 The next question is from morelifejojo. It recently seems that a common message in the online fitness space is that we aren't meant to be lean all year long and that wanting to maintain a lean body is bad for our health. What are your thoughts on this type of message? I think this is a message that we've been saying for almost six years now and it's finally getting out to the rest of the space. Yeah, and it depends what you mean by lean. So do I think a man who's let's say 13%, 14% body fat is going to maintain that all year long and be healthy? Absolutely. Even 10? Yeah. 10 is harder. Some people can maintain. Depends on who you're talking about. But even 10 to 14 I think is very realistic. Yeah. So I would say that's a good range, right? Yeah. And it depends on the person but why is it unhealthy to maintain very lean all the time? If you've ever gotten down to single digit body fat as a man or if you've ever gotten down to let's say below 17% as a woman, your lifestyle is very much dedicated to maintaining that leanness. It's not a healthy lifestyle mentally or psychologically. It just isn't. You're constantly looking at that you can't overeat this, you can't do that. You're thinking about food. I got to make sure I get this many grams of protein. My carbs can't be over this or my fat can't be over that. I have to work out like this all the time. It's just not a healthy, it's a very obsessive way of living. It's just not healthy for most people. Especially for women, body fat is essential for health and women who maintain these low teen body fat percentages all the time, rarely do they have a period. The hormones tend to be off. Many of them try to control the symptoms with hormone therapy. So no. Now, when you go on Instagram, you look at the pictures, it looks cool, right? The shredded muscles, whatever. But it's not something to strive for all the time. I think doing it every once in a while, especially if you have a healthy mind, you want to see what it takes. Absolutely fine. Maintaining that, probably not healthy. Well, I think that you refer to Instagram. I think that 80% of those bodies that you see on Instagram is bullshit. If they're not being photoshopped, then they were shot at a period of time. And then Instagram people drip that over the course of a year. So a lot of it's a facade. A lot of them pretend like they looked that way and they don't really look that way. And then the ones that do, the ones that walk around at 6% to 7% body fat year round, you don't know the rest of their life. How many people are suffering? I mean, I know how much Katrina suffered for me, for me to compete. I saw that. And I remember that was a constant conversation with her that I'm not going to make you do this forever. I promise. I promise like there's a goal in mind. We're going to reach that goal. And then I'm done with this lifestyle. As cool as looking that ripped was, as cool as competing was. I would never put that on my partner ever again. And I've been in a relationship where I had somebody who was competing and I was the other person. It sucks. You know how lame it is that we have to map out everything that we're doing all day long to make sure that he or she gets their meals all day just timed right? Or we can't go to this restaurant because they don't offer an option for this. Or, oh, I can't have popcorn at the movie theater. I can't bring this home because then it makes her want to have it too. Just that lifestyle, there's a lot to that. And that's why, too, you see a lot of these fitness fanatics. They end up marrying or dating another fanatic. So they can be neurotic. They have to. Yes, they can be neurotic together, not realizing how much of life that they're really missing out on. It's just another form of an extreme and that's just the thing. When you want to live in the extreme, you're going to have to make compromises. And other parts and other facets of your lifestyle are going to get affected. And so it's like if that's what you really want and you desire constantly, you're going to be battling some things along the way. And that's the thing is in terms of being super shredded and lean all the time, it's your body's going to be fighting you that whole time. It is. And your hormones suffer. Men's testosterone levels will drop. Women's estrogen progesterone levels kind of go out of whack. I'll tell you what, here's the truth in the real life. If you're a man and you're a strong 13%, 14% body fat, most women will consider you physically attractive. If you're a woman and you're a strong 20% to 24% body fat, but you're strong, you obviously lift weights because the muscle gives you shape. You look attractive, physically attractive, you look good, you look healthy. Isn't that ironic, though, that we chase these ridiculous things, but the opposite sex that we're trying to attract or the same sex possibly are not even attracted to that. It's almost like we're competing with our peers. That's the only people that we're really trying to impress. If you're a ripped ass dude, you know who thinks it's really cool? The other dudes that are trying to get ripped, like you said, I mean, they've done plenty of research around this. Most people want somebody in that kind of body fat range because you look normal and healthy and you look fun to be with. You look balanced. I remember going to the first time I ever went to a show. At the time, my business partner was competing in bodybuilding. And so when they did the show, they also have bikini and figure and physique and odd stuff. And I remember seeing the girls that were competing in the bikini and I would go backstage because I was helping them out. So I was allowed backstage and I'd see these girls getting prepared in their faces. They looked dead. They were sunken in eyes. Gone and acne, obviously, because the hormones roll off. And this is supposed to be the best way that they look. And if I saw that person in real life, I would think, I would maybe think, wow, if this person gained 15 pounds, they would look really good right now. It's not just the abs. Everybody wants these ridiculously popping shredded abs. You have to lose body fat all over your body. You get that. You'll get the bony sticking out points that are unfavorable just to maintain this lean ab look. Now, it's also important to note that what isn't healthy either is to get lean every once in a while and then blow way up and come back down. Too extreme. Right. So I don't want to come off like we are advocating for people to be, oh, OK. Well, the guys say I shouldn't be lean that often, so I'm going to blow up. And that's what we see a lot. You see one extreme or the other. You see the neurotic person who tries to stay 6% year around. Or you see the average person who yo-yos hard. They swing high up. They could put on a bunch of weight. And then they push really hard. Nothing wrong going for a goal of trying to make that happen and get to a peak. Like you're peaking just like anything else with sports, even for me, it was like we went through an off-season that led into an extreme competition at the end of that that I was preparing for. But then I came right back into a normalized type of a training situation.