 I'm going to go ahead and call the meeting to order at 6.03. Sam, you'll notice that Linda's not here. Oh, I've got it. So thank you for taking the minutes today. You're so welcome. Thank you all for being here. Our meeting purpose today is to end discussion and board work. Chelsea, thank you for being online. We will start with public comment. Do we have any members of the public present? You can see we don't in here online. It doesn't look as though we do. So I'm not going to read the preamble. I'm going to give it 30 seconds if someone pops on. And I think by 30 seconds, I'm in eight. All right, then let's move on to policy decisions. Second review and hopefully a vote to approve. Required policies, F3, fire and emergency preparedness drills, and F4, access control and visitor management. Questions on the first F3, fire and emergency preparedness drills. Chelsea, can you hear us OK? Yeah. Awesome. Yeah. Awesome. I should have started with that. OK, hearing no questions, I will entertain a motion to approve F3. So what? Do I have a second? I'll second. Katia moved. Megan seconded. Any further discussion? All those in favor, raise your hand or say aye. Or both. Aye. Aye. Aye. Excellent. Unanimous. Passes. F4, I will entertain a motion to approve. So moved. Thank you, Megan. Do I have a second? I'll second. Thank you. Further discussion? All those in favor? Aye. Aye. Aye. And we've got Chelsea. You're now in the city passes. Aye. Thank you. Excellent. OK, well, I'm not going to say the real reason we're here, but the kind of meaty reason we're here. To talk about the ends, the mission statement, these were composed a while ago. And I think we had, we've started some great discussions and they have not quite been, have fit into agenda item and agenda item that was already on. So I think, oh, it's hard to dive back into something that's already been started. OK, let's think about why. Why do we want to reevaluate these? Do we think they're off? They're big. Can I ask a question? Please. Sorry to go back. I was just wondering the letter that we had proposed to send out as a board. I thought that was to be on here to be approved. But is that going to be for the start of school? Or I thought we were doing it as a wrap up. Chelsea, did you have a chance to connect with Ben? Yes, I did. And I got revisions of the letter from Rachel. And then I sent them to Ben. And I said, I think this is what we're thinking. And he said, great, let me know if there's anything else I can do. And I said, OK. Great. So I have it. I thought we were going to revisit it at the next meeting, which I was thinking was not this meeting because there's like if we add everything to this meeting, then we won't talk about the ends. But I mean, we were trying to keep the agenda very short. No, I do remember that. But then I remember asking last time if we were going to do it as like an opener to the next school year or closure to the school year. And I thought we all said closure. It's fine. I don't really care. It's not on here so we can't vote. But I'm just bringing it up. So I was under the assumption it was too rushed to get it out for the 4th of July considering that we were going to try to do revisions. So then we did the revisions. And then did I send that out to the whole board after Rachel sent it to me? No. No, I don't think so. OK. Well, I can do that. And then I would say we could get it out in August before or at beginning of September, like when school is starting. Which will, I mean, that makes sense when people are re-engaging, yeah. Yeah, I think now is not a good time to say. With school. OK, just want to clarify. Yeah, thank you. Yeah, if we warrant it for the next agenda, at least keep it moving. You want it on the August or on the August? I think August, yeah. I got to write that down. Hold on. I'm doing it, too. Thank you. Sorry. No, that's great. I know Chelsea had also emailed us all information about the evaluation process. But again, August meeting is what I believe you suggested. Chelsea, in terms of putting the committee together, yeah, in her email. So we want to do that at the August meeting? Correct, August 9, I believe. So we'll put the committee together and talk more about it at the August meeting. But everyone's got the information about the time commitment and all that, right? Yes. Yes, thank you for that. So do be thinking, if that's something, you have the capacity for to be on the committee. I mean, the term board work is pretty broad. And that is on our agenda. So I don't think we should feel bad about making sure. So thank you. But back to the ends. What they are now, we're saying too broad, not necessary. Well, maybe not. OK, we're at discussion. Yeah? So I can bring us back, too. Remember last, I believe it was last spring, we met with Jackie. And it was through Jackie and sort of revisiting what our work is, and that our work is to make sure that we're reaching out to the community and checking in on our ends. And what she had suggested and what we did was to move into the portrait of a graduate process, partly because the state is encouraging all districts to have a portrait of a graduate, but also because Jackie, having been in a policy governance district, was encouraging us to do that process because she felt like it would be a nice way for us to then look at our ends and sort of integrate the portrait of a graduate into the ends so that we can flesh them out a little bit more. So that was sort of the process that had been started. So we're not starting from just scratch. We've sort of done that portrait of a graduate, which is now sort of a draft to sort of see if. And that was a community outreach, which we delegated to the administration to do for us as a board. So our role as a board is supposed to be going out to the community to gather that information. We haven't done that. We haven't been very good at doing that. So we sort of said, we haven't been doing this. Let's direct the administration to take a lead on it. We'll involve board members, but we won't commit the board to doing that whole process themselves. I don't think it was necessarily for the administration to take on connection with the community. It was one avenue to take, much like another avenue was this letter trying to get them to engage with us. Right, but it was to direct her direct, because doing community outreach like portrait of a graduate, it takes a fair amount of time and organization. And the board hasn't really had the time or energy to do that over the years. So it was to sort of jump start it was to direct the administration to do it so that we could get it going and get board members involved, but maybe not having them lead the process just because hadn't been happening. And that also made it so we were able to access Title I federal funding for community engagement and outreach and how our students do the work. So actually, and board members were involved at every single meeting. So it really worked out in my opinion very nicely and gives a really good document for you to compare with the existing ends and make some decisions. It sounds like you're thinking to form a committee to do a multiple series of meetings. Is that right? I didn't think a subcommittee. I think the suggestion was that the board go out to it. Chelsea, correct me if I'm wrong, but it was recommended to you that the board not necessarily committee be present at other places rather than expecting people to come to us and share. So that is what the suggestion was. But I do think that we should start with comparing what we've done or what our ends look like now with what came out of the portrait of a graduate because we have that information. And it feels like a little bit like recreating the wheel to try to get another whole set of data. So if we start with this and if we feel like there are holes, then I would think that we could maybe fill those holes by putting together maybe another survey. But it does seem like we do have this information. We do have what our ends are. And maybe we could look at the two together. And Heather, I would ask for you to be maybe remind us of the portrait of a graduate sort of results. And then we could start there. So would you like me to print up that information now or do you want to do this at a later date? Is that tonight's work? I mean, maybe you could pull it up now. And we could start with critical thinking or the first thing on the. Let me print some copies of things so I can distribute. And I can also put it up on the screen for you and anyone else who may join online. Yeah, the screen would be great. And then we could say, is that just to do more? I think just the screen, just for time. But that's just my suggestion. I don't know how everybody else feels. I apologize for not being there in person. No, no. I think that's a good start, Chelsea. We do have data. There are only so many times we're going to engage the community. And they're going to come and participate and then not see results that they're going to engage with us. Right. We did Winston thing, and we did portrait of a graduate. We needed to take that information and do something with it, where people will stop playing in our sandbox. Right. Portrait of the graduate was developed a long time ago. It's meant to develop a mission statement, which is kind of the equivalent of what your ends are. Your ends are a little bit more goal-specific. What I see it as possibly doing is one of two things. One, it might add some specificity to the ends that you have. It might allow things to kind of hone in, make more specific goals. The other piece, too, is it should probably give a good idea of what the priorities of the community are. I mean, you've got 14 different separate pieces there, but of those 14, what are the most critical in terms of what the community wants? So you might have data to be able to figure those two things out. Heather, do you feel like you could put things out? I do. And I'm happy to do that, but I'm going to also get it ready to go up on a screen. Because I worked on this for quite some time, I have many documents that are named POG. So I think I'd like to share with you not only the consolidated information, but if you have the bandwidth for it, some of the raw data, meaning some of the survey results where people were asked, what do you want in there? And some of it was really similar to what's in the ends, and some of it was very far-fetched. We would probably not put in there really specific things like learn to swim. We might, but from the community, we have many, many pages of this raw data, which might make you feel that you have a chance to review the exact words that came from the community. These are the exact words. But then, of course, we also have the compilation that the students and teachers and the parents and community members and board members created as a draft of the POG. So we have all of that. How do I share? So if you open it up, then you're going to link into the meeting. And then she's printing that too. That's why. I hope it prints well. Anyways, let me get it up on the screen. All right, so I'm going to my calendar. Or I said I just sent you the link of an email. So it should be one of your most recent emails. Why don't we open this all up over, we're waiting. Here you go. Do you want to hit anyone? You all stuff over here. They keep moving stuff around. Choose the people up here. And you're going to want to shut off the mic. I have an email for so much nicer than this. Hold on. I'm going to shut your speaker off here. And then turn this down a little bit. Oh, you got the trickiest one. All the things to open. Oh, did they take it? Oh, they didn't like that. I'm going to put your smell on it. What's that? My texel. So if it's open in the background, you're going to get up through that. Right. I forgot this. I usually do window. That's green. That's the name of which one. Is that the name of what you want? Quick on that. Yeah, they changed it from last. I don't know what was the easiest. You want help? Probably scissors over there. Oh yeah, library. But it's only going to show in that little window like that. A little slide bar to just focus on maybe on that page. At the bottom. I'm going to get the printed copies, okay. Okay, off the printer. Well, what's interesting is the last is critical thinkers, which we can immediately start comparing. What do you mean the last? It once Heather scrolls down. Good luck. It's narrow. Yeah, I don't think this is by... I don't think it was designed. Well, I don't know. I wasn't thinking they were doing the final thing, but I don't think this is everything that they want graduates to have. I don't think it's a priority order. No, no, no, I know. I said last to bring your eye to it. That's all. Okay. It was in a packet. And I'm... Order. It may have been the May 10th packet, or I'm not going to listen to your... No, right? No. I thought that's why you were looking at her. Blame. You want to hit her. Give them a little bump. The morning mother of me. At least they're going a straight line. I know. The one time they were like, don't talk to the sidewalk. I'm going to tell your mom on you. Yeah. Because I know Morgan is really... She's working hard. She's working hard on keeping them in a straight line. They have a meter and they've got a sweep in there. These are off-hours. Yeah. Well, I remember that when Connor was what? Nine. He's not airborne every six feet. Yeah. A few times I helped Olivia get the boys down to the pool. I was like, all right, we're stopping. Guys, we're in town now. No money for business. They just wanted to go off the sidewalk. Weird. You have got to be predictable. That's what cars want. Yeah, it's not even the kids. It's the people not paying attention. It scares me. My kids biking. I saw your voice. Yeah. I know one of my students is usually looking backwards while he bikes the whole time. I'm like, why? He's got to make sure someone's watching. The bike ped group that I'm volunteering with, we're thinking about getting some low-cost mirrors because that is a hard skill for young kids to look back. But that's one of the things you have to do when riding for transportation. You've got to be checking. So they have mirrors. Yeah, also good if they have ear buds in or something. You can't hear the car. I don't know why. Just thinking of the possibility. Thank you. My pleasure. I'm seriously today this morning I said, I should print up all the stuff for that. And I said to Lane, what's on the agenda for any, we're just going to approve these two policies. And that's it. We're done. So I'm really sorry. I thought it was just discussion, but this makes sense if we're looking at you. I'll give you your fancy. Well, and what I've printed for you is like what it's going to look like in a brochure, but then I blown up the tenants because it's designed to be printed larger than eight and a half by eleven. It's meant to be printed like a it would look like a school folder type of size. Right. So it would be more of a poster presentation. So I have this one. And then I'm going to see if I can find all the data and we're going to add the data. Thank you. Such an exciting conversation. This conversation. So that's the pretty one, but the ones like more like big enough to read. So yeah. So we have this in front of us. We have our ends in front of us. One point one critical thinking. It happens to be last, but not prioritized last critical thinker. Yes, these could be moved around. Yep. Absolutely. Just want to make sure. There's a lot of overlap. There is. But mostly just what I'm getting at is I agree with the broad assessment in that the ends are kind of just the titles and it doesn't explain what we mean what it might look like. You know, they're they're thesis statements, but not what it might look like in practice. In practice. We would be involved with the result of what it might look like. Well, there's what the process might look like and what the finished product would look like. So we would be right. What's the finished product right in the in the means of getting to the finished product is right. The professionals job right, but critical thinker finished product is awfully big. Yes. So I think even if we're just going to put out finished product, it can be the next interpretation. I would recommend that you move forward with creating a strategic plan in the same way involving community members in the creation of a strategic plan to execute whatever you decide your ends are. So a five year strategic plan and you say if you want students to be able to be effective communicators that's built into the strategic plan. We just do a strategic plan. We've been working on it based upon the ends that are there. Right. The question is it's never it's been unclear to me if people are satisfied with the interpretation of the ends. I know the board is because you vote on it, but I mean more in terms of a broader community piece. And so this is actually a good good check on that. But the pieces that you're talking about are really good. There's processes that you can use to the strategic plan is how you get there. There's outcome. And so you would be looking at outcome process is kind of what we work on to decide how to get there. But there's board involvement in that too because process typically involves budget. And so as we're going through the budget discussions. Okay. If this is what you want we've talked with the cabinet. We've talked with the faculty. These are the ideas on how to get there. This is what the cost is. What do we have the pallet for during those budget discussions. That's kind of that. Well, and also these are the ideas of how we get there. Not necessarily obviously something we vote on or something we approve. But I do think being observers of the process and not just this is how it went. Yeah. Because the community isn't going to get there's actual work going on unless we are discussing process. Have what we're doing to get there. Would it be helpful to discuss process then? I believe again in my experience though I know it goes against policy governance. I believe it would because these meetings are a very good platform to have those discussions. You know these are the these are the things that we're planning to do to meet this goal. This is where we're at. This is the work we're done. This is the cost so far because otherwise it just once a year you're looking at outcomes. People don't know what's going on in the district. So I think that I think that maybe we've been misapplying policy governance. It's a fine structure but it's not the only thing we do. Like it can even be the core of what we do but it doesn't necessarily need to be the only thing we do. And I'm not trying to poo poo on policy governance at all but I think in being able to reflect back over the last couple of years given a couple of more COVID those were things that I see missing that I think might have helped in terms of public perception because there's been a lot of work going on. We just don't talk about it that much. Right and I think it's irresponsible of us to just expect a result and not express buy-in to the process. We need to express buy-in and as does the community the result even if it's positive is great but if we don't know or understand how we got there Oh well we're trying to do to get there You can piece my back conversation right there Did I have to get everyone's no wine items? You can just say this discussion about POG in relation to ends you're required to get any emotions and things like that in your decisions Let's do a good read Let's do a good read There was a silent pause So if just to kind of bring this back around if it's not policy governance or if it's a combination of the good things about policy governance and something else what is it something else? So I think what's important for me and maybe for others to remember is that we're not we don't have to sign in blood saying this is the name of this is the formula we're using and it's named after this person that's not necessarily required if we figure out some sort of combination where because I think at this point policy governance has us scared to do the wrong thing because I think it's gotten to a point where we're so focused on what we can't do or can't ask or can't be involved in that we're not doing anything that we can we get so stuck with what we can So I think what I'd like to be able to say is I'd like to have some oversight and understanding of the process not dictating the process but I think policy governance has gotten us to a place where we can't we I feel we can't even question the process or push to understand it push back not disagree with it, not disapprove it we're not approving it that's not what we do but I think and I hope it would also be helpful to the people who are operating the process to be pushed so you know reports not just Lane we're not supposed to have contact with staff except through Lane well I think that it feels too restrictive right so we've talked about having the principles coming and talking about okay critical thinking what are you what does this mean to you what are you doing to and that's something they would have already talked to with Lane their supervisor but instead of hearing it from Lane who also they're not gonna say anything different but hearing it from the people who are doing it I don't want us to get to a place where we feel like we're we have to sign a commitment to something that has a title I think we can create what we feel we need to be for this district not Google search different forms of school I've done it is anybody else done it you know different structures for a school board we need to figure out the structure for the OS I'm talking right to you and I don't mean to I'm sorry we need to figure out the structure of the OSSD board that might not look exactly like someone else's and the only thing that I ask is that you know as stuff comes up if there's questions you ask them and let us answer and what not but I one of the things that I go back to the first couple of years not going into a lot of detail there was a lot of cleanup in this district there were a lot of things that needed to be cleaned up that had been going on for a while the reason that they happened even then in discussions with the board was because the board was too disconnected and I don't know if it was policy governance that made that happen but there's a disconnect here that makes me nervous too and that it's great I've got all this autonomy I'm kind of doing my thing but I never really is this what people really want is it you know there's always that question but I think having a little bit more of that contact helps fulfill the oversight responsibilities that folks have and fulfilling policies that don't aren't just ability to adapt and then basically defining what adapt means and the power that if we're on the same page and we've had the discussion it's great because you get your minds at the table looking at things but it's also that backup as a board and as a superintendent and after having discussions with the community this is the path that we've decided on and this is why we're doing it so when I push a little bit if folks are reluctant even though they've been involved and it's been vetted I know that I've got that backup there I think it'll make things a little bit easier because this is the goals that the district has to meet people have to work towards right and I also think that the cleanup that you refer to I think is because you had to clean up things that were in the past or had been had been established in the past and I think that there's a lack of looking forward because there's still a lot to clean up a lot and if we can redesign these to be specific about okay once it's cleaned up what does that look like what because this specific district has very specific challenges to get to a student's ability to adapt every district has their challenges but this one here has huge ones to overcome and clean up still yeah I was just going to say I appreciate your point on creating a custom model that works for our district and I guess for what I would like to see is for the board to have a little bit more agency in owning some of the direction that we're going in so that way we can provide more of a unified front and provide more backup to the administration but also you know be able to hold the administration's feet to the fire if we say okay let's tweak it this way you know let's so I don't know where that balance is without getting too involved in the process but that's just that's what I would like to see more of a community front so when you I wrote down three words agency owning direction what is owning the direction mean to you yeah I mean I think these are too vague for me of course these were these were implemented before I was involved and I'd like to drill down deeper on each of them and figure it flesh out like what is success in mathematics look like what is success in science look like what is success in critical thinking look like because we're already constrained so much with our reporting abilities right we only I don't feel like I know we're stopping at ninth grade to a certain degree with a lot of stuff and I don't know if we can change the mechanism for how we success in one discipline or another I'd like to explore what that looks like how does college placement job placement I don't know I don't know what it is student surveys where the students feel like they have a voice in what's going on in the community is it faculty surveys that are more frequent where faculty can voice their opinion and how do we collect and aggregate that data and make it effect you know useful to the direction that we're going but I don't know I just think public school systems in general are constrained by these boxes that we have to fit each student into and I don't think it's all that realistic we've noticed that with standardized testing to a great degree so I don't kind of just rifting right now but if we can use dialogue to you know measure people's the climate of the community I mean that's the big one for me right now is do we have a healthy climate and or are we to siloed in each group in the faculty or staff the administration the board the general public the student body I don't feel like we have great alignment amongst all those different groups I think we're very siloed so whatever we can do to get more of that intel to the table in a more transparent manner seems like it would benefit company culture yeah I record I mean I know like the yeah yeah yes table but yes yes I mean I assume you mean for us to have that information yes yes I think we've explored things too and we have explored bringing student voice on to the board and I think that I would still really advocate for that of having student representatives student board representatives there's just other ways to kind of help that as Sam mentioned like help kind of increase that bi-directional conversation ways that are beneficial like reporting back at each meeting um what I get like this when I think about well no I mean I there are school boards that have student representatives as part of the school board and their students that sit in to school board meetings and they may bring um you know if they're as part of student council they may bring kind of a report of what's happening in student council but they may also be good voices in the conversation if you're having conversation about the school it's always I think great to actually hear kind of from those that are living in it and staff how do we get that voice yeah I mean that's we have that voice through the union but that's a we're trying to connect with them but getting them you know part of the reason the listening sessions board members are welcome to be at too um has been an attempt and again I'm going to speak openly here and hopefully it stirs some people to come in and take a counter point to it but what I've seen over the last couple of months and I think it's probably a result of the constant negotiations the last couple of years on contracts is that there seems to be a wall between union administration staff easiest thing to do is to talk directly with the staff but there's a wall that's in place that's being set up here so that that doesn't happen so the conversation has to happen here and that's made things difficult and that's one of the reasons I started the listening sessions was to have the communications directly with the staff to hear from the staff have them hear from me and not filtered through another body that seems to be in the way of those direct conversations um I think there's been some progress made lately but it's been difficult um you're from a high level assessment you're a district where people did their own thing for years and years and years so anybody coming in trying to change direction um is fighting decades of folks just being allowed to do their own thing and so you can vet it you can discuss it as much as you want but in the end things are going to change things have to change and so at what point after how many conversations after how much vetting do you just pull the trigger and say okay now we just got to do it and we're getting to that point with some things where we just got to do some of the things if we want things to get better but there's pushback because people are used to doing their own things it's like taking away a privilege that they've always had that they probably shouldn't have um but it is the taking away of a privilege being able to just kind of do your own thing whether it's in your classroom or whether it's as a principal within your school um that was the culture for years and that's been a huge clock and I was talking and I shouldn't be on management and is there a way to invite I mean I guess this might be going against union um but is there again I don't know if this would be okay with the union but is there a way to like invite a staff representative who's not a union like a union representative like they're just here as a in a staff capacity but they're not like uh you can they do have the right to control the messaging to the staff and so it's uh it's just that's what I've been trying to do in in recent conversations is yeah we want you there as a union but we want more of the staff let's let's have these conversations big and broad and you know like I said to them I'll give you a whole day of PD at the start of the year we'll all sit down we'll have a whole faculty there because his concerns and these discussions are about everybody and let's just have that open talk um and I have not been able to get them to allow that to happen this is a naive question but are all staff members members of the union uh I'm gonna say yes and no um no and the fact that they don't have to pay dues if they don't want to be a member but yes and the fact that by law the union is the only group that can represent them and they are the only representatives so no individual staff member teacher can come and represent themselves um whether they want to or not the union has that control by law in my statute I'm just wondering if it's framed more as a as a pie in the sky kind of conversation sitting face to face and talking and not behind the scenes and it's gotta be face to face open discussions it's how you get to know people and how you build relationships it's been very hard to get people to come and have those meetings but I think spinning it like that pie in the sky kind of conversations what do you want to what if you had all the money in the world for your classroom what would you want to be able to do that kind of just the positive forward thinking kind of listening session or invite tell us the your dream classroom model or something like that that's not about tell us how you feel about something that's happening right now let's look forward together yeah because I think you're right most of the contact we have with staff is negotiations which is just contentious and the process is set up to make it that way it's not the union that's contentious it's how that process that collective bargaining process absolutely but that being the only um contact that we have with them rather than come and tell us not how it's going right now although of course we're interested in that but how could it be going thank you Heather yeah what I've provided you with is and this is only one method of data collection really easy for me to share at a quick notice so these was the original survey that invited people to write a narrative and then a subsequent survey that invited people to vote on like their top five of you know 15 different choices to be on the POG in addition to these we did postcards for people who were not comfortable with online surveys we pushed into classrooms and had students do drawing exercises and responses to like I dream of a school where and a lot of that was compiled and I'm sure I can get the compilations but I don't have them tonight I'm sorry but this is just a representative piece of some of the raw data there was a lot more there were chalk talks and other methods of collecting information from the community the students did it with staff as well so the students met with their teachers and did like I don't know how many teachers oh they did it at the faculty meeting they were pushing faculty meetings every faculty member who was present that we get faculty meetings at the elementary and high school and so the effort was to get something from every student every staff member and as many community members as we're willing to participate and I think the kids did a pretty good job I mean my I love it and I'd love there to be a subsequent document that's more measurable like what do we mean by that how do we measure that type of thing so that we're we we can measure where we are in our vision okay so can we we go back to the mechanics of changing of having we're talking about customizing our policy governance to OSSD's district we're talking about making these ends more in depth how do we actually execute that short of all of us deciding right now what we want to see and even if we were to all decide what we wanted to see what do we have to do to implement implement them like change the ends yeah rewrite them that's our that's our specific layers underneath you had bullets underneath that make it more specific what you mean in some ways I would like to sort of take an underneath instead of just put this right underneath our mission statement it's pretty specific it gives the broader idea but then it is specific and I mean we could then we can dig in and take on the task of a professional educator and then try and figure out the I mean the board has the ability to do that personally I don't think that would be a very wise thing for our board to do but if people on the board would like to do that there's nothing that says the board can't go to that extreme the board could say this is what it means for third and fourth graders and we can we can map right out and we can say this is what we want and we would take a lot of we'd have to do our we'd have to do some research and maybe get educators in here to tell us what they think good benchmarks are but the difference between the board doing that and delegating it to the to the superintendent in the past we've delegated that process to the superintendent and the professional educators and we've kept it pretty broad and then he has to then take these ends and interpret them into measurable measurable outcomes so that his ends report shows us that he's that he's accomplishing it and of course for many of these he may not be in compliance initially but what he has to do is say I'm not in compliance I'm projecting that I'll be in compliance in the next two years I'm working toward this this is why and each of these when he picks a measurement that he's going to use he gives a rationale for it and it doesn't have to be you know some objective test that he's giving them he could he could he could say I'm using this and and what is supposed to happen is he's supposed to be digging down in using his professional educators his curriculum specialists his teachers to kind of come up with what are benchmarks that would be here and what's the rationale we are you know those are the professional educators who know the educational theory they've done some research some of them depending many of them have a lot of experience so this could be a measurement that we use to show as evidence that this is being accomplished so I think that you're describing two extremes where one is we're prescribing okay a third grader needs to know this and be this and I'm not qualified to do that and I'm very happy to say that I'm not qualified to do that and the other extreme being here's this broad statement that can be interpreted reasonably we're given reasonable evidence to see that you're in compliance but I think there's somewhere in the middle where we can say here's this broad statement but here are some more very specific that's what this is that's where we go to the community and say this is what we've come up with is there something more and again my complaint with these initial ones from the get-go is they're very very vague now that we've gone out to all the different entities we've got much more specific description of what we're looking for and so then you push that back to the educators to then say okay what would this look like in a system K-12 by third grade or fourth grade kids should be you know and have benchmarks along the way because the other thing that from Brent to our current superintendent we have no checks in our system it's all at the tail end well we've got a big huge ship word we're steering and we steer it with these but we don't check in at third and fourth grade because we're public I'm going to qualify that statement the board does not check in but we have plenty of data from every grade along the way because I built the assessment systems that allow us to do that so I just want to make sure that the community knows yes we do know what's going on with our third graders in our second grade that should be in an ends report and we should have that by delegating it and saying to figure it out and not having any oversight or any understanding of the information from this one person and it may or may not be what you want that's my problem I don't know what you want and to understand how you got it and who got it and that's it why that works for that's in the ends report from him I want reports from other people I want to understand how it got there so principles and then the process that I'm not prescribing I have delegated but just because I delegated and I'm not prescribing it doesn't mean that I shouldn't be involved, understand, observe and have oversight over that process so you're not going to if he gives a report working through the system with the educators and the principles we you're feeling like the board needs to hear a report from the teachers to say yep we gave these we decided on these benchmarks we gave these assessments we you want to hear that from the teachers that's all dry data what do you want to hear from the teacher what do you want to hear I guess I'm more not numbers I'm I feel rifting I don't know which one it is because I'm figuring out my answer in real time so I just want to care about that there's something about the word report that I'm having some sort of reaction to that that is what we are receiving it feels dry it feels cold and disconnect thank you I'm in agreement I think a couple of possibilities that are kind of in the middle Chelsea you got a hand up Chelsea go yes I do so I think and you make a really good point about having to assess things like I don't want to say not the fun stuff because it's not necessarily fun stuff but you have to assess those benchmarks at the grade levels to see if kids are reaching a certain reading level at a certain math level like those things are important I think that's already written into the ends and I think that the teachers are very focused on that and it seems to me that processes are being put in place to sort of push that along what I do see missing from the ends report completely is any sort of positive culture benchmark which I think is something that should be at so that would be what you're talking about Hannah right but that's what I think Hannah might be talking about when it comes to when it comes to looking at how our school is performing and we hear these reports in the high school I mean you're talking about bringing students in from a student council so that they can be a part of the school board but honestly there's no student council and there hasn't been for a couple of years so like those kinds of things I think are things that the board needs to know about that they might not necessarily know about and adding something like that to the ends is I think it might be an idea just an idea and no you've hit it on the head just say we need to be added to the ends if you stay with the system which is fine because then we know what we're shooting for and what folks want but if you read your end statements about what's there so two possibilities is that in terms of connecting with the folks that have the most knowledge which is what we did in terms of developing the current end statements that we have in the that go along with it you've got this portrait of a graduate you know it might make sense to have a facilitator come in bring staff and students and what not together and say you know in terms of our ends explain what they are and what it implies for the district and its work and start to have them adapt what this means in terms of ends and give the specifics that might be a good process plus you've got folks engaged having the conversations that they should be having developing things that you know that everybody is going to be had by and on because they developed it for the most part themselves you know with a little bit of guidance along the way so that's one possibility the other piece to go back with what Ann was saying earlier in terms of the board prescribing things you know one of the ways that boards typically prescribe foundational knowledge for kids is through your graduation requirements for students how many years of English how many years of social studies how many years of health how many years of life skills and that's another typical way if you don't like the numbers and foundational knowledge in social studies means every student has four years of social studies to graduate and successfully completes and passes that's another way of doing it but that's typically it's one of the things I've been talking a little bit with a high school about is because there's some things there that need to be upgraded but that's one of the ways that the boards you know usually state their foundational knowledge is through how many years of social studies that you're supposed to have and that's board set graduation requirements just some ideas that are coming up through a good rich conversation they're in the student handbook that's what my question was should they also be in our handbook should they also be in our packet especially if it's something we prescribe well the state there's a state prescribed thing as well as and then schools will put in their own handbook and staff love having things prescribed in terms of graduation requirements because if we only have a one year social studies requirement now and you move it to three or four you're providing job security because if you require it we have to have the staff to carry it out I can tell you in looking in reviewing those graduation requirements that they are very shy of what most schools are doing now why is this the first time we're hearing that maybe not because my work has been on the ends that the board has prescribed and I'm trying to find other ways as the conversations comes up I had a very good conversation with me a while back about other ways of potentially looking at ends and one of them being how you know how many courses in a certain discipline and for a student to be able to graduate so it strikes the graduation requirement piece and so I've been looking at that lately can we get a copy of when the school handbook is out we get a copy of the can I just be part of the routine one of the things that should be one of the things that a board does is typical typical school boards again there's the policy side of things and there's the way the policies are carried out but typically any new policies in a handbook are voted and vetted by the board and again the other thing that that does is it adds weight that when we're carrying out something that might be difficult it's been vetted by the board we are carrying carrying out the will of the community in terms of the schools and that's helpful because there's a lot of things that we're trying to change to improve climate culture academics and whatnot and it's been very hard because it's kind of just been us like I said that's not a don't mean that to be a criticism it's part of reflecting upon where we're at what might make things better but typically student handbooks every year if there's changes to the boards that and vote graduation requirements these are things that normally if there's changes to them but we have new board members every year so I think you're suggesting yeah they should be vetted your policy governance has delegated a lot of that kind of to us but I still don't feel comfortable with it because I'm just not used to that that's usually a board piece that's policy that's board are there other things like that what are we doing as a board that we're not currently doing I think I'll do some reflection on it but those are the two biggest ones in my experience yeah in your time in Marblehead how did what were the metrics that Marblehead High was using every again Massachusetts a little bit different than Vermont but Massachusetts it's more like every other state in the union than Vermont is they cared about they wanted to see their AP scores they wanted to see their state testing scores they wanted to see where the kids were going to college and graduation now remember different population 98% of those kids were going to a private four-year school probably 20 to 30% of them were going to the Ivy Leagues but again those were the typical things as a principal that I would come up and as the principal I would do reports to the board on what those scores were each fall I do my state of the school address to the on the opening day of school where we would go over the same data with the faculty we'd review it I had a bunch of processes that were set up okay we've got some identified weaknesses here when you go off on your first day you're going to use what I call the CSEP process that we created where they kind of figure out where the kids are weak and what they're going to do differently this year to address those weak areas in terms of what's happening in school and that was just a yearly process it's just what we did it was the culture that's part of what I've been trying to establish here a little bit with reasonable there's been a lot of pushback on it and again it's not because they're not reasonable people it's because they've been able to do their own thing for so long I'm honing in on their territory and so it's understandable that they're pushing back but there's got to we got to come to a meeting of the minds or at some point in time like I said we just got to pull the trigger on some things this is a very specific question but if there was a policy policy change in the handbook when would that come to us like in the rhythm of the year so normally what would happen is if it was an emergency thing you might be at your next meeting we'd ask you to put it on the agenda but typically it gets done in the fall and that's for the next year kind of like the budget process has done a year in advance they work on it in the fall usually by February I think they voted in you should also the other piece that goes along with that is the program of studies as the budget keepers for the district you have the indirect method of deciding which courses we teach and programs we run in which ones we don't because you're not supposed to be fiddling with it but you have an indirect way of saying we're not going to vote for that budget because you're trying to add this program that we don't like but usually program of studies is also something that's at least reviewed by the board a lot of boards will actually be the ones that voted in other boards they will do what's called a vote of support so they're not saying this is what you can do or what you can't do what you're doing and it's in line with the mission that we have to the district so we're going to give you a vote of approval for those changes so in this scribbled list of maybe August agenda things in terms of an annual agenda August might be the time that we would review handbooks and programs programs of study is that yes I'd say a little bit later because it's for the next year usually October you could give people time to get in get settled get the school year running in October usually by February when they were voting January February when they were voting on the changes to handbooks so because this is kind of a fresh it feels fresh to me not saying you have to do it on this no I just feel like maybe on the August agenda we could review these things that we're I'm unfamiliar with I'd like to insert changes to the handbook should be considered like procedure not policy it's not a policy at all and they should be living documents so at any time we need to update what we're doing for fire drills because a new thing has come up the principal can open it up put in the new policy practice on fire drills and email it out to the community and say please see update under section you know fire drills whatever but the protocols because I she's right the handbook is protocols but the protocols are based on policy putting in new protocols that haven't been there before that's because there's a policy that either exists or doesn't exist that the board needs to approve on so boards have always in my experience have always to prove the handbook or not because it's not close to me so sorry about that when was the last time we had changed your handbook every year they changed it every year especially during COVID we were changing them sometimes yes our practices had to change on what constitutes sick keeping child home then there was test to stay last year it was the cell phone policy we were trying to get in to help with the culture there were a couple of other pieces at the high school that we put in in terms of student dress and things like that that have been going in but those are things that should be discussed at least with the board and if you don't want to do a formal vote in of the thing it could be just a board approval we can see the process that you're using to try to get us where we want to go in this mix up so for example a homework policy would that be considered a change to the handbook do you have a do you have a policy that requires homework no no that would be a change to the handbook that would be good for the board to review and say yeah you're on the right track but remember this is where the policy governance comes in and what it tries to protect you are asking me to accomplish things and I have things that will get us there and you tell me no it's not my fault we didn't get there with yours mm-hmm so we have to you know some things we have to do so that means we basically we either rubber stamp everything that you put together or we say no and then you say well then don't hold me accountable for getting to these ends because you tied my hands by saying I couldn't do this and I couldn't do that and you changed the plan of study so what you do is say we realize that this is important find another way and then it's my job to go out and find an alternative to it so it's not just a blank no because the problem that a homework policy is trying to solve the problem doesn't go away whether we have a right if we just have a homework policy is voted down and we do nothing we still have the problem of the kids learning of retention so then we just try to find another way to do it maybe more expensive it may be but again that's the board's desire that's the control that a board does have slippery slope the micromanager yeah that's my feeling but it seems like there are many people on this board who feel like they need to have more control in what's happening I think we definitely need to have more discussions just so people know what's happening but you're also asking for the board to then come along and approve handbooks and approve courses and study yeah yeah I'm not sure I'm not sure I'm not sure that's a great use of the board's time and I don't think the board has the expertise to be doing that necessarily I think the board can understand it and have an idea of we chose this that's that rationale part of the ends is we chose this course of study because we feel like that's going to get us to this end and to this outcome but for me as a especially currently one meeting a month with my expertise in education I'm going to decide whether or not this plan of study is a good one or it should be changed or the program of study I think a logical process and again this is one of the ways that we could do it and I process out loud as I talk so I apologize for that but I think one of the ways that we could do it is you know we say once a year or once every other year we're going to have on the agenda that we review the graduation requirements and it's my job to come in and give the board recommendations and give you the information of why I think that's good based upon the conversations that I've had with folks what's happening in and around the world what the other expectations are at other districts and you make a decision on it I mean part of my job too is to be an informational resource to the board to make those decisions and so but that's you know if I'm coming in well then it seems like it would be a no brainer to say yes and if I'm not you are all very capable people to say hey that doesn't make sense to me or it looks like you might be missing something and that's good feedback to get but that's the teamwork piece you know it's a lot better with a lot of minds just some thinking you just have to worry disgust you don't have to work for work you don't have to work for work for the video but I appreciate this sort of a discussion because it's getting people to thinking of possibilities and if there are changes that need to be made if you want to stick with policy governance there's nothing wrong with policy governance I feel we need more discussion I don't want the board to be as distant I want more oversight because I think that was the problems but I also feel that the discussions are valuable for the community to hear and for other folks because they get the logic behind why we're doing what we're doing why we're doing it doesn't mean that it's always going to pay off but there's some good rationale behind what we're doing and as a board member I would like to be able to get out to the community and say this is what we're doing this is the rationale behind what we're doing and here's where we're at and this is what we're targeting to I don't want to personally I don't think it's a good use of my time in a meeting to be reviewing the handbook the dress code if we come in and talk about the changes and why we're making them that's probably good for people to know or why we're recommending them they be changed but yeah the reason it could be embedded in the rationale for why we're working on this this is how we see ourselves getting there we've implemented this or that in order to hit this target and this is the reason for doing it here's a really interesting thing that I want folks to think about where the reality may have caused problems that we didn't want climate issues at the high school have been a topic for a long time when we did the research and did some surveys early on we settled on the idea that it was it was an equity in a social justice issue and we worked on equity in social justice and look where we ended up was that the intent when we did and that's the problem with generalities we had data that we were following we were doing the work for a good reason besides the fact the state's requiring it but we thought that that was the root of the climate piece that is a part of the climate issues here but it is not the biggest part as we're discovering but again that generality in terms of what to work on has been difficult to navigate sometimes not sure if I'm making any sense it makes sense in my head so I'm just wondering how we can take this piece of paper add to it what we want to add to it delete what we want to delete and then every meeting look at it to see how we're getting there and in my mind I would I say to myself I think that it would be great to have representatives from the school teachers students staff whoever to come in and tell us about every single one of these things every single month but I know that we don't have a ton of time to get everything done all the time the way we have it set up right now but those seem like they are the most important pieces of our work of the school's work of the most important pieces in our ability to monitor sort of the job that's being done what if we talked about having a principal come to a meeting what if they invited someone to each meeting such as a student or a staff member they used to we discussed the ends with them as part of the meeting yeah I mean I think we just have to start start somewhere and make maybe a small change or the September meeting you know and then let the whole school community know about it and then just start there and then just have it be a work in progress I you know we can I'm trying to figure it all out but it's hard it's like eating an elephant I think our ends need to be a work in progress but we can't adjust them every month because that's no I agree I agree 100% but I just mean the process I mean I think we should just start somewhere and maybe do it for a year and then look back and say did that work what would we like to add what didn't work or six months I don't know I think your starting point is if you need to adjust those ends so we know what we're working on or if anything's changing in terms of what we're working on which is fine but I I think what you're saying is good we used to have the principals come in each principal would come into a board meeting at least one board meeting a year and talk about a specific piece that they were working on in terms of the ends but I think we got to get your ends down in terms of what it is that people want specifically specifically so we can begin working on I mean I remember we stopped those for a reason I felt like that was because we felt like it wasn't really well they were reading us what had been sent to us in an email that is how I remember it this would be more like an open discussion conversation and we decided it was kind of micromanagement but I think having them come in and if folks are talking about math and is having either Betty Young or a principal come in and say this is what the changes have happened in terms of math in the last year at RES look like and this is what we're working on and this is what the results are so far I think that's a worthy conversation plus it's helpful to me too because the more that folks are talking about the stuff the more it's in their minds every day as they're going about their work because that's how you change culture it's got to be on your mind all the time every day for culture to change I think the principals would really welcome the opportunity to come and speak to you especially if it wasn't just an expectation that they would read you a narrative but rather they might share initiatives and hear your thoughts on their initiatives I think that would be really welcome just one one concern that may pop into someone's head is what's to keep the principals from just wanting to make you guys happy they don't care about it believe me they are pretty independent people and again that's a part of what the culture has been for many years is that I think a lot of it had to do with the reductions staff that happened they were pretty much left they were the masters of their own ships and every ship was doing its own thing and so that was one of the difficulties coming in was to try to centralize things a little bit so that we all had common goals that we were working on across the district even though you still have control over somehow that shape is happening in your building that was not a structure they were used to or comfortable with they were used to do in their own thing it was a tough push to try to change that culture there I don't know how to answer you can ask them what would make them comfortable doesn't I mean to some extent everyone wants to be in line with their boss their employers like expectations and the nature of public education is though that people have the ability to speak their mind because of the protections in place it's not really the same as like working for an employer at will with the contracts in place you have some ability to say like someone could come here and say I'm unhappy with the district level leadership I wouldn't want to work in a place where people thought that way I don't think they do I think I've worked in a district not this one but I've worked in a district where the superintendent was doing things that were not legal or ethical teachers came to the board and said this is a problem I mean it's real like there's a certain level of protection that people will speak up if there's a problem that's my observation from 20 years 30 years in education and these aren't folks that are going to shy away from stuff which is good sadly should be so we have this document from the portrait of the graduate yes do these better align do these people talk about it's too vague we need to flesh them out does this do it this is a much better roadmap than what we currently have I have a couple of concerns with it as being you know heavily involved in it I think some things sort of repeat themselves and I just think that that's because we ran out of time and didn't go through another dive like there's a couple of places where it says critical thinking there's a couple of places where it says analyzed data and that's fine so I still think of it as a draft and my other concern is I don't think it's measurable but other than that I love it but that's why if you had a group of folks together that are charged with actually fleshing it out is again it's the same questions as the interpretations it's okay what does this look like what does this look like I think when people think measurable they're always it's not necessarily I'm thinking of rubric like a rubric that says this is like an emerging level and this is a distinguished level and so for any of these competencies you could say okay here's where I am now and here's where I want to be I like that it's a self evaluation too it could be right these could actually a lot of these you know we're supposed to have graduation proficiencies a lot of these could be adopted as the graduation proficiencies and that way you know they're getting met just through the because the teachers are it should be a living document that is driving what the teachers are doing on a daily basis and they all had input input into these and they I mean the way the system is set up is laying laying doesn't have the expertise to figure out a measurement for an interpretation for all of these it's got to be pushed down into the system for the educators to sort of say this is what it would look like to have uses knowledge and understanding to collaboratively develop solutions this is what it would look like in the fourth grader and they could do it out in a almost there you know this one's really got it you know but that's got to be done by the educators and then they have to have a rationale for why you know help us as non-educators help us understand why you chose that rubric and and so that we understand and then we can bring that out to the public and say this is where we're headed this is where we're going this is the rationale for it and if the public's like wait no we don't want them to be doing that then we can readjust but I that seems to be and in terms of dictating down I would say you know anybody doesn't want to be just saying you know you do it this way because I say it you know this should allow people to sort of build up from the bottom to be saying yeah we're going to do it this way this is what makes sense maybe the principals and the superintendent then take a look at it but and in doing that they may or they may not agree that a homework school is going to fix um but anyway I would hope that would that would work well I think that seems like a good idea can you guys hear me my computer died so now I have my phone yeah okay the one thing I think is missing from this that I with STAM is we'll never know a full statement something about a culture I think some of that's in here too about like the caring connected community member yeah that talks a lot to culture um do we do proficiency based like report cards we do that in high school the tech center is definitely moving to that the high schools at standards based not proficiencies so they are it's just this they're using standards and so it's a lot does anyone have a high school student right now I reviewed them this year it's a lot it's a lot um Vicki Johnson one of our science teachers is sort of leading an initiative to start adopting proficiencies so I collaborated with her and shared this with her and she shared with me what she has and there's a lot of similarities very much like there's a lot of similarities with the ends and so as we're thinking of like what's the ends and what's our POG and what's our proficiencies for graduation it would be nice just a line yes right let's see other proficiencies standards based grades and graduation proficiencies I'm going to share with you Vicki's document because she shared it with the they call it the RUHS leadership team and it's basically your department chairs and a few other people like your counseling leader and the principals and so it's it got it was well received it's certainly not a final but it was well received because I mean even reading these some of these just sound like proficiencies like how you would evaluate a student on their ability to analyze information you know like there should be I think alignment there which would then make things more consistent too as far as the messaging that's being given like you're seeing these same things repeated in multiple different aspects and it's it's helping everyone kind of understand like this aligns rather than this is I hear this here but then here I'm seeing this and over here is another thing but they kind of sound similar but they're not really the same and it's like it helps you know and some of the confusion that might be under you know people experiencing but these are at a broader kind of graduation proficiency level as opposed to standard you know there's multiple standards that we're going to end up student have to be successful on multiple standards achieve multiple standards to be able to meet any one of these but I mean even when you're reading through these things a lot of these you know you could associate this with a senior you could associate this with a second grader so that's what we should see over the years and that consistency of the expectation the message and the alignment of what we're seeing students from elementary school all through senior year and I mean obviously this is like you said there are some redundancies but if you scaled these down and you would like each one had maybe two or three bullet points underneath it I mean those would be your that's harder than you think I know I definitely know trust me it is hard to like even leave out a word like you don't want to leave out the word maybe empathy or equity or kindness right and then you start to be like where can I squish in that word it's really hard to take the thoughts of hundreds and hundreds of people and put it into one document so but I'm thinking if we're trying to bring this if we're trying to bring this down it's like the triangle we're trying to kind of move to the top there that could be a way to help us understand how we go from this to our roadmap of the ends so I've shared this with you do you want me to share it on the screen as well this draft PBGRs or none at this time they're actually much shorter I'm very interested to see it I just want to trying to be conscious of people's time and that people seemed pretty sure that a six to eight thing was the capacity for having a really rich conversation so I'd like to propose that we look at this and then think about what our action items not that sounds like we're voting on something but what we're going to take from this meeting and nudge or push or do sound I would push that um if there are going to be changes to those ends we get them done in certain circumstances we get said again if there are going to be changes to the end that's the first priority so we can start working on them as a group especially as we're approaching the start of a new school year they're not going to be huge changes to the ends they're going to be clarified and as I look at the policy that exists the mission statement pretty simple I think could be richer could be richer it could be a it's pretty boring it's pretty bland very vague it's not inspiring at all but does that mean that a next step would be three people sit down and figure out how to marry these two documents together what I'm just trying to think or everybody writes their own and then we come together and say okay everybody takes this document and takes this document and says from this I would make it this way and then we come together and bring them together I mean not that I'm encouraging homework I am I'm well beyond homework policy now but this is the work we should be doing though right not all work is in the meeting in my opinion so this was Vicki Johnson's proposals for PBGRs we could all do that and then bring it to them yes and you can see she's narrowed it down to investigate analyze create communicate collaborate as the green bar on the top and under that is that might be measured or demonstrated this is the entire document it's not multiple pages or multiple bullet points this is the currently the entire proposal it's very concise so I just thought I would throw it in as these three items the end statement the portrait of a graduate and the PBGRs ultimately would align I did via email I did I share this via email setting on this document is anyone with the link can view so it is currently set to be a public facing for review anyone who wants to see it this has not been adopted this is a draft so I have a POG draft in here but this is a P proficiency based graduation the link to you via email I sent you to the OSSD board I got this one I just want to make sure I said the first email I sent had multiple links and then I sent this it should be alone and this one came now excellent so homework is the next yeah well we have something from a staff member we have something from us and we have something from a diverse group of students community so I think if people kind of want to use one as there I would suggest use one as your kind of jumping off point and pull from the other two until you feel good about different categories why don't we what is it August 9 because the next August 9 August 9 can I make a really selfish question can we get like weekly reminders definitely definitely thank you yep can you remind me to send out those reminders I'm just kidding that was clever I could send it up as I could yep I can do a text group bandong thing but so let's try to I want to figure out how to also make it really productive when we're in the meeting if everybody's bringing their own stuff if we're that's why I kind of want to say okay everybody start with the ends as the as your skeleton so we have 1.1, 1.2, 1.3, 1.4 you might add a 5 you might add a 6 but let's use this as our as each individual jumping off point and and flesh each out and then almost do a minute taking of it in real time with people throwing out for each how you would flesh it out and and our lovely clerk no I'm kidding you have to do but I think so we can see it and so the so hopefully we have public here who can also see us working it out in real time is that work off with this one please the the ends as they are now there's our action back to speech writing pair it down make your own outline excuse me I also just want to review the other things we're going to be doing in the August meeting which is reviewing the letter that will be going out the we're going to form a committee to begin the process of the superintendent evaluation with VSBA we included in the materials for that meeting will be the handbook as it is now the student handbook so that we can review it maybe have a chat you have no requirements so there's handbooks there's the high school and then each elementary school has a handbook I propose we start with the high school high school is usually the flagship and you want both the faculty and the student staff I mean student family I would and I think we can set aside a very defined amount of time to start talking about it probably won't end there if we have it in the materials before the meeting we can become familiar with it and of course if we want to understand the board homework on the mission and ends I've got letter to community committee creation student handbook review and I think that's it I was just waxing one of them this is Rachel there's a comma missing and an R somewhere in that letter so let me fix it send it out to you in like acceptable form send it to the whole board so everyone can look it over before the meeting or Rachel I'll just send it I'll just send you what I said great and we'll have a review and possible vote to approve it I mean she just gave me like she's just going to use what I sent to her so I mean I can change it all and send it again cut off like half of it no I just think it's going to be the shorter we can make it the more powerful it's going to be the less like it's people stop reading about the second paragraph yeah all right well thank you everyone we found a date where we could all be here which is fantastic yeah eight Heather thank you for providing so much while we were in the meeting I move to adjourn no need for an executive session anyone no good I have a motion to adjourn do I have a second second all those in fact do we vote to adjourn we don't need to vote adjourning 751 wow you're early