 It's really my great pleasure tonight to have, as our guest speaker, President Paul Kagame from Rwanda. I would like to thank him for two reasons. The first one is practical, I think it was not easy for him to be here tonight. He had to reschedule some of his activities and I am very grateful to him for that. But the fundamental reason why I feel honored to have President Kagame tonight is that I think I'm sure I'm convinced that he's one of the greatest leaders today in Africa. He, after a very bloody war, he was able not only to reconcile the population of the country, but as I understand it, to help creating a real nation, which is not obvious, as in many other states in Africa, the concept of nation is not easy to exist because of just the division of Africa into borders inherited from the colonial times. So after the bloody war of the 90s, President Kagame was able to build a nation, not only to reconcile people, but to build a nation. And since then, he has transformed the state into a modeled state and which is very often compared to the Singapore of Africa. Of course, I would say Singapore with better climate, as I understand it. So Mr. President, I thank you very much again. I'm going to invite you to come here. You are going to make a short presentation. And after that, we will have a short also discussion, the two of us. And I will open the floor to a general discussion. Mr. President, the floor is yours. Dr. Fieri de Montbriere, founder and chairman of the World Policy Conference, Excellencies here present, ministers, senior officials, distinguished ladies and gentlemen. I thank Theody for the kind introduction and for the invitation. I also congratulate you and your team for the distinctive quality of the World Policy Conference. This is a forum focused on anticipating and shaping the future, rather than trying to hold back change. That perspective is refreshing for those of us who experience the world from somewhere in the middle, not one of the poles. So I'm very happy to be back to continue the productive conversation. Started eight years ago, when Thierry was kind enough also like today to host me in Paris. Tonight I would much rather talk with you than at you, and we all know dinner is also waiting. So let me make two simple but topical points. The first is that Africa is nobody's prize to win or lose, not at all. It is our responsibility as Africans to take charge of our own interests and to develop our continent to its full potential. In fact, this has always been the main issue. We have been waiting far too long, actually for centuries, trade, ships, a nation's economy in powerful ways. The search for comparative advantage generally leads to gains in competitiveness and wealth. That's why at a certain point, the concept of aid for trade gained currency. The issue was to build a country's trade capacity so that it could transition from dependency to self-reliance and eventually to prosperity. This should have been the approach all along. Today Africa enjoys strong trade relations around the globe, whether with Europe, India, North America, or China. Indeed, we want more investment and trade with everybody because it leaves us all better off. That's why coming together as a region has been so important for Africa. Internal barriers to travel and commerce in Africa continue to fall, though more still needs to be done. For example, Sierra Leone is the most recent country to announce visa on arrival for fellow Africans, joining around 15 others. However, that is still less than one-third of Africa. The African continent of free trade area is now in force and trading will commence in July 2020. This agreement will radically reshape how Africa does business with itself and with the rest of the world. The revitalization of the African Union Peace Fund, which now stands at more than $125 million, has enhanced the credibility of Africa's security partnerships, and it should continue to grow. The second point concerns the tone of anxiety and defeatism that dominates current policy debates. Overall, it's about the fear of losing something rather than the ambition to do more and better. Even science and technology, the very engines of human progress, are increasingly seen as problematic. For example, with artificial intelligence or genetically modified crop. From there, it's a short step to the false belief that preserving a high standard of living in one place depends on preventing others from getting to the same level. Barriers go up, trust vanishes. If I may take the liberty of generalizing, this pessimism does not resonate in Africa. There is a determination to live better lives for ourselves. We have already seen evidence of tremendous advances, particularly in health, connectivity, governance and incomes. Recovering that sense of hope and optimism, wherever it has been lost, is very critical. We can be better partners. Being all of us here and beyond working together, that's what will get us back on track toward a better world where everyone benefits. Once again, I thank the World Policy Conference for this wonderful evening and thank you all for your kind attention and interest. I look forward to our continued discussion. Thank you very much, Mr. President. So we are going to start the discussion and then we'll ask you two questions and after those two questions we will take interventions from the participants and members. My first question will be about Rwanda itself. It is very simple, just very simple to ask, not to answer. To what extent is the Rwandan model exportable to other African countries? Rwanda is almost everything work in progress. We are still in a number of things, still experimenting, but some progress has been made. Now in terms of that being a model, I suppose relates to what has worked even in the worst of circumstances or the diversity we have faced has been so challenging. Therefore the model we have applied can apply in other places depending on demonstration of where we have come from, what challenge we have addressed, and the outcomes. Now, therefore it's not the overall model that is going, but except if you pick a few pieces. One piece I have in mind is the model is going to work because it builds on putting people at the center of addressing the problems and involving them and from there move forward. The second piece is if you can change people's mindset, for example in our case what we try to do as, and this is practically a discussion with everybody or people in our society. We would go to every part of our country, we have a conversation with our people and tell them that much as we have a lot of problems, there is a lot in them that they can bring out to meet these challenges and address them. So we are telling people that we have been telling people along that you can't sit back and wait that people will come and help. Yes, many times people have come and helped, absolutely, but why wait for people to come and help? Even on the things you can do yourself, this is what we have been trying to plant in the minds of our people. This is what I am talking about in terms of mindset, because apart from other problems we found there was also this mentality that people are poor, they know this, they know that, so some people who have more will bring what they need, they will bring medicines, they will bring food. We found actually in the country about 45% of our food needs were coming from outside as donations, and we said no, but we can grow food to feed ourselves, and let's do it. Then we started moving forward. So the model can work anywhere. Not everything is going to work for everybody or everywhere, but overall the conceptual aspect, the philosophy behind it can apply in any situation in Africa or beyond. It's about saying we can do it. What we can't do, then we can rely on friends or partners and we still can move forward until over time we are able to actually do what we were not able to do before. So I think it can work, and for us we don't have in mind anything else that would have changed our situation unless we involved ourselves, sort partnerships, sort systems, but always knowing that this is our responsibility. A footnote to the same question, have you yourself been inspired by the experience of Lee Kuan Yew of Singapore? When we started off with our liberation struggle and the challenges we faced even during and after, we did not even think about that. But as we started rebuilding, we started looking all around us, whether in Africa or beyond. And particularly we did look at the case of Singapore. Because some of the things we have done have come from us, many other things have been lessons learned from others, how they address their problems at one time or another with the kinds of problems and the approaches they made and so that we can also find something in our own. So it was at a later stage, let's say 95, 96, on the margins when that was ending, that is when we started looking around to say, what is it that is going to help us overcome these insurmountable, at that time they looked so, challenges. So the Singapore case was very appealing, it was the case of Singapore, mainly it was the case of South Korea and we looked around. In fact, we looked around for not only development models, but also governance models. In fact, our constitution is built on patching up ideas from one place. We looked at South Africa, which was also being born at the time, things they were doing to reconcile the society and approach different things for their development. We looked at some European constitutions, the origins, why things are the way they are. We looked at the US, we looked at, we went to other places, so we kept pieces of what we thought was appearing and particularly to address, to deal with our situation. And so Singapore was very appealing in many ways, we looked at how they have approached investments in technology, application of different technologies for efficiency, effectiveness in things they are doing, we looked at how they invested in their people, sciences, mathematics, different things and then how doing business, when people want to do business, companies, whether small or medium or big ones, what is it for making investments, what is it that would be appealing for people to come to Rwanda, especially with that background we had that was not appearing at all. So we had so many things to change so that we can stop being seen as some place where people can't do anything and created that appeal, but learning from and definitely the case of Singapore as one of them. Thank you very much, so all that was my first question. The second question is larger, you served as a president of the African Union. So first, what have you learned from that experience? What have you achieved? What are you proud I would say to have achieved during your terms? And would you say also that the African Union is to use your own expression a work in progress and if it is so progressed towards what? Africa on one hand is a place of enormous resources, whether human or natural resources, there's no question about that. So the challenge therefore is if you have that on one hand, how would you fail on the other hand to have the kind of prosperity, the kind of transformation that you should have given these enormous resources, the statement by everybody that we want to do better, want to be better, want to prosper, want to do this. At the same time decade after decade, we are a place that can easily be dismissed. So there is a paradox here that we need to resolve. So with that in mind, one year is a very short time to do anything significant. So I was chairman for 12 months, but the beauty is that you don't do anything alone. That's where you have to start from. So working with other African leaders and having had all these things in mind that we needed to do to get going, started with the example, the institution of the African Union. How can we get it better, organize better effectively producing the results that the Africans want? How does it become effective? So we agreed that we need to pay attention to that. And that was the birth of the reforms that we had to carry out. And the African leaders entrusted me with the responsibility to read the reform process. But it was really reading the reform process with them, also doing different parts of that process. One thing we achieved, there are a number of things which we achieved partially, even if they are not completed, but at least we got started. And we know where we are standing and work will continue with other leaders who come after and take the leadership of the African Union. For example, we working with the president of Niger, President Yusuf, were able to put together the African continent of free trade area that has been created, which is going and we hope by July next year is going to be the biggest free trade area in the world. But we are not just thinking about the area, it's not just the area, it's also what we do and how, where we do what we need to do in the free trade area. How do we, as Africans, trade well with each other? How do we allow the movement of people and goods and services? How do we partner with other parts of the world as a group of African countries in this free trade area? So we've seen that come up. He mentioned in my speech the peace fund, which means from our own resources as Africa could contribute something. We can contribute in the area of prevention, of conflict, in the management of the conflict that exists. We can't always just be running to other countries that have the capacity and went to the UN and say, you know, we help with everything. So we said we can contribute, even if it is 10%, even if it is 15%, we need to contribute. And now the Africans have contributed the fund which is running into 130 million US dollars. It's a good thing. It never existed before. We have never been to this level. The level was like sometimes 10 million or even less. So and then there is a new place, another chairman of the African Union. We always hope everyone who becomes the chair helps cover another area that needs to be covered. Well, thank you very much, Mr. President. Now we are going to take a few questions. Renaud Girard, whom you know will be the first one. Mr. President, I'm very happy to meet you again. First time I met you in the bush in the north of Rwanda, in a place called Moolindi. And after that you took the power and you are ruling Rwanda for the last 25 years. You have been able to maintain peace and to develop in an extraordinary way your country, in agriculture, tourism, industry, services and so on. And it's obviously a big success. You have run Rwanda, I would say with an iron fist, but an iron fist which works. We call that in French despotisme éclairé. So it's a beautiful success. But what will happen in Rwanda after Kagame? Do we have a guarantee that the civil war will not resume? Yeah, there is the part you started with which I think is a good thing. You started with all the good things you said are happening. Good things don't happen because you are doing a bad thing. They happen because you are doing a good thing. So that is one. Second, I also mentioned it earlier, there isn't really going to be a situation where only one person does everything. Even in our situation, even with the so-called iron hand you are talking about, that iron hand has its own limits. It is where it starts from and where it ends. Third, the judgment in most cases by Rwandans of our own situation from given where we started from and where we are and what has happened in between, one is the most important. Second, it's a fair judgment. It's a fair judgment fair rather than when somebody uses an outsider's eyes to make judgment about Rwanda or its leadership. Fourth, if I were to go into statistics of what has happened, of people we have trained, young people, people actually who, by the way, people who were born during and after genocide, that is around 25 years, constitute 42% of our population. Those under 30, now about 32 below, are 71%. These are actually the people who are doing most of these things we are talking about. They have hard education, they have trained. We have been sending people outside to go and study with Europe or there was a program to send massively young people to go on. And what is interesting is that over 90% of those we send outside come back on their own. There is no enforcement about bringing people back home. They come back home and the ones running the institution is most of them. Those who have been there recently will have met some of these young people running these things. So the Kagame you met that time so long ago and you were able to see the iron fist. That iron fist has passed on to many other fists. There are many young people, men and women doing their work efficiently. You give results and that's how I found my time to come here and have a conversation with you. They are doing the rest of the work. So my time will come when I have to leave and these same young people will decide what to do with their country and will choose from among themselves who carries on the baton. Thank you very much for this answer which is both precise and unprecise but that's normal and I think that generally speaking after successful stories succession is always difficult. That I think is a generality we can agree on. So I think even where succession has come so rapidly and where success has been across the world there is no guarantee that things don't go wrong. We can talk about two cases if you want. Yes we have had rapid succession and we still have not benefited from that if it has any benefit from that. We see it by the way from across the world whether it is developed world or the kind of not the undeveloping world like ours but that's another story for another conversation. Thank you very much. So I saw several hands. Well the gentleman to my right yes you. I think you is you good. Thank you Your Excellency President Paul Kagami. Well my question focus on the model of development Rwanda's model of development. Well you try to actually you explained it. Basically it's people centered and then it has also governance model as well which you took from different parts of the globe. So my question is what is actually the model because there are already known models is it the modernization type which is not which I understand. This is a developmental state paradigm or any other paradigm because for me to my readings and my personal observation Rwanda is becoming a model of development Africa. I mean everyone can say it even some of them have started to say Rwanda is the Switzerland of Africa not only the beautiful mountains but the development as well. So that is one of my my question. The second one is the reform the African Union reform process. You let the process at a critical stage. Now well someone has taken over. So are you personally following it or well I know as a member state. Yes but I mean the future is your legacy. So what is your involvement in this particular issue. Thank you. Well quickly let me say this. The model people call it all kinds of things. I'll break it down into some realities. Maybe we see whether that constitutes a model of one kind or another or a model at all. But I guess there are things that have to be put into consideration. One there is the role of the state. There is a role of the private sector. There is the role of the ordinary citizen. Some of them organize in civil societies. One has to find the formula that brings these responsibilities together because it's one country that is being served. So ours what we have tried to do is to strike this balance in a manner that gives results. The state how far does it go in delivering the goods it should deliver. The private sector how does it work together with the state or what does the state provide as an environment for the private sector to do what it needs to do. And then on the side of the citizens the governance part how do they participate. How do they get involved. So they feel they own what they have. These are the three legs of the stool if you will that we have worked on. But centrally let me quickly also give you an example. When we were dealing with the partners during those years they were very active in Rwanda supporting our from all the emerging situation to normalization and development. Every time we used to tell our partners that we appreciate the kind of support they give us. In fact we need more even of it not less. But we also want to be the ones in the driver's seat leading our development process. So we had to form a partnership. We said we will decide for ourselves or if you will we will even work together in deciding for ourselves. We will tell you everything we want to do how we want to do it and we can make you partners. But you have to be the ones to decide. This was as early as 1996 for example. So that in itself is very important and whatever you call the model those things have to be there. The understanding of the balance that has to be struck. People at the center. People I mean the citizens but also their leaders working together. And the rest is what you get. On the part of the African Union I still play a role of continuing the leadership of the reform process. But in support of whoever will be coming or whoever is there as the chair of the African Union after me and yeah this is then we will report to the African Union General Assembly and we have the African Union Commission at the center driving the day-to-day responsibilities around that. We have the commission and the chair and the commissioners and they participate in that. Well I am told by the protocol that we should wind up now. You know I think the protocol in this case is probably the kitchen but I will take nevertheless one question please. Mr. President Rwanda has been the country that has the most the biggest number of female parliamentarian in the world. And I think also that women are positioned strategically very strongly either in the in the economy in the politics. I like to ask you whether you saw some real value added on promoting and supporting gender equality. And would you see the link with the success that everybody is describing. My assumption is that there is a link very strong link in putting women where they need to be in a very strong position and the result you were able to have both in the economy and in the society as a whole. So we would like you to explain to us how the case went about making sure that women's rights is good for both the economy and development as you did it. I definitely first of all want to confirm what you just stated and then I rebuke it with these points that will come along. One, women involvement or participation as you have said it's either their contribution to the economy. It's also their rights. And then if you look at the numbers just look in our case in Rwanda 52% of our population are women. So I mean it is basic, very basic. If we were to remove 52% of your population and make it Rwanda I don't think it's a very clever move and I don't think you get anywhere. But if you can also look at many other aspects. When we tried for example when we invested in education for women because women were lagging behind almost everything including education, education, business and even the area of governance they were absent. So we first invested in their education, in fact their health, their education for women. What is going to be the result? I also tell you that in the management of population growth the rates we have seen year in year out Rwanda was growing the population growth rate was at 3.2% which was quite high. Rwanda is a very small country geographically. So we have managed to bring down that population growth rate to something like 2.4 from 3.2. What has contributed largely to other elements including family planning for example was education of women and women being educated, participating in the economy, in doing business, in doing work, public service or anywhere you know started bringing some sense of sanity in the whole economy and society. So there is a direct link and there is a direct benefit no question we have seen. So we in primary and secondary school education the enrollment rate in Rwanda is one of the highest if not the highest on our continent. About 92% of people who need to go to school access school for the first 12 years and that is how we brought in women who were being left behind because with the poor families if they have girls and boys in the family because of low incomes they would leave girls at home and take the boys to school and so we have now made sure that no girl is left behind everybody is getting educated and the performance whereas the boys in some cases much better. So all of these things can't add up to nothing they they add up to this impressive progress and the results we see in every sector of our society by numbers alone raising people women who participate by restoring the rights they should have for their participation and what affects them and what affects everybody's by improving their health their productivity in the area of agriculture or in business or anywhere else I mean you can go on and on and on every case speaks for itself for that women should not by the way if you flipped it the other way around if it was women living behind men you would end up with the same poor results so it has to be the society as a whole being taken care of and particularly making sure that women are restored right at the center where they belong and as part and part of our society. Well Mr. President I think that a good evening is when you can combine in a harmonious way food for thought and food for eating I think we have reached a good equilibrium tonight I wish to thank you again very very much for having come here with us it was a great honor pleasure and I think you have indeed given us a lot of food for thought so thank you very much and I hope that it is not the last time that you will come to the World Policy Conference.