 Hey I'm Todd Bergen and we're here at my ranch in Oregon and I'm going to discuss today a little bit the differences of the cutting turnaround as opposed to the raining turnaround. To me, the way a horse functions in each one of those turnarounds is completely different. For me doing the cow horse, we have to work at that a lot. We want our horses when we're working out of the herd to obviously stop and turn like a cutter. Then we got to walk over there the big arena and do the rain work and we want them to stand up and step around like a rain or should. So it's something that we struggle with all the time but it's something that I try and really teach my horse the difference and you know it's a different set of cues and anything we do with horses is just muscle memory. So I'll just go over real quick what I expect of them on a cow and the way we want to turn there. To me, on a cow and the way we want the horse to turn there it's all about that drawing back, sitting kind on that outside pivot foot and I really, I really try and stress those horses to get soft in the inside part of this turn. So when you're turning a horse around or just dry working them for on a cow it's a lot more bend and it's a lot more back trying to set them back here on this outside pivot foot and getting them to draw back, draw this inside back foot out of the way. Okay really got them supple here on the inside of this turn. So when we're first teaching these horses how to do this I spend a lot of time just getting these horses supple to the sides. You know getting where I can really pull this nose around and they'll really just follow this nose. I can bring this across still and get them soft there. I'm not really so worried about what they're doing back here at that point. So that's kind of where we start with the young horses, just getting them really soft here.