 So now that you've determined that an applicant is competitive by their GPA, their patient care hours, they wrote a great essay, you think they're a good match for the school, and you've decided to invite them for an interview, what's something that makes an applicant stand out, and maybe are there any red flags during the interview process that you could think of that would make an applicant less competitive in the interview process? I talk with my colleagues at other schools a lot and we share that one of the best things an applicant can do and really an interview we can do is to be really familiar with the college that you're interviewing with. We just live in such a lucky day and age where you can find so much online. It's not like even when I went to college for the first time and you relied on these paper brochures to come in the mail, we don't really even mail anything anymore, it's all right at your fingertips. So whether it's exploring again the college's values and mission and what they stand for, the program or specific faculty coming to your interview with as much information you can already under your belt really makes your interview more engaging because you can skip all the intro stuff, you know, you don't have to spend time talking about the basics because you've already done your research. So when that happens, that really is a standout point for us for an applicant. They really, they came knowing a lot about us, they clearly are interested in us because they learned a lot through their research and they come with questions that are related to our program specifically. That's a great tip for applicants if you're invited to interview, to bring questions that are specific to the college you're interviewing with. As opposed to more generic questions, you know, about all PA programs or the PA profession very generally, it's really nice when an applicant can show that they've done that research, you know, on the specific school that they're interviewing with. So one thing to make an applicant stand out for your program specifically is to know about your program specifically, not just saying the answers to every program but know exactly when Lemoine was founded, why things like that or like any other specific reason. Yeah, we're certainly not looking for you to be a tour guide, right? So I don't need you to know like every rote fact about the college, but specifically about the mission and the values of the college, you know, we are different than a larger research institution in a big, big city. You know, we have a different feel. We have different, different pedagogy. We do things differently. So understanding that and understanding the type of program you're applying to is nice. But of course, you know, we're not going to ask you who was the first president of Lemoine or you know, what's this building called? That's that stuff we'll teach you as you're a student with us. But we want to more so just know that you understand our mission, our identity. And then again, how does that relate to your values and your goals as a clinician down the road? And so if a student does want to research, for instance, Lemoine, your school, and they have an interview at your school, where would they find those values and all those things that they should research? Every college website, when you go on to any college website, there's almost always a call to action at the very top and it'll say either about us or info or fast facts and it'll tell you a lot about like the college's mission statement. And then you can kind of go into the program websites and start looking more specifically at the PA program websites. And very often, our creditors require us to put a lot of that information on our website. So a lot of that information is available. And of course, if there's something that you really feel is important and you're having trouble finding it, the admission office at any any college will be happy to guide you to that information too. Excellent. So just to kind of recap, one thing that definitely makes an applicant stand out in the interview process is knowing the colleges, the college that they're interviewing, the mission values, and then also being able to kind of dovetail those with their own values and explain why that person is a good fit for the college and the program and why the college and the program are a good fit for them as well. Absolutely. Yeah, absolutely. Excellent. And so next question just off of that is, are there any common mistakes or red flags or anything during the interview process that would make somebody less competitive as an applicant? Oh, yeah. I have to laugh a little bit because it doesn't matter if you're applying to PA school or you're applying to an MBA program or you want to be a teacher and you're applying to an education program. Some of these common mistakes are just found everywhere. One that I would mention is saying that the school you're interviewing with is not your first choice or that you're applying because you didn't get into your first choice or there's some some illusion there that you're, you know, we weren't the ones that you were hoping to apply to. That can be very a quick deterrent for a faculty interviewer to say, what do you mean, you know, or what we tend to see in clinically based programs is I was trying to get into med school and so now I'm just going to try this instead. And it's like, well, you know, everyone has a life path and there's a way to explain that life path, but just to kind of unload that and make it seem as though this isn't something you really even researched and maybe you don't really even know that much about it can be a deterrent as well. So why don't you be really honest in your life path if that's what your life was and you were intending to do that, we value that, we think everybody has a good, you know, way that they got to us, but you want to be sensitive in the way you approach that topic if that's the case for you. So just with that, let's say somebody had been shooting from med school their whole life and then we discovered the PA profession during their shadowing experience and they decided, Hey, this is better for me. Don't hide the fact that you want it to be a doctor at some point and now you want to be a PA. Absolutely. Yeah, I think that again, as a Jesuit institution, having a really holistic review process, we oftentimes throw around the term cure a person Alice, right, care of the whole person. So we want to know that life story, you know, what, what did you do? Why did you apply there? How did you start a program and now you're not in it anymore? What happened? You know, and so we're really sensitive to the fact that everyone has a different path to getting here. You know, some people were were born with parents that were PAs and they knew from the second they could talk that they were going to be a PA. Other times, it's not something people discover until they've been in a career and this is almost like a second career for them. So it really, there's so many ways to come to this place. So being really transparent and honest in that, but being sensitive to the fact that, you know, this is a very competitive program and we want to make sure that if you've made the choice to apply to it that you've done the research and you understand truly what this, what this profession is. Alright, so number one on the list of things not to do is don't say that this is your second choice program or second choice career. Don't say you actually want to do something else and you're just trying out this PA thing. Don't do that. Pretty much. Yeah. Yeah. Think of it like your, I sort of, I sort of joke sometimes with students and say, think of it like you're interviewing someone to be your new best friend. Would you want that person to say, oh, you're great, but like I was really hoping to hang out with Cindy down the road, but you were just like available. It's a lot nicer if you know that person really is invested in you and they know a lot about you and they think you'd be a great best friend, you know, so it's a silly way to think of it, but kind of put it in that perspective. I think that's a good way to think of it. Alright, so can you give me one more thing someone shouldn't do during the interview? During the interview or during the admission process, like the full process or just at the interview? You know what? How about one of each? If you're invited to interview, it's because we believe that you could be a good fit for this program. And if you do your best and you are yourself and you do the absolute best you can do with the interview questions, that's all you can worry about. That's the part that's in your control. And anything else beyond that, what's happening with the committee and the faculty and the analysis of all of that, there's no, there's nothing a student can do to change that. So I always say, if you've been invited to interview, do your best to lose that imposter syndrome, this feeling that you don't belong there for some reason. You know, we see something in you and we want to learn more about it. So do your absolute best. You know, I've heard that before, like if you're invited to the interview, there's no rank order system anymore. You are possibly going to get one of those spots. It's all about performance at the interview from now on. Yeah. A lot of times what I'll tell applicants in our information sessions is, you know, once you get to the interview, it's almost like everyone's on even playing field, right? Like you've all been invited for some reason. So there's no reason to then be comparing yourself to the person next to you or the person to the right of you or left of you because you've both been invited on your same merit for whatever reason that was. So at that point, it's really a matter of just being yourself and remembering that it's a two-way interview, you know, competitive programs that can feel very much like you're on the spotlight and you're you're the one being critiqued and in many ways you are. But we're also, you're also critiquing us. You know, you're a competitive candidate, which means you have a choice of a number of programs likely in the country to explore. So the fact that you're interviewing with us is a reminder to us that, you know, we want to also recruit you to choose us if we should offer you an invitation. So it's a two-way interview. That's a really good point. And I know one common interview question is, do you have any questions for us? Yeah. The worst answer to that question is, no. No. Yeah, you want to put the other person not on the spot, but you want to know more about the program. Like, what is your favorite thing about this program? Why did you choose to teach here, whoever's interviewing you? Yeah. Yeah, those are all great. I mean, there's, you could, there's so many different ways you could go with that question. But when you're asked in an interview, do you have any questions? It can be an opportunity for you to learn more about the person interviewing you. It can be an opportunity to learn more about the college, learn more about the program, or an opportunity to really turn the question back around, you know, and say, you know, this is something in my experience that I've really valued. Does your program also value that? You know, does your faculty also have experience with that? So it can be an opportunity to also showcase something about yourself while getting a question answered. And many career services offices all at all different colleges offer a lot of help in that. So if you're an alumni, or even if you're finishing up your senior year, and you want to get some good interview practice, very often your undergraduate institution will have a career services office that can do a lot of really good prep with you on that. I will say this year is going to be different, right? We're in a pandemic year, there's just a lot of just different things that we're going to do. So this year will be the first time that Lemoine will do interviews virtually. And I would anticipate, and I'm learning that most programs are leaning that direction this year. So there's a whole other, you know, experience here that will be new to everybody. It'll be new to the interviewers, it'll be new to the interviewees. So something I would say is if you're doing a virtual interview, you need to understand that's very different than an in-person interview. They're just different, they feel different, they look different, the types of time that you'll have will be a little bit different to talk with people. So I would really encourage you to research that in depth, you know, practice interviewing virtually, practice with your career services office or friends and family, you know, colleagues, whoever you can get to work with that, because it can feel very different. And sometimes people who are very charismatic and very personable and very compassionate in person, get stage fright on video. And so you need to know if that's an area that could be sensitive to you, and you need to have practice that in anything else. And what's that? That's really good advice. And just to add to that, just something more practical is like just the logistics of doing a video interview, I should definitely know, is sometimes things are noisy in your house, and you need to think about a time that they won't be noisy. Sometimes your Wi-Fi isn't really good, and you have to work around that, because technical difficulties probably aren't a great excuse when you're interviewing. Yeah, you know, and again, this will be new for us too. Yeah. We, again, cure personalities, being sensitive, being holistic, how could you not be understanding and compassionate to someone that's got a baby in the next room? You know, or a little bit of Wi-Fi disruption, you know, certainly those things happen. That's just part of the game when you move to a virtual environment. But the things that are in your control, you know, are you comfortable speaking to a camera? You know, have you practiced that? Do you know how to log in? Have you used the platform before? Where are you in your house? If you can't control what happens outside the door, can you at least control the environment that you're in, you know, the room that you're in? You know, things like that would be helpful. Okay, so it's definitely good to practice and just kind of be ready for that environment, the online interview? Definitely. And just to watch the instructions from each college you're interviewing with very closely, because not everyone will be the same. So you want to watch and read those instructions really carefully, you know, make sure you're paying attention to detail and those confirmation emails that go out. Okay. That's a really good point. Thank you so much for saying that. I think that's good advice for people preparing for the interview. Yeah. Could you please describe your ideal PA candidate? Well, like every other PA program, we are looking for academically strong students, right? This is a rigorous program of study. So we need students who are academically talented. But in addition to that, because of our Jesuit identity, we are really looking for students who have a commitment to community, who have a commitment to taking these skills and really bettering the world and bettering the communities that they're going to serve in. So there is an element of that that has to come through the admission process. It's not going to come from your transcript. It won't come necessarily from your CASP application, but very often it comes to the interview process or more of the written portions of your application. So for us, the ideal candidate is someone who's academically talented, who has really high quality patient care experience and a foundation to build on that experience. And someone that really identifies with our college's mission and the idea of really bettering the communities that they're going to go and serve. I'm just going to kind of ask my last question here. And that is, what is the biggest piece of advice you can offer a prospective PA student? Or is there anything else that we haven't talked about that you just think that a prospective PA applicant really needs to know? I'd give two really good pieces of advice to anyone who's applying to PA school. The first is to connect with your admission offices at the different schools you're looking at, see if they provide any opportunities to attend information sessions or to meet with with admission counselors. Sometimes just having the opportunity to learn more from the college early on in the process can really help you later on. For example, our office hosts nearly weekly virtual information sessions for PA applicants where you can ask questions live of our admission counselors. So that's a great opportunity for you if you haven't explored that yet. And many colleges offer similar types of things that you can do. And the other piece of advice I would have is be cautious of any one person's opinion. I very often have applicants who will say, you know, I'm super competitive. I have a great GPA. I have a great whatever patient care experience on paper. I'm perfect. But so and so that I've worked with at this hospital and my hometown said that I shouldn't apply because I don't have X, Y or Z. Like what? Anything. All kinds of stuff. I just would really, really caution taking only one person's opinion. You are smart. You want to be applying to PA school if you weren't an intelligent person that really had a motivation to it to be in this profession. So use a lot of different resources. You know, make sure that you're you're getting advice from people that you trust and from people that really know what they're talking about, that are able to guide you on your specific case. And most importantly, connect with the admission offices that you're looking to apply to. So you can get information direct from those sources and make sure that you're getting the information that's most applicable to the application year that you're going into. Very often I'll have applicants who are applying who will say, well, someone says helping me with the application. And they said that you require whatever, I don't know, 500 hours of patient care experience. I said, no, we don't. We require 750. Well, that person that's helping them maybe apply 10 years ago or eight years ago or seven years ago, the admission requirements change. You know, so you need to get the information from the right sources and you need to just be cautious not to let anybody deter you from something that you should be competitive because competitive for because they have a, I don't know, they think they know. That's really interesting. I've never heard of that happening, but I can imagine a lot of times someone who has a parent that was a PA will say, oh, you know, my mom said I should do this, this and this for the application. And also sometimes it's really good advice. Sometimes it's not really good advice. It really depends. So just make sure you're getting a lot of opinions that you're using your your instinct, you're using your good judgment to go from there. So that advice really goes in two different directions. Like one is if someone says that you shouldn't be a PA or you can't be a PA even though you're competitive, don't take their advice. If you want to be a PA, please apply, go be a PA. It's okay. The other piece of that advice was pay attention to who's giving you advice. And even if they may be graduated from the program you're applying to, definitely trust what they're saying, but also verify and do your own research. Because like Ms. Wren said, maybe what they're telling you is good advice, but it was from 10 years ago. And the programs have been updated, maybe their requirements or something like that. So just do your own research. Absolutely. Yep. All right. Well, thank you very much for that. Thank you so much for coming on and answering everybody's questions. So I know everyone really appreciates it. And it's just amazing to hear all these things said from someone who's actually the Director of Admissions, not just some guy who's in a PA program. Oh, no, no. And this is, it's great. You know, it's great to do this for an opportunity to connect with future students and share your experience firsthand for what it was like for you and what it's like for you as a current student just to give a really authentic viewpoint on that. You know, I wish everybody good luck, this application cycle, and good luck.