 Good morning everybody on today's agenda. We have our usual hackfest planning discussion and then we have some quarterly updates to get through. So we have a Roja followed by Composer next week is NB and then for the working groups, did we get the healthcare working group in? Let me check quickly, see if that came in overnight. No, nothing yet, unfortunately. So we'll have to defer that one and then we have a proposal for a public sector working group to go through. So anybody else have any other items for today's agenda? Okay, if not, Todd, you can kick it off with hackfest. Yeah, just the same quick reminder is June 27th to 29th hackfest in Amsterdam. In the coming weeks, let's start pulling together agenda for that. I think a little more structure is one of the things people would like to see within that and just some advanced topics. Beyond that, October 3rd and 4th, Montreal, we'll be the next one. We'll get Reg Page booted up for that soon. Otherwise, nothing else in the short term from my view. Okay. So just one quick comment on the agenda. I think it could be clear on the fact that the first day is this introduction day where we kind of expect newbies to come. Is it still on the registration page or where would you like that noted? On the agenda. Okay. Okay, noted. Somebody needs to go on mute. Okay, thanks Todd. All right, so first up is Roja. Who is on from a Roja to present? Yeah, it is me, okay. So we have pretty nice results on the April and March. So we actually have a best release in the end of March and we have client libraries for Java, Python and C++, yeah. And also we have made a documentation that's available in English and also Japanese. And I think there is some open source updates from community that even translate some Korean, not sure. Also we have improved the deployment based on Ansible we also have fixes for stability and the performance overall. So basically we have pretty poor performance when we just scoping stuff and all the things makes the performance really bad. So we fix and towards that month and the following, I think we are going to and that thing. And also we have made some kind of framework. It's internal and it's helped us to write more integration tests. So we have written about like, I don't know, maybe for now it's like 100 tests even more. Also as after the release we have made a Node.js library, we've made GRPC streaming KPI, some optimization as I said. And also we have problems with the bug and the two of them have been reported. So I just was interrupted by this meeting to say about IROFA. So I just going to merge it after the meeting. So and the second one is actually is in development state. So basically it's not really a bug in terms of production version. So if you have any question, I would like to answer that. Any questions? Just a question, just to give you the stage. Do you have any plans to integrate with other projects? I know it's difficult and I know that some other organizations are putting in a lot of effort and resources, but is there anything like plans in the coming quarter or two to do more stuff with, I don't know, just trying, like the EVM or some identity or something that may work or others can contribute to. If you want to engage community, just a question. So you mean like some new features or other improvements? Well, I'm mainly asking if, like, as they review, is there any plan or if somebody wants to join the project and help either on new features or on some integrations with other projects? Do you have something like that in mind? Is it still on track? Or did you're just wondering, right? Because we have a lot of projects and many moving parts, which is just wondering where you are on that thinking. Like, did you approach the project? I'm not that familiar, to be honest. Like, this is the least familiar project that I'm less involved with this project than the rest of all other projects personally. So I'm just asking, did you have any plan or do you have any plan or do you think, like, knowing enough kind of the technical parts in the market, do you think there's something on the roadmap that can be integrated with your project? Do you need help? Will all the projects be able to integrate with you? Does anything like that make sense now? Is it too early? I'm just, just, it's a very broad question I know. Just want to give you enough space for that. So I'm not sure about the, let's say, official version, but I think I have something in my mind. So we have definitely plans, some, as I said, focusing on stability and security and the things that it can be basically guaranteed to be used in production, definitely not fail, some kind of fails. So some, sorry, yeah. I'm just in a loud place. So I'm trying to mute myself in between questions and answers. So is there any project that will be, like, will it make sense? I'm just throwing it. I'm not trying, it's not a true question, right? Does it make sense to integrate composer with the wrong thing or some identity or public CA or something like, I don't know, sort of the EVM that we have with Voro? Is it something, it can be like in a year's time. I don't mind. I just want to understand if, do you need something to, as somebody will accelerate or help you integrate with other things or do you feel that you are self-contained? Like you have your identity piece, you have the permissioning piece, you have the ledger piece and you don't, does it make any sense to integrate with others? Is this what I'm asking? Yeah, I think we have kind of missing the integration between the other projects in hyperledger, like composer or, I'm not sure they do that in the other one, but composer is most suitable. Okay, okay. Blokenev, Laura, will that be useful for you or not so much? Yes, definitely, it doesn't have tools for exploring the bugs, actually, no. Okay, all right, thank you. That was my only question. Cheers. Hi, this is Dan from the CSP. Can you hear me? Yep. Hello? We can hear you. Okay. Sorry, I had a little confusion with the mute buttons earlier. So I missed the name of the presenter for Iroha, so I apologize for that, but I'd like to hear from you how you feel your community interaction is going with the rest of the hyperledger community. Good question. I think we have kind of diversity of tools, of find interaction for communication. So beside the, let's say, official rocket chat, we also use Telegram and we also use Gitter and maybe something else. So maybe we have missing because of the such of number of chats, we may miss something on the rocket chat. So we kind of interested, let's say, I would say in maybe breaching these chats, so it might be possible to communicate and doesn't spend time on these. On the switching between them. So and for the direct interaction for hyperledger, I think it's okay. We basically have mailing mostly and probably in hyperledger as well, in hyperledger or rocket chat as well. So did I answer your question? Yeah, I think my recommendation to you if you wanted to make more progress on your integration with the hyperledger community would be to shut down your other chat platforms and transition all of those users to chat.hyperledger.org. And then you would have all the conversations in a single place and it would be part of that official hyperledger communication platform. Chat is just one aspect though of being involved with the community. How do you feel other aspects of being part of the community are working out for the IdoHAB project? Things like hack fests, this TSC meeting, for example, other things? Well, actually, this TSC meeting is the first one for me actually. And for the hack fests, I'm not really in it. So maybe some other guys may answer that I have no idea what was happening there or going to happen there. So I am actually once participated in hackathon and just say a few words that we have Iroha and the guys actually implemented. So it was pretty easy, at least with my help. I would say that people pretty like the solution in terms of interaction with it. I also have some positive comments in all of the chats. I think mostly in Telegram. Yeah, I think that is it. Okay, thanks. And then I guess my last question is on your maintainer diversity and contributor diversity. How do you feel that those are trending and do you have any challenges there? Yeah, definitely. So for the previous year and for the small part of the new year, there's definitely increasing number of new contributors. And from Brittany, for the last few months, I think have contributed something helpful, really helpful. So actually I just found a tutorial for the Iroha that just random guy have written. And also we have got a tutorial for the mobile application like installing all the environment and setting things up. And maybe we lack the some deep technical comments in the project itself. So as long as the code base is pretty hard to understand by the usual contributor or open source contributor, it's really hard to make some fixes. So the comments to the direct comments to the code base are actually pretty, let's say, pretty simple and doesn't include much help for maintainers actually. That might be a problem. Okay. What kind of things do you do to try to attract contributors? Well, I think we publish issues pretty rarely that can be done easily in a matter of hours, maybe. I think... So people often open issues and we also try to support them to solve it by their own. So we are trying to help the guys who already open the issues. Can we help you in any way? Like acquire more people, get more maintainers. Assuming that you are going to move back to the hyper leather chat. Do you need anything from the TSC for many of our members, our maintainers, any projects or conditions? Well, I would say that some help can be... There is some need for help. But I'm not sure how exactly the community can help in solving the task of inviting of contributors. Okay. Among the different priorities that you have on the EROHA project, where would you say that contributor diversity falls? Contributor diversity falls? Where in your priorities is contributor diversity? If you had to rank the things that you're working on, is the main thing maybe bug fixing or some feature that's blocking your 1.0 or... I'm just kind of curious, what level of importance that is for your project? Importance of the contributors. Well, it's hard to understand. I think it's hard to realize, but I think it is pretty important to maintain a good community around. So maintainers cannot help all of the people, but people can help the other ones. So this diversity may help in terms of the communication between the people who are interested in the project. And in terms of fixing bugs or contributing new features, well, I don't really know, actually. I don't really know. Okay. I think it's important from the Hyperledger governance perspective that we have as diverse as possible a set not just of contributors on each project, but also of maintainers. The maintainers right now for Iroha, would you characterize those as predominantly from Sotomitsu? Well, it's not really changed. I think yes. Okay. So beyond just regular contributors, I think something that would be important for the health of your project is to work on the maintainer diversity. And I think that the way that's been discussed before is our goal there is that if any one company leaves a project, you don't want the project to die. So the more companies that you have involved there, the more active contributors that you have involved, you're less susceptible to a single failure, kind of a project fault tolerance, if you will. Yeah, indeed. Good advice. Thanks. Broadcast to the team. Thank you. My last question. Sorry, who am I talking to? So it's not my call. It's again, Nikolai. I don't know who is like talking on behalf of the project. It's just for the summary and the record. I didn't get your name. Sorry. My name is Eugene. I think you just type in the chat. I'm sorry. I mean, I'm in New York, which is a zoo. So every time I am here, it breaks loose. So thank you. Yeah. So I guess I would throw, this is my guy, throw one more thing in there. And I think we're kind of happy to work with you. I know that in the architecture working group in particular, I haven't had as much input from the Arora team about the kind of decisions and motivation behind that. If the problem there is a timing one, I know we've been open to moving the times around. I don't believe Rahm's heard back on a suggestion from anyone from the Arora team about how we could get a better engagement from you on that. But I know we would like to get more of your input on sort of all architectural direction, if that's possible for you to incorporate that into your plan. And for the record, we know it's difficult. We are running a small company as well. And, you know, we understand. So, yeah, that's right. That's how I started, right? Not every company has the same resources. But if you can open up or try to at least show the way for others to join you so that you can improve it with your, not just to conclude this diversity, but the maintenance diversity and the outreach that, and if we can help just like we offered, I think each and every single one of us will be happy to. Yeah. And I think just to kind of reinforce that comment, Jonathan, I think it's right. It's done on, which is it's hard for a small company. We know that. But one of the advantages of this project being a part of Hyperledger is that we can build a community that goes beyond a single company. You know, we should be able to offload. Yeah. Some of that into a more diverse developer community, for example. Yeah, indeed. Thanks for the comments. I think we will think about the way of increasing the number of maintenance from other companies. Thanks. I can just tell you that a lot of companies helped us. It just took me a year to understand that I need to ask for help. It took me a while to realize that. Yeah. I mean, in the big boys kind of game. And it took me a while to realize that I should reach out and ask questions and ask for help and advice and references. And yeah. Yeah. I think you should do that. All right. All right. Anybody else? So, yeah, I would, I would definitely, you know, concur that, you know, we're here. The TSC in particular, but, you know, the community generally to help and, you know, to mixed point, you know, we'd like to get a lot of these projects to the point where we're doing a lot of, you know, a lot more sort of cross project collaboration, but also where we're growing the diversity of committers and maintainers such that even if, you know, a major player walked away, things would still have legs. So anything we can do to help. Let us know. Okay. Next up is composer. Simon, you're on. Hi there. Right. I'll start walking through the project update. I don't know if anyone wants to bring it up on screen. I think. Todd put the link in the chat. In the rocket chat. All right then. So for project health, we've just kept on doing what we've been doing. We've been delivering our weekly releases sometimes on a Monday, sometimes on a Thursday. And I'll put my hands up. We skipped a few given the Easter holidays in the UK. But we asked that still churning out regular releases with fixes or features. So the community can pick them up. We are seeing bug reports come in from the community and we try and turn those around as quickly as possible, as we can. So we're continuing to see a lot, a lot of questions on rocket chat and stack overflow. And whilst we're, and I think I mentioned this on the last TSE call where we discussed composer. We are seeing more people start to contribute. But most of those contributions. At this time are still quite minor around documentation updates. Although last week, we did get something quite big. I'll cover that shortly. We don't have any issues to report to the TSE at this time. As per that meeting previously, we are working towards a 1.0. I would call that an issue. We are, we are progressing the things we've discussed around the legal copyright headers, et cetera. So we're seeing more people start to contribute. But most of those contributions at this time are still quite minor around documentation updates. Copyright headers, et cetera. And also the security scan that was put for May. What have we done in the last quarter? So apart from working with our quite large community and answering all those questions. And we still have two dedicated people in the IBM team answering questions. But we also see, we are also still seeing people that are composer users start to answer questions from other composer users, which is really, really good to see. And we're also seeing discussions at GitHub as well. We released a significant release in the last three months, composer 0.19. And this is the version of composer that we think is significant because we think it's ready for production. I won't go for all of the features here. I think I've discussed them before. Unless there's any particular questions on them. So the big contribution that I mentioned earlier was from Nicola who delivered API key support for the composer rest server, which means you can easily stand up a composer rest server for which we generate a set of restful APIs. And you can specify an API key to use to secure that rest server. And before we either have no authentication or we had authentication with LDAP or OOS 2. But this is a much simpler way to secure your rest server during development or test. And this was a really nice contribution. It included both code and tests, unit tests and integration tests and also documentation. So it was a really complete PR. So it was really good to see that come in. Hopefully we'll start to see them contribute more. That's sort of it. There's no changes to our maintainers since the last update. It's still myself and Caroline from IBM and Dan from Clause and the diversity of the organizations contributing has gone down from the last update, although we have a few more unknown companies contributing. Any questions? Hi, Simon. This is Dan. Hey, Dan. You mentioned something about copyright headers. Yes. So Tracy has been running the phosology scans on our source code. And we dug up a lot of files that don't have copyright headers or license headers rather. That state of file is licensed. So we're having to go through and fix all of those. Okay. I see. Yes. The license headers. Okay. That did remind me though, Brian. I don't know if you're on the call, but I think a little bit off topic, but we still need some clarity on official hyperledger policy for copyright banners at the tops of the files. Yes. Yeah. I have that. That's my next tab to get to. There are several of us who want to see the results of that. Yeah. Okay. Anyway, back back to the composer agenda. Thanks for the update. It was very complete. Thank you. And I gather then that, you know, you're working with Steve and on the facility stuff. And then I don't know if Dave is on or, you know, are we still on track with the security audit? As far as I know, it's still booked for the stop. Yeah. Hey, I'm, I'm here. Sorry. It took me a second there to get to the mute button. Um, yep. Uh, I had a meeting with. Uh, Graham and our new account manager, miles at netitude yesterday. Um, they're still on track. I did some intro emails with Graham and Caroline. Um, my apologies for not including you. Um, but, uh, yeah, everything's good. There, I think we're going to do a meeting later. You know what? We're still trying to figure it out. I think, but yeah, there's going to be a kickoff meeting here pretty quick to get the two of them together or the maintainers together and with Graham to talk about, um, or to do the, the initial kickoff about, um, giving Graham some direction. So yeah, we're on track. Okay. Any other. Hey, Simon. Hello. Hi. This is Tracy. Uh, so a question about the, the comments about the contributor diversity going down. I think in the same way that we asked questions of. Eroha, is there something that we can be doing differently or something that we should be looking at to, to help with the contributor diversity for a composer? Um, if you, if you have great ideas for getting people contributing, um, then I'm all is, um, I, I think we're trying to be as open as possible. Um, Not to, not to repeat myself, but I think we're, we're certainly out there on rocket chat and we are talking to people out there, um, and the same for GitHub. Um, and we're also still running those weekly community calls. Um, but. People just aren't contributing for whatever reason. I think I heard Jonathan mentioned at the start of the call that he had a way to, uh, get lots of people. So, um, I think Jonathan's offering to do some development. Oh, that'd be good. Yeah, that's true. The problem is that people paid us to do some stuff and they won't have to contribute it. That's my only concern here. Yeah. Simon, this is Leonard. Um, I would like to contribute. I just wouldn't be able to write any Javascript code. My code is not all that good. So, uh, your community meeting schedule is up to date. Is that correct? Yes. Yeah, it is up to date. And. Time zones as well. So we, we, Most of the world. Okay. Because I was looking at one point and I see you have a meeting for four, four p.m. New York time. Is that correct? Is it four p.m. No, that'd be fine. Okay. Time. I think we'd be home by then. Okay. So I'll have to update these because that's my concern. I tried joining once and it was just dead air. So, okay. Uh, if it's correct on the wiki, I'll go and have a look again. Thanks. Yeah. It should be nine a.m. UTC and five p.m. UTC. And they alternate different weeks. Okay. Because when I clicked on it, it just added it to appended it to my calendar, but I'll go and have a look again. Thank you very much. Okay. On the lack of JavaScript skills. No, I think it's still possible to contribute to Composer because we have the modeling language which allows you to describe your business network. You could contribute some models as samples on that. That'd be great. I mean, that doesn't require any coding or unit testing. Okay. I look into it. Thank you very much. Bye. Yeah, I would just, I, you know, Go ahead, Tracy. Sorry. Oh, go ahead. I was just going to say again, I think, and this applies to all projects. Um, they were small. Um, that, you know, Contribution does not have to always be code. Um, you know, Documentation is always inadequate in any open source project. Doesn't matter how good it is. It's, it's always inadequate. Um, and samples, as Simon suggested, Are another very effective way of improving documentation, proving consumability of a piece of technology. Uh, but there's documentation, there's CI, right? Improving, you know, the testing. Uh, you know, maybe not writing the, the court code, but maybe you have skills as a, you know, A QA person contributing to testing documentation. And, and, you know, but I, I do think in it, and I have, I agree. I've seen quite a bit of. Sort of end user community. Um, contribution. Both in rocket chat and also in stack overflow for composer. I'm, you know, it's, it's not clear to me why, you know, Uh, people aren't, uh, weighing in. Uh, I, I, I'm a little bit baffled because JavaScript is pretty popular language. And this is obviously an area where, um, I think a lot of people have skills. Um, that aren't necessarily down in the crypto layer and. Acquire deep expertise and PhDs and stuff. Um, and so, uh, again, I think, you know, contributions are welcome and applies across the board, not just composer Roja saw to fabric. Indie. Um, in all shapes and sizes. Uh, I think wonderful. That's a very good thing. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I just had Chris. So my question to, uh, Simon is, can you basically harness the community via survey to see if you can conscript, uh, talented individuals by the community because you do have a, I wouldn't say, um, an urgent need, but a pressing need to get more people on board to contribute. Uh, well, there are many ways. Yeah. There are many approaches you can adopt. That's one of them. Okay. Yeah. We can try and ask the community that we have, um, as to why, why they don't feel like they can contribute or have they thought about things that they might not necessarily have thought about contributing. One thing other communities have done is, um, and I don't know if you've done this, you probably have, um, is take a set of bugs in the issue tracker. Uh, and kind of mark them with like a special tag like bite size, um, which indicate that they are good learning experiences. They're just large enough that it, it's something that encourages people to learn more about the internal architecture of something like composer. Um, but meaningful enough that it would help, you know, close, uh, close something on the path to a 1.0. All right. Um, I don't know if you've got a tag like that in the, in the bug database. Yeah. On our, on our GitHub repository, we have the good first issue label. Um, there's only six open issues at the moment. So maybe we need to find some more, but we could also maybe do a better job of advertising that as a way to start. Yeah. Well, and I was just going to add on to that and suggest that, you know, part of the job of the members of the group is also to market the project. So wherever they're able to do demonstrations or get groups of people or appear, um, coupled with those bug bounties, if you will. Uh, that's a good way to advertise and add, you know, get more activity and more eyes on your project. Yeah. Yeah. I think I, um, Oh, this, this past week, somebody, and I can't remember who it was that had posted in Twitter rights about something, a new feature that we wanted to be worked on in that big volunteer to be a mentor on the composer side. And I really, I really appreciate it. I think that's really helpful for new people coming in is to make sure that there's somebody who's willing to help out, right. And help kind of work through that first process of, uh, you know, contributing. I think it's a scary process. And so, uh, the more that, uh, Mentors can step up, I think is really a good thing. Um, I also wanted to say Leonard, the composer meeting is actually today at noon Eastern, nine AM Pacific, if you're interested in joining. And, uh, I'm kind of someone to agree. I think the composer team, right? By, by having the people in the community starting to answer question, I think that's a really good sign, right? Because that is a form of contribution that is highly overlooked. Right. So when people come in and can answer questions, it gives people, uh, time to work on, on other things, right? They don't have to answer those questions. I think it's, I think there's good things happening. I think I just want to see more, right? It was all I was getting at by my question. So, um, please don't take a sense at the question. Thanks Tracy. Thanks for the confirmation. I'll, I'll sign on at noon. Thank you. All right. Anything else for Simon? Just the, uh, sorry. Yeah, just, it was just occurring to me too that one of the other factors that plays just time. So as, as you're getting users, I think there's, um, there's kind of a delay factor in, in once it takes well to ramp the users. And then once the users are comfortable, then they start contributing. So it, you know, it could be that kind of a groundswell coming behind you. Right. So we don't recall how long you've been in incubation, but it's probably much less than some of the other projects that have larger communities at this point. Yeah, that's true. We've only been around a year, I guess. Um, now we'll just agree. Yeah. It's worth bearing in mind. Okay. Anything else? All right. Thank you very much. Thank you very much. Next up is the public sector working group. Who's Chris, we actually have the healthcare work group. Oh, I'm sorry. Oh, it is there. Okay. It is now. Yeah. So we're good. Okay. I apologize. Um, and who's going to deliver that? This is Nate DeNiro. Hey, Nate. Hello. Morning. Uh, let's see here. So I'm just pulling up the document here. The wiki page rather. So, yeah, the, uh, the. Hyper ledger healthcare working group, uh, is reconstituting itself. Uh, it's, it's interesting to hear, uh, a lot of the recommendations because I can affirm that. When you have a single person or company in, in charge of your role, uh, chairing the group rather, um, when you lose them, uh, the group certainly can lose momentum. So over the past couple of years, you know, we've, we've, uh, uh, gotten things going. Um, and, uh, at the end of last year lost, uh, the person sort of leading the group. So we're reconstituting. Again, we've, uh, elected new board members. Um, and, uh, have run a number of surveys to find out what people are interested in and also collected a list of. About 44, 45 names of people who are ready to contribute. So we're moving through the stage of deciding what it is that we want to build. And also who it is, uh, across other, uh, uh, work groups we need and want to collaborate with. Uh, so that's, that's essentially the stage right at the moment. Okay. So yeah, the overall activity in the past quarter has been largely just that organizing. Uh, reorganizing. Organizing interests. Uh, Discussing with the group. We started a bi-weekly call, uh, for the entire group. And then the leadership group meets usually about once a week. So. Can you, can you describe basically how many people are coming to the, to the calls and participating? Yeah. Yeah. And then say on the calls, we have a good 25, uh, or 30 people every couple of weeks. And then there's, there's definitely interest. Oh, there's definitely interest in, and we did a survey last year, uh, when some folks from gem had been leading the group just to find out where everyone is that. And, uh, we basically did a repeat of that survey to find out where things are this year. And it is interesting to see some progression in some of the areas. Um, I think that's a way of capturing interest because, you know, healthcare healthcare is in terms of an industry, pretty complex and deals with lots of complex data and consent and all kinds of weird stuff. So, um, I've actually been involved in other, uh, open source healthcare communities, the opening of our project. And, uh, a bit with Ocero Vista. And, um, you know, it's healthcare is a tough place to get people to participate. So, um, you know, you know, you know, I've, uh, carried a group of, uh, a core group of people. For a period of time who are itching to do stuff. And, uh, we're just trying to figure out what that is and let them get going. You know, obviously in an organized fashion. So. Also at the, uh, the healthcare working group is really helpful. Um, with the prep for hymns. Um, hyper ledger had a booth at hymns. So, um, we've also had a group of healthcare working group, um, demoing and talking about hyper ledger from our booth. Um, this included, you know, companies that weren't, aren't official sponsoring members of hyper ledger, which is great. Uh, so, and it felt like a good, good coming together of folks there. We've also had a couple of, um, members of the healthcare working group helping, uh, edit some of the, uh, use cases on the wiki. Um, that are healthcare related. Um, and I think that's a good point. Yeah. And that goes to the idea that there's more to contribute than just code. You know, we're, we're actually on the other end of the spectrum where we've got people, you know, uh, a wellspring of people interested to contribute and, uh, no code yet. And that's not, you know, a huge issue. I think we're going to. You know, Ford that over the next, um, you know, several months. And that's one of the questions I had about Oskon planning. Uh, if, if you're not aware of the idea of what hyper ledger is going to be there and what's that kind of presence. Um, but, uh, you know, and then the marketing of things as well for sure, like, um, making people aware of it. I mean, because there's so much confusion around. Blockchain in general. That, um, you know, I'm, I'm, I'm all, I'm regularly educating people on what hyper ledger actually is, as opposed to what they think it is. So. So anyways, um, in terms of diversity, very diverse group. You know, in the States when we talk about healthcare we tend to talk about the American system and forget about the fact that there's other systems elsewhere. You know, certainly in open source that is more of a present issue just because things are different, done differently, different conditions and environments all over the world. So we do have participants all over the world from all over the world and I don't have numbers on gender in terms of diversity but I definitely know that there's a mixture of genders and in healthcare that's important for sure. Something that I know, I know that we want to pay attention to. So that's where things are at. You know, we have another meeting coming up here in the next week and that's the meeting where basically we're going to break out into subgroups and start working on problems. We've also identified some cross-pollination opportunities of course with the identity working group and I can imagine that now hearing about Composer, I wasn't really aware of it but I'm kind of excited about it so I can see us working with them and obviously others as well. Excellent, excellent. So it sounds like things are getting back on track which is good to hear. Yeah, I think so. I think there's actually frustration within the group that we're not more formed and people are actually contributing code and or other contributions. So this is Arnold speaking. I find it interesting that you know it seems like the group is there is a lot of interest and yet they seem to be struggling a little bit defining what they want to achieve and you know we have had discussions to better structure working groups and the way they are being proposed and we have one coming up with the public work group and you know I wonder if it would be a useful exercise for you guys to look at the template we are now using and we are just going to discuss one I hope we have time and to see if you guys could develop your own kind of charter type of thing to maybe it would help frame the discussion. Yeah I think it's well it's it's a couple things right it's that that thing I mentioned at the top of having a diversity in the group and a diversity of leadership so that's what we're trying to establish right now but then in terms of how we function you know I've been asking that question if there's any standard sort of framework that the groups within Hyperledger operate under so we'll take that sounds like there is and take a look at that ahead of our next meeting as well and add that to the agenda so we can we can talk about that because it's you know any any tools like that that help us organize because as as everyone's pointed out we all either run for small or big you know we all have jobs in addition generally but uh if we're not you know working for for Linux foundation yeah so speaking of which Brian do you have anybody from the staff involved in the working group that can help guide the group oh there is yeah that's happening I would not say that that's not happening all right very good thank you hey any other questions Nate uh I have no questions just gonna say on the coding projects there's there's kind of a concept of a duocracy and so you can you can also take that within the the working groups that if there's specific agenda that you want to move forward just by doing it it's more likely to get done and trying to um kind of sense everybody's interests and everybody kind of sits around the table looking into each other waiting for somebody to move some something that I would see of of big value coming out of the working group would be a will uh or completely written use case so staying away from the how uh let the the technical teams figure out how they would go about implementing it but just having something that's more or less ratified by health care concerns to say that here's an unmet need in the industry and the aspects of of the what and the why and then leaving it to the the technical groups to figure out how to satisfy that would be be something that would be a pretty big outcome from a working group it's um actually uh I guess I didn't list list that uh but that is that's basically what we've spent the quarter doing in the large part you know through the surveys and the meetings and just can't canvassing interest we agreed and arrived at uh you know our own small framework of use cases and that's the that's the next step uh you know as everyone organizes into uh subgroups and identifies what type of work product they want to contribute um the first step is those use cases so you know as you point out that's that's right exactly where we're at that point excellent I'm on mute I'm just gonna say okay thanks Nate yeah um next up is the proposal for the public sector working group but we have seven minutes left who's pitching us hey it's it's you know Marta and myself um but I'll just jump in and say um we we wouldn't really ever want to drop a proposal on this group it's just one day to read it um so I didn't want to call for a vote this time but you know now that we have a template in place um there's a couple of working groups I think we'd like to propose um and uh first we thought we'd start with uh one that tries to bring together a lot of the folks we've talked to in government who are pretty hands-on pretty technical and and really interested in hyper ledger um and uh and so rather than call it the government working group because the term is a little um uh the term government is over overloaded a bit plus there's a lot of private sector companies that engage on government related projects um we thought a better name for it would be the public sector working group um I the only challenge is that there's also a performance and scalability working group um so uh PSWG might be become overloaded too but um I think it was worth it anyways uh and so this is our kind of first draft of trying to map to the template but also kind of the flow for format for it for these and so I just we would just want to draw people's attention to it to think about it over the next week and then maybe we could vote on it next week um but if anyone felt that you know if the TSC felt it was solid enough now and wanted to approve it that would be great too so are there any questions about kind of the intent or or the goals or comments on what people have read so far I'm sorry I'm still digesting it any questions for people I mean does anybody have any questions or comments for Brian or Marta? I've had a look at it I think it's a very good framework so Marta, Brian and the team they put together that's a wonderful start because it basically compiles a list of many interesting companies all wanting to collaborate and work together in that space so very exciting I think public sector needs that approach so a good first day so thanks and well done I wanted to thank everyone who reached out to me privately after publishing on TSC mailing lists and asked me to join put them on the mailing list if the working group gets formed and I will put you on that mailing list definitely we are going to Dubai with Brian next week to the Global Blockchain Summit so we will be also meeting their people from the government sector and smart Dubai and everyone's very very excited knowing that Hyperledger is working with a lot of government entities and enterprises that want to work on that so I know that there is a lot of interest but obviously we've been working very hard not to launch it too soon and make sure that everything's running smoothly and there are no glitches there. Does anybody have a need to further review this? I mean I'm hearing a lot of very positive things and from my perspective it looks good. I was going to jump in real quick Chris this is Dave Huesby, Marta and Brian I guess the Vegas Meetup Group will merge our code base in with the public sector one because we've been working on a pilot proof of concept to track marriage licenses and and efficiency in the greater Las Vegas area for the Clark County clerk so that would be public sector I guess that's some code we can get in there and start bootstrapping around that. Would you see this be inclusive of impact business or social or impact focused? Probably not. I mean I know there's gray area in overlap I think though there's a lot of social impact businesses that aren't really related to the public sector and I think I might even merit a separate working group or you know it's one thing we've wrestled with right there's a lot of social impact applications in health care or in Fincer so I think the design of these you know the scope of these working groups is something we're going to be careful just to help help it be clear you know that there's when there's they're trying to avoid overlap where people feel like they have to be on five different working groups because they're not well defined. Yeah no I was thinking about it because I was talking to someone at Consensus yesterday in the social impact space and she felt like Hyperledger was competitive with Consensus and so I'm wondering that's why I see Sovereign on there and I'm I wouldn't I don't think that's necessarily true that perception so that's why I'm asking. Yeah we're a big tent. I know exactly. So I think that one of the good ideas would be to actually work with Consensus and invite them to collaborate with us within that group I wouldn't be opposed to that. That's what I was going to suggest Marta. Hey so I got a I have a couple of questions so when just in looking through this trying to figure out and sorry for the bird the is the focus on usages on Prusa Concepts Pilots or is there also a role for informed policy coming out of this? I'm having a hard time figuring out what the sort of main emphasis is. Well as I hope this reflected well in the description it's about Canvas basically mapping the landscape trying to figure out what are the good ideas or the good projects what are people doing be kind of supportive to each member in terms of hey how do we figure out how to do this we definitely want to stay away from anything that looks or smells like lobbying and if there is something about hey what should a government's regulatory policy be about you know recognizing the legitimacy of smart contracts is legal contracts that's that's something we would stay away from I think this is more about hey we're building an ID system. Okay okay because that's different I there is there is also a need though I don't know that it needs to come out of this organization there's also a need for some representation for technical expertise on government policy as well I know we've we've seen that issue come up several times and you know if we can establish sort of a reputation and again this is this is where it's going to cross the you know be very close to that fine line between don't become a lobbyist but is there a way or is it would be appropriate for this organization to sort of become experts that would be represented and respected as the experts for advice in informing policy. Yeah not not on this working group for sure because I got it and it sounds like what you're talking about is sort of pre-work that might lead into that but we're not there yet. Well but this is also about the the mechanics of building stuff you know or the you know. I think we're hitting into the next meeting here. All right sorry. Yeah and so let's take this discussion to the mailing list and we'll bring it back up for consideration next week so thanks everybody and thank you. Thank you. Bye bye. Thank you. Bye bye. Thanks everyone have a good day. Bye. Bye.