 Hey, it's a sunny day in New York City. And I have a rainbow, look at that rainbow. That's cool, woohoo. Woohoo. And it's a sunny day in New York City and it's time for watchful work. And what else do you need to know? But we're gonna get some work done together today and we're gonna talk with you after we work for 20 minutes. We're gonna talk with you about your work and your creative process and give you some encouragement. While we do not have time for you to actually share your actual work with us, we do have plenty of time to talk about process and all those good things. And if you should have a question after our 20 minute work session, why don't we, why doesn't Zoe or Amritha tell us how to get in touch? Yes, hi everyone. We're Amritha and Zoe from the New Work Development Department. Thrilled to be with you and thrilled to be with SLB. And Zoe, you wanna tell us how people can ask questions? Yes, after our quiet work session, we will open up for questions and to ask your question, please use your raise the hand function at the bottom of your Zoom screen and we'll get a nice and neat cue going and when it's your turn, we will ask you to please unmute and that's what we'll do. That's fantastic. And of course we wanna thank HowlRound and we wanna thank the Public Theater for helping us get organized every Monday. And what else, am I forgetting anything? Am I remembering everything? There's a rainbow in the room. Thank you. I was sending out the vibe, let me unmute myself. Please let me unmute myself. Sorry SLP, we had a little bit of technical difficulties on our end, but we are back, we are back on. We love technology. Can we please get back into technology? Hallelujah, thank you technology because without technology, we don't have to be like in the lobby of the public theater gathered around while the people who work hard in the lobby of the public theater are changing the ice machine, which is very noisy. So we love technology. Hey, all right. So anybody have any questions? We're in the rainbow room today. That's what we'll call it, the rainbow. Kenny, we saw your hand raised earlier. Is that a, do you have a question? I just, I didn't get into school and I'm heartbroken. And I don't know where to go from here, what to do. And I'm just tired of being 62 and not having a career and being a writer with no place to go and no place to learn how to be better to get my stuff out there. So I don't really even know if I have a question. I'm just, I'm sad and I don't know. I don't know what to, I don't know where to go. I'm so sorry that you didn't get into the schools you were hoping for. I'm so sorry. Thank you. I don't have any say on admission. So I apologize for just not, way to No, and that's the other thing. I'm sad I won't get to see you and study with you too. That was a big part of it and being in New York cause New York is like my boyfriend. I love New York so much. It's just, everybody knows, even my husband knows that he's a backseat to my boyfriend. Where do you live Kimmy? Where do you live? I live in California now. Oh, okay. But I'm a Jersey girl. Uh-huh, okay. What part of California? Santa Barbara. Oh no, that's beautiful there. Please, anybody come visit. Wow, Santa Barbara. That's gorgeous. That's so gorgeous. Absolutely pretty. So yeah, so what do we do? What do we, what can we, what can we do? What can we do when, you know, the things we're hoping for don't work out in the way we hope for them to work out. I know, I mean, are there, you know, are there any kinds of in-person communities in your community? Is there nobody around? It's, I don't know to be honest with you. You know, there's a lot of people that act and there's theaters here, but there's already, it's just focused on acting, not playwriting. And when I did, I had a reading of a play many years ago in LA with a lot of my comedian friends. A bunch of comics got together and they read my play for me. But then I, you know, I don't know, I just feel out of touch with everybody and everything. And as a comic, it's frustrating because I've been doing this for like 12 years or more. I don't know, whenever Elliot Spitzer resigned, that was the first night. That was the first night I took stage. And I know that because I couldn't remember my material going to the open mic and I got nervous and I turned on the radio and I heard him resigning. And I, and so my first line on stage was, has there ever been a better time to be a slut from New Jersey? Like $80,000 is just, so that's why I know it was that many years ago. But I haven't been asked to, like I produced a show here in town, but it's once a month, so I don't get to home my skills and driving to LA is just a beast, you know? And I, I don't know, I'm just, I'm hitting walls and I'm feeling frustrated at 62 hitting walls and I've tried everything I could think of on my own end. And I'm just, I'm so open to whatever, you know? That's why at 62 I applied for school because I'm open to whatever. So that's why I didn't, I don't even know if I have a question because I don't know what even to ask. Mm-hmm. Well, I mean, I can hear a question, maybe this is correct, you know? Like how do we keep going? Yeah. How do we keep going? And I just, I mean, cause I know LA, it's not like you get on a, you know, subway or the Metro North and you ride over to, you know, the next town. I mean, are there people, you said there are a lot of actors in your immediate vicinity. Yeah, I can do readings and stuff, but how do you get your stuff up and how, or how do I get better at being a writer? You know, like for example, I have a friend that just graduated with an MFA in Columbia. And I thought one of the things that I want to do is I wanted to learn structure. I want to learn, and she goes, Kimmy, your play already has structure. I went, oh, you know? And she says, it's really great. And she gave me notes and I, and I addressed the notes and changed it. And then I talked to a friend of mine who's a director and she says, okay, that's your first scene. So I moved stuff around. So it's not like I don't, I can't take a note. It's not like I'm not willing to, I mean, I'm malleable to the point where if there's somebody that has a great idea or has a good note, I'll take it. But it's also not, I'm not, not a wallflower that doesn't have the ability to advocate for my work either, you know? So I know I could get it read, but how do you get it up? How do you, how do you, how do you network? Like that was the other thing, career development and networking, I don't have those opportunities. Like I would have had in school. Yes, yes. And then the other thing is like, when I get stuck, I go, okay, well, go learn something. And now I can't, I didn't get into school. So how do I, you know, I don't know. I'm just, there's a wall that I've been banging my head against it. No, I hear you. And it's appropriate, I think, to be frustrated because you put a lot of work into those applications. And sometimes when you see like yet, that is exactly what would be right for me. And then it doesn't work out. You think, well, what do I do now? Exactly. I knew, I know it's right for me. And you can entertain the possibility that there's a way to get to where you wanna go without going through the door that you thought you were gonna go through. Like, if you wanna be really malleable, you know, not malleable, but flexible mind, you can start telling yourself that instead of like, I don't have a way to do it. I don't have any community. I don't know what to do. I know what to do. I have community. They're closer than I think. And there's a way to get to where I wanna go without going through the door that I thought. Okay. Yes, grad school does offer opportunities. And living in the world offers opportunities as well. Thank you. The only way, grad school is not the be all end all, take it to success. I didn't go to grad school. You know, a lot of people who are in the business right now that I work with and that I adore and respect did not go to a graduate program to get their degree in writing. You know, so you're not gonna, I mean, you can always, and you can always apply next year. Maybe you applied last year too. You know, you can keep applying if that's something you really believe in. You can keep applying. And in the meantime, you can scour your immediate universe and look around and say, who's to my left? Who's to my right? Who's around? Who's around? What people do I know? And how do you get your play up? You get your play up by working with people. I mean, how do you raise a barn? It's the same thing. You go around and you say, who's gonna do it with me? Is there a community center? You know, sometimes we get the notion that to be a successful fill-in-the-blank, you have to go to a successful fill-in-the-blank. You know, a successful program that's accredited in MFA. To be a real writer, you have to be, you know, you have to have a play on Broadway. You know, we all know that that's not true. To be a real successful novelist, you have to be published by a successful, whatever, random house or whatever. We make up these scenarios, these narratives that are not true. You know, to be president, you had to be a white guy. Well, that's not true, is it? You know what I'm saying, right? But that was the narrative that we were all telling ourselves, right? And now it's other narratives. But do you see what I'm saying? How we hypnotize ourselves into believing something that isn't necessarily true. And keep me as hard as you work. You can work more locally and just say, okay. So I didn't get in this year. I can apply next year. And who's around who can do my plays? You sound like you know a lot of actors. Get them together, read your play, look around if you have, you can self-produce. A lot of us in New York, who, I mean, I self-produced for years, you know? And it's fun. I enjoy it quite a bit. Okay. Self-producing is a way, if you have the financial, a little bit of financial wiggle room, self-producing is a great way to go. Doesn't have to be a huge show. It can be a modest, you know? But it's still getting your show up there. You can, yeah. But you can just look around. Don't overlook in your quest for, you know, whatever the golden fleece or the grail or whatever it is, don't overlook the person who might be sitting right next to you or the person who's sitting next to them. Cause they might be able to help you. They probably will be able to help you in some way, in some way. Just be relentless in that locally, be locally relentless. Thank you. You're welcome. Thanks. I love you so much. Thank you. I love you too, sweetheart. And just keep going. Come on, and then let's be part of your story. Ha-ha, that year I didn't get into that grad program. I went and did such and such, and now I am such and such. Ha, you'll be an inspiration to a lot of people. Thank you. I appreciate that. And I appreciate this community. And thank you so much for everybody's support. I appreciate it. Thank you very much. Cause I didn't know even what to ask, but you always know how to zoom in there. You're a little brain surgeon. Ha-ha-ha. I'm wearing my Yoda t-shirt. I'm all ears. Thank you so much. You're welcome. We love you, Kimmy. We're sending you so much love. And also just wanted to share, and happy to send more of this, but another option to consider too, is there's more play development centers that are offering virtual classes, if classes are your thing. I used to work at the Playwright Center and especially kind of post pandemic, they started opening up all of their classes that playwrights teach about structure, or if you want to learn how to write for TV, or like so many, so many aspects, they're all virtual now. So it's also, they kind of recognize what you named where community building, you know, can be localized. And also they're trying to find ways to make sure that location isn't a barrier. So I'll just put it in the chat for you. Oh, thank you. You're welcome. It's a great resource. That's fantastic, I'm with you. Thank you. Of course. This was great. Love, you mean it. Thank you. And how about Tammy, would you please? Hey, Kimmy. Hey. Yeah, and Kimmy, like I've definitely, I've been there. I get it. I was actually a stage manager in Off Off Off Broadway in New York for like 10 years and doing whatever I can. And I've had like seven careers since then. And so now I'm doing the self-producing thing where I've decided that I, then I mentioned this before, like I'm doing a podcast that's also, that can function as a walking tour. Yeah, right. Oh, that's great. People are saying, yeah, yeah. Yeah, so I'm, I got really great advice a few weeks ago from Neil deGrasse Tyson, he was amazing. And so now I'm ready to sort of share it with like just friends and people who know about the town. And I would love to actually turn it into like something where I get community buy-in a little bit. So I also want to survey because I feel like, because it's not really traditional theater, so you can't really judge by applause and you can't really, you know, you can't, you can't wait for people to email you back and say how marvelous it is or even what they hated about it. So I want to send out a survey and like, you know, some of them, some of the questions are like technical questions, like, could you, could you listen to it? Did it work for you? Did you like it? Did you hate it? Like, and do you have any recommendations for other kinds of questions? Like part of me is like, did you like it? Did you think it was marvelous? And another part of me is like, you know, or if you hated it, like tell me specifically how you hated it. Cause I've definitely been in a situation where you're doing a workshop and you want feedback from the audience and sometimes they'll give you notes that you know maybe you're not going to take or they're not helpful or whatever. So how do I, do you have any, I don't know. Yeah, no, so do you really want their notes? You want their, you want, you want to know, right? Yeah. I want to know that they're at least like relating to like the main characters and like following them. Cause like another question is like, are they gonna finish, like they're gonna be like 16 episodes and are they planning to finish the whole thing, right? Like, are they gonna be engaged enough? So ask, did you, so, you know, whatever Joe and Tabitha were the main characters, I don't know, you know, right? Did you find them relatable? Did you find them engaging? Ask them specific questions, you know? Are you wondering what's going to happen next with them? Are there any things that you'd like would happen next? You know, if they're confined by the history of what actually happened, is there anything, would you like them to break free of the history? And if so, how so? Ask them specific questions, kind of what we call leading questions, you know what I mean? Lead them because, you know, did you, you know, you want to hear their responses, but you want to hear the responses to specific thing. What was confusing? You know, did anything make you laugh? You know, did anything make you cry? Did anything make you wonder? Did anything sound like it wasn't historically accurate? If so, why? You know, is there anything that you wanted to hear more about? If so, what? And how much so? Yeah. Are there any peoples that you think should be included that weren't? Are there too much of certain kinds of people? You know, specific questions. And yeah, like maybe no more than like 10 or 12. Right? Right, right, like I have, I have like, you just listed like 20, right? That's what I asked. Yeah, and that's, you know what I mean? And thank them a lot for their participation and their feedback. And you can always ask more for more feedback later. Yeah. You know, because, you know, you know, feedback is easy. That's just it, right? Feedback is like. Yeah, so if you ask specific questions, get them thinking about, you know, yeah. Cool. Thank you. You're welcome. Awesome. You're wonderful. Love this. Thank you so much. Rocky, would you please unmute and ask your question? Hey, bro. How you doing? Good to see you, man. Go ahead. Yeah, my name is. Oh, I want to say to Kimmy first, I just read this post that said Greta Gerwig was rejected from all of her grad schools. And obviously she had like a really, well, has been having a good decade, it seems. But anyway, my question is, let me get it. Thank you for sharing that, Rocky, while you get your question. That's very generous of you to share with all of us. Thank you. Yeah. What is your advice for organically raising the stakes? Organically raising the stakes. That's such a funny question. I mean, the way it sounds. OK, organically raising the stakes, Rocky, add a lot of shit. That's actually true. I mean, I don't know. That's like gardening, right? If you want to raise something, add a lot of fertilizer. Make stuff happen. Sometimes you're like, OK, my play, my novel, whatever's about someone just going to the store, gets very narrow very quickly. Look to the left to the right. Look over the character that you're looking at. What's going on? Get interested in your characters. What's going on with you? What's going on with her? Why are you two not talking to each other? Get really interested in your characters. And they'll start letting loose to you, start talking to you. And then they might tell you things that are, oh, I had never thought of that. You know, OK? But get interested in their shit, in their stuff. And that will naturally organic. You used the word organic. And it will organically fertilize your story, your plot. Ha, ha. And then you'll have a lovely garden. And we're done with metaphors about gardening. OK, thank you. You're welcome. Good question, man. Very good question. Yeah, get interested in your characters. Always, always, always. OK. That's where your story is going to come from, regardless of what you're writing. Thank you so much, Chromky. Caitlin, will you please unmute and ask a question? Hello, I'm Caitlin. Hey. I'm a director, and I have a question about something I'm writing, which is kind of similar to Rockies. So I've discovered that I want to try my hand at genre, like horror. So I have all of these ideas that don't really connect. I've been putting them on index cards. And it's just really like themes. I'm like, OK, well, this set piece and this theme, OK, but maybe this is where the horror comes from. But they're not connecting at all. I don't really have a story. So what would you do in that case? Yeah, Caitlin, get to know your characters. Same thing. And you said, yeah, Rocky's question teed yours up. Get to know your characters. So a lot of times when we were thinking, here I'm go, get to know your characters. These are your characters. Theme. They're issues. The content. Yeah. I could keep backing up. You're not going to. What are you talking about? I don't know what I'm talking about. I'm talking about theme. You know, what does that even mean? I don't even know. But if you get to know your characters, then it's like, you know, Miss Little Bill kills somebody and hit him under her porch. And now the brother's coming back, you know what I'm saying? Then that's somebody. And then they have a relationship. And then what happened with them? I don't know if that's Horst or I don't write horror genre. But, you know, and scary movies make me scared. But, but, you know, if you like that kind of thing, think about your characters, right? Like, what are they up to? What are they doing? What do they want? Where are they going? Like we said last week, maybe in geometry, two points make a line, i.e. that is where your character starts and where you want them to end up. Beginning point, end point, make lines of dialogue. If it's true in geometry, it's also true in writing. Okay. I know. I'm telling geometry jokes. Y'all ain't laughing. Anyway, but you're smiling. There you go. So, okay, so get to know your characters. Don't, don't shortchange your characters. That's where the story comes from. Believe it or not, the story isn't coming from you and your ideas about what all those things you talk about, theme and such and such and whatnot. That's very impressive. But your stories come through you and the characters are people who, you know, they knock it on your door and you let them in and they're like, we got something to say to you. We got story to tell you, right? Okay. Thank you. You're welcome. And it's fun, right? Cause then you're like, you know, you're visited by people. I welcome it. Okay. Thank you. Great question. Thank you. Thank you, Caitlin. Laurie, will you please mute yourself and ask your question? Hey, Laurie. Hey, I took your geometry class. I don't have a question this week, but I did my points on the line for every one of my characters and I put in all their obstacles. So I'll let other people have questions, but I've been using it for two weeks. Fantastic. Oh my gosh. Yeah. I'm so glad. I love it. I'm so close. That's fantastic. And, you know, yeah, for me in school, I was good in calculus and physics and all that, but geometry was always mysterious. And now I've learned how to use it. So I, I'm just relieved. Yeah. So. Cool. Thank you. I'll let other people go. I just, I love it. Thank you so much. I appreciate that. Thank you, Laurie. That looks beautiful too. I love seeing your lines and your drawings. I know, right? Right? Yeah. It's got coffee stains too. Oh, even better. Even better. Want to give a shout out to Rebecca. Rebecca, you came to our gig at Rockwood. Thank you so much. It was great to see you and give you a hug in person. I know. I miss the, you know, I do miss being at, in the balcony and in the mezzanine. But this is so much better. I get to meet people from everywhere. All right. It was so good to see you. And, you know, I try to do the, I try to do what, you know, they call artist dates. Oh, yeah. Because it does really, it helps me stay inspired for my work. So it was a lot of fun. Yeah. Thanks. Thanks. Yeah. Artist dates that I heard from, from Julia Cameron, right? The artist. Great book. Great book that is very encouraging. If you, you know, if you're on the path, helps you, helps you keep going. Yes. Yeah. Absolutely. So I don't, I don't have a question today. Oh, no, no. I was just saying hi and thank you. You're welcome. I'm just vamping. I'll play with my capo. So you, thank you for posting the events. People should. Yeah. It's fine. It's fine. It's fine. Because we're, you know, we're, we're out there. And it's, it's fun. I think, I think it's a lot of fun working with a band and they're really great musicians, those people. And we have a good time. We're having a good time. Making a new show. That's right. We still have time for a few more questions if anyone has a question that they want to share. Yes. We see one of, we would, can you pronounce your name for us? We'll ask you to unmute, but we want to make sure we pronounce it correctly. Hi, I'm Dastle. Dastle. Dastle is to meet you. Nice to meet you all. Wow. Hi, everybody. Hey, Dastle. What a beautiful name. Thank you. My question was about adaptation. Do you mess with that? And if so, like, how do you approach it? Cause like all the characters are there and the whole thing is there. Like it's all plotted out already. He's like, you have a map and all you got to do is follow it. And I've just taken that map and applied it like somewhere else to a different scenario. But now I seem to be freaked out by my own idea. Oh, wow. Yeah, yeah, yeah, I hear you. Yeah, I've done a lot of adaptations. Most of them for jobs, you know, for work for hire like Native Sun or their eyes are watching God or the Gershwin's poor game best, things like that. And it's, I always, the first thing I lead with is respect. So I feel like I am walking with the original writer and respect literally as my friend, director Steve Brodnack says, literally means seeing it anew, seeing it again, respect, right? So I'm walking with the original writer, you know, hand in hand or, you know, very appreciative of the work they've done and acknowledging that they are giving me an opportunity to see the work anew. So whether it's like Native Sun, you know, originally set in the 19, I think 40s, I think, I'm not sure, or 50s, Brie brought it forward to the present day. So it's just made a contemporary. Oregon Best, we made it, as we say, habitable for everybody involved, updating it, if you will. And it's, so I don't like take a plot and like put it on my own story. I don't really do like that. I wouldn't call that an adaptation. So could you talk a little bit more about what, I mean, not specifics, but... Well, I'm taking this restoration comedy. Oh, okay. And I'm trying to apply it to the same sort of place with different, like a similar place, but with different, I'm sorry, my dog is crazy. Okay. I'm trying to apply it to like a different place with different people, like my hometown, basically. Okay. See how to make that work. And I'm like, oh my God, what have I taken on this? This is huge, like it's bigger than me. It's huge. Yeah, it is bigger than you. The whole world is bigger than you. Welcome, welcome, you know what I mean? So yeah, so again, be very great. I think what helps me is if I'm very grateful to the original writer for, you know, laying the groundwork, you know, they've laid the foundation. Be grateful and be specific and know that, yeah, they've done a huge amount of the initial work. And if you're, I find that with gratitude and with specificity, I can go scene by scene, character by character, focus on what your characters want. That doesn't go away just because you're adapting something. All the things still remain. Who are my characters? What do they want? Where do they start? Where are they going? You know, how do they end up? Do I keep the act breaks the same, especially in restoration comedy, because it might be differently structured, you know? What can the original writer teach me about the story that I wanna tell? You know, they are there to help you. Again, gratitude and respect will activate them even more. And so they are there to help you. Well, sounds like fun. Thank you so much. Great question. That sounds like fun. Thank you, Dassel. James Q, please unmute yourself. I hope I didn't put your name. Hi. Thank you so much. How's your work? How's your choreography? You're a choreographer, a writer, right? Filmmaker, yes. Filmmaker, right, right, right. How's it going? It's been going well. Thank you so much. So I have a question related to the process of improvisation in the creative process of genre dialogues. So I'm curious if you use improvisation in that process and if so, if there are specific strategies of approaching improvisation that you find very effective. Wow. That's really, that's a great question, James Q. And I, yes. And see, my husband is a jazz musician. So he's all the way out there, you know, improvises all the time with the people he plays with. And I do as well writing, but it's not in the same way. I'm not improvising with my actors. I am improvising with the characters in my head. So in my experience, improvisation in dramatic writing is called your first draft. So you just let it roll. You know what I mean, you think of your characters, right? So in jazz and music, in my experience, my understanding is you know what the chords are, right? You're gonna play over the chords and you know what the, you have the head, the major melody, right? And then you start out. So that would be for playwrights, it would be the characters or the dramatic writers, the characters and the basic story. And then you start to improvise, meaning you just let the characters say whatever they want as they are pursuing their wants and going to other goals. That would be the equivalent if you were a musician playing like piano over chords in a jazz context, right? And then you see what you got. And then what's great about writing is that you're typing it, I would type it out on the word processor, whatever, and you have a document of it. Sometimes in jazz, they just play and it's gone, you know? But if you're typing, you have a document that is your first pass at the improvised dialogue. And then you can improvise off of that or you can just hone it and file it and polish it and get it to be more specific to what you want. Does that make any sense? Yeah. A lot of people would involve actors and all that. I find that I, it's a taste thing. I like to improvise in my head. Yeah. So I found over time that I get better dialogue but that's just my, that's what happens with me. Thank you so much for sharing that. Great question though, that's really cool. Cool. Thank you. Virginia, ah! Please unmute yourself. Hey, Virginia. Oh, you're still on mute. You're still on mute. There you go. I have a load in my hand. Okay, so I have a question. I'm working on an autobiographical one person show. Well, so the thing is, so my question is there are different segments that happen in my, from my life or from the character life. Does each, so each section kind of has like a climax of what happens in that little section. So does should the whole story have that kind of a build and then like an ebb and flow also or is it just okay in each segment? The whole interest I think. Yeah, yeah, yeah. That's a cool question. I would think that it would be helpful. I mean, if they already have that, you know, then you go from sort of mountain top to mountain top to mountain, you summit the mountain, then you're, they summit the mountain again and then you're there. And it also would be helpful as you're writing these segments to have an overarching story, if you will. Like, like, like, why am I telling you all this? Yeah. Because I want you to understand, da, da, da. The only way to help you have you understand whatever it is, you know, me or I mean, you or the speaker, whatever it is to tell you this story and this story and this story and this story. And in the end, then now you understand whatever it is that I wanted to explain to you. Do you see what I mean? Yeah. An overarching sort of reason why is really helpful. Then it will keep us in those valleys when we're going, why am I listening to this? Oh, because, because Virginia is telling us the story, we're trying to get to that fifth mountain and here's where we're still on the path. We're still on the journey with her. Does that make sense? It makes a lot of sense. That really helps. Thank you so much. You're welcome. I just love it. Thank you. You're welcome. Great question. Thanks for this class, everyone. Sure, it's fun. It's Monday. Thank you, Virginia. We might have time for one more question. If anyone has a burning question, they want to ask on this beautiful Monday. No, it's a beautiful Monday. Oh, yes, Caitlin, I see your hand. Please unmute yourself. Yeah. Well, again, for the bonus question. For the bonus round. Here we go. Can you please share with us how producing your own work made you a better writer if it did? Sure. Yes, that's a wonderful question. I think it makes the writer responsible. I think it helps the writer be mindful of the bottom line. Economical. Sometimes people think, I'm only going to be successful. I have tons of money to do whatever I want and all that. Hey, uh-uh. Now, if you have $10, can you make a show with $10? If you can, then you're really happening. It also helps you reach out and make connections and broadens and enlargences. Your community. You're creative on your feet. It helps you crawl out of your own head and find creative solutions constantly. I really enjoy it. So the test kitchen I'm doing right now in my band, we're self-producing. And I love it. Also, you're the boss. You don't have to. Which means not, which means you can do anything you want. But it means that literally the buck stops with you and you get to make all the creative decisions, which is really fun. So I think it's, I don't know, something you should definitely try if you find yourself between like, well, either I don't get produced or I self-produce if you can afford it and have a little bit of money and have a few connections or can make a few connections. Definitely try self-producing. It's nothing to be ashamed of just because a famous Broadway producer isn't inviting you into their theater. Hopefully we can let that go and embrace the reality of DIY where it's at. Yeah. Thank you. Thank you. Great question. It's almost 6 o'clock. Almost blowing at the clock. We crushed it. Yeah. Great. Everyone rocks. Woo-hoo. Well done. Now it's the clock. There it goes. All right. All right. It's 6 o'clock. We will see you next week on April Fool's Day, baby.