you might not want to blow your own trumpet about your giving. So you can do this really anonymously through the gift trust. We hold about 50 gift accounts and quite a few of those gift accounts are completely anonymous. So it means that no one's bugging you about your charitable giving and we can help you with that privacy. On the other hand, we have a couple of donors who are really outspoken about their giving and we also, if you want to go down that route, we encourage that ability to be outspoken if you do decide to go down that route instead. So one of our donors who's very happy to talk about the gift trust is a very connected EHF founder, Matthew Monahan, who many of you listening probably have heard of or might know. So he's an amazing guy who's moved over from the States after a really successful venture over there. And he's making a huge difference in particularly the climate change space and environmental space here in New Zealand. This case study on the slide is about what happened during COVID. So the Namaste Foundation that Matthew is in sort of one of the people in charge of, they found during COVID that they wanted to respond and they wanted to respond quickly. So they partnered with the gift trust and they set up a fund that we helped manage with them to distribute money to a range of different organisations that were probably those essential services that I talked about earlier. And we helped connect them to the causes making a difference. So for example, the Namaste and featured in this picture has given to lots of different organisations, but in the pictures, the learning environment, which is an educational hub in Whanganui. And they're doing excellent work and sort of conservation curriculum and mental health and well-being by being educated in the outdoors. So that's hopefully a quick overview of what we do here at the gift trust. I've been the engagement lead for six months and strangely have decided to move over to the UK in the midst of a COVID lockdown. So if you have any questions, I would suggest getting in touch with Cheryl who's about to speak. I'm the executive director of the gift trust and even if you're just interested in giving and you don't know where to start, I'd really vouch for the gift trust. It's an amazing team and an amazing platform to support you in a giving journey. Thank you. So just take any questions first. Does anyone have any questions on the gift trust before we move to the gift collective? I do, if no one else does. So with the tax, because obviously a lot of fellows and a lot of people will be trying to put their money across the border. What countries are fully aware of? We've got something set up in the US for companies to be able to pull their tax across, but what other countries around the world do you have a similar partnership with? Or is it easy to do it with other countries so that people can get that sort of tax relief? Shall I jump in here, Tessa? So yes, we do have a route and just for those who don't know, I'll explain the US route. We do have a really great partnership set up in the US with an organisation called RSF Social Finance. So they are what's called a donor advised fund in the States, which is essentially the equivalent of what the gift trust is. But we hold a fund with them. Any US based donors can give tax effectively into that fund. They get their US tax credit. They give in US dollars. Those funds build up and we bring them over quarterly to New Zealand and distribute them to whatever charitable causes the donors want. So it's a really nice, simple solution. We don't have quite the same set up in any other countries, but we can and do and have brought funds over from the UK, Australia. We bought some funds over from Singapore recently. So there are different ways of doing it depending on different jurisdictions. But generally speaking, we would partner with the equivalent of what the gift trust is in that country. And we can oftentimes donors can give to a donor advised fund in their home country to get the tax credit and then request that they make the grant to an international charity, particularly one like the gift trust, which has gone through this process a lot of times. So we have all the due diligence available. So that's quite a nice neat solution to bring funds from overseas here. On the flip side, I'll just mention we can also make grants to international charities ourselves from New Zealand, from New Zealand donors. We do have a limit. So we can only give 25% of all of our donations in any one year to international causes, but that's actually quite high because we grant a lot in New Zealand. So people can talk to us about making international donations and getting New Zealand tax credits as well. That's really good. So Cheryl, just very briefly. So it was RSF, wasn't it, just to clarify? Yes, that's right. Great. Thank you. Yeah, that was really good. Someone asked me about that the other day. So that's good. Thank you. I couldn't remember. I just knew that you'd done that work with Jason Franklin to get that set up. Are there any other questions from the floor? Otherwise, I have another one. There are 26,000 charities registered. How do you decide when people are coming to you saying, gosh, which one should I go to? How do you sort of help people sort of filter through? Do you have it sort of set in clusters or what makes it easier for people? And how do you make it fair then perhaps that all charities might have a sort of option? I'll jump. Do you want to jump in here, Tessa? Yeah, I'll give it a crack and then I'll pass over to you, Cheryl. So we do have a Charities Register in New Zealand which lists all of the 27,000 charities. And I guess it's a really unwieldy tool to use, but we know how to use it, which is one of the advantages of potentially partnering with us. So we do, if we're carrying out any research, use that tool and make sure that we're giving a fair chance to those 27,000 groups. But you can categorise through that tool. And then we also, I guess, have quite a good sense and connections on the ground, but also with other donors to be able to pull out effective charities depending on what the request is. So a lot of the time it's that desktop research plus the connections that we already have. Nice. Because I can imagine some people would have certain criteria that they want, but they don't want to do that hard yards themselves or if they're doing it from afar, they might not understand what that charity is here in New Zealand. And I just add to that that we work really carefully with each donor to set their strategic vision. So it's not a matter of going and looking at 27,000 charities, really. It's actually sitting down to that donor or that company and saying, OK, what change do you want to see in the world? Because that's really what charitable giving is about. You know, what is the change they'd like to see? What is the issues that they're passionate about? We hone it down into categories and groups. And then we do, like Tessa said, the research, but actually getting the first stage done is probably the most important piece because then you know what you're looking for. And we do connect with a lot of other philanthropic donors so we can get intelligence and research on different charitable entities that are doing good work as well. Good point. I love that about your right because people will have areas that they're interested in. So setting the first thing is sitting down and deciding and having that strategy and plan with them. Because there's actually now financial advisers out that are focusing purely in this area where they will give you a lifetime sort of plan of being able to give. So even if it's only $40 a fortnight out of your pay, but they can work that out with your current salary, your current lifestyle and financial, they can actually look to see how much money you could potentially give for the rest of your life going into retirement. So that you don't actually leave perhaps with a whole lot of money sitting there that could have been given to people in need throughout the whole time. So it's really good to see there's a few more of those popping up. I love it. Yeah and we work with quite a few of those. There's some really interesting ones out there who are focusing on that. I love that too because it's something people don't always think about and maybe we should reframe how we think about wealth in that way like perhaps the idea of leaving when you're gone and leaving all this wealth behind is a bad idea if you decided something interesting to do with it during your lifetime and actually made some good with it, maybe we should think of it in that way. Yeah because you'd see the benefits of what you're giving and that might give you more pleasure in life too, right? Make sure you're happy too because you're seeing it being given. So just for those that have joined us, we've just had a presentation from Tessa on the gift trust. If you have any questions, feel free to pipe up before we shift to the gift collective. No, good. Okay team. Okay, so Cheryl, if you take us away on the gift collective. Sure. Kia ora koutou for those who joined us a bit late. I'm Cheryl Spain. I am the executive director of the gift trust and I'm talking today about our side entity, the gift collective, but just to give you a brief overview of why we decided to do this. The gift trust itself has been around for actually around 10 years and we very much focus, as Tessa said, on providing efficiencies in the donation and philanthropy sector. So what we're about as well as what Tessa said is actually helping people to do things really efficiently and with as low cost as possible, but also in a very tailored sort of way. So we work mostly with quite high net worth donors, people that give reasonably large sums to charitable causes. And so we're all about making things easy and providing that great sort of back-end, I suppose, administration and due diligence. And because we've been running this initiative for some time, we get approached on the other side of things, of course, by charitable entities who are interested in receiving funds. And along the way, we started seeing a need, really, and a niche for... There's a lot of new charitable initiatives that are getting set up. There's a lot of wonderful ideas that people have, including people in the EHF community for new amazing projects which would be charitable. But to get... To go through all the hoops in Aotearoa, New Zealand of getting charitable status and allowing donors to get their tax credits when they give to that charitable entity is quite a process. And it's quite a burden for a lot of organisations or just people who are setting up these initiatives if they've never done it before. And so we started having conversations, particularly with our partner on this new initiative, and I'll tell you about them in a second. And we decided, basically, there was a need in New Zealand for what tends to be called a fiscal host. In some places, it's called auspicing. In some places, it's called fund-holding. But essentially, what it is, is a place or a home for an entity or an organisation to sit under when they are setting up as a new, often a new charitable initiative without having to go down that road of setting up as their own registered charity. So what the Gift Collective, which is our new entity provides, is basically a home for these initiatives. They sit under our umbrella. They use our charitable status. We obviously have to do all the due diligence and checking because that's quite a high risk thing for us to do to make sure this thing is genuinely charitable. And they basically have funds sitting in us. We hold them for them. And donors can give to the Gift Collective and they can get their tax receipts. They can get their tax credit. And the charitable initiative can get on with what they do best, which is their amazing work. And they don't have to worry about their administration and their compliance. So that in a nutshell is what the Gift Collective is. But I should say that it's a partnership project. And I'm actually speaking today, really, I shouldn't be here, because our wonderful partner, Alana Irving, who runs the Open Collective and Biznie Hf Fellow was supposed to do this slot, but she is busy doing much more important work looking after a one in a three-year-old at home. So she couldn't make it today. So Alana essentially talked to us around setting up this partnership. Alana happens to be a trustee of the Gift Trust, so we know her really well. And Alana's day job is running Open Collective New Zealand. So what the Gift Trust and Open Collective have done is we've come together, we've formed this partnership and we've launched this new initiative, the Gift Collective, into the world. Open Collective provides the software platform and the tech, essentially, behind what we do. And the Gift Trust provides the charitable umbrella. And so you can see what we've done is we've just smushed our names together and called it the Gift Collective. So I hope I've explained that well, it's a little bit confusing. There's lots of words that cross over. I am just going to share my screen quickly if that's all right, because I would like to show you what a page looks like on the Gift Collective platform. This is just our sort of sign-up page on the Gift Collective. So people come here, it's all done online. You can simply click this Apply Now button and you fill in a very super simple form about what your collective is hoping to do, how you're hoping to spend money and you send us some links and we assess it and decide if it can sit under our umbrella as various terms and conditions on there. But what I actually want to show you is a couple of live collective pages. So this is one, and these are all publicly available. So when an initiative signs up under the Gift Collective, they get their own page on the site. They can brand this however they like. They can put their logo on. They can write a little piece about what they do, which you can see down here at the bottom. This is called the Christ Church Initiative. This is an amazing initiative following on from the Christ Church Territax to bring different groups together actually and learn from each other, different religions and different groups. So what the initiative gets under the Gift Collective is a page like this and it's essentially what I like to think of it as it's like having a crowdfunding website, and a financial package, kind of all in one. So as you scroll down their web page, you can see they've set up these little buttons and they decide what information goes in here. And this allows people to go and make donations to the Christ Church Initiative. They can click on these buttons and make a donation, and then they get a tax receipt, which comes from us, but it will say it's for the Christ Church Initiative project. Then as you scroll down, people can be named if they want to. Donate to this project or they can stay anonymous so you get a list of all who their contributors are. And then they have a totally public, this is all publicly available, information on how the budget is being spent or where the donations have been received from. So this is a really new initiative and so at the moment they're just receiving donations. They haven't got any expenses on here. I'll show you one that does have expenses shortly. And then there's an about section and they have some sort of team people at the bottom. So that's an example of a page. I'm going to show you Tewaewaka next, which is a te ao Māori group which is looking at restoring the whenua, the land in Aotearoa through traditional health and traditional medicine practices. I just wanted to show you there one. This is a little different. They have some donation buttons, but what you can see interestingly, is that they have a financial section. And again, you can anonymise parts of this if the entity doesn't want sections to be seen by the public, they can. But this basically is an incredible tool that allows Tewaewaka to track, to receive donations and then all the donors can go in here and see how those donations are spent. So they can actually see what Tewaewaka is spending all of these things on, what they've been doing. They ran a hui, they put some catering in, they had to do some strategic branding for their hui and various other things. So it's a really amazing tool just to allow an initiative to share with their donor community what they are spending funds on as well. I'll just stop sharing that page now and come back. So the gift collective does allow a sense of transparency. It allows charitable initiatives to get up and running quickly, easily. It allows donors to give with confidence because they can see where the money is being spent. And it just allows a simple tool really for charitable initiatives to do their good work. We're being very careful, we have to be very careful about it because obviously we don't want to become a sort of pseudo-charities regulator and that is not what we're designed to do. We're really designed, the target I suppose for these types of initiatives is generally speaking newly forming and possibly smaller initiatives because of course when an initiative gets bigger perhaps it gets staff it's actually able to hold its own. We would envisage that they would probably then set up themselves as their own entity and funds can just be transferred to that initiative. So that's the other beauty of the gift collective is it's not a forever home. It can be a temporary thing as long as wherever we're transferring funds to is in and of itself a charitable entity. We can do that down the track. So it allows total flexibility and we're really excited about it. It's the first kind of its kind in New Zealand and really what's happened in the past for organisations that want to set up like this is they've just had to go around and track down perhaps another charity that may be doing similar things and ask if they could sit under their umbrella and no one has any rules for this type of stuff. So we're involved while Alana is involved in putting together something called a funding white paper which is really looking at the policy in New Zealand behind all of these things and how best practice works and what we should all do. So the gift collective is part of that process as well. So that's it. I'm happy to answer any questions. That was really good actually. I love seeing all the examples that come alive a lot more. Do we have any questions from the four? I have no idea. I have no idea and I don't have a charity and I don't plan to have one but I kind of want to understand why as a charity. So I have two questions. One, why as a charity I will go through the gift collective and not like regular fundraising if at the end of the day I will supposed to receive the money and then the other one is like why as a donor I will want to do it through that way and I guess it's about tax but I would like to have that like clearly. Sure. Great question. So from the charity's perspective let's say you're setting up a charity, Perla and what you would want to do if you wanted to do any form of fundraising essentially if you want to do it properly you really do need to become a registered charity in New Zealand or sit under another registered charity's umbrella and that's because you could go off and do fundraising those donors are not going to get any tax relief if you do that though if you're just out there fundraising for a project that isn't registered A, they won't get the tax relief but also B, a lot of donors don't like to give to a project like that because it doesn't give them a lot of reassurance that it's a legitimate project donors are quite savvy these days in New Zealand and I do find that people are asking that question you can't just, I mean that's why we have regulations you can't just go and set up a charity willy nilly and decide that it's a charity so there's a lot of reasons why people do that but the process to set up as a charity in New Zealand is pretty involved and convoluted and it can take I think at the moment between sort of six to twelve months it depends what you do so you have to get a lawyer involved you have to write a constitution that's approved by a lawyer then you have to submit it to the Government Department which looks after charity regulation, DIA they'll often have questions and they'll come back and then it gets approved and it's within charity services there's quite a lot of processes to go through and for some organisations that are volunteer run they're run on the side they just don't have the capacity or the time or the knowledge to do that stuff so that's really why we're offering this service it's to allow people to set up as a charity legitimately and effectively and know that there's oversight and know that there's an entity that has done all that oversight but they don't have to do it themselves so we're just providing that efficiency on the donor side I think donors would like to do it this way because again they just have that reassurance that somebody else has looked at it and it's not just some random idea of somebody's that's decided that it's a charity does that make sense? Yep, good, that's great, thanks this is a technical question does it integrate with accounting packages and other software so that it's all seamless and also with CRMs and that so that you can send out to your database if you're a charity? Yeah and you have asked me the technical question and Alana is really the expert on the technical side so I'll do my best well we run all the accounting for all the projects all the projects sit under so we use zero and this package integrates with our zero so all the accounting is essentially done through the gift trust that's one of the beauties of it to have their own accounting expenses through the platform it's super easy for them to do and they don't really need to do much else so I haven't yet come across a collective that's set up and then also wants to have their own accounting package I think they probably wouldn't need it but I could come back and ask Alana that question there is definitely a way so in terms of the CRM and communicating with supporters and donors it has a really nice little mechanism and built where you can send out newsletters you can write little updates about your project and send them out to all the supporters that have donated to your project so far so it allows you to do all of that as well yeah it's pretty cool it has a lot of sort of mechanisms built in but Alana is the expert on that Alana is an EHF fellow so if people have further questions I'm sure she'd be really happy to answer those Thank you Do we have any questions or comments or thoughts from anyone in the room? Thanks Cheryl and Tessa I was just wondering when you talk about the due diligence process that you go through with charities are you able to talk a bit more about that sort of in detail and what you look for? Sure and do you mean on the gift trust and the gift collector side should I just cover both? That would be great Okay so when we're giving out donations from the gift trust, from our donors to charities it's quite a thorough process because oftentimes they're quite large donations as well so we're essentially checking the simple things like is it a registered charity for example and then we're checking things like their finances we'd like to check are they in a good financial state so we're checking things like some simple things such as income versus expenses how much assets they hold but we're also looking at things like are they reliant on one or more sources of funding too much are they got a good spread of funding in place we're also checking for charitable intent essentially is the main legal test that we have to do so is a genuinely charitable project all of the other due diligence steps that we do are really to provide intelligence for the donor so it's not that we're doing this to kind of trip up the charity or to stop the donation going ahead it's to provide a really thorough picture so generally speaking we're here to look at the resources of what the donor wants to do we want to get the funds out to good causes but sometimes we pick up things in a due diligence process that we like to let the donors know about and also that we like to let the charities know about so we've had some really good instances where I've let charities know that they haven't been keeping up with their financial they haven't been putting onto the charities regulator the correct new version of their financial accounts and they didn't even know for example and then they've been able to go out and update it so that other funders can see it sometimes we've let donors know about particular situations with a charity there was one example where a charity was in quite basically was in a really difficult situation where they had lost a key funder recently they had a dwindling source of funding the donor still really wanted to support the charity but what they did was make it a matched gift instead so they encouraged the charity to go out they increased their donation and they made it a matched gift and the charity had a really great reason to go out and seek other donors and they suddenly brought in their donor base so it really helped things so there's some things in due diligence we pick up on that helps so that's essentially the process on the gift trust side on the gift collective side it's much more lightweight because we're really trying to test is this initiative that they want to run charitable and there's not a lot of documentation because they're not set up as an entity yet so it's quite a difficult task actually to do that so there's an application form it involves more of a question and answer process so oftentimes we'll have to go back to the organisation and find out a bit more detail but we're basically trying to find out what are the funds going to be used for and what are they doing and those two things essentially allow us to we're using the charity regulator guidance here in New Zealand to test that and to see whether that fits with the charitable criteria here yep I have a follow up question if that's okay would you would you consider when you are working with the gift trust would you consider the charities that are on the gift collective as potential donor receivers so there's a lot of overlap you can imagine because we run by entities so we have gift trust donors that give to gift collective projects and of course that's easy for us to do because the funds are all managed by us so yeah that's easy and I should have said actually gift trust donors can give to wider than just registered charities or ones that sit in the gift collective we have in the past given to non-registered charities so we can we have to do a bit of extra due diligence we can give to social enterprises on occasion but even there are a number of different legal structures in New Zealand and it's a bit of a grey area but we have given to companies that have a charitable constitution of which there are a few and spiral network is one of those so there's a number of those entities which we can dig deeper into and there's also incorporated societies in New Zealand which is a whole different legal structure which we can generally speaking give to those some of those are not charitable registered charities as well so there's quite a few legal complications and Tessa knows all about these having worked in the legal charity space as well That's great so in that way basically a family charity that is not registered and I do choose the gift collective not only for the all the benefits that you mentioned before but it's also because you already have a pool of donors that you can showcase and market and say this is a space let's say education well-being or something all the charity that is not in this massive list of all the charities in New Zealand you can think of that so it's like a great, yeah Yeah it's definitely a side benefit Yeah You've got a question Yes I know for charities there is this there is a lot of ongoing reporting requirements but if you're registered on the gift collective presumably those are less onerous and more designed by yourself what's the difference Well if you want the main advantages of doing a gift collective is the lack of the difference in both the application procedure and the ongoing reporting and I just wondered whether you could give us an inkling of the degree of that difference Yes great question Thanks Janine so yes that is a huge difference essentially we do all the report we do the compliance reporting to the charity regulator as the gift trust so connectives don't do any reporting to the charity regulator at all they're only responsible to us basically the due diligence that we're doing is an ongoing process we do the upfront due diligence I mentioned which is during their application to check what their goals, wishes and aspirations are as an organisation but then for every single expense that we pay out so you can imagine they're receiving donations all the time, we hold them and they sit in their fund and then whenever they want to draw down those donations they basically post onto the site their invoice or their receipt for whatever that expense is and we pay the expenses out each of those so it's quite it is quite admin intensive because we need to make sure that any expenses we're paying are genuinely charitable so it's an ongoing due diligence process we're doing to check that those expenses are charitable and if anything pops up that we think there is an issue with we just discuss it immediately at the time with the charitable entity so there is no there's no annual reporting to charities regulator or anything as a registered charity on the other hand you have to do your annual accounts, we just did ours so I know the process back to front so you do all your annual accounts you upload them to the charities regulator you have to answer a number of questions you have to have a board of trustees legally appointed trustees have to meet a certain number of times a year there's a whole process that you have to go through as a registered charity but because we're already doing that that's what we do so we wanted to be able to share that with others Cheryl, good question Janine do you have any other questions or comments you know I want to make or any points that we haven't raised yet regarding the meeting please will there be another meeting about this public or is this the only we can have Tessa and Cheryl can hold other meetings I'm sure at some particular point if you want to get in touch with them Ellie and we'll also share the recording was there a particular question or thought that you wanted to bring up no thank you okay I'm just conscious time has flown but if we don't have any other questions or comments I'll let you both just have your last parting comment that you want to leave to the audience with for today so we'll start with Tessa how about you yeah sure well thank you I know I've talked with Sarah before and I know many of you are probably involved in really interesting initiatives or you might be if you're listening in you might be interested in giving and thinking about starting off that journey and so I just encourage you to think of the gift trust as an option it's not necessarily the option for everyone setting up your own philanthropic trust can be a good option for really really large amounts of giving but I would encourage you to just get in touch with Cheryl and look at this as an option and more broadly to ensure that New Zealand's charitable sector can thrive just being part of that sector in some way or another is a good thing I agree thanks Tessa Cheryl Thank you for having us we've been long-term friends of the EHF network really I would describe the gift trust so it's nice to actually do this session finally and we know so many people in the network so I suppose I would just finish by saying do spread the word I guess what I'm really passionate about is that charities should be out there doing the amazing work that they do and making the changes to society that we so desperately need and there are so many inefficiencies in organisations having to do some of the back-end administration compliance and also likewise donors you know for them same thing you know setting up their own charitable entity and getting paying for lawyers and accountants and all of that stuff it all seems so inefficient so we're just on a mission really to try and help with all of those things we're a small but mighty team and we're very keen to help organisations get over those hurdles so please spread the word and get in touch and we're always happy to have a chat conversation with people likewise Alana Irving who's in the EHF network is also available for chats as well thank you thanks Cheryl and thanks Tessa great conversation and lots of takeaways today key things for me was yes, financial planning of being able to give for the rest of your life is actually a thing and it's a great and there's no excuse not to be able to give even if it's only like $10, $1 whatever you can actually do that out of your pay pack fortnightly monthly however you get your income and that there is just so many different choices of charities and people to give to and you can actually have a good strategy lined up for you at the beginning which I think is great so that the people who are working behind can actually know how to spend your money on your behalf which I think is good so you don't actually have to do all the hard work and also about the tax release so anywhere in the world that we learn today so it's not a hard thing and there's no excuse to have to give and in these times I actually think it's good to get to the four so that the charities can continue doing the work that they do and all the back end stuff is done for them so they're not having to spend all the time doing the fundraising and try to find out where the next dollar is coming from so thank you both for your time and I hopefully this reaches a lot of the fellows going forward Te Nakue, have a great day